Chilluminati Podcast - Episode 97 - Betty and Barney Hill Part 2

Episode Date: April 20, 2021

The final chapter on this saga Patreon - http://www.patreon.com/chilluminatipod BUY OUR MERCH - http://www.theyetee.com/collections/chilluminati Jesse Cox - http://www.youtube.com/jessecox Alex Faciane - http://www.youtube.com/user/ThatOneLazerClown Art Commissioned by - http://www.mollyheadycarroll.com Theme - Matt Proft End song - POWER FAILURE - https://soundcloud.com/powerfailure Video - http://www.twitter.com/digitalmuppet

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Sink back and turn it up. Nice. Rev it up at Toyota.com. Toyota, let's go places. Hello, everybody, and welcome back to the Jaluminati Podcast. Episode 97, as always, I am one of your hosts, Mike Martin, joining my two co-hosts, Alex Fasiana and Jesse Cox. Hello, boys. Yo!

Bop, bop. Bippity bop. Bippity boo. You just got to pitch me sliding in like Kramer, bop, bop, bop. What's up? Do you like it? This is a deep cut that not all listeners are going to get. I don't know how deep it is, but I'm not supposed to call you like

Toomgis now, people keep telling me. Oh, Toomgis? Yes, that's it. Get out of here, dude. I'm so glad you just have to hear me in this. And never see me. From now on, just imagine that Alex is made of junk food. Do not do that. Do not do that.

If the swamp thing was made out of a dumpster in the back of a McDonald's. It looks like shit, man. Too much good stuff. His arms are like fucking big ass cubs. It sucks. We've lost at least half of our audience here. We've got to bring it back. Thank you guys so much for listening.

We're excited to bring in the next episode. But before we do, Alex rather, people have suggested. You're about to make me do a thing. No, this isn't yours. This isn't Alex's thing. This is my burden to bear. This is your burden to bear. But I like the name of the segment. Shilluminati suggested multiple times now on the reddit this week.

We're not shilling. Shilluminati is a very private organization. I'm not shilling. That's the thing, you know, the shilluminati, it's a little bit more exclusive. They don't have a public facing podcast. It's just for members. It's similar, similar show. They don't have weekly episodes.

They don't have good, like monthly art. They don't give pre-sale on stuff. They don't get access to a discord like our incredible Patreon. I want you to go to a patreon.com slash shilluminati pod. It's it's I look, I hesitate to call it a wonderland. But I don't know why, you know, because it really is. Why would you hold back? I don't know.

It's I think it's just my, you know, quiet, demure nature. But I you know what, fuck it. It's a wonderland. Patreon.com slash shilluminati pod. It's a wonderland. Come join the wonderland with your cat. Get on, get on in there and find out what I'm what I mean by that. And then after you do so, go buy a uniform over at the eddie.com slash

collection slash shilluminati. Okay. The Jeff the Mongoose t-shirt, isn't that shit great? The Jeff shirt is awesome. The long sleeve is awesome. That's like a whole, like if you love the X files opening credits, that's your shirt. You know what I mean?

So good. And then look at the moth. Look at the moth pin. Mothman pin. He's so adorable. Mothman. The Mothman pin. He's a cute boy.

He can be like our mascot. Have you seen him, Jesse? I have. I'm sorry. I was busy thinking about wonderland and what futures we would be if we were in wonderland. And obviously, Alex is a door mouse. Is the door mouse.

I'm a door mouse. Obviously. I would say that's actually like, you're the first person in like 10 years who hasn't been like, you know who you remind me of? That fucking stoned ass goofy ass caterpillar. No, no, no. You're the door mouse. You're the door mouse.

I'll take that. Mathis is the jabberwocky. Easy. Easy jabberwocky. Easy. That's fine. I'm cool with that. Who are you?

Me. I've always felt that I was one of those oysters. You know what I'm saying? The sad little oysters. The sad little oysters. The trusting little baby oysters. Yeah. You know, that's what I've thought about myself.

Devoured by a giant walrus. Yeah. That or who's the guy who hangs out with the walrus? The carpenter. Yeah. The carpenter. That or the rabbit? One of the two.

You know, I could be anyone. I could be anyone. Yeah. You're multifaceted, Jesse. But Mathis is definitely the jabberwocky. 100%. It's no context. No snag or whatever the hell the jabberwocky does.

The band or snatch. One of those damn snag. The band or snatch. All right. Tom slash band or snatch your attention. And we've got to shift gears right here because it's time for part two, boys, of the final part of the Betty and Barney Hill story. If you don't recall, when last we left the hills, they had just experienced a weird UFO

occurrence followed by a chunk of missing time. They saw a strange upward falling star in the distance that danced and moved like a paddle ball. It would dip below the tree line and above it, seemingly following them before briefly disappearing and then swooping directly in front of their car, forcing them to turn off the main highway onto a dirt road, attempting to escape whatever this large orange ball of light was. Whatever immediately followed or rather, what immediately followed was a series of intense

buzzing, which is where their memories begin to black out only to be regained again with another series of intense buzzing on the car. After they made it home, but and out of their clothing, which was all scuffed and ripped and dirty, they had realized two hours of time had suddenly disappeared, where once they were supposed to arrive at 330 in the morning, they ended up arriving at 530. The following days were filled with confusion, bizarre experiments on the car and discussions with Betty's family, a physicist, and long discussions with Pee's Air Force Base and Project Blue Book directly in the days that followed.

Wait, what going on with the car? Experiments? Yeah, remember they brought the compass outside and they were like, little like magnetic experiments that had the needle all spinning and stuff? Yes. All of this in the fruitless search and hope that they would find answers and figure out what happened in that two hour chunk of time. And by the end of 1961, the Hills had been no closer to an answer than they were the

day after they had gotten home on just how to remember what happened during that gap of time. All the while, Barney couldn't help but feel like something had happened to his genitals, but when he expected them, he never found... And that just the way... Yeah, just how it happens that I feel something. Something feels weird about my nuts. Something's wrong.

Let me go to the doctor. But he never, ever found any physical evidence for that first almost year or so of anything having happened at all until the end of 1961, where wart-like growths grew in a circle around the front of his genitals. Wait, so it took time for this to happen? Yeah, it did not show up right away. It took months. It took months for it to show up.

Now, all right, we need to ask this question. I gotta be the one. When you say a circular pattern around his genitals, we talking like on the ding dong or like... Where are we talking? So it's like on the ding dong, not the ball, the dick itself. Not the ball, the dick itself. Around the circumference? Yep, around the circle.

Around the circle. In a circle, around the tip, like up toward the front. In a circle, in a perfect circle? If you were cutting a zucchini in half, would you throw this part away? I haven't cooked a zucchini, so what part of the zucchini do you chop? All right, I don't want to. The end of the zucchini. Yes, you would cut this part away.

You would toss it. Now, here's my question. Yeah? How many bumps, like... We'll get to them, because they were... Not synergy. What is the word I'm looking at? What is the word I'm looking at?

A face. No, like one half of the face is... Symmetry. Symmetry, thank you. They were not perfectly symmetrical, as far as my understanding. But there were multiple little bumps in a perfect circle. Multiple, and they were removed and tested, and we'll talk about that when we get there. It was like a perfect circle.

A circle, yes. Around, yes, correct. It was a circle around the dick, but it was not... I mean, look. No mention, rather, in the research. My apologies to families, but this is important. I need to know this, because it does change if this is, you know, in a little STD-ish, or if it's aliens, you know what I'm saying?

Well, we'll get to that. I promise you we'll answer that question. If you tell me at the end that this man got, like, an STD, and that's what this was, I'll be real pissed off at all of you, apology. I mean, so bad. It was two episodes to just be like... And it was STD. How dare you?

No. It's so crazy, because up until this detail of the story, I can imagine, like, with perfect cinema visuals, like, everything that happened, you know what I mean? Like, we say, you know, it's a very influential UFO story. And because of that, like, all the imagery that's out there, like, in movies and TV, it, like, helps me imagine, like, this whole story perfectly. And then it's like, and then he grew a perfect circle of warts around his dick. Months later.

And you're like, huh? What? Unfortunately, and we'll talk, we're going to get to it. Barney, out of the two of them, Barney had the worst of the experiences in terms of his abduction and the health effects that ended up happening afterward. This kind of wart-like situation kind of begins Barney's approximate eight-year health tumble that eventually ends with Barney's passing. As the years continued, Barney begins to suffer from intense headaches, insomnia, high blood

pressure, and an ulcer that would not respond to traditional treatment. As for the gross that he had, at first, the doctor had assumed it was venereal warts. However, rather, after they were removed and looked at, it was determined that this is not what they were. They were actually unsure as to what caused them or what they were, but they were benign and simply removed for cosmetic purposes. All the while, Barney struggled with his new job and commute in the constant concern of their story getting out and ruining their reputation.

To top it off, as the months turned into years and the Hill's search for help continued, Betty began to have horrible nightmares, waking up screaming and shouting in her sleep, crying and confused. According to Betty, the dream itself was reoccurring but always disjointed. Some nights, the nightmares would be taking place aboard a mysterious craft as beings forced experiments upon her, while other times the nightmare took place in their car as they were taken away but rarely in a sequence that made sense. They eventually would book an appointment with a psychiatrist in March of 1962 by the name

of Patrick Quirk, who, upon hearing their story, simply said the pair should just wait it out and hope the memories are turned on their own. By 1963, Barney's health had deteriorated to such a degree that he had to take a three-month leave of absence from work. When he was brought to the doctor, they could find nothing wrong whatsoever and were convinced that his sicknesses were psychosomatic. Yet, no matter how much they treated his ulcers, they would not close, continually causing him pain.

And yet, they continued to search for answers for that missing time all the while, hoping it would come one day. And they would nearly four years after the event took place when they were referred to a Dr. Benjamin Simon, a psychiatrist who specialized in hypnosis. They first consulted with Dr. Simon on December 14th, 1963, and even though the doctor was skeptical about the existence of UFOs, he took on the hills because he believed that whatever happened, breaking through to it would, at the very least, help with Barney's health. Dr. Simon's history as a psychiatrist and with hypnosis was actually completely entrenched

in helping returning soldiers combat their PTSD, and his results had been good, where he was able to effectively help alleviate the symptoms of the PTSD that his patients were experiencing. Can I ask what the current thoughts are on this? Do we have like... Yeah, we're gonna cover hypnosis here in a little bit and just talk about what it scientifically does, that kind of thing. So with the doctor in hand and some hope for finding answers, the hills began their three

weeks of initial conditioning where Dr. Simon would slowly bring them further and further into deeper and deeper trance-like states, easing them into the process before even touching the traumatic events that occurred. While Betty and Barney were both able to be placed into hypnotic trances, it's important to note that Betty's was noticeably less deep than Barney's. So here's where we're gonna actually talk a little bit about what hypnosis is, what it is, what it isn't, what it can do and what you should take from anybody who goes to hypnosis for therapy.

So first of all, let's be clear, this podcast is not a science podcast, in case you boys weren't aware, we don't do science stuff. You're saying those pies aren't actually the best pies? I mean, will we get a Lake City quiet pill if we don't say they're the best? We don't know about a talking mongoose, so... Scientifically, research. Just talking about mongoose. Just reminding everyone.

I read the articles on the internet that I stole it from, yeah. But with that out there, that disclaimer, I'm gonna do my best to say in like layman's terms what hypnosis does and what it's good for, as I imagine there are a ton of misconceptions out there about what hypnosis actually is. First question. Yes. Can I use it to make someone fall in love with me? Like some sort of erotic fiction.

No. No. No. No. Okay. Not at all. That's not at all how it works. Through Pornhub?

Like in the comments section? I'm just saying, you know, I've been giving hope and that's not the case. You can't trick someone into loving you? No. Is that... What? I know. All the lies out there, we're gonna dash from Jesse so you can find love.

With truth on your side and not having to mind control somebody. Aw, man. Here I was all these years of hypnotic courses. So how much... You spent a lot of money on that? I mean, a lot is a relative term. Okay. Right.

How much is a lot when you're searching for love? Yeah. I don't want to know. It's gonna depress me. I mean like stalking. I don't want to know how much it is. What? It's gonna depress me no matter what the number is.

That's where all the Illuminati money goes by the way. That's where all the Illuminati money goes. Thanks for your support. It's all been funneled into me learning hypnosis. I have not. I'm so sorry. I didn't... It's him and a guy with like paper curtains on Venice Boulevard.

The guy in Santa Monica with a snake wrapped around him on the pier. He's trying to teach me. He has a white linens. He has a big ass snake to hypnotize me but it's weird. Well, we'll talk about that misconception in a second but the first one I want to address is that hypnotherapy is a bunch of bullshit and doesn't work at all. This is incorrect. It does work.

Hypnotherapies help countless people from simple things like adjusting behavior for a habit they didn't like like trying to quit smoking. That's a couple people who've done that. Yeah. Has it worked for them? One person really like a hundred percent it worked and for another person they ended up smoking again. Yeah.

Makes sense. I mean, do they tell you about what factors? I mean, do they just come out of it? I no longer require cigarettes. What happened? I don't really know. I don't think Alex knows. I imagine it's over the course of many weeks and months continual subtle conditioning

suggestibility that when and then so like building a bad behavior like when you pick up a cigarette you kind of get like the sick feeling. Maybe they just weren't into smoking to begin with and they don't like maybe they were like poser smokers. If anybody listeners have experienced with hypnotherapy, please throw your experience up on the subject. I would love to know. Yeah, I know nothing about it at all.

Truly. I only know what I read on science and science articles and shit. So it's all just. Exceptually, it seems wild, but I do know that for some people it does work. So there I feel like there has to be something to it. Brains are weird, man. The problem is is that most hip hip notizers, hypnotists, hypnotists. Thank you.

No masters. Hypno therapists. The problem is most mind masters. Mesmer lords. They'll tell you that you have to be willing to like let yourself be hypnotized. Yes. Which to me is always the first like way is this real? Like when you have to say something like that, that's why I'm like I hear people

that works for I'm like, how I don't I just don't get it. Not a lot of people can actually can it work? Well, there's actually I have a number for you here in a minute on how many people can in general speaking can actually are suggestible back that. Sure, unfortunately, though, Jesse, as this next kind of topic, hypnosis is not mind control and no point is the person undergoing hypno therapy being mindwiped or made some sort of manchurian candidate. Emotep.

Even the more theatrical hypnosis tricks like making someone like a food they don't normally like ends up wearing out usually within a few hours. So what you're saying is. The the class that's probably listening to this episode, it's not it's not what I said earlier. Right, your teacher. Thank them for inviting you to listen to this episode. We are now educational podcast.

Thanks. Yeah, we've been we're now educational and I have ruined that for everyone. It was 15 years ago. The government would be partially funding this podcast. That's you are correct. Yeah, so it was not mind control. It is a state of deep suggestion and each person is not at all affected by hypnosis the same as any other person. In fact, only approximately about 30 percent of the population on earth

is is suggestible in hypnosis enough for even for it to even be performed on them in this level. And even within that 30 percent, the degree at which some can be brought into a trance like state varies, as we'll see when like Betty and Barney. They are both suggestible, but Barney is much more suggestible than Betty ended up being. However, hypnosis doesn't immediately also bring out truth. For instance, you can't take a criminal who refuses to tell the truth, throw him into hypnosis chamber and bring out the truth with hypnosis

and use it as evidence in court. What hypnosis does is bring out what the person's perceives to be the truth. While Betty and Barney may have well and truly had an other worldly experience, it is also possible that they encountered some form of government testing or abduction in that case, as we discussed last episode. But the brain does wild things when an experience is trauma. And the brain chemistry physically changes when a human being is put through intense trauma.

So if they were betrayed or abused by our own government that night, their minds may have changed to aliens for some reason or another. The brain maybe just accepted it easier for them. And if they weren't going to be allowed to forget, then the brain automatically would would register and change the people into these alien like creatures. I'm not saying this is what happened. A lot of things don't line up for that to necessarily be the case, but you get the idea. This is what what hypnosis does would bring forward the idea to them.

The aliens were real. And so that's the memory you get when put under hypnosis. Moreover, it's also pretty easy to generate fake memories while under hypnotherapy, if the hypnotherapist isn't being careful. And this is why you always want to go with a professional. When in an easily suggestible state, you want your questions and directions to be clear, concise and as neutral as possible. Anything other than that can lead and sort of paint the questions and answers

leading to answers that might make sense under the context of the question. For example, if Betty said something like they came to our car, the therapist might want to say what happens next as opposed to what do the people do next? One simply urges you to move forward with information while the other implies that the figures did do something next. And so she might make up what they those things ended up doing. If they do you understand the example I'm kind of giving here? Sure. Yeah.

It's like very like just sort of like you're almost like acting. You're guiding them. You don't want to push them in a direction or direct them. Yeah. And being like a director and being like, I want you to tell me what the people did next. You got to let them do their own thing. It's kind of like a improv exercise in a way. Yeah. So going into hypnotherapy sessions,

it's just important to kind of keep all that in mind when it comes to what hypnosis and hypnotherapy actually does. After three weeks of preparation beginning on February 22, 1964, Dr. Simon began doing individual hypnotic regressions with the hills, keeping them separate so they would not taint one another sessions themselves. The sessions lasted were once a week over the course of six months. And by the end, Dr. Simon concluded that while he still wasn't sure if what they experienced was truly otherworldly in nature,

it was certain that they both truly believed it to be true. What I'm going to do is take the event and retell it from the moment of the buzzing on the car and put it in chronological order. But it's important to note that as they were going through this in therapy, this did not come out in chronological order. Events would come forth before others over the course of the six months until the whole picture had been formed. And this is all based on hypnotic regression.

But yeah, both of their accounts over the course of multiple. And you can actually go listen to most of it online. The whole thing isn't made on made available online, but you can get the transcript of the whole thing if you wanted to pretty easily nowadays. It's a little harrowing at points. And it's very harrowing. We got a couple more clips.

We'll be playing this episode of Betty. I'm excited for this. I'm excited for this. So, yeah. So and I just want to reiterate, I feel bad for Barney during all this. Dude got shafted in this. If this is like just to take the story at its face value for Barney had a bad time, dude, Barney compared to Betty, especially.

Sounds it really sounds like he did. It's a great it's it's miserable. But it's it's kind of funny at some point. So here's what happened next, according to. So as Barney turned off the highway under the dirt road, which is where we're going to pick up the car was hit with that intense vibrations. And that's when their conscious memory fades. So here's what happened next, according to Barney

in one of his therapy sessions, quote, I made a turn and I never knew this. I don't know why I had to make that turn. I was lost. I saw I was on a strange area of highway and I had never been there before. And I was being stopped. I was very uncomfortable. But somehow the eyes were telling me that I should be calm and that I would not be harmed and to relax.

And I saw these men coming down the road toward me. So when he talks about his eyes, what Barney is talking about is all the while when he's having these these thoughts of like, don't be violent, behave, like just kind of go along with it. He says he feels the presence of like these eyes pressuring into his own eyes and they kind of like suggesting him to kind of do what he's doing. That's how he turns off the car initially and all this stuff. He feels like he's supposed to at this point in the session.

Dr. Simon asks him if he is certain he didn't dream this or make this up. And Barney replies rather emphatically that this is not a dream. And this did happen. With trees on both sides of them, they were stopped by a group of men at the curve of the road they had found themselves on. As Barney brought the vehicle to a stop, the group of men began walking toward them, separating into two groups, flanking both sides of the car. As they approached, Barney tried to start the car and get away.

But it's then that he realized that the car was completely dead and refused to start or turn over. Barney told Betty he thought it was the men from the craft that he saw earlier in the field. Remember, he saw them through in the binoculars from last episode, which caused Betty to immediately begin weeping. Betty wanted to run and reach for the car door handle only for the car door to be opened as she grabbed grasp onto it by the men who are now immediately

outside the car door on both sides. Barney didn't move, but remembered thinking not to reach for his gun. That if he did so, that he would be harmed. His car door then opened as well, and he felt eyes get incredibly close to him until he closed his eyes completely and fell into a trance like state after a little bit of fighting. There were three initially, but eventually six on Barney's side and four on Betty's, with one standing a bit further back, observing

the whole scenario would play out. And what they saw might ring a few bells for alien aficionados out there. They were small, bald men, no more than five feet tall, with a large head and large almond shaped eyes that went just to the sides of their head. Their eyes were completely black. They had slits for mouths with a type of membrane that seemed to waggle over their mouth when they spoke to each other in their native language, whatever that might be.

Yeah, yes, it kind of, yes. And they had tiny flat slits for noses. Their bodies had larger than average chest with just this proportion of arms and legs. They all wore jumpsuits as well, and they were your mostly classic gray aliens. After the doors opened, they each were put in a slight trance state where it seemed like they were aware of what they were doing, but they had no control over it.

Barney, though, like I said, didn't want to go down easy and tried to fight them off when they opened the door. However, the fight didn't last long before he was quickly also put into that trance like state. Two of the creatures placed their arms around Barney, whose eyes had now been closed, and they pulled him from the vehicle, dragging him forward toward the glowing ship, but only his feet dragged, causing the scuff on his shoes. For small creatures, they had incredible strength.

It seemed Betty had a bit of a better experience coming out of the car as one of the grays simply placed out his hand and Betty fell into a small trance, leaving the car willingly and being escorted by the group of figures, not carried away like Barney. This would be. Literally, I can't think of something scarier than that. Yeah, it's it's rough. It's it's all very strange, too.

And I only get stranger as they began walking. Can I ask you a question called? Yes, please. You mentioned something that is driving me crazy. Yes, that the way they described these aliens. Yeah, is familiar to a lot of people because it's like the universalist. What aliens are like? I'm is this the first technical alien encounter? I mean, like like of this third kind with this of this detail.

Yeah, but like I think there's been there and they hung out with the aliens. Yeah, it's like I'm curious if this is one of those like chicken egg scenarios where the reason we all associated with it is because this was the first and everyone else is just like, yeah, yeah, yeah, no, they're a little tiny big, right, dudes, and right, is that? Yeah, well, I mean, yeah, that's exact. I mean, that's exactly the question about this case, right? It's like this is the one, right?

Like this is the case in every way. Like a couple driving around the road, there's a bright light. Something's following them. They like lose time. They like feel extremely violated by these little bald dudes. Like, you know, it's there's other encounters across the world of bizarre kind of alien encounters. But this is the first one like Alex was saying there.

This is the first one that is widely publicized like this and has this known template going forward. The very least the first time this template of an abduction scenario is put on the public stage to this degree. This is like the first time we really see something like this. Interesting. Yeah, I keep thinking like, well, this is unique. But it's no longer unique to us because every abduction scenario almost is like this.

And so back then. Yeah. And so the this scenario is interesting because it's like they obviously didn't copy it. But the fact that everyone's like, well, this like this is the template for alien abduction. Now I'm just like, everyone else just be copying these two. But yeah, but it's weird. Like, well, you'll see like the man, the strangeness that happens is just

it's funny and just bizarre. We'll push on, though. As they were walking from their car to the ship, Betty recalled the following. She says, and this is during one of her regressions. I'm struggling to wake up and at the bottom of a deep well and I got to get out. Everything is black. I'm fighting to become conscious slowly and gradually. I start to become conscious.

I struggled to open my eyes for a moment and then they close again. I keep fighting. I'm dazed and I have a far away feeling. Then I win the battle and my eyes are opened. I am amazed. And quote, it's interesting that so Betty was able to actually break through more or less this trance like state that they had her. She was kind of conscious the whole time and she's very eagerly trying to fight

it and she's able to break through as before that even make it over to the ship. Meanwhile, Barney is not whatsoever. And it's interesting because in the in hypnotherapy as well. I was just thinking that I was just thinking that. Correct. Betty is much harder to bring into a deeper trance than Barney. So if there's similar tactics for whatever is happening, I do wonder if Betty is just more of a hard, like a hard-headed person to kind of put under.

From here, she goes on to try and wake Barney up, but he remains completely unresponsive. So I'm actually going to play a clip from one of Betty's hypno sessions where she describes what happens next. Do we keep walking? And I try to wake Barney up again, he said, Barney, Barney, wake up. And he doesn't show the man said, he can ask me again. He said, is Barney his name? Then I would ask him so that he says,

he says, don't be afraid. You don't have any reason to be afraid. We're not going to have you. But we just want to do some tests. With a test of roflwhip, we'll take you with body back and put you with your car. You'll be on your way back home at no time. And that's that's left there because she kind of goes on to keep kind of going over that part. But so, yeah, she snaps out of it and she keeps calling for Barney to wake up.

And though there's one of them that seems to be able to speak their language and he speaks English in a very accent, heavily accented tone. And when she calls for Barney, he continues, he asks, oh, is Barney his name? Is Barney his name? And she refuses to acknowledge it until at the end where she's like, what are we doing? And they told him not to be afraid. So that's what happened after she snapped out of more or less after her little trance there.

These guys are liars because then Barney dies. Eight years later, he could be. But he died because you're telling me earlier, he got Dick's circle and then he died. But we don't even know that he's related to that. And then he died. I'm just saying. I have lots of thoughts. Maybe it was just, you know, I think they lied to her. I think these aliens are dicks.

I mean, you just ate a lot of processed food. They might have. What was that? Maybe you just ate a lot of processed foods. It's just that was it. That was the end of his life. You know, like if I got abducted by aliens, I might change my dietary habits and not go outside as much.

I'm just saying I might be afraid of shit to go outside after that. Yeah, I might be really nervous. Yeah. Regardless, after that walk to the craft, after that short walk, they were brought to the craft rather. And the craft itself was an oval metallic vehicle that landed on the ground. The rim of the oval ship was tilted slightly down and a ramp extended from that lip down to the ground.

At this point, they had gripped Betty due to her actually being awake and actually put up a little bit of a fight to try and break free. But she she ripped her dress in the process in a small struggle. But as they reached the ship at this point, Betty thought to herself, quote, the heck with it? I don't have any control here. They've already got Barney close to being on board, so I might as well stop fighting and go ahead and behave myself.

End quote. And so she stepped aboard the craft with the other figures and Barney was dragged along behind. As the two were quickly separated into different rooms and Barney's recollection of this, he said the following quote, I'm out of my car and I'm going down the road into the woods. There's an orange glow. There's something there.

Oh, if only I had my gun. What do they want? The crazy eyes are the crazy eyes are with me. They're with me. We go up a ramp. My feet just bumped on a corridor. I don't want to go and I don't know where Betty is. The eyes are telling me to be calm.

I'll be calm. I'll be calm. If I'm not harmed, I won't strike out, but I will strike out if I am harmed in any way. I'm numb. I'm numb. I have no feeling in my fingers. My legs are numb. End quote.

I do not like the eyes. I do not like the eyes consistently present in his mind, more or less the way they kind of keep him subdued. So the rooms that they were brought into resembled that as they described as a hospital operating room. The bright overhead light gave a faint blue glow and the rooms each had an examining table that they were laid upon and left alone for a little while

before the creatures ended up returning. From this point, a sort of typical medical examination takes place for both of them, including a traditional neurological exam that took place with what looked to be an EEG without an actual tracing machine attached to it. I'm going to go through their individual experiences here because again, suffice to say, I think Barney got the shaft.

We'll start with Betty. After she's brought into her room, Betty's dress and shoes are removed and she is forced to lie in an examination table. The leader. This is something she continually calls them, by the way. The leader is the one that can communicate. This was the guy that was hanging back earlier.

Yep, the guy that was talking with them and all that stuff. The leader, the only one that can seemingly communicate and heavily accent in English begins to scrape her skin and examine her mouth. The skin flakes are taken and placed onto a fine cloth, gently folded and then taken away. Ear wax, hair clippings and nail clippings are also taken while being reassured

that nothing is going to hurt her and that she'll be fine. She is then given a neurological exam before the final examination procedure has to happen. Being told they are checking for pregnancy, they take a long needle with what Betty describes as a wire at the end of it and inserted it directly into her navel. Which ends?

The needle part into her navel. Had a nail? No, but I mean the nail. The other end had a wire at the end of it. I'm going to play the second Betty clip as she explains this part. And he said, just a simple test, and folks heard me and I asked him what. And he said, he just wants to put it in my navel.

Yes, it's just a simple test. I don't know what will happen, I don't know what. I don't know what. It even though I won't answer. And he said, for the navel, it's in my navel. And I said, after begging them to take the needle out after they placed it in, telling them how much it hurts,

it seemed to finally dawn on the leader that she was in some sort of pain. And he simply waved his hand in front of her eyes and all the pain vanished completely. At which point they finished their examination and removed the needle. Betty described the sensation of the needle like being stabbed with a knife in the stomach.

This is where things start to get a little bizarre for Betty though. And to this point, the examiner attempts to remove her dress completely. And this is where the zipper ends up ripping. The examiner tried to take the dress off and meddled with the zipper in the back, but clearly was unable to figure out how it worked,

tugging at it, pulling at the cloth, trying to pull it apart. So Betty reached behind herself and began to unzip it. Once it was clear how the zipper worked, the creature then reached up and helped her unzip it all the way where they were able to take the dress off. This hyper-technical alien creature

had been completely baffled by a zipper on a dress. I mean, did not understand it. I kind of like that detail because it kind of like humanizes these guys a little bit. They're all just a bunch of little bald guys, right? Yeah, so basically the people about are these little bald people who are not talking to Betty. They're all mumbling to each other.

And then one that seems to be the leader that kind of keeping them calm and keeping them under control while discussing things with the others. And then one of the ones that doesn't speak English is trying to like take his dress off. She calls him the examiner. Just couldn't figure it out.

Yeah, it just seems so realistic to me. I don't know, it makes the whole story more believable to hear that things like that were going on because it just seems like something you wouldn't consider in like a normal alien scenario that probably would happen, you know what I mean? Yeah, it's weird. It's funny as hell to think about the little grays

just like tugging at the dress, just being like, can't, not under able to comprehend how the hell is working. They would be completely screwed on prom night. They would be done for. They would be the best date for any father, though. Yeah, that's true. It's true.

They'd be like... So after she takes her dress off, what they end up doing is examining her spinal column, seemingly counting the number of vertebrae that go from her neck down to her, down to the bottom. And then afterward that they're done with her. And she's left to sit there as the examiner leaves the room.

The leader explains to Betty that they can only do one exam at a time to the examiner headed out to go to Barney's room next. And she is left alone with the leader where she engages in what can only be described as polite conversation. She tells the leader that no one is gonna believe this experience

and she wants some kind of proof to bring back and show these people that she was indeed aboard this weird alien ship with real actual aliens. The leader at this seems bemused and asked Betty what she would like to take with her as evidence. And so Betty looking around grabs a book and asked to keep it.

As she opens it, she describes it being written in vertical lines and varying thickness with symbols that she simply did not understand. She asked the leader if she could take this home considering this being proof that nobody could refute and the leader saw no harm and simply agreed to it. All the while a smaller alien with a rounder head stands outside of her examining room

glaring at her with an unfriendly face the whole while. And when Barney, I mean, and when Betty was eventually brought off the ship he took the book from her not allowing her to take the book off the ship. He's probably an unorthodox alien. Yeah, yeah, take a book, who cares? I can't imagine, like out of all the stories we always get

not one can I ever think of wearing aliens. Like, yeah, take what you want. It's fine, you'll be good. It seems that seems so much more believable to me. Why would they need to be like, we don't exist. Don't tell anyone, you know? But then the mean grumpy looking little alien boy said no and said and took it away.

Maybe the smaller they are, the more distinguished they are. Maybe that's part of their culture. That's it, the shorter, the higher and the power rankings. Yeah, maybe that was his dad out there. That was the leader's dad. He was letting his son try like one, like one interrogation.

All right, well, English is pretty good. Yeah, like go with fishing. He's taking his boy human fishing. Yeah, just one catch and release. He's like, no, before he left the ship, though, Betty's curiosity in that room with the leader continued inquiring the leader about his home planet. He asks in return if she knows anything about the universe

in which Betty replied some basics, but really not much else. He walks her over to her nearby wall and pulls forth from a tube an oblong map with lots of white dots with lines connecting them. Some of the lines solid and some of the lines dashed and dotted. Think of it, the thing that it's best to compare it to in my mind, Jesse, think of the, and Alex, if you're familiar with it, the Star Wars tabletop RPG,

you know, the galaxy map and all the trade routes and stuff with the different dotted lines. That's exactly what I was going to say, yeah. Exactly like that. He explains that why the dots I mean, quiet. I have so many, I have so many things that I'm like, wait, why? All right. He explains that all the different dots are different stars

in the universe and Betty asked what all the lines were. And the leader explains that the solid lines are trade routes and the dotted lines are expeditions. Betty then asked the leader where he was from on the map and he returned asked her if she knew where Earth was on the map, at which point she said no and was unable to point it out. He then answered that it would be pointless to point out where he was from on the map, as she had no idea

even where they were on the map now. Makes sense. And then he and then he put the map away. And that was the end of the discussion. While they were all talking, though, as the map is getting put away, a group of grays come in all excited, mumming and humming to each other and what Benny and Barney both described as a weird noise that came out of their mouth. And that's when they noticed the membrane when they made

these particular noises, like a membrane in their mouth would flap back and forth. OK. These new these grays come back in the room with Betty and the leader and they shuffle over to Betty and quickly begin to examine Betty's teeth without saying a word. Betty obviously confused, looks over to the leader as to what's happening. And he simply explains that they are very confused. In the other room, Barney's teeth.

He had been examined the whole time and his teeth came out because he had dentures and they were unsure why his teeth came out. But hers did not. So they were just in there trying to pull at her teeth and just being like, me, me, like, do these come out? Nope. And then they were just completely baffled by what dentures were. She then explains when when I asked when the leader then asked why his teeth came out and hers didn't, she explained that it was because of old age.

And the leader then followed up with asking what age is. As he she does her best to explain that as time goes, they get older and eventually they pass the leader then answers that they have no concept of age and time. There is no death for them in that way. He was also confused about the color yellow as she was bringing up her favorite color because he asked or no, it was bringing up the color. She was bringing up the color of her favorite vegetable because he asked

about vegetables as well, and she was trying to explain what vegetables were. And so it led into the idea of like, what is yellow? What is vegetables? They had they didn't have any understanding of what these foods were and certain colors were, which is a bizarre note because their ship did make yellow lights and orange lights in the sky. So them not knowing what yellow is, maybe it's a miscommunication. It's another very bizarre point between Betty and the leader.

But this confusion as to what the color yellow is when their ship also kind of made that light is kind of bizarre. These details only underline the reality of the story for me. They're so wackadoo, crazy. It's like an improv scene about being in space. And I'm like, I believe it. It's really a great improv scene. What are vegetables?

I don't know. What is yellow? Um, afterward, Barney's examination finished up. They are led back to the car. A member of the crew took the book from her, as I stated earlier, and the leader informed her that she and Barney would not be allowed to remember the encounter. When Betty rebuked this notion, the the leader applied, quote,

maybe you will remember. I don't know. I hope you don't, but maybe you will. But it won't do you any good if you do because Barney won't. Barney won't remember a single thing. And not only that, if you should remember anything at all, he's going to remember it differently from you. And all you're going to do is get each other so confused, you won't know what's going on.

It would be better if you forget it anyway, end quote. The leader escorts Betty and Barney to the car and the Hills check on Delcy, their dog, who they found curled up in a tight ball under their back seat, then resume their journey home after another series of buzzing sounds. And that's where her abduction story ends. Barney's is a little different, not massively, but he got a bit of a harder shaft for one.

He didn't have the leader there the whole time. Nobody was there to communicate with him. He was only being influenced through the eyes in his mind to keep him calm. After being taken aboard the ship, Barney is taken down the ship's corridor and into a room he describes as a hospital rating room or a hospital operating room. Barney, Barney narrates his exam as the following. And we're just going to put Barney's own words as to as to what happened to him. Quote, I felt my shoes being removed and my pants being opened.

And I could hear a humming like sound that they seem to be making. They pulled my pants all the way down to where my legs were. I could feel them turning me over and putting something into my rectum. It was like a tube. It was not painful. I thought it was just a little larger than a pencil. I felt to go in very easily and then it was withdrawn. They looked at my back as if they were counting my spinal column,

much like they did with Betty. I felt something touch right at the base of my spine, like a finger pushing a single finger. I could only hear this mum, mum, mum, mum, mum, mum, mum. And then he in the actual audio, he just goes into this rapid humming noise. And he says, so this mum like sound and then I was turned over again and my mouth was opened and I could feel two fingers pulling it back. And then I heard as some men came in and I could hear them rustling around

the left side of the table as I was laying and oh, something scratched very lightly, like a stick on my arm and these men left. Now I was left with what I thought were three men, the two that brought me in and the other one that seemed to follow these two men. I could tell that there was more than one person in the room, but only one man seemed to be moving around my body all the time. That's the end of his recollection of that point. Later, Barney recounted that the examiner also checked his ears,

adding that the examiner seemed particularly interested in Barney's bone structure. Barney explains that something was placed around his genitals and then he felt a tug or a pressure or something, but he did not achieve erection, nor did he get to ejaculate. So it was just something tugging and pulling on his dick the whole time. He thinks it was like a try at getting him to. We don't know. We don't know. We have no idea what it was.

Yes, would be my guess, but that's just because I'm using other abduction scenarios as like a to fill in for what I assume is happening. But it was in this area that the concentric ring of warts appeared during the time of reliving the examination. The growths actually became inflamed, and that's why they initially had to be removed, because as he was going through in the regression of the examination, his warts were just getting worse.

What got inflamed via the real time. Yeah, like over the course of a few weeks and going through it. But yeah, of course, a few weeks. The growth is removed for more cosmetic purposes than as a medical necessity. And after the medical exam is complete, he then too is escorted back to the car where he accidentally sits on his gun and checks on Delci.

He waits for Betty to enter the car. And when she does, they watch the UFO become a glowing orange ball and fly off. Barney negotiates the negotiates the bend in the road and heads back to route three. They hear the rhythmic buzzing sounds again and the missing time reconnects with conscious memory. So if we are to believe if we take it all face value boys, that is what occurred during that two hour chunk of time that they were missing after their car got stopped.

Wow, I mean, that is. It's like a template, like a perfect template. With weirdness involved in funny, bizarre aliens, not understanding earth stuff involved and all the things you would think kind of go along with it. With the added kind of twist of Betty's bizarre, light, like brunch talk. I love the idea of them being like alone in the room like. What do you got?

Veggies, what's vegetable? What the hell is that? I don't know. It's great. It's so weird. So that so that was in 1964 after after they finally over the course of six months were able to kind of put this together and find this piece.

Barney truly seemed like he found peace in some regard. And while Dr. Simon at the end did not necessarily believe that they this is exactly what happened. He was happy to see that it seemed to have at least have a positive effect on their lives. After six months of checking to and from Dr. Simon's office and despite still having lingering questions, Betty and Barney were feeling better. They threw themselves into their social and political agendas

and they promoted civil rights and fought to end discrimination through their civil work. This is all post-hypnosis life at this point. Through their civil work with the Unitarian Church, the hills were made on voice to the United Nations. Barney made several speeches across the Eastern seaboard for the NAACP and was a frequent guest speaker at the Portsmouth Naval Shipyard. No shit. Betty, Betty threw herself into work for the Democratic Party in the 1964

election and because of their tireless work, the hills were invited guests at Lyndon B. Johnson's inaugural ceremonies. What? Fuck. Yeah, man. Barney was given some very prestigious positions due to his endless work with civil rights. In May of 1965, he was appointed to the New Hampshire State Advisory Committee to the U.S. Commission on Civil Rights for a term ending on the 31st of December, 1966. And in July, 1965, he was nominated to the Human Rights Commission for the state of New Hampshire.

Suffice to say, things started turning around. Unfortunately, it wouldn't last. In August of 1965, the hills received a phone call from their friend Adele Dara, saying that they were reported by the name of John Luttrell, who wanted to interview them concerning their abduction. The word of the story had gotten out since they had spoken to so many people about it. And now an actual article was going to be written about them. Betty and Barney Hill declined the interview, simply wanting to put the whole thing behind them.

Luttrell called Barney, revealing that he knew personal facts about their lives and requested an appointment to discuss with them. Again, they denied and Betty was afraid if their abduction story got out, then she might lose her job at the time, which was a child welfare worker at this particular point. And they found out later that despite denying them, Luttrell had still gone to their house while they were out and sat on their porch for over half of an hour, for over an hour and a half until eventually he left and got frustrated.

Luttrell continued to pester the hills, going through their friends to glean more information, basically playing telephone with anybody who might have heard anything from the hills in terms of their story. And in response, Barney got in contact with two lawyers in an attempt to force a cease and desist. Unfortunately, he was informed that so long as his medical confidentiality isn't violated, that he had no legal recourse to stop Luttrell from digging into their lives. That is insane. Yeah, it sucks. Luttrell went behind the hills back and interviewed friends about the hypnosis.

He actually acquired a copy of the Blue Book file and managed to get a copy of Walter Webb's final report on the situation without Webb's knowledge. Now, keep in mind the the Project Blue Book file, or it says it's a scam. It said it was a hoax and that it was the tracking light. Remember that we talked about last time. So that's like the art information he's getting from these side things. Armed with all of this, Luttrell felt he had more than enough to go ahead and write the article with or without the hills interview, despite repeatedly failing to get in touch with them.

And on Monday, October 25th, 1965, the hills worst fears were realized. They were inundated with international or international phone calls asking questions about the article in the Boston Traveler named the UFO Chiller. Did they did they seize the couple? Reporters and civilians mobbed the couple trying to get more information every day. At one point, they actually took Salas over at P's Air Force Base because one of the lieutenants they had befriended wanted to get them out of the media circus and just give them a day without the chaos. And that was Betty recalls in one of her later interviews in later life is one of the more peaceful days of that era

because of how relentlessly they had been hounded once this article hit. That is crazy. It's a shitty thing to do. After the article went live in the papers, the hills visited family visited family nearby to let them know what was going on and to get their positions on it. On their way home, they repair. They reported that they saw a red orange light bouncing directly in front of their vehicle about 200 yards back from the highway. It traveled over a nearby pond across an adjacent field and over the treetops ascending and descending over the trees at different heights.

Clearly remembering the event from four years ago, Barney break the car and the craft stopped as well. It rocked back and forth and landed behind a nearby wooded area. The hills went to go investigate, but the craft had landed across a stretch of impassable swamp land. They had no desire to risk approaching in the dark, so they went back to their car and they began to wonder if the beings had abducted them were coming back because the story had become public. The response to the article was immense and there were 3,000 requests for reprints and since requests for additional information were beginning to snowball, they decided to speak publicly about the incident for the very first time. On the 7th of November, 1965, an open forum at the Pierce Memorial Unitarian Universalist Church in the neighboring city of Dover.

400 seats were filled with people standing in the hallways, the basement and outside, hoping to learn more about their alien tale. The hills were introduced by Lieutenant Alan Brandt, the Public Information Officer at P's Air Force Base. The Lieutenant was dressed in uniform and explained that the Air Force took UFO reports seriously and that all sightings should be reported. Betty and Barney Hill took the stage next and they said they would and in fact could only speak to their conscious memory and nothing else. Barney explained that the publication of the article had happened without their cooperation or even consent and that they had hope to maintain confidentiality about the whole experience. After they finished speaking, they opened up to the floor to questions and the session which lasted more than an hour. One person actually asked Barry if he was happy to be there and the response was, quote, my wife says to say I'm happy to be here. So I'm guess I'm happy to be here.

Damn. And quote, everyone ended up laughing. And we know in the end, three years later, Barney would pass away and for the next few decades, Betty would go out trying to research more about UFOs, doing more questions and answers at conventions and stuff like that and helping as much as she could in the political life as well. But that's the end of the Betty and Barney Hill aspect of the story. The last thing we want to talk about is, of course, a few of the theories as to what people believe it is, what you boys believe happened, if anything at all. And that will end the Betty and Barney Hill series here on Jaluminati. So the first one, the one that's kind of predominant is the dream theory.

As I stated earlier in this episode, Betty started having really bad nightmares during the couple of years where they were trying to figure out what happened. And they would wake up Barney as well. She'd have a very vocal. One of the theories is that Barney took her dreams over the course of months and it kind of sat into a subconscious. And that is what ended up filling those two hours during those hypnotherapy is was he was pulling memories of what he remembered. Betty was having as part of the nightmare. The issue is that is that what he recollects and what she was dreaming don't line up. However, what he recollects and what Betty recollects under hypnosis does line up.

So because the dream is off, the dream is not it's like it's it's it's very dreamlike. There's aspects of it that fit their regression and then there are aspects of it that just don't match whatsoever. However, their hypnotic regressions both line up pretty fucking close one to one. So that's that's kind of the theory as far as that is concerned. The other theory is that there are there are a ton of people that that stick to the light in the sky theory that it was simply just if it wasn't something advertising something, it was a light being driven by a truck being brought somewhere to advertise something the next day. And that's what the light in the sky ended up being. How does that like connect?

Like, are is it is the idea that they like that both are true? That they like had a freak out on the side of the road. And then later we're like, it's your dreams. Yeah, the no, they're saying the freak out on the on the side of the road caused Betty's dreams. And then Betty's dreams were reciprocated back into buying. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. Exactly. Which doesn't again, I don't really think that makes any sense. The other there's another theory out there that and I don't prescribe to this theory.

Whatever. It doesn't make much sense to me. But there is a few out there who fully believe that there was a rape scenario that happened in the woods that Barney like raped his own wife. And people point to the physical evidence of the ripped zipper, the ripped dress, the scuffed shoes. However, it's just listening to their hypnotherapy and other evidence in the way their relationship wires was prior and after. I don't know. I mean, you can't say it's not. But it doesn't it doesn't seem to line up in terms of like when you listen to both of their therapy. Like who brought that up? Like who it does.

I couldn't tell you where it originated, only that it is online. Like you can go research or like read like big takes, like opinion pieces. But it's not based on like something Betty said to someone. No, only only based on what they they kind of take as like traumatic experiences and people turning them into something that it wasn't. They point to the science experiments being replacements for physical assault that happened on on them and what not. So this that would be the worst possible outcome of this.

Yeah, agreed. It doesn't seem it doesn't seem like anybody in the family on that side seems to believe that that's what there was a case. These are and even after Barney died for decades, that Betty never brought that up as something that seemed to happen. Right. And then finally, there's a theory that maybe they ran. They ran into the last two theories, rather. Maybe they ran into as we talked about briefly.

Maybe it was some sort of government thing. Maybe there was a secret government like testing plane that flew over and landed. And they got all kinds of like freaked out and they, you know, were being essentially kidnapped by people and they just kind of warped it in their mind to be something else. The trauma response of the brain made it turn it into a scenario that was way more wild and way more otherworldly. But it was easier for them to maybe process over the course of the years

and months of the months and years that end up following. And the last one is they simply had a nervous breakdown. They might have saw a light in the sky, a satellite passing by. And what I think Jesse kind of described last episode as mass hysteria took place where maybe Betty thought it was one thing or maybe Barney what thought it was one thing. And they coaxed the other through their panic to believe that they too are seeing the same thing and that kind of they feed each other and their wild imaginations kind of take over from there,

maybe traumatizing themselves in some in some way. Regardless, what theory you prescribe to, we don't have a definitive answer. We do know, though, that Barney did get sick, like things happened to him physically and there was physical evidence that something happened to them on that particular night with the car weirdness that other people witnessed, the pile of leaves that showed up in their house with a missing earring return, all that stuff. It's weird. It's weird.

But much like alien stories kind of go, that's where we pull our hands from it and say, that's all we really have. I would suggest if you want way more details, please go read captured, go read the journey, like all the books that we kind of talked about. The interrupted journey or whatever it's called. Interrupted journey is another. Yeah, I don't know that you can ever truly pull away, though. Like this is this is the thing that it doesn't.

It makes sense. Yeah, totally doesn't. Right. Like going through everything you described with. I wrote down a ton of notes, like just going through everything you described with Betty and her scenario and what was going on. Like it makes for a great story. But if you look at like I have so many questions, like why did she recognize it as a hospital room from like I guess maybe Barney to why do they recognize

it a hospital room from like the 1960s? Why is that like of their immediate like, oh, yeah, it's an operating room. Like is alien technology looked like a 1960s hospital room or I imagine they described it like that because it was just clean and like clear of anything I'm just saying table. Our definitions of what a hospital room is are totally different from 1960s hospitals. Agreed. Yeah. The one she talks about a large needle.

Mm hmm. If you can travel intergalactic, why do you have large ass needles? Maybe it was like one of those prop, you know, like, I mean, like if you can travel intergalactic, why do you have a rollout paper map with like dots and shit? Like if if the one guy talked to her in a strange accent, like you think there's too many 60s features in the in this futuristic spaceship? Well, all I'm saying is I would more likely believe that in 20 years

of someone came out and said this was an MK ultra experiment. They found these people and literally tortured them and one of them later died because of whatever drug they put in his ass. Sure. I would believe that more than an alien. Like I would believe the US government did something to these people more than I would believe that an alien because like even when you described the first thing I thought of when you're like, so later on, after this all came out, they're driving down the road and they see a light.

Yeah. And then when they stop, the light stops. The first thing I think of is like, oh, it's a reflection in the car. One of the lights on the inside of the car is hitting the window and when they stop, the car rocks back and forth and they see the light rock back and forth in the window. And then when they get out, it's like gone. And they're like, oh, it went down. So we're going to go look for it. Like it makes perfect sense that way.

Like it just seems like, you know, going back to the thing I said last time, it's comforting, you know, for Barney to hear, oh, I was abducted. All these things happen because at least he knows what happened. But I don't know that's what happened. Like I would say abduction definitely occurred. I would agree with that. I agree. But I don't know that it was aliens. I think it more likely is like any number of other insane things

that could have happened to a couple of the back roads of America. But if you if you want to take the the the fucking math, this view, Mother Mike view of things, the war aliens are real and well, but instead of assuming that these aliens are purely from like another planet in our realm of existence, what if what if there's a cyclical element? What if they are from another dimension? That would help explain the dimension and they can travel dimensions and they still have paper maps.

Well, like, I wonder, like, again, we don't know how it works, but it would also explain the weirdness of not understanding zippers of like the teeth thing, which is fucking hilarious in my mind. Is that stuff makes me the most convinced to me. This this one to me reminds me a lot of the one that I did a couple of months ago, the Robert Taylor with the like where it like grabbed his pants and the police. Very similar vibes. I like both of them because they both have like super weird details

that like don't really mean anything. They're just like weird things that would happen in that type of scenario. Like if if if I was like telling you the time like the one time I like I was in Vegas and I randomly met Putin like or some shit like that. Like, you know, I don't know. Like I would be like, he had this like weird thing with his pinky and like he far. I think one of his guys farted. Like, I don't, you know, like those are the things that would stick out to me.

And I feel like I feel like because these guys obviously had better things doing their lives, they wanted to go like, you know, organized for civil rights and like speak for that's what they their lives. You know, like, I feel like they really weren't into it like in in it for the the fame about the alien stuff. You know, they didn't really like capitalize off of it really themselves. Right. The same thing with Robert Taylor.

He was like, I don't even talk about it. I don't want anybody to talk to me about it. I never want to talk about it. You know, it was Barney's whole vibe, man. He hated it. Like Betty was the only one that wanted to talk about it because she was just intensely curious as to what the hell happened. But Barney seriously like ruined him in so many ways.

He truly hated the experience. And even when you read about him on the like doing like occasional talks, he clearly didn't want to necessarily be there. But he was pulled into it with his article being written. He could no longer escape it. And then this kind of became his life until he passed. Yeah, there's a there's a documentary about the Golden State killer. Mm hmm.

And there's one of the guys who's like he survived the attack and he was he's just obviously damaged. And it has he has that same tone of voice that Barney has in his like little hyp hypnosis recordings of just like this sort of like you can't. It's hard to fake that, you know what I mean? Like the broken, scared as hell. Yeah, it's hard to like just like roll up and be like deliver a performance beyond any actor that I've ever seen.

You know what I mean? Like this is for a guy who's working for the USPS in 60s. That's what I'm saying. Like, I, you know, there's there's some trauma there, for sure. And I I'm not saying I believe that aliens have visited us in any specific way. I, you know, I don't think there's been any definitive evidence period that aliens have ever been here, like for real, for real. Like there's lately been some pretty crazy stuff,

which I'm sure we'll talk about in the minisode. But like, you know, it's just like, I don't know, if there are some true stories, I feel like the ones like Betty and Barney Hill and like Robert Taylor are the ones that I'm willing to believe over other ones. I agree. And, you know, at the end of the day, I kind of agree with Jesse, regardless of whether it was aliens or strangers in the woods or government. I truly believe these two people like were abducted by something.

And, you know, it's it's you could easily say that strange accent, plus like not knowing. I mean, other countries do not use the word yellow. Like, you know, yellow Russians are like, what do you mean yellow? Is it like it's like Zipley or something? There's no color that's happy for us here. I look like real zippers can get stuck. All I'm saying is like all these interesting facts do not necessarily prove

that they didn't know how to do these things. It just means that whoever she talked to, like it could. What if it was like I am big American man? There's no problem. It was the height of the Cold War. All I'm saying is you never know. Also, did you know? Also, did you know that their granddaughter,

Angela Hill, is like number 11 straw weight UFC women's? Yeah, she's MMA fighter. Yeah. And she's also like a gamer and cosplayer. Did you also know potential Russian spy? Just putting it out there, putting it out there. Just putting out the well-manted Russian spy. Oh, shit. I hope you. I hope you guys enjoyed the Betty and Barney Hill case again out there.

Listeners, if you want more, the books give you so much more detail. This is just kind of a long and short of it with as much as I can get to you. But it's a fascinating read to just hear about everything that they went through over the years after the abduction and just kind of the hell that they went through. So if you want more, go check it out. It's a great read. But thank you guys for letting me do another alien episode. It's been a while.

So getting that out of my system was just felt good. It felt real good. I love that. We will be we will be back next week with a special guest, everybody. Oh, man, I can't wait for this to go. And also and also if you are listening to us right now and you're like, man, this is the end of the podcast already. Oh, man, guess what? You get like 15, 20 minutes more right now by heading over to patreon.com

slash shilluminati pod and getting that mini-soad right now right into your air holes. It's true. We're about to record it. Never signed up before. You've got like 40 minutes, many soads. You can just binge while you're over there. It's a lot. It's more than you think it is. It is. It is. It's more than I think most of the time. I'm always surprised.

It's always like, I got to dip into the mini soads again for an episode. I have to like move states and I'm like, we have so many and I'm like, oh, we have like 20 backed up. We're fine. We will be back next week with that special guest, everybody. Be excited. I can't even I don't even know what we're doing yet. He hasn't given even told me. So we might be the one who's pulling the topic. He told me he was going to give me a topic

and I was just going to do the research for it. But I he hasn't given me anything yet. So if he doesn't give me anything in the next two days, I'm just going to make pick something really weird and just do something really weird with him on the show. OK. So no names being dropped at all. You'll be surprised next week thrown. The gauntlet has been thrown.

We will see you all next week. And if you're a patron, we'll see you in a few minutes. Thank you guys so much for listening. Goodbye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Anyway, me and my wife were sitting outside indulging on our porch one night, enjoying ourselves. I needed to go to the bathroom, so I stepped back inside. And after a few moments, I hear my wife go,

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