Chilluminati Podcast - Minisode 2 - Me, Myself, and a ghost that wants to be Me

Episode Date: May 2, 2018

Jesse is currently traveling abroad! Which means me and Alex get to believe in whatever we want without Jesse telling us we're wrong! Yay!

When it comes to broadband internet, streaming, and mobile packages, Choice Overload is real. Whether you're upgrading or moving to a new home, smartmove.us is a quick, easy, and free way to compare packages. Explore all your options now at smartmove.us slash discover. Well then, let's do what we always do and just kind of dive in. Hello, everybody, and welcome to Chaluminati Podcast. I guess we're calling these mini-sodes or like 0.5 episodes.

They're a little in between. I called it a bonus. I called it a bonus shorty when I named the audition file just now. I like it. Bonus shorty works for me. Bonus shorty, dude. Well, for those who don't know and who don't follow our Twitter, first follow our Twitter.

Also, go onto our subreddit because I didn't announce it there as well. But Jesse right now is ChaluminatiPod. Hell yeah, dude. Hell yeah, ChaluminatiPod pretty much everywhere is where you can find us. If you don't know, Jesse is currently traveling abroad. He did bring all of his recording equipment. He just got a little unlucky on his first hotel stint, where he didn't have very good internet.

So we're going to make- He was also in the bottom of a salt mine in Poland. Was that where his hotel room was too? I have no idea. I was just, that's where he was. So it was like a very weird place for him. It looked awesome though. Yeah, it did.

I'm very jealous. Yeah, goddamn. But he's going to be in a new hotel soon and we're going to make a second attempt at doing the full-on episode. I'm not going to spoil what we're doing here, but I'm excited to cover that. But in between, we want to make sure we give you a show. And much like the first mini-show,

this is going to be Alex Helmed. He's got all I know is an interesting story about a topic I won't spoil. And we're going to talk about it because I like the topic a lot. I've done some research and much like many topics that I've researched, these can easily be connected to aliens in some way. Because that's just how this world works. Yeah, so as I have hinted at a few times, I have been doing a comedically in-depth amount of research

about alternate universes lately. And that's the overarching theme of probably what I will eventually present to you someday. Just research takes a really long time. I feel like people don't really understand that. Like if you really want to do not just looking up something in a book that somebody already wrote, if you really want to do research, it's a very long process. Pull it out and make it into something reportable.

Yeah, and a lot of the time too just to kind of go off on that. These episodes that we do are usually about two weeks worth of research for me. But when we are looking at something like a multiparter, I know people are really excited to talk about Skinwalker Ranch in the future because I've teased it a little bit. For that alone, that's going to be a multiparter in which I pulled in a voluntary research assistant. So to be able to hit the bigger things, it's a lot. You have to read books.

You have to deep dive into the internet where those terrible websites are. There's a ton of documentaries you could watch and pretty much any weird subject you want. Yeah, and it's a lot of fun for me just to do research. Like I really enjoy doing it. But it also definitely takes me some weird places. And so let me walk you up to how I got here. And then basically it's going to go like this guy wrote the notes for a short episode on this topic. So the topic, first of all, that we're going to be talking about today is doppelgangers.

Yeah. Okay, so this is like a weird topic already because it's not totally something from myth. Like it's kind of just like if you boil it down, right? It's just like somebody that looks like somebody else. Like if you if you boil it down, but like what it is in the like supernatural sense is like seeing somebody that is the same as someone, like exactly the same. Maybe it's them. Maybe there are two places at once.

Maybe it's like an evil clone of them. There's a lot of different ways that doppelganging. I don't I don't know what you doppelganging doppelganging banging. There's a lot of different too bad. Jesse's not here for that. I know he would have loved that. He would say you would have loved that if Jesse if Jesse was here. He'd be like, I doppelgang bang all my own doppelgangers.

You know, I doppelgang bang a wolf man. That's that's his end game. But so basically so basically what happened was I read a crazy story online. And like traced it back like a million fucking times because they always just show up a billion times. Like it's crazy, like especially with like paranormal shit, how much just like straight up copy pasting is going on all about their time. Yep.

And so I traced this story that I found all the way back. And I'm not going to get into what that story is about now because that's going to spoil the later thing. But it led me to a man named Paul Begg. And nowadays, if you looked at Guy up, he's a he's mostly like a Jack the Ripper researcher. Okay. Like he does a lot of like, you know, like sort of like fringe stuff. Not I don't want to say fringe, but like he's he's he's like going in depth into some aspects of the Jack the Ripper myth mythos that are like less substantiated or like new takes.

And, you know, I don't know. There's I don't know how legitimate any speculation can be about Jack the Ripper at this point. But he's he's one of the he's respected in this field. He's like not he's not like some crazy guy. He's like respected. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. Yeah.

No, he's he's not what most alien researchers that come across are. Exactly. Exactly. He's like a legitimate dude. But you know, this book that I have in my hands here that I ordered as the source of that other story to get to the bottom of it is from 1981. Okay. The edition the edition that I'm holding in my hand and it's and it's and it's a first printing

and it is called The Directory of Possibilities. And I wish you could see this book. It's like purple and pink. I'm going to Google it. Yeah. It has a crazy as font on it and it's like a little bit bigger than you would expect, which is like very cool. Oh, yeah.

That's a cool looking cover. Right on the cover. It says truth is stranger than fiction. More than 500 spectacular supernatural phenomena that are possible. I think we all know exactly what kind of book this is. Yeah, I mean, I have from my last or the trip before my last trip, I think I picked up two books. That's when I picked up Edge of Reality, but I also picked up the 60 greatest conspiracy

theories of all time. So you can imagine like that kind of thing. Book of the weird. Yeah. I have like some like reader's digest books that are called like, you know, unexplained phenomena. Like, but it's like a reader's digest like who knows where it's coming from. Um, but this one is really neat because I like this is this is interesting to me because like, so basically like they just like reference stuff in this book and then there's no like

glossary, right? Which like on the one hand is frustrating because like, you know, then they could just be making stuff up, right? Yeah, you want to be able to check the sources. Like it's one of the most important things about doing something like this is being able to trace back sources and figure out where things originate from. Because taking things at face value, especially in this field is very, very dumb. Don't do that.

Right. Exactly. And so I felt kind of like, I felt kind of weird about this if I was going to like present this as fact to you guys, but I'm going to present it to you as a reading from this book. And we're going to like break it down and talk about it a little bit and like how weird it is. So, you know, we can, we can like take it with a grain of salt. But I actually reached out to Paul Begg about the other thing that I was researching into and he actually like wrote me back.

That's awesome. And yeah. And so one of the things in here he wrote and you know, it's one of those things that was like totally unsubstantiated in the book, but he actually like sent me down a course that I like was able to find some further leads on. So I don't want to say that every single, I can say from actually researching it myself that not every single thing in this book is completely a fabrication. And so for that reason, I think it's fun to read from something like this.

And you know, just to consider it as a relic of the supernatural sort of like lore that's out there from the 80s, I present to you the section from this book on doppelgangers. And we're going to get right into it because it's a good, it's a good little, it's a good little segment. Hell yeah. Let's go. Doppelgangers, phantasms of the living are among the commonest, but also the most puzzling forms of apparitions.

And originally, I immediately liked this because I have never thought of doppelgangers as ghosts of people that are alive, but that is a great way to describe a doppelganger. I immediately want to go off on a tangent. Let's go. So my first love as far as paranormal is concerned, before aliens really absorbed my major fascination, ghosts were my big thing. I think I even told you and Jesse, I'd love to drag you in like the whole scary game squad and like a real life ghost hunt one day because I have equipment and all that other stuff for it.

However, there is this theory that I've read before and actually came across a second time, not too long ago, about what ghosts could potentially be. And while there's obviously the theory that ghosts are all dead people, what they, what it could be is that ghosts are you encountering someone, even the possibility of encountering yourself at a different time. Like it's a thin fabric in the time space continuum if you want to use like kind of star trekky words, I guess. In that, as an example, there's a ghost hunter that I follow still to this day who said

at one point during his team was encountering EVPs and obviously you don't hear what an EVP is, an electronic voice phenomenon. It's a voice that you can only catch playing back on you when you, on a tape record or whatever you're recorded on. And as they were asking questions, the ghost voice they heard was also asking questions back like where are you or I hear you but I don't see you. And that immediately opens up the possibility that whoever they were talking to, because they were calling her by name and she was responding to that name.

And it really, it opened questions was like, well maybe they're not talking to the, it's possible it's the ghost, right? It's possible it's her spirit stuck forever. Or it's a possibility that at her time where she was alive, she was hearing these voices that she perceived as ghostly and phantasmal and that they were literally speaking to each other in a way across time and space. I would love to do a study on like what people used to say to ghosts back in the 1800s and whether it's any, there's any correlation between that and what people's say ghosts say.

Right. It's very interesting. But he also used another example and the example's a little vague on it because it was a while ago and just remembering it in that the, he had walked into a room and was, did like an EVP session not long and then he ended up walking out and he sent somebody else into the room to sit in the room and do like a longer EVP session and chill. And the lady who she, he sent. EVP session and chill.

Yeah. Like just sit in the dark, quiet, ask questions, you know, that kind of thing. And she said, she saw a shadow person walk in, lean up against the bed, was there for a few seconds and then walked out and disappeared. And when she explained that to him, he said those were the actions that he actually took where he walked in, leaned against the bed, asked a few questions and left and then sent her in. So, you know, the questions are raised.

Well, did she see the shadow of what he did in the past is, is where they are or where all these, are where all these hauntings happen. Are these weird like thin areas when it comes to time and space and again, all of the things that I'm saying, you know, I also take with a grain of salt because there's no real way to prove it. And it's so 1800s-y feeling. It's, it's, it's crazy. But I bought Ambrose beers.

So the idea that you're throwing out the, the idea that maybe you're, you know, they're entities of people that are not dead or whatever or future. I've heard that before. So continue. Yeah. Yeah. Louis Spence has described the doppelganger or double as the etheric counterpart of the physical body, which may temporarily move about in space.

In his auto, in his autobiography, Yates writes, one afternoon I was thinking very intently, and that's William Butler Yates, I imagine. One, one afternoon I was thinking very intently of a fellow student for whom I had a message. In a couple of days, I got a letter from a place some hundreds of miles away where the student was on the afternoon when I had been thinking so intently, I had suddenly appeared there amid a crowd of people in a hotel and seeming as solid as if in the flesh. My fellow student had seen me, but no one else and had asked me to come again when the people had gone.

I had vanished, but had come again in the middle of the night and given him the message. I myself had no knowledge of either apparition. Damn. Yeah. That's cool. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

So this at first sounds as if Yates desired to pass on the message could have produced telepathic contact with the student, but since he returned on request to deliver the message, this seems unlikely. The doppelganger behaved like a person with a will of his own and this raises one of the honest problems encountered in such cases. It seems as if the double is quite unconnected with the conscious ego. It may even cause it distress and embarrassment. That's interesting.

Have you ever heard, oh God, what's the word where you can physically or psychically rather manifest like a separate personality because of the T I feel like. A tulpa? Tulpa? Have you heard of tulpas? I think that's actually right. Yeah. Yeah.

Tulpa is, oh yeah, here it is. Tulpa is a concept and mysticism in the paranormal of being, of a being or object which is created through spiritual and mental powers. It was adapted by 20th century theosophists from Tibetan Sprupa, which means emanation or manifestation. The idea of you creating a separate personality or a separate being that exists purely psychically. Like it emanates from your own mind though. Yeah.

It's a separate consciousness. Yeah. It's a, there's a lot involved in it and it's been, to be honest, it's been a while since I've really dove into the tulpas. But if you look up, it seems, yeah, I'll give you a quick explanation on the wiki page of what a tulpa is. Tulpas are seemingly sentient, autonomous mental companions subjectively experienced by the psycho knot, which I love that term just because of the game, as a separate being

with their own agency, emotions, preferences, thoughts, and character. They can be likened to a separate mental consciousness existing alongside the psycho knot. Now when they say psycho knot, they're talking about the person who created the tulpa. Yeah, like the person who's going on this psychic endeavor. Yeah, more or less, yeah. Tulpas can be considered as a type of autonomous entity distinguished by their persistence and continuity over time.

This is opposed to hallucinogen induced autonomous entities, which only persists throughout the substance's duration or action or dream characters that cease to exist upon waking. Sounds like produced by conscious effort. Yeah, basically, hallucinogens are basically things that are generated by drugs or dreams, more or less. Also, unlike autonomous entities, tulpas are often the product of intentional creation, starting with an idea of their characteristics and developed into a robust mental companion

capable of meaningful interaction and communication through sustained meditative attention. That is very interesting that you say that. Yeah, it kind of reminded me of tulpas in general, probably not the same, but maybe in the same similar family if we were to believe that this actually happened. Is it more like a spell or is it more like a mental phenomenon? It's more of a mental thing. It's more you're inducing meditation and over the course of many meditations and with

very clear goals in mind, you're literally trying to create the second entity that is either like control via your subconscious because you're not directly controlling it or it's something a little bit more paranormal than we like to admit. We don't know. Do you think you could do it by accident? Do you think it's possible? Oh, I think if these things are possible and any of the stuff is possible, I think accidental creation of these things is probably more common than we want to believe.

I feel like when a person is in a point of high stress or high trauma or high any type of emotion, I think we're more inclined to do things subconsciously with our own minds than we're aware of. And I feel like things like this could happen if it's true. Well, check this out. So check this out. It goes on. It goes on.

Emily Sege on attractive French school mistress lost 18 jobs in 16 years between 1829 and 1845 because her astral double had a habit of appearing beside her, terrifying her pupils. On a typical occasion, Emily was picking flowers in the garden in full view of a class of girls whose teacher had gone off to consult the headmistress. Suddenly, Emily's form appeared in the teacher's chair. Two girls tried to touch her and said she felt like muslin. Emily later said that she had looked into the room, noticed the teacher was away, and had felt worried about discipline.

So the double was apparently a spontaneous projection, unwilled and unintended. One girl remarked that the real Emily in the garden became very pale when her double appeared in the classroom. That's wild. I don't know how I would feel like if that ever happened to me and what I would like to see myself in the room. You think there would be more, when did this happen again? According to this, which has no sources, mind you.

Right, true. So grain assault, it occurred between 1829 and 1845. In France. So sometime in the late 1800s, which is really hard to get sources from other than word of mouth at that point. That's pretty much what every source is when it comes down to it, right? Yeah, of course. Unless there's cameras that exist.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, of course. I mean, doppelgangers are fascinating in general to me. I mean, they've been referenced in and around since back in like the Shakespearean days, if you think about it. Yeah, I wish I could track paranormal activity and see if it lines up with fashion trends. Yeah, that'd be interesting. Like even thinking back and doing just general research while you're talking about it, and like how far back do doppelgangers go as far as stories are concerned.

I mean, Edgar Allen Poe was writing about them, but that was later on anyway. But if you look even further back, like the mythology of Narcissus, of him falling in love with himself and his own reflection stuff is kind of an early. Kind of the same thing, yeah. Alluding to something similar. It's cool because doppelgangers for me, I've always, I've always kind of likened doppelgangers to paranormal, where maybe some spirits or ghosts or not so nice spirits are usually tormenting the person that they're trying to pretend to be.

Right, like they're like fucking with him like when nobody's looking and shit. Yeah, or like they when someone's home alone, or they think they're not home alone, and they hear their mother or see their mother walking up the stairs or calling their name, and when they go up there, the mother is not home at all, and she hasn't been home for like two hours. Like that kind of, there's a lot of those stories out there that are terrifying. Luckily, I've never had any kind of encounter with those, but doppelgangers in general never seem like they're there to be good, almost always. Almost, they almost are always there to cause problems.

Problems or like they're just scary. It's never like a doppelganger came to me and like saved me. Yeah, no, my doppelganger never showed up and gave me a sweet high five and said, you look good today and then left. Right, even like in time travel, it's like not usually a good reason you see him. Yeah, no, it's almost always bad. Or they can represent bad omens a lot of the time too. They, I find doppelgangers an interesting subject and they kind of touch every corner

of paranormal research as well. Yeah, they're like almost on the border of like generic western fairy tale. Yeah, I mean, if you think about it, even mythology when it comes to Faye and the fairies and stuff that are in legend and even in that eat their way into tabletop role playing systems, if you want to go that crazy, the idea of like Faye kidnapping somebody and then replacing them with a doppelganger, somebody that looks exactly like acts exactly like the person that they've kidnapped, but they're made of inanimate materials that are magically made to look like they're there who are who were who was kidnapped.

Yeah, which is also horrifying. Yeah, it's the other thing that's weird is the idea that like it could be a part of you that like breaks off from you. Yeah, like a psych piece of your brain like manifesting itself, but like also decides it wants to be alive or something kind of thing. I don't know. But then you know, but then you have the question, of course, and we can't answer it, but the question of like, if that's the case, how are they making themselves able to be seen

by anyone other than you? Exactly, exactly. And that's the thing that's like kind of screwed up about it. And it makes you think about like what your own physical presence actually is. Right. But I mean, you know, of course, this is in the realm of like almost like literary pseudoscience at this point. Like we're like almost talking about like Charles Dickens or something.

You know, yeah, yeah, of course. But for this next bit, you need to know about the fact that what the Glastonbury scripts are, and only in the only in the sense that you need to know that they're automatic writing, which means that it's writing somebody did that is not purported to have been by their own hand, but rather channeled through their hand, which is always always a little suspect in my mind just because it's it's hard to be you can't prove it. You can't be like, well, he definitely was using his own mind. You don't know.

Right. But the book goes on in the case of the Glastonbury scripts, the communicator who claimed to be a monk called Johannes made the interesting remark. And this is the person I believe who was the actual writer. If you know what I mean, the spiritual writer. Right, right. I get what you're saying. The entity.

Yeah. Why this is what the the entity said. Why cling eye to that which is not it is I and it is not I but part of me which dwelleth in the past and is bound to that which my carnal soul loved and called home these many years. Yet I, Johannes, am of many parts and ye better part do with other things. And certainly the study of and that's the end of the quote. And certainly the study of cases of doppelgangers and Vardgoers as well as of multiple personality suggests that our mind, even our personalities may be of many parts.

OK, now this is again illustrated by another celebrated case. OK, I've not heard of this before, but apparently it's very celebrated. So his name is spelled like Cole, but it sounds like soul. SG. So had been at school with a boy named Gordon Davis in 1920. He heard that Davis had been killed in the war in 1921. So was at a seance at which his brother Frank also killed in the war was apparently communicating. Frank then his brother Frank then introduced Davis who gave many factual details about himself.

Davis returned at a later seance and spoke about the house he used to live in. He explained that it was not in his street, more like half the street, and that there was something like a veranda in front of the house. The name of the street, he said, contained ES, like S. He described the interior of the house in some detail, including a mirror, pictures, and two funny brass candlesticks. In due course, soul located the house in eastern Esplanade, two S's. South end, an Esplanade facing the sea could be described as half a street,

because there's only houses on one side. There was a bus shelter opposite the house. The description of the inside proved to be remarkably accurate, but Davis was still alive and living there, and he had no knowledge, whatever of his appearance, the seances. SG. Wait, so his friend didn't die? He didn't know, it was a guy that he went to school with that he heard had been killed,

so he never really knew him in life, but he heard that he had been killed in the war, and then his brother, the ghost of his dead brother who he knew died in the war, brought this other guy to him, and the guy like gave details about himself, and then they found the house based off the details that the ghost gave him, and when they got there, they found the guy still living there. I'm assuming you had no idea what they were talking about. SG. Exactly.

And Aldous Huxley apparently used a similar situation in his play called The World of Light. That's just an example of it being unconscious, and maybe somehow, maybe ghosts aren't necessarily only of dead people, maybe we're just looking for the dead people because we miss them and stuff, maybe there's something to the nature of ghosts that we don't know about that makes it possible for them to be made by living people. SG. Tie the idea of ghosts to the dead due to just a lot of mythology and religion of the idea of like once you die, your spirit goes on and does its own thing and goes to heaven or hell or

whatever it is you believe in, so the idea of tying the dead to ghosts and stuff I feel like was probably ingrained in us really, really long time ago, but there's that other theory that ghosts aren't necessarily just the dead, but when you die there's that other dimension or realm of being, that other, what do you call it, you elevate to a higher plane of existence, you still continue to exist but you no longer have your physical body and there are already aspects of you that exist in that particular dimension that you can maybe contact through seance or whatever other alternatives you may have, and that when you die that's the only part of you that's left, is this part of you that exists on this other, I don't want to say the

fourth, that's sort of like the basic understanding that we all have without getting too religious about it, right? SG. Yeah, exactly. So I firmly believe that if ghosts exist, it would not surprise me at all if there was other living people that are able to project themselves unconsciously or whatever to this ghostly, in this ghostly manner to make contact, I guess. SG. Yeah, but it also, okay, the book also says though that it does seem possible for people to project themselves consciously. SG. Astral projection. SG.

Yeah, a well-known case cited by Myers in a book that he wrote called Human Personality and Its Survival of Bodily Death, a pretty perfect subject for a book. I have not looked up whether or not that book exists, so go crazy internet. Concerned a young man named S.H. Beard who told his fiancé L.S. Verity that he would attempt to project himself to her house. He made a powerful effort of concentration and was seen not only by Verity, but by her 11-year-old sister, and similarly John Cowper Powis, I'm not even going to tell you how to spell that, actually I will because you might want to look it up, John is spelled like J-O-H-N, Cowper is spelled K-C-O-W-P-E-R, C-O-W-P-E-R, and his last name Powis is spelled P-O-W-Y-S,

Powis. Similarly, John Cowper Powis projected himself into the sitting room of his friend Theodore Dreiser. Powis had dined with Dreiser in his New York apartment and left hurriedly to catch his train back to a town on the Hudson. As he left, he told Dreiser that he would appear to him later. Dreiser assumed he was joking, but two hours later, Dreiser looked up from his book to see Powis standing in the doorway. Dreiser stood up saying, well you've kept your word, now tell me how you did it, and as he moved toward his friend Powis vanished. He immediately rang Powis at home, but Powis refused then or later to say how he quote-unquote did it. So perhaps there's a totally, I mean obviously, let's just go into this episode assuming that none of these stories are

true and that everything that I've been reading has been fabrication. I like to believe, I like to believe Powis told these people he was going to appear to give himself an excuse to creep on them. Yeah, like I don't, like that's the only thing I could think like otherwise, you know, like I'm just saying like assuming this is all fake, right, let's look at the evidence here and let's say you know if he can do it in this cheeky ass way that there's probably not a spiritual angle to do at least one way of doing this, you know, on purpose. Like you could maybe, maybe there's a trick to this possibly. Yeah, I mean if he's doing it in some way and he's doing it kind of like a parlor trick or an illusion of some sort, dude's a good magician if it happened. The idea of when

you said he just appeared in front of the 11 year old sister, I was like oh creepy, all right, let's not, mister, let's not do that, okay. It's weird, it's weird to think about, but like could I do it, like how, is it possible, like I always think about that, like is it possible that humans can do this if they believe in themselves but we're just like so cynical that we know it's impossible? Yeah, I don't know, that's an interesting way to think about it too, that we've convinced ourselves so thoroughly that it's impossible, that our brains are now shut off from the possibility of doing it. It also feeds on the idea that children are more open and can see more weird shit than we can because they haven't been beaten down, you know, mentally by adults saying none of

this is real. Yeah, which I find wildly interesting as well. It's also, that whole idea of mentally closing yourself off feeds into aliens as well, where the idea of an abduction scenario that aliens are both a physical phenomena as equally as they are a psychic phenomena that they are able to only abduct those or more easily abduct those that are already more open to the experience because there's that boundary between their reality and our reality that has made more thin when your mind is more open to those ideas and you believe so fully that they can happen, that aliens can grab you a little easier. Interesting. Yeah, I don't know, not to always keep going back to aliens, but have you ever had that, like have you, did you ever hear about that,

how aliens are in equally psychic and physical manifestation in equal parts? Yes, I mean, I've definitely like read that theory on aliens, but to me, when you start talking like that and we talk about ghosts and stuff, sometimes when you, you know, go down the rabbit holes of this line of thinking, it's like this sort of like pseudoscience sort of like paranormal line of thinking, everything starts to sound like different versions, like different explanations of like the same thing. Yeah, it really does. It really does. Yeah. And it's really weird. And I wonder what that thing is. Yeah. And I mean, I'd love to have that answer while I'm still alive, obviously. But you do kind

of poke at something that I feel like I've heard people talk about before, like the more you deep dive into the stuff, the more threads you see connected to all of the paranormal occurrences and you could go one of two ways. You can go the more open-minded like, well, if they're all connected, maybe they're all coming from something a similar place or a similar idea. And you can go down the rabbit hole of is our reality a simulation and all that nonsense, or you go where Jesse would probably go and be like, well, they're all connected because everything's rooting from the same mythology that we're all drawing from. Well, everybody in around the world has different mythologies. They all have a very similar root base. Jesse would say Jesse would say that that

root is that everybody is lying and likes fame. But the thing is, like as simple as that explanation is, you can't discount humanity's need to be popular. I think he's probably right. Yeah, I do. But you know, it's fun to talk about because there's always these other these other ways of thinking about it. And in the case of doppelganger specifically, the book goes on that on the left and right hypothesis is already hypotheses already discussed. We may theorize that doppelgangers are basically telepathic images projected by the right cerebral hemisphere or the unconscious. This certainly fits the majority of cases as it also fits and your green story of the woman in the telephone kiosk, which is only available to hear in this book. And I will get to in a minute.

But yet it is hard to see how such a telepathic image could be seen by a whole class as in the SAGE case. Here we are forced to give serious consideration to Spencer's suggestion that's a doppelganger is the astral double. And I think both are equally hard to swallow pills. But yeah, of course, one, you know, it's about like one thing, which I think is a lot more likely, right, which is like the untapped power of the human mind. There's a million sci fi stories about that. And, you know, a lot of the things that have been my problems over the years turn out to be something that's in my own brain, you know, and I wouldn't be surprised if even ghosts were that. But yeah, I mean, a lot of experiences you can always trace if you have personal experiences,

at least for my end, I can always trace them back to a point in time where I was like half a sleep or not in a fully conscious state. Yeah. And it's it's it's strange to think about that. But also, you know, there is also the possibility that it could be some sort of spirit or, you know, whatever entity power that emanates from you that is like some part of maybe maybe science, maybe something else, maybe nature. I don't I don't really know, you know, what else, whatever that could be like, I feel like that is the possibility that we have the least equipped to comprehend. Yes. I'm still waiting for the day. Government step sounds like aliens are real, by the way. That I think could happen. I think that is more likely to happen than a lot of people are willing

to admit. Yeah. And that is that is it for this section on on doppelgangers. I want to give credit to the actual author of that segment, who was a man named Colin Wilson, who is credited as a writer on many subjects, notably psychology and the paranormal. Cool. But before I go, is do you have do you have a weird doppelganger story or anything that fits into this? God, man, I wish I did. I wish I had like a personal like doppelganger story of my life, but I don't other than the fact that I've read into doppelgangers and they do pop up occasionally when you are in this line of research, because even things as simple as talking back about skinwalkers, which was episode two for us, skinwalkers have a tendency of taking the shape

of things you're familiar with or things you love to to bring down your your defenses. I will say I don't I don't want to say I hope something weird happens to me that would be considered dangerous. It would be comforting almost right? Yeah, like I'm down like if I get abducted by aliens or I encounter a ghost or a doppelganger, we started this podcast for a reason and I'm I hope we have ways, you know, if it happens, I hope we can get the word out there because I think out of the three of us, while we're all skeptical, some of us more so than others, we want answers and that's the reason we even started this in the first place because we're so interested in the truth and what's actually happening that there's enough out there to throw doubt enough doubt out

there to make us question what is actually real and what isn't. What are you? Do you have a doppelganger story? So sort of. So this this is like one of these weird stories, right? And it's like hard to verify because I'm talking about a video that I don't have that I don't have anymore. Okay, okay. Which sucks, but I this this really did happen to me. At least, you know, I'm saying it did. So, you know, if you want to believe me, you can. It was a really weird story. Um, my brother and I kind of lived in like a, like a, um, what do you call it, like a condo complex, like a, you know, like a, where all the houses look the same. Yep. It's not quite a suburb, but it's like they're condos and they're all like in a little like complex together,

like a homeowners association type vibe, right? So there's not a lot of like foot traffic, you know, and, you know, a lot of old people live there. So it's very quiet. And so like me and him, we'd like screw around all the time and we'd like run around outside and nobody was there to tell us not to do anything. And it was really like a good free childhood, which was really fun. And at the time that we were young, like Jackass was a really big thing. And so we had a camera and we'd like film ourselves doing dumb shit all the time. And, uh, one of the things that we used to do was pranks. And so we'd like do like a, uh, like my brother, we'd like throw my brother in a bush and he'd have an air horn. And I'd like go across the street from him and film

the area where he was in the bush and like film people walking by, getting scared by the air horn. Right. Yeah. All right. I got you. Little being little shits. I got you. Yeah. It's shitty that I did that, but like I did it. It was in Jackass. The movie was really funny. Nice. Um, but, uh, so basically we saw this very old Japanese woman who lived up the street coming down the street, towards us. And, um, we were really excited because, you know, it was like the perfect prey. She was like a very quiet old lady. We were going to like just give her a little nothing too crazy, you know, just a little jump. I get you. Yeah. We're not trying to kill this lady. Um, and so I was, I was hiding in the bushes across the street, uh, because I was filming

and my brother was in the bushes, like right next to her. Uh, and, um, I filmed it and nothing happened. And when he, when he did the beep, like nothing happened, like she just didn't react to it at all. And I like, that was really funny, but I was like, you know, looking at the footage and stuff. And, um, when we watched it back, my brother watched it back first and he was like really weirded out by it. And he was like, this is like, I don't, he was like, this is really weird. Like, will you look at this? And I looked at it and there were two, uh, there were two ladies walking next to each other that were both this like, it looked like the same lady. Like it almost looked like twins walking,

but there was only one when you were like there in person. There was only one. Yeah. And the weirdest thing about it was that I don't personally remember her doing this. She definitely could have cause I was definitely like laughing at the fact that she didn't respond. Yeah. But in the footage that I remember watching and, you know, granted, this is warped by my childhood and I couldn't tell you where this footage is now, but this is a real bona fide story was that in the footage, she turns and looks almost directly into my lens. Oh, that's creepy. Uh, just want, just the one, just the one that was dressed the way that we remember because I remember for sure, because after it happened, we ran up the street and it was just the one lady.

That's so weird. Yeah. So that was actually a pretty freaky diggy little story. And I wish that I could like substantiate it in some way, but you know, if I did, then I would be famous because I would approve ghost exist. That's wild. I actually, you're talking about like this idea of ghosts but stuff. And I'm actually right now trolling through my phone because a few months ago, as just a side story, and I will find it, I have the video and I know my sister has a video if I don't. And I was out hanging out. It's right before Christmas, I think. Right. And I was taking, I was out to dinner with my me, my sister, my niece and my nephew and my dad. It was like, we went out to lunch. I might have said dinner. I meant lunch. It's like noon,

dead restaurant, middle of the weekday, just chilling. And I was taking pictures of me and my nephew and I was making videos of me and my nephew. And he was being silly and he was like slapping spaghetti on the table and being just, you know, a fucking one year old as one year old czar. Right. And I looked to the, I like, I was holding him and taking a video of him while he's doing it. And I said to him, like, who's a bad boy? Because he was just being a little bit of a fresh monster. Yeah. And I was cute. And we're laughing and stuff. And then later on, I get home and I play that video back because I was talking to my sister and telling her how to good time and stuff. And as I was playing the video, right before I say who's a bad boy, there is a clear as

shit voice lean that sounds like it's right next to my phone and a voice that is not mine that goes, who's a bad boy? And then within a moment after that, I go, who's a bad boy to him? And then the video continues on. And I got to find that video. I it's, it's, it's less than a year old. And I just remembered I have it. God, it's awful. And I showed my sister and I'm like, do you hear something that wasn't there? And she listened to it. And she's like, Oh my God, whose voice is that? And I'm like, I don't know. I listen to it over and over and over again. And the voice doesn't belong to myself, my sister or my dad. And anyway, love, if you find that, please, God, I will find it. I swear to you, I'm going to find it. I either have it or she does one, one or the other. I actually do. I

actually do have like one other weird ass story. I could tell that now that now that it's just ghost story time, you reminded me of it. Well, it's also like similar to a doppelganger story, because it says exactly what I am literally about to say. Yeah. And it's so weird. Yeah, this is, this, this has almost nothing to do with doppelgangers. But now that we're, now that we're here, I feel like it's time to tell the story. All right, all right. And it's a weird setup, too, because it's always a weird setup when I'm telling the story. So the dude, the dude that I was talking to is a guy that I sat next to on a plane. And I don't know how true this is. This is just purely straight up from when I, like what I, what, just what he said when I talked to him.

And you can bleep this if you think it's going to get me in trouble or not. I didn't, I did not ask this guy if I could tell the story. But this guy said that he was like low key Snoop Dogg's weed dealer. Okay. And that his son was on Snoop Dogg's like football team that he has, like that is like pet project. Are you aware of this? Okay, I didn't, I'm not aware of it, but this is a real thing. And I saw like footage. So I like believe that this is a real thing that this guy's saying. But he told me all these crazy stories about like times when he was like banging back in his youth, like all these like crazy, like, you know, gang related stories like guns and shooting and all this crazy shit. And that was like amazing. I love like when I sit next to

somebody on a plane, it turns out to be somebody cool. But the whole reason that we started talking about it in the first place was that he asked me what I did for a living and I told him I was a YouTuber, which is like my least favorite thing to do in the world. I've adapted to telling people I do video production. Yeah. I tell people I'm a YouTuber and he was like, Oh good. And he started getting his phone out. And I was like, Oh boy, here we go. Cause I thought it was going to be somebody asking me like my niece does make up, you know, how, how does she get famous? Like you kind of thing. But he was literally asked me, how do I upload a video on my phone to YouTube? Which is like as a YouTuber, something that I know about that is not often something that

people ask me about. Yeah. No, not, not really. How can I get famous? I don't usually do tech support. But I was like, well, what's the video? And he was like, yo, it's my grandson. He's like, he lives with me because my daughter died. And I'm pretty sure I have video for like talking to him. Oh, damn. Yeah. And I was like, can I see the video? Yeah. That would be my ability. Can I see that please? Yeah. So he was telling me how the kids like he, he used the word touched, which is like out of date word that means the kid has the shining basically. Yeah. But he was basically saying like the kids like smart and quiet and he keeps to himself and he like talks to things that aren't there a lot and all that good stuff that creeps you out when you

talk about kids. But he showed me the video and it's clear from him from the jump street that the kid loves five nights at Freddy's because he earlier, the guy was showing me like like some like the kid likes five nights at Freddy's. Yeah. And so at the time, I don't know how much you know about five nights at Freddy's, but there's more than I want to know. But yeah, but for those who may not feel free to. Yeah. At the time, well, basically it's a really shittily designed game where you like look indoors. That jumpscare you. Yeah. And so at the time, the famous one was four and that one is set in a child's bedroom. And he was basically recreating the scene from the game. He was sitting on his bed with the camera facing like forward.

You feel me? Yeah. I'm imagining it in my mind. And if you're and if you're watching, if you watch YouTubers play the game, a lot of the time they count because they are wanting to, they're playing the harder levels of the game and they want to like try their strategy for opening and closing doors because you have limited power. And so you, so you have to count and like everybody has their weird little system for beating this completely bullshit RNG game that sucks and is not well made. But if you watch the, if you watch the let's plays, right, like you'll see people counting. And so that's exactly what he's doing. He's turning the camera to the doors and he's counting. He's like doing it in real life, right? Okay. He's counting from like one to like

25 or something in the video. And I just saw the kid doing that and that was what the video was. And I was just like, okay, well that's extremely creepy out of context. You know, and I thought that that's what he was talking about was just like, I knew because I watch YouTube videos that this kid was just like playing five nights at Freddy's. Right. But I could see how that would creep out an adult. And so I was like, Oh, I didn't want to tell him that it wasn't scary. But then I, then I was like, did you hear it? And I was like, what? And he was like at 13 seconds. And at 13 seconds, a woman's voice comes in and says, I love you. And then says the kid's name clear as up. See, that's that's creepy. Rone ass woman's voice like ASMR into my ear and like whispered it.

But I know that it couldn't have been somebody because he was clearly holding it to his chest. I don't know. That's that's that's that's that's the that's the best evidence we can, it seems most people can get is like disembodied voices that are clearly not coming from anybody that you know is in the room, but are there and you can't explain it. I'm actually texting my sister right now because I can't find the video. I know I have it, but I can't find it right now. Damn it, man. Yeah. But anyway, here's to doppelgangers for being that type of paranormal occurrence that's not super sexy. That makes you feel weird. That's hard to believe a lot of the time, but that like if you see you are like instantly convinced is real. It's a it's a good time. It's a good type

of paranormal occurrence that I think people like don't really like get into in a fun way anymore these days. If you like this type of thing, check out like an like a neat old timey horror author or like sci-fi author like Ambrose Beers. Get in there. Don't let creepy things like this die. It's really cool stuff. That's why I shared it with you guys today. Pingo pango. Pingo pango. Pongo. Yeah, I agree. Don't let this just it makes for fascinating, really fun, creepy, creepy stories. And hopefully for the next episode, if I can get the video from my sister, I find it on my own. I'll open it up. I'll open up the next episode with Jesse there with that little recording just to get it going. And hopefully you guys can hear what I heard and maybe maybe you'll

tell me I'm crazy, but either way, I'm already like creeped out about the idea of hearing it. I don't want to have heard it. It's like it literally sounds like it's right next to the phone and it doesn't it's it's not like it's a far off distant voice or anything. It's straight up just a voice who belongs to nobody at the table. That's so creepy. Yeah, it was creepy. It was really weird. Now I'm excited to hopefully show that off on the next episode, but we'll wrap this little mini episode that's almost as long as a normal episode, but less less a deconstruction of a very particular event and more of this is cool and it's tied to a lot of very interesting things. So Alex, I appreciate it very much. I'm glad we were able to get something out for the

people who have been clamoring for more stuff, which is always a big, big compliment. So thank you guys. No, it's not. It's no one's fault, man. That's, you know, Jesse's traveling and there's something we can really do about it. But hopefully we have a proper episode up for the next one, hopefully within a few days. The next episode, all I'll say about the next episode is that I wanted to pair this episode with another episode we already did back to back. But after having done that episode, my brain was fried and I wanted to hold off a little bit and do something a little less crazy. So it'll be a, it'll be a tinfoil hat type episode, guys. As always, if you enjoyed this and you want to talk about it, the subreddit chilluminati pod is the best way to drop topics.

And there's just, there's so many people on that subreddit now. It's phenomenal. If you want to tweet at us directly chilluminati pod on Twitter, we are already almost at, I think, 255 star reviews on iTunes, which is hell yeah. It's insane. You guys have been amazing for supporting the show for how, again, how young it is. Keep an eye out. We're working on some really cool stuff behind the scenes and we'll be back hopefully really soon. A few days. Yeah. Yeah, really, really soon. We'll see you guys later. Peace. Bye. Bye.