Chit Chat Stocks - The Luckin Coffee Scandal

Episode Date: April 7, 2020

This week we have an interview with author and speaker Anthony O'Neal, but before we get to that our hosts Ryan Henderson and Brett Schafer have their stories for the week. Ryan kicks things off discussing the Zoom Video debacle (1:10), and Brett covers the infamous Luckin Coffee scandal (11:39). After our news for the week, we have fintwit beef and an update on Davey the Day Trader (20:25). We have best selling author Anthony O'Neal on the show to discuss financial advice and debt situations for younger people (27:10). After the interview, as always, we have our Hot Water (57:20), FMK (1:05:01), and Anecdotal Evidence (1:06:05).  --- Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/chit-chat-money/support Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Welcome to Chit Chat Money. Today is Tuesday, April 7th, I believe. Today we have an interview with Anthony O'Neill. Sort of untraditional compared to some of our recent interviewees, a little more personal finance related. Part of the Dave Ramsey network, if anyone's, I know there's a lot of fans of that. So Dave Ramsey got myself, but it was a great interview. Before we get to that though, I have my story, which talks about Zoom video. And then what's year's about mine is the luck and coffee debacle they're down 87 in the last three months because apparently they faked like two-thirds of the revenue last year which uh you know i don't think that's a lot standard that is a lot yeah no absolutely not and then we have current state

of finn twit as always and then we also have hot water fuck mary kill and anecdotal evidence after the interview so let's go all right welcome in i'm going to kick things off um my story for this week is the tale of zoom video so as most people now know thanks to this whole social distancing effort going on around the world, people have flocked to Zoom video as a means for communication. But this week, a little bit of a debacle, I guess you used that word earlier, but debacle came out about a lawsuit against Zoom. There is a Zoom user in California that is filing a class action lawsuit for their practice of sharing users' data without them being properly informed.

It stated that they share the data with third parties like Facebook, and the lawsuit also states that Zoom is getting paid to share that user's data. So I did a little digging and Zoom was very open about it. They were very transparent. They did a few blog posts. Two were written by their CEO, Eric Yen, who I am a fan of, just so everyone knows in case I sound biased. And then they had another one by their chief legal officer, Aparna Abawa, probably messing that up as well. but in these blog posts, Zoom highlighted the information that was being collected. So they made sure to make it really obvious what data points were actually being sent to these third parties. And it's not what everyone kind of thinks it was. So it wasn't in meeting content.

It wasn't like from your actual meetings. It's due to, so you can sign up through a Facebook account on Zoom. You can build a Zoom account with your Facebook account and it's through that facebook sdk or software development kit which uh i mean is good typically for users let's say they don't want to use their phone number or something like that they can use these uh their facebook account um but all the data that was collected around the users was around their actual devices so it's like the app version the device carrier the ios device model the ios language ios time zone it did not have anything to do with the actual meetings they don't monitor any of the meetings they'd or the content that is in the meetings um they made sure to i mean that

was a huge selling point for them because i think a lot of people got that mixed up um and then in regard to selling data zoom stated that they do not sell users data nor have they ever and nor will they ever they don't have any intention of doing so in the future um so there was a lot yeah definitely a lot of miscommunication on the lawsuit like you read the headlines on twitter and you automatically think Facebook's watching our videos or our meetings. That's not what is happening. They did respond, though. They may be taking audio transcripts of stuff

and feeding it into their algorithms, but they're not directly watching us. No, I mean, it's only device-oriented. It has nothing to do with the meetings because that's the SDK. Sorry, I meant on Facebook's side. Yeah, with Zoom, they're not doing that. Right. And I mean, so the only, they, they highlighted, or at least Zoom, what they told us through those blog posts was every piece that they're basically giving to Facebook and none of it had to do with any of the meetings. They took basically two different actions in terms of a response to these lawsuits.

The first was on March 27th, Zoom removed the Facebook software development kit from iOS entirely. And there was a lot of iOS info that they collected. So like I said, there was all that the iOS time zone, iOS language device model, all that stuff. I thought it might have been an overreaction, honestly, because there are probably a lot of people on iOS that may have signed up with their Facebook account. But regardless, on March 29th,

they also updated their privacy policy to be more clear about the data they were collecting and how it was used. Note here, if you don't sign in on a Facebook SDK or you don't sign in using your facebook account they don't they don't give that data away to them yeah um look first off it seems like zoom in a serious note is taking uh you know they did things the right people probably just overreacting because it's gotten so popular and there's not really anything in the news besides the pandemic but don't you think so if facebook's like the

leader of the mob in silicon valley you know like in goodfellas when henry hill comes out of the room the courtroom and they're like ah you broke your cherry and everyone starts clapping that's like all the data harvesting companies to zoom after this they're like ah you got your first scandal and then they start clapping they're like welcome to the club guys as a user as a user do you care if like so let's say you sign in through a facebook account and facebook got access to the size of your ios screen and they got access to what ios device you use or i mean i guess you're an android user but um like do you care that they have your device details like okay go ahead and target me like a new phone case i don't care well yeah i mean android i'm an ios when you're using

your smartphone it's just there's someone is getting to you whether it's super personal data or just location and you know aggregated data they're getting they're getting it and zoom is not doing anywhere near the worst it's just that they're in the news the cycle will definitely go down and personally it seems like if you're not using the software development kit and they're already you know taking down um the connection so they're not sharing any data whatsoever because i guess they're not making money off of it it seems like it's not a big deal and then personally like with the phones yes this is how we live and that's the sacrifice we have should it be better yeah i mean there probably will be government regulation eventually but i'm not going to stop

using my phone and all the apps uh the other thing people are probably asking is they're like okay they say they don't sell data then why do they give their data to facebook there's the the nature of that transaction is that there's more optionality when it comes to building a zoom account like that's the point that's the why they sign that's why they allow users to sign on using a facebook account and then in exchange facebook gets the data points that they collect from the device that signed on yeah it's like the login stuff like spotify was going through this they make most of their money uh through subscriptions like zoom does and they use the facebook sdk and people got upset because they were using the data um it's just part of the

software development kit if there's anyone to blame here it is facebook because the way they have it where you can log in with facebook on all these apps that's how they aggregate all the data it's a little over my head for the actual technical ways to do that but that's how they get like everyone's data and not just stuff uh from the facebook apps doesn't it doesn't it bode poorly for facebook though like everyone's like i mean i guess it bodes well bodes poorly for zoom on face at face value but then when you dig into it you see okay they're giving away my device specs like that's it but now at the now i automatically think okay i'm just never going to sign in through a facebook account because if the goal is to not give facebook as much information

as you can just avoid signing in on their accounts that's what apple's been trying to do with the new iphone stuff where they're trying to keep everything in-house with the apple id sign-ins or i think it is or the face sign-ins yeah apple's taking your face as well but they probably have earned more trust with people and they're not using the data to target ads with you. So yeah, I mean, people don't want to log in with Facebook. Probably, I don't know if a lot of people actually understand or care to understand how it works. So Facebook might just be in the clear still being kind of a scummy company, but yeah, it can't be good for Facebook either way. Side note, they also noted in the blog post that DAU's both free and

paid was 10 million as of december last year and then as of march this year it jumped to 200 million uh that's daily active users are you surprised that they've had they've done a good enough job handling that many users like usually when there's that big of a jump there's probably like latency issues or like issues with servers and overloading like how come we haven't seen any problems out of that i think that's the beauty of the cloud offering so depending what cloud provider they use if it's aws azure google cloud or other uh you can scale up rather easily which is why zoom was able to do that uh if they had to buy like i actually just watched the social network again on uh netflix because it was on there if you were using like the servers like

they did in that movie it's kind of the easiest examples where you have to keep buying stuff or else it crashes cloud just levels up for you and you just keep paying more just because it's aggregating on these giant uh in these giant data centers so that's probably why they're succeeding but one note financially i don't think very many of these users at all are actually paying more they probably already had subscriptions within their company or their university uh or their like educational program and this is why they're using it now but they're not actually paying more money of the 200 million daus if you had to guess how many of these are paid users i mean i don't know i guess like 40 30 to 40 percent is what i'm probably guessing yeah yeah yeah uh they're

definitely going to see an acceleration in revenue growth but it's definitely not going to be 10 to you know like a 20x uh bump here because a lot of people are using it for free and right Right now, they're offering it to children for free at elementary and middle school and possibly high school, I think. I think it was K through 12. But on a positive note, it's getting Zoom in the lexicon where if people want to use apps like this, this is the number one for them. But I don't know how they're eventually going to charge everyone if people kind of think of it, oh, this is a great product, but it's free. How are they going to start charging people like $10 a month? So I don't know if the valuation really warrants all these users eventually being paying users.

It seemed like they're just going to go to the free offering from Google Hangouts or Skype or whatever, even if it's like 80% as good as the product. All right, well, let's get to your story. What do you have? Okay, it's Luckin Coffee. You guys probably heard about this. Last week, they announced an internal investigation revealed that the COO had been fabricating sales numbers. I don't know for how long, but I'm assuming it's been going on for a while.

Stock was down as much as 81% Thursday. so just if you had put options on them congrats because you could have i mean it's not really investing but that someone could have gotten really lucky there yeah they are now down 87 in the past three months company said as much as 310 million dollars in sales were forged in 2019 for reference their q3 sales number uh in air quotes i guess was about 200 million meaning that was a ton of uh faked numbers like just an absolute ton and i guess they were saying their revenue growth was 400 500 300 i guess it was slowing down to like 150 but those were just i guess too eye-popping uh to really take seriously on february 3rd actually the investor

relations page had a blog post and this is so that's like two months ago from now or sorry two months before now right uh that any fraud allegations that were coming up were materially false because there was muddy waters research who i guess congrats uh for doing all the boots on the ground stuff was coming out with claims the stock had gotten hit a tiny bit but there was no proven thing going on uh and they were right and lucken was they definitely they must have known uh the executive team definitely knew when they put out that blog post on february 3rd uh but other than that citron research uh tough look for them they were really back and looking and there's a lot of people on twitter thin twit at least that were saying yeah you know i mean i was back and looking

in february and march but you know i sold all my shirts i knew like it was it was a fraud but you could see all the time stamps from people like oh yeah looking they're the new thing they're going all over china's going to be the new growth story you gotta go all in on luck and coffee and they're probably not feeling too hot today no okay two things here a those people it's a miracle that all these people that were huge luck and bowls was randomly sold out before and oh yeah i don't know how that's possible uh it's probably not but the other one is this you think they were sitting in a room and they're like all right it's gonna be you that's got to take the blow the ceo was the one fabricating the numbers. Like, oh, it's like just that one person fabricated 66% or more

than 60% of sales single-handedly. I mean, who's going to believe that, that the CEO and the rest of management had no clue? Yeah. I mean, we've been saying this on like every episode, but when the tide goes out, you see who's swimming naked and the economy slowed down in China and they were exposed uh it's just like any other ponzi scheme where you keep adding on stuff you know you need money coming in you need growth coming in if the chinese economy is slowing they were gonna have a tough tough time uh expanding their sales there but one other note uh apparently people in china are rallying around the company they're making it kind of a patriotic thing there's a bunch of very viral weibo posts which is i think kind of the twitter of china so it's

now sort of or i don't know if this is a political thing or it's just the company trying to you know get their brand back up but it's part of the cultural trade war with china starbucks versus luck and seems like it's going to be tougher for starbucks if the brand is that it's like america versus china for starbucks to kind of grow uh without having that stigma among chinese citizens in that country yeah i'm curious if that really is the stigma that it's starbucks is an american company and they come that like that they want stuff that's only organically or stuff that has been grown from yeah like domestic companies versus american companies it's tough to know because we're uh i guess we're not there so right yeah and i i read that piece that you

screenshotted and put on twitter and it's like i guess props to their marketing team yeah they're really they gotta dig deep and spend a lot to get their image back uh it's like they're like they're like guys forget that we just defrauded everyone remember this is real this is real chinese coffee not those americans that came over support us now in our time of need i know it's crazy that they wouldn't just be like no this is not like doesn't it worry you that the the fraudulent company they weren't like no no this is this is an aberration no companies in china are like this they're like no no we need to rally around this company and it's like but aren't they the one they're they're different than all the other companies right

uh but i guess this rolls into my question here how does this make you feel about the chinese adrs which is how you invest in a chinese company um if they're listed in like not in the united states yeah i don't own any chinese stocks right now um and this honestly it will discourage me i i hate to like if i see a company with wonderful financials and i'm thinking like god like you know like it's hitting all the marks there you have to discount the possibility of accounting fraud if there's just yeah there's too many cases yeah i mean the the precedent is there like there there's been so many examples where it's too good to be true and especially coming out of china and this is just another example yeah yeah i'd agree all right one more question this or two more

questions one of these is a little i don't know if we can answer this but do you think this is like a one-time thing or with this economic crisis definitely worldwide one now uh are there more dominoes to fall fraudulent companies in china and throughout i mean the entire world yeah i would be surprised if this was the last one i mean chanos has been saying uh some things about and hi he's a smart guy he was short-lucking um i respect him a lot he was saying that alibaba is the bigger whale in the room i don't know if that's true uh that's it that would be a big big that would be the biggest fraud in history if that were true i mean there's probably a ton that maybe it's not i mean maybe it's not two-thirds of sales but what's to stop them from juicing up the stats a

little bit and there is a chinese i would say there is a chinese discount already being that there could be that accounting fraud like and what doesn't that make you think that the company is if they were legit like most of them are legit they're i i think so most of them are legit doesn't that make you think if you were an executive wouldn't you be like all right if we get audited by the american firms do the same uh gap principles and sec regulations that the american companies do wouldn't we get a valuation premium compared to our counterparts which makes them even richer i would think that right it sucks like it really sucks for companies like jd.com companies like alibaba uh thus far that companies that i mean let's say you are you're

you're you have good integrity you're honest and you're reporting true numbers it sucks because you're going to get that same discount because of the mistakes that your your other companies other domestic companies have made and i guess you can buy back shares and eventually it'll happen but it's just a lot harder because i mean there's a lot of money in the united states that can invest in these companies and i think they're probably missing out on valuations but if you're building a business it really doesn't matter last question here assuming they have a market cap of about a billion dollars which is what they finished at today i think or about 1.1 billion dollars and they're actually growing sales at 20 a year and

let's say they have a price to sales of like six or seven right now yeah is luck gonna buy it all no yeah yeah okay so you know what if they were like uh all right we've completely got rid of all management the board removed everyone they didn't know what was going on and they found a way to validate that the board had no idea and management was removed brought in some new people the business model has some merit to it however management is still there and they everyone was like it was more like damn they caught us like like shoot like they figured it out instead of like this was this was a mistake on us like ah they got us like coo's gotta go like oh do you think starbucks should just buy them at this point i think starbucks would be better off going solo

i think they could without having to buy them out yeah because they already had way better traffic numbers anyways, or like better spending numbers anyways for their stores when Luckin was faking their sales numbers too. Yeah. All right. Current state of FinTwit? Yeah. I got a few short ones. I guess this is kind of some news. Airbnb is raising a billion dollars and led by Silverlake, who is another investor in Twitter right now. So they're kind of pumping in a lot of money, Silverlake partners into distressed tech assets. I wouldn't say these they're distressed but struggling uh they say the valuation in middle in the middle of march had only come down to 26 billion dollars uh that has to be lower now right there's no way i hope they're

losing like 80 of their revenue i mean there's there's no way it's 26 billion dollars it's yeah it's crazy to me that's that's one where it's like if you would have given them maybe 10 more years that or maybe even five more years it's like oh that's that's bailout material yeah but because they're private they're not in the public markets it's like all right who loses here a few vcs yeah booking.com is like down 50 percent uh no way airbnb would they would be down the same i guess they don't have the liabilities of all the liabilities go on their host and they just take that cut which is like for airbnb it's a good thing the host kind of gets screwed if they over lever but beauty of

platform yeah the beauty of the platform for sure and they are legit actually a platform uh next one here have you been seeing those fin twit and i guess there's also a non-fin twit uh dad's doing the dad colon and then kid colon like question and response things yeah kind of yeah you know you know i mean vcs do it too a lot of tech people those most of those can't be real right uh i mean it was there was a few that i was like all right there was a few vcs where it was like that was a humble brag like look how smart my kid is and i'm very skeptical they make sure to highlight it's like my five-year-old son and then it's like yeah and it's like dad when i'm coding java like you think i should be and it's like all right whatever when i'm coding java do i i don't

even know anything about that but when i make my business plan for my lemonade stand should i charge should i offer should i go for growth uh or should i try to get profiled right away and get those 20 operating margins but they i'm very suspicious on the validity of all those and then yeah last one here this is going to be short i think to get rid of our tesla talk each week i'm just going to ask you the same question every week and you can respond and then we'll move on all right so weekly update is tesla fairly valued no all right let's move on we're going to stick with that that's going to be the question yeah so we just we can stop uh talking about them every week all right yeah temporary solution we're not going to stop but yeah sure um i mean there's too

much news to avoid that i have a few things from the current state of fintway uh did you see this ross gerber perusaxina beef yeah to uh do you see ross gerber bullish on zoom z oom gerber is such a clown like okay i guess everyone was like everyone kind of said like oh i was out of luck and i didn't trust management and peru saxena said that although he did at one point tweet yes i sold it gerber literally i mean there's screenshots that were sent to him and gerber like called out peru saxena like oh haha too bad you're bullish on luckin and then peru's like oh yeah i sold it and he showed him the screenshots and then he's like well i don't keep track of all that crap and then someone's like gerber you were bullish like you put here like china's the growth story

and tagged luck in and this is a prime example of if you just refuse to believe it is it true like because i mean to him he probably does he literally thinks i never thought that no it's like the people that are so i hate he's in denial and there's either he's so in denial that he believes what he's saying is true yeah it's mind-blowing to me also this stuff the davey the davey day trader stuff is so good yeah i mean it looks like he's losing a lot of money uh but i don't even know if he knows how to calculate internal returns so he might not actually be losing that much money or he might be losing a lot more but one more thing about ross is he is the guy that apparently is buying the z o o m ticker consume video i saw first off he called

the new facebook which is just i mean maybe dude but i doubt it uh and second off you give the dumb ass ticker that got suspended are you like how how does this guy manage like 500 million dollars i i don't know all right yeah um but uh yeah i was gonna say this combination of barstool twitter and fintwit is everything i've been looking for yeah it's right up our right up our alley uh definitely keeping us at least partial entertained without sports okay those are my only things from Twitter. Next, we're going to have a quick break, but we had the Anthony O'Neill interview. What were some of the things you liked about it? Yeah. I mean, it was different. We're not talking really investing. It's advice for anyone. I mean,

I know some of you listening might be pretty good with your money, at least probably think so, but advice for anyone in debt. He's written books on how to survive college if you don't have that much money things like that we talk about go in depth of all those um he's not he's a personal finance guy so he had a lot of good tips i thought he had a lot of good tips for young people trying to get out of debt and trying to push forward and like start building your wealth and that's pretty much it right yeah and even if like even if you're not someone that's in like student debt it's refreshing to hear like that people are and you kind of maybe you take it for granted that you don't have that or maybe you you know have something in sight as far as

what you were able to do and you can kind of compare and contrast as to the advice that he offers but definitely not a typical interview um but refreshing information it's always good to hear you All right, today we are welcomed by Anthony O'Neill. Anthony is a best-selling author, speaker, and Ramsey personality. We'll dive a little deeper into some of those things throughout the interview, But let's kind of start with you just introducing yourself, how you got to where you are today, and what kind of inspired you to help young people make decisions with their money?

That's a good question, man. Well, again, thanks, Ryan and Brett, for having me on the show. For those listening, my name is Anthony O'Neill, a Ramsey personality, number one national best author and speaker. You know, the key thing that really got me to where I am today and doing what I am doing today is myself, actually, to be honest with you guys. Back when I was 18 years old, I'm a freshman to the college campus. I didn't have freedom. I didn't have, in high school, freedom. I couldn't go to prom like that. I couldn't go out to dances. I couldn't date ladies. I couldn't really have a

life. I grew up in a very strong, strict, spiritual home. Man, one of the things that I quickly learned was they didn't really give me knowledge when it came to money, when it came to life skills. I just knew how to go to school, look good, come home, do my homework, and then go to church. So I'm a freshman under the college campus. I'm 18 years old, never had this much freedom before. I'm on there trying to holler at the ladies. I'm trying to make friends. I'm trying to, you know what I'm saying? I'm trying to have a good time. I'm trying to join a fraternity. Like I'm just trying to really just turn up and just be the young man that is free. and I remember going off to class and uh while I'm heading to class this this guy jumps out and

he says hey son if you fill out this credit card application I'm gonna give you two free large pieces and one free t-shirt and I was like well that's cool that's what's up so I fill it out and about a month later I get the credit card me and my mom get into an argument because she's like son you don't need it um the credit card is not what you need at this present time and I was like I'm a grown man. I got this. And so, man, y'all, before I even turned, not before I even turned, but 13 hours after me having a card in my possession, I maxed out my very first credit card within 13 hours of me having it. Quick lesson, you know, but it was $150 at Red Lobster to spend it on a young lady, taking her out to dinner. Then number two, I spent the $150

was sending that same lady roses and flowers and then number three I bought her a $200 purse so you guys I'm like this is easy like I can rack up this I can rack this up spend $30 a month and pay it back you know I just made the dumbest decision of my life and from there I went and applied for every single credit card everything that I could do um could apply for it and before I turned 18 and a half you know I'm $35,000 in debt and then I do something stupid in college participated in hazing and because i participated in hazing um i got kicked out of school i got kicked out of school i lost my job i lost my apartment i thought i was going home but my mom and dad was like no you can't come home you made these decisions we told you to make better ones

so you need to go live with your consequences and to make a long story short you guys for about six months of my life i'm 35 000 in debt uh and trying to figure out figure out where am i going to sleep and the majority of those nights i was sleeping in the back of my car in a walmart parking lot off of highway 76 in oceanside california and um that's why i'm here you know because my parents taught me the spiritual side of things but no one taught me how to budget no one taught me how to uh build a lifestyle that is on a solid foundation no one explained to me what's the difference between a credit card and a debit card no one explained to me um what is a credit score No one explained to me how to start a business, how to build wealth, how to start your legacy.

No one really broke this kind of stuff down for me. And so that's why I'm here today. It's because I had to learn the hard way. And I want to help as many millennials and Gen Z and young people and all people across the world, to be honest, how to avoid debt, how to make sure you have an emergency fund. I mean, look at what the world is going through today. And then how do we start building wealth? How do young people like yourselves, Ryan and Brett, how do y'all buy homes at 21, 22, 23? How do we really become successful at a young age and it's not an older age mindset?

Right. That makes sense. And then that's probably how you ended up like that inexperience is what ended up making you want to help young people with their money so they don't make the same mistakes you did. Yes, correct, man. And it was it was pretty much the all the mistakes that I made from not choosing the right friends, from racking up all that debt, from not even really listening to my parents, because my parents transitioned from parents to guidance people in my life, like guidance counselors. They were mentors more so than my actual parents. And so all the decisions that I've learned has really, really helped me to really make the decisions that I'm making today and how I want to give back to the community I'm giving back to today. Yeah. So you sort of talked about the kind of times we're living in right now with the pandemic and people are struggling as far as like liquidity and losing jobs and stuff like that. one of the things they're getting though is that uh that stimulus check and so uh from your

perspective what do you think people should be doing with that money well i this is what i always say the caliber of your future is going to be determined by the choices you made today so there's there's two things we can look at this thing um if you um are out of a job and you don't have any income coming in and depending on you may fall in the 1200 mark or the 2400 mark no matter what, there's four walls that I really want you to focus on. I want you to focus on utilities, transportation, shelter, and clothing. Um, and clothing is really technically last because, you know, it's right now you shouldn't be buying any clothing. So I really want you to take care of your food, utilities, and your shelter. Um, and clothing if you do need it,

but you don't need to be going out there buying new clothes. I'm at this present time because we ain't going nowhere. So, um, so what I'm going to say is that I'm going to make sure that we are taking care of that. And so at the top of that list, I want you to make sure that your mortgage and your rent is paid. Then make sure that your utilities are paid and make sure that you're eating. And then from there, if you have anything left over from that, just stack it. I want you to put it into the savings account and just stack that money as long as you possibly can. But nine times out of 10, it's only if you're getting $1,200, by the time you get done taking care of your four walls, you will not have any money back at all. And so make a wise decision with the

income that you have coming in. Yeah. It's a sticky situation because, I mean, we're going to talk a little bit about investing here, but that's enough money to basically cover your fixed expenses. So that's kind of tough. But the other thing, you've written a book called debt-free degree. I have a question regarding debt. There are a lot of people out there with debt that are also having liquidity issues and cash issues to begin with. What do you say to them about their debt repayments if they're already having cash issues? Well, if you're already having cash issues, it sounds like you have two problems. You have a small shovel and you need to get on a better budget. Before we can even address the budget, we do need to

figure out how do we get our shovel bigger, which is a bigger cash flow. And so when I'm recommending to people, clearly right now during this pandemic time, it's going to be a little bit more difficult to find a job. But once this pandemic is over, you need to figure out how can you, if you're working this one job, if you can get a better job that pays you better or maybe give you more hours, or do you have to get two jobs? Because right now I'm a huge fan of attacking your debt as much as you possibly can today. So if that means you got to get two jobs and maybe start a small business at home, so you can have three streams of income coming in to attack your debt, that's great. But once we get the income fixed, you got to get on a detailed zero-based

budget. And the zero-based budget just simply means that you list your income minus your expenses, and at the end of it, it equals zero. So if you make $1,000, that means you're going to spend all $1,000 on paper. And at the end of it, it's going to be zero. If you make $1,000 at the end of it, you spent $1,200 on paper. That means that you're negative $200. You need to go back and fix your budget to make sure that it comes out to zero. But especially even right now during this pandemic time, your budget is your number one frame. Today's the first of the month when we're recording. And for me, I've already looked at my budget two times. I have a surplus of income and i'm fine but i'm even still figuring out what are some areas that i can cut back

during this pandemic time to save me some money so i can have a lot more money in the savings but during this time if you are struggling with cash then sit down and see where can you can where can you cut things from your budget if you got netflix and hulu cut one of them and if i was if i'm struggling with with some income i'm cutting both both of them you know and i'm gonna keep my internet and maybe stream some things on youtube or something like that during a small season if you got apple music and spotify you need to cut one of them you know you only need one so get creative with the areas that you're cutting so that way you can save some more money right because you always want to you want to get to that place where you have a cushion where

if you have a time like this where things slow down you have that you know weird thing where you might get uh laid off because of you know the pandemic which is just a crazy thing no one was really thinking about. You want that cushion, right? That emergency fund so you can survive at least two to three months. And then going into that, you're not going to be able to do that if you have all this debt to repay. Yeah, you really won't, man. And you know what? And I'm praying for everyone right now during this pandemic time. You're right. No one's seen this coming. A month ago, no one was thinking we were going to be here today where we are. And right now, this is not about, you know, my message, my voice. I told you so. Right now, it's about let me help people

get to a better place. Let me help them get out of this pandemic. And then as soon as we get out of it, let's get out of debt. You know, debt robs you of your dreams. Debt brings you fear. Debt does not set you up for joy, for peace, for happiness. And if you had three to six months during this time, yeah, it's still going to suck. Let's be honest. You know, this still feels horrible even for myself because I lost a lot of income coming in. But at the same time, I'm able to sleep well. I'm still able to eat. I'm still able to get up and have joy and have peace because I was prepared for a season that may come like this. But right now, let's just focus on how to get out of this season. And for those of you all who may still have a job, let's say you still

have some income coming in and you're a millennial Gen Z. Now is the time that if your job is still employing you, you still got some income coming in. If you have debt, attack the debt. If you don't have debt, then set aside an emergency fund because you never know when you will be impacted and when you will need three to six months of income. No, that makes a lot of sense. And you mentioned that you wrote, or Ryan mentioned that you've written two books before, I think. Do you want to give a brief synopsis on each and then why you wrote those? Yeah, you know, I have two books, The Graduate Survival Guide, which that is the five mistakes high school students cannot afford to make when they transition into college. I

highlight the five mistakes that I made, not having a plan, not relationships, not having healthy relationships, taking out student loans, which led me to my next book, which is called Debt-Free Degree, which is a step-by-step guide on how to get into college 100% debt-free. And so for your listening audience that may be a good book or may not be a good book. Some of your listening audience may be in college or transitioning into college, but it's a step-by-step guide. I break it down from the seventh grade all the way through the 12th grade. Hey, here's what you need to be doing in this grade, during this semester, during this summer. Here are the classes. Here are the secrets to the ACT and the SAT. Here's how you do dual enrollment and actually win with it.

um here's how you do some clep testing like i put everything in this book on here's the plan here's the step-by-step guide but then also i'm gonna give y'all a little secret i have a new quick read book coming out next monday april 7th called destroy yeah destroy your student loan debt so now i have the graduate survival guide where i'm teaching high school students hey here are the five most important mistakes you cannot afford to make. Then I have a book for middle school and high school students and parents of that age bracket who want to get into college debt free. Let's say if you have people like myself who went into college or like you all selves, who we all went into college and we're trying to figure, okay, I took out student

loans, but how do I, how do I get out of them fast? And I wrote, I wrote a quick read. It was about 10,000 words. It will take you about two hours to read it. It took me two hours to read it and I hate reading. So it's a quick read and I literally lay it all down. I do a deep dive into baby step number two, which is where we talk about how to pay off all your debt using the debt snowball. I tell you when is the best time to possibly refinance your loan. I break down the the negatives and the truth about uh the student loan forgiveness um about the government and how they're guaranteeing some stuff i mean i literally give you the step-by-step guide on here's how you attack your student loans the pre-sale right now uh i don't know when this is coming out but the

pre-sales on amazon and then uh we are also live on my website at anthonynode.com as well and they can purchase it there um anytime after april 7th 10 bucks um it's a quick read and it will bless bless anyone who reads it. So while we're on the topic of student loans, I guess this is a little political, but what are your thoughts? I mean, there's a discussion going on now about whether or not student loans should be forgiven and exempt, or if public college should be much cheaper, if not free. What are your thoughts on that debate? You know, here's my thoughts on that, man, I'm like 50-50. I don't have a problem with a Bentley costing as much as it does. I don't. You know, I don't have a problem with a Honda costing as much, a little bit more affordable

as it does. And so I do, I don't have a problem with where colleges name their prices, because just because they're expensive doesn't mean that we have to go to that expensive school. So I do believe that we should make more community colleges available as far as in if not free at a very, very, very affordable price. I do believe that maybe some local and state colleges should probably be a lot cheaper. I do believe with that. But I do not believe that every single school needs to be 100 percent free when it comes to college, because that's not mandatory. That is something nice or something extra. Now, for specific degrees, if you want to be a doctor or a lawyer, yes, you have to go to school. So I would love to see maybe some local community colleges and some local in-state colleges, if they're not free, be at a very affordable price to where someone who is not as fortunate can actually go to that school and work hard and earn that degree.

When it comes to student loan forgiveness, here's my philosophy. We got 44 million people who are in student loan debt and I feel for them because I was a part of that staff. We had literally over $1.6 trillion in student loan debt. So here's my thing. We do need to do something to help these 44 million. it. But before we address that, let's stop the bleeding. When is the last time you put a band-aid on a wound that continues to bleed? Now, you've never done that. What do you do? You go in there, you stop the bleeding, you clean up the bleeding, and then you put the band-aid on there just to make sure that if any little bit of small pieces of blood comes out, it's covered. But you never put something on a wound that will continue bleeding. So my thing is, let's stop the process. Let's stop the student loan stuff, make some more affordable options. Because when we stop student loans, then now we force the colleges to come down because now they're like, there's no

guarantee. So we have to make school affordable for Ryan. We got to make school affordable for Billy Joe Bob out there. And so now we start seeing the school responding because now there's no guarantee. Then once we fix the beginning, then once we stop the blood, when we stop the the water from coming in, then yeah, let's go back and see how can we help these 44 million people right now who were just done wrong. Now, we didn't write this question down, but I'm just curious on your thoughts. And if I'm spoiling your new book, just stop me. But I have friends right now that have student loans. They're not super apt to talk about it, and they're trying to pay it off and they get out of college. They're trying to pay it off faster.

what would be the first steps i know you said you talked about refinancing that loan i think a lot of people don't even know that they're able to do that um what would be the steps to refinancing a loan how would you do that for anyone in that situation man you know what that's a good question i'm gonna leave that one for the book but i would definitely say this though i'll definitely give you this i do not believe that everyone should refinance a loan okay now the step-by-step process on how to do that um i'm gonna leave that for the book but here's when i say you should refinance loan. If that interest rate is ridiculously high and the refi company is going to give you a much lower rate, they're not going to charge you any fees to do it. And so here's the secret. I'm not

refinancing my loan to get lower payments. I'm refinancing my loan to get lower interest rate, but I'm going to put more money towards the payment because in the long term, I'm going to save a lot of money. So when I think of refinancing, a lot of people get excited because their payments go from 500 to maybe 300. Well, no, I want you to keep the same payment of 500, but I don't want you paying a $500 payment on an interest rate that may be 8% when you can get it for 3%. You see what I'm saying? So that saves you thousands and thousands and thousands of dollars. And then now if you keep your payment at $500, for an example, if that was your payment, Now you get out of debt quicker rather than going so long because you have all this injury securing on a daily basis.

So the step-by-step process is in a book. And, bro, I even give people the best company out there that has the best interest rate to refinance a loan if they qualify for my standards when it comes to refinancing their student loans. That makes a lot of sense. Yeah, you always want a lower interest rate if possible. But for when you're talking with young people, what do you think the or at least in your experience, what's the best method of communication you have found to like when you're working with young people to try to help them with their finances? Authenticity, man. You know, one of the things I've learned with my brand is young people, man, we can tell when people are scripted, you know, when they're when they're fake, when they're not real, when they're just doing this for a job. A lot of people call me a financial expert.

And to be real with you guys, I'm not a financial expert. I'm just a student. I'm a financial student. I've made some mistakes. I've learned how to fix my mistakes. So all I'm doing is everything that I've learned and everything that I'm still learning to today and I will continue to learn is I'm just turning around and just teaching it to young people. I had the opportunity to sit up on one of the generals when it comes to the financial world, Dave Ramsey. And every single day, I'm learning something from this guy. And I don't go out there trying to be this big guy that's like, I'm an expert. I'm this, I'm that. No, man, I'm just a young man who's passionate about helping people. And why do I learn so much? It's one, I want to impact my life.

But then two, I want to help young people like yourself. Now, I want to help young people get some knowledge, get some wisdom ahead of the game. So at 21, they're thinking like a 31-year-old. At 31, they're thinking like a 41-year-old. I want people who rock with me, I want all of us to be ahead of the game. I want us to start thinking about building our legacy at 18, at 19, at 20, or at whatever young age that they are when it comes to this new mindset, because that's just so important. So I think one of the key things that I'm noticing with young people is they see that I'm authentic, they see that I'm real, and they see that I'm passionate about this message. And I think if you're really trying to reach young people, you have to be real. You have to be authentic. You have to be passionate because they can smell you from a mile away if you're not that guy or that young lady.

Right. Now, if we kind of pivot from the savings side to the investing side, this is sort of a personal question. So you don't have to, I mean, if you don't want to answer it, let me know. But how do you invest your own money? And then what would be your advice for young people once they get to that investing side of it? man that's a good question man you know i um i started off the way our baby steps teach where we get 15 of our income into a 401k that is matched and a roth ira so i have money into both um i have money into a 401k um and i have money into a roth ira uh with my standards but with not my standards but where i am financially um i do also invest into i purchase a home and i've also purchase some land. I'll tell you the secret that one of my millionaire mentors told me. He said, we're not building any more land. We're continuing to build houses. And so what he taught me was eventually one day, whether you reap it, whether your kids reap it, or whether your kids'

kids reap it, purchase some land as much as you possibly can, because one day it will sell and it will sell more than what you purchased it for. So right now I'm like, I'm on excitement of just purchasing some land here and there. You never know, somebody may come and say, I want to build my house on this. I want to build my business on this. And so that's what I'm doing. But for young people, here's what I'm suggesting is

the number one investment you can make is into yourself. I believe in education. I believe in college education, trade school education, military education. The number one investment you can make is into yourself. I tell this to young people, mind your business. And what I mean by that is your mind is a business. So grow your business and get some type of education that can grow your number one asset,

which is your mind. Get through college 100% debt free. Get through trade school 100% debt free and grow your number one asset, which is your mind. Then after that, let's say if you have no debt, you got some money in savings account, you got your three months minimum in your savings account, the number one thing right now is time. put a hundred dollars a month if you're 18 19 20 years old into a Roth IRA and if you do that if

you just do a hundred dollars a month at 18 19 20 21 22 at least in your young 20s by the time you get to 55 60 you'll have literally over 1.5 million dollars just off of a hundred dollars but check this out those people listening right now you're gonna be making some good money because you're listening to this podcast. So you're going to be able to max out at 15% of your income into this account. So this means by the time you get to 55, 60, you should have anywhere between two to three, $4 million into this one account because of time, time and compound interest. So I always tell people two things. If you're in your young 20s or wherever you are, your number one asset is your mind. Invest into that. Avoid debt. Stack your money,

get three months into a reserve into a bank account number two invest into a raw ira you can go down to your local bank tell them i want to put fifty dollars a hundred dollars into that thing a month instead of for taking out your girlfriend or instead of buying a new pair of shoes you know put some money into your future because it is our younger person's responsibility to take care of our older person it is my responsibility to take take care of my 16 70 year old self it's even uh there really aren't any excuses now and i i obviously i i guess maybe i'm in a better situation but you you don't have to go to the bank anymore in the digital world you can download an app open a roth instantly on like a schwab or something like that and

immediately start to make those payments if you have that extra cash aside um but i i know we're getting close on time here so we'll uh we'll pivot into the last two questions here um what is one financial saying that you disagree with one financial saying that i disagree with people have said uh cash is safe before uh one thing i disagree with is uh credit is king that's a Yeah, that's whack. That's whack. You know, credit is not king. Credit is a lie. You know, it is definitely a lie. Because when you really step back, everyone who I ask who does the credit score thing, okay, cool, I respect it. That's what you do. It's not what I do. but no one disagrees me when I say this. Does a credit score really determine your financial success? And everyone agrees with me when I say no, because they're like, yo, all it simply means is you just know how to pay back your debt. But it has nothing to do with

how much money you make, has nothing to do with how much money you have in your savings account, because it is so awkward to me that you reward me with a lot of debt. But if I have zero debt and i have six figures sitting in the account i get penalized because i want to pay cash for everything but you can have someone who has an 800 credit score but don't even have 800 in their bank and you give them a lot so for me that's one financial statement i disagree with i do believe that cash is king and credit is not all right well here's our last question and then we'll let you go uh what is you know we've had a lot of you've talked a lot about giving advice to young people. But if you had one thing to give for young people starting out in the business or

investing world, what would it be? In the business or investing world, the caliber of your future will be determined by the choices you made today. What choices are you making today that will impact your tomorrow? And the number one choice that I believe if you really want to be successful financially and especially in the business world is avoid debt if you really look at what's going on during this pandemic time um a lot of companies who do not have debt they are the companies who are staying afloat because they have all this cash coming in and it is theirs and they're able to pay their employees i was in the waffle house yesterday i know waffle house shut down about 400 stores uh here recently because of the pandemic

because they want to reserve their cash so they can come back and hire all their employees in the future. And so one of the general managers told me, she said, well, we're debt free. So we're definitely going to bounce back out of this. We're just making the proper calls now. So that way, when we do get out of this, we can come back and hire all of our families. And so she said, but we have no debt. We have no mortgages. And so we can come back and hire everyone instantly. But the people who have a lot of debt and have a lot of payments, when we get out of this pandemic, a lot of companies are not coming back. And so if you really want to be smart as a young entrepreneur, number one, avoid debt yourself, avoid debt for your company, and just make sure that you have patience and build slow and make the right decisions today that will impact your tomorrow. Awesome.

Appreciate your thoughts, Anthony. We'll let you go now. Thank you for coming on to the show. Hey, man. Thank you all, man. I love the show. Let me know when I can do it again. Yeah, no problem.

Thank you, Anthony. All right, man. Okay, welcome back. Thanks again to Anthony O'Neill for coming on the show. Really enjoyed it. But we have our hot water now. I'm going to go first. Go ahead.

Yeah, okay. So the GOAT is back. Billy McFarlane is back, and he's starting a crowdsourced funding project to collect money because coronavirus is tearing families apart. and so he's in prison doing this by the way okay question for you who is doing better who's doing more for their community one martin screlly who's trying to get out of prison to create a vaccine to billy mcfarland or three those preachers in the south trying to get people to give them money to

tell god that the coronavirus will cure that they will cure them of the coronavirus okay so is martin like i don't know enough about martin screlly because that all kind of happened you He kind of went to prison and all this stuff before I was into the investing world. Is he brilliant? Because his record was very impressive. No, yeah. He's very smart, but he's also just a scumbag. So kind of like Billy McFarlane, but with that smart.

Yeah, that's dangerous. Dangerous combo there. But, I mean, is anyone going to ever give Billy McFarlane money again? at least at least screlly like to the best of my knowledge there's no documentaries out which basically highlight his fraud screlly's like i mean there probably will be but if screlly's like like the uh i don't know those movies where there's the guy in prison who helps solve the crimes or you know what i mean like the genius that's in prison yeah like the blacklist or something like that they made they made mcfarlane look so bad too there's there's no you're not

coming back from it um other plagiarism is in hot water for two reasons also um so yeah so that ross gerber tweet today i think so here's the thing he said zoom will be the new facebook whatever you know what i'm i'm bullish on zoom and but he he jacked that take from invest like the best because we were talking about, I mean, it was with, what's his name? Gavin Baker. And he was talking about the power of Zoom and how it can be kind of like a social media down the line. He totally jacked that take from Invest Like the Best.

Yeah, definitely, definitely. It's just, he's, it's unreal. Regardless, he tagged the wrong Zoom, which you already highlighted. So we know who was buying that. We finally know. yeah he was driving out the prize and he must have just been the bag holder no i don't think he actually did that i don't i don't know dude but maybe though like how is he might have um anyway the other one is elon totally ripping off that lady's tweet oh yeah dude he probably i mean

and okay he's supposed to be the meme guy he didn't say anything until literally everyone call them out for being the person that steals jokes um because like no one you know when you have like a fire joke and someone says it a little bit louder that is what happened here oh yeah he probably does that all the time i mean you know how there's that moment when you kind of when elon goes into your sphere of influence uh and then you realize like oh shit like he's bullshitting now the comedians the finally comedians are like oh elon's bullshit wow all right yeah i have noticed like a lot of people on twitter like you know never really looked into it but like he's like he's just really good at pr dude yeah i mean he got me for like three years

i mean i'll say it um all right fuck my kill wait no hot water sorry go ahead uh the tiger who got coronavirus is obviously in hot water but i want to say how are we giving that tiger i mean i'm an animals i like animals i don't even eat animals how is a tiger getting a test when we don't even have enough for all humans okay so that's what i thought at first as well but apparently so i'm here i whatever we were talking about it with the family and they were like yeah so he had he was showing symptoms so like super lethargic you had no appetite and all this stuff and what what so what if it's because what if it's like the transmission from humans to animals oh interesting like what if that's the start scientific huh i mean that's probably that's probably the concern

there right yeah yeah i guess i guess i mean because it doesn't affect dogs or whatever but let's or it doesn't affect most animals is what i'm hearing but what if like human to animal doesn't work but tiger to animal does i don't i don't i don't think many i guess we have tiger king is big i guess more people are interacting with tigers than we think but i i don't think that's it but all right that's it i guess all right other ones carnival cruises uh we know they're in hot water but the saudi fund uh aka the biggest jinx on all investments has invested 8.2 percent in the company if you were running a company and you saw the saudis aka the people that finance terrorists uh the people that killed that washington post reporter who used to be a

saudi arabian reporter you know really just a bad country how scared would you be if they controlling stake in one of your businesses you know what i can't i can't even hate on it because they bought the dip and we talk about buying the dip all the time so they btb they took it to heart but yeah dude they finance their finance terrorists like it's i mean they're erratic their government is super erratic they are they arrested they convinced the lebanon this is like 2017 they convinced told the lebanon president to come uh to saudi arabia and they capped they imprisoned him and forced him to resign from lebanon as the prime minister over video because he like said something about iran or something like that i could begin that wrong but they

they do crazy shit like that all the time if i was an executive of carnival i'd be scared shitless oh i mean yeah so a if i was an executive i'd probably quit my job but if i'm an investor i just don't really want anything to do with it i'd probably sell shares oh yeah no yeah just just don't yeah don't even mess with that all right what else do you have okay well here's something that seems like a total coincidence a rental car lot in a miami airport uh a fire destroyed 3 500 cars on over 15 acres total coincidence right was there a model 3 no no no it's not tesla although i like where you're going there uh i you know there's going to be a hell of an insurance claim on that right i mean and the rental car companies they have zero demands

huh interesting really big coincidence there uh last one though all the other nfl coaches because bill belichick at his library yet his background there has a copy of poor charlie's almanac uh so You know he's like Munger on the football field. I knew he was an investor. I could tell. Don't you think he could run a fund? He'd be a fan. He'd be like Carl Icahn.

He'd be the best corporate raider if he walked into your executive room. You know what I mean? He's got a little combination of Buffett and Munger in him. Cut your losses early, you know what I mean? Yeah, he's definitely like that. He definitely thinks like that. sell brady at the top i mean he tried to he tried earlier oh yeah he cut off what chandler jones i mean whatever football talk but yeah all right uh is that your last one that is it

okay fuck my kill the theme this week is health care the three companies i've got here are similar scientific livongo health and teledoc oh wow well teledoc the valuation has gotten insane i do own shares of similar and teledoc so i guess you probably know but i do like levango health i think i'll marry similar because i do own shares of that too and i like the valuation compared to teledocs because it's getting a little out of hand uh but i don't know i'm not gonna i'm in teledoc for the long haul so i'll probably kill them at this point and fuck levango but i don't know i'm marrying similar and i'm i'm not really selling teledoc i don't think i'd sell all three of these but uh i don't know does that make any sense yeah i'm gonna kill teledoc right now just

purely on the valuation versus these other two similar i'm gonna marry um and then levango i bought shares up 12 the first day so if that's not bangable i don't know what is um yeah so yeah there's that there's my combo there um anecdotal evidence last segment here uh you want to go sure uh so big news on my personal portfolio decided to sell um a company i was a big fan of jd.com why uh i guess because the valuation is not as it's not as interesting as it once was it has gone up quite a bit and it stayed there and i do think uh it looks like the chinese economy i'm not a macro economist but it looks like it's in a lot of trouble um and i just think there's a lot of downside risk right now i got a lot of there's a lot better opportunities elsewhere uh

with companies i know a little more did luckin influence your decision at all slightly i i think i've been thinking about the jd.com for a while though because i've been reading up about the chinese debt market the because the consumer the chinese consumer is what's really important to jd.com and it looks like the numbers aren't looking too hot and for some reason the stock is not taking a hit whatsoever um and i just don't i don't know if things cool off and the economy starts roaring back but luck and coffee was um i think it was kind of a catalyst to you know get me to research a little bit more okay well you got anything else or is that it that's i just i think i'm trying to any i sold my disney as well they got a lot of uh other liabilities

that are probably hurt really bad right now like disneyland and cruise ships but they have uh influence in china as well i'm trying to get my chinese exposure um as minimal as possible okay um i finally got my trip refunded on airbnb oh congrats and i was struggling and they so a If you don't have an Airbnb trip planned, basically they said you get a full refund if your check-in date is before April 15th, I think it was, got extended to May 31st. So if you think it's only between now and May 31st, the full refunds, mine was not until June 5th, my check-in date. So they are having to refund a ton, I'm assuming. Yeah, definitely. no that's probably why they're having that's probably why they raised money they're having

cash flow issues for sure and beyond i'm assuming beyond just their initial like the policy that they claim right now it's interesting and i think they're going to have a lot yeah everyone already knows the take but it feels like there's gonna be trouble there it's crazy how a month we go offline and some of these companies just i mean you would never expect a total shutdown but some of these companies they can't even like survive a month like how how do these executives sleep at night with knowing all that risk that's on the table yeah and so you know that gavin baker interview uh on invest like the best was great and i i think everyone should do that solvency test where you say how many days are they of liquidity do they have left if they don't have

any revenue zero revenue um and if your company can't survive longer than two or three months they're in trouble yeah yeah or they're potentially in trouble um at least i mean if if it's a month they're definitely in trouble yeah two three months probably in trouble okay um the other thing that i was thinking about do drive-in theaters make a comeback why because there's you can be social distancing yeah i mean i would i could attend a drive-in right now and watch a movie yeah i could also watch it on my couch no it's probably it's probably could have if it was gonna make a comeback at all this could be it um the other thing is you could use so there's all these churchgoers you know with that are actually going to church you could not all not all of them

but some um maybe not so smart ones a small part of them and they're but i mean couldn't you use sort of drive-in theater model for church services large gatherings stuff like that no dude god will get coronavirus he'll get rid of it that's all you need yeah all right well i think that's it then right yeah yeah okay anthony for coming on again yeah thank you anthony thanks for everyone who listened feel free to follow us wherever you're listening like and subscribe if you're on apple podcast we really appreciate that it really helps um and follow us on twitter also if you have any like any companies that you want us to evaluate or look at just tweet it at us it's at chitchat money we'll definitely do it we i think we've got a few on the queue right

a few people have recommended some uh one i think one right now yeah could there could be a few i'd have to check the twitter mentions yeah get them in um and we'll get those done we are not financial advisors anything we say or discuss here on chit chat money is not formal advice or a recommendation thank you guys for listening we'll see you next week Thank you. Smarter.