Citation Needed - Competitive Eating, Takeru Kobayashi, and Joey Chestnut

Episode Date: December 4, 2024

Competitive eating, or speed eating, is a sport in which participants compete against each other to eat large quantities of food, usually in a short time period. Contests are typically eight to ten minutes long, although some competitions can last up to thirty minutes, with the person consuming the most food being declared the winner. Competitive eating is most popular in the United States, Canada, and Japan, where organized professional eating contests often offer prizes, including cash.

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Dumb. Hi, I'm Mike Rowe, and I got nothing against celebrities. In fact, I just interviewed Rob Lowe and Jason Alexander, and they were terrific. But usually, I interview people you've never heard of. The plumber who makes 250 grand a year the first responders who risk their lives To save complete and total strangers and the mad scientists who are about to change the world with a better mousetrap Those are the kinds of people I usually interview on the way

I heard it and you're officially invited to give it a listen wherever you listen a podcast podcast. Hello and welcome to Citation Needed, the podcast where we choose a subject, read a single article about it on Wikipedia and pretend we're experts because this is the Internet and that's how it works now. I'm Noah and I'm going to be the lead Masticator as you digest this week's episode, but to make it all the way through, we're going to need a whole digestive track. First up, the liver of this episode because I can most easily picture him in livery, Cecil something Italian. The uniform is bad for the feet. It's livery with bunions

And also joining us is the gallbladder of the show because he's the one with the most gall Tom something Irish It's stones. I have the most stone. Oh, okay. All right gall stones. I'm very unhealthy I have the most stone. Oh, okay. All right gall stones. I'm very unhealthy And also journeys tonight this shows large intestines because tall because tall Colin something The man you all know I would make the rectum even if it damn near killed him Eli Bosnick, okay, be fair. The parics said, I'm lucky to be alive, Noah. Lucky.

It did. Now, of course, you might be wondering who the pharynx, esophagus, stomach, pancreas, small intestine and anus of the show are. Well, those are our patrons. And if you too would like a chance to be this show's anus, be sure to stick around to the end of the show. With that out of the way, tell us, Heath, what person plays think concept, phenomenon or event? What we'll be talking about today.

We're going to be talking about competitive eating, the amazing sport and its greatest rivalry. All right. And would you like to do a weird if he can't beat Tom, join Tom preamble? Yeah. So there's a lot of important things going on in the world right now. Far reaching consequences for humankind and a big thanks to Tom for letting me borrow his Adirondack chair for his test and his dock of contemplative sadness for this. So given these recent events, I've had lots to think about. I'm sure you have too.

As an American Cishet white guy, it feels like my people, my idiot people, need to have a moment of introspection. And where do we go to find answers? ESPN and their amazing documentary series known as 30 for 30 or what Anne calls behind the music for dude bros. So I watched one of their documentaries that truly captures the essence of what it means to be American. It's about competitive hot dog eating. And I'm pretty sure Alexis de Tocqueville said the same thing or something similar.

About America. I was just sure I was searching men choking down massive amounts of sausage and look what popped up. It was. Two things. searching men choking down massive amount of sausage and look what popped up. Two things. Yeah. The documentary is called The Good, The Bad, The Hungry.

It's the story of the greatest rivalry in the history of competitive eating. Nay, the history of sports. Nay, the history of competition as a concept between Takeru Kobayashi of Japan and Joseph Christian Chestnut of the United States. They're the two greatest eaters of all time. Of all time? Are we sure? Do we have paleolithic cave drawings of early man stuffing their faces with wooly mammoth burgers? We should.

Until we know Fred Flintstone's pterodactyl dog numbers, I don't feel comfortable with that claim. Thank you, Tom. He's not even considering the Atruskens. Exactly. But for the record, Heath, you had me at competitive eating is the most American thing you can think of. Thank you.

And that giant rack of ribs that Flintstone had, I feel like that's a great thing for one of these contests that they don't do. That's an awesome starter play. Right? All right. So I'll start with a little background on the majestic sport known as competitive eating. The sport traces its roots all the way back to the 1600s. One of the earliest notable athletes was Nicholas Wood, who was known as the great eater of

Kent and some of his amazing talent was recorded in a 1630 pamphlet called the Admirable Teeth and Stomachs Exploits of Nicholas Wood. According to the pamphlet, Mr. Woods, many feet gastronomical large. See, so thank you. I also, I love that. Like they're like so excited. His teeth may be the process. It was like, well, you gotta imagine back in the 1630s, having teeth was probably a

pretty big deal. Like he was British. Right? That was a whole big thing. Yeah. I was going to say I've been to Manchester recently and I'm still right. Yeah. Make a bet.

How did he stare? That's all Is actually at the bottom of Michael Marshall's business card if you look it's All right, so according to the pamphlet mr. Woods many feats of Gastronomical largesse included eating 84 rabbits in one meal. Jesus, what? Eating approximately 400 pigeons in another. What? So many big ones.

And consuming a whole entire raw sheep in one sitting as well. Raw sheep? Excluding the wool, the horns, and the bones. Black there. Sissy. Not a lot of people know this, but if you find the right strand of muscle fiber first,

you can just inhale the rest of the meat off the sheep like a long spaghetti meal. That's true. It's true. It's true. It goes right in. Weird scene from Lady and the Tramp. It spins.

It does it, it's insane. I thought it was romantic between the two of us, Cecil. I miss when- Right, Cecil? Yes. Thank you, cheers. I miss when- Right, Cecil? Yes. Thank you, cheers. I miss when all it took to be a variety act was a pamphlet lying about your variety act.

That seems- Right, yes. All you have to do is deny. I did 900 pigeons. I did 900 pigeons. Doesn't he have to be remotely believable? What are you gonna read my pamphlet, person in the 1600s?

No, you're not the- Look at my teeth! Look at them. I got fucking tape. I've got top season bottoms. And Stomax Glora.

Okay. So for his amazing skills, the great eater of Kent became a celebrity and he often performed at festivals and fairs. He was also known for accepting challenges from wealthy patrons. He almost always won. We only know about two times that he lost a wager.

The first loss was when he did not finish the entire ale-soaked loaf of bread that he gambled on. Another time, he took a bet from a local nobleman named Sir William Sedley who organized a party around an eating challenge. Details of the food are very sadly lost to history but we I looked for so long to try to find this but we know that Nicky Wood he gave it his all but eventually fell unconscious into a food coma for eight hours. When he woke up, Sir William locked the great eater of Kent in the stocks to publicly shame him for his defeat in the back. No, I get it. My IBS does the same thing every time I have Chipotle, so the tradition lives on. A loaf of, an ale-soaked loaf of bread dude ate and a whole uncooked sheep like a cartoon

Vacuum and he couldn't eat a loaf of bread so was there fucking how much ale was there was there a small lake of? Yeah, I feel like a lot of this was just like 1600s Tom going oh darn I only ate 80% of the free food you kept giving me at the party you organized for the purposes of giving me a lot of food and what a loser am I? I don't think it was like that. And you got to like live at a castle for a night. It's pretty cool.

Yeah. You can do Tom, you got to do the voice. Another big milestone in the evolution of the sport came with the emergence of the pie eating contest as a major event. The first recorded pie eating contest took place in Toronto in 1878 as a fundraiser. The prize for the winner was quote, a handsomely bound book. There you go.

Yeah. Ironically, it was a diet book called how to to Lose Weight by Not Eating 40 Fuckin' Pies in a Sitting. All right, moving ahead to the early 20th century, and the sport started expanding out to many other foods, sometimes all at once. And New York City became a major hub. One of the biggest names during this era was Frank Dotzler.

And he rose to fame after a contest in 1909 when he consumed 275 oysters 8 and 1 8th pounds of steak 12 rolls three large pie large ones and Washed it down with 11 cups of coffee That event was organized by a delightful group called the Manhattan Fat Men's Club. Ooh, any word on if they're still taking members? They don't take people from New Jersey. Eleven cups of coffee. That is adorable. Put me in, coach.

All right, another chapter in the evolution of competitive eating is a niche field called untimed gluttony. This involved eating absurd things over long periods. Seems so draft. Yeah, right. Your gluttony is timed. Come on. You got an alarm that goes off when it's time for the gluttony to stop. So these untimed gluttony things were often a competition to get into the Guinness Book of World Records for example the standing record for eating an entire ox is

42 days I want to point out that 42 days is a unit of time It's a lot of scaramoochies yeah, I don't like how many members of this podcast heard that fact and thought I could be 40. I did When you eat a large mammal about 60% of its live weight is edible meat ox weighs about a thousand pounds looking about 600 Pounds of meat sounds like a lot but for simplicity we could use a standard curry household conversion chart This is about 300 rotisserie chickens. Over 42. I use the similar system. Over 42 days, it's seven chickens a day, three meals a day.

Only have to eat two and a half, two and a third chickens. I'm not saying I could beat this record. I'm confident I can make a good show. Fully agree. Let's do that. We're going to beat that. We're going to get to the Guinness book. That sounds fun. Here's do that. We're gonna beat that. We're gonna get to the Guinness Book. Huh? That sounds fun.

Here's the thing though. Guinness discontinued the untimed gluttony category in 1989. I can't imagine why. Yeah, well, mostly because it's fucking crazy. Yes! They can't do it. I was supposed to risk the goodness, book of all records. Bunch of balanced individuals exploring humanity's limits. Not a crazy guy with fingernails that raps around his fucking head.

I've been on a pogo stick for six weeks! Al, stop eating that fucking live elephant! What is wrong with you? Now that I'm not going to be in a book someone jerks off to at the library, I don't know what the point is. Okay, but Guinness kept one entry in that untimed gluttony genre just for its historic value. Under greatest omnivore, they list Michel Lotito, also known as Monsieur Mange-Tout or Mr. Eat-It-All in French. He was known for consuming entire bicycles, shopping carts, Monsieur Mange to or Mr. Eat it all in French.

He was known for consuming entire bicycles, shopping carts, televisions, beds and most famously a Cessna 150 airplane. Huh? The Cessna took about two years. He'd break the metal components into small pieces. He'd drink. So, yeah, that's helpful. He'd also drink lots of mineral oil ahead of time, and then he would somehow swallow and digest all the metal or it just fucking stayed there. Or he was lying.

It's that one. Well, yes, probably. According to a Snopes report from twenty twenty two, somebody was like, I'm going to look into this way later. Here's the approximate quote from Snopes. It said, come on. Snopes did find evidence of him performing some of this metal eating on stage. And according to an estimate by Guinness, he ate about nine tons of metal between 1959 and 1997, his career. Mr. Eat-It-All died in 2006

officially of natural causes. Yeah and the death certificate just says iron efficiency. And that brings us to the Super Bowl of competitive eating the Nathan's hot dog eating contest in Coney Island. Oh, yeah. I'm sure Chicago's is very good, too. Hard to make it through all the onions and peppers. Yeah. And the celery salt is good, though. That's cool.

So the origin story of the Nathan's event has the first one taking place in 1916 when four American immigrants made a big spectacle of competitively gorging on hot dogs to show off their patriotism I get it. Amazing. That story was mentioned by numerous publications over the years. They're doing it to the national anthem. They're just displaying as they're stuffing it in there. But yeah, that story was mentioned by numerous publications over the years including New York Times But we eventually learned that a promoter made up the whole thing in the early 1970s when he was putting together the first actual Nathan's contest,

which again is an incredibly American thing to do. Right. Right. Yes. Yeah. No, nothing can be more American than lying about that same thing would be. Right. That's just a rule. Here's the thing, even now, there's a big dispute about when the first official Nathan's contest happened. According to a statement from Nathan's, quote, we've held the contest every year since 1916,

except for 1941 as a protest of the war in Europe. Big Hitler fan. And 1971 as a protest to political unrest in America. So they're lying. That's lying. The only record of a Nathan's contest from 1916 to 1971 was in 1967. According to an article from the Reading Eagle, June 30th of 1967 was the 100th anniversary of the invention of the hot dog by Charles Feldman who named it after his hometown of Frankfurt, Germany.

The winner of the Centennial Celebration Contest was a 400-pound truck driver from Brooklyn named Walter Paul who allegedly set a new record with 17 hot dogs in one hour flat. And I say allegedly because there is an aggressive edit war on Wikipedia about this record that includes the mention of a non-sanctioned contest in 1959, but this should count during which a quote one armed carnival worker ate 18 and a half hot dogs in one hour flat. One armed carnival worker doesn't seem like a unique identifier at all. The Tilt-A-Whirl is a cruel mistress.

They go for a high five and you think it's gonna be so cool. Okay, so there was some kind of Nathan's contest in Coney Island starting in 1972. But for me, the real origin of the event was in 1979, or the beginning of what I call the modern open era. They finally organized a set of rules and the winner had to eat the most hot dogs in a 10 minute format. I don't, I wanted to see the version of the hot dog eating contest before there were rules, the fucking no holds barred.

It got crazy. A lot of one-armed people. Yeah. Guys were in an old timey football helmet for some reason. For some reason, a ninja shows up. Whatever. So that event remained nothing but a small spectacle for decades. But then a star was born. That would be Takeru Kobayashi. Thank you. He took the sport of competitive eating to the next level, giving it a place in the pantheon of international athletic competition.

I would say at the top. His career started in the late 90s when the sport was mostly found on TV shows in Japan. And then in 2000, he made a big splash by winning the Gluttony Championship on the Japanese variety show TV Champion by eating 16 bowls of ramen in one hour. What the what? And he revolutionized that event by adopting a new technique that they'd never seen in a ramen contest. He lifted all the noodles out of the bowl, allowing them to briefly drip dry and cool down. And then he put them all in his mouth at once. And then he chugged the liquid part after it was a big moment for the sport.

Yeah. This time the people watching were puking too. So it's a whole. So Kobayashi's ramen victory on TV champion led to an appearance the following year on food battle club. Now this was the big time in Japan and Kobayashi won the season long competition in dominant fashion over the previous champion and his mentor of eating Masahiro Hateshi. I tried so hard to learn more about this eating mentor but I couldn't find anything.

I found a bunch of stuff in Japanese, but then I tried to translate it, it still led to nothing. But it's definitely like a Yoda situation in my head and it's fucking awesome. Like, chew or chew not, there is no try. Like something Yoda-esque with that mentor relationship. And eat that crumb, here's the thing. Sadly, Food Battle Club got canceled in 2002 after an amateur bread eating

contest led to the death of a teenager and eating shows were blamed for, you know, promoting obviously dangerous ideas. Kid gets caught eating eating entire packs of hot dogs in his room Steve on the street later. He's got the pack of hot dogs rolled up in his sleeve like cigarettes So I Googled this cuz dying of eating too much bread doesn't make any fucking sense. And of the 13 deaths listed on Wikipedia as a result of eating contests, all of them choked to death. Which seems more like deaths that should be under failing to know the Heimlich maneuver at a putting stuff in your breathing hole public event.

But whatever, I guess that's the eating contest's fault because that's where the breathing was. I don't know. Yeah, and those guys are so fucking stuffed and you do the Heimlich, you have to start at the feet and squeeze them like a tuba tuna paste. They didn't die from the eating, they died from the chugging. It's all I'm saying.

Oh, God. You're not supposed to pour the coffee on your lap. I don't know how to tell you people. So that time period in the early 2000s is considered to be the golden age of competitive eating in Japan, but it waned afterward. So Kobayashi decided to ramp it up and bring his talent to the world stage. And the US of course doesn't care about kids dying very much. So the American TV market jumped right in. Kobayashi already had a foothold in the US

after winning the 2001 Nathan's contest. And over the next few years, he would absolutely destroy the competition in just about every type of eating event. And unlike the rest of the field with mostly extremely large people, Kobayashi is only 5'8 and about 130 pounds at this point. Despite the size disadvantage, he now holds an impressive number of world

records. That includes, but is definitely not limited to, 100 bunless hot dogs in 10 minutes, 93 hamburgers in 8 minutes, 150 rice balls equaling 20 pounds in 10 minutes. What? Ninety three hamburgers in eight minutes. One hundred fifty rice balls equaling twenty pounds in thirty minutes. Sixty two slices of pizza in twelve minutes. Three hundred thirty seven buffalo wings in 30 minutes. Also, 13 grilled cheese sandwiches in one minute and fifty seven cow brains in 15 minutes. That last one was at the 2005 Glutton Bowl on Fox. So on top of his many records,

Kobayashi also invented several new techniques for both training Kobayashi. I did, I did. He did. He did it. He was muted. He was muted again every time I said it. Kobayashi. Thank you. Several new techniques for both training and competing.

Which is damn impressive when you consider how long eating has been around. Right? He came up with a new, like new eating. This dude was creative. And there's one in particular, one of his new techniques that's become especially important during the Nathan's contest. Instead of just chomping down on hot dogs and washing them down with water, Kobayashi started using a pair of techniques known as the Solomon technique and clearing.

So he grabs two hot dogs out of their buns and he snaps them each in half. Absolutely perfectly based on like thousands of hours of practice. It's snapping hot dogs in half. And then he eats those four halves in a bundle. That's the Solomon. I feel like that's not what happens in that story in the Bible. Nobody gave him a chance.

Nobody gave him a chance, but he would have. He would exactly the message. But you could shove it in there. They dip the baby in water. He snaps the baby like a fucking Kit Kat. He's just like... So after he solomons the hot dogs, he dips the buns in his water cup to soften them up and then he eats the buns.

Well, that's called clearing. And in order to saturate the buns faster, he uses hot water. Oh god. Hot water or hot hot dog? Is it fucking nasty? I guess it could be hot. While probably hot hot dog.

Yeah, it feels a little like, like, pretty hot doggy. Pretty hot doggy. Cecil is going to die. Cecil is going to die on this episode. I've read ahead Cecil gets so much fucking gross. I bet urine would break down the buttons even faster. So nasty.

Jesus. So the Solomon technique in the clearing, it became such dominant strategies that it led to a controversial move by some of the hot dog, hamburger, and other fun-based contests to ban the use of the dunking. And many world records now specify with dunking or no dunking allowed. Now, I know it sounds weird to wash your food off,

but Coney Island is in New York and everything there has a thinly or garbage juice on it. So it's just natural. I mean, I hear you Cecil, but the water in Coney Island is actually just concentrated garbage juice. So washing it wouldn't make any sense in that situation. Even the raccoons don't bother. They're just like, no. You go to Coney Island, you the drink found like hot dog water comes Bill we got another hot dog stuck in there you gotta get the router All right, so that brings us to the origin of the greatest sporting rivalry of all time. It all started on July 4th of 2006 at the Nathan's Contest. Kobayashi came in as the undisputed GOAT of both the Nathan's Contest and the overall

sport. His reign began in 2001 when the previous champion set a new world record with 31 hot dogs. Except not really, because Kobayashi also set a new world record with 50 hot dogs. Jesus fucking what are you saying right now? What? He dominated the field for the next five years winning every single time. Except the time he lost to a bear. It was a bear contest. It's true. Excuse me? Yeah, he lost to a bear. He did. It was a bear contest. It's true. Excuse me.

Yeah, I know. He lost to a bear though. He did have to eat against a bear on a TV show during that stretch, but he dominated the Nathan's contest for those five years, no problem. He almost won against the bear because the bear was distracted

because there were TV cameras and stuff. Yeah, right, because the bear was just going like, what the fuck are you? But then the bear noticed and was like, oh, I'm a bear. And. And. And. like, oh, I'm a bear. And. Here's the thing, little did he know, a scrappy kid from Indiana named Joseph Christian Chestnut

was ready to emerge. Chestnut actually finished third place at the Nathan's contest in 2005 with 32 hot dogs. But that number wasn't even showing up on Kobayashi's radar. But during that same year, Chestnut had drastically upped his game, kind of quietly though. For example, Chestnut was the world champion

of deep fried asparagus for 2005, downing 6.3 pounds in 11 minutes, or investing the very highly ranked eater, Dick LeFave. downing 6.3 pounds in 11 minutes, investing the very highly ranked eater, Dick LaFave. Dick LaFave. Now, the people of Indiana actually crowded around his house after he got back to get a whiff of the asparagus pee because the scent is just a huge improvement over Indiana air.

It actually way better, it smells way better. Yeah, Cecil, true story. I was driving with Haley from New York to Chicago and after hours and hours of uneventful driving, just pipes up, it was like, oh, God, what is that smell? I didn't even have to check our GPS to know that we were now in Indiana. We were here for two hours.

I don't know, it's either Coney Island or Indiana. It's one or the other, I think it's Indiana. So, also worth noting, in early 2006, Chestnut qualified for the upcoming Nathan's contest at a regional event by eating 50 HDB. That's hot dogs and buns, the official unit of the sport. For those in the know. So as July 4th approached, there was a big buzz,

at least among the eating insiders, that Kobayashi might finally get dethroned. And the event was epic. It starts with the longtime MC, George Shea. He's a giant liar. His story is ridiculous. But he gets slowly raised on a platform high above the giant crowd of eating fans and he bellows into the microphone. They say that competitive eating is the battleground upon which God and Lucifer

wage war for men's souls and they are right. This is a battle of the ages. This is a battle of the Titans, the early gods who came to earth only once in only one location. And that is at the corner of Surf and Stillwell Avenue at Nathan's Famous in Coney Island. Okay. One, you can find a transcript of all of George Shea's introductions on the internet. He's the fucking greatest. They are fucking incredible. Two, I'm pretty sure he's the guy who wrote that introduction to Project 2025.

We read that. You're right. Well, at least now I know who to outsource my essay intros if I ever need a new one. If he listens, he turns the pot off after your intros, Tommy's like, all right, well, they're done with the interesting part. So George Shay does that big preamble and the finalists, they all get introduced, including the two favorites Kobayashi and Joey Chestnut. And here are the official rules as governed by major league eating or the MLE, which is sanctioned of course by the International Federation of Competitive Eating. That's a lot of politics. Yeah, it is. It really, really is.

We'll get to some of it. So the field usually has about 20 finalists. It's a weighty subject. And that includes any past champion of the Nathan's contest, the winners of the regional qualifiers for that season, two wild cards who had the highest average qualifier scores without winning first place in a qualifier, and occasionally an eater who gets a special invitation from MLE, like an honorary degree or whatever. This year it's Jake Paul. For the contest in 2006, competitors got 12 minutes.

They moved that down to 10 minutes, starting in 2008 and ever since. Partially eaten hot dogs do count and the granularity of measurement, if you're wondering, is eighths of a hot dog. And any hot dogs and buns held in your mouth at the final buzzer do in fact count if you finish them during the next approximately two minutes. This rule led to a popular technique called chipmunking. Come on. You know, chubby bunny, a giant mouthful of hot dogs and buns at the last second. Every rule that you mention makes this sport exponentially more gross.

I'm sorry. Yeah, so well, one other important rule is about vomiting case in point. So the official sports term is reversal of fortune. And that leads to a red card and a disqualification at the Nathan's contest. And that applies during and after the buzzer. There's a no vomit timer that extends a bit beyond the eating timer and the chipmunking time. And I bet the argument not to be the who is vomiting guy is fierce.

I just want to point out that this rule is there to ensure that whatever damage you do to your body is lasting damage. Yeah, that's right. I also want to know the bylaws about bringing like really gross pictures to suddenly show to your competitors at inopportune. Oh, yeah. That's a really good point. Not having showered in a few weeks. Yes. Really? No, I really, I checked all the rules. There's nothing about those things. Interesting. Okay. So bring like a jar of Indiana air with you and just people. Now that's cruel. That's just uncalled for. So they're ready to go.

There's a big countdown from 10 and the eating begins. Kobayashi and Chestnut position right next to each other in the center part of the long table with all the other finalists. And immediately everyone could tell Kobayashi and Chestnut are the only two eaters that matter after two minutes and 30 seconds each had 19 hot dogs down cheese is a close At only 13 there wow and then with about seven minutes remaining the unthinkable Started happening Joey chestnut took the lead for the first time in five years.

Thank you. There we go. We got two teams. For the first time in five years, Kobayashi was losing. And the crowd of, you know, patriotic racists in Brooklyn started roaring. But then, thanks to a late surge,

Kobayashi pulled back ahead and won with 53 6 8ths HDB, besting his own standing world record and narrowly holding off Chestnut's final score of 52. Joey Chestnut wept that day, but he vowed to be back. Yeah, single hot dog shaped and flavored tear rolled down his chipmunk cheeks, you know? Yeah. Yeah. All right, well, it's always a good idea to give competitive eaters a moment to themselves after a big competition. So we're going to step away for a little apropos of nothing. Where am I?

Hey, Enright! The International Council of Super-Intelligent Beings calls you to represent Earth. If your race is chosen, we will share our technology and knowledge with you, launching humanity into a new golden age of peace and prosperity. Oh my god, amazing. Now, one human activity will be chosen at random. You will explain and defend it to represent your species. At random?

Yes, at random. And your choice is? The Nathan's hot dog eating contest. Oh! Ahhhh. Can I like spin again? Is there like a respin? No, you must defend this activity. Right.

Okay. Okay. So, yeah, it's a contest. Like a sport. It's a real, like a sport. It's a real good time. We'll watch it, enjoy watching it, it's cool. Excellent, but what is the contest?

It's just, well, it's how many hot dogs a person can eat. Hot dog. Yeah, they're like tubes of meat, sort of. And you'll see who can eat the most as a contest. Yep. Uh huh. Yeah, um, we do. But aren't there like, starving humans on your planet?

Yeah, there are a lot of those, that's true. I see. Can I just please do another one, like a respin or something? Humans do a bunch of really good stuff. Fine. You may do the next on the list. The Nazi Holocaust. I, you know what?

Let's stick with the hot dogs. Sure. Climate change. A problem so huge, how could I ever make a difference? I'm Marco Chiaunovet, climate reporter for the Toronto Star. I meet a lot of smart people doing really inspiring things in this space all the time. Small things that add up to big climate benefits. Small things, big climate, Wherever you get your favorite podcasts. The Climate Solutions podcast is brought to

you by SmartFlow from Enbridge Sustain. We're doing business differently here in Manitoba at the Stu Clark Graduate School. It's an energy, a feeling, a buzz. You feel it in our professional services, on our work placements. In the connections you make with business leaders. It's unique. Something you won't find anywhere else. This is the graduate experience at the Asper School of Business where you can master your business career. And we're back when we last left off. Kobayashi thought he had that chestnut swallowed, but I feel like it's about to come back up.

Heath, take it away. All right. So following the epic loss in 2006, Joey Chestnut went into seclusion and he started. I'm sorry, he went into the bathroom. Well, that's seclusion. Right away that and then seclusion. And he started training like fucking Rocky in the Russian snow cabin he was serious and he realized he needed to come up with some innovations of his own especially in terms of strength training yeah thank

you so he made himself some custom equipment for that training that would include a biting ball which is a chew toy, but you're allowed to call it whatever you want. And he chews on the ball to get all those jaw muscles. Nice and yoke. Okay. I feel like if the thing that fails you in an eating contest is your jaw, the thing that actually failed you is society. Yeah. Yeah.

True. Yeah. Look, I'm sorry, but if your training camp involves gnawing on a Kong dog toy, you've got to radically rethink your life. Strong disagree. Now I want to see an eating contest where like there's a Kong for humans and like getting into it as part of the contest. So Chestnut also fashioned himself a set of weights to build the muscles in his neck.

He actually shows off some of the workout routine in the documentary on ESPN and it's fucking amazing. The weights are just like bags or whatever that he tied to the chew toy with a spare shoelace. Sometimes he uses two gallon bags of water for the weight, which is about 16.7 pounds. And he tilts his head back against the weight to simulate the motions of speed eating. Oh, it's all right. So I know it's my fault for doing the music, but now I'm picturing him running up the steps of the Philadelphia Art Museum with the water bags on either side,

holding them with his mouth. I just want to point out that we knew this documentary existed and we thought people were going to elect Kamala Harris on it. That's on us, right? What the fuck? I thought Trump was going to win and this is why. I'd seen this already.

You still told me. Yeah, I did tell you. So Chestnut, Chestnut also invented an exercise that combines a core strength workout with a technique called air gulping. It's very similar to breathing. He does crunches on a bench and swallows big gulps of air on each rep. He also developed a method of power burping that involves squishing his stomach with his hands to squeeze out air pockets and maximize volume to fit more food.

The official term in the lexicon of the sport is beanie baby training. Sorry guys, I can't hang out. I'm training to be a hot dog Bellows. So I've got busy exercise routines say consult a doctor before beginning any new program. That is because of this and CrossFit, but they both do burpees though. So

so chestnut is almost entirely focused on training. He's in seclusion, he's at the snow cabin. And meanwhile, Kobayashi is becoming a pop culture icon. Kobayashi ends up in TV commercials and a cartoon on SNL by Robert Smeigel. And he's even mentioned on The Simpsons. And during the few times that Chestnut comes out of seclusion to compete, he keeps losing the Kobayashi. That includes the legendary Johnsonville Bratwurst Championship in Sheboygan and the Crystal Hamburger Square Off when Kobayashi set a new world record of 97 burgers easily topping

Chestnut with only 91. Oh, but if those are crystal burgers, that should count as like eight. So Kobayashi was already the best in the world and the competition from chestnut, it's only making him better. But then in the spring of 2007, tragedy struck. Kobayashi lost his mother to cancer. And he broke his training regimen during a period of mourning. And then with the Nathan's contest right around the corner,

Kobayashi had to ramp up his training at the last minute. And it led to a serious injury, arthritis of the jaw. Oh, y'all heard. Yeah, it's terrifying. And, you know, if you're not an insider, that's like the ACL tear of competitive eating is getting a jaw injury, especially arthritis. I remember the exact moment this happened,

like in my real life, because I was watching Sports Center and during their injury report, it said something like, you know, Derek Jeter hamstring, and then it said Kob like, you know, Derek Jeter hamstring. And then it said, Kobayashi, jaw. Yeah. Boomers remember JFK being shot.

Millennials remember 9-11. And Gen Z, you have Kobayashi's jaw. So Kobayashi's jaw turned into a big controversy. And that's because a week before the announcement of the arthritis, Chestnut competed in a qualifier event in Arizona and set a new world record with 59 and 4 eighths HDB, besting Kobayashi's record by almost six full HDB. So when Chestnut heard about the injury, he thought it was a bullshit lie. Yeah, I mean, like dead moms are no excuse.

That's valid. And Chestnut told the sports media that the whole thing felt pretty suspect given the timing. Of course, Kobayashi was furious when he heard about the accusation. And despite his debilitating condition, he decided to show up for the Nathan's contest to make a point. He had a gigantic jaw brace on his head around like Hey when they walk out do they have to flip coins to see whose walk-on music gets to be weird Al's

Picture in Kobayashi at this point having to like chew with just the top of his head instead of his jaw. Right? Like a fucking head banging Pez dispenser or something. He looks like Skeletor laughing while he's eating. Yeah, right there! So, heading into July 4th weekend of 2007, Major League Eating did a press conference before the big event, and the MC, George Shea, announced that Kobayashi would be heroically playing through the injury, known scientifically as jawthritis.

And they made Kobayashi give a visual demonstration of how his jaw was physically incapable of opening all the way. It looked like O.J. trying on the glove. It was so silly. So people were assuming Kobayashi had no chance, but he had a trick up his sleeve. He consulted with one of the world's top experts in mandibular and

Okay, shut the fuck up and he Dibular athletics he learned about a special technique for opening the jaw at a weird angle to overcome some of that jaw arthritis Disadvantages doing it. Yes, it was kind of sideways that weird angle. disadvantage. You guys doing it? You guys doing it? It was kind of sideways at a weird angle. You guys trying it behind your mics, I'm doing it. Sure, sure the fuck you are. Sure the fuck you are, Eli. Yeah, so Kobayashi, he talked to that doctor expert,

he figured it out, and against all odds, he sets a new world record, 63 HDB. However, Kobayashi technically had a reversal of fortune right at the buzzer that year. So many people were calling for a DQ, but Kobayashi actually caught the reversal in his hand and ate it because he's a fucking warrior. Okay, I'm out.

Text me when we get to the questions. I'm gonna burn my headphones in the meantime That's she's all right, so Why did you do this to me Heath? Why would you do this to me? It's it's about and the amazing how dare you? It's an amazing effort. So the judges conferred and they decided no DQ and So the judges conferred and they decided no DQ and Kobayashi's record stood. But not really. Because Joey Chestnut also set a new world record with 66 HDB at the exact same time and he became the champion.

Chestnut finally took down his nemesis. I cannot emphasize the importance of making sure you're not behind by three tot dogs Before you eat a handful of your own vomit Behind you you gotta check that shit Yeah Like phrase there is there some terrible punishment for coming in second because like unless they're throwing my family in a North Korean work Camp I'm the smaller trophy here. Right, but he was still going to come in second.

Yeah, he ate that handful of puke for the love of the game, man. Exactly. Thank you, Noah. Well, maybe he hadn't reached his 20,000 calorie intent limit. So following the huge win in 2007, chestnuts career skyrocketed. He starts winning everything, but Kobayashi wasn't going away after a full recovery from the jaw arthritis. Kobayashi was back at Nathan's the next year in 2008. This time the game clock was moved down to 10 minutes from 12, and at the final buzzer

in the 2008 contest, it was a dead-even tie at 59 HDB, giving them each a shared world record for the 10-minute format. So at that point, they go to overtime in the form of a lightning round. Five hot dogs as fast as you can. And Joey Chestnut barely pulls it out by seven seconds. Chestnut finished in 50 seconds, all five hot dogs, defeating Kobayashi's time of 57 seconds to get the overtime victory. So the American beat the other athlete

by cheating when he was hurt and then winning a totally different contest. Okay. When does he drop a second unnecessary nuke? So, chestnuts dominance at Nathan's, it continued, including a win in 2009 and a new 10 minute world record for that year. And then in 2010, another giant controversy rocks the eating world.

We learned that Major League Eating was trying to establish a near monopoly by engaging in some very unethical business practices. Despite Kobayashi being the superstar who put the entire sport on the map and singlehandedly making MLE profitable, They were demanding that he sign an exclusive contract which wouldn't let him compete in any unsanctioned events by other promotions and they wouldn't let him compete in the Nathan's contest without a contract. So the 2010 event went ahead without the godfather of the sport. But Kobayashi did show up in Coney Island in protest and a huge crowd of his ardent fans showed up as well

with signs that said, free Kobe and chanting, let him eat. It was amazing. So this swell of support led to the event security team leading Kobayashi onto the stage to address the crowd. But then chaos broke out. Somebody from MLE allegedly George Shay. He's a piece of shit got on the radio and told the security team to arrest Kobayashi instead of leading him up. And so he gets tackled into offense.

Then he gets handcuffed and literally taken away in a police car. He got charged with resisting arrest, trespassing and obstructing government administration of a hot dog contest. What? They should have taken him to jail in the Oscar wire wiener, I think that would have been amazing. Do you think they put him in the mask thing just in case? Yeah.

He could have a reversal of fortune any minute. Now it sprays more. Like a Hannibal Leitz thing. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Right through those cuffs. So Kobayashi gets taken to jail, but the charges were eventually dismissed by a Brooklyn judge. After the incident, he told

reporters that he ate a sandwich and a glass of milk in jail. Obviously their first question was like, what'd you eat in jail? That was what he ate. He also added, I wish they had hot dogs in jail. Yeah, I mean, his letters from a Birmingham jail were admittedly a touch less inspiring.

Speak through your neck specifically. I disagree, Tom. I think both were great shit. So no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, MLE ever since very deservedly lost a bunch of money. Their TV ratings went down and sponsors like Old Navy, Heinz, and Pepto Bismol pulled out in solidarity with Kobayashi.

Okay, so I get why Pepto Bismol is there and everything, but I feel like Heinz had ulterior motives for pulling out of the eat a handful of your own vomit contest, right? vomit contest right so when the 2011 event came around Kobayashi was still banned so he figured out a pretty cool alternative he competed at a different venue at the exact same time as the Nathan's event he set up a live broadcast from a rooftop bar in Manhattan with a live telecast of the Nathan's event playing next to him on a screen on stage. He got two official judges from the New York Athletic Association to observe, and he set a new world record of 69 HDB in 10 minutes, testing the 62 for chestnut on the simulcast screen next to him at the time.

Now lots of people want to put an asterisk on that record but those people are bigots who hate freedom. It counts. So the contract dispute continued and the epic rivalry between Kobayashi and Chestnut seems to be over. Chestnut, to his credit, put together a streak of 8 Nathan's Contests in a row and won 15 out of 16 from 2007 to 2023. But the story wasn't quite done. Mostly because MLE is a horrible corrupt organization. Fast forward to this year when MLE also banned Joey Chesna. Yeah, no, he signed a sponsorship deal with a hot dog brand other than Nathan's. So MLE got mad Joey Chesna about that and they refused to let him compete this year. And Nathan's was extra mad because the rival

brand was Impossible Foods and their vegan hot dogs. And that is offensive. Hot dogs are supposed to be made of a disgusting slurry of animal products in a tube, not a disgusting slurry of plant stuff in a tube. So other than the ban of Joey Chestnut, the other big piece of news in the eating community this year was the announcement by Kobayashi of his retirement from the sport. Except, don't worry, one more event. Kobayashi and Chestnut went rogue and put together their own unsanctioned head-to-head eat-off because majorly eating the fuck itself

Event was on September 2nd live on Netflix. It was called chestnut versus Kobayashi unfinished beef Amazing okay amazing. Amazing the resolution was better than the Jake Paul my nice fight. Otherwise, you might as well play Pac-Man Unfinished beef so good that that's why you chose the episode. Yeah, I know right there. That's it Yeah So the big showdown starts with a pregame show on Netflix And we learn about the latest training regimen for the two athletes chestnut is still doing most of the same stuff

We learned about already but Kobayashi. It's a couple new ones first the latest training regimen for the two athletes. Chestnut is still doing most of the same stuff we learned about already, but Kobayashi has a couple new ones. First, we see his tongue stretching routine. He does long tongue stretches and also- Like a gecko? Yeah, yeah. Like, what?

He goes out with it, I would imagine, he stretches it, but he also does speed yoga with a series of quick flicking motions with his tongue. You guys do it. His other new technique to strengthen his inhalation power. He sucks on empty plastic bottles until they crumple to get extra power. Really seems like Kobayashi is planning a second career behind a different kind of paywall after this contest.

Yeah, his competitive dessert eating is on only flans. So from there, we get the official rules of the Netflix contest. They use the same basic format as the 10 minute Nathan's contest, but with one notable variation, the Solomon technique and clearing were banned. No separating the hot dogs from the buns and no dunking allowed. Despite being the innovator of those moves, Kobayashi actually does prefer the new rules now. Oh, he doesn't.

He doesn't actually prefer to eat fucking hot dog buns dipped in warm water. Yeah, I think he likes that. He likes that he doesn't have to do that to be doing the best strategy. Yeah. I love that someone at Netflix was like, hey, do you guys want to do it not gross? And they were like, yes. We do. We've been waiting for somebody to ask that.

Oh my God. Right. So they finished the montage of the training regimens and then we get a fun fact from the play-by-play announcer for Netflix. That would be Tim Janis, a retired pro in the eating community. He explains that chestnut has the advantage in terms of total stomach capacity. But Kobayashi has a condition called gastritis or low stomach. And that means his stomach can expand below the rib cage, which makes up for some of the size disparity.

To Kiro Kobayashi putting the pro in prolapse. He's the best. He's my favorite athlete. So the competitors take their places on stage and they get 30 seconds to check their stations. Water cup placement is key because they want to be able to grab it just you know efficiently and once they're all set eating begins. During the first minute they both set a personal record for the fastest start 14 for chestnut and 12 for Kobayashi and surprisingly they're both ahead of their standard pace from other contests where dunking is allowed

Running tally it stays neck and neck for a while, but in the end Joey chestnut appears to pull ahead, but Scores are not official yet after the clock runs out The judges have to sweep up all the crumbs on the floor of each station into a dustpan And am it way them on now potential did. I thought they were going to have to eat her. The judges also squeegee the bottom of the competitors shoes in case they were hiding any scraps and according to Tim Janis, there have been scandals about the bottom of the shoes in the past.

Sandals scandals. Yeah. When Bubba Dupree showed up in the past. Sandals scandals. When Bubba Dupree showed up in his so-called Nike Dyson. Yeah. He said they were limited edition, but. But after the contest, they change into their Reebok Pump My Stuff. So the judges figure it all out. And in the end, Kobayashi's final score is 66 HDB in 10 minutes.

But it's not enough. Joey Chestnut wins with a new world record of 83 HDB in 10 minutes. No dunking, no separating. And the special ends with WWE legend Rey Ray Mysterio, presenting the hot dog eating championship belt, beef squashed. And if you had to summarize what you've learned in one sentence Heath, what would it be?

So the presenter of a hot dog belt has approximately the same resume as our next secretary of education. God damn it. Are you ready for the quiz? Yeah, right. Yeah, I guess. I love the idea of Rey Mysterio presenting like a WWE style belt covered in vomit to these guys. So Keith, what would be like a better WWE names for the competitors? Which one would you choose actually? Let's go with that.

What one would you choose, Heath? A, Disgorgeous George. B, CM Chunks. C, Chunder Taker. Or D, Stone Cold Heave Often. Oh! Okay. I was gonna go with Puke Skywalker from the Yoda

Mendo I think really, but Stone Cold Heave Often is way too good. It's gotta be deep. Yeah it's definitely nice. Oh my god. Alright Heath, I spent a lot of my time and energy thinking about and working on ways to help save America. A as a fucking waste of my time. Hey, it's a Tom. Yeah, it is. Sure was funny. Yeah. All right.

He I have one for you. Before Joey Chestnut, Kobayashi had one other memorable loss to a bear on a Fox program called Man vs. Beast, which was not even in your essay when I first got to that is a fact that you would have otherwise left out of your essay altogether. Why would you do that? A, you are somehow unaware of this amazing moment in pop culture. B, you didn't think the audience deserved that knowledge.

C, you didn't want to mar the otherwise very serious subject that you are dealing with with such frivolities or D, you remember that that show also ended with 50 little people trying to pull an airplane faster than an elephant could and you realize that that was the nadir of American culture and a harbinger of Trump's America coming, thus robbing it of any humor potential. Yeah, it's a combination of C and D. Like in terms of narrative structure, I want it to focus on the rivalry of Koba and Chestnut.

But yeah, the bear thing was pretty great. But I think it's, yeah, it's combo C and D. That is correct. Nice. All right, Heath, I quit the show. Why? Hey, the sentence, but he ate his own vomit so it didn't count will ring in my ears for the next 10,000 years Yeah, okay, yeah, you don't need more it's a it's a yeah, I'm too buddy

Yeah, so I think Eli wins for expressing how we all feel Listeners include our special episode 400. Sometimes it still tastes good if it's like right after. No, Jesus. Fuck. Hey, do that line again. Yep. All right. It actually does taste bad because. No, no, no, no, not you.

Not you. Another person. It's good with cheese. Definitely a different person should say a line. Cheese or ice cream. Dairy is usually the best. If you're going to do that. I'm legit going to throw up before this is over. I want a Noah Essay. We've got a very special episode for 100 coming up. I want a Noah Essay. Alright, well for Heath, Cecil, Tom and Eli, I'm Noah. Thanking you for hanging out with us today. We're gonna be back next week. By then, Eli will be an expert on something else, assuming nobody's too grossed out by this week's episode to ever come back. And if you'd like to help keep this show going, you can make a per episode donation at patreon.com slash citation pod or leave us a five star review everywhere you can. And if you'd like to get in touch with us, check out past episodes,

connect with us on social media or check the show notes. Be sure to check out citation pod dot com. Okay, please just give me one more spin. Fine, fine. A lot of more. Why are so many H words bad things? What is happening? I think it might just be words.

Yeah, yeah, probably just words. In the dry states of the Southwest, there's a group that's been denied a basic human right. In the Navajo Nation today, a third of our households don't have running water. But that's not something they chose for themselves. Can the Navajo people reclaim their right to water and contend with the government's legacy of control and neglect? Our water, our beauty! Our water, our beauty! That's in the next season of Reclaimed,

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