Citation Needed - Mass Hysteria

Episode Date: March 8, 2023

Mass psychogenic illness (MPI), also called mass sociogenic illness, mass psychogenic disorder, epidemic hysteria, or mass hysteria, involves the spread of illness symptoms through a population where there is no infectious agent responsible for contagion.[1] It is the rapid spread of illness signs and symptoms affecting members of a cohesive group, originating from a nervous system disturbance involving excitation, loss, or alteration of function, whereby physical complaints that are exhibited unconsciously have no corresponding organic causes.[2]

Like beads of sweat. I was pouring sweat so much. Just to say stop when you have enough pepper, man. What the... Okay, but what if I want more pepper? A little higher? Little higher? Like this? Exactly.

Yeah, that's amazing. Hey guys, who's this? Who's this? Like you don't know what? No, no, I actually don't know either. Who is this? Uh, this is Oro. He's our $100 patron. Oh, oh, nice to meet you, man. Yeah, nice to meet you. Um, why is, why is he dressed like a tree though? Yeah, he's just like a heath. Check the page. Orro here didn't just give us a hundred bucks one time. He earned himself a full and permanent position on our podcast. Like, like as a cast member. Yeah, that's right. Orro here is the citation needed tree. Tree. Exactly. And though trees don't talk,

our audience will presume from now on whenever they hear our podcast that Oro is here, keeping us shady and cool. And Oro, you're okay with that? Yeah, you only told me there's no small part. Just small actors, exactly buddy, exactly. And it's not just that. We're also gonna dedicate the biggest groner of the episode to you.

Yeah. When, when we remember. When we remember, yeah. All right, well, Loro, welcome to the show, I guess. Okay, does it need like food or water or anything? Peep, peep, peep, peep, peep, peep. We dine the intro all the time. Hello and welcome to Cytaceia Needed the podcast where we choose to subject Rita single article about it on Wikipedia and pretend we're experts because this is the internet.

That's how it works now. I'm Eli Bosnick and I'll be hyping up this ventilation, but I'll need some bags of hot air. First up, two men who knew mass was hysteria before it was school, Cecil and Ola. I've been trying for years to offset my Mass with hot air and hasn't worked yet, so it's not working yet. Cecil and I headbanded our way through the Satanic Panic.

You know, that is like if somebody tried to sell out humanity during the war of the world's broadcast like three body problem style. So yeah, we're all good at this shit. And also joining us tonight, a fan of moral panic and a man of panicked morals, Tom and he, I'm gonna be right one of these days, Eli, and the I told you so's will write themselves. Okay, I don't, I don't know what you like. He was doing like the speech writer thing where he like flipped moral and panic and switch,

but it didn't mean anything. I'm here too. Cool. I know what that meant. I love the pre-show animosity that we've developed on this program. Yeah, it's new intro is just good. Yeah. Before we begin tonight, I'd like to take a moment to thank our patrons, patrons, without you, my rush to sell Tesla stock by Bitcoin and quote, buy rubles on the bounce would have

had consequences for people that matter. So if you'd like to learn how to join their ranks, be sure to stick around till the end of the show. And that was good. Probably. Yeah. And not when I sold it. Anyway, we don't need to reflect on that. Tell us know what person place thing concept phenomenon or event. Well, we'll be talking about today. Today we're going to talk about mass hysteria. And Tom, if anyone is immune to mass hysteria, you're ready to tell us why you locked your cell phone in a led line safe in 1999. All right. All right. Look, I don't know about you. I don't want to compete with anything that vibrates Eli because I can't. So I went away right away.

That is fair. All right. So tell us Tom, what is mass hysteria? All right. So I have to start by acknowledging the fact that the term hysteria is actually a pretty gross word. And I chose it to create a more click baity title for the episode on purpose. hysteria is it just blatantly misogynist word and originates from the Greek word

history, which translates into uterus and is generally understood to mean some kind of ungovernable emotional access. It is actually one of those words whose origins, use and definition is like a microcosm of near perfect institutional and cultural patriarchy, but I'm using it anyway for the clicks. Hmm, fucking based. I clicked before chicks as they say, yeah, no, I get it. The earliest known diagnoses in treatment for hysteria was actually as far back as 1900 BCE in Egypt. Clearly insanely ignorant of how female anatomy worked.

Ancient Egyptian doctors, if you can call them that, believe that hysteria was caused by a woman's uterus just sort of wandering about, like taken their 15, I guess. And the cure for the wandering uterus was to rub a stinky lotion on a woman's vulva, like I guess like vaginal smelling salts to shock the uterus back into place. Okay. Yeah, but that lotion thing only works if she moves her legs in and out like she's operating a vaginal bellows. I'm pretty sure Gwyneth Paltrow sells that on goop.com.

Like for sure, they have that. I'm saying the lotion and the bellows, those are the lotion. I almost guaranteed. At laser guided, no less, yeah. And the ancient Greeks were absolutely down with the wandering uterus theory of women. Am I right? But they added their own twist. In addition to the clear mental illness exhibited when women had emotions, the Greeks tacked

on to their diagnostic criteria, women who didn't want to get married or have children. Plato and Aristotle believe that women who didn't fuck enough became hysterical and described these wandering uterus is therefore as melancholic. I'm telling you guys women get mad at us because their badges are lonely. Right. Right. Yes. So far, the treatments are let me rub your badge and you need more hard, throbbing cock. I feel like I'm seeing a pattern already here. I'm like, the foundation of Western philosophy to. By the time of St. Augustine, the idea of hysteria became bound up in Christianity. And so of course, everything revolved around sin. hysteria then wasn't a problem of a disembodied internal organ, just like hitchhiking its way

about and feeling sad. It didn't get enough dick. No, no, no, the Christians had a tighter explanation for why their women weren't happy, which of course was the devil. It was demonic uterine possession. Satan is like all up in a woman's uterus, and that's just bound to make her cranky. And the treatment, of course, was thoughts, prayers, and exorcisms. Well, and let's take a second to appreciate the fact that that is still the cure, according to Christians, where they have not advanced. Yeah. True.

Very, very true. But it should also be noted that these Christians, they were into hysterical women. Like they were so into these devil possessed women that constantly in the African actually coined the term. And I may mispronounce this and by, I mean, certainly a more heroic kiss, heroic, which is a kind of sexual desire caused by women with hysteria that was so strong that it literally caused madness. Okay, well, I'm a white guy from now. So I think it's important to mention that, uh, no comment. I have podcast listener, you can't see it, but Cecil has a gun. He has a gun.

Oh, we get to the time of St Thomas Aquinas, it was well established doctrine. Not only that women were overly emotional, but that women were naturally inferior to men. This is built into the doctrine. In his summa theological Aquinas wrote quote, some old women are evil minded. They gaze on children in a poisonous and evil way and demons with whom the witches enter into agreements interact through their eyes. So now history was being thought of as a disease afflicting women caused by, of course, evil women. Crossed by women.

What? Evil women with demonic laser vision, no less. So yeah. Say Thomas Aquinas feels like an abstinence only education on final boss. Oh, yeah, any he shoots magical changing fish out of its cheeks. I think we got a whole bunch of moves for him. You got to take him out with your demonic laser vision. Yeah. That was not just that Aquinas nonsense held on until the 16th and 17th century when minor details like the discovery of, I don't know, the goddamn nervous system made scholars sit up and take some notice. Okay, but still won't find the crest of that labia for centuries, though. Yeah.

Now, they discarded the idea that hysteria was a disease caused by witches or they discarded the idea that hysteria was a disease caused by witches cursing, ambling, wombs and instead decided that hysteria was a melody of the mind. And while this may seem like some progress, and I guess it is, it should also be noted that in 1748, some famous physician, no one here knows, suggested that hysteria might be caused by bad city air and that it could affect now both men and women. But when women got the hysteria, it was due to their laziness. Laziness, right?

Obviously, but when men got it, it's because our lung penis was too big. It was a terrible mess. And then we got it. And by 1859, Paul Brickett was making waves theorizing that hysteria was a chronic condition that affected multiple systems in the body. And his work influenced that of Sharko. Sharko flipped the script on causation, deciding that hysteria wasn't the fault of, you know, laziness or witches or demons or bad air or strolling uterus is, but instead place the blame on patriarchy.

Since the idea here is that women are being deemed by a male medical establishment as being overly emotional, this seems both at once astute and also stunningly self-referential. Yeah, sure. Just a female patient trying to talk to the doctor and he's just like, well, actually, it is our fault, the patriarchy. Please don't interrupt, though. Please don't interrupt. That's, I guess, progress is something. Well, I feel like the fact that it took us thousands of years to keep, to like even come up with the idea that like, you know, maybe my wife's mad at me because I'm an asshole. I feel like that tells you everything you need to know about men in general,

right? Look, maybe we'd be a little closer to being free of this stupid fucking notion. If that old Huxter and co-cat Freud hadn't entered the picture, he was influenced by both Brickat and Charco, but Freud decided that hysteria was the result of childhood sexual abuse or repression, which is rather a lot more words to describe patriarchy than likely were necessary. And he also noted that while both men and women could have hysteria, of course women had it way more often, and they were also really good at manipulating their therapists, particularly

if that therapist was off his ass all day smashing lines between patients. Sure. I wonder if the therapy session with Freud would be like getting questioned by a guy like James Lipton on a Chris Farley like Coke Bender. I mean, seeing as he thought a key to psychiatric practice was being so boring, your patients fell asleep. I'm guessing no, but I like the dog. Well, because when they were asleep, you could do a bump, right? Like it was a lot easier.

By the middle 1900s, hysteria as an idea began to fall from favor and hysteria was rebranded, sorry, diagnosed as depression and anxiety. Admissions for patients, intermental health facilities for hysteria dropped by two thirds, but the overall number of patients didn't decline at all. hysteria was simply being understood differently now, categorized as anxiety depression and not labeled as hysteria. And yet not a single doctor has offered me a huge medical bias. I have for all of that. But what's interesting to me here is that part of why hysteria became less and less of

a thing isn't because there was some great medical breakthrough. Instead, as a result of two world wars and the attention being paid to the mental and emotional trauma that resulted, western societies began to expect more cases of depression and anxiety, rather than hysteria. And as a result, that's what we began to find. Soldiers returning from the battlefield were being diagnosed with hysterical symptoms, but the hystericity of hysteria was just incompatible with the narrative of a soldier. The result was at the same symptoms that for centuries were associated with hysteria now had to be remodeled into something less emasculating.

Okay, it's brain muscle, awi from now on and you rub some dirt in it. That's what it's called. Fine. Walking off by 1980, hysteria was removed from the diagnostics statistical man. 1980. People were sending emails through the internet and the DSM was like, yes, sometimes your pus gives you the yips, right? That down down. Right that down on our big book of things. And again, when it took was men getting it, right? The second a large group of men started having the same problem. We actually started solving the problem after 6,000 years of digging around with, well, maybe her lady Oregon's got lost levels of shit.

And because psychiatry isn't real real and it's all made up and subject to political decision-making as much if not more than scientific facts. And because we live in a more enlightened age where we hide our institutional patriarchy behind a thin veil of carefully crafted buzzwords, hysteria has officially fallen by the wayside, replaced with the panoply of other diagnostic options, such as conversion disorders, histrionic personality disorder, disassociative disorder, and whatever else strikes the fancy of the TikTok algorithm. All of which means that I have also now written my longest essay yet, where I don't actually dive into the topic at hand until now more than halfway through the episode.

All right. The country not real. If you like to see how long we remind us of, we remind us Tom and Keith that we have a company policy about coming out of Scientologists on the show. Especially on Auro's first day, we're going to take a break. Get him some water and some apropos of nothing. Like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, see, doctor, I was married to a man three times my age at 11 and I had my first child at 13. And I can't vote.

I can't own property. If my husband dies, his family will literally take back my home and throw me into the street where if his inheritance doesn't sustain me, I'll be forced to prostitute myself for spend the rest of my life caring for the children of others. Y'all. Um, so yeah, I've just been thinking that like maybe that's lame. I see, I see. Well, you have, you need to be held against your will, but everyone else who is mentally ill, regardless of severity or diagnosis until that settles down. I see. Is that all?

still that settles down. I see. Is that all? Oh, also no more horses. Yeah, got it. Key bump? Okay, I'm good. It's, it's, it's 9.30 in the morning. Actually, okay, Judgy. And we're back.

When we left off, the history of medicine was the thinly veiled slavery of women. It's still that, but the veil is like thicker now or something. I don't know, I'm not really paying attention. Talk more, Tom. Talk more now. Well, this finally brings us to the topic at hand kind of. I promise at the outset, we talk about mass hysteria, but that's not really the right term anymore for reasons that I've spent half the episode making. I hope abundantly clear.

This was once branded as mass hysteria, but the more current term is mass psychogenic illness. And this really is a better term than mass hysteria, unless the more current term is mass psychogenic illness. And this really is a better term than mass hysteria, unless one is expecting to see a parade of confused, disembodied uteruses on walk about mass psychogenic illness. Not expecting that, but like I like the right edge. I feel like you should always be expecting that just so it won't surprise you when it happens. Exactly. Like the Spanish and Christian Christian. Oh, you guys are That's a god damn it.

Mass psychogenic illness is the spread of illness symptoms when no known physical cause or infectious agent can be identified. Mass psychogenic illness or MPI effects and afflicts a defined cohesive social group and appears to be a real nervous system disturbance that lacks any underlying pathology. Sure. I like to call it crypto thinky. That's right. I'm not going to talk about that. And while clauses and symptoms vary, there are some features which are unique to MPI

incidences. The symptoms that appear are transient, they're sudden, they're benign, they generally resolve as suddenly as they appear. They occur during a period of extraordinary stress among afflicted members of a specific and particular community. Symptoms are spread by seeing, hearing, or communicating with other people afflicted, merely seeing the symptoms of one person afflicted with MPI can cause a chain reaction, often moving from higher status individuals in a group down the social ladder to lower status parties in that group.

And these illnesses are exacerbated by intense media coverage. So Trump rally, you just described it to Trump rally. Yeah, it's a lot of words again, a lot of words for Trump. It's too long a sidebar to go down, but if you get a chance, check out the DSM entry for this. It's so funny how many exceptions they have to put in for religion. It's like they're trying to play a board game with me. They're like, no, I know. It does go from high to low. And then everyone does. But you can't. We're not saving. Yeah. It's not. It's not the same. It's not the same. It's not the same.

I know it looks and sounds exactly the same. Now, we'll talk about some examples of these events in history, but I also want to point out that there is a preponderance of females afflicted by these mass psychogenic illnesses, which is likely why they were initially branded as mass hysteria events. While several thousand years of history would lay blame at the feet of the lazy women breathing bad air with sad uteruses, there is likely a more scientific and interesting explanation. Some theories suggest that mirror neurons may actually be the culprit. Mirror neurons are neurons that fire both when you see someone do a thing and when you

do that same thing yourself. And these neurons let us imagine exactly what would feel like to do or feel something that someone we are observing is doing or feeling. People with autism seem to have diminished activity in these neurons. And autism is more prevalent among men than women. And because young women have higher than average mirror neuronal activity, this may actually explain the sex difference in the prevalence of MPI, which is why you need to vaccinate your daughters, people. Let's get those numbers up. Come on. Well, and because I've never encountered a theory that invoked mirror neurons that didn't later turn out to be pseudoscience, I also want to point out that we already learned that these

things tend to filter down the social ladder. And through most of human history, women weren't even allowed near that ladder unless somebody needed to clean the bottom of the run. So it could be that too. The first known instances of MPI took place in the middle ages. And these were known as the Dancing Manias. These dance parties were fucking intense. First, they took place many, many times over the course of hundreds of years, spanning

from the 14th through the 17th centuries. These were known as St. John's Dance. These weren't like white dad at a barbecue dances. These were wild, crazy, erratic dances that would go on until people collapse from exhaustion, injuries, and even sometimes died. And nobody knew what the fuck to do because it was the middle ages and just nobody knew anything. Okay. It's like when you look in the mirror while you're crying and it makes you cry even worse because you like point at yourself and you see yourself pulling back and cry even more.

I am begging you to go to therapy. He's heading right. I'm begging you. No. Tom said it's fake. Like high-atreus, not psychotherapy. Sometimes, they're different. Sometimes, musicians would show up and play music for the dancers. And that didn't help at all. It only drew up more onlookers who would then succumb to the MP9 until the ranks of the erratic, shi-irating thongs swelled to the thousands. Okay, I feel like Tom's attacking podcasting a lot in this episode.

And he's like, yeah And it's bad for business. I do love the idea of a band showing up and going like, I mean, at the very least we can make it look normal or I guess. Nunds in the 15th through 19th century were sometimes afflicted in their Nunneries with MPI. Nunneries were not always the voluntary life paths for many women, and the combination of stress, discipline, and enforced poverty and chastity, as well as close living quarters, created ideal conditions for MPI events to take hold. In many instances, nuns during these MPI events would use crude and obscene gestures and

language. Though one notable event had many of the nuns in one particular convent meowing like cats medieval Joe Rogan has an emergency podcast about litter boxes and nunneries. We have to stop. So Tom, are there like pictures of the nunnery filicate girls? It's I want't know for science. It's for science. Yeah, there's, there's a lot of photos from the 15th century to dig up mass psychogenic

illness outbreaks are not a thing of the past during the industrial revolution and after across Asia, Europe and the United States. MPI events have been reported in factories in Singapore in the 1970s. MPI events took place where hysterical seizures, screaming and even violence erupted. And these events were so powerful that even administering tranquilizers to the afflicted, were not effective at putting an end to them. Okay, wait, so the factory's having like an orgy of violence, but then a bunch of people sat still to get a shot of the trunk and and they were like, okay, let's

see if that tranquilizer is still murder. No, it didn't. It didn't work, but we're going to keep building the orgy. I like to think they shot him like a tiger at the zoo that they wanted to get to the vet. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's that's what I like to picture. Now, sometimes they would bring in a medicine man to cast out the spirits that were thought to be causing these events. And that typically they made things worse rather than better. I get it. Yeah. Yeah. Right. No, if I'm having a psychotic break and there's a guy like dressed up like an Indian shaman, I feel like I'm going to freak out harder. Yeah. In 1962, at a dress making factory in the US, 62 workers suddenly came down with bug bites. The workers, 59 of the 62 being women, complained of severe nausea and had skin rashes.

And they claimed a fabric shipment had carried with it some kind of bug that was causing them to fall ill. And entomologists were called in to find the offending critters, but nothing whatsoever was found. And all those afflicted got well and ceased to be harassed by bugs just as quickly as they had fallen ill. And also in 1962, this time in Tanzania, over 1,000 students across 14 schools just started laughing. Just laughing out of nowhere and

it nothing. That's awesome. I assume though that it stopped and someone explained the joke to them. Okay, Tom, you're throwing so much shade at podcasting like all over the place. That's funny because it's like what we sometimes I do that. I like the explanation after right now, it's good. So in fact, these MPI events, these are super duper common. We did go on a fucking mass hysteria go well.

So in fact, these MPI events, they're super common. There was an instance in 2011 in New York of Tourette's like symptoms running through a high school. There was another in 2019 in a secondary school in Malaysia where students all claim to have seen a face of pure evil or a Ted Cruz, as we call it in the States. There are in fact hundreds of very recent examples of these mass psychogenic illness events

all over the world, and they actually appear to be happening more frequently rather than less frequently. Yeah, like when I was a kid, sometimes students would all drop a pencil whenever there was a substitute teacher, it was very medical and very serious. I'm dying. And what I found particularly fascinating about this as well is that there is evidence that these MPI events also spread among cohorts within online spaces. After a popular YouTube channel showed someone with a sudden onset of Tourette's-like ticks,

hospitalizations across the country and even internationally for similar sudden onset ticks began to proliferate. There was even an article last week in the New York Times about this phenomenon. It was called the TikTok ticks. This time referring to the spread of symptoms through communities joined by TikTok, which led to the coining of a new term, mass social media induced illness. And for the first time in history, mass psychogenic illness was no longer limited by geography and proximity, though it's still primarily effects young women. Okay, Tom, I know you're trying to end the internet entirely

because get off your lawn. Yes. I did not anticipate the TikTok zombie hoard argument in phasing. That's solid. You can't prepare for that. Can't not prepare for it. Yeah. And honestly, given the proliferation of anti-vax shit and COVID conspiracy, I feel like pretty soon, all illnesses will be mass social media induced to some degree.

So you have to like, middle that drum down. It's not difficult to see the parallels then between these medicalized symptoms and other spreadable delusions. If Tourette's like ticks can spread from tick tock viewer to tick tock viewer, or if a convent full of nuns can start suddenly meowing like cats, it doesn't seem at all far fetched to imagine there's some connection to other widespread mass delusions. From QAnon to Pizegate to January

6th from anti mask and anti-vax to 5G tower conspiracies. These same ideas seem to be at least somewhat in play as we increasingly have to contend with a world shape, not just by viruses, but by the meaning of virality itself. And I for one just want to dance. And if you had to summarize what you've learned in one sentence, what would it be? So we should really have kept better track of all those uterus. Agreed. Uh, agreed. And are you ready for the quiz, Tom?

Absolutely. All right, Tom. I hope your jokes are hysterical, by the way. Tom, we learned earlier about Constantine, the African coining of phrase, which is a kind of sexual desire caused by women with hysteria that was so strong that it literally caused insanity. What was the first draft of that term? Hey, puna tick. Be literally the best joke I'll ever see. Let alone right. Be a crazy old cooter. See nuts about nuts or D. Quefer madness.

Quefer madness. Uh, put a tick and quefer madness. That's not fair for you to put both of those in the same answer. I mean, question after this motherfucker. put a ticket, que for madness, that's not fair for you to put both of those in the same answer. I'm not that question after this motherfucker. Yeah, me choose. I've got to go, que for madness, que for madness. You are correct. I think I know I would be because I'm supposed to be by the structure of the game. All right. So I have a question for you, Tom. It would be ashamed to throw away a term like massiveia altogether. So now that the DSM isn't using it, what should

we reappropriate it as? Hey, mass hysteria across between a mastiff and a Swiss terrier. I don't think a Swiss terrier is even a thing. I just made that shut up. Um, B, math hysteria, that would be a term for losing one's shit because nowadays kids are taught to multiply 97 and three by tripling 100 and subtracting nine instead of carrying a fucking two. That's what they're pissed about. See, math's hysteria. That's the British version of that. Or the mass hysteria. A term for mediocre white guys freaking out whenever we try to correct a long standing vestige of linguistic misogyny. Well, those are all excellent. The dog lover of me wants to say a, but I think the answer is in

fact, D. No, I thought I'd get you with a, but you're correct. It is D nailed it. All right, Tom, one more for you, which of the following is another example of mass hysteria that we haven't talked about. Hey, in 1944, a town in Illinois became convinced that a rogue, gas or man was going around town spraying gas on people for some reason. After one person made a ridiculous claim about it, a local headline said, anesthetic prowler on loose. And then the whole town started reporting the exact same thing all over the place. The mad gaster was never found. And also just keep in mind drug dealers don't give away drugs. Or was it be in 2001, a power outage in Delhi, India led to lots of people

sleeping on the roof to stay cooler? Then a bunch of people reported being attacked by a monkey man hybrid and showed up their doctors with bite marks from that monkey man hybrid thing. The doctors all said, okay, those are clearly your teeth marks. You bit yourself. That's what happened. I can tell that you bit yourself. No monkey man, chimeras were found. Or was it C for about 2000 years Christianity? Chris G. Anity. Having mass and doing like shumma, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no,

no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, would be all the above, but it was actually, I don't know, it was one of the other ones, cause I'm supposed to stump you here. Okay. The other one. Good.

Keith wins, cause he made fun of Chrissy Annie. It was all above though. It really was, but thank you Eli for letting me win. How about, no, it was secret answer E, all of the above and secret answer D. Oh, that's nice. That's the trick.

There we have it. It's a tricky one. I do really actually win. Oh, that's nice. That's the trick. That's the trick. There we have it. That's the trick you want to know. I do really actually win. Eli, you're next. Nice. All right, well, for Tom, Noah, Cecil, and Heath, I'm Eli Bosnik.

Thank you for hanging out with us today. We'll be back next week and by then, I will be an expert on something else. Which we now and then, you could listen to our podcast, wherever you have your ear holes. And if you'd like to help keep this show going, you can make a per episode donation at patreon.com slash citation pod just like Oro does. Or leave us a five star review everywhere you can.

And if you'd like to get in touch with us, check out past episodes, connect with us on social media, or check the show notes. Be sure to check out citation pod dot com. to check out citationpod.ca And Satsun I realized everyone wants to fuck their mother and kill their father! Brilliant! The founder of the human mind! How would we feel about letting me vote? Okay, that lady's vagina is out of control! Out of control, totally.

Completely. Sorry, guys, my arms just feel like getting tired. Or you have to shut the fuck up. Seriously, man, you're taking advantage. No. Sorry.