Citation Needed - The Great Imposter

Episode Date: April 26, 2023

Ferdinand Waldo Demara Jr. (1921[1] – June 7, 1982) was an American impostor. He was the subject of a movie: The Great Impostor, in which he was played by Tony Curtis. Demara's impersonations included a naval surgeon,[2] a civil engineer, a sheriff's deputy, an assistant prison warden, a doctor of applied psychology, a hospital orderly, a lawyer, a child-care expert, a Benedictine monk, a Trappist monk, an editor, a cancer researcher, and a teacher. One teaching job led to six months in prison. Our theme song was written and performed by Anna Bosnick. If you’d like to support the show on a per episode basis, you can find our Patreon page here.  Be sure to check our website for more details.

Hey, it's it's hard to say I'm a cat guy right, but if you had to choose a breed I don't I don't know what a lab is a lab a breed beats me. I'm also a cat guy. I have no idea Oh my gosh look what he said can't wait for them to love you as much as I do this is gonna be so good So good. Hey, guys. So good. What are you giggling about? So we played a prank on Heath.

A good one. A real. I know I'm gonna regret asking this, guys, but what prank? Okay, so you know how this week's episode is about the great imposter. Uh huh, yeah. Okay, so what better way to celebrate that

than a little impostering ourselves? So, yeah. Okay, so what better way to celebrate that than a little impostering ourselves? So I looked ahead in the schedule and for the last six months, we have been catfishing heat. Catfishing? No, you know, it's a thing where you pretend to be a pretty lady and then you make someone fall in love with you. Not cool. Oh come on. I'm sure he's gonna think it's funny when he you know actually finds out the truth on the street where you live. Hey boys. What's shaking? Not much. How are you? I'm amazing Tom. I'm amazing. Oh yeah? Why is that? That's because I met the girl that I'm gonna marry. Sorry, Mary?

Yup, I know, I know, he's gonna get married. What? No, I really am. The right person has come into my life. And tonight, I'm gonna meet her and you meet, like maybe you shouldn't just do any of that at all That's probably not a good idea. What? Why why not? Because um, you know, we got to record the show You know podcast. Yeah. Yeah, ah, it's a show. Get away. Seriously. It's like 10 minutes to her house

544 maple lane. I'm gonna run over going to propose and then be back here, an engaged man. Uh, so Heath, I think you should know disagreements. I'll see you boys in a few. Tom, you should, uh, get there first and burn down that house. Get there first and burn down the house. Yes, I'm already on it. You think you'll go to hell when you die? I don't think they'd let me in, Cecil. Probably, probably, right. Hello and welcome to Sitation Needed! The podcast where we choose a subject, read a single article about it on Wikipedia and pretend we're experts because this is the internet and that's how it works now

I'm Eli Bosnick and I'll be the foremost faker tonight, but I'll need some fellow frogs first up Three married men who don't even notice if other women are hot Tom Cecil and Noah Yeah, Eli my wife and I have an agreement on those things. We call it our marriage Yeah, I've been doing the monogamy appreciation dance since 1997 Eli. Thank you very much. Yeah. But my ability to notice when women are hot is why I'm no longer welcome as a volunteer firefighter unfortunately.

And also joining us tonight, a guy whose real name is he done right. What the fuck is happening with these intros? It's not an insane. It's gotten worse, hasn't it? It has. Shouldn't have written a format. Before we begin, just start a moment, so.

I'd like to take a moment to thank our patrons. Patrons, without you, nobody on this show would be able to say podcaster with a straight face when someone asks our profession. I'm not sure if that's a good thing, but we needed to live. So thank you. And if you'd like to learn how to join their ranks, be sure to stick around till the end of the show.

And with that out of the way, tell us, Tom, what person, place, thing, concept, phenomenon, or event. We'll be talking about today. Today we will be talking about the great imposter. All right, Tom, and you followed up my having chat GPP right, my essay with a story about fraud. Did I be offended? Yes, always. All right.

So, who was the great imposter? All right, so many times in my own life as an adult, I've looked around in awe and noticed that the adult in the room was in fact me and you know sometimes when I'm surrounded by smart Talented funny people. I feel like at any moment. I will be asked to leave that room Not this room obviously with you guys, but you know you get the drift So that is imposter syndrome. The feeling that despite your successes,

you feel a sense of persistent anxiety that any moment you are going to be found out. It is a common enough feeling, afflicting about 70% of people at some point. But do you know what most certainly did not affect at all? Ever? Ferdinand Fred Demara. That's because the entire life of Fred Demara

was a great big stinking fraud, a lie of farce, and that was exactly how he liked it. Fred was at times in his life a naval surgeon, except, no, he wasn't. A doctor of applied psychology, except also, no. Child care expert, nope. A monk, both Benedictine and Trappist, both flavors, no. A childcare expert, nope. A monk, both Benedictine and Trappist, both flavors, no. A cancer researcher, teacher,

share of Stepudine, assistant prison warden, and a civil engineer, and also, no, no, nope, absolutely not in no. Okay, so like if Eli's essays were a person. Hey, nice summation, nice summation. Civil engineer, I want to be an uncivil engineer, just knock mechanical drawings out of people's hands and break slide rules and come off the top rope. You're the best. I like that he made a assistant prison ward to like what a weird

lie. You can like a full shirt to moon on that one to the regional warden. To understand this story though, we have to try to understand Fred. Fred told biographers, he sold his story to Life magazine that he was able to take on so many roles and positions because he sought out those positions specifically in circumstances where there was a gap and a need. Calian quote. D'Amara had come to two beliefs. One was that in any organization there is always a lot of loose, unused power lying about which can be picked up without alienating anyone. The second rule is if you want power and want to expand, never encroach on anyone else's domain.

Open up new ones. Got it. Quote. He called this expanding into the power vacuum. And while there's a lot to pick apart here, it's her, oh, missing it. You keep saying sex things without realizing it. And while there's a lot to pick apart here

in terms of a life philosophy, no major periodical is offering me any royalties for my life story. Yeah. These days, this guy would have a TikTok called hustle culture for real and only go viral when people made fun of them. What I'm saying is it's a better world right now. Yeah. Honestly, if it turns out he was just lying about being a liar to scam some money

out of life, this is my favorite person ever. Oh, that kind of would have been great. A friend continued to explain saying, quote, if you come into a new situation, don't join some other professors committee and try to make your mark by moving up in that committee. You one, have a long haul and two make an enemy. Instead, Demar suggested creating your own committee quote, that way there's no competition, no past standards to measure you by.

How can anyone tell you aren't running a top outfit? And then there's no past laws or rules or precedents to hold you down or limit you. Make your own rules and interpretations. Nothing like it. Remember it. Expand into the power of acu. Okay.

It feels like a Facebook ad that I don't want to watch. Yeah. I feel like he's about to tell me that doughnuts are the key to washboard abs and cardio's abs. He's got to take this body type quiz. I fucking hate that guy. But that ridiculous drivel and bland, deepety bullshit might, if you are neither careful

nor paying attention, if you squint and you've suffered a recent head trauma, sound like something. But I'm putting this at the beginning of our story for a reason. And so you can contrast this bombastic bullshit with the endless series of failures that defined his nonsensical life of lying lies from a lying liar.

I'm George Chantos and I approve this message. I just love that this dude gave a fake name at Starbucks twice and now he's like, am I a master spy? A born in 1921 in Massachusetts, Fred's father was a motion picture operator, which was I guess not only a real job, but a lucrative job in the early 1920s, because the family was financially well off enough to live in the upper class neighborhood of town until the Great Depression. When hard times around the nation,

we can even these steadfast financial bullwork of the motion picture operators. And the family was forced to leave their life of luxury and move to the poorer part of town. Where I suppose the guys who served popcorn and sodas were forced to dwell and raise their families. Right. And they played with one sad GI Joe while their town expo Okay, all right Yeah, too All their topics one He's a bad boy For Fred this adjustment in lifestyle didn't suit him so at 16 he did what all Disaffected youth did and he ran away to become a trappist monk in Rhode Island what thus fulfilling every boys childhood dream weird

Rhode Island, what? Thus fulfilling every boy's childhood dream. Weird. Except being a trappest monk means a life centered on manual labor and spiritual reflection. Right, but they make some good beer, right? Like transcend. Right. Enlightened beer. I don't know how to do it.

Yeah. It's really good. And all that manual labor wasn't really Freddie Boy's jam. So two years into being a trappest monk, the other monks asked him to leave. And he was sent to a brothers of charity home in Canada. And from there to another boy's home back in West Newberry, where he taught fourth grade, despite not having any teaching credentials at all, but it wasn't a religious school. So everything's made up and the points don't matter. Yeah, I feel like in the 1930s, the only credential required to teach elementary school

was like not actively dying of scurvy anyway, no? Probably not. All right. After an argument with his superiors at the school, however, Fred ran away from the brothers of charity. In a 1941, he enlisted in the United States Army. I feel like you don't have to run away when you're 20, right?

You just can't leave him. You just can't. All right? No, I just couldn't leave it. You just need to. All right, 1941, you might be thinking that is not actually a great year to join the army. What with the war raging in Europe. And although the US wouldn't enter World War II until December of that year, Fred must have seen the writing on the wall because it was here that he began his life of impersonations. The details in this part are pretty scarce, but Fred stole the identity of his army buddy, Anthony Ignolia, and then under that assumed name, he went a wall. What? I do not really understand how that works because he joined the army

under his own right name, and then also presumably Anthony was still waking up every morning like still very much in the army Yeah, and also Fred was waking up and not being in the army Was he like okay freaky Friday magic That work it probably I'm in a city by the way. Anthony. That's amazing. He's Fred. He has to say. Dips. Well, there you have it, or you don't. I don't know.

That part of the story doesn't make a lot of sense to it. I'm still using his buddy's name and identity. Fred returned to what he knew, being a trappist monk. This time, joining the Abbey of our Lady of Guthsamani, a monarchy of the Abbey of Guthsamani. I'm going to say, I'm going to say, I'm going using his buddy's name and identity Fred returned to what he knew being a trappist monk this time joining the Abby of our lady of Guth Samani a monastery in Kentucky Except once he got there he ran into a legit monk from the monastery he was at before

So he'd left the Abby fairly quickly thereafter and he moved to Dubuque, Iowa to join a different Abby But that wasn't a fit either. So he went back home. See, he wouldn't have kept getting away if those Abbies had had a trappist keeper. That's what they do. Trappist keeper. I got so excited about that, that I had to search the document to make sure nobody else had trappist. Bravo.

Hold on. Thank you. Nobody got home. His dad was like, well, hey, son, having seen you in a minute, aren't you supposed to be a monk now? And Fred was like, yeah, but I quit that and I joined the army and then deserted, but it's cool because now my name is Anthony. And his dad encouraged Fred to turn himself the fuck into the authorities, but Fred would be damned if he was going to go back to the army.

So we joined the Navy instead. And that worked. What is happening? We totally deserve to lose that war. Nope. Okay. Nope. No.

No. If it was any other war, I'm just saying the Army of the Navy are stupid here. We deserve to lose some other war. Interesting. He said, no, it's not. It's normal. We're moving on. You know what I meant.

Tom, please. Now, I would refer you here to Fred's philosophy of not really buying into the idea of working your way up the chain of command. But the military is really stuck on that chain of command point. So when Fred failed to reach the position he wanted in the Navy, he did the only sensible thing. Any fake does own suicide and stole the identity of Robert, Linton, French, and then deserted the Navy.

What the fuck is happening? Okay, this feels like one of those, I was just too embarrassed to ask things and it just kept going like that. You know, somebody at the Army and the Navy had to notice he was missing, right? But I guess some low level boss was like, his mirror was upside down, shut up,

it's not that bad. And nobody wanted to admit, they had no idea what was happening for so long. So just kept going. Nobody was like international date line. Yeah, no, that's it. Also, by the way, I'm sure that since it's the Navy, the fake suicide would have been like jumped ship or whatever.

But for a second, when you first said that, I imagined him making a fake dead him at a towel and laundry out of the blanket. So that's not gonna house. That was way better. Now, as Robert Linton French, Fred presented himself as a, quote, religion oriented psychologist. I don't know what that means, but I suspect Fred didn't either. So I'm not terribly worried.

It was, however, good enough to fool the trusting monks over at a Benedictine monastery in Arkansas as a Catholic convert. Those guys whose whole life is based on zero evidence were really easy to fool, huh? Crazy. Crazy. Yeah. Psychology is fucking fake, exactly. I'm really getting wrong with this.

What? He told me you can cure your depression with juice. Can you? Yeah. No. Which juice? Not man, go nectar. Now there, he only lasted a few weeks when he was called into the Abbots office, whereas

identity was challenged and he fled the Benedictine monastery and he moved to Chicago, where he joined the clerics of St. Vietaure before fling again and moving to Milwaukee to join the order of St. Kamilis. In Milwaukee, he got into a row of his superiors because he had claimed to be a cook, but he couldn't actually cook. So he got found out again and had to move to New Jersey, rejoined the Paulus novitiate in Oak Ridge. Ah, shit. Cook turned out to be way more testable than the other stuff I've been faking. Making a grilled cheese was harder than faking being a religious, silly else. Still is he then right?

A Fred was still going by the persona of Robert French this whole time, but now he decided that Robert French had a doctorate and by deciding this and applying for jobs at Catholic colleges, where you know, bouncing around from Paris to Paris was as normal as believing that just saying shit was all that was needed to make things true. He was able to land a job at Ganon University as a psychology professor, where he eventually was made the dean of the school of psychology. Huh. And at that university, he taught industrial psychology, abnormal psychology and general

psychology classes, relying presumably on his educational background of just making shit up as he went along. Just like all the other psychologists in my right time. But why not just steal a new identity that had those credentials, right? This is just a weird oversight at his part. Now, something must have happened at the college because he eventually left, though the reasons for his departure are unclear. And he next took a job as an orderly at a sanitarium for a brief stint before moving on again to become

a professor at St. Martin's University, this time in Washington. It was there that his past caught up to him in the FBI arrested him for deserting the Army, though it does appear that they were willing to forgive his fake suicide that he had used to desert the Navy. Yeah. Well, I remind Tom that the military's never cared about what they do with their semen. We'll take a quick break for some apropos. Nothing. Hi, I'm Noah Luzonz and I'm Cecil, something Italian. You know, if there's one thing we've learned here on Citation Needed, it's that lying

used to be a whole lot easier. Indeed it was, Cecil, indeed it was. Long gone are the days where you could just say you went to a college and it was suddenly true. What were they going to do? Write a letter to prove you wrong? Want to be a doctor, but didn't study medicine? No problem.

You probably knew as much as doctors did back then anyway, but nowadays, it's tougher. Google and email have made pathologically reinventing yourself downright impossible, which is why we're asking you, podcast listener, to sign our MAPHA. That's right, MAPHA. Make America fake again.

A pledge not to check other people's facts or identities. Where if it said, it goes. Guys, that sounds like a terrible idea. The world is way better now that people can't just make stuff super easy. Remind me where you got your bartender's license again, Heath? Yeah, you know what? It's fine. It's fine.

Just whatever you're doing. Make America fake again, because we're all faking it. At least a little. And we're back. When we left off, this guy was couch surfing with a bunch of monks. Not exactly. Catch me if you can, Tom. Where to next? Well, Fred was caught by the FBI and imprisoned.

And although I don't imagine that he enjoyed his 18-month stay, it likely wasn't that bad, because as soon as he was released, he used a fake identity to study law at night school at Northeastern University, where it appears that he eventually did earn a JD, although it does not appear that he used it for anything. And again, there's no evidence that he finished high school or did an undergrad anywhere.

And then he again joined a religious order. They're now I'm thinking he just likes places that offer free room and board. Yeah, and the little tasteless crackers too. Wait, let's leave Lindsey Graham out of this, okay? Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha name Joseph Seer and Joseph must have been a hell of a guy because the next iteration of Fred was as Joseph This part is totally fucking nuts. This is why I wrote this story so buckle in after taking on Joseph Seer's identity Fred got work as a god damn trauma surgeon aboard the Royal Canadian Navy destroy

What the HMCS Kayuga in the midst of the Korean War. Damn it. I lost another one. War is so cruel and full of death. Boss that guy. He just had a flu. I said, war is so cruel and full of death. Okay. Now, of course, as a trauma surgeon in wartime, you know, sometimes you have to do surgeries, which Fred did more than once while serving on the Cayuga 16 Koreans came aboard with major war injuries because, you know, war war again. And then, you know, of course, everyone on the ship was then expecting the trauma surgeon to do surgery stuff to help, except Fred was not a surgeon.

Fred, as a reminder, left home at 16 and did not finish high school. But this would not dissuade Fred. He ordered the injured soldiers to be prepped for surgery and sent to the ship's operating room. Fred then grabbed a surgery textbook and read the parts he thought would be useful given the injuries that he had seen, including a rather major chest surgery,

and then headed off to the surgical theater. Clearly just phrasing everything as a test for the nurses to try to like get answers out of them. Okay, and now I would take this sword and... This is a scalpel. It's got a scalpel, a sword pen, exactly. And then, you're frowning, I would put it back down. I'd put that back down, and then I would grab what you're handing me out.

But this sounds impressive, but keep in mind like, Ben Carson did surgery, right? Like so how hard could anything that Ben Carson did for a living really be? That's true. To give Fred credit, none, not one of the 16 gravely wounded soldiers died. They in fact so much did not die that the story of Fred acting as trauma surgeon Joseph Sear saving these kids' lives appeared in the newspaper back in Canada. Where the real Joseph Searars mom read about her son's supposed heroism except that her son was actually living and working in New Brunswick and was not at back stitched together wounded soldiers aboard a Canadian destroyer.

See a Jewish mother would have just assumed her son was moon lighting as a war hero. Sun was moonlighting as a war hero. And when the ships captain heard that Joseph Sear was not really Joseph Sear, he had first refused to believe it, but he was eventually forced to concede the point when Fred had no actual evidence that he was anyone other than Fred. The Canadian government shows not to file charges because the whole thing was just so fucking ludicrous and embarrassing. Okay. look, I think we all agree whoopsies were made on a lot of ends here. Let's just forget who did or did not wing it while sewing humans together. And who was supposed to check that?

Absolutely. He dressed like a doctor, whatever. The Supreme Court dresses like Santa. If it ain't broke, right? We just, that's fine. We're dropping it. Fred turned his attention back then to the college system. This time by founding one. What? Working in Alfred Main, Fred succeeded in creating a college and getting a charter to do so by the state.

He in fact founded Lemanai College, which still exists and is now called Walsh University. Fred ended up quitting because he was passed over for the job of Reckter or Chancellor of the College and because even though he had founded the school, he was not allowed to name it and he hated the name Limonai, which I sort of agree with. Well, the now Walsh University also agrees with you, Tom. Yes, clearly. but in what way did he found the university if somebody else got to name it and he was stuck assistant to the regional chancellor

or whatever? Right? But between this and the A-Wall thing, I'm increasingly coming to believe that we're just dealing with a really gullible life journalist. What up, Aaron? That's the right answer. Right.

I mean, counterpoint, he gave me a third of his company and now he's enemies with But that doesn't mean it's a lot. I mean, counterpoint, he's gave me a third of his company and now he's enemies with a shoe and we fuck his mom a lot. So, he's better now. No, that's fair. That's fair. Doesn't feel fair. I don't think that's fair.

I don't think that's fair. In the 1960s, Fred began working using his actual name this time as a counselor for a mission in Los Angeles. In 1960, 70 received a graduate degree from the Multnomah School of the Bible in Portland, Oregon. But by now, his exploits as a famous bullshit artist were well known likely because again, he has sold the story to Life magazine and he also appeared on television, proudly promoting that one time at Bandcamp when he opened up a soldier's

chest based on a quick scan of the spark notes of Grey's Anatomy. And that note arrived. Because of the salient details, Tom, you don't need to get personal about sparks now. Of that note, a riot, he didn't do many favors, and he was pressured to resign his position as a counselor. He went on to serve as a pastor at a church in Washington, and then he had a job as a school bus driver

in the San Juan Islands for a bit. This guy is literally world famous at this point for his dangerous overconfidence, in Washington and then he had a job as a school bus driver in the San Juan Islands for a bit. This guy is literally world famous at this point for his dangerous overconfidence and people were like, let's put him in charge of a boat full of children, huh? You want him? No, no.

Metal tube. Now by the 1970s, he found himself working as a chaplain at Good Samaritan Hospital in Anaheim. Although his bullshit artistry past continue to plague him, he was by all accounts well liked and actually pretty good at being a chaplain, but let's be real, how hard a job can that actually be?

Yeah. All his nonsense, however, never really netted him much in the way of money. And he was again put on the scholarship program and given room and board and allowed to live in the hospital where he worked until 1980. When poor health forced him to stop chaplaining, chaplaining, chaplaining,

to focus his attention on having both of his legs amputated due to diabetes. And it doesn't say it, but I do kind of hope that the surgeon was Joseph Sear. Okay. Okay. A two years later, Fred was dead. But I like to think that, well, anytime a bell rings,

somewhere Fred is stealing an angel's identity. And Tom, if you had to summarize what you've learned in one sentence, what would it be? If you're going to make a lifetime habit of lying, start a podcast, the money's better. And are you ready for the quiz? Indeed I am. All right Tom, Fred fled a lot of religious positions.

What was his nickname around the religious communities? A, greener pastors, B, brother we're out though, C, tourist trap. This D get away card no or E missing person missing Carson. Oh, oh, oh, well, although he wasn't much of a good man, I'll still pick. Oh, brother, where

aren't that? You are correct. I think top. it took the Canadian military way too long to realize he wasn't really a surgeon. What was the most egregious clue that they missed? A, the way he kept going, oh, gross, oh, gross, oh, gross, oh, gross, do every surgery. B, the fact that he kept having to sing the shin bones connected to the knee bone on respect to the distress. See, that time they told him we needed to take out an appendix and he asked if they'd also like to take out the index and the bibliography for D. The fact that he kept asking the anesthesiologist if he could get a hit.

All right, well, D is clearly if Noah was a surgeon, so I'm going to eliminate that. That's just dreaming. I don't think he was literary enough for C. So it's either the shin bone. I'm going to go with the shin bone. I'm guessing you figured it, you whittled it down and that is correct. Sust it out. Sust it out. All right, one more for you.

Which is the following. It's the best title for Freddie D's biography. Hey, prep for Purgier. Oh, that's gonna be, that's good. Doctor, nope. No, nope. Or see, the art of the heel. Oh, the art of the heel is so good.

It's see, the art of the heel all day. It was actually not, it was prep for Purgier. Oh, prep for Purgier. All right actually not, it was prep for purger. Oh! Rep for purger. All right, Heath, you stumped Tom, which means you are this week's winner! All right, no, you're up next. Okay, fine.

Well, for Tom, Noah, Cecil, and Heath, I'm Eli Bosnick, thank you for hanging out with us today. We'll be back next week, and by then, Noah will be an expert on something else. But we now, then, you can listen to our other podcast, which is about the goodness of Fred's lies. And if you'd like to help keep the show going, you can make a per episode donation.

hatredon.com slash citation pod or leave us a five star review every where you can. And if you'd like to get in touch with us, check out past episodes, connect with us on social media, or check the show notes. Be sure to check out citationpod.com. [♪ OUTRO MUSIC PLAYING [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC PLAYING [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC PLAYING [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC PLAYING [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC PLAYING [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC PLAYING [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC PLAYING [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC PLAYING [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC PLAYING [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC PLAYING [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC PLAYING [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC PLAYING [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC PLAYING [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC PLAYING [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC PLAYING [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC PLAYING [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC PLAYING [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC PLAYING [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC PLAYING [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC PLAYING [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC PLAYING [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC PLAYING [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC PLAYING [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC PLAYING [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC PLAYING [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC PLAYING [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC PLAYING [♪ [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC PLAYING [♪ [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC PLAYING [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC PLAYING [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC PLAYING [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC PLAYING [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC PLAYING [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC PLAYING [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC [♪ [♪ OUTRO MUSIC [♪ [♪ Drink my cares away. Oh, you got it, buddy. I'm gonna go get it right now. And how about if I go pick up some KFC? You want some KFC? Ah, that would be fantastic. Thanks, guys. Really appreciate it.

Okay, so you knew it was down the whole time, didn't you? Yeah, obviously. Eli spelled it such a giveaway. Right, of course. Yeah, I liked that I won this one. Give away. Right. Of course. Yeah. I like that I won this one.