Citizens of the World: A Stoic Podcast for Curious Travelers - How to Love Doing the Hard Thing: Stoic Discipline and Eudaimonia

Episode Date: November 11, 2022

On a recent trip to Scotland, I ate well, I drank well -- didn’t so much sleep well. But I enjoyed just the right amount of indulgence for me on a trip. This kind of happiness is hedonia. Hedonic pleasure is about, well, pleasure. Comfort. Satisfaction. What feels good in the moment. Pleasure coming from external things. A massage after a long day. A bite of flourless chocolate cake. Sprawling out on your beach towel and doing nothing.  These pleasures are fun and worthwhile and should be savored in the moment. Hedonic pleasures are also temporary. You may have heard of the hedonic treadmill. This is the idea that we chase hedonic pleasures, we get them, and then that becomes our new baseline. You get the promotion you want, but that’s no longer enough money. You want more. You move into a ‘starter’ home that you love, but one month in you’re wishing you’re already in your ‘forever’ home, one that will be much bigger and perfect and you’ll finally be satisfied then. This kind of happiness is tied to external pleasure. Moving toward pleasure and away from pain.There are two ways we can extend hedonic happiness: 1) by expressing gratitude for and savoring these moments and 2) by abstaining from these pleasures for awhile. Absence makes the heart grow fonder and reminds you to appreciate what you have. There’s a second kind of happiness that’s long lasting: eudaimonia. We achieve this by living as our highest selves. By being people of good character and being good to ourselves. This includes being disciplined enough to do what's best for us and those around us. Enjoy this episode on how to learn to love doing the hard thing through Stoic discipline. Hello! I'm your host, Sarah Mikutel. But the real question is, who are you? Where are you now and where do you want to be? Can I help you get there?Visit sarahmikutel.com to learn how we can work together to help you achieve more peace, happiness, and positive transformation in your life.Do you ever go blank or start rambling when someone puts you on the spot? I created a free Conversation Cheat Sheet with simple formulas you can use so you can respond with clarity, whether you’re in a meeting or just talking with friends.Download it at sarahmikutel.com/blanknomore and start feeling more confident in your conversations today.

Welcome to Live Without Borders, a travel and wellness show for expats, the expat curious, and globally minded citizens of the world. We are the travelers, the culturally curious, the experiences and not things kind of people. And we know that freedom is about more than getting on a plane. It's about becoming the most heroic versions of ourselves, which is why on this podcast you will hear insider travel secrets, inspiring expat stories and advice on how to live abroad. but you will also hear episodes that will help give you the clarity, focus, and skills you need to create a life that will set your soul on fire. I am your host, Sarah Micatel, a certified clarity coach trained in the Enneagram, and I first moved abroad on my own at age 18, and I have been permanently enjoying life in Europe since 2010. If you are ready to make some big moves in your life

and want my help moving from someday to seize the day, visit live without borderspodcast.com. My cab pulls up to my hostel around 10 p.m. It's raining, the door is locked. There's a sign saying that I can collect the key at a bar down the street. I'm about to ask the place next door for directions, but then I realized it's called Privatized Gentleman's Club, and I discover that it is one of Scotland's premier lap dancing clubs and the only strip club in the Scottish Highlands. What am I doing way up here in October? The weather has turned, the tourists have cleared out. Well, I'm here for my friend Kyla, who several months ago, told me that she signed up to run a marathon here in Inverness. When we were back on our beach and Fokston going for a walk, she was telling me about her training. And I just thought, wow, she asked me if I would ever run a marathon or if I ever thought about it. And I said, no, even though I ran track and cross country in high school and I jog on my own now, the thought of running a marathon just has never appealed to me. I would rather jet set around and cheer in my friends who want to push themselves in this way. Or so I thought, by the end of this

trip to Scotland, I realize how awe-inspiring discipline can be when we see other people just really going for it and how we can learn to love what's good for us, how we can learn to love discipline for ourselves. And that is what this episode is all about. Every year, thousands of people flock to Inverness to run in or watch the Loch Ness Marathon. Choices of accommodation were slim by the I booked, which is part of the reason I ended up in a hostel. Also, like, I knew I was barely going to be in the room. Plus, I was up for the challenge of sharing a room with others because I spoiled myself a lot in Italy the week before. So, a little voluntary discomfort on this trip, plus some adventure. For days, I have been slashing around gray and drizzly

Inverness. This is the northernmost city in the UK, and it only became a city officially in the year 2000, though it looks more like a town that's dotted with church steeples and bridges crossing the River Ness. I flew up here, but I wish that I had joined a friend on the sleeper train, which he took from London, and that takes about 11 to 12 hours, but God, what a beautiful ride. For the last few weeks, I have been traveling through the United States, then Italy, down to England, now up here in Scotland, and I've decided I am just going to be a hedonist on these travel. So here in Inverness, this means getting a pumpkin donut at this place called Perk, Cabuccino, at Velosti, which is also a bicycle workshop.

Got a great breakfast sandwich at Blend, more cappuccino at Green and Grind, wine and music at Hootanani, and Yoki at the Mustard Seed. So in case you're going up to Inverness, these were all fab places, and shout out to Kathy at the Watchmeasy blog for her Inverness recommendations. I also went on a whiskey tour around the region with a funny bloke named Jim from the tour company Rabbies. And to my delay, I discover that many distilleries in Scotland have modernized their production and they no longer use peat to turn barley into malt.

So peat is like soil, it's made of partially decomposed plants, and it's what gives whiskey or what gave whiskey. It's smoky flavor, which I don't like. So I am very happy on this tour to sample generous pores of whiskey that don't taste like a campfire. Although some places still do it like that, but it's not so much like the tour that I was on. One Dutch guy on my tour was frowning at this, though, and talking about the loss of traditional ways. And he has a fair point.

Modernization and change don't always mean progress. But I did read that Pete is really great for wildlife and preserving the earth. And harvesting it damages the environment because of the large amount of carbon dioxide it releases. So hooray for this peat-free whiskey that's environmentally friendly and aged and recycled bourbon and sherry barrels. On this trip, I ate well, I drank well. I didn't so much sleep well, but I enjoyed just the right amount of indulgence for me on a trip. This kind of happiness is Hedonia. Hedonic pleasure is about pleasure, comfort, satisfaction, what feels good in the moment,

pleasure coming from external things. So this is a massage after a long day, a bite of flowerless chocolate cake, sprawling out on your beach towel and doing nothing. These pleasures are fun and worthwhile and should be savored. in the moment because hedonic pleasures are temporary. You may have heard of the hedonic treadmill. This is the idea that we chase hedonic pleasures. We get them and then that becomes our new baseline. You get the promotion you want, but that's no longer enough money. You want more. You move into a starter home that you love, but a month later, you're wishing you're already in your forever home,

one that will be much bigger and perfect, and you will finally be satisfied to that. This kind of happiness is tied to external pleasure, moving toward pleasure and away from pain. There are two ways that we can extend hedonic happiness. One, by expressing gratitude for and savoring these moments, and two, by abstaining from these pleasures for a while. Absence does make the heart grow fonder, and it reminds you to appreciate what you have. There's a second kind of happiness that's long-lasting, and that's eudaimonia. Aristotle coined the word eudaimonia in his Nicomachean ethics, though it's a concept that goes back before him. Aristotle studied under Plato, who studied under Socrates, who of course was a great influence of the Stoics.

Eudymonia has been translated several ways, including happiness, flourishing, to live with a good spirit or soul, self-actualization, reaching your potential. You means good, and Dimon means spirit. Live as your highest self. The goal of life, according to the Stoics. One of the keys to happiness and flourishing, according to Aristotle, is to live according to his doctrine of the mean, also known as the Golden Mean. The Golden Mean says that there is a middle ground between too much and not enough, between working out four hours a day and never getting off the couch, between workaholism and barely lifting a finger. Going overboard on either end of the spectrum isn't good for us. We want to find balance in the middle, And that's where virtue is, Aritae. Excellence. And living with virtue or Aritae is the key to happiness,

the key to flourishing and living a good life. And there are no hard-invest rules on what that balance is. It depends on your situation. Our ancient ancestors ate a lot when the opportunity came up because they didn't know when they were going to eat again. Since you have the luxury of listening to a podcast, chances are you know where your next meal is coming from, so you don't have to eat the whole fridge. Aristotle said in his Nicaraminkian ethics, quote, For both excessive and insufficient exercise destroy one's strength, and both eating and drinking too much or too little destroy health, whereas the right quantity produces, increases, and preserves it. So it is the same with temperance, courage, and the other virtues. The man who shuns and fears everything and stands up to nothing becomes a coward.

The man who is afraid of nothing at all, but marches up to every danger, becomes foolhardy. Similarly, the man who indulges in every pleasure and refrains from none becomes licentious. But if a man behaves like a bore and turns his back on every pleasure, he is a case of insensibility. Thus, temperance and courage are destroyed by excess and deficiency and preserved by the mean. end quote, and that is the Penguin Classics Translation. The virtue of courage is the golden mean between recklessness and cowardice. Recklessness is having too much courage and cowardice is not enough. The virtue of moderation is not depriving yourself of everything, but living mindfully and not

going overboard. There's no pleasure when you do this. Let's say you order a pizza. It's Friday night. You want to have a chill evening in and treat yourself, and you haven't had pizza in ages, and you are really hungry when it arrives. the first bite tastes so good. It hits the spot, but then you keep going. And by the time you get to that last slice, you're not even into it anymore. But you think, well, I might as well finish it. And then I

can go back to eating healthy tomorrow. And so you eat that last bite of crust and you're feeling a little doughy and stuffed. When you eat past the point of being full, the last bite is nowhere near as good as the first bite. By the way, no judgment if you can eat a whole pizza and feel fine. I learned to eat a whole pizza in Italy where the Roman style pizza crust is super thin, and everyone I know ate the whole thing, including me. So we're not talking Chicago-style deep dish pies here. Anyway, again, the rules of balance depend on the situation. You can remember the golden mean by thinking of Goldilocks, trying bowls of porridge.

She didn't want it too hot or too cold, but somewhere in the middle where the temperature was just right. I apply this concept to every area of my life to keep myself in balance. Think of the most important things in your life. Health, relationships, work. Where are you overdoing it? Where do you need to put in more effort? A German friend of mine recently visited me, and Germans, on the whole, love eating bread, so I made sure that I had bread and cheese in my house for her breakfast. I didn't eat any, well, she was there. I don't often eat bread these days. But when she lived, left, I started to finish it and I felt like an out-of-control monster. I just love it too much. And the craving just feels beyond me. The British have a word for this moorish, something that

tastes so good that you want to just keep eating. It's this desire. I love delicious food. I love enjoying local dishes when I travel and dining out with my friends. However, there is a time and a place for that. If I ate casidias all day every day, my health. would suffer, my physical health, but also my mental and emotional health as well, because it's all connected. There's space for indulgences for sure. But how can you have more self-control so you're not eating an entire bag of chabotaroles in one sitting? Asking for a friend. Epicita said freedom is not achieved by satisfying desire, but by eliminating it. In one of my favorite books, Switch by Dan and Chip Heath, the authors say that what looks like a person problem is often a situation problem.

And they go on to say that Stanford psychologist Lee Ross surveyed dozens of studies in psychology, and he noted that people have a systematic tendency to ignore the situational forces that shape other people's behavior. He called this deep-rooted tendency the fundamental attribution error. This is the error that lies in our inclination to attribute people's behavior to the way they are rather than to the situation they are in, end quote. In the book, Dan and Chip talk about drug use and American soldiers during the Vietnam War. Back then, the U.S. government was really concerned that the soldiers would be drug addicts when they came back to America because the government had done studies and knew that hard

drug use had skyrocketed amongst the troops in Vietnam. Before going over there, only one percent of them were addicted to drugs. But according to Dan and Chip, quote, once in Vietnam, almost half of the soldiers tried narcotics and 20 percent became addicted. Demographics did not predict who would become drug users in Vietnam. Race and class were irrelevant. The drug use started early. 20 percent of all users started in their first week in Vietnam, 60 percent within the first three months. Oddly, drug use did not seem to be triggered by trauma. The Researchers found no statistical relationship between drug use and the difficulty of soldiers' assignments, or the danger they faced, or the death of friends. End quote.

20% of soldiers became addicted to drugs, and 50% were recreational users. But when they went back to the U.S., the number of people addicted went back down to 1%. This is because they were no longer surrounded by their war buddies doing drugs. they were back at home with their friends and their partners, families. They were back amongst people who were not using drugs, and they wanted to rejoin the society that they knew. Now, of course, it's much harder for certain people to overcome addiction, and a lot of that is genetic. The point of this story is that our environment has a major impact on the actions that we take or don't take. So change your conditions. If you don't want to binge on bread, don't keep bread in the house,

or potato chips if that's your thing. And the Stoics agreed with this. You don't need to white knuckle things or to try to get by on willpower. Seneca said, he who would lay aside his desire for all the things which he used to crave so passionately must turn away both eyes and ears from the objects which he has abandoned. That's from the letter on rest and restlessness, letter 69, the Dow of Seneca. If you want to decrease your cravings or desires for something and increase your ability to do the things you've been avoiding, add some pain to what you're trying to quit and add some pleasure to what you're trying to achieve. Marcus Aurelis shares this really helpful technique to manage cravings in the meditations. How useful it is when you're served roast meat in similar dishes to think to yourself, this is the corpse of a fish, this is the corpse of a bird or a pig. or again to see Philernean wine as mere grape juice.

How good these thoughts are at reaching and getting to the heart of things. They enable you to see things for what they are. This should be a lifelong exercise. Whenever things particularly seem to deserve your acceptance, strip them bare so that you can see how worthless they are and dispense with the descriptions that make them seem more significant than they are. That's Meditations 613. Robin Waterfield Translation. I love this. It's not about abstaining from all life has to offer. It's about

managing desires that feel out of control, stripping down our desires and seeing them for what they really are. Let's say you have a craving for Doritos. You know if you bought a bag, you would eat the whole thing, but you keep thinking about how they just make you droll. They're so good. What are in these Doritos? I'll tell you. Corn, vegetable, oils, whey powder from milk, wheat flour, salt, cheese powder, tomato powder, some just generic ingredient called flavoring. Like, I don't know how you can get away with the word flavoring by itself as an ingredient. But that's what makes up Doritos and a bunch of other things. So the next time your mind is telling you to give into your desire and go get that bag of

Doritos, you can tell yourself, this is just corn, a bunch of oil, and power. And I have to tell this to myself because for me, Doritos are like crack. Or if you make the conscious decision to eat Doritos that day, get a mini bag instead of a huge regular size bag. And if you want to dial up this pain, remember the empty feeling you have after eating these empty calories. Chintas are you're still going to be hungry. So what could you eat next time that would feel deliciously nourishing, something so tasty

and wholesome that eating it feels like an act of love to yourself? dial up this pleasure of what's good for you. And if you think nothing, if you think that you can't find anything good and healthy in the kitchen, it's time to start experimenting. Being disciplined enough to take care of yourself physically, mentally, and emotionally is an act of love toward yourself, those around you, and the world at large. You cannot make the kind of contribution that you want to make in this world when you're tired, run down, stressed, eating poorly, not sleeping. The ancient Stoics said that animals follow their impulses, but humans don't have to because we have reason and we can question our impulses, our desires, and aversions. Modern science today backs this up, agreeing that we've got an emotional impulsive side and a rational side that can help us make better decisions. Our ability to reason is our human nature, but we forget this because we get caught up in automatic personality patterns that you. keep us on autopilot and seeking temporary hedonic pleasure, which often prevents us from experiencing

true, long-lasting happiness, eudaimonia. We need to rediscover our ability to be rational, to question what we know, and even what our preferences are. Do we even like this thing that we're craving? There's some really interesting research being done on how our physical state, whether we're tired, hungry, sad, and things like the weather, how they affect our decisions and experiences. Kareem Hagg, an assistant professor at UCLA School of Management, says that we are often disappointed by an experience the second time around because of our attribution bias.

For example, let's say that we have any in all day, and we've been walking around in the cold. When we walk into a cozy pub with hot soup, we think this soup is the best soup we have ever tasted. Then let's say we go back to that same place for soup in the soft. summertime. It's hot outside. We're not that hungry when we get there. Chances are that soup that we remembered being best in the world doesn't taste nearly as good. This can affect multiple aspects of our lives. Grim co-wrote a paper called Attribution Bias and Consumer

Choice, which says, in the labor market, an employer may find interviewing an applicant less enjoyable if they are tired during that interaction. So if the employer is tired during the interaction. That employer may later penalize the applicant if the employer misattributes her own temporary tiredness to a stable quality of the candidate. Health investments may also be skewed by attribution bias. For example, an individual that tries a new exercise and a day they are not feeling well may consequently be less likely to re-engage in that activity, end quote. I find the study fascinating and it's a reminder to keep an open mind. When we try something once and we think we don't like it, we should consider why we are feeling like we don't like it. What else might be

going on? Maybe with some adjustments, we'd have a better outcome. For example, Kareem says if college students are choosing majors based on the times of the introductory classes, universities can schedule these courses in a way that favors careers with the highest social returns. So what adjustments can you make in your own life to do the thing you want and need to do but struggle with? How can you you use this idea to be more disciplined? A few years ago, Ryan Holiday did a podcast episode called Try this Secret Roman Party Trick. In it, he talks about how the ancient Greeks and Romans water down their wine because it was too strong and if you didn't do this, you were considered a barbarian. He says, this is a metaphor for moderation and asks, how can you add water to something in your life?

That is, how can you make something a little better for yourself? For example, going for that little little bag of Doritos instead of the big one. Going back to the book Switch, the guy cited a study in which a bunch of moviegoers were given really stale popcorn to eat. Some got medium-sized tubs, others got large tubs. Those with the bigger tubs ate way more, even though the popcorn that they were served was purposely not good. They made it taste kind of gross. They were just mindlessly eating this popcorn that they were given. You can also set up rules for yourself. If it's the weekend, then I eat whatever I want. If I'm traveling, then I eat whatever I want. If I'm home, I eat vegan. If it's January, I don't drink any alcohol. Whatever you feel will help you

the most set up some if then rules for yourself. For me, I've gotten used to eating in a pretty healthy way. I go on periodic cleanses with more rules, but overall I eat healthy. And if I go out to dinner, I don't worry about it. I'll have whatever I want because I know at home I'm eating clean and I'm feeling good and getting a lot of energy from this. This week is a big going out week for me. I went to a Spanish restaurant with a friend. Tonight, I'm going to the grand opening of Taco Bell in my down is the talk of the town. So I'm heading over there with some friends of mine from the gym. And I don't stress about it when I'm home, I eat clean. I have energy. And when I go out with friends, I don't know whatever I want. So find the balance that works for you. The important thing is to be conscious of your eating habits and how you want to be. So you don't feel like you are at the mercy of your cravings. Make conscious decisions. You are in control of your life, not a slice of pizza. French fries are not the boss of you.

To think and act clearly, we need to manage our negative emotions, our passions, and learn to want what is good for us and to stay away from what isn't good for us, to not automatically give into every thought, emotion, an impulse that pops into our head. And this is in our control. Our ability to reason comes from the part of universal reason that's inside all of us, according to the Stoics. When we can see reality for what it is without making false judgments, we can flow with the life instead of fighting it. We can achieve eudaimonia. Most of us are addicted to comfort, and my hand is raised here. Our self-preservation instinct works over time to keep us feeling safe by sticking to the life we know. And so we, we

We don't apply for that job or start a podcast or break up with the person we know isn't right for us or we keep eating chocolate ice cream every night even though we say we want to stop. We host, we make excuses. We say we will start after the holidays. We will wait for a day when it's not raining. We want perfect conditions before we start. In Inverness, when I saw my friend cross that finish line of her marathon, it really hit me how much time and dedication she put into this race. I was so proud of her. She put her mind to something and she followed through.

She set a goal and she rose to the challenge. And her actions inspired me and made me realize that I want to push myself harder to be more disciplined and not in a hustle culture sort of way. But in a way that stretches me and encourages me to show up as my highest self, to do the hard thing, to live with Arate, personal excellence, to feel that kind of eudaimonic happiness. When you go to bed at night and you know you gave your all, that kind of pleasure feels very different than the hedonistic pleasures of laying around on the couch for hours watching the Kardashians. Not that there's not a time in place for that stuff. My mom visited me recently, and one of my favorite things to do with her was just at night, chill in my living room and watch the comedy only murders in the building. These were fun, relaxing evenings where we could just be in each other's company. And I will always cherish these experiences. In everyday life, though, I'm looking to rise to bigger challenges.

I've started lifting weights at the gym, drinking ginger beer, which is not an alcoholic when I'm out with friends. I'm prioritizing, seeing, and talking to the people I care about. Not that this is a challenge, but the challenge is doing the things that we say we want to do. prioritizing what's really important rather than postponing them. I'm reading more books this year. I'm meeting new friends. I'm saying yes to things that scare me. I'm switching up things in my business, focusing more on stoic leadership coaching and helping introverts communicate more effectively and with more confidence. And I'm recommitting to podcasting and sharing information and stories with you that I think might interest you and hopefully benefit you. And the more I do these things,

the more I love them. Seneca said that what we do is who we are. I want to live a life where wisdom, courage, justice, and moderation are reflected in my thoughts and actions. To say again, there is a difference in how you feel after a day of doing nothing and how you feel after you've given your all to something. What do you want to start that you have been putting off? How do you want to be more disciplined? What do you want to offer this world? What is the marathon that you want to start training for? Start now. That's all for now.

Go ahead and follow the show or hit subscribe so you can hear more episodes like this. And if you would like my help taking bold action on your own dreams, like living abroad, changing careers and other life transitions, visit Live Without Borderspodcast.com. Thanks for listening and have a beautiful week wherever you are. Do you ever go blank or start rambling when someone puts you on the spot? I created a free conversation sheet sheet with simple formulas that you can use so you can respond with clarity, whether you're in a meeting or just talking with friends. Download it at sarah micotel.com slash blank no more.