Closing Bell - Closing Bell Overtime: 6/6/25

Episode Date: June 6, 2025

From the open to the close, “Closing Bell” and “Closing Bell: Overtime” have you covered. From what’s driving market moves to how investors are reacting, Scott Wapner, Jon Fortt, Morgan Brennan and Michael Santoli guide listeners through each trading session and bring to you some of the biggest names in business.

That bell marks the end of regulation. Housing and Urban Development Secretary Scott Turner ringing the closing bell at the New York Stock Exchange, TechNYC, doing the honors at the NASDAQ in a rally in the markets on the back of a better than expected jobs report. The S&P touching 6,000 for the first time since late February.

Tech was the best performing sector of the week up more than 3%, led higher by chip names. Crude closing in the green, posting its best week since October. Broadcom shares the lower following its earnings. Despite the move, the stocks higher for the week up 39% in the past three months.

Lulu Lemon, the big loser on the day. It's worst day since 2020 after cutting full year guidance and DocuSign sinking after Billings growth was slower than expected in the first quarter. Well, that's the scorecard here on Wall Street. Welcome to Closing Bell Overtime. I'm Morgan Brennan along with John Ford.

The jobs report comes in better than expected stocks moved higher with the S&P breaking back above 6,000 all major indices closed higher for the second straight week. It's the first back-to-back weekly gains that we've seen since May 2nd. So what is that telling us about investor sentiment? Well, let's bring in Mike Santoli, CNBC senior markets commentator. Mike, talk to me about this rally. We discussed it yesterday.

6,000 might be a round number. It might not be the technical level that investors and traders were watching, but certainly a round number. How does it speak to the momentum we have seen in stocks despite bond yields moving a little bit higher again today? Yeah. I mean, Morgan, look,

investor sentiment has grown more comfortable and it's grown more comfortable because you have this mix of the real economy, the hard data has been hanging in there enough. And I think I put the jobs report in that category.

It's good enough to kind of push off some of the worries, even though it doesn't show acceleration. And then you have the brute force of mag seven, mega cap growth earnings that were just so strong. It just enabled that part of that market to really revive

and drive the indexes higher. Obviously we have the makings of some progress on trade. I think we're pricing in a fair amount of deescalation on the tariff front. We have this talks announced with the US.S. and China on Monday. It kind of doesn't matter what happens or what comes out of that in my view, if it's part of a process of just declaring victory

on some level and trying to get past the issue. So we'll see if that all fits together. I would point out we got to 6,000 for the first time seven months ago, right after the election. So it's enabled this market to kind of just retread that old ground and still make it feel like it's progress because of how deep in the depth we were two months ago. Yeah, I think we're something like only 2.5% below

the all-time high we saw back in February now for the S&P. Mike, stay with us for more on the jobs report specifically. Let's add to the conversation Apollo Global Management Chief Economist Torsten Slock as well. And Torsten, do you wanna get your thoughts on what we saw in that jobs report? You're the first person that came on CNBC and said there's a divergence between soft data and hard data until the hard data catches up. The soft data is concerning, but it doesn't mean we're tipping into recession. How do you see it now coming off of a jobs report that was better than

expected, but still shows signs of softening in the labor market. You're right, Morgan. And that's exactly the backdrop here, Naomi, that we had, of course, a very turbulent period in April. And that's why it was very significant relief today that the jobs numbers were actually still relatively decent. It is still a downward trend, as Mike just was saying.

And we are having a little bit of a worry in the market, of course, with wage inflation moving higher. But the big picture really here is that the market has been trying to assess what is the magnitude of this shock that the trade war was. It was obviously not a shock that had the magnitude of COVID or Lehman. And the magnitude of the shock was, of course, at least up to this point, so mild that it hasn't quite yet been weighing on the hard data. But Morgan, to your question, we should expect in the market that,

in particular over the next several months, now companies are adjusting to these high levels of tariffs. It will weigh more and more on earnings. In particular, we just heard Wal-Mart say also about this today that they were continuously worried about the negative effects. So taking together both the trade war still being an impact on earnings over the next several months and quarters ahead and at the same time also They continued move high in rates. There's still plenty of things to worry about when it comes to the headwinds to the economy Torsten how much do these numbers you think reflect what's actually happening now? Do these numbers, you think, reflect what's actually happening now, given the pull-ins that we've had from the various reactions to the Trump administration policy, and also given the expectations on the implications of some of that perhaps inventory build for the second half?

Yeah, that's a very important point, because it does, of course, take time to slow the economy down. And what really is going on is that companies are trying to figure out how should we respond to this level of tariffs? Of course, there's discussion about will these tariffs be permanent? Are they temporary? How long time should we expect them to be in place? But at the moment, if they do stay at these levels, we should expect to see companies,

in particular, of course, in the sectors that are vulnerable to trade, continuously adjust. And that adjustment has been recognized also by both Scott Besson and, of course, Trump, even Navarro, that there is an adjustment period. And we should not expect that that will just be a few weeks or a few months. It's something that is going to take time. So this is still a headwind when it comes to the earnings outlook for the S&P and to GDP. The Yale Budget Lab is predicting that the drag on GDP growth on the trade world will be minus 0.7.

So that's not a recession, but it's still enough of a drag to put some upward pressure on the unemployment rate for the next several months. So to your question, we should still expect to see going forward, especially combined with rates moving high in the long end, that there is still a lot of challenges for the economy, not enough to generate a recession,

but definitely enough to give it some significant headwinds. Mike, you mentioned that we've seen 6,000 before. How is investor sentiment, particularly retail, there had been this sort of very big bifurcation between what institutions were doing and what retail was doing, I guess redefining what smart money is perhaps. Right now until we get kind of final numbers, although I would argue there's also a bifurcation within retail.

I think the traditional kind of long-term oriented buy and hold investor, you know, if you listen to what they say in surveys, if you look at some of the flows into traditional equity funds, they're not exuberant. They actually have remained pretty cautious. I think that there is, though, this much more active thread of retail traders who are just in the game all the time, very quick to buy dips, very quick to press momentum trades, and that's been working so far. So one of the things I would point to this week, and maybe in retrospect it'll seem important

in one respect or another, you know we had this circle IPO you are starting to see the window open up for IPOs that's a feature of the bull market that we've only had sporadically and that's sort of a positive until it tips over into getting into kind of silliness and frothiness and I don't think we're quite there. Yeah of course huge moves in circles since it started trading yesterday. We're gonna talk a little bit more about that later in the hour, but Torsten, I wanna go back to wage growth here

and what we saw in this morning's report, because the fact that it came in stronger than expected and that we do continue to see wages grow both on a month over month basis and a year over year basis, if you start to see inflation ignite again, but wage growth continues to outpace it, doesn't that help offset the worries around stagflation?

That is correct, because then you have real income growth and real income growth is of course very important because that is what ultimately drives the consumer. But the challenge here of course is that that does require that CPI and consumer prices do stay low. The challenge, of course, for the Federal Reserve is that they need to look at both and wage growth being high, it is, of course, a little warning sign that the Fed will just not be able to cut rates as quickly as we thought just until more recently.

That's why the market has now been pricing that the Fed will stay on hold for longer. And that is, of course, why the main theme here in markets really is that rates will stay higher for longer because inflation, including wage inflation, will stay higher for longer. And that is, of course, why the main theme here in markets really is that rates will stay higher for longer because inflation, including wage inflation, will stay higher for longer. That's, of course, good for fixed income investors. And this will continue to be a headwind to the S&P 500 because combining that with the upward pressure on rates also coming from the fiscal side, you both have the front end going up because of inflation risks. And now you also have the long end going up because of fiscal risk. So combined, the yield curve will stay elevated and that continues to be a very important theme in markets.

Mike, what's the most important next macro benchmark we're gonna get? Probably macro CPI next week, I would say, and really how the bond market, you know, digests whatever we do get out of there. We are in this period where there's not a lot of alarm on either side of the, you know, the employment or inflation mandate,

but we're not far from tripping into that, either a growth scare or something that seems like sticky inflation, and here we are with a wait and see Fed that we're not gonna be able to deal with. I also keep pointing to July as a confluence of a lot of things. You're gonna get the tariff deadlines expiring in that month. You're probably going to have to really get down to it on the bill, the tax bill going through Congress. You got a Fed meeting late in July. Who knows if it'll be live. It'll be the

last one until September. And the seasonal patterns in the stock market tend to turn a little bit more negative or less favorable in July. So maybe that's where you might look toward to say you got some challenges ahead. All right. Well, Torsten Slock from Apollo Global, thank you for joining us. Mike, we'll see you in just a bit. Shares of Tesla rebounding about 4%, recovering some of what was lost

in yesterday's Trump-Musk war of words. So now that Elon Musk's time as a government employee is really over, is his return good for Tesla or has he become too polarizing? We're gonna discuss and debate when overtime returns. And we're watching shares of some of the air taxi operators, Joby Aviation, Archer Aviation, and AeroVironman all rallying on the back of an executive order focused on development and commercialization of unmanned aircrafts as well. That spike into the close just a few minutes ago.

Welcome back to overtime, a big week in the IPO market. Shares of Omada Health soaring in their debut today. Virtual Health Healthcare Company priced at $19 a share closed more than 20% higher, about 21%. Also check out Shares of Circle. $1.5 million in shares. $1.5 million in shares. $1.5 million in shares. $1.5 million in shares. $1.5 million in shares. $1.5 million in shares. $1.5 million in shares.

$1.5 million in shares. $1.5 million in shares. $1.5 million in shares. $1.5 million in shares. $1.5 million in shares. $1.5 million in shares. $1.5 million in shares. long-standing traditional financial institutions, banks like Fifth Third, M&T, and State Street. Now, let's turn now to the very public breakup between the President of the United States

and the world's richest man. Tesla bouncing back somewhat today, still down 13% since Monday on the back of yesterday's slide. That's its second worst week of the year. Meantime, the New York Times reporting President Trump has decided to sell the red Tesla he got in March and told everyone else to buy. You're looking at a live shot of that car still parked

on the West Executive Avenue at the White House. And joining us now is Ross Gerber, Gerber Kawasaki CEO and President, and Brett Winton, ARK Investment Chief Futurist and a member of the ARK Venture Investment Committee. Both are shareholders in Tesla. Welcome guys, happy Friday. Brett, how did you calculate the valuation benefit

that Tesla got from Musk's closeness to the president and from that Tesla buying endorsement that's sitting there in the driveway still? And how do you kind of reverse that out now? I mean, I think it's clear that Elon Musk and how do you kind of reverse that out now? I mean, I think it's clear that Elon Musk has a different strategic view of the playing field than almost anybody else does. And on the surface, his actions may appear erratic,

but if you look over time, those actions lead to long-term value creation for shareholders and advance his companies towards meeting their mission. And we think between Neuralink, SpaceX, Tesla, these are all companies that are actively changing the world. And that's why we're invested in them. And we believe that he's leading them in that direction,

you know, assertively and effectively. Ross, that sounds to me like the trust Elon, look how right he's been so far based on stock performance. Why is that not right here? Well, this isn't the same Elon that we were dealing with five years ago, that's for sure. And I think that the toll that his lifestyle has taken on him has finally reached a point where it's been like monumentally detrimental to the future vision that Brett's talking about.

So as much as I like the vision of Tesla that Elon has for its future, it has to be actualized. To actualize that, he needs support from the United States government. Tesla is a government-supported entity. It receives billions of dollars a year in subsidies from the US government. Losing these subsidies are really, really bad for Tesla. And many of Elon's other businesses will be greatly affected if the government begins working against him. So this is a strategic error of epic proportions.

And the sooner that he can apologize to Trump and try to get something back in his good graces, the better. But now having all the magas selling their Teslas is about the worst-case scenario you could imagine for Tesla. Brett, I mean, the fact that Tesla's down, what, 15% now on the week, and we know a lot of that happened yesterday, there's a little bit of bounce back today.

You just mentioned there's other companies which are privately held, SpaceX, there's Boring, there's Neuralink, XAI as well. Is this a situation that has ripple effects to all of the different companies? And if so, how do you quantify the impact to the broader Musk ecosystem, if you will, or is it outsized for Tesla? Sure.

I mean, we, you know, because we have exposures to most of those companies, we assess, you know, the thesis risk against those companies with any meaningful piece of news that occurs. And broadly, the reason that those companies that we invest in those companies is because they are doing things that no other company in the world can do. The incremental car sale isn't as important to Tesla as launching RoboTaxi this week. Neuralink has installed its devices more than any other brain computer interface company in the world. And SpaceX is really the only game in town in terms of, you know, lopping astronauts to the space station as well as going to Mars. So there is like the

near term volatility, disruptive innovation, looked at very closely, often appears messy. And our job is to manage that exposure on behalf of our clients. It's why active management is so important. Ross a week ago the narrative was this will be great for Tesla and Musk's other companies because and with the case of Tesla specifically, Tesla is Musk Musk is Tesla.

We'd heard that from a number of guests on the show in recent weeks. Is Tesla a help or I mean is Musk a help or Tesla. We'd heard that from a number of guests on the show in recent weeks. Is Tesla a help or, I mean, is Musk a help or a hindrance now, given what we've seen in the last couple of days? Well, it's a tough one because obviously he's a very talented engineer. He has tremendous skills and applying his 100% focus

on Tesla was actually what I had hoped for for some time. This whole side show at the government was wholly unnecessary and very detrimental to Tesla. On one sense, having Tesla and Elon back together at this crucial part where they launching RoboTaxi, which basically doesn't work, so he's got a lot of work to do. That's the good. But he seems to have doubled down on the negative side of Elon with the marketing and the view of the company so bad, you know, and then to, you know, really start a feud with, you know, whether Elon likes it or not, Trump is the most powerful person in America.

And so, you know, having money is one thing, but being the President of the United States is the President of the United States. And that involves things like regulation of robo-taxis. It involves things like SpaceX contracts and supporting his companies. You know, it's a very, you know, combined with the government. So none of this will be good for Elon. Brett, it's interesting.

I don't think anybody, very few people in here, were suggesting that Elon Musk should apologize to President Biden when he was the president and had the power that he had. It seems like both President Trump and Elon Musk are protecting their brands here. Neither wants to seem captured. Musk saying yesterday he's gonna be around for a long time.

Should he apologize? No, I don't think he has anything to apologize for. I mean, Musk is a very principled individual. I think that's clear. And he's adhering to those principles. His goal is to achieve the mission that his companies have laid out, to make humanity a multi-planetary species,

to deliver the abundant future that we deserve with Tesla and to allow kind of our relationship with computers to fundamentally change with Neuralink. And his relationship with not just President Trump and President, former President Biden, but with leaders around the world is in the interest of making sure that those companies can accelerate as quickly as possible. I think that's what he's been focused on all along. And from an outside observer's perspective, sometimes you say, huh, that's a funny move he's making. But the body of evidence over time has demonstrated that he has a reason behind it. And again, if you look at the track record, he has managed astounding results

across a number of his companies that no other company has been able to achieve. Okay, Brett Whitten and Ross Gerber, thanks for joining us to discuss. Well, we just touched on it a little bit, but let's turn to Musk's other big company, SpaceX. As the Trump-Musk feud escalated, SpaceX got caught in the crossfire. The president threatening to pull government contracts and Musk threatening to decommission

the Dragon space capsule. SpaceX has $22 billion worth of government contracts. Its rockets launched key national security missions, science missions for the government. Its Dragon capsule ferries people and cargo to the International Space Station. Starlink provides broadband connectivity, including to the government. It's dragging capsule ferries, people, and cargo to the International Space Station. Starlink provides broadband connectivity, including to the military. It holds contracts to bring the ISS down from orbit at the end of the decade.

And the Starship mega rocket that's under development will eventually land American astronauts on the moon. And while more competition is coming in the space sector, SpaceX holds a wide lead over everyone else. That's also why SpaceX is the most valuable private company in the world. It's currently pegged at $400 billion, according to secondary market site, Forge Global.

And while Tesla shares tumbled today, funds holding SpaceX also felt the pressure yesterday in particular, especially the Destiny Tech 100 Fund, ticker DXYZ, that did bounce back today, but it is 50% weighted to SpaceX. And as all of this plays out, others to watch do include Cathie Wood's ARK Venture Fund and Ron Baron's focused growth fund.

SpaceX is the top holding in both. Also, keep an eye on other pure place space stocks. Rocket Lab up eight, well well closed up 9% today. It's up 155% in a year. And taking off after the election, it launches rockets smaller than SpaceX's and makes satellites as well. All right. Yeah.

Well, Apple shares down 18% this year following a list of setbacks. Can Monday's big Worldwide Developer Conference reverse the company's downtrend? And while Apple has struggled so with small caps, the Russell 2000 down 4% this year underperforming the major averages, but is a turnaround coming? This is seasonally typically a good time

for the small caps. We're going to discuss that coming up next on Closing Bill Overtime. Welcome back to overtime. Tesla's recovered some losses today but the stock closed 13 percent lower this week. So let's bring back Mike Santoli for a broader look at the so-called bro billionaire stocks Mike. Yes John so that bro billionaire nomenclature is from Michael Hartnett over at Bank of America

who puts this chart together showing all the value that was piled on by the shares of several founders, such as those of Nvidia, Meta, Palantir, Tesla, interactive brokers, plus crypto, over the course of the last year, but in particular, since the presidential election, compared to sort of a Main Street index, that would be the Russell 2000. Now, that's been a longstanding trend right the Russell 2000

underperforming mega cap growth take a look at what's going on right now though. This is a two-year chart and there's a lot of attention on this. There's a little bit of a downtrend from the fourth quarter that big reflex Trump trade. We got that benefited Russell 2000 small caps. It's nosed above that.

We'll see if that means a longer-term recovery by the way that high from a few months ago was matching the high from late 2021. So it's been a long time that these stocks can't get out of their own way. Mike, it's interesting that the bro billionaire stocks have kind of gone against smaller caps in general. Do you see another cohort that's similar within, you know, outside of the Magnificent 7, or are they behaving in a way that's entirely different from most other stuff? There are other groups in the market that are also vastly outperforming.

I mean, you can even look at industrials that, you know, kind of pretty, kind of mundane businesses or those that are just big conglomerates, big proxies for the economy. They've also done well, but it's just the magnitude and the suddenness of all those stocks moving together that I think was somewhat eye-catching recently. By the way, Russell 2000 in part is breaking out because some of the bigger holdings, yeah, there's 2000-some stocks in there, but some of the bigger holdings are some of the momentum favorites like him's and hers rocket labs in the top five or 10 So so it's not just Main Street kind of mundane businesses in there All right, Mike Santoli. Thank you

And I should note rocket labs up more than five hundred fifty percent over the past year It's time now for a cvc news update with Pippa Stevens. Hi Pippa Hey Morgan The man mistakenly deported to El Salvador more than two months ago is reportedly on his way back to the U.S. as he faces charges for transporting undocumented immigrants into the country. The government accuses Abrego Garcia and co-conspirators of collecting money from illegally transporting immigrants into the country and then transferring that money between one another to conceal the origin of the payments. Five leaders of the Proud Boys, who were found guilty and then pardoned for engaging in a seditious conspiracy for participating in the January 6th riot at the Capitol, filed suit

against the U.S. government today. They're claiming their constitutional rights were violated and are looking for 100 million dollars in restitution. Their demand will force the Trump administration to either defend the prosecutions or pay damages to the far-right group. And CNN reporting this afternoon, the Trump administration is prepping to cancel a big chunk of federal funding for California. A White House official told CNN this afternoon that no final decision has been made. John, we'll send it back to you. Pippa, thank you. Well, President Trump once again lashing out at Fed Chair Powell on social media, saying

he's too late to cut as Europe has cut rates eight times in this latest cycle and European stocks have outperformed the U.S. So does that mean Europe is a better place for your money right now? And as we head to break, look at some of the top performers on the S&P 500 for this week on Semi of 20%. Big gains also for Micron and Microchip. Overtime we'll be right back. Welcome back to Overtime.

Let's get a quick check on the market. Stocks rallying today on a better than expected jobs report and hopes for Monday's meeting between trade reps from the U.S. and China. S&P 500 topping 6,000 for the first time since late February or at least closing there. All the MAG7 names hired today, including Tesla, rebounding slightly after its big decline yesterday. And a big week for silver, up nearly 9% rising to its highest level in 13 years. Yeah, maybe a little bit of a catch-up trade there to gold. Well, let's go around the world, shall we?

So far this year, the global markets are widely outperforming the U.S. The FTSE is up 8% year-to-date, the German DAX jumping 22%. That's been trading at a record high. France is up 5%. Brazil and Mexico are both at more than 10%. Meanwhile, the S&P is up only 1%. All this as trade tensions continue around the globe, particularly between the US and China.

Let's bring in Mobius Emerging Opportunities Fund Chairman, Mark Mobius. Mark, it's great to have you back on the show. Let's start right there because we know there is a US envoy that's going to be meeting with its Chinese counterparts in London come Monday. How much hinges on these trade talks? I think it's very, very important. If you talk to any manufacturer around the world,

you see that China figures very high in the parts and components that they use, particularly here in the US. So I think the talks will be very critical. The big problem, I think, facing the talks is the weakened position of Xi Jinping. I don't know where you've been keeping up with the political developments in China, but he is in a weaker position,

maybe because of this problem with the US and the general failure of the Chinese economy. So it'll be very interesting to find out what comes out of the talks with him and with the people in London, their meeting in London. So let's see what happens. But I think there's a very interesting development taking place in China now. It's such a key point.

I don't think we pay enough attention to it. We're so focused on the geopolitical ramifications of trade dynamics and trade policy that sometimes we overlook the domestic implications as all of this is happening in real time in different I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point.

I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. I think that's a good point. the U.S. more leverage and thus does it make U.S. markets look more attractive again? I see the key country would be Mexico to begin with. Because if you talk to

manufacturers, companies in the U.S., they are so dependent upon Mexico for manufacturing and for components, for all kinds of things. So I think that is going to be a very key factor going forward. After Mexico, then it's India.

India will gradually replace China for manufacturing, particularly of high labor content goods, and that will be a very important component. And as you can see, Indian market is doing very well, and I think will continue to do well going forward. Mark, how do you feel about the optics of the Trump administration's trade deals? A few weeks ago, they were saying a bunch of deals were imminent.

They have this framework with the UK, and then really not much since. Do you think people or other countries are sitting on their hands a bit trying to see how this plays out? Is it a problem that the deals haven't come as quickly as the administration suggested? There's no question that the overseas,

they're looking at the domestic situation. For example, they look at the Trump problems with other people in the politics. And of course, the fact that the bill has not been passed by the Senate yet. So people overseas certainly looking at these things and are waiting to see where the greater opportunity will be and the pressure is up on Trump to do some deals and there's no question that there's going to be a bargaining that takes place with these countries but there's no question that

all the domestic strife that's taking place in the U.S. makes countries hesitant to close a deal and think that they can get a better deal from the U.S. You mentioned India, it's rebounded the market there significantly since the beginning of March. What's the lesson there and anything in it that applies more broadly to some other markets?

Well, the key of, is a young population, average age about 26 compared to about 38 for the Chinese population, 1.2 billion people growing at 7% to 8% real growth. So that's really the secret of India and the growing importance of India going forward. Very quickly, Mark, you were on a couple weeks ago. You said you were largely in cash. Is that still the case? I know I invested more, but on our new fund, we're waiting to get into India, and that should happen within the next few weeks, and we'll be able to reduce the cash levels. But we're still high in cash. And one of the reasons is because of the high uncertainty brought on by the Trump administration. All right, Mark Mobius, thank you. Thank you.

Well, Apple's higher today, but still, well, if it were a market in bear market territory, up next, we're gonna discuss whether next week's developer conference can help the stock regain its appeal with investors. Plus Samsara shares falling after sales guidance was only a little bit better than estimates. The CEO breaks down the results in a first on CNBC interview later on overtime. Welcome back. Apple closing higher for the week but down more than 20% from its 52 week high. Next week brings the company's worldwide developers conference where investors will be

looking for updates on its AI strategy, surge partners, developer fees, much more. Will it be enough to get the stock moving in the right direction? Well joining us now is Neelad Patel, Editor-in-Chief at The Verge and CNBC's Steve Kovac. And Steve I'm gonna kick this off with you especially as you get ready to head to San Francisco yourself. What is going to matter most come Monday? Yeah, everyone's looking for an AI answer, Morgan. What does that mean? What does that look like? Well, we got a report from Bloomberg a few weeks ago

where they said it's going to be able to tap into the AI models of Apple and use that to develop their own apps. That's not the most exciting thing in the world. But remember, the exciting stuff happened last year with the Apple intelligence announcement. That was supposed to spur that super cycle of iPhone upgrades, and Apple kind of whiffed on that one, and they weren't able to execute and deliver

on all those promises that they showed at WWDC. And so now you're gonna have a extra layer of skepticism, let's call it, over everything Apple announces because what they showed us last year didn't really materialize. So we'll see what they have on the AI front. It sounds a little more subdued though, guys. Nealey, how are you watching this?

What do you expect here, especially since AI has been a little bit of a trouble point for Apple? Because this is not just investors that are watching. It's also tech folk and developers and others that help to spur the innovation of the iPhone along. Yeah, I'm really paying attention to developers. Last year they thought Apple Intelligence would drive a super cycle of upgrades, that didn't happen,

but they managed to keep growth up because they have growth in their services line of business, which is all the transactions on the iPhone from developers they take a cut from. That's going away. Recent court rulings, recent regulatory positions around the world have meant that Apple can't force developers to use their payment services and take that 30% that drives services. I'm already hearing from big developers that drive a lot of revenue that they're going

to go look for alternative payment systems. Apple's got to show up at Worldwide Developers Conference and make a case to its developers that they should not only stay on the platform and develop using Apple's latest techniques, Google or Microsoft or anyone else's, but keep their revenue inside of Apple's payment ecosystem. I'm looking for a lot of news there

because if they don't, that money is moving. Neelay, for me, the big question of this WWDC is does Apple renounce its previous Apple intelligence announcement and reset and say okay now actually here's what we're going to do or do they keep chasing the promises they made last year and have thus far been unable to deliver on. I think Apple has adopted the sort of royal family approach to problems. Never complain, never explain. I'm expecting to hear nothing. I think that was going to be their move to talk about the models on device that developers can access, like Steve said, to talk about

the great new features of the redesigned operating systems, to talk about the redesign of the operating systems themselves, which will look visually different. I think they're going to try to layer on new announcements and say the past is the past, that stuff will come when it comes, and we're really excited about what we have today. And that has been Apple's strategy for a long time. I don't know how the developer ecosystem, the user ecosystem, or the market will react to that. Steve, what do you think, when you look at what Google's doing with Android, you know, the competitive threat certainly that's emerging as some users in China start to tap into AI and Apple certainly doesn't have it in Chinese language. You read my

mind, John. So what we saw this week in China was that the release of Apple intelligence in China seems to be delayed because the authorities there that have to kind of bless it before it can launch, they're playing game with the Trump administration right now and so they're not going to be able to launch that. As far as what they can do to kind of get people excited again, I agree with Neelai. It's like this is a developer's conference. This is supposed to show them that they're supposed to stick to this platform.

I don't know how good it's gonna be or it's gonna be a tough sell for them rather to say hey, use our language models instead of the ones you've been using, the better ones from the likes of OpenAI and so many others. One thing we should look for though is partnerships though. We heard last year at this very event

that they might use Google Gemini and incorporate that into Siri the same way they did for ChatGPT. Also, we heard Eddie Kew, the services boss, last month say they're thinking about Perplexity, the AI search engine which already cut deals with Motorola and supposedly they're gonna have one with Samsung later this year.

It's an excellent search engine. It does a lot of what Apple promised previously last year with Apple Intelligence. Maybe we start to see some more of those partnerships open up as we heard about last year. That is one opportunity investors can look for to get people saying, okay, they're taking this seriously and they're gonna partner until they can do it themselves.

All right, Steve, Neelai, thank you. We're gonna see you next week. Well up next, the first on CNBC interview with Samsara's CEO. He's going to discuss the software companies better than expected earnings, how tariffs are impacting his customers. And because you love the show and want even more Overtime, scan the QR code on your screen. Follow us on LinkedIn, where we'll post exclusive content. Overtime will be right back.

Welcome back to Overtime. Shares of Samsara falling as much as 11% today before pairing those losses into the close, ending up down just about four and a half. Investors partially looked in on a small, annual recurring revenue beat as a potential sign of some tariff-related caution from Samsara's customers, the Internet of Things companies,

otherwise posting a strong quarter across the board and guidance as well. Joining us now on our first on CNBC interview is Sanjit Biswas, Samsara's CEO and co-founder. Always good to see you, Sanjit. I wanna focus in on safety and productivity of large equipment. You actually spent quite a bit of time on this

on the call mentioning Sterling Crane in particular, and the effect of uncertainty on your customers really wanting to control as much as they can using your software. Give me a sense of what it is that customers are getting out of that software right now. Sure, well, first John, thanks for having me on. Sterling Crane is a great example.

They're a big crane rentals company up in Canada. Think the large industrial cranes used to build stadiums and other large facilities. For them, they're trying to be as efficient as they can with assets like those cranes, so they wanna make sure they're available, which means they're maintained correctly, there's no unplanned downtime,

and they wanna make sure they have the right number of them and in the right locations. They can do all of that with data, whether it's fault code intelligence that we're able to pull from the devices or just simply knowing about asset utilization and really how often these things are being used in the field.

So it's all about operating smarter using data. How is the uncertainty of these tariff windows and questions about the amounts, how is that affecting the way customers plan out exactly what they're going to spend on other things, including your software? So the world of physical operations has, it's very asset intensive.

We're talking about industries like construction, like the crane company I was referring to earlier, or even the Dallas Fort Worth Airport is a customer of ours and other kind of large asset heavy industries like that. So for them, they're very much tariff impacted. They're procuring a lot of equipment. And so they're really trying to be smart about those buying decisions and they want to drive up efficiency. So we play very well into that. All that being said, they're always just recalculating how to run their operations. These are businesses that have been around in many cases over 100 years.

So they're used to changes in the economic climate. They're just trying to be as smart as they can about how they operate. You've got a product and service that's kind of like Apple's AirTags, but for industrial equipment. And we've talked in the past about how that product sale leads to a longer tail of service possibilities.

What update can you give on the rate of deployment of those tags and the sort of business opportunities you're seeing crop up as they get deployed? So the tags have been very popular across different industries. They can be used for everything from locating lost or stolen goods to understanding where something is in a large job site, might be 40, 50 acre site,

to also just understanding utilization. So a lot of different use cases that have been very strong. And again, it's about pulling in data from the field, figuring out ways to really understand what's going on out there. I think it's early days for us. There's a lot of different types of equipment out in the field.

And that also includes not just industries like construction, but in service industries, they have to show up prepared. They have to have the right tools on board. So we're seeing a lot of customers pair this together with our telematics and safety offerings and really find a way to digitize their entire operation. How much is the desire to control insurance costs

factoring into what your customers are doing? How big a piece of your business would you say that is now? It's really significant. For us, we're selling a platform. Safety is a real cornerstone for us. In many cases, our customers, they spend tens of millions of dollars on accident or insurance payouts. They can reduce their risk in the field.

They see direct financial benefit, and they can simply keep their front line safer. It's a huge driver for us, but again, it's part of this broader digitization story we're seeing. Interesting look into an under digitized part of the economy, Sanjit Biswas. Thank you. Thanks. Oracle and Adobe are the big earnings in next week's calendar, but there is a lot more that can move markets. Up next, we're going to tell you what needs to be on your radar. And don't forget, you can catch us on the go by following the Closing Bell Overtime podcast on your favorite podcast app. We'll be right back With a Mata Health strong public market debut today coming just two weeks after hinge health

IPO is the prognosis moving for digital well-being companies well today John takes a timeout with a CEO whose company Almost went public a few years ago. Yeah Morgan Owen Tripp is CEO of included health It's a company that formed four years ago from the combination of Grand Rounds and Doctor On Demand. The company had been poised to IPO just as the financial markets got choppy just ahead of 2022. Included continues to focus on using technology systems to bring quality and lower costs to patient care in a way that combines approaches from Tripp's father, a doctor, and his mother, an innovator in education policy. My dad, as much as I love and admire him, his business was really about sort of one-on-one,

right? It was one patient at a time taking care of that person and moving on. My mom really was the system thinker, is the system thinker. So she was thinking at scale about how you transform whole educational systems and communities. And it's a nice story, but I also think it's true that I was really influenced by both of their thinking in arriving to where I am today. I like Ken Jenomata. Included Health is focused on providing services outside of traditional doctor's offices by

tackling inefficient areas in the health system where employers are frustrated. Tripp says Included is finding ways to add value and grow sustainably even as the overall digital health space has gone through a bit of a reckoning. What I'm most excited about is employers are leaning in and saying enough is enough. We're going to find those most effective high use case drugs, help reprice them, help deliver the care management, wraparound services that allow people to understand when to use those drugs, in what combinations,

over what period of time, with great medical support. I think that's gonna transform the curve of what an average American carries from a cost perspective on pharmacy. So the timeout takeaway, health shakeout. Venture capitalists for more than a year have been pulling back from digital health investments as shifting preferences in telehealth and GLP-1 drugs

have roiled the market. But at the same time, companies tackling niche pieces of the healthcare puzzle while avoiding capital intensive approaches have managed to thrive. Tripp told me this week he's optimistic now about the capital markets and that was before Omada today Morgan.

Interesting. Women's health and fertility still getting a lot of attention too. There are more big earnings on next week's calendar that should be on your radar. We'll get results from David Buster's, Jams Smucker, GitLab and GameStop on Tuesday. Wednesday brings Chewy, Oracle and Victoria's Secret. And Adobe and RH are Thursday's highlights. On the economic front, we will get wholesale trade on Monday. The Small Business Optimism Index on Tuesday.

Wednesday brings the big report of the week, the Consumer Price Index. And Thursday we will get the May Producer Price Index and weekly jobless claims. We'll also get U.S. government bond auctions for three-year, 10-year, and 30-year Treasury notes, which, John, given the volatility we've seen in Treasury yields are going to be ones to watch.

The other one to watch is Robinhood because we're going to get an SPX rebalancing announcement probably in the next hour tonight. A lot of folks expecting that Robinhood could be added to the S&P. We'll see. In Oracle and Adobe, we're going to get a hardware and software look at AI progress off the cycle of most of them that should be interesting as well. All right. Well, that's going to do it for us here at Overtime.