Club Shay Shay - Allen Iverson & Al Harrington

Episode Date: August 23, 2021

On episode 33 of Club Shay Shay, Shannon welcomes in two guests: former NBA players Al Harrington and Allen Iverson. Iverson recently partnered with Viola—the cannabis company Harrington founded—for a new line of A.I.-themed products. The two discuss how the perception of cannabis has changed since they were in the league, and Harrington talks Shannon through the excitement and challenges of growing a business. Iverson and Harrington also discuss their roles in NBA history, from Iverson’s influence on player fashion with his baggy clothes, cornrows and arm sleeve to Kwame Brown’s career and meeting Michael Jordan.#DoSomethinB4TwoSomethin & Follow Club Shay Shay:                                                                 https://www.instagram.com/clubshayshayhttps://twitter.com/clubshayshayhttps://www.facebook.com/clubshayshayhttps://www.youtube.com/c/clubshayshay Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoicesSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Make sure to listen to the Good Morning Football podcast Monday through Friday on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts. All my life, been grinding all my life. Sacrifice, hustle, pay the price. Want a slice, got the roll of dice. That's why all my life I've been grinding all my life. All my life, been grinding all my life. Sacrifice, hustle, pay the price. Want a slice, got the roll of dice. That's why all my life I've been grinding all my life. I've been grinding all my life. Hello, welcome to another edition of Club Shea Shea. I am your host, Shannon Sharp, and I have two guys stopping by the club today for a drink and conversation. One is a 16-year NBA vet.

He's the CEO and co-founder of Viola, Al Harrington, and the other is an NBA legend, 11-time All-Star MVP, three-time All-NBA, four-time scoring champ, three-time Steel champ, Hall of Famer and Rookie of the Year, Mr. Allen Iverson. You know him as AI. How you doing, guys? What's happening, Shane? What's up, OG? I'm good, bro.

How y'all feeling today, bro? I'm good. I'm medicated. I'm chilling. Okay, you guys got a special announcement you guys want to make. Take it away, Al. Hey, man. So, really honored and super excited to be doing a partnership with...

How can I explain this this dude, man? Like, he means so much to me, to our culture, to, you know, all the ballers that came up behind him. You know what I'm saying? So just being able to work with him and be able to, you know, create a business opportunity is just amazing. So we're going to launch some Allen Iverson products in the cannabis space. We're going to launch some Allen Iverson products in the cannabis space. We're going to do THC products, which would be like flower pre-rolls, vapes and concentrates.

And then on the CBD side, you know, we're going to do some topical teachers and capsules. You know what I'm saying? You know, we're always constantly trying to, you know, create products for athletes, by athletes, because we know what we put our bodies through and when you think about him he was a warrior you know what i'm saying throughout his career you know obviously played through unbelievable amounts of injuries and you know when we think about the ways that we have to even myself i played through a lot of injuries and yourself yeah even you and the things that we had access to um to me were very very harmful, you know what I'm saying, to deal with, you know, the opioids and all the prescription drugs.

But now, you know, cannabis is now being viewed through another lens, you know, and we think that we have products that will be very beneficial to athletes. So just really excited for this partnership. All right. A.I., what made you want to partner with Viola, Al? Obviously you know Al. What made you want to get involved with this company? It was definitely Al.

His vision. I could just basically hear the excitement in his voice when he called me about it. And, you know, when he explained to me everything that he was trying to do, I was on board. You know what I mean? Because it felt like an honor to help him develop something and make it better than what it is now. And for one of his dreams to come true and, you know, for me to have the opportunity to help him in any way, you know, I was all for it.

You know what I mean? Me and him got a great relationship, and it just felt like the right thing to do. Al, what made you decide to get into this space? You tried other things. You tried a restaurant, tried hotels. What made you decide to go into this space? Because you were ahead of your time.

It was my grandmother. Okay. You know, now, 11 years ago, I was able to convince my grandmother who was 79 years old at the time to, you know, come see me play when I was playing in Denver. Okay. And when she got there, I didn't know at the time but you know, she was dealing with a lot of different ailments and you know, I I bought a bag up for her and she opened it and took all these pills. And I was just like, grandma, what's going on? Why are you taking so much medication? And she gave me the long list of, you know, I always say like the black grandmother ailments,

right? She had high blood pressure, diabetes, glaucoma. And when she said glaucoma, I was telling her about an article I was reading literally two days before she got there about how cannabis helped with glaucoma patients. So finally started telling her about an article I was reading literally two days before she got there about how cannabis helped with glaucoma patients. So finally started telling her about it. And she just asked me, she said, well, what is cannabis? And I said, it's marijuana weed. And she's like, reefer? She's like, well, I ain't smoking no reefer.

You ask your mom. So I was like, well, grandma, this is medical. Doctors prescribe it. You know, you should give it a try. She told me no. But this was a guy, I feel like God was working. Right. You know what I'm saying?

The next day, I come home from shoot around, and she's literally in the kitchen complaining about how bad her eyes hurt. So I just said, Grandma, why don't we just try the cannabis? It'll be our secret. I won't tell nobody. Let's see what happens. So she said yes, and went to the dispensary.

My boy did. Bought back a strain called Vietnam Kush. We put it in a volcano bag of all things. So just to let you know, I know nothing about smoking. Had her try it. She hit it two, three, four times. And I'm looking at it, and I'm like, all right, grandma, that might be enough. So I took her downstairs.

I went and took a nap because I had a game. Woke up before I, you know, jumped in the shower. So let me go check on her. So I go downstairs. The door is closed. Sooke up before I, you know, jumped in the shower. So let me go check on her. So I go downstairs. The door is closed. So I open the door, you know, knock on the door. I don't hear nothing. Knock again.

And I open the door. Her back is to the door and she's looking down. And I just said, Grandma, how you feeling? And she turned around, man, and she was crying tears. She said, I'm healed. She said, you know, I haven't been able to read the words in my Bible in over three years. Wow. And it changed me at that moment. You know, I went in been able to read the words in my Bible in over three years. Wow. And it changed me at that moment.

You know, I went in there, I hugged her. You know, she was crying. She made me start crying. And, you know, she was just testifying, saying how everything was so bright and everything was so clear. And that's what inspired me to learn more about cannabis. And eventually, you know, we got our first license. And, you know, Viola is my grandmother. Right. You know, we named the company after. I thought you was gonna say

you opened the door and you found grandma hitting it again without you. That's now. Hey, obviously, hey, when you play as long as you guys play and you playing, you know, you play on a Monday night, you play, might play-to-back, you get two days off, and then you play Thursday, Friday, and you're playing these games, the up and down, the 35, 40 minutes a night AI for you. Do you wish that the NBA, because it seems to be there's a shift in how we view marijuana now, do you wish there would have been that shift back then? Do you believe guys could have played better, played longer, had they had this substance instead of the narcotics and the pills and the injections that they were forced to take back then? Do you believe guys could have played better, played longer, had they had this substance instead of the

narcotics and the pills and the injections that they were forced to take back then? I don't know exactly, but I think it should have been more of a conversation. Right. You know what I mean? More of a conversation. Instead of it being

something so negative. Right. You know what I mean i i think it should have been looked at another way and you know the the most important thing is our health obviously correct you know what i mean um and you know obviously it's to each his own with everything that uh that you do but you know a lot of people just from hearing from al and different people you know they felt like, you know, it could have added more years to their career and did a lot of things for them as far as healing from night to night. So I don't know, man, like I said, I'm getting education from Al and, you know what I mean, just listening to different things that, you know, he tell me

about how it, you know, can help people. And I'm all for that. You know what I mean? If I can have a chance, an opportunity to help somebody and make their career go, you know, a couple years longer, you know, get people to heal the best way that they can, then I'm all for it. You know what I mean? I just felt like it was a great idea idea a great opportunity to help a partner of mine you know what i mean i'm looking forward to the results of everything but al you just did al you did something very unique because you're not one of these guys says okay i'll you know i got some money i'll be the front and that's it you rolled up your sleeve you found out about it from picking the seeds and where to go and the different types of strands and what would be best for you in the business that you were trying to go in a lot of

people don't do that why were you so like you know what i need to know everything there is to know about this business so when people ask me this i can tell them that when they ask me that i can tell them this and i can go into great detail and tell them why this is a good a good substance for them. Well, to be honest, you know, when I started this 10 years ago, this is my 10 year anniversary, bro. It wasn't I didn't have an option to be in the face of. Right. It wasn't popular. Right. You know what I'm saying? To be honest, you know, yeah, it was too taboo. I mean, honestly, if I asked Chuck 10 years ago to go in a weed company he probably looked at me like i was crazy you know what i'm saying like that's that's how serious it

was during that time and i mean for me my financial advisor literally dropped me because i made the investment in the cannabis right he literally told me he wasn't going to help me launder money he wasn't going to jail behind helping me start a cannabis company it just wasn't popular back then i had to do it all myself. You know what I'm saying? And even from the standpoint of, you know, hiring attorneys and different things like that, my first attorney that I hired, man, like everything he told me to do was the wrong thing. Right. You know what I'm saying? Like, thank God I knew how to read and understand and be able to, you know, interpret, you know, different contracts and legislation

that actually got me to this point where I am today. You know what I'm saying? But anything, what I've learned just in my career is being an entrepreneur, like if anything that you're going to put your money and time into, you're going to have to put blood, sweat and tears into it if you're going to get something out of it. You know what I'm saying? And being that and during that time, like, you know, I was afraid that if people found out, I might lose my contract. Like it was just different then.

And it was, but you know, but I had to literally do everything myself. And you know, obviously it made me a monster in the game. You know what I mean? Like now I am a cannabis expert. You know what I'm saying? I'm a thought leader. And you know, we're really breaking down barriers

every single day, you know, as're really breaking down barriers every single day, you know, as a company and me personally as an entrepreneur in this space. Some of the best restaurants are owned by chefs because they're the ones doing the cooking. They understand what the clientele is going to like, what they need, you know, what they prefer. So you were in the fields. So you went, so how did you know to go about saying,

you know what, I really need to know everything? And you admitted that I had to do this with a veil of secrecy So you went, so how did you know to go about saying, you know what, I really need to know everything. And you admitted that I had to do this with a veil of secrecy because it was so taboo. People didn't look at marijuana then like they look at it now. Right. Well, I had to be like, to your point, like I had to know everything because at the same time, like cannabis is still federally illegal. Right. Right? So I couldn't put, you know, all that I've worked for, you know,

all the net worth that I was able to get, my reputation, I couldn't put it in the hand of somebody else. Right. I had to know exactly what was going on. You know what I'm saying? And why I was making certain decisions and where our money was going

and how we were paying taxes and all these different things. You know what I'm saying? So to your point, yes, a chef, you know what I'm saying? If you want to run a restaurant, you need to know every part of that restaurant to make sure you don't lose any. Right. You know what I'm saying? So I learned that early in the game. Like once again, my old financial advisor, one of the things he used to challenge me with every time because as NBA players or as professional athletes, you know, we get a business deal every week. Right. Right. So, you know, a lot of times I would bring deals

and want to do it, he would say no. And then finally he told me like, you really want to do this deal? You do the due diligence yourself, you do the research. And that's what really opened my mind. I was 28 years old when that happened, you know what I'm saying? And ever since then,

that's how I conducted myself in business. And I was able to take pretty much, you know, we're athletes, you know, the way we grind and, you know, and how regimented we are and different things like that. I took all of everything that made me a 16 year pro and bought it into this world. And that's why we're thriving. You know what I'm saying? Because we're diligent. You know what I'm saying? We militant and we get shit done. You good, bro. You good. But AI.I., you can attest to this. Everybody got great business ideas with your money. And the thing that you have to understand, Allen, I'm sure you found this out, is that with people like, oh, he going into a business, he don't really

know. So we might be able to steal a dollar here, steal a dollar there. I mean, he ain't going to know. He worried about something else. So let's take advantage of him. A.I., I'm sure you tried to open up a business. What is some of the advice that you know, if I were to, you know, you're trying to explain to someone like, okay, you want to open up a business. This is what you need to do. That's it. That's

basically the problem that I had a lot when I was playing, you know what I mean? Because I was I was dibbling and dabbling and a lot of things and you know, I was dibbling and dabbling in a lot of things and, you know, I wasn't as serious as I was with those things, like I was with basketball. Correct.

You know, a lot of times during my career, you couldn't tell me that it would come to an end. You know what I mean? So I always, I always felt like, you know, once I retired, you know, the things that I get involved with, you know, that's a job. Every single day, like it was being an NBA basketball. Correct.

You know what I mean? I think that's the most important thing for anybody that's trying to do anything. You got to put your blood, sweat, and tears into it, like I said, and make sure you're watching everything to make sure it's done the way you envisioned it, the way you wanted it to turn out and be successful. Alex says cannabis is going to be a $70 billion industry by 2028. It's a $24 billion business as we sit here today in 2021. But you know, with anything, when it comes to businesses, normally minorities are on the outside looking in, even though, you know with anything, when it comes to businesses, normally minorities are

on the outside looking in. Even though, you know, when they had the war on drugs, it was the minorities that were going to jail. It was the minorities that were getting the harsh sentences and suffering the penalties. So how do minorities gain access to a business that now people see that are profitable? You're going gonna have big tobacco big farmer trying to come in and overtake it yeah so the way we're going to do it is you know one of the things that we advocate for at viola is you know for obviously inclusion right and it's through a lot of these social equity programs uh right now cannabis is very very very expensive to partake in because you know right now you can't get loans. Any

traditional ways of, you know, starting a business is not accessible to us right now, right? You have to either get it from, you know, private people, family offices, and that comes down to resources and relationships, right? A lot of these social equity programs are, you know, catered to giving them to people that were recently incarcerated, all these different things. And what makes it tough is because, you know, if somebody was just recently incarcerated, you know, how do you make an investment into this person where, you know, they're going to be majority, they make all the decisions, all these different things. So what some of the things we're working on at Viola is we have an incubator program where

we're trying to teach, you know, the people that actually come through our program ways to, you know, be able to, you know, get into the business and actually be successful in the business. Right. Because it's obviously overly regulated. The legislation constantly changes. And it's just very difficult to actually, you know, be successful in this space. But what we're going to fight for is for that opportunity either way. You know, a lot of times these states, you know, usually give out all these licenses and they give out social equity after the fact. And in basketball terms, I look at it as like, it's like spotting the warriors from two years ago,

a 30 point lead to start every game. Right. It's impossible for us to win. Right. You know what I'm saying? What black people have shown constantly is we are masters of making something out of nothing. If you give us a true fair shot shot opportunity we can compete with the best of them right and that's what we're fighting for and that's what viola is going to do and that's what i'm really excited for bringing alan into this family and into this into this purpose you know what i'm saying because you know what we're doing is we're giving people hope and we're giving them you know we're giving them something to aspire for we're inspiring them to really go out and go after this

because this is generational wealth at risk for our people. You know, there's obviously industries before this, rice, sugar, cotton, alcohol, the lottery. These are all things we started. We pioneered those things and we have no ownership, but we can't allow this to happen with cannabis. 85% of drug arrests, like you just mentioned, in black communities is always

cannabis related. The one thing that I know that I've been in the game for 11 years, I still haven't met any black farmers that own thousands of acres of cannabis and I haven't met any of them that own trucking companies. So all I'm saying is that all those things had to happen before they hit our community and none of those people

were ever affected. It was only us. So we just feel like right now we got to make a stand and we got to make sure that we get our piece of the pie. And that's what I'm fighting for every single day. So are you telling us we started the numbers game that they be playing the cash three and the cash four? We started playing that. I think you remember we used to play that

at the club, you know, and locked us up for it. And they locked us up for that, too. It's crazy. But as you mentioned that weed is still federally regulated, how do you get it off the federal control list? Because, I mean, if so many, if, you know, you're making billions and billions off of it, what's going on here?

I think it's just a matter of time, man. I think the government, as you know, this is what they do, right? They just got to figure out how do they tax it, how do they get their cut. How do they get their cut? And then the main. How do they get their cut? And then they also have to figure out how do they regulate it, right, and regulate it consistently across all markets.

Well, I think that it's probably going to end up being just like liquor, where they're going to allow each state to kind of have their own nuances or whatever but you know we have Chuck Schumer um you know Cory Booker we have people that are definitely out pushing for federal legalization and you know I think that it's coming sooner than later you know I think the first thing that will happen will be federal decriminalization which will allow each state to make their own rules around how they want cannabis to be, you know, in that state. Right. And then after that, federal come right behind it.

Do you think America would be surprised at how many of their best athletes smoke cannabis? They would be very surprised. I personally, I personally think that there's 80 plus percent of the NBA players that use cannabis in some shape, form or fashion. I want to just say that like most times when you hear about someone using cannabis, the first thing you think about is them smoking a bomb or that, but cannabis has evolved so much past that now, right? To the point where, like I said, you know, now we have all these other different ways to deliver cannabis, whether it's a vape pen, whether it's

an edible, whether it's a tincture, whether it's capsules, you know what I'm saying? Whether it's a topical cream. It's all these different ways that players can now use cannabis to benefit them for recovery and just overall wellness. When, if I said, Al, you could get four people

you could smoke with, dead or alive, give me the four you're choosing. A.I. This ain't smoking. I want to smoke with you. Hey, we definitely going to have to be at the house. I want to smoke with Bob Marley. We definitely going to have to be at the house. I want to smoke with Bob Marley. And I wouldn't mind smoking with Barack Obama.

I want to watch him inhale. Wow. That'd be a nice group. That's a nice group. That's a nice group. I think I don't know. I think I could get you. A.I. say he did it 26 years. I think I can get AI. Let's get to some sports.

AI you had you did it all you were Mr. Basketball. Mr. Football at Newport, right? You from Newport, am I correct? Yeah, you from Newport. Newport. Newport, yeah. Michael Vick, Sweet Pea, all y'all from down in that area.

Right, right. Let me ask you this. Had you not chosen basketball, do you think you could have been as good an NFL player as you were an NBA player? Shannon, and this is like a bucket list moment for me because Shannon Sharp is asking me a question about football. So right now, I'm already, when I go home

and I see the guys I grew up with, I'm going to brag about this situation right here. I appreciate you asking me about football. But not being cocky, not being arrogant, I think, no, I know that I would have been a better player in football than I was in basketball. And that's not disrespecting basketball guys. That's not disrespecting the game that that that's done so much for me.

I mean, I'm a household name. I'm a Hall of Famer in that in that sport. But football was my first love. And at the same time, Shannon, you know, if I would have had to get on the gridiron, then I wouldn't never stop lifting weights after high school. You know what I mean? If you would have seen a whole totally different physique, I might be looking like you or something.

But I would have had to. I would have had to. I would have had a short career. You know what I mean? Basketball, I just didn't like weights because I was too happy. Football. I know I would add out had to live and then you can you can ask anybody from Virginia and and they would tell you Shannon that, you know, hands down. I was I would have been better. been better in football. So that was my first love. So you would have been a Russell Wilson, Kyler Murray, Lamar Jackson, Michael Vick. You, you was Michael Vick before Michael Vick. All you got to do is ask Mike. And then, and then what's, what's, what's wild about what you're saying. And that, that, that lets me know about definitely where I've been know about

your, your sports IQ, but you know, that's how I was as a basketball player. about definitely what I've been know about your sports IQ. But, you know, that's how I was as a basketball player. You know what I mean? I wanted to add some of Michael Jordan game, add some of magic, be fast like Isaiah, rebound like Barkley, be dominant like Shaq. You know what I mean? Do it all on the court. Like, you know, you know, the guys that do everything, not just one particular thing on the basketball. I didn't want to have no weaknesses out on the court.

So I tried to implicate all of those guys' game in the minds. And that's what I would have did in football. You know what I mean? I would have wanted to be accurate like Aaron Rodgers and have the arm like Aaron Rodgers. But I definitely would want to run like Russell. I definitely would want to run like Lamar Jackson or Mike Vick, you know what I mean?

I just wanted, you know, in basketball, I didn't want the opponent to feel like they could do just one thing to shut me down. I wanted to have a variety of things that I could counteract with, you know what I mean? When they try to take something away from me and it would have been the same thing in football. it means just the way you change the game at tight end you know tight end is not playing the game nope like you know you played the game you know what

I mean it was like a wide receiver playing tight end you know what I mean and that's how you change the game and that's what I would have tried to add to my football game was different parts of greats and try to put it in one game and be out of that. Al, you came directly out of high school. Did you know that that was something that you always wanted to do when you're growing up? Obviously, you were probably taller than everybody else and you wanted to play in the NBA. When did you realize like like you know what i ain't going to college i'm going straight from high school to the nba so i mean i i don't tell my story enough but believe it or not i didn't start football with my first love too okay right and i wanted to be a defensive end i played i played defensive

end and offensive tackle uh when i was a freshman in high school, I was the worst player. Bro, offensive tackle, yeah, yeah. Bro, that's left side, bro. That's where all the money at. For sure. But I didn't hoop until I was a freshman in high school. I was 6'4". I had moved. So when I got there, they see this

big, tall kid. They're like, oh, you're going to play basketball. So I was the worst player on my freshman team. My sophomore year, I transferred to an all-basketball school. I don't know why I did that. I just decided to say, forget football. I'm going to play basketball only. I was probably the worst player my sophomore year, too. But between my sophomore and my junior year, man, I just dedicated myself to the gym. And my game, my sophomore and my junior year, man, I just dedicated myself to the gym. And, like, my game just, like, I just got nice out of nowhere.

Right. And to be honest, like, I didn't have hoop dreams as a kid. Like, I thought I was going to go to Notre Dame and play for the New York Giants. That's what I wanted to do. Okay. Okay. And next thing you know, bro, like, I'm a junior. I'm killing.

I'm going into the summer, going into my senior year, and I was like top 25. I got that good that fast. And it was certain names on that list I needed to go get. And they were all at the Nike All-American camp. Okay. So instead of me, I was an Adidas kid,

but I said, I'm going to Nike to go get those kids. And I went to Nike, and I ended up being the MVP of the camp. And I had just told the guy that was training me, I said, yo, if you can get me to be in the number one play in the country, I'm going to go pro out of high school. And bro, that's literally how I made the decision. Like I had no idea, bro.

It was just, I just got really good out of nowhere and ended up being the number one play in the country. And you know, the rest is history. Wake up with football every morning and listen to my new podcast, NFL Daily with Greg Rosenthal. Five days a week, you'll get all the latest news, previews, recaps, and analysis delivered straight to your podcast feed by the time you get your coffee.

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And I don't think, me personally, I don't think Kwame was a failure. You don't make it to the NBA, the number one overall pick. Now, maybe some people say, well, he wasn't a Hall of Famer. He wasn't this or that. But what, if you could have given, what do you think some of the things that happened to Kwame? Because watching him, he's athletic. He could run. He was nimble. He can run. He was nimble.

He was quick. Why don't you think he enjoyed the level of success that many think he was destined to have? Well, from what I know about the situation, because I know a couple guys that was on the Wizards when he got drafted, was that he went to a veteran team where I guess that they didn't really want him there.

Right. You know, I think that what he was saying was the truth. Like he thought that he was supposed to go to the Clippers for Ellen Brand. Right. So those veterans that, you know, Michael Jordan want to win right now. Right. Right. He don't want to develop a high school kid.

Right. Yep. So from what I hear, it was just like he didn't get a lot of support. You know what I'm saying? From the from the vets. And, you know, that's that's a big thing, man. And I will say, like, as much as I wanted to be a top five pick, you know, God blessed me to be picked at the 25th pick because he put me on a team full of veterans

that taught me how to be a man, how to be a pro. You know what I'm saying? What they instilled in me, the foundation they gave me, was the reason why I was able to play 16 years and why I had a respectable career was because of the things that those guys taught me. And from what I was able to play 16 years and why I had a respectable career was because of the things that those guys taught me. And from what I understand from the outside looking in, from some stories, was that he never got that.

Because when you think about it to your point, he had everything, but what he lacked was confidence. And sometimes you need vets to give you that confidence. You know what I'm saying? The one thing I'll just talk about, Allen, is like from how I seen it because I was in Indiana when he was at the height in Philly, when he was giving us 40 every night,

but he had all these guys around him that you could tell they believed in him, bro. You know what I'm saying? It was something about the way he gave him a high five, the way he patted him on the ass that made them willing to run through a wall for him. You know what I'm saying? And that's what I think that Kwame never got. And that's the reason why I think his career

started off that way. I totally agree. I don't believe you could... 18? Yeah. 18? Yep. 18 years old. Number one pick in the NBA. Draft. I mean, if that's not pressure,

because, I mean, even if you go lottery, that's big-time pressure. Straight out of high school, no college experience, to step on that stage like that, I applaud him. You know what I mean? And I played with Kwame. I love Kwame the person.

I played with him. You know what I mean? Everybody talk about, you know, they didn't know Kwame was like this, and, you know, how outspoken he is now and everything. Kwame been like that. You know what I mean? And something, I don't know when it was and when it happened, some lit a fire up under him and it all came out of him.

But, you know, Kwame's smart, very intelligent, man. You go on his podcast and you listen to him. He got a lot of great points. You know what Kwame's smart, very intelligent, man. You go on his podcast and you listen to him. He got a lot of great points. You know what I mean? And I just feel like, you know, he was put in a tough position, man, being the number one player in the NBA at that young of an age. You know what I mean? And like Al said, going to a squad where they were trying to win.

Right. They had black jeans on that squad. You know, any team you're on, you're trying to win. Like, they had black jeans on that squad. You know, any team you're on, you're trying to win now. You know what I mean? And it's just, I didn't like the way it turned out because a lot of guys that he did get into it with is guys that I love and respect. You know what I mean?

So I didn't like the whole fiasco anyway. And, you know, it gave me a bad feeling anyway. And I just think, you know, Kwame did what he did. He was successful. I know him as a person and as a teammate. I know he had fun when he played. He enjoyed himself. And Kwame had a lot of great moments.

Now, you would expect a number one player to, like Shannon said, end up being a Hall of Famer, an All-Star. Yes, yes, yes. At least an All-Star. Maybe if you don't make the Hall of Fame, at least an All-Star. Yes. Right. And it didn't happen for him.

But, you know, a bust, I can't really say that, man. you know, a bus. I can't really, I can't say that, man. I mean, number one player. I mean, number one pick on all the beautiful things he's done for his family and for himself. I applaud him, man.

You know what I mean? I love Kwame Brown. Guys, we're all ex-professional athletes. And you know the number one thing. People can say, well, it's size, it's this, it's that. It's confidence. We've seen guys that are tall.

We've seen guys that can run and can lift all these weights. But if you're not confident when you step out there on the court or the field, it don't mean nothing. That's it. That's it. That's it in a nutshell. If you don't have the confidence, I don't care if you're LeBron James himself. You can be Michael Jordan, you know

what I mean, with all the athletic ability in the world, you know what I mean, and if you don't believe in yourself, and that's in anything in life, that's anything, you know what I mean, you behind the eight ball anytime you don't believe in yourself, you know what I mean, my mentor used to

teach me all the time when I was young, he used to say, if the time when I was young. He used to say, if it's you and me, it's me. You know what I mean? That's not cocky. That's not arrogance or anything like that. That's the belief. That's you believing in the talent that God gave you.

You know what I mean? And respecting the talent that he gave you by believing that you're the best. You know, I stepped on the court with number 23 before both of them. Right. You know what I mean? Both of the number 23s. And when I was on that court that night, I felt like in my heart I was the best player on the floor. Right. And a million people would say otherwise. But all that mattered was how I felt.

Right. You know what I mean? You're going to always know who number 23 is in black and red, you know, when he leave up out of this gym tonight. But you're? You know who number 23 is in black and red, you know, when he leave up out of this gym tonight, but you're going to know who number three is too. And that's just how I approached it. You know what I mean?

Cause once you don't have the confidence and bow down, the battle was already lost. You're in trouble. Go ahead. In the trouble from stuff on the floor. I'm just, I'm just agreeing with him. You know what I'm saying? Confidence is everything.

You know what I mean? Like, you can have it all. But if you don't believe in yourself, you know what I mean? It don't matter. Right. Shannon, I thought we were a super team. That's how I believed in myself. Because I'm saying you put four other pros with me.

Why can't we beat anybody? Right. Them pros I'm on the floor with. Right. And they like you got janitors. I believed in them like they believed in me. Right. Well- They felt like every night in

that foxhole, as long as they saw me in that foxhole, we had a chance to win. Hey, I think- And I felt- Hey, everybody knows what you did on the court, but you also change the rules because you had everybody coming. If they were 150 pounds, they were wearing a t-shirt that was bit shat. They were wearing jeans that were foot calm alone. You started that you started the cornrows. Nobody was had cornrows. Nobody was tatted up. My teammates hated me for that. You started the cornrows. Nobody had cornrows. Nobody was tatted up.

My teammates hated me for that. They were going to big and small, and I would get there before them and buy up all of the stuff. So they couldn't stand all the big men because I would buy all the stuff from big and tall. And I was just – I didn't never think that I was doing nothing wrong. I was dressing like the guys from my neighborhood right it was just it was just at some point it it turned from Levi's to

Jabo's and guests and all you know because I couldn't afford right you know what I mean and and and I was getting beat down a lot um and I think it's kind of bittersweet because if you look at today's game in every sport, you see guys dressing and looking the way they want to look. Some people can disrespect it and it might not be their look, but people are comfortable. They're supposed to be able to come to work comfortable. Right.

And like for me, I never went to the basketball court when I was growing up in a suit. You know what I'm saying? I wear them now because, you know, my lady like when I wear suits.

But back then, for me, I was, I didn't mean anything bad or anything like that. I was being me. Right. And I felt like that.

What's wrong with being you and everybody else taking up? So when, so when the commissioner, when the commissioner changed the rule, even though he didn't say it was the Allen Iverson rule, you got to work, sport coat and things of that nature. No oversized t shirt, no FUBU jeans size 50 when you're a size 32.

What went through your mind? God bless them. May he rest in peace. I love him to death because we became real good friends towards the end of my career. And I just remember going in there to meet him about that dress code situation. Shannon, man, and I had on all baseball gear. You know what I mean? And he said something. I think I had on Indian stuff. And he was like, what's, you know,

what's up with this major league baseball stuff you got on? And I'm like, man, it's just clothes. You know what I mean? And I sat in that meeting and I thought I may have been in there 30 minutes and it seemed like I was in there getting chastised for hours. And I really felt like they changed that rule because, you know, once everybody seen that I was dressing like that, guys were like, well, damn. That's how, you know, I want to dress.

That's how I feel. Yeah. Where was we going afterwards, Shannon? You know, we would go from the gym and go right to the club. Right. Straight up. I'm not going to wear no suit to the club. Right.

Straight up. I'm not going to wear no suit to the club. So you was that bridge because everybody saw Michael Jordan suited and booted. He had a suit on. He had the tie on, the nice gaiter, the nice shoes. Okay, Michael Jordan. And then AI comes along in 96, and he got on 4X t-shirt and FUBU, and he tatted up. They're like, well, hold on.

I want to be like this. This is more comfortable than being like that. t-shirt and FUBU and he tied it up. They're like, well, I don't know. I want to be like this. This is more comfortable than being like that. It's not the it's not the it's not the it's not the clothes, right? You know, just like when I got when when some guys, you know, you said ever seen Reservoir Dogs. Yep. When they robbed the jewelry store or anybody go rob some banks, they don't never have on sweatpants and jeans.

They come in there with suits on. You know what I mean? It's a stereotype. Right. It's inside the clothes. Right. There you go. You know what I mean?

Do you understand? It's the purpose. But you started the sleeve. Wasn't nobody wearing no sleeve. Yeah. You started the sleeve. I'm like, why he got that on? I'm like, what's wrong?

Was the sleeve, was it just a fashion statement, or did you actually need the sleeve? It was an injury, and I had just got surgery on my elbow. Your bursa? It was an injury, and I used to have, I don't know, remember the cloth that they used to have in the training room. Yeah, they cut it and put it over your knees to keep down swelling and things.

There you go, there you go. And then I just said, okay, won't y'all just make me one? Right. And then it started to get so popular and I love it now. Like I love seeing guys in different sports, you know, have them on and whatever. Some guys wear them and don't even be injured. Right. One time I was watching the R. Kelly video

and the man had it on in the video, man. R. Kelly must have fell off the stage and hurt himself. The man got a sleeve on in the video. And I was really hurt then. I had to wear it. Right. Ended up turning the sleeve into a fashion, man. And today, when I look back on it, it's so cool. You see high school players, college players wearing it, even dudes playing rec league football.

I just think it's so cool and it's a blessing, man. I'm going to ask both of you this. Who do you think had the best draft class? We're going to start with 96. AIU is the number one pick. Kobe, Ray Allen, Steve Nash, Jermaine O'Neal, Stephon Mulberry. 84, Jordan, Stockton, Barkley, Malone, Sam Perkins. And then in 2003, you got LeBron, Wade, Melo, and Bosh. AI, you up first. First of all, Shannon, you already gave, you already said the best draft class because when you named ours, look how many players you named. And then you forgot some. You forgot Lorenzen Wright.

Did you say Kerry Kittle? No, I didn't say Kerry Kittle. Did you say Marcus Camby? Nope. Did you say Jay Wallace? Nope. Twan Walker? Man, did you say, I think you said Steve Nash.

Yeah, you, Kobe, Ray Allen, Steve Nash, Stephon Marbury, Jermaine O'Neal, Derek Fisher. But here's the thing, though. But here's the thing. You, Kobe, Ray Allen, Steve Nash made the haul. Jordan, Stockton, Barkley, Elijah Wan made the haul. Braun, Wade, Melo, Bosh will make the haul. I don't know.

I don't know. I don't know. Al, Al, you. You're a little too smart, know. Hey, I don't know. I don't know how you You look too smart That was good. I'm going to let Al. That was good. What did you think, Al?

I'm thinking you was going to know that we had so many good players and all-star players in there, but then you had to throw that Hall of Fame thing out there. Yeah, I like that one. You got that one. What did you think of that, Al? You got that one off. What do, man? I'm going to go 96.

You're going to take 96? I like that. Yeah, I mean, I think for me, like, that was my era. You know what I'm going to go 96. You're going to take 96? I like that. Yeah, I mean, I think for me, like, that was my era. You know what I'm saying? And they was just like, those are the dudes that I looked up to. You know what I'm saying? Remember, I came into the game late, you know? So for me, 96, I would say those guys had more of an impact

on the way I played the game than any of those other classes. AI, if you were playing – You know what I mean? When you got – see, when you, it's hard, man, when you got, and I'm not taking nothing away from Dwayne and Mello, because I love them guys on and off the court. But in the same thing with Elijah Juan and Mike, when you put LeBron in the class and you got Mike. Hard, man got Mike. Oh,

did not choose that class. They take about four or five spots by themselves. Exactly. That's cold. Monster. AI. If you if you were playing in today's game with the way the rules are now,

with no hand checking, with all the space on the floor, at your peak, how many points do you think you could average a game? People ask me this, and it sounds so arrogant, but it's the truth. The way they play now, and it's so wide open. Yeah. Definitely more than my highest average. So I think I have most average and the season was like 33, 33, five,

something and I lost the scoring title that year to the mama. Yeah. You know how great it was that- Right. For me to lose a title and I'm averaging 33. But definitely more than my highest average because it's too wide open. And with the floor spaced out like it is now,

it would have been harder to double team me like they was. And I don't know, but you still now, you can sit in the zone, can't you? Yeah. like they was and I don't know, but you still now, they can sit, you can sit in the zone, can't you? Yeah. See that's what I mean, I thought, I would think that it would be harder for me. Like when I was in college, all my teammates used to say,

man, well, you know, you're gonna have it good being that you don't have to deal with no more two threes, one three ones, no more boxing ones, you know what I mean? They gonna have to deal with no more two threes, one three ones, no more boxing ones. You know what I mean? They're gonna have to play you head up, you know, night in and night out for 48 minutes. And then ironically, somehow, all of a sudden, when I started winning a couple of scoring titles and this dude six feet, 165 pounds, you can't stop him. Then all of a sudden, the zone came into the NBA. You all remember that? A zone in the NBA, man. Yeah, they jump in and out

of the zone right now. Never play a zone in the NBA. I think that was some type of conspiracy, man. How many points, because a lot of people said he averaged 40, he averaged 50, he averaged 60. How many points do you think Jordan could average

in today's NBA? What's the most he ever had is 37 37 one. I so 40 easy. 40 easy. 4040 easy. Yeah, 40 easy. 40 easy. 40? 40 easy. Yeah, 40 easy. Like, 40 is easy. 40 will be easy for Black Jesus. Cuz Harden, I think Harden a couple of years ago averaged 36.

So you- Right. So you figured Jordan could average 40 with no problem. Man, Shannon, like when I talk about him like it's when I talk about him is different and a lot of times a lot of time is bad because I love him so much like it wasn't for him I

wouldn't had the vision I wouldn't be the Allen Iverson the basketball player today if it wasn't for him. Right. You know what I mean. So I feel and plus he was he was he was the best to me. today if it wasn't for him. Right. You know what I mean? So I feel, and plus he was the best to me. You know what I mean?

I definitely think he was the best. And I don't put LeBron in the conversation because I love him so much as a person and as a basketball player. You know what I mean? It's real real real personal when I'm being Michael Jordan don't have the personal relationship like me and LeBron LeBron, right? But those three LeBron, Mike and Kobe.

I never seen nothing better. I never seen. I never seen the player better than those two. I'm ask both of you guys and you add to that when he had when he average 37, he was doing it with twos. They weren't even shooting three-pointers like how they shoot now. You know what I'm saying? Just imagine if Michael decided to shoot six, seven threes a game like they do now. Like 40 would have been easy.

Oh, no question. See, I didn't even think about that. Well, let me ask you a question. When you first met Michael Jordan, both of you guys, what was it like to meet him for the very first time? You go ahead, Al. So for me, the first time was actually seeing him on the court with the Wizards or whatever.

So it was just in the game. And, you know, that game, I actually had a good game and you know, he started talking, you know, he called everybody a hoe. It was this hoe, so hoe, hoe, hoe, hoe. So finally I got to the point where like, you know, I know it was Michael Jordan, but I'm like, damn OG, you gonna keep calling me a hoe. He like, nigga, you a hoe.

I'm like. Yeah, he called me the little bitch. So I had to wear it. But after that game, you know, after that game, we went to an overtime. And I had 35 that game. He had 41. They won the game. And after the game, he signed some shoes and sent it to me after the game.

It was like, best wishes, keep playing hard and all that. And I didn't even ask him for them. So for me, it was like, you know, obviously, you know, I grew up a Knicks fan, but obviously everybody, you gotta like Michael Jordan at the end of the day. You know, it was just, you know, it was a surreal moment for me, but at the same time, you know, I went out there

and I competed against him for sure. Hey, I. First of all, I was a Bulls fan coming up because of him. Okay. But while he was in the league, man, I mean, I hated the Bulls more than any team in that league. I hated the Bulls. You know what I mean?

Like, once I got into the league and heard the way they talked to us, and you know what I mean? Like, they knew they was at the top of the mountain. And man, I'll never forget my first time I talked about it in my Hall of Fame speech. And I wasn't lying at all, man. He didn't look real to me. I know I was starstruck. I know I was starstruck because, like I said, I talked about the Charlie Murphy Hollywood story.

And he talked about Rick James and how Rick James walked in the room and he saw, like, the orange, like, his aura. Yeah. You know what I mean? Yeah. I saw that. Like, I looked at that man and he didn't look human to me. You know, I'm looking at him like, damn, he got on the Jordans.

You know, he don't even have on the NBA socks. You know, I'm looking at his knee brace, you know, on his shin. And I was like, man, it's him. You know what I mean? And my teammates, they teased me before the game because they were like, you're not going to play your game because, you know, Mike on the floor, your idol going to be out there on the floor. You're not going to play your game.

And I was starstruck. But when that ball went up and somebody hand touched it, it just went away. You know what I mean? It was showtime, time to dance. That's what I tell people. The very first time I met him, I was on an elevator. He was on there with his first wife, Juanita, back in Atlanta at the Super Bowl.

And I'm looking at him, and he's probably looking at me like, this dude, I know who he is. He's like, look how he's looking at me. I'm like, he's like he was levitating. He didn't look real. I'm like, man, this is Michael Jordan. It was like, I'm talking about, it's the closest thing. You know, in the Bible, they talk about how the disciples,

they saw G, and they're like, he don't even look, to this day, every time I see him, he don't look real. I've never been like that with a man before in my life. And I've met some big time, I've seen Samuel Jackson, man, from Samuel Jackson to Zane Zale. And Shaq, Kobe. But when it comes to that, he apart. He ain't real.

I'm right there with you. I understand exactly how you feel. The only time that I had an experience like that is I was coming in from an All-Star. I was coming in from somewhere at an All-Star game, and everybody walked up to me. They was excited because everybody didn't know how I feel about Michael Jackson. Right. Anybody that know me, like before the games and all that, I listen to Mike. You know what I mean?

I got to get up by listening to Mike. And he walked in the hotel, and I came in after. And everybody was like, Chuck, Michael Jackson just came in. And I felt faint, man. And I was so happy that I didn't see him, because I thought I was going to be all on the internet or whatever. I thought I was going to really pass out like one of them fans. You know what I mean?

That's how much I love that man, man. And I didn't even see him, and I felt bad about the song. He felt faint. I felt faint, bro. And I understood. I'm like, okay, now I understand what them fans be going through when they see him. Because you know Mike.

You jump on the stage and don't say nothing for a few minutes, right? And everybody just this man is not singing. Yeah, he's a letter simmer. He's a ego saying that he just come on stage. He just standing. He's a letter simmer. Just let that by let it man. Yeah, just they don't hate just keep the focus. Just let it simmer. Obviously when you when you grow up like we grow up, we all dream. Miami Vice was huge when I was growing up. And I just remember saying, I'm going to get me some money. I'm going to get me a Ferrari.

I'm going to get me a Rolex. I'm going to be crocking in tubs. I'm going to be dressing like that. When you were growing up, what were some of the things that you was like, when I get me some money? Oh, I'm getting that. Yeah, Chuck, me and my mom, me and my mom was always me and my mom was like, I don't know. Since I can remember five, six years, five, five or six years old, Me and my mom was always infatuated with jewelry.

Okay. Always. Since I was a small kid, five, six years old. And I remember being at Georgetown and Tupac, what was it, All Eyes on Me? Yep. Where he had the jewelry and the Rolex and all that. Yep. And I remember that album cover and I was telling my teammates,

like when I get drafted, you know what I mean? That's one of the things I'm gonna get, you know what I mean? Give me a Rolex and I'm gonna give me some jewelry like Tupac. And I think even like buying my mom a crib, I think obviously that was the best you know for me and my own but even with all the cars and all that like that was the best to me for that moment right there you know for to be so young and always love jewelry like that and to be able to afford it to get whatever i wanted and get my mom whatever she wanted you know because we were so infatuated with jewelry.

That was it. That was it for me. And for me, it was a Benz. I just always wanted a Benz, man. And, you know, obviously I didn't get drafted as high as I wanted to. So my first Benz I got was a CLK 430. That was the small two-door. And I'll never forget, man, I got it.

When I played that season, I brought it home for the summer, and I went to Seahawks, and I'm thinking I'm stunting on the campus. And I pull up, and my old high school point guard named Shaheen Holloway, I pull up and I get out. He's like, your big ass just got out of that little ass car. Hey, Al, listen. Let me see if you had this moment. When you first got it, when you first got it,

was you nervous in it, driving away like you thought you was going to wreck it or something? Hell yeah, bro. I couldn't even get out the drop. It was crazy. It was terrible. It just drove different. I thought I was going to wreck it gonna wreck i was driving i'm talking about straight up driving miss daisy man

i had both hands on the wheel seat pushed all the way up one no cool leaning back and all that i was so scared i was like i had never been in the business before hey you know what i mean hey we're gonna get you here we're gonna get you out of here on this. We can't let you go. You say you was in awe of Jordan, but you crossed that man up. How you going to cross that man up and then talk about you in awe of him in the same breath? Okay, because Shannon, the guy that taught me to cross over, was a walk-on at Georgetown. And he never played, never got in the game, but he the one that taught me to move

cuz he used to hit me with it at practice all the time. And my ego, I just put it to the side and said, look, man, you gotta teach me that. You gotta teach me to move. Taught me to move. And I used to always remember telling my family and my friends, my teammates, like if I got the opportunity that I was gonna telling my family and my friends, my teammates, like if I got the opportunity that I was going to try my move against the best player that I've ever seen play the game.

And it just, I'll never forget the moment, obviously, but I always hear that voice in my head when Phil Jackson said Michael on the switch and he stepped out and I was like, okay, have a moment and I'm not going to be scared of it. You know what I mean? I said I was going to do what I was going to do. So I'm going to try it. So when I tried the loop and he bit on the little one, that's when I said, oh yeah, he in trouble.

He bit on the little one. You said when I come under that big one. He told me one day I went to a, I went to a, I went to a Charlotte cause I live in Charlotte. So I went to a Charlotte Hornets game and he had me come in and we in the back and me and him just, you know, sitting back drinking and reminiscing or whatever.

And I was like, man, I love you, man. And he was like, you don't love me, you little bitch. man, I love you, man. And he was like, you don't love me, you little bitch. You was like, what the fuck? Man, and everybody in the room just bust out laughing. Man, it was crazy. Hey, congratulations, Al.

Viola. He was just a casualty at war, Shannon. Oh, he casualty at war? Yeah, that's all. Al, congratulations, man. Viola's doing big things. Congratulations on the business. AI, congratulations on the partnership. Hell of a career.

Hell of a career for both of you guys. Thanks for stopping by Club Shea Shea and giving me a couple of minutes of your time. Thanks, man. Love my brother. Appreciate it. All my life. Been grinding all my life.

Sacrifice. Hustle pay the price. Want a slice. Got the roll of dice. That's why. All my life. I've been grinding all my life. All my life.

Been grinding all my life. Sacrifice. Hustle paid the price. Won a slice. Got the roll of dice. That's why all my life I've been grinding all my life. Wake up with football every morning and listen to my new podcast, NFL Daily with Greg Rosenthal.

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