Club Shay Shay - Best of NBA News Part 2: Spurs PROBLEMS, Trae Young DECLINES option & Knicks NO SEX rule

Episode Date: June 21, 2026

Shannon Sharpe, Chad "Ochocinco" Johnson, and Joe "King Iso" Johnson bring you the Best of NBA on Nightcap! The crew  breaks down the brewing point guard controversy in San Antonio between De'Aaron Fox and Dylan Harper. Plus, Jordyn Woods drops the details on the Knicks no-sex rule and much more! Subscribe to Nightcap presented by PrizePicks so you don’t miss out on any new drops! Download the PrizePicks app today and use code SHANNON to get $50 in lineups after you play your first $5 lineup! Visit https://prizepicks.onelink.me/LME0/NI... 0:00 - Spurs committed to De'Aaron Fox23:30 - Isiah Thomas on Jalen Brunson being face of league46:57 - Trae Young declines player option (Timestamps may vary based on advertisements.) #ClubSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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From the ESPN's Mike Wright, the Spurs are committed to Deeran Fox. The Spurs remain committed to Fox as their franchise starting point guard. One Rough series essentially playing on one leg doesn't change that. The four-year, $229 million contract extension, Fox signed last summer,

kicks in next summer. So he goes from 37, point one to 49.8. He's scheduled to make $61 million in the final year of the deal in 2930. He'll be just 32 years of age. It's expected that calls for Harper's camp for his part

in the starting lineup will grow louder and louder going into the next season. But it's not an issue San Antonio needs to address right now. Fox contract won't become a potential eyesore until Wemby's upcoming rookie extension kicks in. And when

Spurs are looking the next summer to extend Castle or what should be a max deal. Joe, it's a great thing to have young talent. We saw this with OKC. They get Shay done. You get Jay Dub done. You get Chet done.

But damn. And, okay, you just gave Fox his money. Wimmy going to want his money. Castle going to want his money. Something you have to do with Harper. You can't have four guys on the max contract. I don't give a damn how much with it. How many can you have?

Probably three at the most. Three. Yeah, three at the most. But then you're going to end up having to get off one of them. But at the same time, if I'm San Antonio, you know, you kind of ride it to, you know, Fox, I mean, for the next couple years. Because you're going to be able to pay Wemby. You'll be able to pay Castle. But when Harper come up, somebody has got to go.

Somebody got to go. It's just period point blank. I'm saying. Hold on. You're going to have to go. You're going to have to pay him max dollars. You can't have four max guys on your team, Mojo. Yeah.

You'll be in the second tier. You'll be playing more. You'll be paying more in bonus and penalties than you were salaries. That means Fox would be going by that time. Yeah, well, I mean, you got to. But that's what I'm saying. They would have to move off one of them. That's what Joe is said.

They're going to have, and you can't have four. The max you can have is three. And then when you have three, because. I think O KC's going to lose Wallace. Wallace is going to want big bucks. Somebody going to pay Wallace big bucks. A guy that can shoot the three, a guy that can defend like that, Joe. I think they probably going to lose Dork versus that.

I think they're going to try to keep Wallace on. How are you going to keep it? Joe, he's going to want $25 million a year. Man, if I'm OKC, it's going to be hard to let Wallace go, bro. How do you got a choice, Joe? You remember now, you still got those three first round picks that you need to do something with. You have to let them go.

You have to trade that. Oh, yeah, you got one. And you got Caruso on big bucks and no whammy. I think. And you got Hart, what you're going to do? You're going to let Hart and Stein go? Hey, listen. At some point, man, you go, you go, some of them got, I think the most disheartening thing

with OKC is that they were hampered with injuries throughout this whole postseason. So you never really got to see what they were like at full stream. So I don't count them out. I still think, you know, they got a chance if they're healthy. If J.D.L. can stay healthy. but damn to lose Wallace and Dort those are your blue-collar hardworking guys bro if you lose them too hell damn

well you're gonna lose Dort you're not gonna pay I think you're not gonna pay Dort he's gonna be looking for 20-something million you're not paying him that there and Wallace is gonna be a wanting 20-25 million I don't see them paying him that there especially when you got Caruso on the number that you got him on I see you bro I see you I think uh I think I think when you look at it

if I'm Casey Wallace, you know, because, man, it ain't always, it ain't always a given that when you go to another team, bro, that you're going to shine like you think you are. You know what I mean? Like, would they pay me my money? Would they pay me that $5 million? Okay, that's what you're, it looks good to me. Hey, hey, because I know a guy named Joe Johnson say,

hey, man, you know, hey, Phoenix. No bad news was over here because there's something over there. I don't know if we're going to win in Atlanta like we do it in Phoenix, But I came up with a single-payer home. I didn't go to get that. I knew we weren't going to win like that. But see, here's the thing. When you are unrestricted,

when you're restricted free agent, it's like they'll tell all the teams, oh, man, y'all might not want to pay Joe because we're going to match anything that y'all going to give them. So that's to scare off. That's to scare the other teams off so they can come in and lowball you. You know what I mean?

Yeah, of course you. So it's times where you do. Like me doing my negotiation period, I had to get on the phone. Me and my agent aren't telling me. We're on the phone with Robb Solver. And I had to tell him, hey, look, bro, don't match, bro. Just let me go, bro.

You know what I mean? So, Joe, what, where is this new at Joe? Don't you tell that girl, he ain't going to do what I do for you? We do that all the time. Oh, hey? Oh, you think that man going to take you on trips? You think he's going to buy you flower and buy these nice-ass-ass person like me? So, listen.

Listen, I'm going to be honest with you. I didn't really want to have to do it, My agent was like, man, you're going to have to get on the phone with him and tell him not to match because they're scaring teams off. You feel what I'm saying? So in case and Wallace situation, we don't really know what he really thinking. Do guys want to get paid? Yes. But I think situation matters too.

You know what I mean? To some degree. Joe, let me ask you a question. Had you won a ring already in Phoenix, it'd have been a no brain or wouldn't it? You wouldn't even thought twice because you already had a championship. how many more championships I need, is that going to change the way people look at me? Kason Wallace says if I win two championships

in OKC, are people looking at me like they look at Shate? Are there people looking at me if they look at Jalen Brunson if I get to? Absolutely not. Let me go ahead and take this one and go get to three. I understand what you're saying. And I respect that too. But I think the chemistry and continuity

that some of these guys have with each other and these teams, bro, I think some of these guys, you know, they don't necessarily. really want to leave, Uncle Ocho, but if the money is too, it's too good, hey, I mean, you ain't got no choice. Joe, they're going to pay that man 25. Look at what Caruso make. I think Caruso make down the $30 million a year.

They're going to give him a comparable. Somebody going to give him five years, $125, $150, Joe. OK, see, got to make some changes now. They got to make some changes. Yeah. Oh, Caruso make $19. So if Caruso make $19. on a deal that he got paid.

Caruso, when he just redidded that deal, right? Four years 81. What is Wallace going to get? Wallace is younger. He can buy the Hyundai. Yes, sir. So you're going to have two guys coming off the bench, making a damn near $100 million.

That's going to be tough, man. That's going to be tough. But, hey, look, when you look at it in San Antonio's situation, you know, you can afford to, you know, pay Foxx that, these first, these next couple years, hopefully you win a title out of it. And you have a situation. I'll see you got a situation to where you're like, damn,

we didn't want a title. So we can't let Harper get out of here, got to pay Castle. Hell, when be going to break the bank? You're going to be a team full of G-leaguers. Yeah. Yeah. But it's a blessing and a curse.

Because you're like, okay, the guys that we drafted, they're really, really good and they're paying off. But guess what? We got to pay them in order to keep. And that's what O KC, okay, he's like, hey, when they trade for trade, they knock it out the part with J-Dubb, they get check, they get Wallace, they make great trades, and they get Hardinstein, and they get a Caruso, you get Isaiah Joe, you get all those guys, you're like, well, damn, well, we're doing okay.

I want to call you up, call you up, Clay Bennett, call you, say, hey, bro, look at this. This was going out. Then we're coming in. Now, either you find another way to make some more coming. me it or guess what's going to go out? Yeah, and when you look at it, it's just like football. Okay, Ocho, the quarterback, when he on their rookie, when he on their rookie contract, you got to maximize.

You got to pay them guys around him and hopefully, and he can get you that. Same thing with San Antonio, you got Wimby and Harper on these rookie deals, and you ain't got to pay them right now. So you got to try to maximize what you can get from or put the right pieces around them so you can try and win a title. because when you have to start paying these dudes, things start to get different, bro. Because Castle about to get on the, Castle about to get on a,

yeah. After that, he's going to get, boy, he's going to get by 250. Yeah. He'll get by, when be going to get by, when be going to get by Street 50? By Street, that would get wind by, he's going to get by 320. And then, and then Harper coming behind him, so that's going to 10% increase, so that'll be about 3.30. Are we going to make more than Wemby?

No, Wemby, because Wemby has been an all-N-B-A selection and a D-P-O-Y. You need to get one of those titles. You need to be an all-MBA or you need to be a all-defensive player. Now you get to be into that Supermax, Jalen Duren. Remember, he made 13 all-N-B-A. So now he's eligible for a supermats. Now, without that, he's probably two-fibbing. With that, now you're talking to two-n-old.

9310. Woo. Hey, boy. Hey, it's good. Boy, hey, when it's good, it's good. You hear me?

But here's the thing, though. How long? Because they say Harper's in his camp. Now, hey, this is what's being reported. Of all the things

they could have put out there, he's saying he's going to want to they report him that he's going to want to spot in that starting lineup. Yeah. That's what's being reported. Go, hey, hey, hey. What are he reports coming from?

You already know it. You already know it. Inside the house. Hold on. Even with the report, Joe, Uncle just said, what did the dispersay? We are committed to keeping who.

Okay. And the first check, and guess what? You keep putting your foot down? These guys leave your ass. It ain't like it used to be Joe before, like that group before you got there. These players are loyal.

These players are not loyal to these teams now. They'll leave your ass in a minute. They'll take that four-year deal, and in three years, they're back, and they're able to sign a five-year deal. So you keep on A. And that's what makes it so tough to coach in the days' time. You've got to handle these guys with kit gloves.

You actually think they're holding the hope down or something. Because if you don't, Hey, and think about it. For San Antonio, here are two key guys on their team for Seine and Champini. Yeah. You want to keep them guys, Ocho, but it's going to be hard to keep them. Hard.

It's going to be hard. Because the sales are the 3-&D guys. You know what? That's a good problem to have, though. It's a good problem to have early. But see, the thing is you still get a chance to run it back next year and not have to worry about all that.

So, you know, hopefully they can get back to the promise land and have different results. But it's tough, man. You know, you have to maximize when you got great players, on them rookie contracts, bro, you got to do whatever you can to maximize that and put great pieces around those guys.

I think Senate. That's why it was imperative. You look at what Kansas City did with the homeboy. Oh, Cho. Think about it. They got a couple of years when he's on that rookie contract. And so now I can put, I can go out and get a Sammy Watkins. I can go out and get pieces and add

around it. Yes. Because next year, that thing, that salary kicks in. It's going to be $64 million a year for the next four years. You know what they're going to do. They're going to play games and manipulate the cap. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, yeah.

Yeah. Oh, yeah. He got 238 guaranteed. Damn. He already made by two-s-something. He's not made two. Hey, Joe Bixon. Oh, yeah.

And he worked it, though. He worked. He worked. Oh, yeah. Absolutely. They keep advancing the ball. They're going to have to do something, but they're going to have to do something with a, what's you call them?

Who that? with this far. This, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, this, watching, Boussel offered some information that he didn't have to. That's what let the cat out of the bag, yeah. But he said that at different points in time this season, he was upset with the role that he was given. He didn't have to say that.

But we know that hung up even if he didn't say it. Yes, yes. Right. But most of the time you don't hear players voice, their displeasure about the role. Right. And so now he's like, hold on. I can make a case throughout the five games.

I was the second best player. And there were some nights I was the best player on the Spurs. And I'm coming out of the bench. And guys are gagging left and right. And I'm still sitting on the bench. And guys are still playing more best to me. Hey, when you think about it, if I'm Harper, I don't want the James Harden effect.

Meaning like, you know, when James was in OKC, yeah, he was a hell of a player, but he came off the bench his entire. entire 10-year in O.KC. And obviously when he went to Houston, he turned into somebody who probably nobody even seen. You know what I mean? I think Harper has the exact same type of talent,

bro. Hold on. Whoa, whoa, whoa, Joe. Hold on, Joe. Now, let's understand how great James Hardin was at his apex when he was in Houston. Are you saying Harper had that same potential to do the same thing? Yeah, I think he got that same type of potential, Joe. Yeah. Okay.

But you have to understand the Ocho, he wasn't allowed to play like that in the KC. He went to Houston where he was the dog. And so they gave him the ball and you got an opportunity to see what he can do as the lead dog. And he could get as many shots as he want. And they had guys around him that would defend and rebound and get to the ball. I mean, for Joe to say he sees similarities and thinking that he can do that if he wasn't on the spurs. Ocho, Ocho, you put. Dylan Harper in their

role Cooper flag got in Dallas to where he the man. Oh yeah for sure, for sure. Yeah. Hey, that boy's going put up at least a dub a night, 22, 23 a night. As a rookie, I think, I just think he has that type of talent. See, it's different when you go out there and play and you know

you can shoot whenever versus damn, I'll come out here, I got, I feel like I got to, every shot I take, I feel like I got to make. It's got to be a fisher. There you go. There you go. I ain't got If I turn it over once or twice, they take it me out. You know what I mean?

You ain't got to worry about that. Come sit. Hey, come on over here, sit by me. Just remember, Ocho, how it was with you when you didn't have to worry about if you made a mistake, the coach is yelling and screaming or they bring you out for a play to say, hey, son, that ain't what we, that ain't what we do. When you know I can just go play football. Yes.

If I've made a mistake, I've made a mistake. If I dropped the pass, I dropped the past. You were free, your mind free, and you could just. Nothing like that, bro. Nothing like that freedom. You know what I mean? Because now you can go out there and play kind of loosey-goosey versus when you on a star-studied team, a team with expectations of winning a title and you're playing

with arguably one of the best, not arguably, but one of the best players in the league, it's a little different, bro. It's a little different. Very, very different. Also for Mike Wright's article, multiple NBA big men reportedly trying to find a way to play alongside Wemby. on the Spurs. San Antonio can use a backup stretch big as it reloads for next season. And the combo stretch big man who can start and possibly play alongside Rui in bigger

matchups such as Rui Hachamori. The opportunity to play alongside Wemby, the franchise success, its culture, its collective youth makes San Antonio a preferred destination and no tax in Texas, adding that multiple big men are already trying to get to South Texas. Joe, do you like Wemby playing along? Excuse me. Do you like Rui playing alongside Wemby? If you got Rui, then that means you got to move what,

the sale of Champini? You're going to move probably Champany, but he's a big guy. He's a big guy. He can guard bigger guys. He can shoot the three. Rui don't want to go back to L.A.? Man, L.A. ain't going to have no money.

If they look at potentially Kessler or do you hear Rumblers about Duren and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, hey, look, I, I, listen, I was very pleased with how Rui played in the postseason this year for the Lakers. I thought, I thought he was probably the most consistent play on the Lakers team, being honest, you know, outside of run, I think he was the most consistent. When he came to shooting at a high efficiency rate, you know, playing the right way, I think he'll fit right in with the Spurs, honestly.

You know what I mean? But I think, I think the Spurs. need a, they need a, they need a dog. They need an animal coming off their bench to help Wimby too, Arcan Ocho, meaning. They definitely need a big that can give him some minutes. Yeah, you might, maybe. Because his thing is the problem with Wimby had, Joe,

is that we talked about it, only playing 30, 32 minutes. And now we get to the postseason, it's harder, and I need you to play 36, 38, 40. Yeah, yeah. Now what? Yeah, I get that. I think, I think even, even if you look at Detroit, situation because I think they're going to really go with Paul Reed because of the way he

played in the postseason and you might get off a big steward you know a dog like that maybe maybe maybe maybe he go over to the San Antonio to help because you need that you need that muscle that intimidated factor you know what I mean I just don't think yeah I don't think San Antonio had that bro the way they were whoop and whimby they ass out there like you need somebody who can come in throw some elbows you know no you know no real oh Joe put somebody on the ground a few times, bro, you need that. Set the tone a little bit. I definitely think that because Cornynett did give,

look, Cornett was great in the regular season. Cornet, Cornet made one good play. He did that block on Hardinstein, and I think he was content with that. But in that series, that five-game series, Cornynett was, bro. And he was awful the majority of the time against the Thunder. He did make that play.

Kudos to that. But more times than not, Cornyth was. It was old. It was Ole when he came in the game. Yep. It'd be interesting to see because, you know, the Nuggets got to do something with Aaron Gordon. Now, Aaron Gorn is a phenomenal player.

He's turned himself into a hamstrings, Joe, every year for the last couple of years, Joe, what we've seen? Amstring puts him down significant periods of time. It happened until the playoff year before last. It happened again this year. He missed a large chunk of the season with that hamstring. he got to the post season he got nick to gain that is concerning if i'm going to have to dump out 35 40 million dollars for a guy over three and he a free agent right i think he has one year left

he's going to want a deal yeah it's hard though if you're the nuggets to let him go obviously i know he hadn't been healthy but when he is and you know who else uh uh uh got one year left and he going to want a deal who that big fella yoke oh shh but he up already we're talking about we talking about we talking about we're talking about we're about. Get him a blank check. Yeah. What'd you want?

That may have that having a triple double, bro. They gave him envy. Back to back years. When nobody had been mad if they had gave him MVP. Led the league and assists in the house. The first time it's ever been doing. We've seen guys lead the league in assistant scoring.

We've never seen a guy lead to league in rebounds in assists. I think the last. Hey, Joe, what does that look like, Joe? When? What you mean? Oh, he's talking about his contract? Yeah. What, your, what, your, what, your,

It's going to be about three something. Probably about 3.20? Three quarter. Four year three, four year three something? It's going to be five. They're going to give him a five year year there about 340. He's going to probably reset the market.

293 over four years, which is about a little over 70 a year. That's the highest you can get. Yeah, four years. Seven over 70. Yeah. Hey, what if, what if he was, that's about, that's about, that's about 70, that's about 72 million a year. Yeah, damn.

If he was to go somewhere else here, no, no, because they can see the thing is with your team, because they have your rights, they can also do more than a new team. So that's how they're trying to stay in. It's the same thing with the franchise tag, Ocho. I can pay you more if you stay here than if you go somewhere else. So the home team can add an extra year. year where the other team that you go into, they can. And knowing Denver, it ain't no way in hell, Ocho, they let that man get out of the door.

They don't see him whenever. Oh, yeah. I mean, obviously not being that he's obviously the face of the franchise, but I would just curious, but number why, because, you know, if an NFL player, get away from a, get away from a team that he's on, and you, you're the star, you get in way more elsewhere, as opposed to what they're going to be. Yes. That's, what, 73, 293, it would be 70, like 72.

73, five a year. 72, 73, something like that. 72, 250. 293, 77 250. Look at those ass you what'll calculate it over there. It's 73 250, ash 293.

Damn. Yeah, but this San Antonio thing, Joe, you know how that can cause some problems. Because his agent said, hold on, we need numbers because we're going to want a max deal because what y'all going to come to say when it comes time

to the contract, you only average this, you only play this many minutes. You use everything you're saying, you're going to use that against me. You're not going to say, well, you know what, Dylan, you were a good soldier. You came off the bench, you didn't complain, we're going to give you the max anyway.

That's not what you're going to do. So what I'm not going to allow y'all to do is to go ahead and hold me back. Yeah. And it's great. as he is, you know, being 20 years old, bro. He's only going to get better, I cano. An I heart radio experience.

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You'll see what I mean. Listen to Rebel Spirit Season 2 on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Isaiah Thomas questions why the league continues to push Wemby over Jalen Brunson's face of the NBA. That was the question I was asking in Detroit. when we beat Bird, Magic, and Jordan, but they made Jordan the face of the league.

Here in Detroit, they're saying, why can't I be the face of the league? Why is there anyone elevated when you see him three, four years in a row beating your face of the league? When you ask that question, it's much deeper question in terms of who they want to be the face of the league. Who's the best? The small guy, we always have to take a step back

because we realize it small people, and that's 6'6 and above category. Man, I then won't let that. Man, I'm a, hey, I'm a call Zee. Zee, you got to come on here and explain you. Hey, Zee, say, damn there. I'm the only one. I'm one of the only ones who has a winning record against Michael Jordan.

I'm going to tell y'all how I really feed. Against Byrd, against Magic and Kareem. He's like, look, I beat Larry Bird. I beat Magic and Kareem. I beat Michael Jordan. I'm the only one that can say that. Nobody else can say they beat all three of them in their brand. I didn't.

Yeah, but I'm going to Joe, Bono, listen to me. I think players, people need to understand. You beating certain individuals, you know, when you plan, okay, it's a great thing, but it takes more than just beating people to be the face of a league. What do you say?

What do you say? It's more true than just that. He said, I thought so it's about, what is it about? I thought you said winning championships. Well, I beat those guys to win the championship. You know, that's not, that's not what it is. Yeah, I mean, I mean, you look at the upside that Winby has, bro, being only 22 years old.

I just, I can see why the NBA wants him to be the face. You know what I mean? Any global. Yeah. You know what? And you got a lot of players too on, like, you know, Isaiah, was Isaiah quiet? Was he quite, he just seemed like a quiet person. Man, Isaiah stated some stuff.

He did. I mean, Isaiah was fight, man. Y'all better go pull them tapes and look at Isaiah swinging on people left and right. Yeah, he just doesn't seem like that type of polarizing figure that could be the thing. Oh, he was very polarizing because Ozzyl was stated. Oh, Cho. Ocho, I ain't going to lie now. Hey, hey, the boy got here.

The boy had plenty of game now. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Listen, I know we could play. I know he could play, Joe, but it's a lot of people in the NBA that can play that just don't fit the criteria to be in the face of the league. Remember, we talk about Jason Tate and being the face of the league.

He just doesn't have that. It's a certain it factor. I don't even know how to explain it. I don't even know how to put it in the words where it just doesn't fit because it didn't have that, that, you know what? Anthony Edwards. Now, I can see him

be in the face of the league, but it's something he don't want. It's just something about him that's polarizing. Yeah. It's having that media savvy. When you talk to the media, how you captivate everybody,

everybody just really listening and hone in on what it is that you're saying. I think Amen has that. And he has that. I don't give a damn. You know what I mean? Like, Aung say,

he comes to the game and it slides with his wife beat on. He ain't done nothing about that fashion. stuff all y'all on, bro. That man just out. He comes to who? That's it. And remember, Isaiah was president of the union.

So he's going back and forth. We want this. We need that. And David's third party said, no, you know what? Because I said, Isaiah won at every level. Isaiah won at 81

National Championship. I said one. Isaiah won. They beat North Carolina. Carolina. And North Carolina had a really good team, a really, really good team. But Isaiah team with him, I think Randy Whitman, Rolando Turner, they beat James Worthy, Jimmy Black, not Jimmy Black, Al Wood. That was the guy. Al Wood, I think Matt Dardy, and I think Sam Perkins was on that team.

If I'm not mistaken, that was also the night, they thought about cancel it because Ronald Reagan got outside of the attempt. John Hinkley almost took Reagan out. Don't quote me on the book, but you can quote me, quote me. Quote me, quote me. I'm almost certain. That was 19. Yeah.

Chad of my right, chat? Damn, that's a year I were born. 1981, John Hinkley, assassination attempt. And that was on that Monday, and they almost canceled the game. They ended up playing that Monday night. And Rolando Turner, that offseason, he ended up getting the car accident and getting paralyzed. Damn, the irony. Yeah. I think that was,

it was that the year? Or you ain't looking okay. But I think that was the year. So I remember Isaiah. No. It was March 30th, 1981? Who's on Isaiah's team? Give me Isaiah line up. If I'm not mistaken, I know Isaiah and Randy Whitman and Rolando Turner. I don't remember the other two guys. I know Al Wood, Jimmy Black, if I'm not mistaken, came off the bench for Carolina.

James Worthy Perkins. Yeah, you're talking about when he was in Indyman. Indiana? Yes. Because Isaiah left. Isaiah turned pro. Mark Aguoy was the first, if I'm not mistaken,

I think Mark Aguad was the first pick in that draft out of DePaul. Mark has some game too, boy. Yeah. And when you think about it, you know, Isaiah Thomas was a little fiery, little, little ficed.

Landon Turner, what I say, London Turner. Was a fiery little feisty, little joker, Ocho. I think he took, obviously coming from Chicago, you know, it's probably how he was raised,

but playing under their damn Bobby Knight. Bobby Knight is a legend, boy. I can only imagine what that's like, bro. Yeah. But like I said, and then Azeel came in the league, and, you know, it took him a while to get over being Boston. Right. Because it's like every year it was either Boston,

it was, in the beginning, it was the Sixers. and the Celtics. Every year with the Sixers and the Celtics, Dr. J. Darrell Dawkins, Caldwell Jones, Bobby Jones, the Boston Strangler, Andrew Tony. He used to light him up

until they gave him the nickname the Boston Strangler. And then Isseldham came along because it was like Lakers, it was like Lakers, Lakers, Lakers, Rockets, Lakers, Lakers, Lakers, Lakers, in the West. Because you got to realize

magic went to the, finals nine times in 12 years. Jesus. And so once they broke that stranglehole, Isaiah and them broke that strangle hole with Boston, now Magic them had to deal with Detroit. And it was Detroit.

They lost in 88 to MagicNem, then they came back and got Magic Nemein them in 89, and then Portland beat them, and then Portland got to the finals, and then Isaiah them beat them in 90. and then, oh, Lord, that guy to Wilmington, 6-6, from Chapel Hill. And that was it. Yeah.

Yeah. That was it. Good time. But like you said, Ocho, Joe, yeah, little guys, I mean, maybe you can make the case for a small guy. Maybe the closest we've had or you say the place in the league has been step turned. But most of the time, it's a Jordan. It's a Kobe. It's a LeBron.

Yeah. I don't know. Could it be somebody a smaller Jalen Brunson? I'm sure it could be. But for the most part, if you go back and study, it hasn't been. Outside of probably AI, AI was so polarized. Yeah. Okay.

I'll give you that. He changed. But the problem was when Jordan came back, Jordan was the baseball league again. You got to realize when AI came in the league, Jordan was in the league. That was 96. I got a 96. And so Jordan, 96, 97, 98, they won the championship.

Wasn't nobody supplanting Jordan. So maybe that period when Jordan left 99, 2000, stuff like that. But then probably like 2001. Now, here's Kobe. Yeah. Yeah. Josh Hart said tonight that the Knicks knew the Spurs were food after seeing Wemby cry when they beat OKC.

Wow. Hey, you can't show that kind of motion. I think a few other basketball players say the job is not done. The job is not over. The task at hand, the ultimate goal is the winner, the winner championship. You know, that Larry O'Brien. So to be crying because you're going to the final. I don't know if it was crying because they were going to the final.

I think he was crying because they beat OKC, knowing how tough and challenging it was, knowing that they were the champions from last year. I think that's why he was And they got the MVP on the roster Yeah you go Yeah and Wimby probably feels slighted That he didn't win MVP Yeah

Yes He said he used that in motivation Yeah so those emotions came out Yeah I understand but Yeah yeah I mean But at 22-Ocho I mean

It's tough bro I mean it's probably other cats Who could Who could have held them emotions in but I just felt like they kind of took over. Like I heard him saying many press conferences, like he didn't really, he can't explain it. You know what I mean?

Like, it's just something he dreamed of. You know what I mean? And I think that's the, that's the great part about sports, bro, because we all grew up, whether it's y'all catching touchdowns, whether it's me counting the shot clock down, making the game winning shot,

and then for you to actually be in that situation and actually come through, yeah, I think it's very, emotional. I think it's very emotional. Yeah. I got it. And then he 22.

You don't know. I'm sure he understood that like, wow. Because, I mean, some people had them in the playing tournament. Some people had them, the fifth or sixth seed, and here they are the number two seed, and they took down the reigning defending champ

with the reigning, defending MVP on the roster. They did that. I don't hold nobody's emotions again. because everybody does it differently. And I think the thing is that when you try to put, obviously how you do certain things, you know,

we all know how you do certain things, how you talk about your teammates and how you carry on, that's very, very important. But everybody deals with success differently. Yeah. And some people, you know, like,

hey, like, you know, some people, you know, cry like George. Yeah. When Jordan won and then he realized,

like, you know what, man, and maybe it was because his father, wasn't there to see him celebrate. He was on Father's Day. And you see Kobe. Kobe got the trophy in his hand and he's just looking at it.

And that was around the time that he and his mom them had stopped speaking. And all the things, all the thoughts that's going through his mind. Some people are like, man, please, this is a time of my life. I can't worry about who not here. Right. Everybody had a little situation differently. Yeah. I mean, when, Ocho, when you look at it,

Jordan won a championship on Father's Day. You know what I mean? I think that's why it was so emotional for him. You just seen him break down, bawling crying. Hell, I probably would have been the same way. I ain't going to lie to you. If I was that close to my pops, bro, and he got murdered. Man, I've been insane.

We won on Father's Day? Come on, bro. I mean, death is really never easy. That's the thing that, I mean, you have to really respect and love about death. If there's anything because it doesn't discriminate? it takes young, it'll take old, it'll take rich, it'll take poor. It does not discriminate.

Just know when you have that appointment, you can't reschedule it. And depth, you know, there's no way to prepare. It's like, well, how do you prepare for it? We all know we're going to die. It doesn't make it any easier when it actually happens to your loved ones that you left behind. But it's the fashion in which your and father succumb. so sudden. Man, 85, 90 years old,

man, he had a great life. Man, you can remember, but tragically how somebody senselessly took that man's life. And you think I'm Michael Jordan. I'm supposed to be able to insulate stuff like that. I should be able to insulate my family from that's foolishness.

There are some things I can't control cancer. I can't control kidney disease, liver disease, things like that. There are certain things I don't get, they ain't enough money. But there are certain things I feel like, my money, my fame, I should be able to insulate him like that. I don't know.

And probably whoever did this, you know, I don't know if sure they even knew what it was. Right. Until probably they went to his wallet and took it, and they probably still had put two and two together. It was sad, and I couldn't believe it.

I couldn't believe, because I don't, I didn't really know anybody famous that father or mother had gotten like this. this. So what are we looking at? So what? Remember it came on the new father of Michael Jordan killed. What?

First thing, what you think of a traffic accident? Not murdered. Damn. Man. And because he looked just like his dad and how close they were. Think about it. Every time Jordan was something, he was right there. Now all of a sudden,

win. Three Pete. Finish off a three Pete. Hadn't been done 60, 67, uh, Celtics. Yeah. Hey, man. I, I think in certain situations, even when you look at Michael Jordan and six six, if you look at his parents, okay, Ocho, hell, you probably could even go through his whole family tree. He probably ain't got nobody over six foot, six two, because you know what I mean? So I feel like, you know, in situations like that, man, it's almost destined, bro, because the athleticism that his brother Larry had, and MJ had, like, his brother probably was more athletic than him, but he was just a lot smaller.

Yep. You know what I mean? Versus MJ getting 6'6. Now he got this 45, I think they said even 50 inch vertical. I mean, man, come on, bro. And his desire to work ethic. And when you didn't took as many ass whoopens as he took from his brother coming up, kind of like, oh, you take all them ass whoopens,

you'd be ready to do you be ready to do some, not when you get a big hey let me get somebody that's my size i just whip them yeah and you know he he he told a story that uh what do you say about basketball the reason why he loved basketball so much is because it's loyal because he knows what he what he gives the it'll give it back to him yeah yeah i just i just love to hear greats serena and vina and vina and Mike and Tom Brady. I love them because, you know, Ocho, we and I say how great this is

and it's lonely and everything. They don't want to hear from us. But we talk about the upper, this is like the wealthy, like once you get to pass, like that 50 billion, there's only a certain level of people. Well, when you get to that Jordan and Serena

and Tiger and Jordan level, Tom Brady, Tigerwood, there's only a certain level of people that have ever reached that conchendo. and to hear them talk about what it takes and the selfishness that is involved, then you get an appreciation. Yes.

Just a little bit of success that I had. I knew what it took, what nearly as great as those that never professed to be, but I knew in order, it is lonely and it is very mundane. And unless, and who can join, what's the female equivalent of Jordan

marrying someone that would, actually know what he's going through. Hey. Serena, she's 60. And she's a 23-time Grand Slam champ. She would know. That's why movie stars normally marry other movie stars, because they know what it's like to live that life.

They know what it's like to jump in and out of character. Yeah. You see? Hey. And the one percent of the one percenters are the one percenters. Yes. Yes. They're the zero point.

whatever that point is like 99.9.9, they're that 0-0-0-0-0-0-0, like 55-1. That's where they are. You know what's funny? The numbers you just said, you know, there's another level above them, too. Yeah. What's another level above them, Ojo? Yeah. What, the elites?

God. When you talk, will you talk, Joe? Jordan and Serena and Tiger Woods. Jack, Jack, Nicholas. God. You start looking at the Stephanie Graf's and things like that, man. I mean, yeah, it's crazy.

I mean, the, think about me, the work that, I mean, and everybody hear about George's work ethic, how legendary it was. You hear about Kobe. You hear about Serena. And all the balls that they hear and their dad teaching them. He's watching BCR tapes

and teaching them how to swing and how to hit the backhand. And you hear about all the work ethic. And you hear about LeBron getting to the gym five hours early and getting a workout in and getting shots up and to do that. And you think about this, you do all of that with no guarantee you ever going to reach the level that you think you are.

You do it on a hope that this is going to pay off. And I tell people all the time, hard work doesn't guarantee you anything, but without it you got no chance. At all. You see, I read a quote a couple of days ago, guys. They said two people that are smart could never fall in love. One of them has to be an idiot to fall in love.

See, the fall in love, see, the fall in love with a sport or the fall in love with something that you cannot control. Right. You got to be an idiot. Damn. I don't. I've done. That's it. That's it.

That's it. Thank you for joining us to now. Oh, hey, hold on. Hey, that's a good one. Well, hold on. Let's write that down. You got to be. Because think about it, Joe.

Think about all the work that you put in with no guarantee. I go to work every day. What about guaranteed? I'm going to get a salary at the end of the work period. At the end of his work week. You work from the time you was nine, ten years of age. Titus, get out. As a matter of fact, get out.

Hey, hey. You worked from the time you was 9 or 10 years old, so you worked 12 years with no pay. Basketball didn't pay you a dime. Ocho, you worked from the time you was 10, 11 years old, and football never paid you a dime. You worked on a hope that everything that I put in this would pay off one day. Yes.

There are many of people that put just as much time, just as much effort in it, and it didn't pay off. Hold on, you got to bring me back to that question. Hey, hey, basically. Hey, Ocho. Too smart people can't fall in love, Ocho. If you fall in love, one of them have to be an idiot. You've got to be an idiot to fall in love.

Too smart people can't fall in love. Hey, hey. Hey, the moral of the story is we are awesome damn idiots, okay? Yes, yes. Yes. To fall in love with, and Jordan said it. Go back and look at some of his quotes. He said, I fell in love with this because.

it's the only thing I know would love me back. I got to use that way. You do, it's more than an obsession. It's more than a commitment. It's a singular focus. Because people say, well, plan A and plan B. What's your plan B? Well, if plan B was going with so probably,

it would be plan A. They got no plan B. I got a plan A. That's a lot of, that's a lot of cash out here, too. Yeah. To fall in love, someone has to be an idiot. To fall in love with something. Two smart people can't fall in love, Ocho.

One of them has to be an idiot. So that's how it works. That is, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's the only way it can work. Faith. That's a good. The Bible teaches us to say you're supposed to have faith. Faith is the unknown, but believe it. You see, man says, show me, I'll trust you.

God say, trust me, I'll show you. You see the difference? Yeah. What man's, oh, I would trust, okay, blindly trust. Mm-mm. Uh-uh. I said, you put your faith in me. I'm still stuck on that first one.

I ain't heard that one before. You know, I'm, I know, I do, I do you're going to love that one. I like that. I like that before. Josh, oh, man. All right, Wimby, you let them see your weakness. You got a... Up close and personal.

With you and Zach Myers. Win your way into an exclusive I-Heard Live for an intimate performance in Q&A. July 6th at the Horsesuit Tavern in Toronto. Don't miss it. For your chance to win, enter now at IHardio.ca. With Brent Smith and Zach Myers of Shinedown. Stream the new album 8.

Available now. I love the sounds. The buzzing from the stadium, the chanting from the fans, the announcers calling the place soccer, football, at home. Why do I watch the World Cup? That's like asking me, why do I breed? I inherited that fandom from my mom. I like watching it with my dad.

It's a connecting force. From Futuro Studios, I'm Fernanda Chavari, and this is American Football, a show about soccer culture in the U.S. and its underdog roots. We go beyond the game to live. the people and the stories that make it great. A soccer game is a festival. It's not just a game. It's your culture.

I took an elbow to my head, which cracked my skull. It is an American game. The Brazilians don't like hearing that, though. Are they the only ones that don't like that? Nobody likes that. As we get ready for the Men's World Cup this summer, listen to American Football as part of the MyCultura podcast network, available on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,

or wherever you get your podcast. Hey, I'm Hoda Kotby, host of the podcast, Joy 101 with Hoda Kotby. Together, we're going to have meaningful conversations with the world's most fascinating people, like when actress Olivia Munn shared how she overcame fierce health challenges. I've gone through breast cancer and then helped my mother through breast cancer, and that was more difficult. There's a lot of people who understand postpartner depression. I was not prepared for postpartum anxiety.

Listen to Joy 101 with Hoda Kotby on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. What's up, fam? It's Isaiah Thomas. And I'm CJ Toledano and our podcast Point Game is about defining the odds. Like LeBron heading into the playoffs without Luca and Austin Reed. And finding ways to win no matter what. He's the smartest player to ever play the game. His IQ is at a level that we've never seen before.

And he knows without Luca and Austin Reeves, I got to manipulate the game. We get a player's perspective on the challenges of the playoffs. I think Joker's going to be exhausted. this series because when they don't have Rudy in the lineup, he has to really guard guys like Nas Reid. He has to guard Julius Randall. And then he has to give us everything he gives us on the night-to-night basis on offense. And when IT's friends stop by, like Quentin Richardson, we dive into some playoff history too. Steve Nash would get that thing. That man, hell get the flying. He run up the court licking his fingers while he got the ball like, after you go through a training camp with that,

Isaiah, you figure it out real quick. Get your ass up and down. court and you're going to get the bomb. So listen to Point Game on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Here's something that should not be as complicated as it is. Getting a racist statue removed. And here's something that should be a whole lot easier than it is. Getting a new one put up in its place.

As long as there's a politics of race in America, there's going to be a politics of remembering the Civil War. To get to school, I had to go down Robert Lee Boulevard. Get to the grocery store. I had to go down Jefferson Davis Parkway. If you're an historian and you leave out half of what the history is, you're not doing your job. I'm Akila Hughes. In Rebel Spirit, Season 2 goes deep on both of those things.

The fights, the politics, the people who won, and my personal campaign to add something to the Kentucky State House that's actually worth the wall space. We are more than our bodies. We contain essence. We contain spirit. How do you represent that? They are just fueling a fire that is really catching. You'll see what I mean. Listen to Rebel Spirit season two on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Button up. All right, Joe, according to Mark Spears, trade young class to decline his $49 million dollar player option for the 2026 season and become a free agent on Monday. Washington remains the front runner for the four-time NBA All-Star as he loves the team and D.C., but he still expect multiple team max interest. I'm confused. What do you think about? I don't think anybody surprised. I mean, one year versus opting back in. He can get a five-year deal.

I don't think he, well, he don't have bird rights. So he just got there. So I don't know, can they offer him a five-year deal or is it a four? That's what I'm not. I'm not sure. I think because he's been there, I think he should be able to get a five-year deal. I'm not sure. But.

Hey, please explain to me on. Say what you just said. He opted out of his play option. How much was his play option? 49 million. Like 49 million. How you opt out of 49 million? Because this is one year and I want to get in for four years at 190 million,

or 200 million, the five years for 250. Basically, he won a new contract. Oh, okay, okay, okay, okay, okay. With multiple years and just this one. So. Yeah, and knowing that he's probably going to get it, you know what I mean, considering that this is last year. So he had an option.

He opted out so he can restructure and do it and get him a whole new. deal. Hey, hey, it's smart. I think it's smart. I think it's smart on his behalf, considering the fact that they're going to have a number one pick, which is probably going to be AJ. So you still got time before you have to pay AJ. And then you can kind of see how this works out. You got at least three years. Yeah, you got Tray, Anthony Davis, and AJ DeBosca. I don't know what people are talking about. I feel like Washington, with them three dudes alone, plus they got other guys, you know, they got, they got some more talent over there in Washington they can help, but

I can see them making the playoffs next year, Uncle Ocho, the Wizards. I can see it. Have for you and Ocho, are they going to keep Anthony Davis? Because I think Morty he would probably have a high interest from a Golden State or somebody that have championship aspirations.

I'm saying he ain't no free agent, though. No, no. But could you get draft capital or do you want to keep him with Trey Yuck? Obviously, he can pick pick a roll, be unbelievable him in Trey. Obviously, he can pick and pop. Obviously, he can roll great lob threat.

He's got a nice mid-range game. Play outstanding defense. You're going to need that because Trey is a little undersized. He's at a disadvantage. We understand that. So the question is, does he have more valuable to Washington or would he have more valuable to somewhere else where you can get draft capital for it?

Nah, I think if I'm Washington, I got to at least try it out for a year. Okay, oh, two. I mean, considering the fact that you got a nice, big who you can play next to him. What's the big they got over there? The big fella. I think he would like number two in the draft. Oh, oh, Star?

You're talking about Star? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You got him and he made leaps and bounds last year. So I think he'll be even better going into his third season. But I just think, man, they got enough talent over there to where they can make some noise in the Eastern Conference. I don't really, hey, I don't want to see, I don't want to see these guys. Like, for instance, I don't want to see Janus in the Western Conference.

I don't. I really don't. No, I don't. Why not, Joe? Because the West is such a gauntlet, Ocho. I mean, it's so, they stack and they not only all they top heavy, but the teams that's in the middle and at the bottom, they're going to continue to get better.

I just feel like it's going to be such a dog fight over there and kind of like how Minnesota and San Antonio and OKC, how they beat each other up to the finals, Like, I just feel like if he stay in the Eastern Conference, you have a better chance. That's just me. I feel like you got a better chance of making it to the finals. The East ain't, it ain't really top, baby.

It's got a few good teams, obviously, the Knicks. You know, you want to Boston be good, especially if they get Janus. And then you send J.B. to Atlanta. We're going to be probably third best team in the Eastern Conference, baby. Alex Sar, that's the name. Alex Sar, he's a freshman. Yeah, Alex Sar.

Yeah, he's a freshman. Yeah. Alex Saar. They got some talent. Washington got some talent, man. I'm telling you. Okay. So it's going to look. The question is, how many more years does AD have on his contract? Because he's probably going to be looking for a new deal, Ocho and Iso.

Well, he's going to have to, he got to show or something. I mean, can he come in, can he come in the camp in shape? Yeah, I can come in shape. But I feel more comfortable coming in shape with a new three, four year deal. Hey, hold on, huh? Hey, Joe, hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on. The best availability is availability. Young bull hurt every year.

What we talk about here, he'll be happy with a new three, four year. Can we stay healthy for a season? Can you give us 70 games? You ain't got to give us 82. Can you give us 70? That's what I'm saying, no, Joe. But you heard the report, though. He's not happy being there.

Y'all have heard the reports. I ain't breaking no news to anybody. But he don't even know, though. I do know it's D.C. I don't want to be in D.C. They haven't won a thing since, what, 78, 79? You got a good team? They got a decent team, right?

I feel better in Golden State. How about this? Hey, we get y'all our first round pick in Jimmy Butler. Y'all give us AD. Man, ain't that Jimmy Butler got an ACL 10. I'm just telling what we're willing to do, OJ, uh, ISO. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, we ain't, we ain't going. We ain't going.

Because look, if you. gonna pay tray man you can't have that man out there trying to figure it out by itself he needs some veteran help over there too and you got saw yeah you need some veteran Jimmy coming off ACL uh-huh he don't care he don't care he won't see well he won't all in the team he won't brun and 80 and all them the team up in going to talk about it but the reports look like LeBron is going back to uh LA oh yeah I don't know Hold on, how they're going to do that?

How they're going to pay Reeves and play Brown? Don't start me the line. Don't start me the line. Wait, hold on. Matter of fact, how they're going to pay Braun a respectable number that is willing to play on and pay or is Austin Reed? Or is Austin Reed going to take a pay cut just to keep the band together? I don't see Austin Reeve taking no pay cut.

Me neither. He turned, he turned out an extension this, uh, this past off season to get to this point. Hey, Brunson took a pay cut. Every year he's averaged more points than the pre. previous year. He's not going to take what they got to do. He knows there are other teams out there that that is willing to give him a four year max extension. Brunson took a pay cut what they got to do with me if I'm a. I'm like what they got to do with me? You're trying to win or not? Man, I'm trying to get this money on. Hey, you're talking about am I trying to win? I'm trying to add up. I'm trying to secure

the bag. What'd you mean? But you got but see here is the thing. The problem that you have with that is that you you got to agents are going to go to tell the clients no because what you do is that you press the market. You remember how many people, Tom Brady was another one. Because what happened in New England? If Tom Brady only making 10 million, I'm a 10 time all pro.

How can I pay you more than Tom Brady? Quarterback, look at Robbys, look what Tom is getting. How are we going to pay you more than that? He's the best quarterback in the game. So this is why baseball players, and a lot of time, basketball players, you get an isolated incident like Jalen Brunson. But most of the times, they won't let you do it

because they want that thing to keep Climbing. Keep climbing. And the only way you can keep it climbing is you don't give guys a discount. The same reason. Okay. TV contract. CBS lost their deal because there's like, you know what? We want to pay you a little less money. And Jared Jones said, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. Whoa. Uh, we understand y'all been in this thing for 50 years. But you know what? There's that new network and they only got the Simpson and living color and news. They're willing to give us X. That's Fox. And what happened? So, There don't cut, now they might cut you a little discount. If you go in, they still got what, three plus, they got 26, 27, 28, 29, 30. They still got five years on the deal. They say, you know what?

You know, give us a little bump in pain. You don't make it right. You don't flip that thing. You don't flip it. Add a little five years to it. We might shut you out. Yeah, cut your little 200 million a year off. Yeah.

Probably not because guess what? Netflix right there to cut. They're rubbing the hand like bird made. They wait. They're waiting. So what are you going to do? Well, I mean, if you like somebody, some major network is going to lose their TV rights because they don't have Netflix money.

They don't have Amazon money. NFL might be hesitant to give Amazon Thursday night package, but for the right price. Anything possible. But I know Netflix coming. Netflix. is coming. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. One thing about it, Joe, boy, everything for sale, boy. I don't know what it is. Everything got a price tag, now.

Hey, anything can be bought, can damn show be sold? Did they buy the NFL team where their damn show sell them rights to the highest bidder? Come on, man. Yep. Yep. And Netflix probably looking to get into live sports and all that. You can become a for real network. You got to have live events. Why do you think they pay, yeah, the Anthony, Joshua, Jake Paul, Jake Paul and Mike Tyson, why you think they keep having these live events? They understand it?

The movies are great. Taped events are great. They do great job with movies and documentaries and all that. Unbelievable. But live events is where it's at. Oh, yeah. And they understand that. The same thing with Paramount, what did they do?

They got the UFC. Yep. I'm just saying. Yeah. It's going to happen. Oh, yeah. It's going to happen. You got lock in, twin.

I'm going to be ready when it do happens. It's that time to put on your jersey and wave your flag, whoever you root for. Why do I watch the walk up? That's like asking me, why do I breed? And it's beautiful. The guys are young and cute and fat. It's not just a game. It's your culture.

I like watching it with my dad. It's a connecting force. From Futuro Studios, I'm Fernanda Chavari, and this is American Football, a show about soccer culture in the U.S. and its underdog roots. Listen to American Football on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Joy is essential, and it's all so elusive. But now, there's a new and exciting way to start your journey toward a more joyful existence. Joy 101.

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