Club Shay Shay - Best of NFL Part 2: Is Tyreek Hill WASHED UP after Dolphins release?! Jalen Hurts STUCK UP ways for being ranked MOST HATED in the NFL

Episode Date: February 18, 2026

Subscribe to Nightcap presented by PrizePicks so you don’t miss out on any new drops! Download the PrizePicks app today and use code SHANNON to get $50 in lineups after you play your first $5 lineup! Visit https://prizepicks.onelink.me/LME0/NI... 0:00 - Tyreek Hill released by Dolphins21:51 - NFL's most hated players27:19 - Jerry Jones on Michael Irvin's leadership28:34 - Josh Jacobs reflects on playing with Antonio Brown (Timestamps may vary based on advertisements.) #ClubSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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The Dolphins have released Tyreek Hill today. Hill turns 32 on March 1st and was set to carry a $51.1 million cap hit in 2026, which have given him the highest cap number amongst non-quarterbacks coming into the season. The decision leaves Miami $28.2 million in dead money, but also creates almost $23 million in cap space by releasing Hill. Now, Ocho, which team is the best landing spot for Tyreek, the chiefs, the bills, or the charges? I think Tyreek's nest move has to be his best move. Obviously, coming off of injury, going to a team where he's going to be utilized in the correct way.

I think the bills would be a nice place for him. Obviously, I mean, you have Shakur, who was somewhat in that same position and being in the slot, but Tyreek being able to play on the outside, I like the chiefs. The chiefs also being able to use them, you know, the course. correct way and it all comes down to how healthy is he going to be when he's recovered, you know, even once he goes to rehab. Even a Tyree Kiel that's not as fast as he once was is probably still fast than everybody else.

I think that's all what's going to come down to. I think the Dolphins might have moved on a little too fast, honestly. Just in my own personal opinion, they could have restructured and found a way to get that, to get that salary a little bit lower with him coming off their injury. but to let a player of his magnitude go, which is the staple of your offense, obviously having A-chan, having, having, ah, God, having waterless well,

I don't think they should have let him go. That's just my personal opinion. Obviously, being 32 and coming off injury, you know how, you know how this video works. Serious injury. Injury, yes. That ain't just no ACL. He tore a lot of ligament and he broke his tibia.

Yeah, I understand. But rehab, the resources, the access to some of the methods he has to get himself back to where he once was, I think that the chances of him coming back and being the Tyreek of Ovald is possible. Even if he's not the same Tyreek of Old, it will still be better than, damn there 98% of the receivers in the NFL if he's used correctly. Well, the ruddy was on the roll.

I'm surprised that it moved on the offseason. After what had transpired the last game, Coach, we talked about this. The one thing you can't do as a player, players will forgive a lot. but you can't leave him out to dry. You can't quit on them. When things are going bad, that's when your best players. That's when I need Ocho to show up and be his best.

I understand, Ocho, we're not going to the playoffs. I understand, Ocho, you're not going to get your customary 90 catches, 1,300 yards. But don't quit on me. Don't be a guy that when things are going good, they go great, and when they go bad, they go terribly, horribly wrong. Yes.

And so I thought they would move on in the off-season because I knew he would never have the same trust in that locker room that he once had. Go ahead, Ocho. Can I tell you something? I can tell you why they didn't move on. They didn't move on because they understood his value. They understood his true value despite him giving up, despite him quitting in that previous season. We can't let someone like this go.

Look at the numbers he put up. Look what he does for us offensively. He makes everyone else job around him that much easier because we have to, everyone has to focus on him in game. So it opens up everything else. So of course they were going to let him go. But now that he's injured, now that he's hurt, and it's kind of up in the air, you don't know what you're going to get.

Once he's back healthy, you know what? Now we can let him go. But you'll never find another one. Let me ask you a question. You'll never find another player like that. Did they make the playoffs with him? No. They can miss the playoffs without it.

I mean, we can say that about a lot of players on a lot of things. But at $51 million, and I told you that said, oh, no, you know you wouldn't get $51. You would restructure that, though. You would restructure that. I would have moved. on, Ocho. Because he's not going to be the same guy in the locker room.

They're not going to believe in him. The coaches staff don't believe in him. There's a reason they didn't give him to see again. There's a reason, Ocho, you know that. You've got to do something really, really bad, something really egregious for you to be a captain one year, him being the player that he is, and then all of a sudden he's not the captain. Because nobody's going to let, bro, how are you the captain?

You quit of all people. If I give Ocho to C-Shee, if damn near my leg broke, hey, man, hey, Doc, what you think? It's broke, Ocho. Can you tape it up? Can I steal go?

Can I run a stop? You're going to do everything you possibly can because you understand the importance of that C. You understand the importance of that leadership and the guys look to you. Was that transpired? I said it's never going to be the same. You know that?

I know that. Everybody knows that. Now, people try to make it all of you old school. I'm telling you. Quitting is the worst thing that you can do in a team game. Because if you're by yourself, you're a golf or a tennis player. Who can't if you quit? You withdraw.

You withdraw. Oh, you got an injury and you can't continue? Okay. Hey, no, who was that? Who is that? Somebody had a. Oh, Djokovic was playing somebody in the semifinals. And the guy, he was up two sets to love.

And he had to withdraw because he had to end. injury. Okay. Injury. He couldn't continue. But as a team, and the thing was, Ocho, he was healthy. And one of the guys, and it got out that,

uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, waddle asked him, hey, reek, you done? You can't. The problem is, Ocho,

what you have if you restructure at what number? Because he's going to deem it different. First of all, he's going to deem it disrespectful that you're, you're cutting his pay based on what he's done. So now what is the number that you, and the team. That's comfortable.

You know the team is looking to be here. Tyreek and his representative are looking to be here. Can we find somewhere in the middle? Yeah. I mean, obviously at some point I'm not sure when it's going to be.

You're going to see Tyreek Hill post videos showing how healthy he is. You're going to see him running routes, lateral movement, being able to accelerate, being able to stop, being able to transition and do some of the things he once was able to do. I think once those videos are posted, on social media, then you're going to understand, okay, he's back. He's back. He might not be

Tyreek of old, but even the same Tyreek of old, even if he loses the step, he's still faster and almost better than 98% of those that play his exact position. A lot of people, they mistake and allow the off-field stuff to kind of camouflage what he's done on the field. Right now, if he was the try today, he's a Hall of Famer. If Tyreek Hill was never play another down in the NFL, he is a Hall of Famer. He is a first ballot Hall of Famer. For those who don't know and probably said,

Ocho, shut the hell up. We didn't get away from that first ballot. After they put T.O. and Coach Belichickie? I understand. I understand because they allow all this stuff to overshadow what players have done on the field. Look at what he's done on the field. Look at his numbers to date.

And obviously, knowing Tyreek, being 32, as fast as he is, he's probably not going to slow down anytime soon based on the way we've seen players come back from even gruesome injuries like this. I think he's going to be all right. But I feel he's a Hall of Famer based on what he's done thus far to date in the NFL.

I think the thing is also Ocho, I think he should take his time. I think he had this injury. I think he did it in week four. So he's about five months into his surgery. Excuse me, rehab. He should be in no rush. You said his next move should be his best move. It's got to be his best one.

I agree. Because the one thing, okay, he left voluntarily. Okay. to go to Miami. Miami, he doesn't leave under the same circumstances. The last thing you want to happen, Ocho, is you go somewhere

and then after a year, they move on. So now what's the, what's the thing? He ain't the same player. So you start to bounce. Boom, boom, boom, boom. Yeah. Now they ping pong. And that's the last thing they want.

Because like you said, he's coming off a gruesome injury and he's 32. Yeah. I'll tell you what. Y'all do realize, I mean, he was running, he was running four, three at 31.

So, yeah, I agree with you, Ocho. I don't know if we've ever seen a player this fast, have this gruesome of an injury. So we really don't know what he's going to be when he gets back because that's a lot of down force. That's a lot of deceleration and acceleration. If he can still excel, can he still get in and out of those breaks with the quickness? Can he still put fear?

Hey. Go ahead. Can he still put fear? Hold on. Go ahead. Now, Fat fat. Come here.

All right. Go here. No, I was just, I think that's the biggest thing. We've never seen a player with this kind of speed to have this kind of gruesome injury because the acceleration and the deceleration. Because you may,

hey, the faster you go, because normally guys that run really fast, hey, they have to throw that blank on there. To get it out of them brakes. That's not what Tyreek does. He can deceliorate, he can accelerate and decelerate with the,

And the same, blap. Yeah. It's going to be very, very interesting to see. But I would take my time. I'm in no rush. I'm Tyreek.

My resume speaks for itself. Yes. And they're going to ask him. You know they're going to bring him in. They're going to ask him what happened in that situation. They always do. They always do. I don't know.

I don't think so. I don't think so. Understanding knowing what it can do. It's about moving forward. I don't see them rehashing the past because the past is not going to help what you're trying to do and what he can do in helping a team right now in trying to to reach their end goal, especially the Kansas City Chiefs. Based on, yes, based on, huh, based on, you know, them missing the playoff last year and having

struggles at that position, I think they'll be happy to bring them back, especially with Eric B. Enemy, knowing how to use them the right way. Let me ask you a question. And, chat, y'all can chime in. In a regular job, if you get fired of your regular job and you go to a new job, they ask you what happened in the old job, don't you? You know what? I like it, but it's a different environment with different leaders where he doesn't have to be that main one.

You got, you got my homes, you got some of those other fellas over there. When you got the coach Belichick, what did the coach Belichick asked you? Oh, he didn't ask me nothing. I know what he did say. What he said? Listen, welcome, welcome, welcome to New England. You know you're going to have to change who you are to be here. So, but you don't think, but you don't think if we're going to ask him anything about what transpired?

He's already been there and he's already been there, honk. He's already been there. He's just coming back home. He's been where? In Kansas City before. I get Kansas City. Kansas City, no, look. Kansas City saw some of the red flag.

If he goes, if he goes somewhere else beyond that. But what if he doesn't go to Kansas City? What if he goes to Buffalo? What if he goes to the Charger? I'm not saying going to a familiar situation. Right. They knew, they took Tyreek knowing what had transpired beforehand. So they have an understanding of who Tyreek is.

Yes, yes, sir. But Sandy ain't. excuse, San Diego, LA, the charges don't. Right. Buffalo does not. Maybe any other teams does not. So I need to get a sense. I need to get a feel to make sure this situation doesn't arise again.

Go ahead, don't you? Right. Yeah, I don't think we have any issues. Obviously, the all-field stuff, it overshadows what he's done on the field. No, that was on the field. That wasn't off the field. I look. I know, I know.

I don't understand. His wife and the divorce and the kids. I don't care nothing about, hopefully, hopefully, the allegations about DVV isn't true. I hope the kids, the kids, hey, that happened. I don't care, I don't care if he got a baby, one baby mama, two baby mom, they ain't got nothing to do. I don't care about that.

But what we're, I'm only talking about what transpired the last game of the regular season when he was fully healthy. Yeah. That's it. And I'm not, chat, and I don't want you to go. Oh, okay. I'm not trying to minimal. it. I'm just saying

we're talking about because all that, and they might even ask him about that. Yeah. But I'm talking about on the field play. That's what Ocho and I'm discussing. Yes, DV is bad. And so I'm not trying to, because y'all know you're going to try

to parse words and it'll clip it and say, uh, doesn't care. I do care. But I'm not asking him about that because I can read and I'm going to ask him, who knows? Maybe they call. Maybe they call her, I don't know, maybe they get the police report and deduce what they can from that. All I'm saying is, is what transpired the last game of the regular season a year

and a half ago. That's what's going to be the major concern for teams, all the teams, maybe not Kansas City because they know who Rique is. And it's very familiar with him, Brett. Beach is familiar with him. Obviously, E.B. is familiar with him. Kelsey, Mahomes, everybody. I saw Chris Jones, Cheetah, had the clock. Yes. Yes. So, but I'm just saying, I think in a situation like that, Ocho, you get asked those questions. Because it'd be, you know, a great person to be had on tonight would be asked Tio. Because Tio went from San Fran. He went to Philly, from Philly to Dallas, Dallas to. So did they ask you anything about what transpired at the previous stops? Right. I mean, you know, it's possible. It's possibly. they can. I'm sure there'd be an easy question that he won't have a problem answering. Obviously, being a player, you know how you can get frustrated, but there's certain things you

really can do, especially wearing that seal on your chest, and it got to him. In the moment, he was upset. I'm not sure what was going on. I can't remember that previous game or who they were playing, but he was frustrated, especially offensive because he wasn't being able to, he wasn't being used the way he felt he should. Well, I think the thing is, Ocho, is the first time and maybe since his rookie year that he didn't get a thousand yards. You know you as a wire receiver, you measure your success by a thousand yards.

Let me get that thousand. And then I'll deal with it. Hey, I might only have 50 catchers. But if I got 50 catches for a thousand yards, that's 20 yards. I'm good. I'm Gucci.

Yeah, good. Yes. And so I think that might have played a part in it. And when you're at that level, you see all these young guys. You see what Chase's doing. You see it what Jettah's doing.

You see it what Pooka's doing. You see it. Yeah. As we start to get older, we see those young dogs coming. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Damn, man, pretty soon I'm going to have to get my ass on a damn porch. I can't even run with him no more.

Yeah. Yeah. We had an old dog without growing up, Ocho. Hey, old Joe boy. That was his name Joe boy. Joe boy got old. The other dogs be running the yard. He just bark at him.

Basically said, I remember I used to be able to do that. But I got to stay up here now. He can't move. Yeah, he can't move no more. He could get off the porch to go out and do his business, but he ain't running with nothing. And he definitely ain't going hunting with those other dogs. But I wish Tyreek the best. I thought for what he's been able to do on the field, the way he turned himself from a gadget guy,

a guy's getting, you know, some shovel passes, some jet sweeps of, you know, flea flickers here and there, a return specialist, and to turn himself into a preeminent receiver that's dedicated, that's hard work. We all have applause. We've all made mistakes. But in this situation, I commend him on what he's been able to overcome to turn himself to the receiver that he became. And so I wish him the best, nothing but going to forward. But I agree with you, 1,000 percent.

Take your time. You should be in no rush. If this thing doesn't happen, I mean, it don't have to happen the first week of money. You know, the signing period is the second week of March, Cho. I ain't got to get one of the team. I ain't going to be able to do anything anyway. But the one thing about it, I think it's going to happen before that. When the time comes, I think, you know, teams especially that need a receiver of his caliber, again, even coming off injury, understanding the value that he can bring once he is healthy, a lot of teams can use that asset, a lot of teams.

And, you know, just not to go off topic, I love talking about Tyree, speaking of receivers that need to be utilized in the right way, that is another Matthew, Golden. Yeah. Matthew Golden had that same, that same type of, I don't understand what they're doing over there in Green Bay, but I just felt like throwing it out there. They need to utilize him the right way, too, because they use him as if he's just a gadget player and he can do somewhat of the same thing Tyree can. He just hadn't figured it out yet, if that makes sense.

Plus, I think the thing that players get caught up in is that teams do not get caught up into this. Hold on. We're about to invest $15, $20 million. I mean, maybe it would have been with incentive they can. can get to that number. You have to, you have to set aside what a guy once was.

Yes. And actually pay him and value him on what you believe he'll be. Right. We get caught up at a lot. We get caught up at a lot. We get caught up. Oh, I remember.

I remember. I remember. And we pay for what he was as opposed to what he is. What he is. Everything. Some things do increase in value. Some things, they lose value. Hey, I just saw it in.

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Charm has been part of your love stories and bromances for over 50 years. And you can find Bromance on the IHeart Radio Network or wherever you get your podcast. I'm Bowen-Yin-Yin. And I'm Matt Rogers. During this season of the Two Guys' Five Rings podcast, In the lead-up to the Milan Quartina-26 Winter Olympic Games,

we've been joined by some of our friends. Hi, Bowen, hi, Matt. Hey, Elmo. Hey, Matt, hey, Bowen. Hi, Cookie. Hi. Now, the Winter Olympic Games are underway, and we are in Italy to give you experiences from our hearts to your ears.

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Audible. There's more to imagine when you listen. Sign up for a free trial at audible.com. that went for $16 million. Yeah. The Enzo? It was yellow. I think it was one of one. But they're skyrocketing.

They're skyrocketed. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. And so I think for me, that's what I think that's what teams are going to look at. I think they'll give him decent money, Ocho, but I think it's going to be a lot of it's going to be incentives. Yeah. And knowing him, I think he's a player that would be able to hit those incentive, especially if he comes back anywhere near like what he once was. Miami traded a first round pick, a second round pick, two fourth round picks,

and a sixth round pick to acquire a cheetah in 2022. Despite Tyreek having two productive seasons in Miami, in hindsight, what do you think, Ocho, you like this trade? Yeah. I like it from a monetary standpoint. That's it. I mean, yeah, but it's, you would never be able to get that any. anywhere else, huh?

No. You would never be able to get that anywhere else. This is one of the best receivers, not just of this generation. He's still one of the best receivers of all time. Of all time. I think people need to understand the run that Tyreek was on before his injury. This ain't just know anybody. So, I mean, it was worth it.

And they got what they wanted. Obviously, the end goal is always to win a championship. But there are so many different, so many other holes that need to be filling before we can even think about, talk about a championship down here in Miami any damn way. So now, now I don't know it's going to be hard because just saying now,

Ocho, he has two more Super Bowls with another Super Bowl appearance. Now, maybe he doesn't have 1799 and 1700. Maybe he's around 13, but he has three, 1,300-yard seasons. Now, Ocho, we're looking like,

hold on, man, Tyree got like 12,000 yards and another bloop, bloop bloop another two Super Bowl rings hey I don't know ohcho you might be right even though we have some issues that and don't let anybody fool you they say they're not supposed to look at off-field issues

it all it all depends on who it is yeah yeah you know they they move the goal the goalpost for who they want to want you know that absolutely you understand that and it's it's unfortunate that they've been given that kind of power to be able to control the narrow and tell the, and have, be able to finish your story in their own right. They just have too much power to me.

And I don't like politics. If I wanted to play politics, I would have been a politician. And everything becomes political and not what you've done on the field, which is why it just, it is what it is. You'd be a great politician. Just lie. Just tell people, just tell your constituents what they want to hear. They'll vote you in.

And then they get comfortable. That's why these people, 80, 80 plus years old. that's been in office for 40 years. Yeah. But, you know, they say, Lady Justice, because Lady Justice supposedly have a scale,

so justice is supposed to be balanced, and it's supposed to be blindfolded. But every once in a while, she'd be peeking on your, oh, I see you, yeah. Oh, yeah, all the time. All the time, and depending on it, when it comes to that, too,

now certain people play by different rules. Absolutely. Certain people play by different rules, and we can see that. going on right now. That's not the kind of talk show that we do have. But as you can see, there's a huge story going on. And there's certain people that play

in a whole different ballgame. And run their own system where the rules don't apply to them. Ocho, here's the list back to the NFL most hated players. Here's the full list from Vegas Insiders. Can you see it? No, I can't. If As can just text that to me,

so I can really chime in on this I like this. I want to see who's hated. Josh Allen, he's number 17 for the most hated, but he's number one for most loved. Kenneth Gant is number two for most love. Cam Ward,

number three, Bo Nicks, number four. Tyne Robinson is number five. Jane Daniel, six, Daniel Jones. Daniel Jones, Daniel Jones is number five most hated, but he's the seventh most loved.

Russell Wilson, number eight, most love. Justin Field, number nine. Aaron Rogers number 10. Sam Darley, Baker, Mayfield, Trevor. I don't know who put this head on Trevor Lawrence, but this ain't Trevor Lawrence. Okay. I got the list in front of me.

And most hated, obviously, being Jane the Hertz, Jake Moody, how in the hell did Jake Moody? How is he the most, who the hell voted on this? Don't start me the line. I mean, listen, I can understand Luther Burden, Luther Burden, has had some issues, you know, some issues, obviously. on social media, a lot of people going back and forth.

Hey, Unk, no disrespect, but people hate cold strange. Bro. I'm thinking he's a tight end, right? Ain't you a tight end? From Jacksonville? He's from Jacksonville or Miami? I see Miami.

Deshawn Watson. I mean, we understandable. Oh, he's a guard. Tarreek Stevenson. Okay. I'm trying to figure out how these offense and linemen and some of these players like, Like, bro.

You know, some of this really doesn't make sense to me. Most of the time, players that are hated are those that are always at the forefront or those that are very active. So this is confusing me. We see Justin Fields on here. We can kind of understand why people hate Justin Fields. Obviously, Drette, the Jets is not having any success. Anthony Richardson, the ups and downs that he's had in his career.

We can get it. Shamar Stewart. We can see Bengals fans being upset at him. I can understand why he's made this list. Aaron Rogers, I mean, he rubs a lot of people the wrong way, obviously. Either you like him or you don't, there's really no in between with him. Zach Wilson, who doesn't like Zach Wilson? I love Zach Wilson.

Anybody that doesn't like that Jackson, there's something wrong with you. He don't even. Again, exactly. Why do people not like Zach Wilson? Cooper Rush. What? I see Joe Burrow on this list. I think people don't like Joe Burrow because, I mean, for very, for very,

for obvious reasons. I mean, Joe Burrow. He has a supermodel as a girlfriend. I mean, he looks like a damn supermodel and he's a quarterback of the best team with the best dual threat of why he's not in the NFL. And I understand why they hate him.

This is a cool list. Hold on. John, why is, why the hell is Cooper Rush on here? Tell me so we both, though. Why is Josh Allen all the way at 17? Why is Miles Garry? on the most hated list. What is there to hate unless you're a Steelers

fan and you're still holding what happened with him between him and Mason Rudolph against him? That's pretty much it. And Cam Ward. What the hell the Cam Ward do? What the Cam Ward do to be on the list of most hated? Look at the number three for most loved. Yeah, this makes absolutely no sense.

Look at Josh Allen. He's number one for most love. Kenneth Grant. Yeah, I don't know. I don't know who made this. Hey, who the hell Listen, that ain't Trevor Lawrence? Who is that? With the dreads.

They got Travis Hunter. And that ain't Travis Hunter either. Oh, it is. Yeah, it is. Yeah. Yeah. That list is weird. It's kind of weird.

You kind of understand why some people hate certain people. Obviously, Jaylen Hertz, his hate is well renowned because people do it publicly, whether there's players, whether there's analysts, whether there's pundits, and whether there's fans. But some of the people on here, it just, it makes no sense. No. What the hell did Josh Moody do? What did Jake Moody do? Excuse me.

Jake Moody. What did Jake Moody do? I mean, Roshan Slater got hurt. Why are you hating him? The man got hurt. Daniel Jones. Daniel Jones barely even talks. I barely heard him, I barely hear him talk.

All he does is he leaves New York. He goes to goddamn Indianapolis and changes the trajectory of that franchise until he got hurt. I don't know. It's a confusing list. Oh, yeah. Jake Moody was the guy that kept missing those, he missed those kicks for the 49ers. Remember?

And they released it because he was, hook it, he was, he was kicking issued into San Francisco Bay. Okay. Okay. So it's, it's the 49er fans that,

that hate him, then obviously. Okay. I'm assuming that everybody, it's the fans that voted on this. They didn't get no team vote. Oh, that's messed up. Hey, that's funny.

Hey, that's funny. As long as I'm not on the list, that's all that matter. Oh, Cho, Jared Jones became a Hall of Famer in 2017, but he says it never would have happened without the presence of one key player. Jerry said, I have a gold jacket. I wouldn't have the gold jacket had Michael Irvin not played for the Cowboys, in a matter of speaking. To be involved in be around winning mentality or that winning physicality,

When Michael says it, I listen. Oh, yeah? I like Jerry giving Mike praise, you know, for him getting his gold jacket. But hell, if Mike didn't play there, he still would have got their gold jacket regardless. Jerry? Michael was the heartbeat.

He was the heartbeat of that team. That Michael was, and it's very, it's not very often that the leader of your team is a wide receiver. But playmaker was it. He was. He was the heartbeat of that. You see him on the sideline.

It's Michael is getting in... Pause, getting in everybody's ass. It's Mike. I mean, Troy, we're every once in a while, but normally it was Mike. Right. Do your damn job. Right.

Packers running back, Josh Jacobs, spoke about playing with Antonio Brown with the Raiders in 2019. This is what Jacobs had to see. He'd be in meetings on his phone, and he ain't even hiding it. that he's on his phone. The only person to go out there in the field

and never mess up a mess up a play, the hardest worker ever. That's always been him. Ocho. That's always been A.B. How you, Ocho, how are you in the meeting on your phone? Hey, when he touched that field,

you know what you get. He's one of the hardest workers. You've got to understand. Me and A, B, been working out together since 2001. Every off season. He wasn't even in NFL yet. every off season. So I already know

why the product on the field looked the way it did because we all worked the same way. We worked the same way every single all season. I'm not sure at what point in our career did things go that way.

Because I understood what it took for us to even get to the NFL. I don't know when he went off track a little bit. You became great and kept that same focus. He became great

and they let stuff slide production intolerance. So when he miss a meeting... I'm Dylan Playfair. And I'm Tyler Smith. We're putting loneliness in the penalty box by talking to some of our favorite athletes about the importance of friendship. This is bromance. Bromance is brought to you by Charm Diamond Centers, proudly Canadian-owned and operator. Charm has been part of your love stories and bromances for over 50 years. And you can find Bromance on the IHeart Radio Network or wherever you get your podcast. I'm Bowen-Yang. And I'm Matt Rogers. During this season of the Two Guys Five Rings podcast.

In the lead-up to the Milan Quartina 2026 Winter Olympic Games, we've been joined by some of our friends. Hi, Bois, hi, Matt, Hey, Elmo. Hey, Matt, hey, Bowen. Hi, Cookie. Hi.

Now, the Winter Olympic Games are underway, and we are in Italy to give you experiences from our hearts to your ears. Listen to Two Guys Five Rings on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. And the winner of the

I Heart Podcast Award is you can decide who takes home the 26 IHard Podcast Awards Podcast of the year by voting at IHeartPodcastawards.com now through February 22nd. See all the nominees and place your vote at IHeartPodcastawards.com. Audible is a proud sponsor of the Audible Audio Pioneer Award. Explore the best selection of audiobooks, podcasts, and originals all in one easy app. Audible. There's more to imagine when you listen. Sign up for a free trial at audible.com. they let it slide.

When he was late for practice, they let it slide. Remember the last game of the season, he was supposed to display, and he was late. He showed up 30 minutes before they were supposed to kick off, and Mike Tomlin deactivated. Remember that? So that's the difference. What you did is that you became great

and you still showed up on time. He used that time like, damn, okay, I can get away with stuff. That's the difference. Hey, he was special though. Yes, I believe he had another 300, the catches in him. Another 3,000 yards, another 30 touchdowns. Yes, he did. He was. But he got high on his own supply. You got to realize, Ocho, what the Steelers let you get away with, they weren't going to let you get away with that at no place else. What your first relationship

let you get away with, nobody else will because they know the backdrop and they know how it ended with them. So even though we let you get away with it, you see what happened? So I've got to hold you accountable. Everybody knew the story. The man, they had a walkthrough in the hotel. Ocho, how do you miss a walkthrough in the hotel ballroom? You in the hotel, Ocho. Ocho, we got a meeting going on in your backyard.

All right. Damn, everybody there. What a hell, Ocho? It's in your backyard. Right. And it just got to the point. he didn't get it. He didn't get it.

I wish there was someone that could have reached him that could have, that AB had a five-year, six-year stretch that you could put alongside jerry's, T.O., Randy, Lafiz, Gerald, Tori, Hope, whoever the receiver is, whoever your favorite receiver is currently.

A.B. had a five-six-year stretch that arrived with anybody that's ever played that position that's ever played in the NFL. Ain't, ain't none like it. Ain't none like it. And one thing that I've always done is obviously I understand the stuff that happened off the field, being a very, very, very good friend of mine. But there's certain boundaries that I don't cross, allowing people to mature, allowing people to grow within their own right and not trying, not wanting to interfere in what they have going on. Because, you know, you have people surrounding you and you don't want to somewhat, you know,

butt into people's personal business and personal space. So A-B is one that I've always allowed to spread his wings and do his own thing. But I've always been a huge advocate for what he's done on the field. Always and always showed love, always talked about him in high regard based on the relationship that we've always had. Not agreeing what he's done off the field. I don't agree with that. But the work we put in over there, it's been damn, Uncle, it's been damned there 20 years now. Yeah.

Yeah, for sure. Just think about where we came from to where we ended up into how it was going now. I wish it could have been different. I wish it could have been different. And he has time to write his wrongs. He has time to write his wrong still. Now, it might not be on the field. No, that's over.

Once he threw those paths and the stand, then he did what he did in the metal lands or what, just they, whatever they call it, Ocho, it was over. His career was effectively over. after he said what he said about Tom I could have never done that after that man took you in allowed you to stay I could have never done that but the problem is chatting like

oh oh you say production intolerance but you see what happened is is that if he'd have been on the roster the first week of the season that 30 million becomes guaranteed so if he don't have the guarantee any behavior like this Ocho how is he going to be

when he got 30 million guaranteed on point no he's not No. He was making money in Pittsburgh and he wasn't on point. He was showing up late. He was doing all that stuff. So in other words, you just told us last night.

If you can't manage $1,000, you can't manage $100,000. So in other words, he's getting preseason money and behaving like this. What happens when he gets $30 million fully guaranteed? Okay, I see. I see what you said. Now, I'm just using what you said. That's what you told. Chad, what don't you say last night?

if you can't manage $1,000 you can't manage $10,000 if you can't manage $100,000 if you can't manage $100,000 if you can't manage $100,000 you can't manage a million so the man making $1,500 a week in training camp

you mean to tell me that now of a sudden he ain't going to be on his phone in meetings when he's got $30 million guaranteed he's going to show up the walk-toos that's in the hotel ballroom Hey go ahead Hey can ask you a question

being on that phone right? And in the meet rooms. Missing that walk-through, right? When that whistleblower at 1 o'clock on Sunday, what'd you get on the field? See, you could see? You've got to have a singular focus.

I got to manage a team, Mocho. No, but answer the question. What do you get when he gets on the field? He played well. Where it matters. We got a lot of people be in the meeting rooms, right? They don't be on their phone. We got a lot of people show up to the meetings on time.

But on Sunday, they ain't worth a goddamn. So in other words, you to tolerate. So in other words, you'd tolerate. that. Yeah, like the Steelers did all these years. Why? Because what is he giving you on the field? And what happened?

And what happened? They got rid of it. He goes to the Raiders. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. And what did the Raiders do? Got rid of it. Okay, he goes to the Patriots. Hey, eh, um, hey, um, hey, wait,

they had the Raiders. Hey, he would try. Oh, so we're talking about the Raiders. This is the Raiders story. Oh, let me talk about the Raiders. Oh, I was just speaking in general. So he goes, so he leaves. You thought he learned this lesson, but I said this in 2016 when he went Facebook live in the locker room after they beat the cheese.

I said, boy, they created a monster. I said, if they don't suspend him, they've created a problem that they're not going to be able to harness. And I be damn. But anyway, that's neither here nor there. Okay. Hey, but the funny thing. The funny thing about it is, is if we talk about, you know, the issues and the behavior most of the time, when you know also the owners in general, the teams. the coaches, when you have a player that's that productive, a lot of this stuff slides for a very long time.

It slides for a very long time. And he's just not, he just happens to be one of the cases. You know, there are many cases. I'm talking with some of the greats, the elite greats that have had these same issues over the years. And we hear the stories all the time. Obviously, there's no need to bring it up right now being that we're on topic of just him in general. But some of us, some of us are able to do it the right way. You were able to do it the right way. I, was able to do the right way pushing the envelope a little bit. I love pushing the envelope on without crossing the line. If you know what I mean.

Yes. I knew what lines had crossed. I'm going to get to the line, but I ain't going to jump off the way. How about this, Ocho, you get to the line and look over it. You don't step over it. Oh, no. I can see everything I need to see looking over the line. Like, yeah, okay, yeah, yeah, I need to be over there.

I understood. Listen, I also understood is that window of opportunity I had in NFL. People don't understand. I was a thinking, man, I understood it was merely a chess match for me. How can I maximize everything I can out of this small window of opportunity, right? Without burning the bridge because I'm going to need this bridge later on in life. And I tell you this, I tell you this all the time. I'm going to need this NFL bridge.

I'm going to need this entity to be able to continue to push me forward in things that I want to do outside of the game of football. I understood that. So I'm going to piss them off a little bit, but there's certain lines I refuse across because I know I'm going to need you later on. I know I'm going to need you. So I was I was playing their game doing it my way, but I understand I'm still going to need you on the back end. So I'm not going to burn the bridge fully.

I'm going to light it, but I ain't going to burn it down. Ocho, he got the numbers that he got. A.B. had another 300 catches in him. Easy. He had another 2,000, 3,000 yards in him. Easy. I just wish somebody could have got to him to say, AB, do you realize what you're costing yourself?

And I look, and they gassed him up because you remember he got on, yeah, A, B, you're free. That man can't tell you what to do. That's a grown-ass man. Why are you tripping? Y'all gassing this man up to lose $30 million? Yeah. I just never, I never understood that. I'm a grown man.

I get that you're grown. But when you're working, when you're working, when you're, when you're, you're, you working on somebody else's job, you have to, if they say your shift started this time, you have to be there. At that time, yes, sir. I don't get it.

I don't get it. I don't get this way of thinking for some of us. It's not all of us. But some of us think like, oh, as long as I do my job, no, bro, it don't work like that. It does not. It does not.

And the moment they get an opportunity they're going to let you go because you don't get comfortable and you're never going to see it coming. And then the thing is, you're never going to get treated in the second place like you got treated in the first. Because after a couple

of incidences with the orators, what happened on Joe, they let him go. One incident with the Patriots, they let him go. Tom Brady goes in there, vouchers. Do you know what it takes?

for a quarterback of that ill to vouch for you. Yeah. He understands the value that you can bring in help. You're going to make my job easy. Come on now. And then you do. Come on down here to Tampa. Yeah.

I can't remember what happened, but I know it was something. But that's crazy. I just hate that this man, he was special. He was special. Absolutely. And I think not enough. At the end of day, he grown.

At the end of the day, he grown. But I don't think he had enough people around him to hold him accountable. And if they're worse thing that can happen is that you go on social media and you let them gas you up. People that's never going to be in your position. People that would love to be in your position. And they tell you what they would do. Man, I wouldn't do that either, A.B., if they were in that position, they do just the opposite. Yeah, especially if they were that good.

Especially if you were that good. I mean, it's easy for people to say, what they wouldn't do when you can't do it. But when you can and you're that good at what you do, sometimes you're thinking isn't logical as it is knowing you can't do it. Everybody say what they would do if they had $10 million.

Well, it's easy to say what you had wouldn't do when you ain't got $10 million. Everybody goes, oh, but I wouldn't, man, if I had $10 million, I still live, no, you wouldn't. Ain't nobody made that kind of money and still living the exact neighborhood unless it's middle class, the upper middle class. So stop lying.

I mean, y'all just say that because y'all think it makes y'all sound good. Or I'm down to earth. Ain't nobody making $10, $20, $30 million driving the same car that they grew up with. You're not buying a Honda. It sounds good. And on the internet, like, oh, yeah, boy, oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. But you're not. You're not.

I don't know who y'all are trying to convince. but I've come to the realization that the discrete committee, which is the internet, they're not real. What you call them? What? I like that. That's a good one.

But they're not real. They just say stuff and they hope somebody else picks up like, yeah, and piggyback that. Right. And agree? What person you know, Ocho, make $10, $20 million and stay in the exact same neighborhood that they grew up in?

Mm-mm. But it sounds like that. good. Yeah, it does. It does. Everybody is not happy that your success that you were able, that Ocho was able to leave the neighborhood. Man, Ocho left. Man, I remember Ocho, he, well, he right there in the Pocan being right there in Liberty City. He ain't held nothing. Everybody is not happy for your success, even though they watch you and could not say, they had your ability, but they watch you and what you did to become successful and then become envious of you when you became successful.

Put it to you like this, Ocho, a lot of times failure loves company. Because if you're not careful, somebody will be mad at you and they'll get other people to be mad at you because they're not successful, they're not successful. So guess what? Now you got two unsuccessful people mad at you because you became successful. You see how that company, how they love each other? Yeah. Oh, they always do.

Hey, up, we all got the same 24 hours. Now, what you choose to do with yours and what I choose to do with mine, that's on you. But I know what I'm trying to get to. But they get mad at you, Ocho. Man, all you do is work, um, then I have success.

Don't nobody mean no house that size. So I guess I'm supposed to say at the same score. I make it. I'm supposed to stay in the same thousand square foot send the block home that I grew up in. As a matter of fact, why don't I just build an outhouse? I don't need no running water,

no indoor plumbing. You can't get mad at someone's success because they're willing to do what you want or can't. Sometimes it requires both. B-O-L-F, both. Both. And you know what? Another part I hate to is when you put all the work in,

when you put all the work in, right? and you become successful, the people that had nothing to do with your success, all of a sudden they act like you owe them something. I don't owe you. I can give you something out of kindness of my heart, but I don't owe you anything. Oh, you nothing.

Absolutely not. The hell? Get you what? Boy, hey. Pay for who? You got an idea. Everybody got an idea, huh? Everybody always has a brilliant idea.

idea on what to do with your money. Man, if I had it, well, God must be no something because he'd know you'd end up if you had it, so that's why he didn't get it to you. That's your passion. Okay, man, I have me a car wash. I have me a fleet of salons.

Okay, that's your dream. That ain't mine. Uh-uh. Definitely not. Definitely not. And then here's the thing, Ocho. So where's your money? How much you putting up? No, man, I'm going to run it.

Now, all you're going to do is run your mouth. So I'm fronting all the money and you got, you got no skin in the game. Anybody that doesn't have skin in the game, it's easy for them to walk away. You ain't got to take no loss. Nothing. Man. Somebody talking about Warren Buffett. Hey, y'all, let me ask you a question.

How does Warren Buffett fly? Is he on Delta? or do he got a 50 to 70 million dollar private jet? You see? Anybody else y'all care to mention? Hey, them folks that are a little different, man. They live different. And the thing is, look, when you got that kind of money,

I mean, at some point in time, I mean, some people like land and, you know, they bought artwork or they buy cars, but they have habits. I guarantee you, Warren Buffett got something. I understand he got to, you know, he liked to go to Dary Queen and get a, McDonald's. Yeah. like ice cream cones. He got something.

He got some artwork. He got something. He lived different. And I don't blame it. But guess what? Breaking news. Oh, Jacob said he ordered the calamari. But you blame me?

You and you and Jacob ate both. I had one piece. Hey, calamari, good. I like me some calamari. It's the only seafood I can eat. It's a mom. Well, it's not a shelfish, but anyway. I'm Bowen-Yang.

And I'm Matt Rogers. During this season of the Two Guys Five Rings podcast, in the lead-up to the Milan-Cortina-26 Winter Olympic Games, we've been joined by some of our friends. Hi, Boen, hi, Matt, hi, hi, Matt. Hey, Elmo. Hey, Matt, hey, Bowen. Hi, Cookie.

Hi. Now, the Winter Olympic Games are underway, and we are in Italy to give you experiences from our hearts to your ears. Listen to Two Guys Five Rings on the I-Heart Radio, app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. And the winner of the IHeart Podcast Award is, you can decide who takes home the 26 IHeart Podcast Awards Podcast of the year by voting at IHeartPodcastawards.com now through February 22nd.

See all the nominees and place your vote at IHeart Podcast Awards.com. Audible is a proud sponsor of the Audible Audio Pioneer Award. Explore the best selection of audiobooks, podcasts, and originals all in one easy app. There's more to imagine when you listen. Sign up for a free trial at audible.com. I'm Daniel Jeremiah. And I am Greg Rosenthal. I know that, Greg.

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