Club Shay Shay - Best of Playing Days Stories Part 1: Ricky WIlliams Played on THC + Pranking Rookies!

Episode Date: July 11, 2025

Shannon Sharpe and Chad “Ochocinco” Johnson are joined by Ricky Williams, Terron Armstead, and DeSean Jackson! Ricky opens up about his THC use during his career, Armstead recalls his record-breaking 40-yard dash, and DeSean reflects on his rollercoaster journey with the Eagles.   0:00 - Ricky Williams on using THC during his playing days 16:19 - How Unc/Ocho used to prank rookies back in the day 25:00 - Terron Armstead on breaking the combine 40 record for OL 30:07 - Armstead on dark truths about NFL injuries (Timestamps may vary based on advertisements.) #Volume #ClubSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Join me, Greg Rosenthal and an all-star cast of media personalities, including Mina Keim, Steve Weisch, Kevin Harlan and more for a look at football's best since the turn of the century. Listen to NFL Daily's top 25 players of the last 25 years starting on June 30th on the iHeart radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcasts. Ricky, we got something. You know, you're from, well, you're from San Diego. Where do you live now? Are you back in San Diego?

You in Texas? You in Miami? I live in Northern California. You live in Northern California now? Yeah. Oh, okay. Well, we got something that you might can help us out on. You recently spoke at Legislation Texas.

They're trying to ban marijuana products. I guess it's products will have the THC in it, correct? It's, I mean, yes, it's not, it's not supposed to, but, and that's why it's the issue is that pretty much, you can go to a gas station in Texas and get THC. Well, damn. And they try, so they don't like, in California, you have these like, these specialty shops.

You have cannabis shops that you go into and you can buy, you know, obviously you can buy, I don't like, in California, you have these like these specialty shops. You have cannabis shops that you go into and you can buy, you know, obviously you can buy, I don't know, Graham or whatever the case may be. I mean, you can probably speak to that a little better than I can. But so what are they trying to like take it completely out or they're trying to get like restricted where you have to go to a specific place

and not just your arbitrary gas station? It's both, but it's a little extreme. They're trying to ban it 100% and they say they're gonna open up the medical program. And I think it's a good idea to open up the medical program, but I think it's a little too much to say, to ban it 100%. It does need to be regulated more, but not banned.

But you do realize that when they open it up for medical purposes, or so they say medicinal purposes, you know only a select group of people get those licenses, right? You know that it is, you know, what we have been incarcerated for for two, five, 10, 15 years, now we got, you know, we're selling a little nickel bag

or a little gram, little whatever the case may be, woop, woop, woop. Now they get a license and they get to capitalize on it and make millions and millions and millions of dollars. And then we get cut out like, and we done spent time in jail for that. Real. Yeah, it's real.

It's real. And then the funny thing about it is they don't allow things to pass or they don't legalize things until they're able to monetize on it. Yeah, once they find they can tax you on it. That's exactly how it is. And obviously, you understand the other aspect, the other dynamic of certain people, obviously of color, who have used it as a way of survival, as a means to provide. They've been locked up for years, and we understand how that goes.

It's always a double-sided sword in a sense, but hopefully those that are able to use it for medicinal purposes and everyone is given the opportunity to get those licenses when the time comes. Yeah, I mean, speaking to what you're talking about, Chad, there are a lot of people in prison still that shouldn't be in prison. Yeah.

But also most states, because when the movement first started, most of the people were liberal. So when the movement first started, they made sure in a lot of the legislations that people who have been incarcerated or felonies have easier access. They can. If you've been incarcerated for cannabis, nonviolent cannabis related offense, in a lot of states, you have easier access. You can get access to a license. Okay, that's nice. That's cool. Okay. It is but the issue is that most of those people can't afford or don't have the expertise to be able to do anything with those licenses.

Right. Right. So, yeah, so it don't really work. Yeah, so it don't really work. I was talking to someone and they said, look, when we get a license, us, people that look like me, you and Ricky, don't be selling your homeboy a pound. Do what you do to guy like, do the guy, Ocho, I'm talking to somebody that's kind of in that business.

And to keep the business above the board, when your homeboy come, don't sell him a pound. Sell him what you're supposed to sell. Keep it above the board so you get to keep your license. I know your homeboy, come on bro, ain't nobody gonna know. Yes, they gonna know. Cause as soon as you get jammed up, do what you gonna say, Ocho.

To keep yourself from getting 10 to 15, you gonna dime your partner out, he gonna lose his license, they gonna shut him down. Every time. So if we're fortunate enough to be in those positions, let's just do right, hey, keep that money flow going. Because like you said, that's a cash business. Big one, a big one at that.

It's just like alcohol, prohibition, they read bootleg, moonshine and all that stuff and they say, hold on, we keep bus, let's just, hey, let them make it and let's tax their ass on it. The same thing with cigarettes. Let's tax them. We could get some, oh, this is a billion

and billion and billion dollar business. Instead of hiring all these people to try to bust the steels and cut the trees down, we can monetize it. It wants anybody, look, once someone finds they can make some money off it, they're gonna make money off it. It's really that simple. And, but I'm glad you look, Rick, let me ask you this. Had the laws and the way people look at because when I was when I was younger and growing up in the league,

marijuana was a stigma. People frowned upon it. And it's not nearly that. I mean, now, California, they walk around, they be smoking it outside, it ain't nothing. How different do you think your career would have been had you been allowed to partake? You know, I think it would have been a lot different

because just off the field, just all the trouble I was in all the time and the hits to my reputation at the time, it was so stressful that it, I'm sure if things were going better and I was allowed to be myself that I would have been able to perform at even a higher level, no pun intended.

But no, but seriously, because I think we only have so much energy and when things are stressing us out, that's energy that's being wasted that could be going to something different. Right. I mean, you look, California has always been very, very liberal, very open-minded.

I mean, you go to the Bay and the hippies and the yuppies and they had Woodstock and all that other stuff going on. Do you think your upbringing, do you think where you was raised at played a role in you being so open and partaking in marijuana? And did you smoke in high school? Did you smoke in college? When did this, your love, infatuation,

or whatever the case you might want to call it, when did your love or when did you first partake in marijuana? The first time it was in high school, but I wasn't a smoker. I didn't really become a smoker until I got into the league. Because it was stigmatizing. I was an athlete and growing up, one thing that ever my grandma everybody said, right, don't throw it away for drugs. So, you know, I tried, I listened, I tried to

listen. So no, but it wasn't until I wasn't until later. And I definitely think when I was 13, my mom, my stepdad was a was a roster. And so he would smoke every night, it just was part of his routine. And my auntie, she had a she had a tree in her in her kitchen. So it was around me. So I was I was desensitized to it, like, you know, I think if people aren't around it, and they just hear the stigma, that's all they have to go on. So I was around it. And the people that I Jim, I stepped down to my auntie with people I probably liked the most in the whole world

and they smoked. So, but I get, I wasn't partaking when I was young, but I was open to it. I wasn't against it, I wasn't anti. Right. Yeah. Oh, my bad, my bad. You know what, I'm really curious.

You say you hadn't smoked when you, me obviously most of the time when it comes to people having certain habits, it comes from their surroundings and their upbring, but the fact that you had the discipline not to be interested in it, why you were young, but once you got to the NFL, did you use the NFL because of injuries, because of stress?

I mean, is there a specific reason why? It was stress. I think the reason I had to use it up until that point because life was good. I think the reason I had to use it up until that point because life was good. I wasn't really stressed about anything. I didn't need it. And I got to the point where things got really stressful and I realized that this helped me.

Because everybody knows I'm a shy person, I'm an introverted person, and something about smoking, I just get to be with myself. Right? And I feel like I get energy. I get energy from that and it helps me. Was it a situation, Rick, I think the thing is,

you said the expectations, and we gonna get to this, where Mike Dicker gave up his entire draft class to select you. You know that had never been done in the history of sports. I mean, basically that was ASAP giving his kingdom away for a horse. And the expectations that came along now, you're supposed to be the greatest NFL running back

because you look at all the running backs, Jim Brown and Barry Sanders and Emmett Smith and Dickerson, all those guys, they got slotted. The man gave up his whole entire draft class to select you. So now that comes along, I mean, you're a Heisman Trophy winning running back. You had the most rushing yards in college history. So now I'm a Heisman Trophy winner.

I got the most rushing yards. A guy just gave up an entire draft class for me. That's a lot of expectations on a running back. Did that play any role? Honestly, if I'm being real, you can call me ungrateful, but I don't think I even got to the point of realizing the expectations because I was so disappointed

that I slid to the number five spot. Oh, okay. Wow. Okay. So I was like, I was in shock. I mean, after that, I don't even remember what happened. I don't even remember. I don't even remember what happened because just what you said, you know, to me,

I thought I had made the case and not even to be the best in the future but that I was the best at least I had the potential to be the best because of the track my track record so I thought I should have been the first pick and I wasn't and then and the edger was picked number Hall of Fame career, but I wasn't even the first running back pick. So, so I mean, again, I remember sitting there and I was spinning. And I remember them saying something about picks or something, something, you know, Mike Dick got something with the cigar.

And then, and then I was on an airplane headed to New Orleans. Did you get hot? Did you get hot at night? I wasn't smoking then. You weren't smoking then. So you didn't start smoking till you got to what, Miami? I started smoking in New Orleans. Started smoking my second year in New Orleans.

Was it injury related? I mean, you talk about you're an introverted person. I mean, I think I remember you was talking and you always had your face mask, you had your helmet on and you had the dark shield. And everybody was like, damn, what's going on? Ricky seems like, this is what they were saying. They said, man, that dude weird, man.

Who gives an interview with the helmet on? We can't see his eyes. We don't know what he's thinking. People like for you to make eye contact. And you were like, and I was like, wow, okay, this is different, but hey, to each his own. The man did win a Heisman. He was, you know, won all these awards, the dope walker.

So, hey, it's hard to argue the man has had success doing it that way. It's not the same though. I mean, my time in college and my time in the NFL were completely different. And basically, it was just the people's orientation towards me. Okay, you know, because as a sensitive person, that's what it means. It means like, I need to be around people that feel me. Because if I'm around people that don't feel me, then it's hard for me to feel myself. And so I would be around people that didn't feel me. And when I get to feel myself was I go home,

my home is just where I smoke a little bit and get on the game, just to relax, just to give it I was around people that didn't feel me. And when I could feel myself was I go home with my homies, right? Smoke a little bit and get on the game. Just to relax. Just to give it, just to, again, recharge so I could get up and go do it again. Being on the field, I love being on the field. Nothing, nothing better, nothing. To me, there was no better feeling in the whole wide world.

And I'm talking about practice. There was no better feeling in the whole wide world for me than to be on that football field, nothing. That's all I wanted to do. But all the other stuff, it just made it almost to the point where it wasn't worth it. And so I realized if I wasn't like smoking, connecting, I wouldn't gave up the game.

You know, it's funny, and Rick, when I think about it, as great as you were in college, as great as you were in the NFL, just imagine if they were a little bit more lenient with the rules and allowing you to smoke, let's say for medicinal purposes. If it's something that you have an issue and it makes you feel a little bit more comfortable and being able to operate and do your job on a day-to-day basis, who knows what you could have done because you were smoking weed and doing damage and running like crazy.

So I could just imagine, do you ever sit back and think about and have regrets in the way things turned out or went? And if you could rewind the time and do it all over again, would you make a different choice as far as smoking is concerned? I think about this a lot. And I think I think about more is the people, the players, the guys now in the league who, because things have changed, who can, who can, it's not so much pressure.

And I feel like I had something to do with opening that door. And to me that makes, that makes all of it worth it. And as far as regrets, I can say this now because I've lived and I've like I had something to do with opening that door. To me, that makes all of it worth it. As far as regrets, I can say this now because I've lived and I'm living now, is I wish that I would have taken more of a advocacy role at the time. Because what you're saying is true. That's real. I wasn't hurting anybody.

I was just taking care of myself so I could go deliver the product that they That they were expecting me to deliver and I and I did I mean when I got to Miami and I got into my groove You know, I led the league in Russian all pro um And so I think and to me the league we go out there and put our bodies in our minds and our hearts on the line And they should give us all reasonable means to be able to take care of ourselves to be able to do that. And I wish I would have been courageous enough at the time to say that publicly. Because whether people believe it or not, once you say something

publicly and people are hearing it, it starts the conversation. And I think, and that's what I've seen the biggest effect I've had is people can talk about this now when I'm in the right almost expected to talk about it when I'm in the room, so It makes it easier Yeah I think the thing is Ricky is that like it was a stigma and the more people started to talk about it and you started To have more prominent people you started to have people like yourself or you have some of the Hollywood elites Start talking about it and it and the medicinal purposes

that it have. And it's it, and you know, I've heard people talk about, oh, you got no problem giving these guys shots. You got no problem giving these guy painkillers, getting them addicted to something. And then when they lead the league, they still need that and they can't get that and they're crashing out. Why can't you allow them to smoke marijuana?

Calm them down, take the pain away. Because at the end of the day, they're day, this is a gladiator sport. This is not a contact sport, this is a collision sport. There are no winners, there are only survivors in this game. And so if you're going to, hey, take this Vicodin, take this Percocet, take this, take this Toradol, take this and that, and all these anti-inflammatories, which is more dangerous to the body,

which is more harmful to the body, which is causing more harm and breaking the body down even more than this. Why not have a conversation? And I think the NFL, they did open their mind. They started doing a little bit of their own research because obviously, you know, they don't wanna make sure

they don't wanna get sued down the line. They started doing some research and I think they came to the conclusion that you and many in your area, Rick, had already known. Yeah. Yeah, it takes time. So I feel like I was a pioneer and I'm being rewarded for it now.

So it feels like it's working. But see, Rick, I don't know, man. You might've been smoking that Scania. You might've been on that Khalifa Kush. You might've been on that boat. So if you'd had that old homegrown, that would never showed up in your system. You could've just been...

See Hawks rookie DT, Byron Murphy II, took his teammates out for dinner and was pranked with a fake dinner bill 155,000. Oh funny. His reaction was priceless. His actual dinner bill wasn't much better. It was $38,000. Hey, that's oh Joe. Did y'all ever prank the rooks? This isn't I had a I mean as when I was a veteran, I didn't make the rookies do rookie night. I did. Now, when I was a rookie, I'd never forget Peter Warg, Darnay Scott, Ron Dugans, Danny

Farmer was there at the time, TJ. Now I had to pay for rookie dinner that night. I can't remember what the price was, but it was, it was, it was, it was a little hefty, but 38,000 thinking about that. That ain't much on that. Ain't much. When you look at some of the linemen, when the linemen go, go out, man, I've seen some of those, some of those receipts when the boys go out, boy, it'd be expensive. Well, you start ordering, you start ordering that King, you order that King Louis.

They do it on purpose. 500, $1,000 a shot. They do it on purpose. You get like 15 shots of that. And then they go order that big, they go order a bottle of wine that end up costing like 10 grand. Yes.

You get the big, you get the lobster. You know, they bring the lobster round on the wagon. The lobster this big, the wagon, I know y'all have seen it. They bring the lobster round in the wagon. Right. He think he going y'all y'all I know y'all seen it they bring the lobster round in the wagon right he thought he going for a ride little do you know hey they don't be playing boy they don't be playing a look uh porters and actually lilyie, they're rookie night out. We hit them for about 22,000.

See that ain't bad. You know me, I had to have a limo, you know, cause I ain't want nobody, cause they gonna go other places. I had a relationship. Y'all not finna get me broken up in the middle of the season. I know, I know, I know my, I know my limitations. I ain't fooling with y'all.

Same thing I tell my homeboys when they come, you know, Hey Sean, come on, let's go out. No, bro, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. You not finna mess with my home and leave. Right, right. No, absolutely not. I get some of my tea. Hey, hey bro, you going no, no, no. You're not finna mess with my home and leave. Right, right. No, absolutely not. I get some of my T.A. Hey bro, you going out?

Yeah, man. Hey, my homeboy's in town. Man, Sharp, you know we got him. Hey. Right. There you go. You good. Yeah, but other than that, old choc.

Yeah. Now listen, if you're a rookie, and you're not only a rookie, and you're a first round pick, man, listen. Oh, we rake it across the coast. Oh, they come in. I got a limo.

I got a limo because I got a limo by myself. That is a limo for me because I wasn't going out with them. Oh, I was going out with them afterwards. So I did a limo that would go take me back because I would. No, no, no, no. I'm going home. Right. But you know, back there, I think you had to get limo for like for like five, six hours, seven hours. It was probably like a hundred dollars an hour. It wasn't no sweat like that.

But the only thing I made sure about you, I wouldn't let you get stuff to take home. I don't care if you're mom, I don't care if you're dad, I don't care if anything. You're not getting stuff to, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, we're not gonna do that. Strict, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, we're not gonna do that. Strictly us. Us, us, us.

So that was like 22,000. I mean, you know, the guy that ordered King Louis, they ordered like a 15th Petruse, bottle of wine or Rothschild, whatever it was. They get a couple of bottles that I said bro y'all But you know they got to get they got to get the most expensive steak they got to get the lobster They got to get the mat everything so It it it it it cost them. I mean

22,000 wasn't that wasn't that much? But oh, yeah, you gonna pay. Oh, yeah, somebody say oh I wouldn't pay. But oh yeah, you gonna pay. Oh yeah. Somebody say, oh, I wouldn't pay. Oh yeah, you would. Oh, we gonna take it out your check. Oh, you won't pay. You won't pay. We're not going to allow you a tradition

that's been handed down the first round draft pick, a lot of times, we let them, y'all pull together. A lot of times, the first round they had to pay their own for himself. I remember to hit my brother, I think to hit my brother for like 12, 13 grand. But the thing is, is that you gotta do that. If you're a rookie, you've got to bring donuts,

you've got to bring breakfast sandwiches, you've got to bring food to the plane. I did it. You know how many times I'm hustling and bustling, I'm dressed like Jethro Bodeen, tie hanging all off. Pan about to fall off my ass. Man, Ocho don't laugh, Ocho.

Cause I gotta go, man, he want Kentucky fried chicken. He want Popeyes, he want this. I gotta go all the prided place, man. No, hell no. That's why I was like, I gotta make the team. All this they got me doing. I would have me somebody doing this for me. Please.

Oh man. Hell nah. But we did all that rookie thing in Ochoa. I went big into the haze and we make rookies say, you know, we might steal their car and drive that off or something like that. But all that I ain't cut nobody here. Because they nobody cut my hair because it really been a bit of some cut my hair.

They're gonna be a problem. So we're not gonna do that. So I wouldn't we didn't cut anybody here. You know, at Baltimore, we take the rookies to the goalpost. Goalpost. That was a hard. Yeah, that was a hard knock. Put him in a cold tub. Put him in the cold tub. Yeah him in the cold tub, yeah. We tape him up and put him in the cold tub. Stuff like that, Ocho.

But mainly we make him sing, not your album, I don't wanna hear about your fight song. I don't wanna hear about your album, you gotta sing some Luther Vandross, Barry White. I don't care. Sing something. Hey, whatever you know the words to. Other than your damn fight song.

So, but yeah, but that was, that was, yeah, that was back in the day, that was back in, yeah, we used to steal people cars and stuff like that. It's funny, because the past of time, it's like grown men, we behaved like eight, seven and eight year olds. Look kids, yeah. Oh, there's some good-

Armand Ross A. Brown thinks the NFL should make a rule change. Let's take a listen to the change he recommends. Okay. The rules should be changed. Obviously if you're in a division, you know, you should obviously make a playoff spot, but having a 14-win team, having to go on the road, it's kind of crazy, but I guess, you know, having to go on the road is kind of crazy,

but I guess, you know, I don't make the rules, so. Okay. No, we're not gonna change the rules because y'all might lose the game if you're a 14 win team and go on the road. That ain't how we do it. Right. It's been like that, Ocho.

So, well, listen, they go into Minnesota, right? They play Minnesota tomorrow. No, Minnesota comes to them. Oh, Minnesota comes to them? Yes. They already beat Minnesota on the walk. They kicked the field goal. I remember.

But what is he complaining about then? Because they might lose, be 14 and 0, and they have to start the season on the road. I know, yeah. Listen, that's nothing you should even worry about. Especially that goddamn high powered offense. There should be nothing you worry about. Whether you playing home or the way.

I understand the advantage that player that teams have playing at home, but missing the weight, the way y'all rocking offensively right now. I wouldn't care if we was playing in the Sahara desert. As long as Dan Campbell is my coach and he got that wheelbarrow with him go hornets, he carry in them every time he's coaching. I'm not tripping.

I am not tripping. I am not tripping. Yeah, he... So I don't agree. I think we are not both, we don't agree because the rules are the rules. We're not going to change the rules because we have an anomaly. How many times the 14 win team has had to start on the road?

So one time it happened in the hundred plus year history, now we're going to make a rule. So what? Nah, we're not going to do that. It was, it was, it was a great suggestion. Yeah. But, but the team, you know, and how y'all are playing on the road and at home, it really don't matter. It don't matter. So, no, what he said to Ocho is that if we have a better record than a division winner, we should be at home and they should have to go on the road. Okay, I see what you're saying.

No, they won the division. That's the reward you get for winning the division is that you get to play at least one game at home. At home, yeah. I see what you're saying. In the 2013 Combine, Teron recorded the fastest 40 for an offensive lineman in Combine history, a record that still stands to this day.

It was close. Lane Johnson ran 4.72, but Teron's record of 4.71 is close. And if I'm not mistaken, they're the only two offensive linemen that's running the 4.7s. They've been a couple of run low 4.8s, but no other linemen other than Teron at four seven one, Lane Johnson at four seven two have been in the offensive linemen have been in the four sevens. So as of yet, so now we're 13 years in counting 2013 to 2015 and Teron still held that record.

Teron look, you coming out of Arkansas, plan Pine Bluff and it's not like it used to be. There used to be a plethora of guys coming out of HBCUs. And so that would have been nothing, but here it is now we're in the 2010s and we get an offensive lineman, you're a three time SWAC, all conference player. And you go to the combine, what were your expectations?

Did you know you had this kind of ability in you? Yeah, for sure, for sure. I knew I had the talent and the speed and agility to showcase, I just had to get to the showcase. So it was really huge for me to get that combine invite. That was monumental for me trying to get more exposure, get more eyes to my tape. So I knew that I was going to go,

I was going for the record for sure. Like before we got to Indy, I was going for the record. I wanted to run faster, honestly, than that, but I'll take the four seven. Six four three oh five, that's moving now. Listen, that's what I would get rid of actually. I would get rid of asking how tall you were and how much you weighed to be able to run that fast.

Listen, I ain't run number four, five. So technically, boy, you right there with me. I'm right there on your neck. No, I was six, five, three, oh six, I believe. Three or four at the combine. Wow. So you knew, you knew, so what was, if I'm not, I don't know what the record was.

What was the record, what was the fastest 40 time for an offensive lineman before you broke it? It was 4-8-4. 4-8-4, wow, you didn't break it, you obliterated it. I needed it, I needed it, I needed all that. I needed that, that my moment, I was on NFLnetwork.com, NFL.com for like two hours, I needed all of it, so the scouts can go watch my film.

Okay, so now you go run that 40 yard dash time. You run 471 and that's really the audit. Yeah, they want you to jump high. Yeah, they want you to do too. But speed is what captivates their attention. Now you're in offensive lineman, you never gonna be able to unwind that 471 again. But you just want to put that on tape and let them see,

look, you got a phenomenal athlete. Yes, I went to Arkansas Pine Bluff. Yeah, I know you're going to downgrade me. Talk about who did I block and who did I play against, but I'm going to come and showcase my skills and let you see and then the chips fall where they may. So when you ran that time, did you know like, okay, I got their undivided attention. I'm about to get drafted. Yeah, no, for sure.

We have special talents down in these HBCUs all across the country, we do. So I just needed the opportunity to showcase my skill. I knew what time it was. I was going for the vertical record too. I missed that by half an inch. So like I knew that I was gonna be able to make that splash. And like I say, again, I needed it.

I really needed that chance to get all the scouts, just to watch my film. I wouldn't ask for no favors, but just check out the film and see the dominance. Yeah. Now, also, when I look at the offensive line position, as fast as you were, you know, as far as running a 40, did you have an advantage as far as your footwork goes when it came to playing offensive line as well?

Because most of the time, obviously, you know, playing offensive line is all about your hand placement and your footwork. You know, we always being balanced. Did that give you the advantage? Yeah, no, my athleticism, my agility, those were my strengths when I played throughout my 12 year career because I'm 6'5", 304, not the biggest tackle, not necessarily the strongest either, but I'm on your ass as soon as the ball's snapped, you know what I mean?

A lot of jump sets, I had to use that in my game, so finding ways to play to my strength and I was using my speed. Were you always an offensive lineman? Because I mean, with that kind of fast twitch, you might have been a tight end at some point in time in your career. Were you always an offensive lineman? Well, back in my hometown, Cahokia, Illinois, we're known for speed.

That's what we do, we run. So I was a defensive lineman and an offensive lineman. But I would go play 707 with the guys, corner safety, receiver. Damn! Really, yeah, really was like that. Really was like that. I can't do that shit no more, but I really was like that.

I can't move like that no more, Ocho. What season, look, you mentioned, you say, so you what 34, 34 right now to 35? 33. 33. Teron, you walk away from the game, you're only 33. Lyman normally played in at 36, 37, 38. We saw Jackie Slater play 20 years.

Yeah. And he retired at 40 plus. And we see Lyman especially, I don't know your injury history, that's why I'm going with this. Why walk away from the game and all that chatter out there? You see that money. So it is.

It's a lot of freshly printed money out there for sure. Yeah it is, yes indeed. I got a, man, God bless me with so many great moments and great years and a great career. My injury history is extensive. It is. It is long and I've been through it. And that's really the part for me is my body.

I love this game. Mentally, cerebrally, I can play the game forever, but it's just physically. And I'm okay with saying that, that my body is slowing down, it's movements and abilities that I just can't perform at the same level. And I take so much pride in my film. Yeah, man.

It has to look a certain way. Like every time I step on a field, it has to look pro ball, all pro. Like that's the brand I wanted to leave. So I never wanna look like I'm out there getting whooped on. That can't happen. You know what it takes a lot? It takes a lot of awareness, self-awareness at that for a player of your caliber or any player that's played in the NFL, that's played at a high level to understand when it's time to call the quiz. Most of the time, we'll ride the car to the wheels, fall off, you know? But no regard for, you know what,

I don't look the same. At what moment did you realize that, you know what, I really don't have it to be the player to all pro or pro bowl level anymore. But what moment did it hit you? Yeah, I've been dealing with a knee since my third year in the league, but it's been with me for my entire career. So man, just I'll speak on this year alone.

I didn't see a practice field like at all. And not because I didn't want to or the Dolphins just wanted me to rest. It's like, I literally couldn't walk. You know, I couldn't, after a game on Sunday, I wouldn't be able to walk on my own, you know, under my own power until Wednesday, Thursday. So I was only able to play under the pain meds.

I couldn't put any pressure on my knee. So it was like, I can't keep doing that to myself, man. We, it comes to that time. 33 and you now you get to be 40 and all of a sudden you're like, man, what my liver is shutting down, my kidneys and all the other things from taking those pain medicine. Because I've seen linemen have to take Vicodin

just to practice. I get the game. I get the game. I get the game. I really do because you know, hey, that's once a week. But the practice, oh hell. Yeah, yeah, no, that's crazy. And that was the norm for sure. I didn't wanna fall on that side.

Right. But the thing is, as Ocho was saying, it takes a space, because to the lay person, they don't really see what you know. And the thing is, is that when you, it's kind of hard to let go and not practice because as an offensive lineman sets or everything, whether you're going to jump sand, what you, hey, hey, lazy feet don't eat. And the thing is, you got to practice that during the course of a week.

It's hard for an offensive lineman to just go out there on a Sunday, jump set, quick set, a stab, whatever the case may be. And you going against the best of the best. You said it. You said it. The reps, especially for offensive line play, we so based on technique and timing

and all the hand placement and not to mention the cohesiveness of everyone. Cause you know, we're the only unit that never comes off the field outside of the quarterback. That's one person, but we're the only unit that never comes off the field. So that chemistry and timing, it just is really tough not getting those practice reps

and then preparing mentally for Max Crosby and Miles Garry. And that ain't cool. Like that's not okay. I can't keep doing that. You're dealing with TJ Watt. Listen, I'm not about to keep doing that, man. With no practice, like come on, man. Because like you said, you talk about your offense, Tyron,

you talk about your teeth, excuse me. you talk about, T, excuse me. You talk about your offensive lineman and like, okay, they get somebody else in there to practice it. But you and that left guard, y'all need to be cohesive. You need to like be on the same level and pass it off because if you're on different levels, gotta go hit that crack. And now everybody like, man, y'all hate judges.

But see, you might be a little slow. He might've been a little fast. And all of a sudden you give up a sack when y'all should have had that situation covered. I know, I look, and everybody doesn't do it the same. Cause I remember practicing with Gary Zimmerman, who's a two decade, all decade player in the eighties and the nineties.

He went to the hall of fame, but he didn't like me to chip block. He didn't like to chip. He like Sharpie don't touch him. He say, if I jump set him and you hit him, you're gonna knock him inside and now I can't get him and everybody gonna think I got beat. So don't touch him.

That's, yeah, no, that's a real thing. Especially if you have a big physical tight end like yourself. So like you hitting him too hard, he getting momentum. He getting like a joke into the inside move. You know what? I got him. Just get out the way.

Go get open. Jonathan, J.O. now I played with J.O. Jonathan Ogden who's the first baller Hall of Famer. He like, hey, knock him out if you can. For me, it depends on who it is, man. Who over there? Exactly, but like you said, certain offensive linemen, they want some,

I mean, hey, stick and stay, or some guys like don't touch him. But like you said, that practice, like for an offensive lineman and seeing, like I said, I've worked with them for like four years, worked with J-O for two years, and to see what they go through because they're working on their sets.

They're kicking. Am I gonna stab him? Am I gonna quick set him? Am I gonna jump set him? What am I gonna do? And now in the game, man, I wanna jump set, but that knee bother you. Now I can't just,

I can't, T, I can't do what I wanna do. The mind say do that. That body say, brothers, you do that, you gonna hurt. That body say you can't do that. No, you can't do what I want to do. The mind say do that. That body say, bro, just to do that, you gonna hurt. The body say you can't do that. No, you can't do it no more. Hey, when it came to playing the left tackle position, I think about my approach to playing receiver when it came to DBs and studying each DB every week

and understanding what type of DB I'm going against. You got some that are quick, some that are fast, some that are physical, some that are, some of that, you know, playoff or whatever it may be. What was your approach when it came to playing defense ends each week? Was your approach different as far as from a technical standpoint? Did you change up things you did depending on who you were playing that week? Well, I've always said to Zoto that it's a lot of parallels to me, a lot of similarities between O-line tackling D-end and receiver and corner. Like that one-on-one matchup, it's a lot of similarities between O-line, tackling D-end and receiver and corner.

Like that, that one-on-one matchup, it's a lot of dynamics there that's parallel to me. The technique that goes into it, tendencies, like you said, is he pressing? Or if I jab inside, what are you doing with his hand? Same thing, as I'm reading the defensive end. I'm looking at their alignment first, how wide is he getting?

And then it get off, you know, how well is he timing the snap? Then I want looking at their alignment first, how wide is he getting, and then it get off. You know, how well is he timing the snap? Then I want to see his home runs. What's his go-to move that he's consistently winning on? What's he's winning on the most? I break that down. That's the one I want to take away. I want to take that one away and then, all right, what's his second highest percentage move? The counter. I'm taking those top two away. Throughout my career, that was the goal, my objective of game planning. I want to take them top two winners away. Now, if you beat me with a third, you a bad man,

but you're gonna have to get that. But for me, I was taking those top two moves away. And one of the things that I've always liked to ask players that once they're done playing, who gave them the most fits for me? You know, everybody asks me all the time, listen, you played a very long time, you were going against most fits for me? Everybody asks me all the time, unless you played a very long time,

you were going against some, I've always had to deal with the number one DB, and everyone asks, who gave you fits? And obviously the one person I say every time- Reavis locked him up. That 2009, Reavis, he said, yeah, they had to lock everybody up. Reavis had to be super strong.

He ain't ask you about nobody else but you. You see how you did that? You see how you switched it? Dry some litchin' ass. You can do it, not about the litchin'. Hey, but who gave you fits, or you just wanna give them they flowers? Yeah.

You wanna, you know. Man, I had some battles. I had some of these guys I seen too many times. Like, I didn't wanna have these rivalries going on, but you know, that's how the schedule go. I played Miles the ton, Miles was always one of those. He's one of those, you gotta make sure you eat breakfast.

Like he's one of those for sure. But the guy that gave me the most fits, and I've probably seen him the most, and he is still underrated in my eyes, Robert Quinn. Robert Quinn, man. Oh, that first double Quinn? He been in that edge. He, listen, Robert Quinn. Robert Quinn, man. Oh, that first double Quinn? He been in that edge.

He, listen, Robert Quinn, he probably got the most sacks on me, like, out of everybody. He's the person that say, I got two on T-Steel. Like, he probably that one person that can say that. Right, okay. That dude getting, yeah. I don't even wanna see him post-career.

I don't wanna see him no more. I'm cool. We can't be friends, nothing. I don't wanna run into see him post-career. I don't want to see him no more. I'm cool. We can't be friends, nothing. I don't want to run into Robert Twins. That's dope. It's really like a dance because like you said, they getting that wide, they getting that wide, they getting to that wide nine.

And now, hey, you like, okay, I know he going to come wide, but what if he dropping bull with me? Okay, now he going to hit me and then he's spinning side. So I got all that going into, I got to look at him. Okay, what if he drop and bull me? Okay, now he gonna hit me and then he's spinning side. So I got all that going into, I gotta look at him, okay, what is he doing? Now I'm kicking. I can only kick so far cause the damn quarterback right there, hell,

I keep kicking, I'm gonna be in this damn lap. So I can only get probably like two kicks, T, and then I got the set. And I gotta take, I gotta be, I don't want him to get it, I don't want him to bend the edge on me. Cause these, like you said, miles can bend. But I also, I also don't want him to wax on wax off me across my face.

All that, we trying to process all that man. And they lining up in this wide nine and these athletes are only getting, they're only getting bigger, faster, stronger. So it's, man, it's tough to deal with. Like Micah playing Micah Parsons for the first time, it was Christmas day, we in Miami, beautiful day. We smacked the Cowboys, that ain't part of the story.

But seeing Micah Parsons for the first time in real life, it was different, bro. Like you are way too big to be moving this fast. It can be in that way. Like it just, the athlete, the evolution of the athlete is just, it's becoming something different, man. I'm cool. I'm cool, y'all.

Can you also- Especially watching, you know, playing against Derek Thomas, but the guy that I had the most respect for, I only played against him for two years because I was only in Baltimore two years. I've never seen a guy his size that quick. Javon first.

Who's that? Mmm, the freak. Man, freak. The first time I played him. The first time I played him. Yeah. Man, hey, I turned around and said, hey, y'all better throw it.

He was gone. Look out block. Dude, he took a step down this, cause I had to step. So I stepped with it. Man, by the time I put my foot down, he was on my shoulder. That's a bad feeling.

He get to your shoulder and you ain't extended. Hey, you might as well kiss the baby. That's a bad feeling. That's a bad feeling. Mom, hey uncle, you saw the picture. I just saw Javon cursse in the airport leaving Philly day before yesterday. Oh, did you?

Yeah, man. Before he got that, before he hurt the ankle, Ocho, dude was, I'm talking about, you talking about somebody like, he was like 6'4", 250. I'm talking about all, I'm talking about 5X gloves. I mean, his hands were like a ketchup man. Did Kirst get in, did he get into the hall? Nah, nah, nah.

He would, I mean, Tennessee, he was at Tennessee, his best years was at Tennessee. He goes to Philly and then he messed up his ankle. And it messed up his ears. But hey, back in the day, you know, dealing with DT, Bruce Smith was fast too. Bruce could bend. For a guy his size, normally guys 270,

they can't bend like that. Bruce be parallel to the ground. That move that you see there, that you see Vaughn Miller do, where he dip under and come down on one hand and get back up, Bruce could do that at 270 So hey, that's why you guys make the big bucks That's why you guys have paid on the offensive line because you guys got the toughest assignment because you're dealing with Like I said, basically it's like ginger Rogers and Fred Astaire. He's coming forward, but you gotta mirror

what he does moving backwards. And the thing is, you got a target that's sitting right there. And basically everybody in the shotgun now, so you can only set so far, before he sits your ass in the quarterback lap, or he'll reach over the top of you and grab you. Listen, yo, we need some more money, man. Hold on, we need some more of that money.

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