Club Shay Shay - Club Shay Shay - Stephen A. Smith Part 1 REWIND

Episode Date: June 25, 2025

Legendary sports journalist Stephen A. Smith visits Club Shay Shay to chop it up with Shannon about everything going on in the sports world. Both have experience working with Skip Bayless, so Stephen A. and Shannon share stories from their respective experiences working with Skip at "First Take" and "Undisputed". Stephen A. also dives into the importance of HBCUs, Jayson Tatum being better than Luka Dončić, Devin Booker's "Mamba Mentality" being stronger than Jimmy Butler's, and the real GOAT of the NBA. Is it LeBron James or Michael Jordan?See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Michael Kassin, founder and CEO of 3C Ventures and your guide on Good Company. The podcast where I sit down with the boldest innovators shaping what's next. In this episode, I'm joined by Anjali Sood, CEO of Tubi. We dive into the competitive world of streaming.

What others dismiss as niche, we embrace as core. There are so many stories out there. And if you can find a way to curate and help the right person discover the right content, the term that we always hear from our audience is that they feel seen. Listen to Good Company on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, I'm Sarah Spain, host of Good Game with Sarah Spain and the co-author of the new book Runs in the Family, an incredible true story of football, fatherhood, and belonging written

with and about Las Vegas Raiders running backs coach Dylan McCullough. It's the story of a football coach and father of four who sees his life forever changed by the unsealing of his adoption records. And it's got a twist you won't believe. Based on the viral ESPN story I did a few years ago, this book will blow your mind and bring you to tears. Buy runs in the family wherever books are sold. It crabs in the barrel mentality, blah, blah, blah. Nah, man, we showing something different. You know, first take, I've been blessed and fortunate enough throwing shade on nobody.

We've been number one for 12 years. We gonna be number one for 13. It's just that simple. At 14, and damn it, if I do it for 15, it gonna be 15. That's the way that it's gonna be. That's how my mentality is. And I don't root for anybody to fail. I just root to be the best.

And there's a difference. And as far as I'm concerned, anybody that's with me, we the best. Why all my life I've been grinding all my life All my life been grinding all my life Sacrifice, hustle pay the price Want a slice, got the rolling dice That's why all my life I've been grinding all my life Hello, welcome to another edition of Club CheChe. I am your host, Shannon Sharp. I'm also the proprietor of Club CheChe.

And for my first partnership with The Volume, I knew I had to land someone big. He's not big, he's huge, he's ginormous. He's a legendary sports journalist, a featured commentator, premier analyst, famed host, veteran reporter, podcaster, actor, writer, executive producer, business man, New York Times bestselling author,

one of the most recognizable on-air personalities, not just sports personalities, personalities on television, a cultural icon, and he's also HBCU alum, Stephen A. Smith. Bro, bro, we here. We here, but you keep knocking my breaks. I'm gonna get on with it. I'm sorry, man, I'm sorry, man.

I ain't know I can break anything on you. That's new, that's new, right there. Yeah, bruh, I mean, I'm gonna do? I'm sorry man, I'm sorry man. I ain't know I can break anything on you. That's new, that's new right there. Yeah, bruh, I mean I'm gonna be able to keep this one because every time I hug somebody it comes off. Yeah, we good. Bro, how you doing? It's good to see you bro, how you doing? Bro.

I promise you I'll be here, I'm here. I need you to tell the people what you went through because you promised me this, because we've been trying to get this thing together for a little over six weeks now. And I said, Steven, can you do Tuesday at noon? Yeah. And you said, I'll do it.

Yeah. But I want you to tell the people the length in which you went through to get here at noon. Well, what happened is that my pastor for the Christian Cultural Center in New York City, Pastor A.R. Bernard, had a fundraising event at a golf tournament in Long Island. Right. fundraising event at a golf tournament in Long Island. And so they were honoring me the night before I came here and I had to play some golf, which I don't play. So obviously I had to embarrass myself for a few hours. For every one shoot.

There's no footage, there's no footage. Nothing I know of, nothing I know of, nothing I know of. But for every one good shot I hit, I hit about five to 10 bad shots or whatever. But then after I did that, I promised you I hit about about five to ten bad shots or whatever but then after I did that I promised you I was gonna get here in time so I had to take the private jet get up here in time and I flew here last night got here about two in the morning woke up at 430 to prep for first take and then did first

take and here I am. Bro that's love I really appreciate that. Of course. I know you talk about your pastor but everybody that on, you know I have my own line of cognac. That's right. And I need to get you a bottle, and you're gonna leave here with a bottle. Ain't nothing wrong with that. I mean, he know, I can get out of here. You need to get out. Nothing in excess. Nothing in excess.

Okay, nothing in excess. But I want to toast you, bro, because you paved the way for a lot of guys. You made it, not just athlete, and I want to give you your flowers, bro. I appreciate you. I appreciate you, man. Thank you so much, man Coming from an HBC you obviously is a very very big deal. That's something that's near and dear to my heart I've been an ambassador for HBC you week since around 2019 or so and in that span we've generated over

What about 65 million in scholarships for over, you know, 3,000 students. And so I'm really, really proud of that. And HBCU is always near and dear to my heart. And the basketball coach Clarence Bighouse-Gaines, who helped the late great John McClendon in integrating the sport of basketball, they were both HBCU icons. And both of them were big-time mentors of mine. And they knew I didn't have the game that was going

to take me to the next level, but they knew I had the mindset and the tenacity to do what I could to help HBCUs and all he ever said to me was when I said what can I do for all that you've done for me he said don't forget HBCUs you make sure that you help any chance you get and that's what I've been doing. What I tell people Stephen A is that when I went to an HB, when I went to Savannah State, I had no idea the importance or the magnitude of what was going on at the time. It wasn't until much, much later that I realized that I had done something special.

So when you're matriculating at Winston-Salem, did you understand what was going on at the time and how big of a deal it was going to be later? No, I didn't, man. All I was trying to do was get my degree and to make sure that I positioned myself to have a career instead of a job. When I'm giving speeches, I constantly say to kids,

there's a difference between a job and a career. Right. A job is doing what you have to do to maintain or elevate your quality of life. Correct. A career is doing what you want to do. Correct. It just so happens to do those maintain or elevate your quality of life. Correct. A career is doing what you want to do. Correct.

It just so happens to do those things. Yes. And so for me, if you don't have an education, the chances of you being able to pull that off, even with the advent of social media and the opportunities that present themselves, I think it's a misnomer to think that you don't have to have any kind of education whatsoever and you're going to succeed from a normal perspective. There are abnormal examples of course. There's always somebody that breaks the code, but for the most part, you got to go through

that terrain. You got to go through that grind. And for me, it was always understanding that. So when I was at Winston-Salem, it was really about getting that degree and getting practical experiences. I did an internship at the Winston-Salem Journal. I did an internship at the Atlanta Journal of Constitution. Then I came back. I did another internship at the Winston-Salem Journal. I did an internship at the Atlanta Journal of Constitution. Then I came back and did another internship

at the Greensboro News and Record. Then back to the Winston-Salem Journal before I even graduated. And so for me, that was incredibly important, establishing that resume and really, really showing that I was a worthy individual because if I didn't have those internships, something to prove that I was really, really committed

by acquiring that level of practical experience, then it was gonna be my resume against somebody from a PWI. And if you're somebody from a predominantly white institution, chances are you gonna get the nod over somebody in an HBCU. So I understood the climb, I understood the obstacles that I had to fight off,

and that's what I wanted about the business of doing. Did you always want to go to an HBCU or it just happened? Bro, it just happened. I didn't even know what an HBCU was until they came to offer me a scholarship. I had no clue. I heard about the United Negro College Fund, New Raw, doing that every year.

But they ain't never met you in Savannah State. So I'm like, I don't know about, well the big ones, the Grand Lath and the Southern University. Yeah, you know about Eddie Robinson. You know about Eddie Robinson. Yes. But that was about it because the fact is is that when you took it at HBCUs,

I mean there's some up north like Bowie State in the Maryland area and what have you. But for the most part, that's right. But for the most part, they down south. South, correct. They ain't out west, they ain't in the Midwestwest, they damn sure ain't on the east coast. So if you're living in those places, you simply don't know.

Right. And you know what, I caught a lot of criticism because I was one of the top prospects in the state of Georgia when I was coming out. And I said an HBCU wasn't my first choice. Had I not been Prop 48, I mean, I had Georgia, I had Texas, I had Nebraska, I had all the big schools recruiting me. And more times than not I was like, but the best thing that I did, Stephen A, is when my former coach Rest is Soul Bill Davis came down. He

said, son, if you good, they'll find you. He said if I was drafting, he said I would take you number one overall. Wow. He convinced me. And I would have had an opportunity to transfer and go to a PWI. Right. I couldn't do it. Well, I will tell you this. It's like, and a lot, and I've said this

to a lot of our white brothers and sisters. I'm like, look, ain't nothing like being surrounded by your own. And the advantage is the pageantry. It's her own cousin. Oh my God. It's her own cousin. They just don't understand. They just don't understand.

I mean, you know, the bands, the pep rallies. I mean, Lord have mercy. The band played the whole game. They know where they got the ball, you got to be quiet. The band plays the entire game, whether we got the ball or they got the ball. And then you got the step shows, and you got the saw rods, and you got the frats, and you got the park.

And everybody's coming back from 20 years, 30 years, 10 years, 15 years. Just stop. Just bring back memories. Just bring back memories. Let me tell you something, man. Listen, you've heard me, listen, people see me on TV. You hear me complain about a lot of things in life.

You ain't never heard me complain about going to the HBC. No, no, no, no. It's the greatest experience I've ever had in my life. Let me tell you something right now. I had a mentor of mine, he's a God rest his soul, Mr. Robert Devon. He was a telecommunications director at Winston-Salem State, loved him dearly. He had to convince me to graduate on time. I wanted to do internships to delay and postpone graduation.

That's how much I was living the life at Winston-Salem. You understand what I'm saying? I mean, it was like, and then everybody was like, well, you know what, you be a disingenuous because you went and you did an internship in Atlanta. I was like, have you ever heard of Spelman? Yes. I have.

You know what I'm saying? I mean, that's right down the block. That's right down the block, okay? Atlanta just started, and look, Atlanta's always been Atlanta. That's right down the block, okay? Atlanta just started, and look, Atlanta's always been Atlanta. That's right. It just exploded in the last 20, but Atlanta was back, Atlanta back in the 70s,

and Atlanta was like that, how about that? And then on top of it all, check this out. So you gotta take a route. If you're going down, you're going I-85. If you're coming up, you're going I-85 North. You're passing HBCUs in root. Yes. So it's like, yeah, I'm at Winston-Salem,

but I'm stopping at Johnson C. Smith. Yes, yes. You got Johnson C. Smith, you got Fayetteville State. I mean, it's Bennett College in Greensboro, all girls. I mean, it's beautiful. You got Allen, you got Sanchez out of state. A&T is like, Lord. I mean, I used to take the long route,

because you know, you could cut through and get to Winston- Lord. I mean, I used to take the long route, because you know you could cut through and get to Winston-Salem State, but I used to take the long route because you had to pass through all of them things to get to Winston-Salem. I was like, why would I want to rush? Why would I want to do that? I tell a lot of people, I tell my white counterparts,

I think everybody should have to experience one semester at an HBCU. Yeah, yeah. To get the feel, to get the ambiance of what it's actually like. And to have some of those teachers, because the professors, to get the ambiance of what it's actually like. And to have some of those teachers, because the professors, Stephen A, I believe they sincerely cared about Shannon Shaw.

I remember going to a class and his name was Haynes Walton. And Stephen A, he come to class with a piece of chalk, this big, in his pocket. And he start writing on the board. I was like, okay, taking notes and everything. And he said on this page, such and such, and in this chapter, such and such. I'm like, what the hell?

How he know all of that? Every day for like three weeks. So I got the text, I said, I'm gonna find out how he know so much. I started reading text by Haynes Walton. Yep, he wrote them. That him! He wrote them, he know everything!

And from that point on, I felt that every class that I went to, every professor, doctor, they could teach me something. And I was attentive. Now, it didn't hurt that they were in class, too. So I sat in front of the class. I was there, had me a briefcase. I had on Fridays, I had hard bottom shoes on, slacks,

had me a nice blazer, pretending like I'm gonna be something one day, y'all need to go get on those shapes. That's right, ain't no question. And listen, they cared, they held you accountable. They did. They felt like they were an extension of the family that you departed from.

And they made you feel like if you disappointed, if you ended up being a disappointment, you disappointed them, you disappointed yourself, you disappointed your family, you disappointed, if you ended up being a disappointment, you disappointed them, you disappointed yourself, you disappointed your family, you disappointed your community. It was at a level of accountability. And not only that, they highlighted the obstacles that were waiting for you. So I was like, listen, we've been here, we did it, this was waiting for you. What you gonna do about it?

And there's a sense of pride that kicks in. But more importantly, when you go to an HBCU, I think this is the most important thing for folks to understand, particularly as it pertains to black folks. Usually, in every walk of society, we are alone in certain respects. When you go to an HBCU, you got company. People who look like you, who share your cultural identity, who share your trials and tribulations, the obstacles,

the pitfalls, everything. You literally are looking at people, hanging with people, and talking to people every day where your experiences are not foreign to them. They all know it. And so they're going to lift you up unless you don't want to be. When you don't want to be, they know to leave you to the side

because you ain't about anything. We're going to stick with people who's about something. And that self accountability elevates everybody. I think back, Stephen A, one of the, I started off, I was Prop 48, so I had to start off in developmental studies. Developmental studies is remedial. So in other words, all you're taking is classes

that doesn't go towards graduation. Dr. Joyce McLemore, I'll never forget, I had a reading class. And after two days, she called me up. She always called me Mr. Dr. Joyce McLemore, I'll never forget, I had a reading class and after two days she called me up, she always called me Mr. Sharp. To this day when I go back and see her at Savannah State, she calls me Mr. Sharp. She said, Mr. Sharp, I don't want to see you next quarter. Yes, they all say that. She said, you're too smart. She said, you have no business being in this class. Now Mr. Sharp, I don't want to see you next quarter. She told a story, everybody, cause back that time

I ended up graduating, got my degree and playing in the NFL. She said, y'all see that young man on television? He was in this very class, but he worked his tail off to get out. And I did, a lot of my teammates were embarrassed because you know, it wasn't a regular class, even though it was a trailer. And you know, it was right next to Peacock Hall

where I went, I would go eat breakfast and walk right up in there just as proud because I wasn't ashamed because I put myself in that situation. See, you shouldn't be ashamed of something that you put yourself in. I put myself in that situation. But a lot of times people don't see themselves as putting themselves in that situation because they're not willing to absorb and accept accountability. See the beauty of being involved with athletics is that you're surrounded by people who make you accountable for yourself.

You, it's like a human mirror. You know when you didn't work hard. You know when you didn't put in the work. You know when you didn't listen to the coach. You know when you didn't do all of these things. So that transitions to other forms. It could be the classroom, it could be anything else. I remember even before I got to college,

seventh grade, it's in my book, Straight Shoot even before I got to college, seventh grade, it said my book straight shooter. My seventh grade teacher, Mr. Caravan, looked my mother dead in the face and she said, your son is not a dummy. She said, he doesn't listen with things he's not interested in. He drifts. So what happens is, you think he doesn't know

and he didn't understand, he never heard him. He will literally drift and he doesn't hear anybody anywhere. He said, but when you find out what he's passionate about, you'll have a star on your hands. And that's what he said, and that came in handy because years later when I... Welcome to the You Versus You podcast. I'm Lex Perero, and every week we sit down

with some of the biggest names in entertainment to talk about the real stuff. The struggles, the doubts, and the breakthroughs that made them who they are. We go deep, flowing childhood trauma, family, overcoming loss, and the moments that shaped their journey. These honest conversations are meant to take the cape off our heroes, with the hope that their humanity inspires you to become a better you and therefore set you free to live the life of your dreams.

Here's a sneak peek. I'm trained to go compete. I'm trained to like go harder. But sometimes that mentality stops you from stopping and smelling the flowers in your own garden. Is it wrong to want more? We migrated, our family migrated here. I'm like second generation.

Who's not going to have a trauma coming from a foreign country and you arrive in the United States and you don't speak English? Listen to You vs. You as part of Michael Tudel Podcast Network, available on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Michael Kassin, founder and CEO of 3C Ventures, and your guide on Good Company, the podcast where I sit down with the boldest innovators

shaping what's next. In this episode, I'm joined by Anjali Sood, CEO of Tubi, for a conversation that's anything but ordinary. We dive into the competitive world of streaming, how she's turning so-called niche into mainstream gold, connecting audiences with stories that truly make them feel seen. What others dismiss as niche niche we embrace as core. It's this idea that there are so many stories out there. And if you can find a way to curate and help

the right person discover the right content, the term that we always hear from our audience is that they feel seen. Get a front row seat to where media, marketing, technology, entertainment, and sports collide. And hear how leaders like Anjali are carving out space and shaking things up a bit in the most crowded of markets. Listen to Good Company on the iHeart radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm a beat writer, especially when I was covering the 76 and stuff like that.

I have this uncanny ability. I'm not saying it's a gift, but I have this uncanny ability. I have been in an arena with 20,000 people and I didn't hear a word. I didn't hear anything. Like, I'm on deadline. I got an hear a word. I didn't hear anything. Like I'm on deadline. I got an article to write. I got 20 minutes to write 800 words. And I literally have the ability

to block out all the noise. And it reminded me of what Professor Caravan said to my mother about drifting. I drifted to a different place, except this time I saw the positive in it, because a lot of times, if you're hearing that noise, you can't focus, you can't concentrate, you can't get the job done.

I could, because I could lock in, and I could tune out the noise. You sound like an athlete. If you heard athletes say it, say, it's like everything slows down, everything is moving in slow motion. I don't hear not one of those 85,000 or those 30,000 fans screaming.

I hear nothing. Everything is just hush. And I can actually hear my heart beat. That's how quiet it is, even though I'm in a stadium with 80,000. And those are the great ones. As an athlete, those are the great ones. Because the ones who hear all the noise

are the ones who succumb to it and they panic. They sweating a little bit extra. Palms sweaty, backsides tight. They can't really handle the pressure. They fold under the pressure. But when you can be composed and poised under pressure, particularly on the field of athleticism, whether it's the quarter play, the field of play, or whatever the case may be, you got a star in your hands. That wasn't me. That was me when it came to my job. I could tune out all of that noise. What people have is pressure. It's like we do television every day.

I'm in front of the camera, bro. I worry about nothing. I'm not fazed by, I don't care who's in front of me. I don't care what noise people are saying on the outside. I don't care about the camera folks. I don't care about the producers in the control room. I don't care about the bosses up there, whatever. When the camera is in front of me, I believe I own it.

And I'm not fazed by anything. It just doesn't faze me. But I've seen people who have been reporters, for example, and you put them in front of the camera, brother, they sweating bullets. They nervous as hell, they stuttering, they don't know what to say, they're trying to gather their thoughts,

they're trying to be ultra careful, they don't know what to think, what to say, or whatever the case. And I'm like this, they have no thoughts. They're trying to be ultra careful. They don't know what to think, what to say, or whatever the case. And I'm like this, they have no chance. They have no chance. But people think it's easy. Everybody can't talk on camera. Everybody can't speak in front of an audience.

We've seen some of the greatest players not be able to do what you and I do on the regular. And people just like, well, how do you do it? You just do it. You just do it. I don't see you. I don't hear you. All I hear is my own voice. Right.

You... I'm a little different than that. I think that you and I would be a little bit different than that because that's your gift and that's cool. Me as anybody producer, anybody would tell you, when I'm on the air, that's why they named me the executive producer.

First thing, I ain't asked for the job. I didn't need another job. The last thing I needed was another job, bro. It ain't like they throwing extra money my way for this. It ain't happening. But they came to me and I'm like this. They're like, why? They say you producing the damn show anyway on the set.

You looking at the camera. I know this camera is on. I know this camera is off. I'm imagining what the audience is doing because I have a connection with the audience. This is what they wanna hear, this is what they don't wanna hear. This is who they wanna hear from

at this particular moment in time. This is who they wanna hear from at this particular moment in time. All right, Steve, it's time to jump in. All right, Steve, it's time to lay back because the objective is the show. It's not me, it's not you, it's the show. And the objective is to make sure that's not me, it's not you, it's the show. And the objective is to make sure

that the people on camera are maximizing their potential in terms of their presentation to the audience to grab them and to reel them in. That's how I'm thinking. Now, it wasn't at the beginning. At the beginning, I was a lot like that. But as time went on, you're just seeing it. You're saying, well, wait a minute.

Why did this person? You're the quarterback. That's what I've been. See, for me time went on, you're just seeing it, you're saying, well, wait a minute, why did this person? You're the quarterback. I've always, that's what I've been. See, for me, I got, look, I know what everybody's supposed to do, but I focus on my job. Now, if I need to tell somebody they're out, or they need to, hey, this blitz, you're hot,

or you gotta block this blitz. Well, you showed the world that, what you posted on Twitter. You would say, who laid it up for you? Who laid it up for you? And then you're like, yeah. You'll say, that's what you're supposed to do. That to me is my job.

Let me ask you a question. Like, when you say, like, these viral, and people ask like, when do you know what you're gonna say? A lot of times when stuff goes viral, I had no idea because I don't know what he's gonna say. You don't know what everybody's gonna say, but sometimes it just happens, a moment happens.

How much is just reactionary? Because like I said, you have a lot of different, you have Mad Dog, you have Ryan Clark, you have D.O., you have Swaggoo, you have so many different people. So it's hard to get a beat or rhythm to what they're gonna say. If you don't know them. Okay. And if you don't know the audience. Okay.

And so what happens is, I know what the audience wants from Ryan Clark. I know what it wants from Swagoo. I know what it wants from Molly. I know what it wants from Mad Dog. I know what it wants from Olaski. I know what it wants from Shannon Sharp. Okay.

For the purposes of that show. And so I'm looking at Shannon Sharp and I'm like, that's three times Super Bowl champion. That's one of the greatest tight ends in NFL history. That's a Hall of Famer. And damn it, he loud, and he's boisterous, he going to come right at you, and all of this other stuff. OK, this is what they want, and this

is what they're going to get. Now, you don't want to give it to them too much, all in one bowl. You want to spread it out. You want to spread it out. You want a little bit here, a little bit there, a little bit. All right, it's 10, 10, 10 o'clock. Boom, 10, 15, here we come.

The momentum is swelling. All of a sudden, it might be a little bit too much. You might want to dial it back a little bit because we coming at 11. We might come back at 11, 15, hell, but we coming at 11.30. See, that's how I'm thinking. OK. So it's like, OK, yeah, I want you to shine,

and I want you to be you, because I'm going to be me. Right. And so here we come, and the audience is watching. How do you know that? Because you paid attention to the audience. You're not sitting up there manipulating them. You're not disrespecting them. You're showing them you appreciate them,

because you're paying attention to what they're telling you and showing you they want. A lot of times you have talent and it's like listen, this is my lane and there's something to be said about that when you know who you are and you know what you bring. That's not to be disrespected, that's to be appreciated. Okay, here's his strength. Well if I have a different strength,

how do I get to compliment that so he can shine while we shine. That is the objective when you're trying to win. And it's applicable on a football field, on a court of play, or on a television set. But how many people are thinking like that? I'll tell you who. The winners think like that. The losers don't.

It's very simple. You know what? I want to address some comments that you said, because you said Condolas is in advance. He's very simple. You know what, I wanna address some comments that you said because you said condolences in advance. Yep. He's the modern day black hole. He's not used to getting beat down. That's right. Welcome to the beat down.

Well, let me tell you, let me elaborate. First of all, obviously I wasn't talking about physically. I got no shot, I got no shot. I mean, let's get that out the way right now. Let's get that out the way right now. You understand what I'm saying? Let's get that out the way right now. I was not talking about physically.

I got no shot whatsoever. But you know, I've seen you, I've seen you debate quite often. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I see you. I'm good at this thing. I'm good for it, yeah. You can do your thing, but you know, you ain't never been up against me.

You're serious. This is a little different going up against me. You see, what happens is, you got people that are trying to win the debate to be right. Yeah. Yeah. False. It's about your perspective up against mine. And who can convince the audience their perspective

is better than the next? That's what it's about. You see, a lot of times somebody can, like, somebody, it's a mistake to argue with Shannon Sharp about the facts of football. You don't do that, not if you didn't play. Oh no, no, no, no, no, no, no, oh please, you got no shot. But you can go like this, you know something,

I, it's really nice, I heard what you said. But you see, you said this two weeks ago. That's not consistent with what I just heard. I mean, you saw this game right there. Now, I'm not you, but damn it, I got two eyes. I saw that. Are you telling me what I saw was a lie? Really, you're sure about that?

What, didn't you say this a year ago? You see, these are the kind of things, like, you know, obviously, you know, you love yourself some LeBron James. Yeah, yeah, yeah, you know that's gonna happen. He the go. He the go. He's not.

Say it with me. He's not. He's not. I just got off the goat, he the goat. He's not. Say it with me, he the goat. He's not, he's not. I just got off the phone with MJ last night. That's okay. Just to remind him. You should've hung up on him. Just to remind him. I just hung up on him.

Yeah, say the goat. The blast from me coming out of your mouth right now. Let the goat, let the goat. It's okay, you can believe that. You can believe that. The man's still going strong 21. But we'll do, I'm sure, you know what? Right.

The first LeBron topic. Right. Don't need to be nobody. Don't need to be nobody now. Here's what's gonna hurt you. Here's what's gonna hurt you. Because you see when you talking like that, people like, but shit, but shit, but shit.

Nope, I'm gonna sit back and let you talk. And then I'm gonna say, you finished? Are you finished? You sure? No. And you're gonna be like, nah. And I'm gonna say, you gotta wait now. Cause I waited.

Here I come. And you gonna have to deal with the tsunami that I'm gonna bring. I'm gonna rain down you gotta wait now, because I waited. Here I come. And you have to deal with the tsunami that I'm gonna bring, I'm gonna rain down upon you when it comes, especially to that subject. Especially to that subject. And that's what you're gonna hear. Listen, LeBron, listen, I got this man.

The game was started in 1947. I got LeBron James, the thousands of players that have played in the NBA. I got him number two all time. You got people walking around like that's disrespect. It is. See, that's emotion. That's emotion right there.

Listen, let me tell you something right now. I personally believe a legitimate argument could be made that I'm sitting in front of the greatest tight end in the history of football. Some people bringing Gronk, Tony Gonzalez, other players, whatever, Travis Kelso, of course. Gaines gets, right? But you in the conversation, you understand?

And you know, because you're brethren, I mean, they give you bad love and respect, right? I can say that. But my point to you is, is that if somebody said you weren't number one, you don't feel insulted. No. So why you got to be insulted about it? Because.

That's emotion. No, that's not emotion. That's emotion. But the goal. Huh? See, that's emotion right there. You told me the storm was coming. Right.

See, your storm happened for nine years, then took two years off. Right. And it happened for three years and took another three years off. And it happened for three years, and took another three years off. And then it kind of just like drizzling. My storm been going for 21 years, Rainey. You could say that, that my retort to that would be six NBA finals losses.

So, so they'll, so they'll, hold on. This is bad. Six final losses. Six finals losses. Let me ask you a question. Six. I just want you to tell me one thing, and we gonna debate this.

Sure. Tell me ask you a question. Six. I just want you to tell me one thing, and we gonna debate this. Sure. Tell me the team that he faced that was the 2017 or the 2018 Golden State Warriors. What do you mean? I don't understand your question. Michael Jordan, tell me the team. You talking about Michael Jordan? I want you to tell me the team that Michael Jordan faced

that was the equivalent of the 17 and 18. No one, can I respond to that? Sure. Can I tell you why? No one, do you know why? Because none of them had Jordan. No.. Can I respond to that? Sure. Can I tell you why? No one. Do you know why? Because none of them had Jordan. No! That's exactly why. Okay, let me explain.

See, see, see. That's the ultimate equalizer or usurper. Pick whichever one you want to pick. Do you understand that Jordan is 6-0 in NBA finals? Yes! Do you understand that Jordan was MVP all six NBA finals? Yes!

Do you understand that Jordan never even allowed a final series to go seven games? You understand that? It never went seven games. I also, I also, I also know he just started going to finals to that bird back when I. Excuse me. Ten time NBA scoring champion. Nine time all defensive player, all defensive first team.

You do know that, right? Yeah. All right. So in other words, it was LeBron on both sides of the ball. Was he that dominant? Oh, he was the right about. You know he should have won it. You know he should have won.

Are you kidding me? Steven A. Are you he should have won it. You know he should have won it. Are you kidding me? Steven A. Are you kidding me? Steven A, give me this. You know good well LeBron James should have one defensive player of the year. How does Mark Gasol, who's a second team

all defensive player, be defensive player of the year? I agree with that. I agree with that. But the flip side to it is that as we watched LeBron James, even with his greatness at one point in time as a defensive player, we never looked at him and said, oh my god, that's that dude defensively. Yeah. You had, you had, now LeBron is universally respected and revered. MJ was feared. You know the difference. You know the difference! Because there are people who have feared you! You know the difference better than me!

You know the difference between reverence and fear! Look, look. You know this? You like John Wick, I like James Bond. He's alright, he's alright. John Bond, James Bond. Can I have James Bond? I prefer James Bond.

You can be John Wick. I prefer James Bond. John Wick shot up the whole place, killed everybody. Okay. James Bond killed a few people But got the ladies they do the same thing Remember when Halle Berry was walking out the ocean and he said Magnificent view remember that?

That was really you know that that's that stuff is stuff like Pierce Brosnan, but you know Daniel Craig of course Sean Connery The man okay, I mean this is I'm trying to say the versatility of James Bond is where it comes in. The versatility of Go James. You could say that, but at the end of the day. He can guard one through five. You've seen him do it. I'm not denying that.

Shut down Tony Parker on one end. In the last five minutes, I got Timmy D. I also saw him get checked when Jason Terry was guarding him in the post in the Finals against Dallas. You gonna deny that? No! Okay then. Let me ask you a question.

Has there ever been a time where Michael Jordan showed up in an NBA finals and you literally looked at him and said, yo, he ain't show up. He ain't playing nobody. Come on. Let me ask you a question. I'm gonna do it like this here.

Sure. Tell me the guy that he faced that deal with the equivalent of Kevin Durant Anything like Michael Michael my good. Well, I was you have courage I wouldn't say I wouldn't say the equivalent of Kevin Durant, but let's go down the list He beat magic for his first time back. It was 73. Okay, I find you. I'm going down the list Okay, I didn't hear you say that when magic was here, but we're talking The man they go to the night nine finals but we're talking about the- No, but you know Magic. You say that when Magic was here. You didn't tell him that. But it's okay.

The man that's going to nine finals in 10 years. I feel you on that. And by the way, he took Vlad A. Divock in those guys. Yes! Wasn't Kareemah worthy in them. But you saw what he did to Jordan in the first game, right? Allow me? Put a triple double on him in the head

and put Scottie Pippen on him. That's cool. Okay, I ain't gonna say he backed him. He made him look like Kareemah, Carlwell Jones. Okay, go ahead. That's fair. Michael Jordan, I'm sorry, Magic Johnson in the first title, Clyde Drexler in the crew, the second title. He backed them. He backed them. Made it look like Kareem and Carlwell Jones. Okay, go ahead. That's fair.

Michael, I'm sorry, Magic Johnson in the first title. Clyde Drexler in the crew the second title. Charles Barkley, Kevin Johnson, don't ignore that. Dan Marley in the third title. Good team. Okay, okay. Peyton, the glove, with Sean Kemp before he became Sean Kluh.

That's one Hall of Fame. And then also you've got Carl Malone, John Stockton. Yes. And you have an NBA game that was considerably tougher at that particular moment in time than today's NBA game is in terms of physicality and what's allowed. So you can appreciate this, you can appreciate that,

where you can put your forearm on people, where you can hand check them, where you can do a lot of things you can't do now. Right now you get called for passing gas. True, you will. It's a different game now. But here's the thing, Stephen. Okay.

Welcome to the You vs. You podcast. I'm Lex Burrow, and every week we sit down with some of the biggest names in entertainment to talk about the real stuff. The struggles, the doubts, and the breakthroughs that made them who they are. We go deep, throwing childhood trauma, family, overcoming loss, and the moments that shape their journey.

These honest conversations are meant to take the cape off our heroes with the hope that their humanity inspires you to become a better you and therefore set you free to live the life of your dreams. Here's a sneak peek. I'm trained to go compete. I'm trained to be like harder, but sometimes that mentality stops you from stopping

and smelling the flowers in your own garden. Is it wrong to want more? We migrated, our family migrated here. I'm like second generation. Who's not going to have a trauma coming from a foreign country and you arrive in the United States and you don't speak English? Listen to You Versus You as part of Michael Tudor Podcast

Network, available on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Michael Cassin, founder and CEO of 3C Ventures, and your guide on Good Company, the podcast where I sit down with the boldest innovators shaping what's next. In this episode, I'm joined by Anjali Sood, CEO of Tubi, for a conversation that's anything but ordinary. We dive into the competitive world of streaming,

how she's turning so-called niche into mainstream gold, connecting audiences with stories that truly make them feel seen. What others dismiss as niche, we embrace as core. It's this idea that there are so many stories out there, and if you can find a way to curate and help the right person discover the right content, the term that we always hear from our audience is that they feel seen.

Get a front row seat to where media, marketing, technology, entertainment, and sports collide. And hear how leaders like Anjali are carving out space and shaking things up a bit in the most crowded of markets. Listen to Good Company on the iHeart radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What you and the old school guard have equated physicality with talent and skill. The guys in today's game are more skilled. I totally agree with that. I totally agree with that. But you would know this better than me

because you were an all-world player. Even though the game of the NFL has evolved significantly, you know good and damn well that if you were playing in this time, you would have adapted. You played in that time, you adapted. The game in the 60s and 70s, you would have adapted to the time. So what I'm trying to say to you is this,

Michael Jordan was what he needed to be. If he was playing today, he would be what he needed to be in order to be successful today. That's all I'm trying to say. When you see greatness on that level, you have to concede that that's the case. But see all that Michael do with the cook, LeBron had the cook, he had the clean,

he had the weight tables, he had the take orders. Well you could say that, but what I'm saying is if the brother's doing it on both sides of the floor, then obviously he's doing more than one thing. He's doing that too. But how many guys you know that are top five score and top five or six? How about this?

How about once Shaquille O'Neal with Penny Hardaway, Nick Anderson, 3D, Dennis Scott and those boys were on Orlando, right? How about the fact that they couldn't even get the ball past half court because Scotty Pippen and Michael Jordan had them on locket. Yeah, with Ron Harper. Full court press.

We ain't never seen LeBron doates. We never see LeBron do that We never see LeBron do that. I do that, you know, stop it. He never did it You remember with D never did it you move with D Rose with the MVP. Y'all voted D Rose MVP What he do to D Rose in the playoffs? Excuse me. Excuse me D Rose. What kind of team did? Yeah, you come tell me yo Kim knowing those boys was a supporting They did enough to get the number one when those boys was a supporting pass. They did enough to get the number one seed. So what?

So what? You voted him MVP. That's why I called LeBron. They told me. I voted him MVP and still picked Miami to win that series. I knew they weren't going to beat Miami in the best of seven. Players are different. All right?

But that don't mean LeBron deserved the MVP. I know, by the way, I don't even knock LeBron James for not getting the MVP. Because when you're that great, you're not going to put all your efforts in over 82 games. You playing for April, May, and June. So this entirely plausible. I'm very fair to LeBron James.

You dial him back. Sometimes. Most times. Most times. Actually, I'd say all. It's just that I call it like I see it. I'm not emotional like you. No, I don't know.

You're emotional. I saw you. You are emotional about it. I been doing my homework on you. About LeBron. Yeah, you know what? I got a call today for one Michael Jordan. I did? He rolled up on me in a black SUV

and rolled the winner down. That's true, that's true. I was scared, I thought he was gonna shoot. I thought it was a drive-by. It was a damn drive-by. Scared the living hell out of me. You understand what I mean? That's an absolutely true story.

But at the end of the day, all I'm trying to say is that LeBron is phenomenal. He's great. We should throw no shade on him. One of the greatest ever, top three. B, I didn't see you saying one of, it's B, TH. He will never be greater than Jordan to me, but more importantly, let's go to Kareem.

19 time All-Star, six time league MVP, champion on a high school level, Tom Amorio. That don't get Kareem's credit. Champion at UCLA, champion in the NBA. Six times. Good Lord have mercy. Six MVP. Four time leader scorer before LeBron surpassed him. All of that stuff happened. I'm just saying, come on now, the resume is better,

but I still don't believe he was the player that LeBron James is. All right. But what I hold, and I'll say this to you, I'll tell you something that I very really said. If you took LeBron James' career from 2012 to now, and that was his history, from his first title to what he is now, and you wanted

to make an argument against Jordan, I'm listening. The problem is we don't get to ignore those first seven or eight years where there were a couple of occasions where, one, he was accused of quitting, and I don't believe that, by the way. No, they accused Noah of drunking. No, no, no, no, no, no, I'm talking about this. God still gave him the arm.

I got you, but I feel you, but it's true, but it's still accused of him drunking. But the point is, the point is- Accusation's ain't facts, Steve, it ain't. No, no, no, against Boston, I don't believe that. It was a lot of stuff going on over on, that's none of our business, that people, they were totally unfair to him,

including his damn teammates. But that's a different story for another day. I never held that against him. But when you got four games against the Dallas Mavericks in which people looked at you and said, choke. If you say that, you know what? You cannot get past that. I can't argue on that one.

I can't argue on that one. That to me, that to me sealed the deal about the MJ LeBron comparison. So what if he were to win a title this year? At 39 years of age. So that don't erase Jordan. See, there you go. See, that's the argument that people have when I was talking about Tom Brady not playing well. I'm not trying to take away what Jordan's accomplished. I agree. He got those rings, but he got six finals MVP

He has six championship. He has five regular season MVP, correct If LeBron gets another title Steven A I'm not gonna erase what Jordan did But he already he already here for me. Okay, all he doing is just but but what I'm saying to you is I already Talked about the Dallas thing. Yeah, and I talked about moments which you can appreciate What I'm trying to say to you is that when you are that dude, right? That doesn't happen to you often that happened to magic when they call them tragic. Yeah Johnson 84 and all that we get all of that Yeah, but for the most part that doesn't. And this is the kind of thing that you also

have to pay attention to as well. Not only do you not get to say that about Jordan, but when you look at LeBron, think about this. You want me to tell you what I hold against him just as much as I held against the Dallas performance? What? The following year with the All-Star Game. You got the ball in your hands.

It's an exhibition. Oh, he really passed it. It's an exhibition. It doesn't count. Right. It's all the fun. Right. Kobe claps his hand, God rest his soul. And he's like, yo, let's come on with it. You got D Wade on the court. You got Mello in the corner. And he threw the pass. And all three of them, along with Kobe, descended on LeBron and said, yo, what's up? What you doing? Because they knew he was psyched out. He was messed up.

And what I'm saying to you is that Kobe wasn't like that. MJ wasn't like that. D-Way wasn't like that. And his first NBA Finals appearance, they down-o'd two to Dallas. D-Way goes berserk, averages 37 in the last four games. I'm just saying, it's stuff like that.

It's not that you look at LeBron and you diminish him. It's just that you can't elevate him above somebody like MJ when I got that evidence to support my argument. That's all, and that's why I got a number two all time. God strike me down. I mean, my Lord, I mean, what an insult. I mean, the number two all time in the history of the game and it's an insult.

Only you and Rich Paul and people like that feel that way. Most of us sane individuals know better. No. Let me ask you this. Yeah. You and I have conversation and people like, well, how close are you to Stephen A? I said, I met him in 2014 when I came on the show.

I said, we've talked over the years, we exchanged numbers and we've talked over the years. But I said, over the last year and a half or so, I was going through some things and he was the one guy that was in this business that I felt I could talk to. It would stay between us, but he would give me sound advice.

And so now you have your thing with First Take. You are the voice, you are the face of First Take, you're the face of ESPN. What made you reach out, say, bro, I want you? Because I got love for you, bro. And that's just me being a man and speaking as two brothers. You know our former boss at First Take, Jamie Harwitz, who is over at FS1, he brought you over to FS1 and all of that.

And he knows my history. He knows what I stand for. I remember when I first, you can ask him, I remember when I first arrived on First Take and I rolled up in there and I saw a bunch of white folks. And I said, yo, where the brothers and the sisters at? You don't think I'm going to be sitting here working with a bunch of white folks, do you? I don't mind white folks. I ain't got nothing against y'all.

God bless you. You understand what I'm saying? We all brothers and sisters, the eyes of God, when all is said and done, but you ain't gonna just have be surrounded by a bunch of lily white folks. You better sprinkle some pepper in here. Put a little pepper up in this mix.

You know what I'm saying? And so, you know, he brought one, and then the next thing you know, I picked two or three others and made sure to diversify that staff. And then one of the things that I did, when I came in there, I knew Skip was going to want to debate me or whatever,

but I was talking about subject matters that we needed to broach, because it was still his show, but he respected me enough to get my opinion. And I was like, look, we need all of these other people, because I want voices, and I'm just, I'm built differently. What I was like, look, we need all of these other people because I want voices and I'm just, I'm built differently.

What I mean by that is there's no shade on you or anybody else, but I don't believe anybody's knocking me off my perch. I will knock me off my perch, you know, corporate stuff, bureaucratic stuff, that stuff you can't, you know, but I'm talking about in terms of my on air performance, my job performance, I don't worry about it. You know what I worry about?

The day that I wanna leave and I haven't done anything to create opportunities for us to continue. And so for me, it's like I look at you, I think that you're smart, you're obviously incredibly accomplished. You ain't gonna never hear me say, no disrespect to anybody, not to bring up nothing. You ain't gonna never hear me say,

three Super Bowl championships or Hall of Fame status don't mean nothing. I don't mean nothing. I don't roll like that. That's not who I am. I'm the kind of person that I argue with you about football, but I want the audience to know, yo, you the football expert, not me.

I'm the reporter that walks in, and I'm like, this what I saw, tell me I'm wrong. This is what I'm seeing, tell me I'm wrong. This is where I'm coming from, just like me and you talking about. I know you, I don't give a damn how much basketball you know. You is what I'm seeing, tell me I'm wrong. This is where I'm comforted, just like me and you talk about. I know you, I don't give a damn how much basketball you know. You don't know no more basketball than me. I've been coming, I learned from living legends

and all this stuff, but I still want to hear what you have to say. If you can listen to me talk about football, why the hell can I listen to you talk about basketball? And so all of that, and then your heart, being a conscientious brother, caring about the issues that you caring about, speaking about the issues that you caring about, speaking about the issues

that you speak about. Nah, brother, I ain't sharp as iron. And yeah, I got Mad Dog Russo, that's white. I got Dan Orlovsky, that's a white dude. You see what I'm saying? Jeff Saturday at one time, he was on the show. That's a white man. But the bottom line is I want it all.

I wanna make sure there's brothers, there's sisters, black and white, Hispanics, Asian, I don't give a damn who it all. I want to make sure there's brothers, there's sisters, black and white, ethnic, you know, Hispanics, Asian, I don't give a damn who it is. I want to make sure we're representing America and we make sure that everybody that looks at our show says, I can identify with what they're saying. But in the end, when it comes to me personally, you know, whether it's Ryan Clark, it's Marcus Spears, all right? It's Damian Woody, it's Louis Riddick. The list goes on and on. My brother Michael Irvin, that's now over at SS1, Keyshawn Johnson, these are my boys.

I go back decades with these. These are my brothers, you see what I'm saying? They will tell you, you ask anybody that knows me, I'm about getting you paid, I'm about helping you become successful, I'm about letting you shine. I'm not threatened by anybody's appearance. It's my obligation to do it.

But you heard it. You've heard the comments. Yes. Man, Stephen A, man, he's strong will, he brag, blah, blah, blah. Right. Shannon, strong will, iron, blah, blah, blah. How is that going to work? They don't know. You know what I tell people? I'm saying two people that strong will

can absolutely get along as long as there's respect. Absolutely. The moment one disrespects the other, the other loses respect for the one that disrespected him. So now it's just a matter of time. Exactly. And that's not gonna happen. No. Cause I don't roll like that. I don't even. I don't roll like that. It's Exactly, and that's not gonna happen. No. Because I don't roll like that.

I don't even. I don't roll like that. It's like, yo, I'm gonna argue with you about your points, but you know what? We gonna agree, we gonna disagree. But at the end of the day, we brothers, and we gonna sit up there and try to do what we can to make our product shine.

That's our responsibility, because if we do otherwise, all we're doing is inhibiting the other success. We're getting in the way of what we're trying to do. That makes no sense whatsoever. And not only that, it's setting a bad example for our community if I really need to get deep about it. Because what happens is, is that always, so they can't chill, they can't sit up there

and do a show together. They can't get along. You see, that crabs in the barrel mentality, blah, blah, blah. Nah, man, we showing something different. First take, I've been blessed and fortunate enough throwing shade on nobody. We been number one for 12 years.

We gonna be number one for 13. It's just that simple. At 14, and damn it, if I do it for 15, gonna be 15. That's the way that it's gonna be. That's how my mentality is. And I don't root for anybody to fail. I just root to be the best. And there's a difference.

And as far as I'm concerned, anybody that's with me, we the best. This is what we gonna do. So now it's we, it ain't Steven, it's we. And when you come to first take, cause you ain't start yet, you gonna see it's a family. You gonna see we get along. It ain't fake, we roll with one another.

We vibe with one another. We watch one another's back. It has always been that way under my stewardship of the show. And I can say my stewardship of the show because the show was handed to me. They ain't come to me and I just took the title and all. No, they came to me and said, it's yours.

You're responsible for it. If I didn't want Shannon Sharpe at first take, Shannon Sharpe wouldn't be at first take. That's just how it rolls. But I had to come out that day because all that you were going through. Bro, when you was telling me this behind, see what you're saying now is that you told me months

in advance because you was telling me things that were going on in the past. Hell, I didn't know. And I'm like, hold on. I drive this building everyday. How the hell you know what I don't know? And you telling me, bro, it's going down like this. It's happening like this and I'm just scratching my head I'm like I'm at this building every day and everybody cheese and I write it in my was I right you was absolutely spot-on

Say I was right, you know, and and by the way, it wasn't because of Fox it's because I know the business. Right. I've been here for 30 years. I can see it a mile away. You know, I can see the handwriting on the wall. I knew when it was over for you, bro. I'ma be real with you. I knew when it was over.

And I was like, I'm here. You see what I'm saying? You did? Because I knew what was gonna happen. What happens is, when you got noise, and we gonna call it like, I'm gonna call it like I see it You don't want to do this. Let me do it. All right, cuz I've been in the business long When you're black and you have the kind of welcome to the you versus you podcast

I'm Lex Burrow and every week we sit down with some of the biggest names in entertainment to talk about the real stuff The struggles the doubts and the breakthroughs that made them who they are. We go deep, flowing childhood trauma, family, overcoming loss, and the moments that shaped their journey. These honest conversations are meant to take the cape off our heroes, with the hope that their humanity inspires you

to become a better you, and therefore set you free to live the life of your dreams. Here's a sneak peek. I'm trained to go compete. I'm trained to be like harder. But sometimes that mentality stops you from stopping and smelling the flowers in your own garden. Is it wrong to want more?

We migrated, our family migrated here. I'm like second generation. Who's not going to have a trauma coming from a foreign country and coming to the United States and not speaking English? Listen to You vs. You as part of Michael Tudda Podcast Network, available on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Michael Kasin, founder and CEO of 3C Ventures, and your guide on Good Company, the podcast where I sit down with the boldest innovators shaping what's next. In this episode, I'm joined by Anjali Sood, CEO of Tubi, for a conversation that's anything

but ordinary. We dive into the competitive world of streaming, how she's turning so-called niche into mainstream gold, connecting audiences with stories that truly make them feel seen. What others dismiss as niche, we embrace as core. It's this idea that there are so many stories out there, and if you can find a way to curate and help the right person discover the right content, the term that we always hear from our audience

is that they feel seen. Get a front row seat to where media, marketing, technology, entertainment, and sports collide. And hear how leaders like Anjali are carving out space and shaking things up a bit in the most crowded of markets. Listen to Good Company on the iHeart radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Of evident, apparent, meaning public situations like that, we don't win. Everybody's circling. The sharks are circling now.

It's not one person. And it's not collusion going on. Instinctually, people tend to believe this, believe this, believe that, and the shocks are circling. And that's why I came out. You know the number one reason I came out, even before First Take was even on my mind. The number one reason I came out, Shannon Sharp,

and I said, I want Shannon Sharp on First Take, because I wanted the world to know that you were wanted. That was the most important thing to me. I wanted the world, I didn't want you to be in a situation where the sports world looked at you and said, what'd he do? He must have done something. Persona non grata, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. So I said, I said, if he ends up here, ends up here.

The honchos know I want him. But more importantly than that, this is a brother that I think has done a lot of good work on television that has helped our community. And as a result, it's incumbent upon me because of the perch that I sit on to let them know he's wanted. Don't cut him off, because that's what they did to me in 2009.

They cut me off and left me for dead bro. And I'm not talking about ESPN, I'm talking about the industry. They cut me off and left me for dead. They thought I was done. They were right in my epitaph and I knew it and I said I was blessed and fortunate enough to have enough connections and to do what I do to overcome it. I don't know if this brother does. So let me let the world know he has me and we'll go from there. That happened. That absolutely happened like that

cause you and I was talking and you like, bro, I got this but soon as I get out of this meeting, I'll hit you back. And we were talking 20 minutes, 30 minutes, an hour. And you took every last one of my calls. And I'm thinking to myself, and I remember getting on the phone calling my sister and I said, maybe it's probably gonna happen.

I said, because it's not coming from inside, it's coming from somebody that I know knows the business. And he wouldn't bulljive me. But he told me that there's a 95% chance that it's gonna happen and he wants me on his show. And I'm like, I think I'm good at what I do. And for him, it did my heart good because I know what you represent in this industry

to say I want him on my show. Whatever these, I don't believe nothing. Look, you go back from when I was with the Broncos for 10 years, went to Baltimore for two, back to the Broncos for two, CBS for a decade, I was with Fox for six years. Now, one person ever said anything bad about Sheldon. He's difficult to work with, he does this, that.

My greatest compliment from players is guys that were on my team say, Sheldon Shalf's the greatest teammate I ever had. He's my favorite teammate, the way he approached it, the way he was. And so for you to come to me, and to say what you said, Shannon Sharpe's the greatest teammate I ever had. He's my favorite teammate, the way he approached it, the way he was. And so for you to come to me, and to say what you said, when you didn't have to do any of it, and nobody would have held that against you. Because like you said, that's what would have happened.

And I heard it. Man, he must have did something. No, showed up every day on time, and did a hell of a job. I remember when Jamie Horowitz, who're talking about came to recruit me in 2016 in April at the W hotel He said you gonna be a star. Yeah, I said I see Jamie. I know what he said. Trust me Yeah, he says I've no talent it goes deeper than that because you see

Jamie whether he wants to tell you this or not, I knew back then Skip was auditioning you. Because whenever I took off, you would be there. Yes. And what Jamie wouldn't tell anybody is that there were extra days that I would take off, just so Skip could bring you on. Because again, if you're not creating opportunities for other people, what good are you? My pastor says, and I'm not the most religious person

in the world, I mean, as promiscuous as I've been in my lifetime, at least for the first, I mean, I am in no position, I'm a lot better now over the last decade or so, but Lord, I have my issues, no question about it. And my pastor would say all the time, there's no success without a successor. And so when I look at, you know, for me, all the brothers that are on the show, one of my proudest moments was when Michael Irvin came last year. And the reason why it was proud, because I love

the playmaker, he and I are very, very tight with brothers. And I know what his name brings and the stature that it holds. And so you're thinking that he comes and others are gonna feel alienated. But if you watched him when he was on the show with us, it was a brotherhood. Yeah, yeah. You see what I'm saying?

He's a great man. It was a brotherhood. So you know him because you know how great he is. Exactly. He loved everybody. But it's like all of these, all of me, Olavsky and R.C. and everybody, it's right, they wanted to be on the air with him.

And so my point is is that that's how it's supposed to be. It's like, wait a minute, the NFL constantly talks about what a brotherhood exists. Well, guess what? First take is a platform for brotherhood. So when Shannon comes on, yeah you gonna be on the air with me. But guess what?

Them brothers gonna slide up in there. Y'all need to be with each other. You need to be next to each other. You need to be verbally knocking somebody like me upside the head when I'm coming at y'all. I'm not a little journalist. I saw this. And y'all like, look at this guy right here. You know when I'm coming at y'all. Like, I'm that little journalist and I saw this. And y'all like, look at this guy right here.

You know what I'm saying? I mean, and we're laughing and having a blast. It's entertainment, bro, but it's information. Okay, it's perspective. It's serious stuff that needs to be addressed. It's the whole gamut. And think about it. We got the national airwaves for the worldwide leader available to us

to disseminate and display our message, our belief, our culture, our perspectives, and put them all on display for everybody to see, to come back or to embrace. But the point is, at the end of the day, you ain't gonna feel alone. You gonna be there and we gonna be together. Why? Because I'm gonna have your back, that's why.

And they gonna have your back. And that's the way it's gonna be. You know, people ask me. That's the way it's gonna be. When people ask me, Stephen, they just like, bro, how do you say what you say? And then, because Shannon, you go to the game, you might be bumping into some of these guys.

So how do you handle that situation? I say, if I see them out, I'll nod. They acknowledge me, I acknowledge them back. If they don't, I keep it moving. Keep it moving. I don't make it personal because I don't know these guys well enough to make it personal.

I'm talking about a given situation. You didn't play good in last night game. It doesn't diminish anything that you accomplished before last night. It doesn't diminish anything that you might accomplish moving night, right? It doesn't diminish anything that you might accomplish moving forward, right? I'm talking about a specific set of events that happened last night, right? How do you handle that stevie day? Cuz I know see most times they look at me. They do a double take They like nah, I'm gonna let that go. That's right. They don't want that smoke. They don't want that smoke

They don't want to approach you physically. They don't want to do nothing. Okay, we cool with that. I'm gonna go pretend like I don't see you. But with you, I'm thinking it like, man, why you say that? Yeah, well, first of all, I respect any of them who comes up to me man to man and confront me. Because if you wanna have a conversation, here's where I'm big on. If I said something publicly and I'm wrong,

I'm gonna correct it publicly. I'm not gonna do something publicly and then apologize privately. Now, if I'm wrong, I'm gonna correct it publicly. Thank you. I'm not gonna do something publicly and then apologize privately. Right. Now, if I'm wrong, I'm gonna do it publicly. I'm a man up, cause that's the kind of man that I am. That's how my mama raised me to be.

The other thing that I'm gonna do, but if I'm right, I'm not budging. You ain't gonna scare me, you ain't gonna intimidate me, you ain't gonna phase me. Let's get it on. Like I tell people all the time, figuratively or otherwise,

it's not about getting your ass kicked. It's about what you willing to take an ass kicking for. You gotta be principled. And you gotta be somebody that's willing to stand on something. And I'm the kind of person that's willing to stand on something. I'm not trying to get personal.

I'm talking about your game. Listen, I've seen players do some stuff behind the scenes. Man, I'm walking out of a hotel room, whatever, I see whatever, and I'm like this, it ain't illegal or nothing like that, but I'm just going like this. I don't know what you're talking about. That keep it moving, ain't none of my business.

Ain't none of my business. Yeah, none of my business. Some of these are, but when you shoot two for 20, oh, that's my business. That's my business. When you lose and gain, that's my business. When you sticking up the joint, that's my business. When you not showing up at practice, that's my business. When you sitting there bitching and whining and moaning about your money, but you ain't earning it, that's my business. Because that's

your career that you've decided to put on public display. Correct. That's the difference. But your personal business, man, I always got you covered on that. As long as, you know, don't ask me to assist in breaking any laws or anything like that because I ain't going to jail for your ass. That ain't going to happen. But outside of that, I mean, it ain't none of my business. I keep it moving.

Football. Yeah. You love your team. I'm thinking you like all things New York. Steelers. You the Steelers guy. I'm a diehard Steelers fan because the first game I ever saw was the Immaculate Reception. Wow.

When I was six years old. My dad, the Immaculate Reception, Franco Harris against the Raiders. And I fell in love with the black and gold ever since. Yeah, I've been a- I still haven't given Neil O'Donnell for that interception. He threw the Larry Brown Super Bowl. I still am recovering from that. I still haven't given Ike Taylor

to give another damn touchdown pass to DeMarius Thomas that T-Bow through. Don't get me started. That probably was the worst moment. That probably been the worst moment of your own career. That probably been the worst one, Steve Lee. the worst moment of your own career. That probably been the worst one, Steve. Listen, man, I had, oh my God. I was with a girl I was dating at the time.

You know, her fine self and everything. And I had my mind on other things. Yeah. And Tebow connected that pass. I collapsed face first on her living room rug and laid there for two hours. Didn't do nothing that night. Totally ruined my night.

Yeah, totally ruined the board. Then he wanted to do nothing. I didn't want anything. I was so damn depressed of all people, and I love him dearly, he's my friend, but that non-throwing Tim throwing Tim Tebow throw an 80 yard touchdown pad, I could not believe to save my life that that happened and I couldn't recover that night bro.

I was depressed. But those two moments are my worst as a Steelers fan. So obviously if you're a Steelers fan, you have to hate the Cowboys. Because when the Sevens, they always met in the Super Bowl. And the Steelers fan, you have to hate the Cowboys. Because when the Sevens, they always met in the Super Bowl. And the Steelers always beat them down. Damn right, damn right.

Roger Starbock and Drew, Drew Hill, Tony Dorsey, keep your ass out of here. He coming, the Steelers took him out. Yes, Bradshaw, Swann, Starwarp, even Franco Harris. I really didn't like that much as a running back. You understand, I like Rocky Blythe more than I liked Franco Harris. He was a fullback. like that much as a running back. You know, I said I like Rocky Blythe more than I like Franco Harris

He was a fullback, but the Steelers and the Steel Curtain with me and Joe Green LC Green with Jack Lambert, Jack Ham, Mel Blount. I like Lord. This is what it's all about. Yeah, Steel Curtains. I couldn't move from no New York teams. They ain't win anything. They were terrible. They were terrible. Terrible. So now, you, basketball, that's your thing. What's Stephen A's favorite sport?

It's basketball, but I've grown to really, really love football because football has been established as an event. So that's Sundays. You know what I'm saying? When you come to New York one time, I'm gonna bring you by the crib. I'm gonna bring you by the crib, show you the crib. You know what I'm saying?

I got the man cave. It's set up. It's set up now. You know, so you got to get- So we gonna watch the game together? They're right, they're right, they're right. We can do that. We can do that with Ryan Clark, Marcus Spears, all that he talking about.

Come on, one time I just invite y'all around, make sure I got some catered food. Yeah, yeah, okay, because I know you can't cook. Hell no, hell no. I cook some lasagna, cook some steak, but I cook- Nah, nobody eat no lasagna. Hell yes, we do. Who they think I am, Garfield?

You, you, you, you might not eat the lasagna. You know what I'm saying they think I am Garfield? You might not eat the lasagna. You know what I'm saying? Knowing you, you're watching your carbs and stuff like that. But some of us gonna eat it. But I will tell you this, I ain't cooking for a bunch of men. That ain't happening. But I tell you this right here. I tell you this right here right now.

You know, you're gonna get, football has established itself as an event. Yeah. But really, the two things I love most is basketball and nothing beats a big time boxing event. Oh yeah. Like when I was at Errol Spence. I was out there, I saw you. Right?

It broke my, I picked Corford to win. I didn't know he would win like that. Yeah, he beat it down. It broke my heart to see Errol Spence get whipped like that. It really, really did. I didn't see that coming. I might be at Canelo versus Charlo. But see, my problem is that Charlo's moving up two weight classes.

I'm scared for him. Now he got mad skills and he got heart and he walks around looking like the bigger guy, but he ain't been in a ring with somebody that's punching him from 168 pounds. Right. In a real fight. Right.

And so that's my concern. His brother got some issues that he gotta resolve. That's what they say, but he's the natural super middleweight. Right. So he was the one who, in my opinion, should have been fighting. Right.

Charlo, I'm sorry, Canelo, rather than this guy. But those big time boxing events in Vegas, I mean nothing beats it. I mean, the Spence fight was really big, but it's been a while since you had those. I remember going to the Mike Tyson and the Mayweather, where it was an event. Mayweather Pacquiao, Mayweather Canelo.

Mayweather De La Hoya. Yes, that was a big event too, but I will tell you, nothing was really bigger than Mayweather Canelo. Mayweather De La Hoya. Yes, that was a big event too, but I will tell you, nothing was really bigger than Mayweather Pacquiao. We had waited so long. Yeah. And the only thing we wanted, it was five years too late. But we didn't know until after the fight

that it was five years too late. So leading up to the event, oh my God, it didn't get any bigger than that. But you know the thing is, everybody that Mayweather fought, he made them look like it was five years too late. Right. And that's how the great that's the greatness of him. Yes. Everybody that he fought they like what he beat Sugar he beat Sugar or Sugar Shane Mosley. He beat Sugar Shane Mosley.

Shane caught him. Shane caught him in the second round. Yeah. Almost heard him. Yeah. Almost dropped him. But you look at you look at the champions that this man beat. Yep. And made them look mundane beating them. This concludes the first half of my conversation. Part two is also posted and you can access it to whichever podcast platform you just listened to part one on. Just simply go back to club Shea Shea profile and I'll see you there. Welcome to the You vs. You podcast.

I'm Lex Barrero, inviting you to go beyond the titles and the accolades of the world's most successful entertainers. Each week, we take off the cape and get real about the inner battles, childhood stories, and the moments that shaped our guests. Get inspired to become the best version of you. Listen to You vs. You podcast on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Michael Kassin, founder and CEO of 3C Ventures and your guide on Good Company, the podcast where I sit down with the boldest innovators shaping what's next.

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