Club Shay Shay - Club Shay Shay - Tyronn Lue Part 2

Episode Date: August 27, 2025

In Part 2, Tyronn Lue discusses LeBron James at length — their dynamic in Cleveland, the trust he built with the Cavs, how he guided them to beat the Warriors, and why calling out LeBron in the Finals made him mad but ultimately stronger. He reflects on the LeBron & Kyrie Irving duo, the failed Derrick Rose and Dwyane Wade experiment, trying to trade for Paul George in Indiana, and whether LeBron might return to Cleveland.From Ben Simmons’ struggles to thoughts on today’s stars like Steph Curry, Jayson Tatum (his cousin), Anthony Edwards, and Kyrie Irving, Lue gives honest takes on the league now versus when he played. He shares his admiration for Kevin Garnett’s trash talk, Rajon Rondo’s fiery personality, and what he’s learned working under Clippers owner Steve Ballmer.Finally, Lue opens up about his health battles, only getting three hours of sleep, and picking the ultimate starting five of his teammates. From Kobe and Shaq’s dynasty to LeBron’s greatest era, Tyronn Lue delivers unforgettable stories, sharp basketball insight, and a masterclass on what it takes to win in the NBA.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Season two of Good Game with Sarah Spain is underway. We just welcomed one of my favorite people, an incomparable soccer icon, Megan Rapino, to the show, and we had a blast. Take a listen. Sue and I were, like, riding the lime bikes the other day, and we're like, we! People ride bikes because it's fun.

We got more incredible guests like Megan in store, plus News of the Day and more. So make sure you listen to Good Game with Sarah Spain on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Brought to you by Novartis, founding partner of IHeart Women's Sports Network. Tune in to All the Smoke Podcast, where Matt and Stacks sit down with former first lady, Michelle Obama. Folks find it hard to hate up close. And when you get to know people and you're sitting in their kitchen tables and they're talking like we're talking. You know, you hear our story, how we grew up, how I grew up.

and you get a chance for people to unpack and get beyond race. All the Smoke featuring Michelle Obama. To hear this podcast and more, open your free IHeartRadio app. Search All the Smoke and listen now. Thank you for coming back. Part two is underway. Paul Pierce, it went viral for saying he's the best pure score.

I mean, I mean, I mean, I mean, I didn't come to mind like maybe Kobe, maybe James Hart, George, K.D. Not saying that Pete, uh-uh, uh-uh. He was a hell of a score. Yeah. And Pete was my guy. I mean, he's my guy.

Right. We came out to drive together in 1998. On the Lockout year, we worked out together, Inglewood High School, every single day. Like, that's my guy. But he says some crazy stuff. But, no, I mean, I'll take away, like, like I always say, just because Braun's great, don't mean, KD isn't great. Right.

You know, like, and P.P.S. was a great score. Right. Like footwork, post, on the elbows, catching shoot threes, he can do it all. So he's not lying about that. You know, so he gets a lot of, you know, but he could definitely score. But like you said, when you, you know, say Katie and, you know, Colve and George. I got through the feet, don't line more to him. But I love it.

That's why he is who he is because he's the confidence he has. Right. You know what I'm saying? That's why he is who he is. So what was it? Because I remember the. The last time LeBron was in Cleveland, you guys beat him, and he had a monster game.

I think he had 27, 19, and 12. That game six, y'all ended up beating before he went to Miami. Proud of that, I mean, but proud of, you know, you guys getting KG and Ray Allen, you know, it was more, I think he beat you guys a little bit more than you guys beat him. But when he goes to Miami and that year, y'all got them and i remember kj say it's over y'all beat them in game five in miami

was up three two you're up three two kj say it's over we ain't coming back down here and then lebron in game six 45 everybody says that's the greatest game he's ever played did you did you get a sense I mean how soon how early in the game did you know for a week we got a lot we got we're in for it

I know I mean I saw a look in his eyes you know when he first on the floor and just his mentality to start the game, how aggressive he was. Yeah. And we were always scared, and Doc was always scared to, like, trap and double team him. Right. Because of his passive ability. And so

he figured that, like, I figured, like, he's going to get everybody's involved. Now everybody's going to get going. Right. He's going to get his anyway. Right. But we didn't think he's going to get 45. Right. And like that game, when he's able to do that game, like that's what really took him to the next level. Right. Like, 45,

go to Miami game seven, win, game seven. And then, you know, to move on, like, but that game was, oh, man. I still have nightmares about that game. Was Miami Heat LeBron? That's the best LeBron we've ever seen? I don't know. I mean. I think 2018, Brian.

The year we went to the finals when Kyrie was gone. Cairoo was gone. Yeah. The way he put, and y'all go to Boston and that game seven. and y'all beat Toronto, y'all beat Toronto, y'all beat Indiana. Yeah. And he had, what, like 8, 40-point games in the playoffs. He had that 51 against a Golden State.

Yeah. He was just, in Miami, he was extremely efficient. Efficient, yeah. You're talking about somebody shooting 55, 56%. 57% from the field. Yeah, that's crazy. Yeah, he was super efficient in Miami. But I didn't get a chance of watch it like I wanted to.

Right. You know, of course, you can't see every game. But what he did in Cleveland, you know. You get him back, he comes back. Yeah. That stretch he had in Cleveland, I think that was his back. So you think the second, the return to Cleveland might have been his best LeBron.

Yeah, for sure. I can't say I disagree. Yeah. The year, 16, the 16, 17 season, we went back to the final. We played against Katie for the first time. Yeah. Like that season right there, I think. was one of the best seasons, like you said,

things ever had. And then I can't remember what that playoffs was, the playoff run he had that might have been the best playoff run. That 18. That was 18? Yeah, yeah. Yeah. We had eight, yeah, I think he had eight, 40-point games.

Yeah. And you got to end up, y'all swept Toronto, who was the number one seed at the time. And then you go on the road in game seven. And Boston, yeah. All 48 minutes. Yeah. That period, that 15 and 18, I think that might have been his best basketball

ever played. people always you know and you get this a lot and I'm sure you've heard it he wouldn't have done that if he played the 90s he wouldn't have done that and he played the 80s he couldn't have played back right the dude got Carl Malone's body he can handle the ball like magic

he got calm alone body and he's more athletic who's been having that kind of athleticism that can do all the things that he can do I'm asking I mean I play the 90s I wasn't sure so you got to say LeBron James can play in the 90s like come on man

I didn't know if I played it like it. What we're talking about? They don't even make sense. Like, if you're great, I don't care where are you playing, you're going to be great. Right. And it is what it is. Coaching the Clippers.

So you're not at the Clippers. No, I want to go to this. I'm going to talk about the Cavalier situation. Because when David Blatt, you were in line to get the job. You were supposed to get the job, right? Yeah, we interviewed the same time for the job. And my agent called me, it was like, you know, Dan Gilbert decided that you wanted to go with, you know, David Blatt.

But I got a crazy thing to tell you. They want you to be the associate head coach. And I was like, no, like, I'm cool. Like, no, I'm going to stay here with Doc. Because I figured, like, if I'm with Doc, who's the best coach in the league, like, I'm going to get a job next year. I mean, it's coming. You know, so I'm not going to leave Doc. I'm going to be loyal to Doc.

And he said, but you wouldn't believe how much money he offered you. And I was like, well, what they offer is, they want to offer you a million dollars a year to be the same thing. associate head coach. Now, the time, I'm making 375 with the Clippers. Yeah, I don't think I could do that. Well, no, I still said no. You said no?

Yeah, I was like, no. Even in California? Yeah, I was like, because you know that 155. Yeah. Yeah. And so I was like, man, like, no, I ain't doing it. I'm going to stay with Doc.

Right. I was like, you sure? Like, yeah, I can't do it. So they came back. An hour later said, they said they give you one, two, one four, whatever. And I was like, no, man. Like, I'm going to stay with Doc.

I ain't going to do that. Like, I'm going to be loyal to Doc. So I called, you know, B. Shaw. I was like, B. Shaw, man, he said, what? You got to take that job. I'm saying, man, I ain't doing it. And then so I called Jerry West, who's my mentor. Right.

And Jerry, like, you know, could you mother you? What are you thinking? If you don't take this job, they'll never give you another job ever again, think you can't leave Doc's umbrella, whatever, whatever. So I was like, man, I'm not doing it. And so he's, like, going crazy. So my agent called back again. He said, like, they said, well, what do you want?

I said, well, just tell him 2 million, 2, 2, 2, whatever, whatever. He coming back said, they said yes. You're like, damn, I feel to say, 2, 5.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. So I was like, all right, I got to go. Hey, Doc. He said, I called Doc, and Doc was like, you know what, Ty, like, it's going to be hard

for us to match that. He said, but I think you're ready to, like, leave my umbrella and, like, you know, spread your own thing, and do your own thing. I think it'd be good for you. And I was like,

you sure, he's like, man, I think it'd be really good for you. And so that's kind of how it happened how I ended up going to Cleveland. So now, okay, you're on the bench that first year, y'all go to the NBA finals, you lose to the Golden State Warriors and Six. Halfway through the season, they make a change.

You get elevated. Now, being a head coach is one thing. When you're the head coach, and now you're coaching the best player in the NBA, that's something entirely different, T. Lou. Yeah, it is. You and LeBron, what type of relationship did you have with LeBron before you became head coach? So I had a relationship with Bron, Rich and Mav, Randy, before I became the assistant.

Like, we always been cool and tight. So, like, we always had that bond. And so when I became the associate head coach, like I said, he, then he came back. You know, so we already had that bond. And so, which was cool. Like I said, I had Rich and Mab behind me 100% in Randy. So even Brown get mad. I had them behind me.

Anyway, you know, but that's kind of like, you know, like that's family. Like that's family. So, you know, when I took over, like I said, I was scared because, you know, anybody can say, I would have did this, I'd have done that, you know, like especially all that social media. You can say all that until you're in that number one seat. And now you got to, okay, let's see what you do. You said you go do that. Yeah, yeah, exactly.

You know, and so moving over six inches, you know, it's tough. It's like, especially midway through the season. Yes. And so I just thought it was a lot of pressure, man. Just like, we just went to the finals. Game six, we lose. No Kevin Love, no Kyrie. And now you want me to replace Coach Blatt, who's done a hell of a job.

And if we don't make it to the finals and make it to least game seven, like, I'm a failure. Right. You know, it was scary. And I didn't really know if I could do it because, like, you're coming through halfway through the season. Right. You haven't really had a training camp. You haven't implemented what you want to run. What you want to do?

Because you got to stick to what? And you got the best player in the world. And so it was, it was tough, you know. But like I said, I will give a lot of credit, you know, to K. Love, Kyrie, Braun, J.R., Tristan, like, those guys, like, they said, listen, we got your back 100%. Like, whatever you want to do, you know, let's do it, we got your back. And I said, I'm going to make some mistakes. Like, you know what I'm going to make some mistakes, but we all guys stick together.

Right. And I get those guys credit, like, they have my back 100%. But you, the natural thing is like, man, Tilu undermined. David Blatt. He was just, you know, he was supposed to be there anyway and he probably was doing X, Y, and Z. Did you hear that? All the time. And that's why it was hard for me to want to take that job because I knew what it was going to look like from the outside looking in. And if they knew the truth about it the year before, they would never said that. Right. You know, and so my job as a social head coach is to do whatever I can to make the head coach job easier.

You know, and so I did that. Right. To the best of my ability. And, you know, I would never undermined somebody for a job, you know, because that's just not who I am. It's not my personality. And I believe it will come back on you if you do things like that. So what was it about Coach Black? Was it, was his message just not resonating? What was it? Because he did go to the NBA finals.

Y'all did make it to a game six minus Kevin Love, minus Kyrie. I believe if you have those guys, we'll never, ever know. I believe you win the series. I do, too. But we'll never know. And then halfway through the season, it wasn't like y'all was in the sixth spot, T. Luke was number one spot. And they fired a coach.

That's never been, I don't, well, maybe I think Milwaukee did something similar a couple years ago with Adrian Griffith. But I'm just saying I don't recall a situation of something like that happening. Was his message just not getting through? Was it just falling on death ears? Somebody go upstairs. Why would you make a, the number one seed? Can you change the head coach after you just went to the finals? You know, for me, I think he did a great job and overseas, like, when you coach overseas, you are the face of the team.

Right. Like, it's what you say goes, no matter what. No matter what player is there, like, you're the face of the team. And when you come to the NBA, the players are the face of the team. And so it's a different dynamic. And so just understand that dynamic that, you know, as much you want to go in and go crazy and cut somebody out, you might can't do it today. You know what I'm saying? You just came.

And, like, his offensive system, like, was great. Right. I wish I could run it today. Like, all the stuff he did. But, like, it didn't fit with Bron. Like, Braun's not going to move like that. Karee wanted to dance. He ain't running around.

Kevin Love is not a mover. You know, and so it was just the offense they ran over there was different when he came over here. Now he'd been successful over there, winning all the championships. And he was a great coach. And I thought it was great stuff we were doing, but it just didn't fit our team

and what we were trying to do. You know, and so I think guys got frustrated with the process and got frustrated with, you know, how we did things, like offensively and defensively, because some of the stuff was different. Right. But there's nothing wrong with change if it works and it was working, but it's just, you know, I think a lot of people got frustrated and didn't take the time and had the patience to really kind of wait for it. And that's kind of like where things got, you know, got harder, you know, so that was it. Do you remember your first game getting booed? Who y'all Do you remember who y'all played first?

Played the Bulls. Bulls? And we played them in Cleveland? Y'all lost. And they booed me? Oh, I don't even remember. Did they booed me, man? Y'all don't remember.

I mean, like I said, I got tough skin. If I mess up, I mess up. Like, I deserve to get booed. I deserve to get criticized. Y'all lost 96 to 83. Okay. But, I mean, do you understand what you did? They fired the coach mid-season.

You get that team. Not only did you get them to the NBA finals, you orchestrated the greatest comeback in finals history, down 3-1 to a guy that was, he was the first guy to be a unanimous MVP, and two of the last three games were on the road. How do you lie to them? You got a lie.

Coach, you tell us all the time. Sometimes guys, they got a lie to you. How do you lie to them and tell them They really got a chance to win this You know what's crazy is that I swear to God I thought that we can win Like even we were down 3-1 I thought that we could win

What? You had just lost You had just went down 3-1 At your home court, T-Loo? But I'm saying we lost the two first The two games we lost first We got blown out Yeah

We win game three Yes We should have won game four We tricked it off the last two minutes of the game Right Right So we go down 3-1 And I'm like

We still have opportunities to win this Like, we still can win. I really believed it. But we had to make some tweaks and we made some adjustments. And like I said, I give our guys credit for doing that. But it was funny,

like getting to that point, every time we lost a game, I never showed film. And so David Griffin would go back to our video guy, DV. He was like, man, what the hell is he doing? Like, why? He said, listen, just trust him.

He know what he's doing. Like, just trust him. If he's doing it, I believe in it. Right. So, like, because after game one or even in the finals before, like if we show film and like they was blowing us out like it was like you don't want mentally you don't right you know we can't beat these guys exactly so you don't want the guys seeing that so we're coming

and have a fun day shooting half court shots right tweak some stuff here and there and when we win that's when we be a long film session all the stuff we've met we're making mistakes on and like well we got to clean up to be better and it worked because you don't want to psych your guys out thinking like how can we beat them right you know so every time we lost I never show film we won I showed all the stuff we need to get better at. And we just had to make some tweaks defensively, and we made those tweaks. Like I said, I give JR, Shump,

and all those guys credit for what we was able to do to change our strategy because if you play Golden State the way they play their pace and how fast they play, you don't know until you're in it. Right. You can't go to practice and work on stuff. You can't replicate that.

Can't do it. You know, and so I saw that when you plan, when you're switching everything, they're going to pick you apart. Right. Like, Dremont, with his passing, step and clay with their movement like you just can't switch everything

and so after game four I was like listen when step and clay come together splits and all that we're switching it anybody else you stand locked in so it won't be no confusing we make a mistake we're gonna make a mistake on you know the other guys

we ain't gonna make a mistake on these guys you know and so it worked like j'all and shump locked in the step and clay like if you go on Eagle Dala Livingston you're pushing up you're just protecting and like it changed our whole series Like, it changed it. And then the performance that Braun and Kyrie had in game six.

No. Game five. Game five. Yeah. In the game five and, like, going home for game six, like, I thought we warmed down. And then game seven, you got the best player in the world going into game seven. You got to love your chances. So that's, you know, kind of what happened.

With an ever situation that you had like, because it's hard because you got a LeBron man or any great player to like, bro, I need more from you. You got to give me more. Yeah, half time of game seven Yeah, half time of game seven We come in a locker room And Like this, we're going to show a film And I said, no, I ain't no film

Like, so I came and said, Brian, what are you going to do, man? What you mean? So you got to do more. Like, you got to be better Like, what do you want me to do, T. Luke? I'm like, because he had 20 points and might have seven assists But he level out on the table

To me. Right. And this is game seven. You're the best player in the world. I was like, we need, what would you want me? I said, you got to guard Draymond better. score the basketball, stop turning over, be aggressive.

I'm Jake Hofer, and this is Back 40, a limited series show on Wire to Hunt, part of Meat Eat Eater's podcast network. Each episode, I'll be asking eight white-tail hunting pros, a focused, thought-provoking question about hunting and land management. How do I hunt the best part of the farm with less than ideal access? Should you, that's what the real question is. Stand without good access is not a good stand.

Listen to Back40 on IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. I'm Dan, he's Ty. Hello. And we're the Solid Verbal College Football Podcast. College football season is here, and you know what that means. Your team is going to break your heart three times, probably before Halloween. Uh-huh, but fear not.

The Solid Verbal will be right there with you through every soul-crushing loss, an impossible comeback. Join us all season long, all years. long as we ride the roller coaster of this ridiculous sport. Whether you're a die-heart fan or a casual observer, we'll help you make sense of all the chaos and, of course, celebrate the madness. Tune in for previews, recaps, bits you won't hear anywhere else, and all the emotional support you need as a college football fan. We don't just love college football, tie.

We live it. Listen to the Solid Verbal College Football Podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Simone Boyce, host of the Brightside podcast, and on this week's episode, I'm talking to Olympian, World Cup champion, and podcast host, Ashlyn Harris. My worth is not wrapped up in how many things I've won, because what I came to realize is I valued winning so much that once it was over, I got the blues, and I was like, this is it.

For me, it's the pursuit of greatness. It's the journey. It's the people. It's the failures. It's the heartache. Listen to The Bright Side on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The U.S. Open is here. And on my podcast, Good Game with Sarah Spain, I'm breaking down the players from rising stars to legends chasing history. The predictions will we see a first-time winner and the pressure. Billy Jean King says pressure is a privilege, you know. Plus, the stories and events off the court and, of course, the honey deuses, the signature cocktail of the U.S. Open. The U.S. Open has gotten to be a very fancy, wonderfully experiential sporting event. I mean, listen, the whole aim is to be accessible and inclusive for all tennis fans, whether you play tennis or not.

Tennis is full of compelling stories of late. Have you heard about Icon Venus Williams' recent wildcard bids or the young Canadian, Victoria Mboko, making a name for herself? How about Naomi Osaka getting back to form? To hear this and more, listen to Good Game with Sarah Spain, an Iheart women's sports production in partnership with deep blue sports and entertainment on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of IHeart Women's Sports. Anything else you want me to say?

So he madden them up, right? So I go in the office, I slam the door. So later, after we, you know, it was over, Damon Jones said, Braun came to him like, man, can you believe he? Heeloo, man, called me out like that. That's some boys. Whatever, whatever. Dee Jones said, well, I ain't been here all year, but everything I read and you called

and told me, you trust him. Why not trust him now? He's like, F you. He goes to James Jones. Can you believe T. Man, I can't believe it? James Jones said, did he lie? So then Braun snatch his step out of the locker, storm out.

That's all she wrote. I mean, JR, people understand. J.R. scored the first seven points. He did. He did. And then after that, because he was down seven. But J.R. scored seven straight. And then after that, man, Bron, what he did after that was, it was all she wrote.

The chase down and then Kyle Reese three-point shot. I don't know because you guys had gone like three minutes, T. Lou, and nobody could score. I know. It was like somebody put a lid on the basket. Everybody was bricking, air balling. You could feel that it was tightening. Everybody felt, I don't care what anybody says, everybody felt it. Do you feel that if Iguodala had laid that ball up,

that was going to be the momentum that they needed to win the game? Or you felt you guys, even if they had broke the score? Because you guys scored first. Yeah, I mean, no, they scored first. The guy escaped. No, he was tied. Yeah, he blocked it. Yeah, we called time out.

And then Kyle restarted dance. Right, and so we called time out, and the thing about Brown was exhausted. And so we get to the bench, I mean, he's like, he's done. So I'm like, shit. You know, Kyle, it's time of dance. You know what I'm saying? I'm like, we want to run pick and roll, you know what I'm saying?

Because Clay was a great defender. Right. And like I said, Steph, you know, to where he's at now, defensive-wise, like, he took a huge step and take pride and garden, you know, now. And so they had no weak links. Right. You didn't want Dreyman.

You didn't want Eagle Dollar. You didn't want Clay. So I was like, but we got to try to get Steph into action. Right. You know, so, you know, we run a pick and roll. You know, Kyrie gets to swing. switch, I ain't know you're going to shoot a three. You know what I'm saying? I ain't going to show a three.

And so he gets... But that's his, that's his shot, though. That side step three, that's his shot. So he gets to that right wing, he's dancing, and he shoots it. And, like, man, like, from that point on, I was just blacked out. Like, once he made that shot, I, like, blacked out. Like, I remember Caleb, like, you know, guard and Steph, yeah. Guard and Steph. And I remember it was, at the end of the game, we were up.

Four? Yeah, Braun gets fouled. We up four. And it was two things that we worked on. They ran two knee three plays for shots. And so the whole series, before we got to the series, leading up to it, and the series, I was like, listen, we're going to work on these ATOs. But on their need three plays, guys are going to be in different positions. So every day, we worked on their need three plays.

I said, it's going to come a time we're going to need it. So, like, Kyrim, man, we're doing this again. And then, like, because all the games were blowouts. It wasn't no close games until Game 7. Right. And so we never had to use it. And so we worked on an every day on this play. Kai Rie, you guard this guy.

Tristan, you guard this guy. Bron, you here on this play. When they do it, now you garden over here. So we had guys in different spots. So when Draymond goes to take the ball out of bounds, you see him, he's like, man, what the? Because the matchups was crazy, but we knew how we wanted to switch. Right. We got deflection.

So the ball goes out of bounds. So they called the second play they run ATO-Wiles for knee three, and guys go to different. different matchups. And Jayvon's like, man, what the... Like, it messed them to... So then we win the game. So the next day, like, see, that's why we work on.

He said, man, you was right. And we worked on it for seven, like, eight days before the series started. And then every day we worked on the need three and they talked trash to me. Oh, man, we ain't gonna never use this. This is stupid. And then, end of the game, we needed it.

How are you able to earn the players trust in Cleveland so quickly? Um, I would say being around the players, coach and play with. I think that's one. I think winning. I think with something. And then I think just having a relationship with Bronn, like I think having a relationship with Bronn really set the tone for everybody else. And I had a relationship with JR. You know, when he first

came in league, you know, he used to come work out with us in Vegas. And so I knew JR. But the other guys I didn't know, like you said. But having Brown's respect and having a friendship with Braun, that really helped me earn to respect to everybody else in the locker room. You're the first coach in the NBA history when his first 10 postseason game. You did you know that? Yeah.

I don't think that's going to be broken. Somebody almost broken recently. They did? Almost. When you're good, they got to start over again. Somebody almost broke it first year. I can't remember who it was. Was it?

Let me see. Was it Missoula? Did they go? Yeah, you might be right. Yeah, I think he broke. He got closer, tired of so I don't know. I mean, it was right there. I know that happened.

I read the story that you're, is this true about the money that you put up in the ceiling? Yeah. Or you made that up? No, that's true. You knew after winning game five that you guys were coming back for game seven. Yeah.

Because you didn't feel there was no way they could beat you in game six in your building. I didn't think so. And so after game five, our owners and, you know, front office people are in a locker when everybody's going crazy, we hype, whatever. So I walk in the locker room, I said, all right, everybody gave me $200.

I was like, what? I was like, everybody gave me $200. I'm going to put it in the ceiling, and we're coming back for Game 7 and get our money. And so we're going, oh, yeah, they're going crazy. So everybody gives $200, $200, $200, the owner, Dan Gilbert, you know, Nate Forbes, they all get money, put it up in the ceiling. But I got it from Doc, because Doc did it. We played the Lakers in L.A. Right.

Christmas Day, and they blew us out. Right. And Doc said, listen, y'all remember this, remember how it feels because we're going to play them in the NBA finals and we come back to get our money. And we put it, hit in the attic, I mean, in the ceiling, came back and it was there. And Doc passed the money out.

The only difference with me, I kept. Come on, Keeloo. I'm going to tell you how crazy Brian is, how tight he is. So we win the championship. We just won. Man, they're in the block of room. They spray him champagne. Brian, man, man, what are that 200 at?

Man, come on, man. We just want to. You weren't about two. I said, man, I think this ball boy stole it. It ain't in there no more. You know what I'm saying? So I kept that. I deserved it.

I deserved it. Man, come on, Brian. $200. He wanted it. I wanted it back. I wouldn't give it back to that. There have been whispers about LeBron possibly returning to Cleveland. Do you think he's going to return to Cleveland?

Before you answer that, are you surprised? This is the first time in LeBron's career. LeBron James is on an expiring contract. I'm surprised about that. I mean, this is a player that, like, he's... He gave you 24, 8, and 7 last year. And he's changed the game. Like, he's made it to where these guys are able to go to whatever teams they want to go.

And, like, you said, build their careers and do... Like, he was the one to take that first step. Yes. You know, and so... He took all the heat. All the heat, you know, to get to this point where now you see... Everybody's doing it, you know, and he paved that way, you know. And so I think if he's on an expiring contract, I think it's something that he wants.

I don't think that, you know, like the Lakers are willing to give you, you know, finish this year out and that's it. I think if he's on a one-year contract, that's where he wants to be. Going back to Cleveland, I don't know. Yeah. Like, can you see it? I don't. I don't. I mean, I don't know.

You went to L.A. You've done everything you can do in Cleveland. Right. I think you finish it up in L.A. I don't know how much longer, how much longer they want him in L.A., but I think the thing else, he finishes up in L.A. I don't think he's done after this year. No.

I don't think he's done. And the thing is, Tilo, I was telling, I was talking to somebody other day. I said, if you play 24, you might as well go and get that 25. Yeah, he's not done it this year for sure. But I think he wants to sit that record out there. He wants to sit that record out there. Ain't nobody going to get it. They can't catch it.

Because K.D., he thinks KD. is the closest, but KD. is 10,000 points away. That's 10,000. So if you average, that's another seven, eight years. That's right now. Yeah. LeBron plays another two, three years. That thing will be a 45,000 point. I mean, it's going to be hard to catch that.

I don't see no more. Because you have to play a lot. You have to have to have sustained greatness. Yeah. Because nobody thought Kareen. And healthy. And hell. Because nobody thought Kareen the record would be broken because, first of all, only Biggs played that long.

Exactly. Long jump. And then you could play that long if you were big. big because guess what you go down to the block they dump it down to you you ain't trying to get up and down to court like that but you're averaging eight nine 10 points yeah you know when you get that old as a big yeah like think of all our great bigs when they play you know past their prime yeah yeah they only have eight nine 10 points brawn after 25 yeah like like so I mean I think he's gonna put it out of reach where it's gonna be hard to it's gonna be hard to get

there but he was working at the I saw that you know he posted a video he was working at the clipper facilities yeah no I see now Yeah, I saw that. What that mean? I don't even know if I could speak or not. You gave the key? No. Yeah, he's working out at our old practice facility.

Oh, yeah, the one that we had in Pliar. So, yeah, put that out there. The one that plier. Yeah, he went out of our facility. You know what I'm saying? I can't say anything about that. Had LeBron and Kyrie stayed together? They won another championship?

Yes, sir. Yes, sir And I think Also think if KD doesn't go to Golden State Oh y'all But they had to get it Yeah

They had to get him They were never going to beat you guys again Tee Lou. Yeah If KD doesn't go to Golden State I think we win Three in a row And I think Kyrie stayed Because you can't leave after that

Right You know what I'm saying And so I think he stays And I think Like I said we had chance To win two or three Is there anything you could have done differently

to maybe keep Kyrie and LeBron together or has Kyrie made his mind up that he wanted to go elsewhere? He had made his mind up but that's like another Kobe and Shaq's I would never let it happen. Right. And I begged and pleaded.

I begged and pleaded. LeBron said he begged and pleaded. He said, hey, don't trade him. He still got to year on his contract. Don't trade him. Brown was doing an autograph signing with jerseys and stuff for his foundation. So I come sitting next to Braun.

We're sitting there handing the phone, Sports Center. Kyrie Urban's just been traded to the Boston Celtics. Man, Braun dropped the marker and just lays back in his chair for about 10 minutes. It doesn't say a word, like just pissed off. And Bronn was crushed. And I saw when that happened, I thought things would, like, I thought Brown would do something different, you know, sooner or later.

And that's what he did. So you believe LeBron would have stayed in Cleveland had Kyrie stated? Yes. I think so. Damn. I mean, you've seen breakups. You were there. I mean, you weren't there at the time,

but Kobe and Shaq. You saw Blake in CP3. You saw LeBron and Kyrie. If somebody would have told you in the beginning how well it was working that this was going to be the ultimate outcome, would you have believed it? As far as what?

Them parting ways. All those guys? Yeah. No. No. I mean, I couldn't see it, you know, the way it happened, you know, especially like I said, Colby and Shaq being in it every single day in the locker room, like, because it had too many great guys around them.

Like, you had a lot of great buffers, you know, like Rick Fox, Robert Ory, B. Shaw, Harp. Like, they were old enough to, like, understand, like, what was the stake? Yes. And I understand, like, we got something special here. Yeah, something special. And so they would never let it come to where it came to. to, you know, so that was tough. And then, you know, I think Kyrie, his biggest thing is, like,

because he's a competitor. Yeah, he's a killer. Like, so he wanted to show, kind of like Kobe did, you know, with Shaq. Because that's his mentor. Yeah, I want, I can win, you know, without Braun. And for me to take that next step, this is what I got to do. And so to have his own team and to do that, like, that was his, that was his goal. And that's what he wanted to do.

Right. So I don't think it was nothing though ill will against Brown. It was just something he wanted to do for his career. Right. KD He starts out in And OKC He goes to Golden State

Wins two and three Goes to Brooklyn Leeds Brooklyn Goes to Phoenix Now he's in Houston How different Are we looking at KD If he doesn't go to the Warriors

As far as if you want or not Yeah I mean I think the only difference would be If you won an OKC And which they could have They could easily done that too Right

You know, so, I mean, I wouldn't look at them different. You know, I think a lot of great players, like, they think, you know, you have to win a championship to be, you know, to be on this tier or whatever. And it's not fair. It's us now. Yeah. We've done that. Yeah.

Because we say you're a bum. We say you're not any good. We don't say you're bum. But we say you're not any good. Or they put, who's the greatest NBA player that's never won a championship? Yeah. So rings are everything now. Yeah.

We'll take a guy that's average. and 10 points and put him above somebody that's historically great because he has a ring. And Kenny's one of the best players of all time. All times.

Yeah, so, like, it just, it just, you know, everybody doesn't win, you know, and so. And they shouldn't. Yeah, exactly. No, no. What's the value of a,

what's the value of a championship if every great player won it? Mm-hmm. But, you know, if he goes and go and stay and went, oh, well, he went to Golden State.

Well, what you want him to do? Right. If he don't win, you're going to say he didn't win. You criticize him. If he goes and wins, it's criticized as well. Right. It's just not fair. Right.

You know, and so, I mean, what else can you say? He's a bad, he's a bad dude. Whether he won a championship or not won a championship or whatever, like, he's one of the best, greatest players to play this game. And so what did you guys need when he goes to the Warriors, when he goes to the Warriors, what did Cleveland need to combat that? Because I don't believe, I don't believe without KD, I believe without KD, they're not going to beat you again.

Yeah. After you beat them at 2016 coming back from 3-1, I don't believe they can beat you again. I think we had the blueprint on how to beat them. Like, Steve Kerr's a mastermind, so he probably to figure something out. But I thought we had the blueprint. But for us, probably, I would say, like a dominant center, like a guy you can throw the ball to.

Dump it down to him and punish him inside. Yeah, so Draymond's not helping all over the place because Tristan was a really good player but offensively being able to throw the ball post the basketball and make plays because K. Love played more of the four. But I think a bigger center that can protect the rim

could be dominant on the block. I think that would have helped us out a lot but it was just when they got KD like you blitz. It wasn't even fair. It wasn't even fair. You blitz Steph. Drey Mons is the best pocket, catch the ball

in the pocket and now you got Clay instead I mean Clay and Katie sitting in the cool like I mean, I mean, Eagle Donald for the Lobb, Clay in his corner, KD in his corner, like, what you're going to do? And you still, you're still worried by still? Yeah, like, it just, it was unfair. That last year, you guys had D. Rose, you guys had D. Wade. And it just didn't, it wasn't working.

Yeah. It wasn't working. Why wasn't it working? I think D. Wade and, let's say D.Roles is, you know, coming down towards, was the end of the career, but D. Rose ended up playing a lot longer than he thought he was going to play. Right. But you have, like I said, great players. You know, D. Rose, one of my favorite players, like, to play the game, and then D.A., you know, as well.

And then, well, they've been able to do with other teams and then coming to Cleveland with Braun, I think, like, Braun gave them the leeway to do whatever they want. But I just think just trying to figure it out, playing with each other, the spacing, the shooting, you know, all those components played a factor. And it just wasn't a good fit. Like, it wasn't, they could still play. It just wasn't a good fit, you know, basketball-wise. And that's just kind of like how it didn't work. But if I had a little bit more time, I would have been able to figure it out. Right.

You know, but it just, like, it just didn't fit the style that we wanted to play or had to play or need to play. It just didn't fit. Adam Silver says he's changing the All-Star game. It's becoming watchable T-Lew. It ain't number three's, it ain't number threes and dogs. And that ain't the way. Man, nobody.

Bro, I grew up on the All-Star game. They played. I ain't saying you got to play it like it's a game seven. I ain't saying you got to play it like a playoff game. But this is unacceptable. So they've changed the format. What's the format now? It's the U.S. versus the world, isn't it?

Yeah. So Yokic, Luca, Janice, Embed, Shea, going to be Steph, K.D., LeBron, book. Yeah. And what's the... they win, then what? No, we want to see some action. We don't want to see the, man, we always had a 200,

somebody almost scored 200 points in the All-Star game. No, I'm saying, but it's like in baseball, if you win, like, you know. Well, that's what it should do. We should have went, go back to the East West, and the winning side get home court advantage. No matter what the record is, whoever wins the All-Star game, get the home-court advantage. Right.

And you'll start playing. Yeah. Because, come on. Let me go shoot 73s. I mean, I don't know. No, man. I don't... However Adam Cil was going to fix it, it's going to be great

because, like I said, he makes sure he does a great job. So I believe in him. It's been a while since we had an American boy in the Pitch, Lou. It's been a minute. I mean, Yokey's got three, Janice's got two, and B's got one, now we got Shea. Maybe not as a hold, a hold, but is the world catching up with us as far as basketball?

Like, not overall because each player is from a different country. Yeah. But they are getting better. Yeah, they're getting better. I mean, you know, it ain't a foregone conclusion in 28. Now, you do realize that, right? Because they're doing. I'm Jake Hofer, and this is Back 40, a limited series show on Wire to Hunt, part of Meat Eat Eaters podcast network.

Each episode, I'll be asking eight white-tail hunting pros, a focused, thought-provoking question about hunting and land management. How do I hunt the best part of the farm with less than ideal access? Should you? That's what the real question is. Stand without good access is not a good stand. Listen to Back 40 on IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. I'm Dan. He's Ty.

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Listen to the Solid Verbal College Football Podcasts on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Simone Boys, host of the Brideside Podcast, and on this week's episode, I'm talking to Olympian, World Cup Champion, and podcast host, Ashlyn Harris. My worth is not wrapped up in how. many things I've won. Because what I came to realize is I valued winning so much that once it was over, I got the blues, and I was like, this is it. For me, it's the pursuit of greatness. It's the journey. It's the people. It's the failures. It's the heartache. Listen to the Brightside on the IHeartRadio

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I mean, listen, the whole aim is to be accessible and inclusive. For all tennis fans, whether you play tennis or not? Tennis is full of compelling stories of late. Have you heard about Icon Venus Williams' recent wild card bids? Or the young Canadian, Victoria Mboko, making a name for herself? How about Naomi Osaka getting back to form? To hear this and more, listen to Good Game with Sarah Spain, an IHeart Women's Sports Production in partnership with Deep Blue Sports and Entertainment

on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of IHeart Women's Sports. T-Loo, it took Herculean effort, T-Lu? No. T-Lu! I mean, it took, it took... Basketball still comes through here. T-Lu, it took LeBron, it took KD, and it took Steph.

Okay. That's why we the best. They're not going to be there at 28. How many MEPs Braun got? Oh. How many KD got? One. Step.

Two. Okay, there you go. You try to have them around for 20, for 20. No, I'm just saying. I'm just saying, like, that's why we're the best players in the world. I mean, they have, like, Joker, like, they have great players, too. Right. What I'm saying is they're not going to be able to catch us because it's one or two guys in each country.

Right. Like, we're one place. Right. And we have all the talent. We have all the skill. We have all the athleticism. But, like I said, they are really good. I mean, they're great.

Because they're playing, because the thing is, Tilu, is that the Germans, they've been playing together their whole life. Right. The Slovenians. The Serbians. The Libyans, the Lithuanians, Australians, they've been playing together. 10 years old. Yes! We come together for two weeks, come to Vegas for two weeks, practice.

Then we go to somebody do, play, like, three exhibitions, and then they go play. Right. Now, I do think, uh, wimby. Oh, yeah. Wimby, I think, but I don't know, man. I just, y'all, we, no, we're the greatest. You got, you, we got this at 28? Yes.

Okay. Yeah, for sure. I'm going to check out the game now. You can rewind his tape in three years and say, you know what, Tee, listen. But no, we're going to win. You were on the staff at the Clippers when Shea was there. No. You were there?

No, I was in, when Shea got there, I was. You still in Cleveland? Yeah, I was in Cleveland. Doc said he pleaded with them, says, look, this guy going to be. special. Don't trade him. But to appease Kauai you had to because Kauai is like, I ain't got time. I need somebody that's proven.

PG was proven. He's been an all-N-B-A player, can play both the ends of the court. But watching him, I mean, watching Shay, did you know Shay was going to be this? No. No, I did. And we talked about it all the time. And, you know, 30 GMs or presidents or whatever, even like, like, if it would have been done all over again

I mean I'd have done the trade too yes like PG was second in MVP voting yes like two-way player like it was like Jordan Pippin you know what I'm saying yeah and Shay like I said he was a really good you know young player but you know he's going to be this right you know and I think it was the best thing

for Shay because Shay would stay with the clippers he wouldn't be yeah he wouldn't have a ball in his hand like exactly and so he was able to grow and figure it out have his own team yes and like I mean anything hindsight 2020 you can say oh I would have never done that But who wouldn't have traded, you know, a first-year player for a guy like PG, you know, to team up with Kauai? Right.

Like, anybody would have done that. They lied. They said they wouldn't have. Right. You know, so now, now, and they'd be like, no, it's only, yeah, it's not, it's not a question. But, yeah, that was, that was a no-brainer to me. Did you try to get, did you guys try to trade for Paul George when you was in Cleveland? Yeah.

When he was in Indiana. And why didn't it happen? I don't remember. Damn. Yeah. We try to get them. PG, LeBron, and Kyrie? Ooh.

See, that might have been enough. That might have been enough to go back. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Because now you can throw LeBron. I mean, obviously, you let PG start with him, and then you can have LeBron, but you still got guys now. You got three guys that can really score the basketball.

LeBron, Kyrie, and PG. And Kelle can score. Yeah. Yeah. So, that about, man. We try it. Damn Ooh

You got to answer me this This is what I want to know The bubble Because this is what I got Man, the Clippers didn't even want to be there Okay, they wanted to be there When they got the 3-1 lead They lost the 3-1 lead

They didn't want to be there I'm like, what kind of boy guy is that? Do you know who? Am I wrong? So explain to the people That was in the bubble because I see a lot of people that didn't win try to undermine it.

I think, who was that that said something the other day about it? The gym, right? Jim. Was it David Griffin? No, the one at Philly. Mori. Yeah, Darry Mori.

Darry. Now, he almost blew the whole thing up talking about what he was talking about. And now he wanted to talk about the championship don't mean nothing. Now, had he won't, I guarantee you he wouldn't be talking about that. I'll take it. Give it to me.

I'll take it. So how with the team that you guys had, did you lose a 3-1 lead? And you guys had double-digit leads in every game. Yeah. Man, Jamal Murray and Joker, like, they took it to another level. Yeah. You know, they took it to another level. And they played great.

I mean, like I said, if you build a little. a 16, 15, 16 point lead. Like, you was doing something right. Right. You know, and so it just, they play better than we did, you know, coming down a stretch, you know, and so if you get hired at the right time, like you said, it's tough. And so being up 3-1 and having an opportunity to close them out, and we would have done that thing, we could have won.

We could have won the bubble. We could have won it. Yeah. Out of ticket. You took the championship? Doc would have took it? What you mean? Yeah, we took it.

But after that. doc ends up getting fired he and PG have a back and forth PJ said well I'm not playing the kind of basketball that I want to play running you know maybe he said I think he wanted to run pendines and Doc had him running flares or whatever the case may be you know whatever the case may be

I've really never heard you say anything about you know obviously players move on and you understand that having played in this game having coached in this game that players are going to move on and sometimes we might have never get out but we don't see eye to eye and me and the player don't see eye to eye

is there ever scenario where you feel you would player said something that you would counter that or you just let it walk I let it walk I mean that's just something that's egregious

or you're testing my man who like you want to scrap I ain't running from that you know I'm saying like but yeah I ain't running from that but like you know players are going to be upset they're going to say

what they're going to say, but I think if you're a leader and you're a coach, like, you've got to take the higher role, you know, I do believe in that. And so, you know, to me, like, I'm always going to take the blame, whether I'm wrong or not. Right. You know, and so if you're a leader at any corporation or any profession, like, if you're the leader of the team, like, you should take the responsibility and you should take the blame. Right. Even though, you know, 100% it wasn't. Right. But my job is take that pressure off you guys, so you're not getting, you know, crucified and so that's just how I feel it should be, you know, and so

I wouldn't go back and forth with a player, you know, I wouldn't do that. The Lakers had a vacancy. You was in the running. I think LeBron called you a couple of times, wanted you to take the job. Why didn't you take the job? I mean, you played for the Lakers. I mean, I think it's always a good story when a guy can go back

and coach the team that he played for. I would have loved it. I mean, it'd been a dream coming from. True. Yeah. Why don't you take the job? One, they offered me short years. They offered me three years, and I want to do five.

Right. I guess they were trying to tie me to LeBron. Two, the money was low. No, don't they know the cost of living in L.A.? Well, I'm saying it wasn't low for me personally the money. it was low for the head coach and for what it meant to everybody else going forward. It's kind of like, you know, the players association,

if you take a bad deal, they're going to give us all bad deals. Right. And so I just felt, for me, being a championship coach and being black, you know, I thought it was up to me to make sure I set the standard where if I take a bad deal, then what's everybody else going to get? A worst deal. Yeah, a worst deal.

So I just thought it was up to me, you know, to make sure I did that. that. Right. And then from, and I, it's hard because, you know, loyalty is tough, but then I couldn't pick my coaching staff. You know, I had, well, they won't let me pick my coaching staff. So they was going to pick my coaching staff for me. And so I had to leave a lot of guys behind. What, what, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, what you mean? Pick your coaching staff. They wanted to pick my staff for me. So in other words, instead of saying, I want to hire, you know, John Drew or this guy, that guy, they're like, no, you got, you got him,

him and him. Yeah. But you don't know them like that. I knew some of the guy. I mean, it wasn't a thing why I didn't like the guys they wanted me to hire. My thing was just leaving guys behind.

Right. Like, so if I'm fired and my guys are out of work, then, you know, I get a job and just say, I'll forget them and you're leaving behind. Like, we won a championship together. Right.

Went to four straight finals together. Yes. You know what I'm saying? And so what we've done, we showed is it worked, you know? And so I just felt that that wasn't, that wasn't something that I wanted to do. And so those three things kind of, you know, nipped it in the bud.

And, you know, we went out, I mean, it wasn't no bad blood. Like, it was what it was. It wasn't. And then, you know, Monty Williams. Yeah. Save the world. You know what I'm saying? Getting that big deal.

Yeah. And then, because we had coaches and meetings in Chicago just talking about, you know, it's going to be hard to fire coaches if we make more money. Right. You know, and so they don't really respect us. as leader as the organization. Like, we've run in a billion-dollar organization. You know, they don't really respect us.

Like, we're getting three, four million. I mean, that's a lot of money. But I'm just saying, like, in a coaching world, they can just let you go. They're paying, you know, some teams are paying three, four, five coaches. You know what I'm saying? But, like, Monty Williams. So I told Steve Kerr, I told.

Phoenix. I told Doc. I told Spow, like, because this was like, you know, four years. I said, y'all, y'all, the face of the league, as far as coaches, like, y'all got to get the money up. Like, you know what I'm saying? Right. And they're like, well, you know, whatever.

And so two years later, Monty goes and gets... Get the bag in Detroit. Yeah. And then he gets the bag, then Smow, then Steve Kerr, then pop, and then me. You know what I'm saying? And then now everything is going up, you know, and so I think it's fair. I think, you know, when you have a coach and there's 15 players and you like the 13, 14th, the highest paid player, I mean, I mean, out of the players and the coach, you know,

Like, that ain't, that ain't fair. Like, you know, and so I thought he did a really good job with just, you know, showing appreciation for coaches. Right. And, you know, because it's a hard, it's a hard job. I'm always wanted to ask you this. Why do you like, I look at you, you give John Wallace an opportunity, you give Russ an opportunity, you give Ben Simmons an opportunity. What is it about that?

Why do you, why do you, why do you, why do you do that? Give, give guys an opportunity. because, you know, Ben, for whatever reason, seemed like he lost his confidence, and we'll touch on this a little later. John Wall had a situation. He went through some stuff with his mom and had some tough injuries.

Russ. Why do you do that, T-Lew? Because I played, and I understand. And so, you know, a lot of times you just need, you know, a coach that can give you confidence and get you back to, you know, where you want to get to, you know. And so I've been a player when, you know,

the time's almost up. You know, like the clock is running out. And, you know, you never want to see guys go out like that. And having a relationship with those guys and giving them an opportunity. I will always do that. And so, you know, a lot of guys have career years playing under me because, like I said, give them confidence. So guys, they didn't want to play the game no more like Reggie Jackson and Nick Baton. And then they're playing six, seven, eight more years, you know, when they was ready to retire.

You know, and so it's important to be able to give back, you know, to our guys and any way I can. And so I really enjoy that. What happened with Ben Simmons? You talk about the guy that was rookie of the year. He was an all-N-B-A player. He was a perennial all-star. And then all of a sudden, it just didn't click. Something happened.

Me, I trace it back to that Atlanta game where he had a layer. I mean, he had a look like a dunk and he passed it. And his coach was critical. The best player was critical. And I remember I was undisputed with Skip. I said, it's over. I said, he's never going to be the same. And he said, why do you say that?

I say, because the head coach said what he said and his best player said what he said. I said, they broke his confidence. I said, at that city, and then, you know, you see the meme where this has been similar than it's a trash can going down the street because the city is flooding. They broke his confidence. And he hasn't been the same player since. Now, I know he's had some injuries. But how do you, when a guy, he's the first overall pick, he's rookie of the year, he's perennial, a perennial all-star.

How does confidence, confidence, is that big of a thing in basketball? Steve, Lou? Confidence is everything in life, whatever you do. You know, and I come from one of the most confident places in the world, Mexico, Missouri. Listen, I'll tell you, you would think everybody down is Michael Jordan. I'm saying, everybody, you know, it doesn't matter. Like, you know, from all my God, Damon to J-Row to Conrad, to Stacey, to fit, like, everybody think they think they're it, you know.

So having that confidence plays a big factor in everything you do. For me, I think I equated to just that, you know, that play, whatever. I don't think that changed. I think the injuries really set him back. You know, having two back surgeries. You know, then we acquired him this year, seeing what his knee, you know, seeing like how his knee was. You know, all things he had to fight through to be able to get on the floor, I think played a big role. I think you saw in Brooklyn last year, like he was good.

He was back to being, you know, who he is. But they didn't work with us, you know, last year, which I'm pissed off of myself about, is that he needs a ball in his hands, and so does James, and then so does Cole. You know what I'm saying? Right. So it's hard. It was hard, you know, and it was hard. Because he can't play off the ball. Exactly, yeah.

And you shouldn't want him to. No. Because the way he plays, the way he passes, his pace, the way he plays the game, and how he can make people better, you don't want him off the ball. Right. You know, and so it was just a tough dynamic, and I take full responsibility. I didn't figure it out the way I. needed to, so he really didn't have a fair shake. So I'm still pissed about that.

What's it like, Russ, no matter what you think about him, he has the most career triple doubles, he's the average triple double. I think, what, three seasons, he ain't going to cheat you. You know exactly what you're going to get Russell Westbrook. A, you're going to get an outstanding play, you're going to get a turnover, you're going to get an airball, you're going to get a big three, but he's going to give you everything he has, and you can appreciate that. Every single night, every single practice, every single day.

And the thing that, which, you know, I equate him with LeBron, like when you have great players like that, always on time, early to the bus, early to the meetings, never late. Like, you know, that means a lot. Yes. You know, that's just so just respect for your teammates with the staff and for, you know, who you're working with. And every day he's going to bring it, no matter what. practice, like I say, games, shoot around. You know what you're going to get every single day, and you can respect that. Right.

So that's why so many people love Russ, because you know every single day, you're going to get this, and you can't ask for anything more. What's it like being a coach for Steve Palmer? You see him there. I've never seen an owner that has more emotion watching the game. I mean, he is a true fan because he goes through the gamut of emotions just like. I'm like, bro, you do realize you got like $100 billion. And you're supposed to be just sitting there and just like, store it.

Right. And he, hey, every shot turnover, I mean, you can tell. I'm like, man. He's fully invested. One thousand. You know, people just see the games and, like, how to game and, you know, his actions and reactions or whatever. But what I've learned from him is, Shannon, is that no matter how. much money you have or how rich you are, you know, you could be a good person.

Yes. And that's what he is. Like, to treat people the way he treats him, like is, like, if you got a guy who's worth $150 billion and to treat everybody like, I mean, everything's so personal, but everything is, like, genuine, you know, he's not faking, he's not, he doesn't have to. Right. He doesn't need anybody, right? But just see how he treats people, like, it just goes to show, like, and that's why I try

to be good at everybody. Right. He doesn't know that you come across because, you know, you never know. And I just seeing how Steve Bomber did for me in Mexico, what he's done for this organization, what he's done for the city of L.A., what he's done for the city of Seattle. Like, he's just a genuine person.

It's a great person. And, you know, you don't see, you don't see to me better human beings than he is. Hold on. He went back to you to Mexico, Missouri, with you on a private jet, and stayed to the best Western? Best Western.

And said it was some of the best sleep he's had in a long time. So I'll say, you know what? If he can come and stay anybody, I don't want to hear nothing from nobody. Anybody can come and stay in Mexico and Mr. Obama can come and stay in Mexico. Like, only where five other people can say they can't. Outside of that, everybody else should come.

Yeah. Who's your favorite player to watch in the NBA? Right now today. I'm Jake Hofer, and this is Back 40, a limited series show on Wire to Hunt, part of Meat Eat Eater's podcast network. Each episode, I'll be asking eight wide-tail hunting pros, a focused, thought-provoking question about hunting and land management.

How do I hunt the best part of the farm? with less than ideal access. Should you, that's what the real question is. Stand without good access is not a good stand. Listen to Back 40 on IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. I'm Dan. He's Ty. Hello.

And we're the solid verbal college football podcast. College football season is here. And you know what that means. Your team is going to break your heart three times. Probably before Halloween. Uh-huh. But fear not. The solid verbal will be right there with you

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My worth is not wrapped up in how many things I've won because of the world. what I came to realize is I valued winning so much that once it was over, I got the blues and I was like, this is it. For me, it's the pursuit of greatness. It's the journey. It's the people. It's the failures. It's the heartache. Listen to the bright side on the IHeart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The U.S. Open is here. And on my podcast, Good Game with Sarah Spain, I'm breaking down the players from rising stars to legends chasing history, the predictions will we see a first-time winner, and the pressure.

Billy Jean King says pressure is a privilege, you know. Plus, the stories and events off the court, and of course the honey deuses, the signature cocktail of the U.S. Open. The U.S. Open has gotten to be a very fancy, wonderfully experiential sporting event. I mean, listen, the whole aim is to be accessible and inclusive for all tennis fans, whether you play tennis or not. Tennis is full of compelling stories of late. Have you heard about Icon Venus Williams' recent wild card bids?

Or the young Canadian, Victoria Mboko, making a name for herself. How about Naomi Osaka getting back to form? To hear this and more, listen to Good Game with Sarah Spain, an Iheart women's sports production in partnership with deep blue sports and entertainment on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of IHeart Women's Sports. I have a few. I love Ant Man

I love Tatum Just from guys that are not on my team I said Love Steph You know, still what he brings Um Who am I missing? Oh, Kyrie, yeah

Kyrie, yeah, Carrie. Yeah, Carrie, yeah, yeah, yeah, Carrie. I mean, it's just something in great players It's just hard to, like, remember, but like, yeah, Kyrie, love to see him dance Yeah, I love Ant Man The stuff talking And I love, you know

Watching, you know, Tatum play But Tatum is a cousin of yours, correct? Y'all play, real cousin or play-play cousin? Real cousins Okay, because, you know, sometimes, you know how we are. Too grown to play, too young to play. Yeah, man, but you know, but you know how we are. Hey, we're a kid called somebody

and we'd be closer to Ken to a German Shepherd than the actual person. Yeah, for sure. Yeah. What? You've got to help me understand. Where all this hate for J.T. Come from?

What hate? Man, they'll be killing J.T. Man, he ain't do this. And I want to ask you because you were there. How that man, a three-time all-NBA selection they can't get but two minutes a game in the Olympics? Two minutes a game? Yeah, okay, my bad five.

No, he played more than that. T. Lou, you got to figure out. You told me we've been sitting here for over an hour and a half, and you say you could figure out how to get guys made it, to get guy shot. You mean to tell me, you couldn't figure out how to get that man more than getting that man on the coat more than that? Yeah, I mean, I take responsibility because I'm part of the coaching staff.

Right. So whatever we decided to make as a, as a staff, I'm never going to go against that. I'm not going to go whisper and say, oh, we should like, no, like once a decision is made, that's what, that's, you know. Everybody got to buy into it. That's what it is. And as much as it hurt me, like, you know, I thought. Now you're like, he's like, damn, cool.

Yeah, no, no, no. Like I'm saying, like, you know what I'm saying, I wanted to play. I thought he should be out there, but like, you know, once you make a decision, I'm not going to go, oh, man, this is the, no, I mean, that's the decision that was made. The decision we made is coach and stuff. Yeah, and I'm not going to never throw a coach on the bus or a player or nobody else, you know what I'm saying? So, of course it's my cousin. So, you know, of course you want to see him do well, right?

Yeah, hell yeah. Upbringing, Mexico, Missouri. Hell, I, what was it like? What kind of town is Mexico, Missouri? What do y'all grow? What do y'all grow? Is it livestock? have, you know, you have corn, bricks.

Bricks. We was known for bricks. Okay. AP, Greens, and Nationals. We were known for having the number one, was it fire brick? Yeah, fire brick, I think, in the United States. And so that's where all the money was generated from it. And then when they closed those plans down, that's when, you know, Mexico kind of went, you know, went down. But to me, it was like a small city.

Right. You know, because it's a town of 11,000 people. Well, back then it was. 13-5, but now it's like 11,000. But it was a small city because you had people that did everything. So if you want to gamble, yeah, all the guys

taught you how to lock the dice or three-car a mile taught you how to, you know, whatever. You know, if you wanted to, you know, you don't get to drugs. You had people who were, you know, went to college and had you got a degree. So you had everything you needed around and there's a small community. So you get that every single

day, you know, and so you learn about it, you know, every single day, you're supposed to do, what you're not supposed to do, what to get into, what not to get into, and what it teaches you is like, when I got to the league, you know, you get around all these guys that grew up in the city, and you look, and they don't understand and see what's going when, like, guys are cheating or when guys are locking the dice or they don't know what's going on, and you're looking like, they're from the city, but they don't see what's going on.

Right. You know, it kind of, so like me, I'm like, in Mexico, you learn everything at an early age. Right. You know, 10, 11, 12, you know about gambling. you know about, you know, if you're going to be in, you know, the drugs scene, if you're going to go out and party, if you're going to be, whatever you're going to be, you can learn about it right now. And so I thought it really did a good job with just teaching me everything at a young age. So when I got older, I wasn't numb to none of the bullshit. You know what I've seen it.

I've seen it from every angle. And so that really helped me to grow. And like I said, just having the confidence that they have back home. Like from a, you know, a cry kid to a, whatever confidence. You know, I mean, walk around, you know, just as common. confidence as anybody else. And that's what I love about being in Mexico because everybody's together and everybody's won.

It don't matter, you know, what you've done. If you dropped out of high school, if you dropped out of junior high, whatever, like, we all people, we all together. And that's why, you know, I love it so much. You don't drink or smoke. Never tried it. Because your father had a substance. Is that why?

It's an abuse problem. Is that why? Yeah. I could say that, you know, my dad, you know, like, he smoked crack, you know, growing up. And I give him credit. You know, once he went to prison and got out, he's been clean for 23 years. Wow.

Yeah, never had a drink, never had, you know, any drug. And we form a really great relationship. And so shout out to Ronald Kim for getting himself together. But, you know, that takes a lot. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. You know, being on drugs the way he was and to be clean and for us or having a relationship. Because every day, you know what an addict, a recovering addict is every day. Every day.

You got to drive by a liquor. store. You got to drive by the package shop. You got to somebody smoking. Right. You got to do this every single day for the rest of your life. And I'm a sugar addict. And I understand. And I understand. Well, Shirley Temple was coming out on the table. You know what I see

it. Like I said, my grandpa, he drank a lot. And so I love my grandpa Tyrone. So just seeing those things and how it, you know, when my grandpa drank, when you come home at night, how he would act, you know, and how my dad was and just, you know, seeing those dynamics, you know, maybe we want to

stay away. And then also, like, it was like a badge of honor, like, all my friends or, you know, they're drinking it. I don't want to do that. Like, I want to be different, you know, and so it's 48 years now, so they don't need to do it now. Hey, yeah, you're too late. Yeah. You said you live with your uncle. And you spoke about your uncle little briefly earlier. Two different.

Yeah, my uncle Jay, so I idolized basketball. Okay. And that's not the one you live with? No. Okay. Yeah. And I went to live with my uncle Kevin. Okay. Is that your mom's brother or your dad's brother? Okay. Yeah. And so, my mom's brother. And so, my My sophomore year in high school, I got some trouble back home in Mexico. And the family came to an agreement that, you know, I needed to get out of there, like, you know,

and have a father figure, being in a bigger city and have a chance to, because, like, teams weren't coming. College coaches wasn't coming to Mexico to recruit, you know, and so to try to display my, took my talents to South Beach, you know what I'm saying? And went to Kansas City. And my uncle, like I say, he took me in, you know, and as a sophomore, you know, that's tough. You know, he took me in. And, you know, I hit the ground running. You know, it was hard because in Mexico, you used to being out on the streets to one, two in the morning.

You know, you're being policed and by all the different, you know, my mom's, you know, friend. It was a community that raised you. Yeah. Yeah. And you know, such a boy. Right. You know, you know better. Right.

And so you get to Kansas City. It's a big city, you know, and so it was the dynamics were different. you know, having to be, you know, in a certain time and, you know, being, you know, being more safe. Right. You know, it was, it was an adjustment for me, but I needed it, you know, and so, you know, Kevin took me in and did my three years there, and then I was able to go to Nebraska from there and then kind of, you know, so I got my life on track because I was going the wrong direction, so it was very much needed. You had some health issues.

There was some chest pains this past season. Damn, I'm coaching stressful, huh? This season? With the last season? No. It was in Cleveland. Cleveland. Yeah, in Cleveland.

Well, this year I had, no, I messed my back up. Yeah, my shoulder in my back. What did you do? I'm trying to get big like you, man. You know what I'm saying? You're trying to throw that weight around and all that. Just, you know what I'm saying. I know better, man.

I'm days are over, man. Yeah, man. And so I had, you know, I messed my back up. With Syedica? No, it was like, it was like. Oh, you're up high? Yeah. And so, but Cleveland is when I had the chest pain.

and didn't understand what was going on. Like, you know, I felt like a heart attack, you know, or whatever a heart attack you think, feel like. And I was scared to sleep at night because, like, these sharp pains were, like, just, like, shoot in my chest. Right. I was scared to go to sleep because I didn't know what was going,

so I wasn't sleeping, and we did all the tests. And so I went to Cleveland Clinic. Yeah. And I did all, like, the EKGs, the echo test, and the treadmill, all that stuff. And so the doctor said, listen, you might die, but it won't be from your, heart. Your heart is

perfectly fine. So I'm like, damn, like, what's... So I was like, okay, I feel better about that, you know, whatever. So he still kept trying to find what was going on. And a guy with a doctor, and he said, oh, man, you're experiencing anxiety and depression, you know, and so I'm like, depression. I ain't... I'm from Mexico. I ain't depressed. Like,

like, yeah, I ain't depressed. Like, whatever. He's like, no, like, that's what you're experiencing. And so he was like, I want you to do this. So they had some medication for me to take for a couple weeks. And I took some time off, which I give Cleveland. Give you an opportunity to do that. Yeah, yeah, they were really, like, serious about it.

And I gave Kobe Auburn a lot of credit for just saying, listen, take the time you need, don't on this. So it took a couple of weeks off, changed my diet, you know, took some medication, started doing yoga and all that stuff. And I made help. And then I got the medication, like, right after the playoffs. And so the guy, the doctor said, my happy place is gambling, like being in Vegas. Yeah, being in Vegas and the playoffs. Really? That was my happy place.

And so he's like, any time you get a chance. So, like, what was crazy is like our general manager, like, David Griffin, he'd come to the house two times a week. We have a poker game. You know, so, like, they did everything they could to, you know, keep me engaged. But once I found that out, but, like, it hasn't been a problem ever since. But, like, that was some stressful times. How many hours of the night where you're sleeping? Probably three.

Tops. Damn. Hell, I might be stressed in anxiety. But I mean, since I retired, I retired. I mean, I used to sleep fairly good when I was a player. But once I got to a certain age, I don't... Yeah, I mean, because when you get older, you don't sleep. No, no, I don't sleep, but when you have in chest pains?

I wonder why, you know, because them old people would be up. Yeah. They go to bed at 7 o'clock, but they're up at 3. Yeah. So, but when you go to bed and you having chest pains, and sometimes you're spitting up blood, like, and you don't know what's going on. Right. You know, so, like, you know, because, like, coach, it's tough.

Like, when you want to be the best, when you want to win, and get the best player in the world. You wouldn't eat too many oxtails and hog mall and stuff like that. No, no. Probably a lot of sugar. A lot of sugar.

So you got a sweet too. Sweets, yeah. Because we see Coach Popovich had to retire. I mean, obviously coaching is very stressful. Yes. Because you coach a team

and the expectations are very, very high. You understand that. You understand when you get into this profession what is expected of you. Right. So it ain't no pretense.

Well, you know, I want this team, it ain't that no more. Right. Hey, it's now, and the players that you have, you got a guy that was the top 75 players. As a matter of fact, you got two them on your team. So the expectations are, is to win. Yes. You feel that. I like that.

Yeah, I like that. Because if you're in position to win a championship, that's all you... That's all you can ask for. Yeah, that's all you can ask for. And so, if it was a situation where you're not playing for a championship, you're not competing for a championship... What are we doing this for? Yeah. What are we doing this for? I like those expectations. Give me your all-time starting five teammates

Your former teammates Guys that you played with For a talent or who I love Give me your starting five Who you're going to start with You got you got a starting five But you know I'm saying who I like the most Or who's the best players

You had to put together a starting five With the five teammates Who would be Why Shack Shack is one Kobe Kobe

Kobe Jordan Jordan Oh, damn, yow me. Yeah, we got yow. Dirk. Dirk. Jake, yeah.

I'm sorry about leaving by here. So, I mean, you're going by position, right? So it's Shaq, Dirk, Kobe, Jordan. You can put T-Mack in there. You can put J-K-N-A-in in there. Yeah, go big. Yeah. T-Mack.

Cole, Jordan, Dirk, Shack. Damn, so. That's a nice little squad, that guy. Y'all might win some champions here. Has ringed culture become a problem? We've got to touch on this a little bit earlier because now if you ain't got a, now if you ain't got a ring, you... I think it has. I think it's become a problem because now you have guys thinking that winning is more important than loyalty and doing it the right way.

And it's not their fault, but it's like you said, it's what is projecting to the world now. Right. I think it's hard to see franchises drive, great players, young players, and you're willing to grow with, but they leave to try to pursue a championship because they think that's what's going to get them to this point, to the pinnacle. And so I just think, yeah, it's definitely, you know, clouded our game, you know, just as far as saying, oh, you got to win, you got to win championship. like he's got to be a great player and a great person like everything is going to take care of myself you know and so I know

Steve ain't no guarantee even if you go someplace you're going to win a championship yeah exactly you know and so I think win is important like you play to win correct that's the number one goal like that's the ultimate goal you know but I think there's the right way to do it though like you can't

sell yourself you know because you want to win a championship like I just you know it's just so to me being the best player you can be doing it the right way grinds, get to that point I think it's important

and it's more of a feeling when you do it that way. Is the era of the super teams over? Yes. I think so because of the way the cap is structure now the first April and second day. They're going to punish you.

Yeah, it's going to be hard. If you want to spend a billion dollars a year to try to win the championship at the NBA say be by gas. And then also, like if you're going to do it, it's going to be with older talent. Like, guys is 35, 36, and it's going to take less money to try to win. But I think the super teams, and especially the way the game is played now.

Right. With all the cutting, slashing, picking up full court, like, Stars ain't doing. So you need three or four guys around and do the dirty work. Right. So it's going to be a little different. So it might be one here or there, but for the most part, I think that's over. Expectations for the Clippers this season? To win at a high level.

to me, I want to get to the conference finals or better, and we have a talented team to do it. Like, our biggest thing over the years has been health, you know, which has held us back and still think about and dream about my first year, like a Kauai don't get hurt that year.

Or the Utah series? Yeah, he gets hurt. We beat the number one C, Utah, and then we play in the conference finals against Phoenix, go to game six. You know, PG had a hell of a series, and, you know, came up short, you know, so every year's been something, you know, Kauas missed every playoff series, PG's been out for playoff series, and so it's just been tough.

So for me, I think with our coaching staff, you know, the team that we have assembled with, you know, Jeff Van Gundy, like I said, Brian Shaw has done a great job, Jay Laranaga, you know, Larry Drew, Jeremy Castleberry, Dante. So we got a great group of guys that have played the game and some or that understands the game been head coaches before. And so I think with that dynamic, with our players, I think we've got a chance to be pretty good. So I'm excited about it.

Gliber's head coach Tyrone Loo, ladies and gentlemen. Thank you very much. Appreciate you, bro. Yes, sir, I appreciate you. On my life, they're grinding all my life, sacrifice, hustle paid the price, want a slice, got the roll of dice, that's why all my life. I be grinding on my life. Yeah, all my life.

They're grinding all my life. Sacrifice. Hustle paid the price. Want a slice. Got the roll a dice. That's why all my life I've been grinding all my life Thank you. Thank you.

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. I'm Dan. He's Thai. And we're the solid verbal college football podcast. Tune in for previews, Recaps, bits you won't hear.

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