Club Shay Shay - Deebo & Joe - Part 1: Aaron Rodgers latest, Bengals trade for Dexter Lawrence + Ike Taylor joins

Episode Date: April 20, 2026

NFL Legends James "Deebo" Harrison and Joe Haden react to the New York Giants trading Dexter Lawrence to the Cincinnati Bengals and the latest on Pittsburgh Steelers QB Aaron Rodgers. Later they are joined by Super Bowl Champion and Pittsburgh Steelers legend Ike Taylor to break down his career, favorite Steelers stories, the latest NFL news and rumors, and much more! Download the PrizePicks app today and use code DEEBOJOE to get $50 in lineups after you play your first $5 lineup! https://prizepicks.onelink.me/LME0/DEEBOJOE Timeline:00:00 - Dexter Lawrence traded to Bengals21:53 - Steelers don't expect Aaron Rodgers decision before draft33:21 - Ike Taylor joins34:50 - Ike Taylor on college journey39:54 - Ike Taylor's role in Steelers organization43:27 - Ike Taylor's mentors45:40 - Dick LeBeau's expectations (Timestamps may vary based on advertisements.) #Club #NightcapSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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I'm your host James Debo Harrison. I'm here with my co-host Joe Hayden. Please make sure you like, subscribe, and download where you get your show. How you doing today, Joe? I'm doing good, brother, Debo. I got my baby Poochitey on, you know what I'm saying, aka my Ike Taylor mask, you know, so I'm feeling real spooky, feeling real defensive backish.

Okay. I just had to, had to represent. When I seen Ike was coming, you know what I'm saying? I felt some type of way. Got me kind of a high. Okay. Okay. I might have to go get me something, too.

I might go give me something too. Look here, man. Hey, hey, chat, we did not have to show Friday. We are extremely sorry that it couldn't happen, but that was actually my fault. See, I ended up forgetting I had to do something with my son on Friday. And long story short, ended up having to counsel it sort of last minute. But I'm sure your blood pressure can kick back to normal by now.

Please, you know, you had covered it. You know, coveted it. Faithful. Stressing. I see you. C.T., what's that over there? He said, no show Friday, we better turn up the day. Don't worry.

Got to. Got to. Don't worry. We got. We got, we got, we got, I. Taylor. Come on. You know?

And you know what the problem is on that one, brother? What's up? The word better. You know I don't like being told what to do. Mm-hmm. You know I don't like that. No, no, no, for sure. You like the, you know, this the D-bo and Joe.

Show. We float on a own boat. Get your ass out to chat. We go out on the court. We better do. Only thing I better do is stay black and die. That's it. Yep.

That's all I got to do. I ain't even got to pay taxes if I'm willing to go to jail, but I ain't willing to do that. I ain't going to lie to you. I'm just talking, all right? I'm paying taxes, Debo. I'm paying taxes. I'm selling with tickets on that.

I'm paying everything I got to pay and some extra just in case. You know what I'm saying? Mm-hmm. Look here, brother, let's get on to what we got going on. But, but, yes. Yo, what they doing over there in Cincinnati, though? Yeah, man. What they're doing over there in Cincinnati?

Yeah, they're trying to get a little action. They don't trade it a whole 10th pick. Uh-huh. The Dexter Lawrence. Yes. Yo, this whole transaction, who you got winning? Or do you think it's mutual to benefit? Like, so when I, when I first heard the trade.

Yes, please tell me. I think, so Cincinnati, when they made this trade, if you're going to make a trade for a first round pick, obviously, they, Dexter Lawrence is a great player. I think he's a great player. I think last year, him not doing as much, him having a down year, him not having the many sacks, his consistency. Many sacks, bro, half a sack.

Half a sack, but a hundred and two. The Giants has got a first round pick from the bangles. The top, top. 10 pick, bro, for a half a sack last year. I hear you. But this, who you, if I'm them, I'm not going defensive tackle at that. If they're going to go get somebody like a, like a, protect Joe Burrow. That's what I'm saying.

I'm loving the fact that end of the day, if you're Cincinnati and you're knowing that you got to, you got to start winning. You're scoring points, obviously on the offensive side. Joe Burr, you got to keep him on his feet. But you're trying to get. defensive players. They went and got the defensive end when they lost Hendrickson. They went and got Jonathan Allen. They went and got the safety cook. So they're getting, they know that they're making some moves. They're making some moves. They're trying to make moves to make their defense better

because we keep saying, your defense's ass. Your defense is ass. So what's going to make Joe Burrow feel a little bit better is if they're getting three and outs, if he's getting the ball and they're not continued to get scored on. So I see where they're going from where, all right, 10th pick overall, this draft maybe not be the best. Like, is who they're going to get at 10 better than this starting veteran that we're going to pay one year 28 million? The Giants were still like 31.30 in the rush game, bro. That was the Bengals problem.

And now you getting him for half a sack last year. He just had a down season. He had a down his, but he has, in the last four years, he leads and rushes in total pass 133 pressures. Only person I got more than him is Chris Jones. So his being able to clog it up. He's a detackle. A lot of his stats, Debo, aren't on the numbers.

Do you know that if you're a good detain? How much? I understand that, but how much clogging you're doing with my run game ranked 30-31? Man, everybody got some dirt. Everybody got, everybody got a thing to do. And he's doing his 11th. I'm not saying that he's not doing this job. I would say at the same time that Cincinnati, I don't think this was a great move.

because still, obviously you want to get your defense right, but me, I'm thinking you want to keep Joe Burrow upright. So I'm thinking that we just need to get, I know they got picks. Now they had a second round pick, the 41st pick, but my move, if I were them, they did a good job getting defensive players, trying to get defense right. But keep Joe Burrow upright is more of a move the Alderman trying to do than get the defensive tackle.

Yeah, I'm, I ain't a lie. I don't, I really don't fully understand. whole contract because it says they obviously got him and then they gave him a one year extension $28 million one year extension. So that means it's added on to the contract he already has. So like what of that is guaranteed? Do you know like what are that is guaranteed? How that goes with that process?

I do not know. Here's my here's here's here's my issue with it. So when I, I guess look at it like on on papers. I don't think it was a good move for the Bengals. You got Lawrence, like you said, he had a down year. If you go back, he's coming off an elbow surgery in 2024 that caused him to miss the last four or five games of the season. Then he had a subpart year this year off of that elbow surgery,

which was a half a set, okay? And now he's going to be 29 in, what, November? Okay. So right now, I'm looking at. looking at it, like, yo, the Giants got to feel good. They got to feel like they got the, they got the best end of this deal. Because when it comes down to it, he had requested a trade. He asked for a trade, so everybody knew he didn't want to be there.

And the Giants were still able to get a top 10 pick for him. No, I thought the giant, I was just speaking on the Bengals side. You're correct. Who won the trade? I could say the Giants probably won the trade for sure, because they get a, top 10 pick now and they already have now they have two they have a what they got five and ten

five and ten bro five and ten bro I just really think the bangos man they was just like like like we got to get a player at this position like and I'll give you I'll get like yes can he make an impact if he can get back to the form that he was at yeah he could definitely

make an impact but I mean what's the chances him actually getting back there from this point? I think it's a really good pick for the Bengals because one thing,

I think he's a good player when we say it was a down year he's now on a prove it year. Like this is the point of your career he's going in the year seven, year eight where he knows he's a baller you got to go out and produce because the last two years like you said

have been down. Now he's playing on that prove it year deal. He's coming in hungry. I think he's a good player. I think he's a good player. I think he's a vet. He knows what it is.

He knows that he got to go get it because, like you said, getting a little older. Is it injuries? Are you really still that good? So it's the time where now action is going to speak loud and words. We need to see numbers. We need to see production. So with Bengals taking him in, we got the 10th pick. We're trying to be nice now.

We got Joe Burrow. We knows he's trying to win now. So we got to do whatever we can. Whoever that 10th pick is in the draft coming out, he may. Hey, whoever that tough pick is. that the Giants get, the Bengals fans will be watching. To see who that is. He will be always in.

God forbid it be a cold offensive lineman that could have been over there with Joe Burrow. Protecting him. I'm not mad at the Bengals, though, trying to. Hey, I'm with you. Hey, they had to do something to show Joe. We're trying to win. Joe Burrow, to show Joe Burrow that they was trying to do something to help you. But Joe.

Joe Burrow. if they really wanted to help you, they would have got you an offensive lineman to protect you. Because if you can't be protected, how you go last the season, how you go be happy, how you're going to love the game again, Joe? You want to love the game, Joe.

You got to stay on your feet. Come on over here, Joe. You got to stay protected. Joe, if you want to love the game again, Joe. We're going to protect you this season. is it's a big year for the Bengals and they know that and I think that's why they're trying to do everything they can because if it gets ugly like it's Joe Burrow he's already told him I'm trying to win I'm trying to play but if y'all aren't this is my thing deepa like you said though if you want to

make something shake you could have brought in that tackle instead of sexy dxy and then I would have thought like okay now for show we work and we already signed these other we already got Jonathan out you got you got you signed the other cat you know what I'm saying you we ain't have to give up a 10 for it. Like, if you don't give a 10, hey, what about, um, over there in, and, uh, San Francisco, what's his name? Is he, is he up or is he out? Trent. Trent. Could have went and got Trent. That's saying that we're trying to win. And we're, and I'm trying to protect you. Yeah, that would have been about, I don't, I don't even know why I just said we, bro. I said we, because I'm thinking about Joe. I'm thinking about Joe Burrow. You, I'm thinking

about Joe Burrow also. That's why, that's why I say we. That's why I said we. You know what I'm saying? I had a year there. I had a year of there, true statement. But I said we because I'm looking at you, Joe, Burrow. Yes. We're happening. It's happening in a real time.

We care about you. I care about you so much. I care about you even when you're in another color. I want to see you happy. And healthy. And healthy. And healthy. And upright.

Standing on your own tent toes. 10D. On all of them. Yep. Uniform's so clean you could put it back on for the next game and not even have to wash. shit. That's what I'm talking about.

Look here. I ain't mad at the deal. I ain't happy with it ain't my team. I don't care. I don't care. Okay. But, you know, next to, that's Lawrence. You right here, you can make this a good deal and you can

make it a beneficial deal for both ends. All you got to do is go out there and get back to the form that they're expecting you to get to that you were at. And it's a win-win. for both, the bangles got what they wanted. The Giants got what they wanted. And I think the only thing that happens then is if he get back to that form,

he might say he needs some more money. He might say he need a restruction. But look, but look. He might say I need some more guaranteed money. A thousand percent. And that's where the Bengals might start bangling. So that's what we could hope with. They might not be able to keep them, who you're going to pay.

Then we're going to see what's up. So if they're not winning and he still balls out, then Joe Burrow, he might be able to. We're going to see. That's crazy. We're going to see. The bangles bangling. Damn, Joe, you start.

I think I think I might be starting to rub off, you know, the bangles, bangling. See, look. Yeah. Yeah. Sometimes, look, but. That's from a brown. That's the browning. Because sometimes we get the browning.

I'm going to be honest. When the Browns do browns and things, so I'm like, damn, when the browns shit, then we'll be browning. Yeah, sometimes we do the browning. do the brown. I'm like, stop browning. You know what I'm saying? So I'm going to be honest. I would really like to see like what his contract looks like. Is it like is that 28? Like what part is guaranteed? When does the guarantee stop? I think it's really what he was really trying to shoot for is get some more. I think he really just put into this season. That's it. So I don't think he had no more

guarantee left. I think he probably signed a one year, 28, probably a lot of that 20 of the guarantees. So he probably just got a one for 20 with. Yeah, but that don't make. making free until he was at 27, 28. I'm making free until 29. I got to go look at the deal. So it added another year onto his deal that he originally had was 23 to 27. Now he just signed. He signed into 28.

Okay. So that puts him to 28. So he's not free till 29. He'd be what, 31, 32? No, bro. So you keep putting years when he'd be 31? He'd be 29 this year. year?

29, two more years. 30, 31. He'll be 32. Going into that season. Yeah, you're okay. You'll be turning to 32. You're right. Okay, you're right.

Don't be putting. But, my man, that's a lot of years. I'm just saying, bro, you know how they start tripping when you get to that 29, that, before you get to that 29, that 30 number. I was blessed and lucky to make it to 38, 39 before I retire. I know. And that's what I'm saying, D. but you're saying what the GMs are saying,

but we're looking at the same way. He's 28, 29. I don't know he felt like he got a good, four more or five, but these years, when you start getting older, you can't have the half sack. You still got it consistently.

Now you got your year of, okay, you had a down year. But when you're getting paid and when you that dude, they got to see the numbers when you're making that type of bag and you're up in the years and you're up in age.

You know what I'm saying? It's not like, okay. I think the big thing is he wanted to restructure his deal. if he didn't want to restructure his deal, of course, he would still be there. But you want to restructure your deal, you just came off of a down year. A half-sac year, down year, a major down year. And on top of that, before that, I think he was trying to do something in 24 before he ended up getting hurt when he had just signed the deal in 23, I believe.

So I think he was a year, year one or two into the deal and was trying to redo it, you know, and they still had what, two or two or three years left or something like that on the original deal. but you can't do that after you you know you you're not a half sack you done ended the previous year with surgery and you missed the last what four or five games of the year yeah it uh the math don't be mapping sometimes

yeah it don't it don't you don't add up if it's but you come on you're coming off 10 you know what I'm saying iron's hot you can go you can go right at them yeah even you know shit on the interior hell even eight eight something over five you know what I'm yeah Hey, you got to get something over that.

He's going off his pressures, though. Second and precious in the last four. Okay. He's going off his pressure. So behind Chris Jones and pressures, 123, that's legit. But I'm talking about the last two years. We got to look at the last two years.

We can't, we ain't going to look at last year. We don't look at last year. Okay. 25. It was down. What was 24? Still had to be down somewhat because you got hurt. Had surgery.

You missed the last four or five games in the season. Yeah. They started new in the injury, but. So you young and get hurt, it's cool. You six years in, you get hurt. Why you get hurt? How you're coming back? What those numbers look like when you come back?

How much are we paying you? Oh, now you ask for some more? Hmm. I don't know. You just kind of, yeah. It's a little different when you start, when you start looking at it like that, but that 30, that ain't lying.

That 30 is the 70 in the league. So you get that 29? Hey. 30 yet? Well, you 30? You're 30. I'm going to tell you right now. You want for them.

65? Regular retirement, what, 65, 62 or something like 67? 65. Okay. So now in the league, that 29, it's like 63. Yes. It's like, oh, 63. You're 63.

You ain't got nothing about two years left. Soon you get 30. They're counting your days in the league. Hey, they start looking at you like, um, soon you get beat. Oh, that boy. lost two steps. Oh, he did. On his birthday.

Was he really trying for that? That boy got slower on his birthday, on his 30th birthday, but woke up. Hey, Joe. Hamstrings. For real. For real. Joe, I'm to tell you real talk. Brough.

Yep. I hit 30. It was like a little window. It was like, oh, snap. I was like, yeah, my kind of, my wind kind of. My wind going down. I ain't tripping, you know what I'm saying? The muscle's still going up.

I ain't tripping. Bro. 35. 35, I was like, whoa, where in the hell did this come from? Mm-hmm. Off season was what then determined if I was going to come back. Can I make it through the off-season to build my body to get ready for the season? Because in-season, that wasn't nothing.

And season's cool. In season, you're maintained, you're just chilling, you're cruising, keeping your body right. You're just maintaining. It's maintaining. Maintenance. Maintenance. Keep the maintenance up. Make sure you put your strength up.

So instead of doing, you know, so many reps, you do lower reps, heavy weight, heavier weight. That way you keep your strength up. You're not wearing your body down. You keep you like, they don't understand that process. But dude, that build up to be able to do it. I would come in the camp at like 275, 280, like rocked up muscles, just muscle. Yeah. And then I start the process of wearing all that down, and I get to about two, six, between 260 and 267 would be my, you know, my season weight.

Yeah. But, dude, I'd come in, I'd come in heavy as I can with all the muscle I could because I would do as little running as I can. Yeah. And try and hold on to the strength so that when I got to later in the season, you know, a lot of these cats don't like the touching weight room when I, when the football start. You know what I mean? No, for sure. For sure. No, no, for sure.

They're walking through there. Yeah, they try minimal. Minimal, minimal, as minimal as possible in the weight room. Oh, man, I don't want to lose my legs, all this other stuff. Nope. Sunday soon as the game over with, I'm going to do legs right now. Straight to it. Straight to it. Look here, brother.

Over here, distillers. Cam Hayward, that's Will Howard. Okay. You know why? Listen to the audio. We got the audio about. Okay, what he's saying? Readiness, future.

I know he's a champion quarterback at the collegiate level and brings that sort of dog to the hunt here. So what can you tell me? What about him and the future here in Pittsburgh for him? So the one thing I've loved is Aaron's been a big fan of Will's and watched him from afar and watched them grow this year. And, you know, Will is always going to compete. Will has always had, you know, the chips stacked against them.

And now, you know, he's going into a year where there's a little uncertainty. Obviously, everybody wants Aaron Beck, but if you do go in a direction where you have Will, you feel pretty confident. And I think when you look at the 21st pick, why not insulate? Why not have some other guys that build out your roster? That way you can look at and say, whoever takes over this job is going to have weapons, is going to have more pieces around him. Brother. Yes, Debo. Hey, listen, bro, I like that.

But the ladies' update right now, Steelers don't expect Aaron Rogers' decision before the draft. With no Rogers in the building, the 2025, six-round pick. Will Howard is set to serve as the team's number one quarterback during minicamp. Joe. What do you think of this, Joe? Do you like this? Do you love this?

Joe, tell me what you think, Joe. Because I know what I think, Joe. This is, all right now, Debo, we're talking as Steelers fans. We're talking as Blood-Bought Steelers, right? Okay. And I'm talking, for the Steelers, organizational-wise, I feel like you're the Pittsburgh Steelers, right? When the New York Jets said, like, we, I feel like we're sitting on what Aaron Rogers wants us to do. Aaron Rogers is going to do whatever Aaron Rogers wants to do.

So what I'm saying is with Cam, with Will Howard, moving forward, we need to make a decision on getting the best players and making the best team. If quarterback is not the decision, if Ty Simpson and none of these dudes that we're worried about, what we need to do is build the best team that we could possibly have. because with Will Howard, we're going to make it easy on him and not depend on him to be Aaron Rogers or one of the greatest quarterbacks in the league. We're going to have a great defense. We're going to have a great special teams. We're going to have a great running game.

We're going to have a great team overall. So we're going to be able to win games regardless. He's not going to be in a spot where he has to lose it for us. And we drafted him two years ago. So we're not looking crazy. Mike McCarthy, he does actually believe in him. He says, Will Howard, okay, I like him.

We'll give him a chance. He's a big guy. He got to go prove what he can do. Cam Hayward, a legitimate player on the team is saying, not just because he's a stealer and this is what you got to say, but Wilhow was in the locker room. He's seen him. A Rod did say that he supported Will Howard.

He liked the way to he, you know what I'm saying, study taking me like the way he moved. So for me, I'm more Pittsburgh. Do whatever you need to do. The way, even the Jets, they told Arod, look, we're not waiting on you. We're going to go in another way. We're going to different decision.

A-Rod's not going to tell you when Dan Rooney was like, oh, yeah, I think we're going to, I'm expecting a decision before the draft. Please don't expect anything, Mr. Rooney from A-Rod, because A-Rod floats at his own boat. And respectfully, he can because he is one of the greatest quarterbacks. But now moving forward as an organization, we don't have to sit there and wait on A-Rod. We're the Pittsburgh Steelers. We're going to do whatever we want to do because we are the Pittsburgh Steelers. We want to get the best players. we're going to build the best team and we're going to do what we want to do because that's the way we move.

So Arod, if he does want to come later on, if something happens, it's the Steelers to say yes or no. Like, we're not sitting here waiting to see what he wants to do. No disrespect. But we got a whole team that we want to build. And if you're not going to be on the ship, then we got to go. Like the Jets did it. The Packers was like they had Jordan Love in the waiting. So they're like, no, Ira, we already have an exit plan.

So it's cool. you can slide. I think the Steelers in their organization need to just build the best team we possibly can. Don't sit here and think we're going to wait on Aaron Rogers' decision because he's going to do whatever he wants to do respectfully because he's great. But we're the Pittsburgh Steelers and we need to be able to move how we want to move and go and take a path where it don't matter. It's not just one player. We're just stillers. We can do what we want to do and we're going to make it work regardless.

I'm sitting here and I'm listening to you, but I'm thinking. And I've been sitting here and I've been thinking, Joe, and I think the Steelers moving how they want to move right now. Now, listen to me. I hear you. Now, listen to me. They're saying that they're going to go with Will Howard. They don't expect a decision from Aaron, however that may be, whatever that process is. Yes.

The Steelers are saying, Mike McCarthy is saying he likes Will Howard. So. Uh-huh. if we go and sign Aaron or as Aaron said, there's no deal on the table for him to make a decision about, then he doesn't have to make a decision. So the Steelers and say, you know what, we're not going to make you make a decision

because we need to see what Will Howard can do. We're going to give him OTAs. We're going to give him training camp. We're going to give him all the time that he can get at the ones with the ones to develop so we can see. see what it is that he can do. Now, Aaron, sit back there, do what you want to do, don't make no decisions. But if through that process of distillers evaluating Will Howard and they see what they have

is conducive to them being able to win, I don't think they offer Aaron Rogers a deal. Unless this a little questionable of if they feel like what he's giving them can help. and when. And if that's questionable, then you go and you offer Aaron something or whatever it is to get him in there to see if he'll come in because now you're in question about what you have in with. So, okay. I feel you. That's where I'm seeing it, where now it's more of a, I think it's more of a stiller's move of like, okay, will. We'll. wait, we'll listen, we'll, hey, we still want you, we do, but we're going to wait on your decision and you ain't gave us a decision. And as he said himself, I don't have a decision

to make because I haven't got a contract yet. So they're saying until you give us a decision on if you want to come back or not, there's no contract for us to offer you, which gives them all the time they need and want to see what Will Howard can do. But that's the whole, but I hear you, but it sounds crazy because when they're saying like, oh, we're expecting the answer from A-Rod. We've been in touch with him. Da-da-da-da. Like, are they, why do you think they're saying that?

I think that was something that, uh, uh, Mr. Uh, Rune, the art said. Uh-huh. I think when it comes down to it as of now, that's not what you're hearing. They're saying it's not going to be that long. It won't be that long. We're hoping it's not that long.

wording is changing. I think the Steelers have come to a decision or understanding that, okay, he's not going to give us decision unless we give him numbers. We don't know what we have in Will Howard. Because it started off before Combine, now it's before a draft, now it's not going to beat to a draft. And when it come down to it, if we have trouble and we're like, yo, Will Howard is not going to do it. It's not going to take Aaron Rogers that long to get up to speed. He can get up to speed and train count. Yeah, no, for sure.

So I don't think it's any more of him holding us. We're sitting there waiting and watching to see what Will can do to see if we even want or need to offer. So are you thinking, so for the draft, Ty Simpson, we're definitely not getting Thai. We're definitely not going tie. I'm not saying we're not going tie. If he's there at a certain position, I don't see it as tie. What's the other quarterback from LSU? No, what's his name?

We talked about him. Oh, you're talking about the fast one. Yes. Yeah, I know you're talking about 6'6, but. Tailing Green at Arkansas. Yes, him. Now, I think if he's. he's there, I think that's the quarterback

there, like if he's there, we'll get him. Now we got our three. I'm telling you right now, if we get Green, where they want him, and it's a deal, we're going to go in there with Wilhoward,

Green, and Rudolph. I am not a fan of Rudolph, but we know he can get us. He did. We still have an opportunity. Like I said, through that process of going through OTA, like, he ain't got to be there day one. He know what he doing.

Yeah. Like, like, and that's, again, if we need it, if we get in that position where they're like, you know what, this don't look like it's working out. I don't, I don't think it's going to, I don't think it's going to, I don't think it's go vibe out. I'm believing in will, man. That's what I'm still putting my time at. Yeah, I can, you know, I don't, I don't have no reason to disbelieve.

But again, that's where I'm sitting back just thinking and listening, you know, like, I think that distillers may have just been like, you know what? They're like, wait, we ain't going to just sit here and wait. We go go ahead. We want him, but we're not going to let him dictate our fate. That's what I, that's all I'm saying. Don't let them dictate your fate, Steelers. You are the Pittsburgh Steelers.

like that's just that's where I see it bro I think we got our good man I think I might see my dog what's up here we're yeah there he go there he go listen man hey

oh man listen Bibo introduce your dog that's what I'm trying to say man I ain't even let me it's too late now man God damn man look here y'all got to let me do my in the dust

hey I got to be able to see everybody in the camera man. Hey, what you got behind you? I see you don't blur it out everything. What you got behind you, boy? Yeah, so it's the twins. The twins are some black art. I'm about I say. That looked like a little, nice little art piece back there. Something. Hey, shout out to coach John Mitch. You already know. Coach Mitchell, yes, sir. Yes, sir. Yes, sir.

Look here, man, we got my, my ace boom cone. We got what we call it 24? 24 Greyhound and 92 people? Hey, we had a rap name, Joe. We used to rap, Joe. Joe. No.

Joe, listen to you, Joe. We get up on the desk in team meeting and rap, bro. It was trash. I was super trashed. Hey, Joe, that's what type of time was on. Yeah, come on. You see what I got my shrizzed, you know, because I knew you was out there going. You was out there mobbing every time I saw you.

Hey, as soon as I saw you with the shites, I said it. Yeah, I said, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, you. Shite's right there. I like that look right there, Joe. Come on, man. This is all, this is for you. I appreciate that. Brother. Brother. Brother. Hey, listen. Listen. What I didn't know is you actually walked on at University of Louisiana, Lafayette.

Walked on. You know me. So this is how it started. Please. So I won't do it right in college. I went to college for the wrong reason. You know what I'm saying? Keeping it a bean. Yeah. So for me, my first. My first couple of years, I was, you know, my class was chasing, chasing hers.

That was my food. I had eight pluses in that, but on the real side, on it for real side, I was just, I was feeling the classes I needed to play. So I had to get my mind right. And I remember my mama called me, I didn't know, I ain't know my grades was going to my mama house. So my mama called me and she asked me, she was like, how are you doing the school? I said, I was doing good.

Yeah. She was like, no, you're not. I say, why you said that? She said, you're on your way for academic suspension. Like, you need to get your mind right. Yeah. So she was like, I got a question for you. I said, yeah, talk to me, ma'am.

She was like, and before I say this, I'm going to rewind. So when mama raised us, it's me and my three sisters. So she was boxing, right? So a single parent mom. So she told me, she was like, just tell me what I didn't do as a, mom for you to be acting like this. So, like, dang. So I'm just, I'm just relapsing like all the sacrifices she made.

Me, she telling me I got to be the man to the house. And for me to be cutting up like this, you know, it ain't making her proud. So I bawled. I was crying. I was crying like a baby. You know how you'd be crying. Bottom up, be shivering. Yeah, yeah.

That's the type of time. I was on. But when she told me that, when we hung up, I told my mom a shirt, never called me for something I'm doing wrong out of all the sacrifice she made. And I just kind of took off from now. I just locked in from that point on. But yeah, the walk on is real. The walk on is, you know, I finally got my grades right.

Then after that, I walked on as a running back. So I walked on as a running back, play a running back, my junior year. And I remember Coach Gary Bartell. Shout out to Coach Garry Bartell. He was like, he from Texas. So he said, look, I act. He said, we're going to have a new coach, I act. But I'm going to change you to defense a back, I act.

So just bear with me. I think that's the best thing for you if you want to make it to the next level. I'm just counting my eyes because on the other side, we had Kareesh A. A. Bear, he wound up being a seventh round drive pick of safety to Minnesota. But everybody was coming to see Charles Tillman, aka A.K. A. K.A. Peanut. A new peanut was going to be a high round draft pick. So I just, I said, you know what? it just changed to the other side, so I wind up changing to the other side, and the rest was history

after that. Oh, no, that's love. So how long did you get to play with Peanut? Only play with him for 12 games. 12 games. That's it? So basically, because I'm going through this with my son, so basically what I'd be trying to tell these kids, like, the NFL ain't looking at y'all freshman in junior year.

I said, if y'all just look at the big picture and the grand scheme of things, Like, you know, I know y'all want to get on the field in college as a freshman and as a sophomore. But if you, if you're trying to get to that next level, just look at it like this. Like, you're putting a lot of miles on your body. So the more miles you put on your body, the less time you have, the less mileage you have going into the NFL. I said, all you really need is a year and a half. So this is what I'd be trying to tell these young kids when it comes down, the kids, want to be drafted and want to play in college right away. Because the more tape you put from the field,

the more I can't critique you and see what you can't do. You know, so that's what I'm trying to tell these kids. Don't, don't rush to get on the field. And what I mean by that, and the first thing I tell them, like, man, getting that weight run, getting a playbook. That way room and that playbook should be your best friend the first year and a half. You know what I'm saying?

Because, I mean, Joe Di Boyard, you know, it's like, you know, when you go, a freshman going against the scene, it's a little bit different. You know, the type of time, their body different, their mind different. They're used to it. They're accustomed to. So that's all I'd be telling the young kids, man, just slow down on trying to rush and get on the field. And some kids deserve to be on the field.

When you have a spectacular freshman, in some cases like the wide receiver from Miami, ain't nothing you can do. You got to play them. He's going to help you win a lot of games. But just wanting to get on the field, just to get on the field because you think you should be on the field. Take your time because at the next level, you know, we're looking at it from a front office standpoint, how many miles you got on your body, and obviously

we critique in the heck out of you off of your tape. So I just tell the kids just fall back in a rush on getting on the field when you're in college. You are obviously involved with the stiddlers. I don't think people know exactly what you do. Can you explain to the people what you do, brother? Like the ambassador

scout. So I'm in the front office with the Rooney's and Omar and the team up there. So You know, I'm on the college side. The college side is, you know, evaluating guys potentially that we might be looking at. So they give me a list. So they give me a list to look at regardless on what the position is.

But, you know, for me, I feel like I'm certified at the wide receivers, the corners, and the safeties in the nickel. So I evaluate them, and I've been doing it for three to four years now. So that's where I'm at. But what people don't know, I was doing this while I was playing. So Paul Paruny RIP, Paul Paroney,

Paul Paroney let me sit in. Kevin Colby let me sit in at the time while I was playing. And I got to hear because I knew what I wanted to do after football, so I got to hear everything they were doing. I learned the language,

how they was talking. But I just didn't know to find details because I was playing. So at that time, it wasn't that time to learn. towards the end of my career, I wound up learning. And Kev gave me, he gave me some stuff on the side to do when it came down to the college side. And I just had to figure it out my style and how I wanted to present it.

So I took it from now. But yeah, I'm now in the front office. But at the same time, I was kind of doing this while I was playing. I always been intrigued on the front office and how they move. But I'm knee deep in right now, 10 toes. Yeah, you know, you're going to be. You know, how they move, matter of fact, how they move. Speaking of how they move, how you think Omar Khan move, man?

That's my dog. Yeah, he moving the way he should move. You know what type of time we'd be all coming from the city. What I mean is city, like New Orleans, all we do is sit back and evaluate and watch. We do a great job of reading the room. And what I mean by reading the room, like the time, me and always in the city, between 94 and 98, who was the murder capital of the world. You had to trust your instincts.

You had to trust your head. You couldn't say nothing. You had to read the room. If your antennas was up and it felt like you was doing something bad, like you felt like something bad was about to happen. I'm sorry. You had to move because the more is going to plan in the city of that time. So the older you got, I mean, the younger your age was 16, 17 years old.

You just knew how to move like a 40-something year old. You can read people. You can read their body. You can read when they're lying. You can read when they're telling the truth. You can just read the room. You can read people. That's just like a gift you just wind up acquiring because that city at that type of time,

it was on some ignorant stuff. And you just didn't want to be a part of that. So that's what we learned it from. But O's just been, O been on that type of time, man. Oh, O move strategic. O's a super smart man. He's super, he's super savvy. So that's what I met with.

Oh, kept his word with me too. Like O told me a long, a long time ago. like 15, 16 years ago, he was like, bro, if you enter shit, just let me know, I see something in you. And, you know, 15, 16 years ago, you're just like, man, whatever, he's talking. But then when he wanted to get in the job, I was like, dang, this dude really is serious. He stood on what he said. So, oh, my doubt. That's love right there.

For sure, for sure. And when did you end up getting, you got drafted in 2003? 2003, yeah, 2003, four-fram. When you got to the Steelers, did you have anybody that you really looked up to, kind of mentored you, taught you technique, taught you gang? Man, listen, the Shea Townsend. Shea Townsend.

Yeah, the Shea Townsend. The Shea didn't even know me. The Shee, I walked in the building. I remember She gave me his four expedition. Come on, bro. Didn't even know me. Now, we're playing the same position. So just picture this.

The She gave me his four expedition, gave me the keys to his four expedition. He told me to get lost, get lost as in like figure out the city. Yeah. And to save my money. He was like, bro, and this is what happens to a lot of rookies, really a lot of us who's in the NFL. We never had this kind of money before, but I'm telling me because I didn't been through it. Like, take the keys, don't buy no card to the offseason, save your money.

And I got you. Oh, G. Yeah. And as far as like, and that's what I did to our level. You know? so every year who was drafted the cornerback so I just did the same thing the She did to me now far as like football wise

I felt like as a player there wasn't nobody smarter than the Shea Townsend so it got to the point and Debo knows it got to because the Shea was a technician Yeah, like the IQ The Shea was a technician Yes I didn't know how hard that nickel spot was But it got to some downs

And Coach LaBeau shot at Coach Nabot Oh, Dickie. It got to some downs, you know, throughout the course of the year where the Shay got the call the calls on third down, you know? So now I see why I say the defensive coordinator for the Detroit Lions right now. But you already know, and we already knew, Joe, in that locker room, who is going to be a coach, going to be doing something related to coaching the front office because we just had them kind of people.

The kind of minds in there. Yeah, we just had them kind of minds in the building. The Shea was the first to grab me on this wing, and I just took it from now, so I did it with everybody else we drafted. Oh, that's love. He said, because how did you refine your mental side of playing corner in the defense in Dick LaBoe's defense?

It was hard. It was hard because you got to look, we ran like a four-foe. We ran like a four-fo in college, so that one number of a man. Yeah, yeah, cover three. Straight single. Yeah, that's all we ran in college.

So getting to the NFL, and you talk about fire zones. I thought that was a spot you go to the eat. I thought that was a restaurant. For sure. Yeah, but it took me a while. It took me, it took me off-season. Because, you know, Debo know, man, we had double-digit calls, you know, on one plate.

It could have been 23-busters. It could have been 63, 24-42, you know, whether the while was off or on, depending on the point. Like, that's just what it was. and all that was like that was a whole new world for me that was a whole new language for me so I had to take my time

and DeShay, Coach Teet me not Coach Teague de Shea Coase Lebo Cornell Lake Oh man Ray Horton All them boys just Tyrone now Ray was something

Ray one of the best ever Like definitely underrated as a coach Not even position coach just coach and general. Coach Ray Hardin was, he was something special. He was my D-Corporonator twice in Cleveland. All right, Dan.

So you already know what type of time. You know what type of time he was on. Man, he'd see the big picture. Yes. He see the big picture. So just being around greatness, you know what I'm saying? Like, I tell people all the time, like I've been super spoiled. My owner, Paul Barone, he was a Hall of Fame.

Kevin Coburn wound up going to go into the Hall of Fame. Bill Cowers in the Hall of Fame. Coach T. probably wind up going to the Hall of Fame soon as if the Bull is in the Hall of Fame. Russ Grum in the Hall of Fame. Mike Winchek in the Hall of Fame. Scott and Montgomery. Bruce Aaron. You see what he did?

Head coach, Ty Haley. Nick Hope, runnerback coach in the Hall of Fame. Then you get on the defensive side, Coach Key Buss, first round draft pick for the Seattle. Yeah. Then you get Cornell Lake. Then you get Ray Horton. He played at Cincinnati. then you get,

I'm missing, oh, Dan Perry, he was once one of us, then he went to the same. Like, you can just, you can just go down the line of greatness I've been around,

so I've been spoiled. So me and my knowledge of the game, I just soaked it up from everybody. That's what to take. Like I said, that automatic buy-in, you know what I'm saying?

You come, you come into a situation, you know, like I said, when he got there, he's coming into a situation of a dude helping him that he's there to try and get his,

job from. But the big thing is we need to get better. And the only way to, if you beat me out, you beat me out. I'm going to help you get to a position that, yo, you go learn everything I need to learn because at some point I might get hurt and we don't need you to come in there. And that's, that's, that's not an issue. That's not an issue. It's part of the process of playing in the NFL, dude. Like, like, what do you think is the, the big difference between like, like, those defenses that we played on and, you know, what? that locker room was like compared to how it is now?

Well, I think Or recently. Well, for us, Debo, when we play, we ain't have no options. You know what I'm saying? You had to get on board. So I think now, just in this generation, we're giving kids too many options.

So they're going to pick the best option for themselves and what works for them. You know? When we played, it was just, this is the rules this is how it was ran this is the locker room this what we expect this is the building this is we expect out of you and we just didn't we didn't ask no why because you ain't have to ask why because the why started in the 70s then it moved to the late 90s and you just carried that over all the way to the early 2000 so that's that's how I feel in general like you give these kids too many options they're going to pick the best one that benefits them no question no question bro Like, like, dude, how many times would you be in there talking about when Kyle was there? You'd be like, damn, man, I missed a block on special. Special.

Hey, listen. Hey, listen. Bro, if you mess up on special teams, that man wasn't going to put you out there on starting. You better ball. Mike, tell him. Coach, coach, Coach Cowell, that's all he knew because that's what he played when he played at this level. So we used to be on the sideline, Joe. me, Debo, Brett Keyser, Chris Hope, Troy, Cheaty, Sean Moore.

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