Club Shay Shay - Deebo & Joe - Steelers WIN AGAIN: Aaron Rodgers injured? + Shedeur's NFL debut, Ja'Marr spit-gate

Episode Date: November 17, 2025

Join NFL Legends James "Deebo" Harrison and Joe Haden as they react to Sunday Night Football where Jalen Hurts and the Philadelphia Eagles defeated Jared Goff and the Detroit Lions. Later, they react to Aaron Rodgers wrist injury, Ja'Marr Chase spitting on Jalen Ramsey as the Pittsburgh Steelers defeated the Cincinnati Bengals. Finally, they react to Shedeur Sanders Cleveland Browns debut and much more action from Week 11 of the 2025 NFL season!   Timeline: 00:00 - Steelers beat Bengals31:45 - Ja'Marr Chase spit on Jalen Ramsey38:40 - Ravens beat Browns44:30 - Shedeur Sanders makes NFL debut (Timestamps may vary based on advertisements.) #Club #NightcapSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. I'm Robert Smith, and this is Jacob Goldstein, and we used to host a show called Planet Money. And now we're back making this new podcast called Business History about the best ideas and people and businesses in history. And some of the worst people, horrible ideas, and destructive companies in the history of business. First episode, how Southwest Airlines use cheap seats and free whiskey to fight its way into the airlines. The most Texas story ever. Listen to Business History on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. On the podcast health stuff, we are tackling all the health questions that keep you up at night.

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Yes, yes, welcome back to Debo and Joe. I'm your host, Jane Debo Harris. I'm here with my co-host, Joe Hey, hey, please make sure you guys like and subscribe. You don't want to miss nothing. Hey, how you doing today, Joe? You kind of like this? like this because I'm like this. You feel me?

Joe, you muted, baby. Damn, I'm feeling good, D'Bow. You ain't want to talk, huh? No, I'm, my bad. I'm feeling great. I'm feeling great. Good day, good vibes. I'm so happy.

I love your energy. How you feeling great? How you feeling great? Because, you know, it's kind of, you got one that did this. You got one that did this. Yeah, I mean, what? Because, look, because I know we're starting to show with. So I know we're starting to show with the good vibes.

So I'm going to go ahead and pop with how I'm feeling. You know what I'm saying? I looked. I said, okay, if we're starting off with the rounds, I would start off with a little different energy right now. Stillers, one. That's the main thing. Right.

That's what we're going to talk about. That's the juice I'm coming with. Okay. Okay. See, I like this energy right here. I like this energy. You know what I'm saying? You know what I'm saying?

I want to talk. Yeah. You know what I'm saying? I ain't going to talk about. never apologize for winning. Ain't that high go. And they don't know with a seat. Never.

Never. It's too hard in the F. Mm-hmm. Mm-mm. Hey, y'all look here. I don't know if y'all heard, but Still is, uh, still as beat the bangle. By twanky two,

twank it two. If you get 21, you're supposed to get sticks up, right? Big sticks up. You're just saying, man. Hey, look here, man. Still is still to start the thing off right, though. They went on up in that thing. Is it?

Got that ball. Hey, first down they hit D. D.K. for five, second down. Jalen, he'll hit him one for five. Third down counter came in there, get a good old tush push. Mm-hmm. He had D-K on the next one for 17, baby. And then, hey, hey, on that next second down, though.

That boy Warren said, hey, 35. One one playing. He ain't playing with him. He ain't playing with him. Gamewell went on head and finished it off with 11-yard touchdown. Hey, yes, sir. Seven, zero. Hey, they play seven, seven, y'all, almost five minutes of work.

Hey, that's what that's supposed to look like when you play in the 30 second ring defense. That's exactly what it's supposed to look like, Debo. That terrible defense, they made them look like they were supposed to. No question, that's what you do. That's what I was expected. It's supposed to do. Hey, still, let's get on out there, man. First play, T.

T.J. rep that boy up. Negative one. Yep. Negative. Dropping for a loss. Hey, Pierre was hitting all night. He was up next. Come on, man.

We're going to talk about him. He was up next. We're going to drop him throughout this segment and then we got to. He was born. No game. And then on third and 11, we do what we do. See? We give him just enough.

11. But that's what I'm talking about right there, Debo. We did what we had to do. But on this third down, guys, we got to drop to the sticks. If it's third and 11, why do we drop 13 yards? We drop 11 yards because we know they're going to run. They're running sticks patterns. So that's just like we get to the position where we need it.

Stop. Like stop dropping so deep. Simple. For sure. They end up being able to stay a little ahead of the sticks, the next few downs, whatever it is. And then on second down, we jumped our sides. So that kind of gave them the opportunity to have that short,

You know, they go pass it or run it. And they hit us for 15, bro, on a run. Listen, the whole D-line on that play was three yards back. They got pushed three yards back, bro. Look at that play. Wow. Wow. Galen came up, made the short tackle.

They still got 15 out of it. And then I believe, what was it, the next we get, some pressure on it, but I think it was like a 28-yard touchdown to Higgins. Yeah, he didn't have no pressure on that one. He was sitting there waiting because Higgins ran a damn drag route, which turned into a

you're right. That's the one he had all day. Yeah, he turned up on me. He was sitting there patting the ball, patting the ball so he was able to turn up. Yeah, so now we're 7-7. What is he? So now we're 7-7, man, and

I'm thinking like what what, you know, what the freak is going on. Like, oh, but then they went on ahead and tried to go for two points because they got a penalty on the extra point. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, they go for the two. They miss it. That was a good hit on that one, too, though.

That was good. That was good hit on that one, too. Matt is asked the direct snap. Thought it was sweet. Caught it right in the hole. FOM. We get the rock bat. I think it was like, uh, what was it?

that second and A gangwell hit them with that one hand, like smooth. Mm-hmm. We went on ahead, got the first down, and then I think it was like second and 10. We jumped off sides. And then we go on ahead, get the fourth and one. Kind of does his thing. You know, we're able to make it up, you know, make the first down. But we end up stalling out and got a punt-the-rock.

I don't even know how we stall out on the defense that bad, bro. I ain't know about it. That's what I was understanding that part, too. I thought we was going to be able to just walk it down the field, take advantage of that defense. They ranked 32. They was kind of getting some stops on the 30th. And then, like, even the offense, they get the ball back.

First down, they hit us for five yards, you know. So now they're staying ahead of the change. Third down, Chase ended up getting, I think, 10 or something like that. Yeah. The next third down, you know, it was incomplete. Dude, that ruffing was weak. that was the TJ was you tell you he fell in with full body

he was falling on the side and he hit the ball did you see the other game where dude just made a straight up clean tackle like just if you tackle it which one I think it was LA or was it the charges one or the other it was a

I think it was the charges dude clean good tackle on the quarterback I mean shoulder to the side all that no head no nut he landed down tackled him It's a hard hit on the quarterback now. They just want to throw it.

You can't do that. It's already hard enough to get to the quarterback. And then they're saying when you're falling into him, you're hitting them, you're tackling them low. You can't, like, if you're stumbling to him as a defense alignment, you just can't touch him now. Like, you can't just hit his legs. It wasn't, it was a clean, like, form tackle on the other cat, dude.

Like, clean. I mean, I could see what they're trying to say, because you know how you scoop a guy in trying to get him down. But, like, you want us to. to make sure that we put our hands out to protect him, but you got to make sure that tackle, too, because he stays up long enough to throw it before you get him down.

They don't understand that, though. They don't understand. They ended up giving him a first down. Again, the next play, we go on ahead and give him five yards, like keeping them ahead, but they end up getting a false start. And boy, on that third down, who was there, man? Who there on that third down, man? James Pierre.

man-to-man. And the good part was, they're talking about something his other hand. He's just touching him making sure that when he jumps, he's making sure he touches the ball, hits it, and just in case he gets into security tackle. You got to secure the tackle. So he's not grabbing him or holding him down. He's just placing his hand right there making sure that if I do miss his ball, now I can secure the tackle. Beautiful play.

The DB's played clean all night. I ain't going to lie to me. I don't even think we've got a penalty. Mm-hmm. No, I don't think so. No, not enough. We end up forcing them to punt and get the ball back, and we go with three and out. Like, bro, three and out.

That ain't something that you do against a 30-second rank defense. That's just not something you do. The first play, though, when the Bengals got the ball back, I think that's when they had, you know, a little. That's when the issue built up right there with Ramsey, let him know, man. Listen, you ain't coming across here. where and having any touch on the ball, whether you catch it or not,

I'm going to make sure you feel me. I love that with that safety, man. We need that. We need that. Yes. Les. Jalen was bawling, bro. I mean, he's playing the safety position coming downhill.

And, you know, as a corner, you can see he's faster. But as a safety, things are happening. You know what's developing in front of him. I love what he's just. See the whole field. He knows concepts. He's coming in there and laying the wheel. I love that.

He came and sound. And we end up forcing the three out, and, dude, we hitting. Like, the D.Bs is hitting, though. They, they, they, they up there. They don't want on ahead and put, put their foot in the ground. They, they land wood, you know? Yes. Dude, it's nice, nice.

Good to see. Go back out there, though. We lose, we lose a yard on the first, on the first, on the first, first down run, again, to the worst run defense in league. But, you know. that guy fry your move yes

he gave that DB at work oh snap them's like boy them sat then started getting activated boy yeah for sure for show

for show and then they got I think Rogers ended up missing old dude like on that on that first down though and then we got

we got sacked on the second we end up punting no heck no this is this when we get to know this will mount This one Mount Washington started going crazy.

No, I don't think that was it. That might be the next one, buddy. All right. Because that was when they ended up still, I mean, still, I mean, still. Bengals get the ball back. And I think it was like a third and six. We ended up giving up 17.

And then that next third down, I think, is when Dugger dropped that pick six. He could have. Yes, yes, yes, yes. Yeah. And they end up. They end up putting the ball, and they came back around to him. But we get to that, babe.

We get to that, man. Still, let's get out there, man. Hey, Ann Rogers said, he ain't that old, man. He went on head on that third down, man. He went on head scramble for a good one now. I remember to get down. You saw his chest strap fell off and everything. He used to one chin strap, man.

You know, old school, man. Single, single. Yeah, we're able to, you know, they get a P.I. On that first down. And then, like, we give it back to him. D.K. ends up getting a P.I. But they come on here and give it back to us. They get a roughing, you know what I'm saying?

That. That's when that man in Washington, hey, hey, he went on head, got 31. Listen, he just stithed on the first dude into hell. That was all that was. The second dude, hey, he made a business decision, man. Second dude could have just pushed him out of it. Listen, he did not want to get in front of that. He made a business decision.

Okay. And the third dude, he's just a little boy at him. That's how you play with just, what you doing? Get out of here. Yeah. The third dude, I felt back, is he just trying to, he's trying to punch the ball out, like getting in the way, got speed bumped. So that, that was just disrespect.

Game well, came back, went on ahead for a hot 12, dude. Then we got another ruffing the quarterback. Listen, I understand, like, you got to protect the quarterbacks. And I want to protect mine. but he hit like the middle of his back bottom of his back butt hot top of his butt like yeah we got it i ain't tripping but being a defensive player like it's getting yeah just being honest just being out of control we end up bro we end up what was it first in goal at the nine and have to settle for three points against the worst defense

in the NFL. Yeah. Yeah. That's bad ball. And that's supposed to be, that's supposed to be damn there routes on air. We got enough talent. We got Aaron Rogers at the quarterback standing right there. We need to score.

Dude, the one play, I've seen four of us within like a 10-yard circle in the end zone at the same spot. Not spacing. We don't. And I thought, I know we always run. What's that other thing that we would do? seven shots. So I know, like, what are the, do you got to have some plays set up

to be in the red zone? Like, whatever, man, I ain't tripping. I'm tripping, but I ain't tripping. You're 16 at the half. You know, we won it. I ain't tripping. I'm tripping, but I ain't tripping. You know what I'm saying?

Uh-huh. Brough. First down. Beginning to the third quarter. We let Brown. Explosive. Explosive. 35, bro.

what yeah hold up and then i think it ended up being a little while later like second and five six something like that we gave him six seven we gave him enough to get it we gave him enough to get it you know we end up holding the next three plays after that force of field goal I mean, we don't give it that 35. We don't even have to force a field. But anyway, dude, it's 9 to 10. Hey. And this, I think, is when I find out that Rogers is out the game.

Yeah, and in comes my dog, Mason. And comes my dog, Mason. Good old. I'm glad. I was nervous. I was more nervous than a hooker in church. I ain't going to lie to you, baby. See, I believed.

Yeah? I believe. You know, we get up out there, man. First down, we get a nice five, keeping it good, you know? Second down, we get that, we get a second and think it was two. We only get like, what was it, one or something like that. Maybe we got the first. But that was, no, that was the play that Jalen, Warren, he got hurt, dude.

Like, oh, yeah, with his name. Like, he looked like, boy, they look crazy. Listen here, bro. I don't know. We got this play right here, bro, is a prime example while, why every NFL team should have grass. That is turd. His foot don't slide and cut through that turf. It don't move.

It totally sticks there. His cleats don't slide through it. Yep, yeah, yeah. Like this. Debo, you speak in facts about that, brother. That's for sure. If it wasn't for that, his whole thing could his whole knee would have been, it wouldn't have said it.

The cleats wouldn't have cut through the grass, cut through the ground, you know what I'm saying? And that little bit that it did was enough to save him. Obviously, he was back out there. 1311 hit Wilson, I think it was for 17. Man, that's, but listen here, then we can't skip that. We can't skip that. Because as a backup quarterback coming into the game, we're worried, you know what I'm saying? you just said, here comes Mason, it's third and 11.

What you're going to do? He's standing tall in the pocket and dropped the dime to Wilson on that seven route. Like, chilling, you know what I'm saying? That could just calm everybody's nerves. I know it calmed my nerves. It calmed like this. That's what I'm talking about, Mason. That's how you step in there.

It wasn't going on this, like, just running game, it's third and 11. What you're going to do? You're going to just look flazzled? You're going to look plastered or you're going to make a pass. So I'd like to just say, for him, you know what I'm saying? watching, I know just people just shaky, what are going to look like? Standing their joint, drop a dime on third and long, you know what I'm saying? As soon as you come in, it can calm down a lot of people and get some vibes going.

I know it did for me. Oh, no question. Then the third down, I'm thinking we got a catch. They get, they get D.K. on the P.I. I ain't go a lot. I'm not upset with that. Even though I am upset with it as a defensive person, I'm not upset with it. Like, at some point, you know.

Yeah. D.K., you've got to be a little more subtle. Just a little. He's strong as a moment. mug and he's double hand pushing. You need to go chicken wing. You know what I'm saying? You're strong enough to where he's, keep them close to you. The ball's coming. You see it. And then you can go up and get it. So like receivers are really good at just doing this instead of doing double. Obviously, we know you, this is still pushing off. This is affecting me just as much as

this is. Right. You know what I'm saying? As a DB, it's wait until it comes, boom, and you're going up and you can't really tell nothing. But it's a way you got to be subtle with it instead of you put two hands on me. You're pushing off. Now, obviously, I can't get back and make a play. That's a pass interference. But if you chicken wing me, you still push me off, but, like, I got to smack that. It is what it is. You know what I'm saying? Just a little.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Hey, man. Don't be obvious. Hey, man, on that third 17, you know, he made, he. That's what, mount. That's the one you're talking about. Hey, if that boy wasn't so tall, we might have been show. I ain't one.

Because buddy had a, he reached, he reached a good. Hey, y'all, his body lad. already seen what he did the previous, you know, to the other three dbs. But that boy was just holding on for life. Like, yo, let me just hold on. The boys went low. Let me just hold on for life. I'm just trying.

I'm just trying. Hey, Mason went, I think on the next two, the first and a second down hit DK for both, on both of them for nine each one. Yep. Hey. Marching down there, taking time off the clock. You know what I'm saying? Doing what a quarterback's supposed to do.

We get seven yards on that next first down and stall out again. Yep. Yep. We still can get no points there. We still got, we got points. We got a field goal, but we want a touchdown. That drive could have been so good. That would have topped it.

That would have topped it. That would have finished them all. Yo, bang let's get back out here. Hey, again on that second down. Yep. Hey, the boy, Renz, you came on up, down that thing, bad. Put that on the million say, get, get that ball up. get that ball up

and then on third and ten we give up 15 because of mistacks yeah trying to trying to just bump people I don't know what that is I don't know what that is

wrap them up you got to wrap up we got to wrap up you're in position and then on the second down I think Higgins got about 15 on that one like on

and then the next one my guy came through though my guy there we go there we go Ben Biddle break, we're in the spice? We in the spice? Tip, you know what?

I don't even know what happened on that next third down. I guess I must have fell asleep. You tell me, Joe, what happened on that next play after T.J. Tipped that bar. I don't know what happened. You tell me. Is it a pick?

Was it a pick six? Is it a pick six? The digger sitting right in the spot that he needed to be and ran that thing all the way back. Hey, hey, it was a really. for a touchdown. That was beautiful. Dugger said, hey, I made a, I missed that one.

I missed that one, but I ain't go miss this one. Great. Great play. Great play. Six, you thought it was sweet. You thought it was sweet over here. We dropping people into the hole right there to make show. And you threw a straight to it.

Leverage. Everybody outside, funnel them inside. You do it straight to him, Joe. Hit him in the chest. Yeah, yeah, you can pick six. Everybody, everybody getting lucky once in a while. That last game you played, Joe, you got lucky. You hear me?

You got lucky. Old man. That defense stood up, brother. That defense was standing up. Yeah. They was giving up some runs, like you said, but, you know, Ben, but don't break. Obviously, they get pushed. Nine to 20.

Hey, Joe, it's nine to 20. Now, we scored. Okay. First play out the gate. Bankers get a ball back. They get paid. to. We gave up 22. We gave up

22. And then we stopped them boys on 3rd 1. And Ramsey gets a P.I. Gets a personal file and he gets

tossed out the game. Now listen, I don't know what happened at that time, but I'm going to tell you what I'm saying to my son. And I'm apologize to you, Ramsey. Off rip right now We'll get to the whole subject Later we get down with this

But I'm sitting in there, bro, and I'm like Oh my God I can't believe this man just hit this man For no reason And my son is like Well, you know, he did that And he didn't know, no, listen It's nothing he could have said to him

That would have made him I'm like, it's nothing, dude I'm like he is selfish he is putting himself ahead of the team. I'm giving all that right to my son. I got to get some good advice. Yeah, yeah, yeah, no, for sure. But at the same time, I am pissed

because that gave him a first down, right? Right. But like I said, I don't know none of the other stuff. So we're going to move forward from here. They're able to stay ahead of the chains for longer. I'm Robert Smith, and this is Jacob Goldstein, and we used to host a show called Planet Money. And now we're back making this new podcast called Business History

about the best ideas and people and businesses in history. And some of the worst people, horrible ideas and destructive companies in the history of business. Having a genius idea without a need for it is nothing. It's like not having it at all. It's a very simple, elegant lesson. Make something people want. First episode, how Southwest Airlines use cheap seats and free whiskey to fight its way into the airline business. The most Texas story ever.

There's a lot of mavericks in that story. We're going to have mavericks on the show. We're going to have plenty of robber barons. So many robber barons. And you know what? They're not all bad. And we'll talk about some of the classic great moments of famous business geniuses, along with some of the darker moments that often get overlooked.

Like Thomas Edison and the electric chair. Listen to business history on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. On the podcast Health Stuff, we are tackling all the health questions that keep you up at night. Yes, I'm Dr. Priyanka Wally, a double board certified physician. And I'm Hurricane Dibolu, a comedian and someone who once Googled, do I have scurvy at 3 a.m. On health stuff, we're talking about health in a different way. It's not only about what we can do to improve our health, but also what our health says about us and the way we're living.

Like our episode where we look at diabetes. In the United States, I mean, 50% of Americans are pre-diabetic. How preventable is type 10? Extremely. Or our in-depth analysis of how incredible mangoes are. Oh, it's hard to explain to the rest of the world that you, like, your mangoes are fine because mangoes are incredible, but, like, you don't even know. You don't know. You don't know.

It's going to be a fun ride. So tune in. Listen to health stuff on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What do you get when you mix 1950s Hollywood? a Cuban musician with a dream, and one of the most iconic sitcoms of all time. You get Desi Arnaz, a trailblazer, a businessman, a husband, and maybe, most importantly, the first Latino to break prime time wide open.

I'm Wilmer Valderama, and yes, I grew up watching him, probably just like you and millions of others. But for me, I saw myself in his story. From plening canary cages to this night here in New York, it's a long ways. On the podcast starring Desi Arnaz and Wilmer Valderrama, I'll take you in a journey to Desi's life, the moments it has overlap with mine, how he redefined American television, and what that meant for all of us watching from the sidelines, waiting for a face like hours on screen. This is the story of how one man's spotlight lit the path for so many others and how we carry his legacy today. Listen to starring Desi Arnaz and Wilmer Valderrama as part of the My Cultura podcast network available on the IHartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. enough but her big her big her big came in with that big set we end up making them settle for

a field though that dude's a baller stepping in there for ice man yeah don't lose the beat 20 to 12 now look look angloatie I'm kind of nervous because there's a lot of time left. And I'm like, yo, offense, all I need you to do is burn some clock. Clown the clock. And you know what they did for your boy? They did one battle.

They did more than that. They did one battle, brother. They put together 12 players, 65 yards, six-minute touchdown drive, brother. Hey, basically thing on that way. He went six or 74. Even after we had got a 15-yard face match. Brother, that's a lot of, and you know at the same time,

that's a lot of yak. That's a lot of Gainwell catching and making people miss and getting yards after the catch. Because some of those, you know, it was some dump downs, but Gainwell being able to make moves. You got to be able to see the dump down, now. You've got to make sure that you go. No, no, no, no, no, no.

It's still your responsibility to do it. I'm not taking away from Mason Rudolph at all. I'm loving the fact that he was able to make the dump off too. I'm just saying it's a team sport and we got players making plays, him getting it into the playmaker's hands. I'm geeked. I'm a, I'm a Mason Rudolph fan. So I'm saying he's doing exactly what I was hoping for and what you were hoping for.

Yes, sir. And it happened right in front of our eyes, Evo. Hey, the bongles get back out there. Hey. force what we do on defense joe man we do opportunistic what we do joe we create turnovers we get interceptions we get strip sacks and we strip people of the bowl and we score score my man pierre the scoop this four come to the house t d 34 yi 34 down to the house with a front flip With a front flip, he could have landed on his feet.

I'm going to cut it. Almost could have. He got scared. He ain't know if he was going to rotate all the way to and hit his face. He got scared. He was trying to find the ground. 30-4 to 12. You know.

Hey, man, game basically over, man. It ain't nothing but like, what is it, low over three minutes left. They look, they little dead balls. They marched down there. But guess what? Turnover on the day, who ended it again. Turn a little down defense. Pierre almost had another pick.

Fourth and one. You want to throw a little hit you over. P. I almost get that off. Stop playing. Game over. Ball game. Game over. Listen here, man.

We do Pittsburgh Stoche. This is what we do. Now, let's go on here. Hey, I ain't going to sit here and make like we ain't got no problems. While the defense did perform better, oh, especially the DBs, like these dudes was hitting. They was playing clean. You understand? And they're going to have to hit and tackle because looking at this dude,

just looking at how we're lined up, what we're doing, who has to do what, these DBs are going to actually have to tackle like linebackers do. The defensive line, for the most part, is consistently getting pushed back. Like I told you before, I saw the one play where the whole D line was at least, three yards back, but nobody nowhere else. Like the defense from me looking at it, dude,

it's no way it's gap time. It's no way they're gapped out properly. I'm seeing things that's impossible to even gap out just from how you're lined up. So from a just alignment assignment, it is adequately trash. I ask you this about the deline with the one game. What do you?

think we made it different when they played against the Colts? Because we've seen that they can do it. They did it versus Jonathan Taylor the best running, you know what I'm saying, the best running back in the league. Why do you think that it worked so good that game? Because they showed us, you know what I'm saying, that they can do it? You know what I'm saying? So, like, why do you think it's just

game by game? Consistently, we do not do well on the D-line. That has been day one, period. We've been getting pushed off the ball, either here or there. And when you have a guy that it's nowhere, where our whole D line is playing on their side of the line.

It's nowhere where, you know, on a consistent basis, I'll say. Where our whole D line is, you know, they're trying to, the defensive lineman is trying to operate from a yard deep. They're getting our ground. Okay. The best that we, I have seen is we get a stalemate or we get a guy here or there that penetrates through the line. And sometimes they still make it through because that creates a vertical hole.

You got this guy who actually did his job. He's a yard deep, but you got this. dude right here who's two-yard. It's getting pushed back. Yeah, yeah. So there's a hope. Mm-hmm. So.

And like I said, just the alignment, assignment, assignment, as it is instructed from the defense itself, like, yes, a man has to whip a man, but I'm looking at this. And from an alignment assignment standpoint, you're asking a man to whip a man and then whoop another man, too. He got to look two men. Oh. like it's that's not yeah so you think it's something wrong with the defense period it's not the de coordinator needs some something something ain't right it ain't it's too many times i'm

seeing a guy do the same thing and if he's doing the same thing and you still keep him out there the dude behind him got to be horribly trash or he's doing what he's supposed to do which don't look like it's supposed to be done because we keep getting hit no i i see what you're saying with the run game. It's just too many times where it's explosive plays, too many gas, too many vertical holes. Not even explosive plays all the time. It is consistency. Dude, the running back almost had 100 on 18 carries, bro.

That's over five of pounds. No, that's what I'm saying. Exposal plays, it's just like 10-yard runs. Anything over a 10-yard run is explosive. I'm like, they're busting getting first-yard runs on first down, running for damn near a first down, like 12-yard carries. 15 y'all carries. And then they'll bust out one for 30-something.

You know what I'm saying? Eventually, if they break too many, break a tackles in the secondary. But I'm with you a thousand percent on that. I think the good thing is with the defense are secondary, like you said, stepped up a whole lot. And it's just a lot of things is with the third down. We also got to do situationally better. Situationally, that's what I'm saying. With the long third downs.

So I would say the first third down, when queen, we just got to get our situation. It's third and 11. don't drop back past 11. Don't drop the 13. Drop to 11 where your feet are meshed on the sticks so you can react down and make sure they drop it short or you can make a play on the ball.

Then on the third and sixth, the man to man, some ones they're going to get rubrous. But on the long ones, we need to be situationally aware to where we're dropping to the sticks and making sure they can come back down and make those plays. The run game, like you said,

I've seen them do it. So I know that they can. I just think that that's every man, whoop a man. And when you're saying, sometimes alignment, sometimes schemes might be a little off. I'm seeing stuff where it can't be filled. You don't have enough people there to fill the gaps that are available.

So that means you got somebody that got to whoop two men. That shouldn't be the case. That shouldn't be the case. That shouldn't be the case. Hey, it don't make no sense. The offense, though, hey, they just got to improve all over 30-second rating. defense and um that's that's what we get like i'm not they didn't they didn't yeah you know they didn't look like a 30 second rate defense you know i mean but hey what'd they say

i ain't never go apologize for win a baby i ain't never apologize for win a baby Now look here That's a fact They ejected Hey Rams I told you I got to apologize to you They injected my guy Ramsey for punching

And I'm like this got to be The Illis brother in Nebraska So just taking off on this man But Hey Hey Jamar said He didn't spin on me Hey we got that

Listen, we got that? Walk us through what happened with the jail? Extanging words. You were saying that you spit on him, did you spit on him? I ain't never opened my mouth to that guy. What do you think clocked the reaction from him? Well, you don't like some of the words I told him. We've been going back and forth the whole time,

so I'm sure something got under his skin. He said something got on the other. the skin. He ain't did nothing to that guy. He said he ain't opened his mouth to that guy. But you know what's so crazy, man. I mean, the eye in the sky don't lie. It's by thousand of things. And you got other people. You know what I'm saying? 85575K, 50 million K. 30,000, 34, 5.000. Hey, there's no cameras at a game now than you've ever had in the history of the world. Hey, now, I know I'm older than you in, uh, my, vision going, but tell me if you can see

what I saw. Can you please show the video? Yeah, let me check. Do-z-do-do-do-do-do-do. Spit. A lot. A big spit. A big spit. A big That was a lot, right? Yep. Yep. It doesn't. It wasn't like I was talking and, you know, you know, how you'd be talking and something just fly, like, like, like, B.C.

when he's talking, and just fly out. Yeah, because it's a bunch of gum. Dang, that didn't... You know what I'm saying? It wasn't the say it don't spread. And tried to do the slope. Brough, you spit on that man.

Listen, it ain't nothing more disrespectful if you're spitting on somebody. This stuff, dude, Jalen, you better than me? I would have still been trying to get it. And listen, I don't even think this is going to stop here. If you spit on me... I'm going to find out where you're at in the offseason.

Period. It's no other way. NFL, y'all need to make an example of this cat and give him four, six games to let these dudes know. Because this is really something that can spill off of the field on into the off season, dude. Like, even if I can't beat you, if you're a mix of John Jones, Mike Tyson,

Muhammad Ali all together, bruh, everybody got something. somebody, if I don't do nothing else but have somebody lay on you for two weeks, find out where you go going to office and where you go to kick it. And all of a sudden, it was a random attack. Somebody in a ski mask slapped, so-and-so in the head with a bottle ice, he was leaving whatever. I got to get my guess that.

I'm dead serious, bro. I know, I know you are. I know you are, Dave, Bo. I mean, that's not me now. I ain't going to lie. That might still, you know, it's, you know, it's the, you know. You, that's not you right now. That's not you right now.

I hope it was and what. I hope it. Don't, don't spit on me, please. Don't nobody. Touch me in my face, bro. Don't, don't nobody try to find out. Don't nobody try to find out, okay?

I got to, I got to lose everything. Debo, this is what I have to say on the situation. One thing is when the freak did it become cool to start spitting on people? You know what I'm saying? Like, we always say, keep your hands to yourself, keep your feet to yourself. treat people the way you want you to be treated. Slapping somebody, open-hand smacks, all this stuff is nothing is more disrespectful

than spitting somebody. I think it's like the third time this year. And like it's not cool. It's disgusting. You know what I'm saying? It's very, very disrespectful and it's just something that shouldn't be in the league. I love Jamar Chase.

Great player, amazing, my favorite receiving the league. But what the f makes it cool that? And then go in the line about it. We're blatant on 4K. Everybody sees what the hell's going on? Everybody sees the situation.

Jay Lamams, you have every right to do exactly what you did and like Debo's situation or you know what I'm saying but like that's just disgusting and I hate seeing

like people keep doing it like oh yeah they went out man spit them like what are we doing? You know what I'm saying? I don't, I just don't rock

and say it's like anyway. They ain't go fine. There you go. Like that's like people who steal and think they ain't to be caught.

They got five cameras pointed at you right now And you think that you cupped it in your hand. Bare face, no mask. And they saw you grab it. And it never left your hand to get back on the shelf. They saw the spit fly out your mouth. Like, come on.

We got the footage. That's you. And you got the Jamar. It says Chase on the back of your jersey. You got your helmet on. Is you looking at the other guy, the sailing that said, Jalen Ramsey, he says you spit on him. Did you?

No. All right. We'll go to the film. You lying like a little kid. You're lying like a little kid, man. That's the same. man, you're a wrong man. You got caught.

You're lying like a little kid. You're scared. What? No, for sure, because you know you did wrong. You know you wrong. Dude. I'm up here hot. Like, yo, Rams, you know, went on here and did this for no reason.

You done, you don't put us in jeopardy. Like, now, no, listen, I see why they couldn't get him off. They wouldn't have been able to get me off the field. The locker room that they at for our locker. room is directly right there. I'd have been like, yo, I'd have been sitting in his locker under something, waiting. And especially I know why Jalen was sitting there

because he like this. He spit on me. And now, because this was the first thing, they had the first little scuffle up they talk and they get the so they both have the warning. And now when I see Jalen still off on it, I'm like, dang, and Jemar Chis didn't even move his arms. I'm like, man, you let him.

He did something. I know what I'm thinking it's just words at that time for sure same thing that i was thinking at the same point so now we're looking at it but then jalen for him not the one to go off the field he like this not this could just spit on me and now y'all kicking me out of the game i'm not going nowhere till he leaves the field like i got spit on you know what i'm saying obviously i'm going spazz and retaliate but like no he then he's sitting there like acting like never happened but chase was like just i'm good i'm good i'm good you know of course you good you think you don't got away with it telling you you're chilling

Anyway, man, but hey, that's what we do, man. You know, we go win, win, win no matter what, you know. Hey, man, listen, I'll tell you right now, man, I 100% think that the Browns just hate distiller so much they're willing to kill themselves. What happened? With your Browns, Joe? Did you watch the game? I can't say I watched the game. I can't say they got a legal formation, you know,

when they went for that four for one, even though after they made it. I can't say that they got a field goal off that. I can't say a lot of things. But did you, I mean, you tell me what happened, Joe. Everything you said happened exactly like act right. The thing is, sometimes just the Brown's offense, like we said, when you're not that, when you don't have too much,

but you're not just abundance of talent, you can't do, you have to do little things right. You can't hurt yourself. You can't be setting up penalties. So long story should, like you said, Debo, first drive, we get it down to, we get it down to get ready to go for the fourth and one. We go for it. We convert it.

And we are in an illegal formation. Like, somebody's covered up. That's what bad teams do. You're expecting, we, you're supposed to plan for this, practice for this, knowing these situations, knowing you're supposed to, you're going to be in this. This is our short, this is our short yarder situation. this man needs to be on the line this person needs to be off the line

you know what I'm saying so that happened punt the ball starts off bad so get deep ball I know I know you're saying What are you talking about? I'm just trying to hear you know just you know just give it synopsis baby you know what happened next

did anybody so scored uh did they I think the game was started off 3-0. I don't know. I didn't watch it. Yeah, man. Ravens got a field goal because then Miles, Miles Garrett, we did, we've been but don't break.

They got, they got some runs. They got down there. Miles got a sack, his first sack of the day. Well, you're going to hear about that a lot throughout the day. You know what I'm saying? So they ended up getting three. Browns get the ball back. 13-yard run. Starts off right. Juckins, you know what I'm saying? Juckins again.

This is when we started. started just handing the ball to Juckins. Juckins started running the ball good. We did some, Dylan Gabriel. Every dog that's once in a while. Go ahead. Well, yeah, yeah. Okay, Dylan Gabriel, he has a chance to do, he does a rollout.

So then the first time we passed it with Dylan Gabriel, he just, on the out route, just throws the ball out of bounds. Did y'all get a touchdown? I'm good. No, we didn't get a touchdown. Oh, okay. Oh, so it's 3-3. Okay.

We got a field goal. It's 3-3. Yeah, yeah. Go ahead, Joe. Go ahead. We get it to the Ravens. Great coverage, defense, doing what they, doing what they normally do. They punt.

Browns get the ball back. But a punt, right? What happened? What happened? What happened on the, I want to get, I want to get, I want to get, I want to get to a punt. What, what happened on the, what happened, what happened? What happened on the punt where? I don't know.

I heard somebody was on the six yard line and they only got a field goal from it. That's what they told me. The Ravens, this is when I started telling you, too, the Ravens was trying to help us out a little bit. Our special teams ball, when they punted the ball off, they fumbled it and we get the ball at the six yard line. You got a test now? We don't get no, we don't score. first time we first we don't get we don't we understand what they did to that dog what you what you're talking about you get field go go go so then punt the ball off I mean we kicked the ball off

ravens get it what do they do what do the ravens do ravens went on here and said hey let's spot your seven more we don't care here interception touchdown yeah yes yeah yeah They gave it to you. They like to make it tough because they know if they go ahead and play you up front and don't give you a lead, it ain't going to be entertaining for the fans. Off the easy. And then what they do immediately after that when they got that ball back, though. They said, we don't want y'all to think you're actually doing this on your own.

We're helping you. They went on here and scored the touchdown. They said, we're going to keep it within three. Hey, and most we're going to let y'all do is six ever. You know what I'm saying? What's the score now? 13.10? Right now.

And then they say, hey, let's make it exciting again. They let y'all get a field goal, man. They let y'all get a field goal, you know? And then on top of that, they said, we ain't going to even score on that next possession. We're going to go in the halftime. And we're going to let you boys go ahead and be up. I don't know why we started calling timeouts before the half.

Like our offense was about to do something. I don't know what he was thinking. So, yeah, that just threw me all the way off. Dylan wasn't, all right, let's go. So second half. Man, I ain't going to lie to you. Man, it wasn't nothing, you know, it wasn't nothing but a little bit of a punt fest,

you know, going back and forth there. Yeah, and then Shadour came in there. So, yeah. Shadul came in. So can we start the third? when let's get so we're 1610 half time right ravens get the ball Miles Garrett comes in there gets a tackle for loss then he gets a sack his fourth sack of the day then the uh ravens got a punt in a hundred sacks it ain't going to matter right

all right look so then shador comes in there I get very excited I'm happy I want to go I hope I'm hoping that he comes out there and does well but at the same time He hasn't practiced. We're going to get some way. He hasn't practiced. I'm Robert Smith. This is Jacob Goldstein. And we used to host a show called Planet Money.

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available on the iHeart radio app apple podcast or wherever you get your podcast let's go ahead go man you give me a lot of excuse me i'm just hoping i'm hoping i'm doing interception he ain't not not off the rip not off the rip i need not off the rip he was out there he got a strip he got strip sack and they had to punt on his first drive the ravens get the ball back they get the fourth and eight what's up listen at least Lamar gave it right back to you

right after that okay so we scratch okay yes Shador's second drive first and 10 Juckin slips and falls

second down incomplete past corner jumped around third and 10 third and 10 I don't know if it was if he knows how to slide the protection, who missed the block,

but there was three people blocking one person on the right. Joe, Joe, okay. What's up? We'll get to that, Joe. Nothing happened, Joe. The Ravens came back out there. They got another field goal, okay? You see?

Do you see this picture I'm talking about? This is when he threw the pick. He gets smacked. Like, right here, it's one person over there to the right block. and we have three of our players. So you're saying he called that protection like that? No, I'm saying, I don't know.

Who called the protection? I don't know if he knew that, like, this is his first time. Man, we need to know, like, hopefully the line is sliding it to this side. There was some miscommunication, something's going on right here where. Well, consider, you don't get a chance to practice with the ones. We'll get to that, but anyway. We'll get to that. But I'm just saying, this does not look right for either the linemen, the quarterback, the sliding,

the protection, obviously. So he sits right there, stands in the pocket, throws a pick, and it doesn't look good for my man. Bravers get the ball on the 16-yard line. And then Brown's defense again. You know what I'm saying? Lamar Jackson, throws the ball, hits off somebody's head, and then my young ball, 49, jumps up, makes a pick, makes a play,

gets the ball right back for us. So now, Chodor goes back out there. Right, right. So now, on the first thing, and 10 on this when he gets to scrambling out, you don't throw the ball back behind your body like this. He could have thrown a pick on the first play. So I'm not here for like to say like I'm going to be honest when everybody plays like Dylan at the beginning of the game too. He had passes. He threw one good pass. And that's the one thing about Dylan. He threw a good pass to Tillman

and you see sports. I said, listen, Joe, what I'm going to do? What? What are you going to do? I'm just go go ahead and let you get to Shador. Okay. Okay. So this. what we go do. Okay. Y'all stall out all day. They kick two more field goals. Hey, man, I could have swore like I seen a dude

take off like he was running forever. Big dude, big giant dude. And they couldn't catch him. But anyway, yeah, yeah, yeah. It's 16, 16, right? At the field goal, hey, just push you. Fake the push.

Touched. Fade you. Touched out. Got to be more. And then y'all go out there, turn it over on downs. Now. let's go on head and get to the Brown's issues. The Brown's issues is your offense is trash, trash.

It's nothing else I can say, period. Okay. Now, let's get to my guy or your guy, Shedore. How do you think Shador played, man? I don't think Shadour played good at all, honestly. Four for 16, 47 yards. Sometimes it's standing back in there.

You know what I'm saying? like just moving just moving a little bit too slow and I'm not going to blame him too much because at the end of the day how many reps has he got this is first time out there at all getting any snaps getting being able to throw the ball to Judy this is crazy talk though him being there since of been drafted rookie camp everything and not being able to have any time to throw the ball to these to these players is crazy so the ill preparedness of him and not like if you're a backup quarterback we know he's going to get you're not going to get a lot of reps at all but when Dylan Gabriel was the backup quarterback was he getting any reps just in case something were to happen if you if your starter goes down your backup needs some type of reps so him not going to never heard in my life in your life in your life

second stream quarterback never getting any time with the one in history of a season ever ever ever in life now listen there's two levels of people man that are looking at Shadoor that one hand go hold on hold on hold on I'm not done because it's not and this is the thing too I'm not here to be a Shadour

I'm going to be honest so you can't stand up here and say the 4 for 16 was great I don't think it wasn't a good performance he did a little things a little too slow some of just the the intentional ground ins stuff like that we just can't have, but the deep ball, the dig when he did have time,

throwing that dagger on time, standing up in the pocket, like being able to be a really a quarterback, throwing the first two passes he did, like rolling out to the pocket, throwing it on target, not high. Some of the passes that were dropped, you know what I was a couple of them that were dropped. So I'm not how to say he didn't, like he played like horrible game, but that wasn't that wasn't Shador's best. And he knows that too.

You know what I'm saying? He's like, man, how did you play? I didn't do good. So I'm not here to be like, no, Shador played great. There's a lot of reasons why he played the way he did. But I'm really excited because now he at least gets to foot the Shador. Heaters is like this, man, throw Shador in. And just the other, just trying to bash him.

But I just now look what you got. This is what you got now. Be happy. I'm like, no, no, no. Shut your mouth. We watch Dylan Gabriel. He's been able to get his first 15 plays. He's been able to sit, get reps with the coaches, been able to get reps with the coordinator,

be able to find what plays I like, what I feel comfortable with on third down, what I want to, what plays I want to, what plays I feel comfortable with. with. So this was not good, but let's give him a leash. He's going to get his time. We able to see Dylan Gabriel throw one good pass a game. Now, I saw in just a lot of Aaron one. So I always been brutally honest. If it's a bad pass, you're throwing something in the ground. That's what it is. If you throw a good pass, it's a good pass. So Dylan's been able to throw, like, it's consistently two good passes per game. I can be like this. That's a nice pass. That's not good enough. You know what I'm saying? If you want to be a professional

quarterback. So with Chador's performance today, that was not the other day, that wasn't good. But for him to now be able to finally get to go in there, for him to now finally be able to throw the ball to the starting receivers, be able to meet with the line and get his cadence, be able to know protections, being able to get, who's calling these protections, being able to just get a feel, being able to get his feet wet, like he said, for this game, unexpectedly just getting thrown in

and to Dylan Gabriel's playbook, you may not perform well. So I don't think he played good at all, but I'm very excited for him now to be able to get some, plays and be able to get out there and be able to play with his stuff, be able to get some plays that he likes, be able to get some practice under his belt and get out there with a clean opportunity. So I'm geek.

It's two levels of people. It's two different kind of people that want to see Shador do something. It's the Shador haters who hate him because of his father, who hates him because they feel like he got an opportunity they didn't that hates him because he is who he is okay period and there's other people who are like yo i want to see him do well okay i want to see him do well i just don't want to see him do well against us now that being said i'm 100% with you shodora did not have a good game but shodora did make throws he did make decisions that were good and bad could have made

better decisions. Again, at the same time, you're trying to make like, oh, he's supposed to come in here as the backup quarterback who has never had a snap with the ones. He has never seen real game time speed

because preseason is not game time speed and you're going to judge him as if he's stepping in there as Tom Brady coming through and just supposed to come in here and laced and light everything up. And you don't this boy that's in front of him more than enough time

and he is still not able to do it. The comparison of the two is very close with one guy getting no snaps and I'm just talking about right here in this half, period. So all your Shador haters, y'all keep hating.

They keeps the door in there. He'll go get time. He'll get a chance to be like, oh, this is how fast my dude is running the route. This is where I need to put the ball. Oh, these guys are going to get to me fast. this i need to throw this ball faster he breaks here i can throw it faster as soon as he cuts to there because i know where he's going he ain't had the timing to get all that together okay he he had the time to work with his lineman and realize hey a crazy you know i might i might

need to know if so-and-so is over here this you know everybody know who the lineman is that may let somebody slide through on you somebody know who may make a mistake which you got to adjust to? Same thing. Your receivers. Hey, you got to go ahead and know, hey, how he likes to run his route. Where he cuts on his route. Is he going to adjust to his route? Like the one, like, he could have hit the,

he could have hit the tight end, but dude, he's reading probably his primary, and he don't even get time to really get to it. But he knows that the blitz come in, he doesn't had time to play and know that you're hot. Boom, right to the turn end. Come on. Stop hating on the man. Come on. Give him time.

Then, Debo, he threw the ball. at the end of the game, too, in the end zone. That was a great play by the defensive back. That was a great play. It was in his hands. If they catch the ball, Oh, well, he threw a ball across his body. Yes, that's the decisions that you make when you're,

you haven't had the time to be out there and he's trying to make a play. He's trying to win the game. I don't see your boy dealing, dealing whoever he is, do the same thing. Persistently, at least one, one time every other game. This man had one half and never had a snap. Never had a snap with the ones. If you as a Cleveland Brown fan or an owner or the GM and he ain't had a snap to he owe two,

y'all need to fire your head coach now. It's crazy. It's crazy. That's putting the position to lose. Just put Dylan back in when we play. See, I appreciate your honesty with that, Debo. I appreciate your candor. You know, but for real, for real, because when you look at your door, when you look at your door,

and I just don't like when people get done wrong. I like when it's a fair, it's NFL is the game where the best players get the most opportunity and nobody's trying to set you up for failure. I just don't want to feel like he's getting set up for failure. Oh, I 100% think that he is not being assisted the same way as they assisted Dylan, period. Yeah. So I just hope now being able to get out there, and the smart thing is, you, Shador is a baller.

He knows when he didn't play well. He was like, man, I didn't play well. So now when I get the chance to go out there, prep for the game. You know you're going to be starting. You know you're going to be out there. It's a whole different type of prep. And you're going to get reps.

And you know that you're going out there for a purpose. So I'm geek for him. No question. What the first thing he did when he got in the locker room? Hey, guys. That's the on beat. Hey, that's, he tried to take the full blame for it. But like, you know, it's a team game.

And, you know, like you said. Hey, that's, that's leadership. And what's your other leader telling? What, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, what, say, this ain't just on you? What are you talking about? This is a team. Come on, well.

It's a team. And La CLAW have already got his back. Stephansky. Huh? That was the most, that was the most energy. And did you, and did you hear his, did you, did you hear his response to how, when he was saying, the crowd was, the crowd started booing for Dillam. He threw that.

third and five yard route out of bounds. Hey, tell me about that. My bad, I post ain't seen the game. Go ahead. No, no, no. You seen just that out route. I'm like, you can't not just throw that

out route. I'm sorry. That's just bad pass. He's wide open. And then the crowd started booing. And then Shadova was like, I ain't going to lie. Like, I just don't like when the crowd like with booze because at the end of the day,

it's support, but you don't want to feel dealing uncomfortable. I'm loving his, just trying to have his man's back. Because at the end of the day, he's not rooting for his downfall, but, When you get out there, it's like, the crowd won it. The crowd wants your door. They said enough.

You've seen them for five games. I've been watching it and trying to be as honest. And like, man, when he makes a good pass, I'm not just saying, get him out of there. Like, give him a chance. Let him start. Like, we give him like four more, like, four games, gets five games. All right, no. Now he's out.

He's concussed and he wasn't doing that well. I'm going to tell you, I'm going to tell you this right now. I'm going to tell you this right now. From the performance the boy had, I'm talking about Dylan, leading up to now and him getting put out with concussion if they bring him back next week

the Fansky hates Shador facts one debunk if he brings him back he needs to let that man get his noggin right go through the protocol you know what I'm saying

don't be trying to rush him for what he ain't won you in that one game brushing them back to not let Shador get his first 10. No, no, no. No, no. We played Browns. I don't know. I think we play. They play Vegas this week coming up. And then I'm going next one. I'm going week by week

with the Browns, man. I'm going week by week. Get a man tying to rest his head. Okay. He obviously has trouble figuring out things. His accuracy is trash. So now his eyes go be a little woozy. But it's crazy.

But it's... Listen, I don't care what you do. I hope you get fired. You deserve it. Just from the comments that you said about him, like you don't know

who you're back up, who your number two quarterback is, and you just got rid to Joe Flacko and you only got one of the quarterback on there.

You was a piece of trash. He was fired. Shout out to DM. Man, yeah. You right. Shout out to Devin Bush with the pick six. Hold up, I got to show you real quick.

Debo, we go. It's a DeBush jersey. Okay. Okay. We did time. That's another good man. He did time. He got drafted by the Steelers.

Now he's with the Browns. He's another one of my cross-contaminated, brother. He cross-contaminated. Yep. Bro, man. Oh, my. Are you, dude, we're out of time. Bro.

It's 12 o'clock. We're going to have to catch up on the rest of these, man. Tomorrow. Tomorrow, but what we go do right now, man, is Joe, we got a super chat right there, Joe. Let me see that. I don't got the super chat on my house. Let me check in your vibes. Oh, we got a super chat.

We got a super chat, man. Super chat. Please, tell me something, chat. Black Wolf 0-4-1-2. He donated $5. He said, I'm going, he said, I'm going right to the point. If any player spit on you, Debo, would you have the same reaction, the same way? No, bro, I'd have went to jail.

I'd, dude, I would have, like, I'd at least try to, like, get all the way, rip his helmet off. Jalen actually kind of, you know, he used to dood itself after he got a couple off, and he realized he wasn't fighting back. And he was, like, kind of, like, no, no, it wouldn't have been no stopping. they had hit a helmet would have been off like it would have been dude I honestly the old me

I said the old me the old me would have clear both both sides would clear both bets then you wouldn't let you wouldn't let go you would a ground a pound of depot no bro I would not have let go dude I would not have let go it's too strong

hey man Rick from New York hey he gave four 99 499 he said with Dick Leboe as your D coordinator Pick a head coach to play your entire career for Cower or Tomlin. Ooh, that's a hard one.

That's a you question right there. You know what? I'd have to go, I'd have to go Cowher. I'd have to go Cowher. I liked I liked what we have to, we had as a team. How many years did you do with each one?

Oh, man. I think it was only, here's the thing. I would like to go with Coward because of his approach and how he coached, how he led his players and so on and so forth. His personnel,

you know, he had coaches in there that were, you know, great talents, you know, guys that went other places, did other things. and, like, Coastal Bowdo, you know what I'm saying? Like, come on. Like, so that, that for me is, is, you know, why it would be cower, but, I don't know.

I can respect that. No, when you got coaches like that, you're picking, you picking between, that, that's the hard problem when you pick between grades. You know what I'm saying? It's not like you're trying to shoot down one to say something good about the other. It's like, you got, he's like, man, both great. picks. I could pick either one, but if you're asking me for my personal. Honestly, honestly, for me, what it comes down to is, I like what we had as far as a defense.

And I think a lot of that came from how Cowher picked his players, like, and how he brought you up. Like, if you didn't play well on special teams with Cowher, you wasn't starting. I don't care. You weren't coming in and just starting because I picked you at this position or that position. like it's not happened dude it's not happening like you know and like coach butts best lineback coach I ever had man like we had guys that you know they went and taught you the position like they played the position we had guys that played the position so they taught you the position you knew you know you had the nuances

of the position and then you knew what was going to be difficult and you knew what was you were never asked to do anything that was impossible Yeah. You know what I'm saying? They pick players that would play to the position we needed them for. So if I need Casey Hampton, why do I need Casey Hampton? Because we run a true three-four. We don't run a bastardized four three.

We run a true three-four. What that mean? That means your three interior alignment got to take up five, at least four. For sure. And your big-body middleman, got to be able to hold to and move. nowhere, and that's what Casey Hampton did. On top of that, his backup, Chris Hope, sorry, it's Hulk, he did the same thing.

And it was, pick the player for the spot, for the position. Learn it. Learn it. It did it to your backup. It was only one player that ever started on Dick LaBow's defense as a rookie. And that was Kendra Bell. And you know why? we played Gap defenses.

Gap defense means it tells the MAC, Gap, M, sword, knife, gun, whatever it is. It tells the Mac take off to A Gap on the right, A, B, C, D on the right, or A, B, C, D, D on the left. Because it's so hard to understand and learn that defense. By time I came back, dude, I think when I came back, we had two or three rookies starting on the defense

that ended up having to be changed because... you can't learn you don't know it but they're being put out there to start rushed into the start because that's what they want done and it destroyed the defense to where you know by dude we had we used to have gold sheets so you remember you wasn't even here you came in 17 right you had no gold sheet right i don't think i had a gold sheet i just saw the sacks shot you all this They stopped the goal sheet after 16 because we couldn't hit them. So it was a goal sheet where you had, it was like, I think, like 15 things.

And it was Coach LeBow's goal sheet. So of these 15 things, if you got somewhere between 12 or more, you had like a 90-something percent chance of the game, you know, winning the game. And these goals were based on like with the top 5 percent or 10 percent, whatever it was, I think it was five or 10, I can't remember. of the league had did the previous years. So yards per game, yards per catch, yards per throw, all this other stuff. We stopped that in 16 because, dude, we were not getting the goals.

So they just stopped it all together. You know, I'm not going to keep this. Dude, we're not feeling. But also, Coach of the ball was gone. It was a change of him. So instead of us coming in, you know, every week and we're looking at this goal sheet and we we we ain't got nothing but you know three of them chat they like they just did away with it so now you don't even have a goal

you don't have numbers you don't have anything that you're setting your standard on to aspire to like coach the bow had analytics before they were analytics he already had that that's what it was set up and and the only reason I noticed is because I asked him like yo coach the number went up a little bit from this year to this year. Well, the numbers of the average from last year went up. So instead of it being a run of, you know, like 3.1 and went to 3.2. So every run has to average less than 3.2. Every pass has to average less than, you know, what was it, six or seven something, whatever it was. Like, you know, and if you hit those goals, you're going to be in that top by defense

so boom like that was our team goal so what's our team go right now we don't have anything I mean we

we turning over the ball we're creating turnovers which is good we need to like you said Debo the like you the the gaps people not in the same gap

people having to do too much for a job we i don't know how that's that's like you said that's defensive that's coordinational change so i don't know how that's going to change all right unless you there we got one more super chat baby i've been what is it labin five dollars you had to he asked he asked you this question he said will miles garrett break the sack record what he got right now 15 16 i think they said he got i think it's maybe seven games left and he had eight sacks to break it. With these multiple sack games, and I don't see he got the five,

and then he backed it up with the four. He got 10 in the last four weeks. So, I mean, if he, he, I could easily see him get a sack of a week, and one of these, go and get three. I mean, he's playing against the outcome. He's going to go against probably the Bengals again. We probably, do they play the still? Yeah.

I think they play the Steelers. Yes. And then Cincinnati at the Braven. play against them. I think he might play everybody in the division. So, you know, with our divisions, it's possible. They say it's the Raiders, the 49ers, Titans, Bears, Bills. Stillers and saying, messing around with the Raiders, he might mess around.

Look, messing around, he goes against the Raiders and gets a three-piece. Like, I'm not seeing, Gino Smith standing back there, their line isn't the best. So he can go easily, you know what I'm saying? Get them behind the sticks. They stopped the run. And then Miles guy, but it's our Tying off. You know what I'm saying? So he go get three.

He got us in the Bengals at the end. So, I mean, awesome. Listen, man, we got to get out of here. I got to get going, man. I'm supposed to be somewhere a little bit. But look, I want to thank you guys for joining us on this episode of Debo and Joe. As I say, as I say, we're going to hit the other games tomorrow, baby. But hit the like and subscribe button so you can be here with us tomorrow.

And, you know, we're going to be back at this thing. Joe? Yep. Make sure y'all come catch up, man, tomorrow with your boy and Debo. Appreciate everything. Make sure you hit the like

and subscribe button. And we out. I'm Robert Smith. And this is Jacob Goldstein. And we used to host a show called Planet Money. And now we're back making this new podcast

called Business History about the best ideas. and people and businesses in history. And some of the worst people, horrible ideas and destructive companies in the history of business. First episode, How Southwest Airlines Use Cheap Seats and Free Whiskey to fight its way into the airline is. The most Texas story ever. Listen to business history on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. On the podcast Health Stuff, we are tackling all the health questions that keep you up at night.

I'm Dr. Priyanka Wally, a double board certified physician. And I'm Hurricane Dibolu, a comedian and someone who once Googled, do I have scurvy at 3 a.m. And on our show, we're talking about health in a different way, like our episode where we look at diabetes. In the United States, I mean, 50% of Americans are pre-diabetic. How preventable is type 2? Extremely.

Listen to health stuff on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. On this week's episode of the next chapter, I.D. Jakes gets to sit down with Oprah Winfrey, a media mogul, philanthropists, and global trailblazer. I could feel inside myself at four or five years old, looking through the screen on the back porch, that this is not going to be my life. Listen to the next chapter on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast, episodes drop weekly. This is an IHeart podcast. Thank you.