Club Shay Shay - Dwyane Wade

Episode Date: June 12, 2023

NBA legend, 3-time Champion and soon-to-be Hall of Famer Dwyane Wade is here inside Club Shay Shay for an all-encompassing conversation with Shannon. The Miami Heat great sits down and dishes out the behind the scenes stories from his illustrious career in the NBA, what led to his success, and perspective on the game today. From playing with LeBron, to this year's Miami Heat featuring Jimmy Butler, you'll want to hear all that Wade shares in this wide-ranging interview. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoicesSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Make sure to listen to the Good Morning Football podcast Monday through Friday on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts. One of your classmates, teammates, contemplating retiring. LeBron. Who?

LeBron. Are you on here? Are you on here? Let me get you a dozen. Let me get you a dozen. Yeah, go there. Go there. Give me that.

Give me that. All my life. Been grinding all my life. Sacrifice. Hustle paid the price. Want a slice. Got the roll of dice. That's why.

All my life. I've been grinding, Shannon Sharp. I'm also the proprietor of Club Shea Shea. And the guy that's stopping by for a conversation and a drink today is an NBA all-time great. He's a three-time NBA champ. He's a Finals MVP, a 13-time NBA All-Star, All-Star Game MVP, eight-time member of an All-NBA team, three-time member of the All-Defensive team, member of the 75th anniversary team, 2009 scoring champ, Olympic gold medalist.

He's the Miami Heat leader in points, games, assists, steals, shot made, shots taken. His number three is retired by Miami Heat and Marquette. He's an Emmy winner, New York Times

bestselling author, executive businessman, host of the game show The Cube on TBS, a model, once voted NBA's best dressed player, father, philanthropist, husband. D-Wade, did I get it all in?

Bro, I was looking to see who was about to come through the door. I was like, who walking through? You took a whole card. DJ, we leave anything out? We leave, actually. D-Wade, how you doing, bro? Thanks for stopping by.

Man, thank you for allowing me to come here, man. Man, this has been a year in the making. I DM'd you a couple years ago. You said, hey, I'm going to get to you, Uncle. I'm going to get to you. And then I saw you at the premiere of Redeem Team. I said, bro, did you forget about me? You said, no, I didn't forget about you.

Hey, I got some things going on, but I'm going to get to you. And then you hit me up and said, hey, let's do this. It's time. So I appreciate it. I appreciate you getting in. So how you been? Man, I'm great. That's the easy thing to say.

That's the easy thing to say. Right? I'm great. And then everything else after that. But, man, I've just been living life. Right. And I've been learning how to live life. Right.

Differently than the bubble of the NBA. Right. Which we all know is, you know, when you play sports, you know you're in this bubble. Right. It's a great bubble. Right. And so the bubble got popped a little bit four years ago, and so I'm just adjusting to life. Right. Before we get started, let's have a toast. This is my cognac, La Portia Shea. Let's toast your career, Hall of Fame career, one Hall of Famer to another. Yes. And my cognac, you have a wine, wine cellars. Yes, sir. All the best, bro. Thank you. And he

sent me, he sent me this to my house. Got this beautiful glass and everything, so everybody out there, when you send gifts, send gifts. Okay. I was going with my do-rags. I took it off in the car. You was going to really take it off.

The mic still got the lines on me. I was like, nah, I ain't going to do that. I ain't going to do that. You were a first ballot, unanimous Hall of Famer. What does the Hall of Fame mean to Dwyane Wade? So I've been thinking about this because, you know, we all have dreams of places we want to be. And even in the midst of those dreams,

I can't say you don't believe him or you do you just you put a plan together and you and you go attack it and so once i i got the call from jerry colangelo and said you are in the hall of fame like i got that call right like i just took a moment just to like to myself man i just was like ain't no way. Right. Like I know who I am. Like I've been living with myself for 41 years. Right. And I remember, you know, how I grew up. I remember my dreams and my hopes and sent them out loud.

How many people laughed at me or told me they wasn't. Right. And so to be able to be like, man, I'm 41 years old. I've accomplished everything in a game of basketball that I could ever dream of. And to be able to kind of top it off the way that I'm able to with my kids being older, understand a little bit. Hall of Fame is the ultimate validation. It's the validation. Because it's the entire body, your entire body of work.

Right. Right. And they say when you get done your entire body work, that you deserve to be with the best. And so before it was a top 75, before I knew that that was possible, which is incredible, the Hall of Fame was like, all right, when I get done with this career, I need to be in there. I want to be that first ballot. Now I want to be that first ballot. First ballot.

I'm not saying that about second, third, fourth, because we all have our own route. But for me, I was like, I want to be that first ballot. Right. nothing about second, third, fourth, because, you know, we all have our own route. But for me, I was like, I want to be that first back. Right. So when you were a kid and you're growing up in Chicago, you're like, okay, was the NBA at the forefront?

Did you say, you know, I just want to do something to take care of my mom? Was the NBA always at the front of your mind? The NBA was the only front. Like, I played football. I might have played around with, hey, I want to be a, I thought I wanted to be a cop but I really didn't I was scared of police so I was like oh but I like the I like the badge I like the outfit okay when I was a kid I might have told my mom I wanted to be a doctor and a cop just because I thought those were the things that she was gonna support me and me telling my mom as a five six seven year old kidyear-old kid, hey, mom, I'm going to be the next Michael Jordan.

I'm going to go play for the Chicago Bulls. That's not realistic in my community. Right, right. Being a cop is realistic. Right. And so, but I always wanted to play in the NBA because I grew up at the perfect time with basketball. And the team, the city that I grew up in in Chicago. At Jordan.

Was at the, it was at the height. Air Jordan, Scotty. Did anything else matter? No. Like, I feel so lucky now. Like, when the documentary, The Last Dance, came out, I just feel so lucky to, like, I was the kid in Chicago that knew about all these stories that no one knew about.

Right. And so I was going back in my mind, like, I grew up on these stories before it was a social media, before things went viral. Dennis Rodman was down in Chicago going viral downtown. Right. You know what I'm saying? And so Chicago Boys was everything. My dad put the ball in me and my stepbrother's hands when we were young, and basketball became everything. Right. You're going in with Dirk Nowitzki, Tony Parker, Greg Popovich. You had great

matchups against Dirk. You played against Tony Parker, Greg Popovich. You had great matchups against Dirk. You played against Tony Parker, NBA Finals beat him once. You grew up against Pop a lot. What does it mean to go in with, like, man, Dirk. Everybody knows that Dirk brought in the stretch. When you see that one-legged step back, it's him. You see Tony Parker, the guy that can penetrate and use the float game to an excellent. Greg Popovich, hey, nothing needs to be said about him.

Do you think about, like, man, man, I got a pretty nice class I'm going in with. Oh, well, yeah. Pau Gasol. Yeah, Pau, I forgot about Pau. For everybody out there, it's not Paul. It's Pau. I told Pau, I said, in the black community, it's Paul.

But it's Pau. Yeah, yeah. You just dropped that L. Yeah. Out of the way, you got that L. You didn't pick it back up. We like Paul Gasol, Powell, Becky Hammond. Yeah, wow. And so many others.

And so if you know anything about my career, Shannon, the individual is great. Individually, I had to work for everything that I wanted and I got. But the team is where I succeeded. Right. That's what my career, when you look at everything, it's like he was on these great teams. Right. Whether it's the Olympic team, whether it's the team with Shaq,

with LeBron, with all these guys. Right. So to be able to retire and then to be able to go into my next team or my next family would be the Hall of Fame team. Right. I mean, I'm looking like, yo, what other Hall of Fame crew that look like this? I remember telling the guy, the Hall of Fame is the ultimate fraternity.

It's so select. If you a Kappa, no disrespect to them, they got 10,000, 20,000 members. If you an Omega Psi Phi, you a Q-Dog, you got 25,000, 30,000 members. If you an Alpha, you a Sigma, you AKA. Man, think about how many men have played and how few have that jacket you're very elite now there's 7 billion 8 billion people

in the world there's only about 5 600 that got a jacket like yours see I'm ready to play and I ain't I don't even know what sport I'm ready to play I'm just I'm getting warm over here I'm like yeah that's why it's fire you see you done got me hot. Yeah, you right.

What would it be? You see a lot of organizations with their great players. It's not just enough for them to hang their jersey in the arena. They're putting statues outside. You see Dirk just got a statue. You know, the Lakers with Kobe and Shaq and all those greats. What would it mean for D-Wade to have a statue outside the Miami Arena? That's a tough question for me, man.

One, because, yes, when you get done playing your game, when you get done playing this game, hopefully the goal is to become a statue. Right. Right? Like you want to play and become a statue. Right. Right?

Because the greats have a statue. Michael Jordan had a statue. Right. And so, yes, I want those accolades because I saw others have those. Right. But it's also a part of me, too, that's like, that's man-given. Right. It can be taken away by man.

Right. I don't like getting things that can be taken away by man. Right, okay. And so I don't celebrate those and I don't look for those because it's temporary. Right. And so I don't celebrate those and I don't look for those because it's temporary. Right. But, you know, so if it's given to me, I know I earned everything that is to come.

I've earned it already. Right, okay. And so if they decide to give that to me, I mean, it would be amazing. Right. It's a place where people can come to the arena, to Miami. And see it. And see it. And be the first. It's something about being the first.

It will. And being the first will open up the floodgates for you. D statue, LeBron statue, Chris Bosh statue, Alonzo Mone statue. You start building this legacy. I don't know if LeBron will get no statue. I don't know if Pat Riley will let that happen. Who will be the next? Pat Riley will let that happen. But we're talking about that later. So when I was reading that you purchased a minority share in the Utah Jazz, and I'm like, why the hell? Miami Heat, great. Why the hell didn't he purchase a share in that? Why go way out there? How did D. Wade, Wade County, Heat legend, go cross-country and purchase a share in another franchise. Relationships, business, opportunity, you know, at the right time for me. You know, Miami and I, sometimes you got to step away from the career. Right. Too close to the career, too close to not getting some of the things that I wanted.

Right. Not getting some of the things they wanted. And for me, I wanted to step away and be able to build and work on our relationship, which I think we've continued to do. I wanted to be able to support the Heat without feeling that anything... It was an obligation. Without feeling the obligation, without feeling this, whatever I felt in the midst of the business of the game. Right.

And I needed to get rid of that. And so I would have jumped right back in it if I would have came back of the game. Right. And I needed to get rid of that. And so I would have jumped right back in it if I would have came back into the fold. Right. Because I would have been once again in that same mindset of what I'm not doing, what I'm not getting, what conversations I'm not a part of. I want to root for my team.

I want to support Jimmy. I want to support UD. I want to support Spoh without feeling any way that I felt before. Right. And so for me, when it came to basketball, when it came to getting an opportunity to learn what that side is like, I felt it was better for me to learn with someone that I built a relationship with, that I'm closer with from a business standpoint.

Yeah. Because this is business now. Right. This ain't basketball. Get basketball. This is now business. And so I don't have a business relationship in Miami with the ownership group. Not a business relationship.

Right. Relationship in Miami with right the ownership making not a business relationship, right? I have a business relationship with Ryan Smith and what we're doing, you know What we've been able to do in this small period of time. I Could be wrong correct me if I'm wrong Does D way feel he gets the respect and the appreciation that he deserves from the Miami Heat? What do you mean from who in the Miami Heat Is a brand it was he really is? The Miami Heat is a brand. The Heat really is two people.

Mick Harris and Pat Riley. Okay. Because you did leave temporarily. Normally the historically great players don't leave via free. I mean, something happens. Something happened. Yeah. Check me if I'm wrong. I'm sitting back after being an ex-professional athlete,

and I'm saying, man, this man, he took less money to get LeBron. He's taking less money to less money, and you tell him, take less money, and we're going to go get KD. Take less money, we're going to go get X, Y, and Z. Take less money. Okay, I done took less money. You didn't get any of those guys. What you got for your boy now?

Yeah, yeah. I had that mentality at one point. I grown now though this is business right it's a cold world right and so how did it make you feel at the time oh it sucked i left yeah i won three championships wade county and i and i left right um and i, you know, obviously a few different reasons, but it hurt. Yeah. And so I believed. I drunk the Kool-Aid like most of the young players come in. They drive to me.

This is family. This is my city. It ain't yours. It's not yours. And when it's time to make a decision, the business have to make a decision. And unfortunately for me, the decision that I wanted them to make at the time I wanted them to make it, they didn't make. Right.

And so it affected how I felt about everything that I put into what I was told when I came in. Right. I'm a grown man. Right. Now I understand this is business. And so I don't feel a way.

Right. I cannot allow that to stay on my shoulders. I need to carry it like a backpack. Because I learned so much in Miami. So I can't just leave with the negatives. Because the positives outweigh the negatives. Even though the negatives, you know. Still sting.

Yeah, I mean, it's definitely in my bank account. You know what I mean? It's definitely in my bank account. But it still stings in a sense. But the sting is helping me in business. It's helping me in life. So as much as I like the positives that I learned in Miami and all the things that helped me become a man and all the... I got to take the other things that hurt a little bit, too, to come along with it.

Because these things as well, it's helping me become a better businessman. It's helping me ask different questions. It's helping me go into things a certain way. And so it's a lesson out there for everybody. And there's a lesson in it for me. And so I have no ill intent. I come in that arena, and I'm who I am. The same person I am outside the arena is who I am inside the arena with everybody

because I appreciate my time there. How have organizations been able to convince the fans that whatever they do is business? Whatever the player does is out of greed, selfish motivation. I don't understand that. The PR for the organization. They got the best PR person in the world. You leave, you being greedy. They do it. They did what was best for the team.

Well, what about my team? What about the Wade team? Yeah, no. I have no idea how that's... That doesn't make sense. You can get traded. No phone call, no nothing. You no idea how that's, like, that doesn't make sense. Yeah. Right? Like, you can get traded, no phone call, no nothing. Right.

You find out on social media and you're going to get your video. Yeah. And everybody's going to stand up and cheer. Right. But let you leave in free agency. Right. And watch what happens when you come back. Right?

From most guys. Yeah. You're going to get booed. Yes. You're going to be talked about. Mm-hmm. And so it's just the PR. It's the way it's spent.

It's the way it is. Right. And we can come out and we can cry about it as much as we want. Right. But that's just the be talked about. And so it's just the PR. It's the way it's spent. It's the way it is. Right. And we can come out and we can cry about it as much as we want. Right. But that's just the way it is. And so now the players got control in the way that the players have control because the owners still, we know what it is, but the players have more control now.

Correct. And now you see no one likes the way the players are doing it. Right. So ain't no win. Ain't no win for neither side. Right. No one likes the way the players are doing. So ain't no win.

Ain't no win for neither side. Right. When you get in the business, how do you approach the business? You mentioned Ryan Smith. You're in business with him. How do you approach the business aspect? Do you approach it like you did the basketball aspect? You put that kind of time, that kind of effort, that kind of energy?

Because I'm sure to be great, D-Way, you know this, you got to eat, sleep, breathe basketball. So now do you eat, sleep, breathe business? I do. I don't play basketball no more. So my life, besides being a parent and a son and a father and a husband and all these things, business is my life. Right. Right? And so as I like to tell people, I've been spending so much of my time trying to become a hall of fame athlete. And in the midst of that, you have so many people that are put in place to help you along the way. And there's so many things that you don't learn and you don't know. And so when I retired, I didn't know much about

business. Right. I didn't know much about all these things that I'm a part of in business. Right. So I took some time and said, all right, well, let me start learning. And so I need to learn how to invest. Right. You don't invest just because it sounds good. Right. Just because the name good. Yeah, yeah.

That's your money. That's your money. And so when it comes to business, when it comes to a Ryan Smith and these certain individuals that you try to link yourself with, I want to link myself with people who want to teach me. Right. Like who's thirsty, who understands that I want to link myself with people who want to teach me. Like who understands that I want to learn, and you're willing to teach me, and you're

willing to say, come on in this room. Open this book up, and let me show you. And so those are the partners that I look at, because I know I don't know everything. I ain't been to school in 20 years, Shannon. Shannon, I ain't been to school in 20 years. But you made your land ability when you were there. It wasn't like you was going to get a finance or economic degree.

Broadcasting and journalism. But you're right. But you haven't been to school in a while, so you really haven't had to apply yourself like you're having to apply yourself now. Right. And so I, yes, now I know that I can take the things that I learned in sport and I can use those same tools and apply them to how I wake up in the morning, how I work out in the morning, like all the steps that it takes. Because I had those same steps to try to be great in basketball. And the hard part is we want it now.

Right. Yeah. I want to be, I see Magic, I see JG. I want to see Hunter, 800, 900, yeah. We want it, like I want to be, I want to, I see Magic, I see JG. I want to see Hunter 809. I want to be a dude. I want to be a big dude.

I see it, I'm like, ooh, Kevin just sold his company for 100 million. Ooh, this guy, like,

and not ooh, like in the hate, like ooh, like. That could be me. Because that's how I look at it. Any time I see

somebody do something, I'm like, man, that could be me. I wonder how he did. Let me ask you this. This is what I really want to know.

In business, are people willing to help you in business I'm like, man, that could be me. I wonder how he did. Let me ask you this. This is what I really want to know. In business, are people willing to help you in business? Because like in basketball, were guys willing to give you information that could help D-Wade become a better player? So are people in business willing to give you information? Like guys on the

court? Like guys in the NBA? Yeah. Once they realized that I was a player. Right. So once they took me serious. Okay. Business is the same same thing once they realize that you're serious about this, right? And it's not just something you're gonna be jacking off the time, right? Like like people that have way more money than you and I was that there's not sitting here They don't have a lot of time, right? You get a meeting with somebody you get 15 to 30 minutes, right? Don't get three hours money to the time is money And so they need to know that you're serious.

Right. Just like the same thing when it came to sport. Right. And so I try to be serious. I try to walk in with the knowledge and the information and questions. Right. And questions and questions and questions because I know I don't know everything. Right.

You're the host. We were talking on camera. You're like, never in a million years did I think I was going to be a game show host. No. But here we are. What was it like? What made you have, how did you come up with the idea of saying, you know what? Game show host, that's what I'm going to be.

It definitely didn't happen. It didn't happen like that? No, it happened like this, okay? It was during COVID. We on the Zoom. When I retired, I got into TV. I did TNT for three years. Right.

I had a production company, 59th and Prairie, that I started with Warner Media. Right. And so they came to me. We on the Zoom with the whole team. And they're like, hey, we got this amazing concept of this show called The Cube that's been filming in the UK. I believe at that time it was 10, 11 years. Right. And so we talked about the show.

I got a chance to look at the deck. I got a chance to go look at all the YouTubes. And I was like, man, I love this show. I want to be a executive producer. This is great. Right. So we shook talked about the show. I got a chance to look at the deck. I got a chance to go look at all the YouTubes. And I was like, man, I love this show. I want to be executive producer. This is great. Right. So we shook hands on EP. Before we got the call, eventually they said, oh, and we would love if you can host. And I was like, me?

Host? I started sweating. No, I said I want to be a producer. Executive producer. Like, you know, and then, so I took a few days. And how it works is this. If I'm scared to do something, I ain't talking about like bungee jumping scared. I'm talking about something that's attainable, something that I want to do.

Like I actually want to challenge myself. Right. When I retired, the first thing I did was I took voice lessons. Okay. Right? Because I knew, I was like, man, one day I may have this, I may be in front of the camera. I will have a microphone in my face. Let me learn how to project my voice.

Right. Let me take this Chicago tongue that I have. Let me learn how to get through my words. Right. Right? And so I was already prepared and prepping myself for an opportunity. But when it came, I was scared. Right.

And then it took me a couple of days and I was like, you can't be scared. Right. And so I said, I'll do it. As if everything you thought it would be? More. I actually didn't think I'd like it as much. I enjoy getting an opportunity. I spend about three hours per episode

with each contestant, each family. And I get a chance to sit there for three hours and one, get to know individuals that I will never get to know. Right. Right? Two, I get to, you know, to be able to help people get over this fear. Right. I see fear when they're in that cube.

I see nervousness. And so this is a time where as a leader, I get to step in. I get to lead. So it's so many different things that you take from sport or you take from your life. And in this show, in that three hours that I'm sitting in front of them, I'm trying to help them accomplish something that I know is way harder than they think it is. They don't know what the game is really like. And also too, it's going to change communities. It's going to change their lives. And so I have an opportunity to be a host of a game show that you're going to see is going to change the people's experiences, but it also has the opportunity to change your life. $10,000, $20,000, $30,000, $50,000 changed

people's lives. And so for me, man, it was like I want to bring joy to families. I want to bring joy to living rooms when this pandemic ends. And that's why I jumped into the Cube. And I'm lucky that we're on our second season. TBS brought us back, and hopefully we keep going. Let me ask you this. For those that haven't watched the Cube, what's the concept behind it? So the concept is you have

probably 60 70 games or versions of And they all and they all can take place inside of this cube, right? Right. It's a plexiglass. It's this big plexiglass that looks a little different than this and inside this cube which brings its own like once you go in and that door closed it brings its own level of like Oh, okay. everything got small. Right, right. You were closed. Now I'm in closed.

Now my breathing is a little different. Right. And so it just brings its own different challenges of all these different games. Right. Right? It's individual games. It's games where you tag your teammate in, y'all got to come in, y'all got to do it together. Right.

And the hard part about it is, it may be a game, and I'll just explain it like this, it may be a game where you sit up here and you got a ball or piece of paper up and let's say you got to throw it in the garbage can. Right. You say, I can do that. D-Wade, that's not hard. Shannon, how many lives

is it going to take you to do that? How many times are you going to try to throw it and make it? It may take you four. Right. Now you've lost four lives.

And so to be able to play this game, you get nine lives, but you got seven games. No, seven games, not as long as I can do it. Right. You may spend four lives

on one game. On $1,000. Right. And so the precision that you got to have, the ability to be able to have no ego. Right. Because some games when you come in that queue that you are not good for, which your partners may be. Right. There's certain games that I know that you got to blindfold and you got to walk through these standing cones.

Right. Standing, your shoulder's too wide. Right. You can't do it. You got to tap in somebody else. Right, right. So, man, I just, I love it. I love being able to sit across from individuals that I never met.

And by the end of that three hours, like, we've connected. And hopefully I've done my job as a host to help them, you know, reach their goal. I'm looking at some of your hosts in the second season, your wife, Gabrielle Union, LaLa, Shaq, Monshumper. What is the guest, what was Shaq like? LaLa, Shaq, Monshumper. What is the guess? What was Shaq like? Because you know Shaq thinks he can do everything.

Shaq bust the cube open. He fell through the back of the cube. I didn't even know you can do that. I didn't know you can go through the cube. That was Shaq. We had him there. It was his birthday. Shaq didn't know what was going on. He showed up. He's like, man, Flash, what I'm doing?

I'm like, just enjoy it. Just enjoy it. And then, like, he didn't want to stop. Right? He kept asking for more tries and more tries. I'm like, Shaq, you can't keep getting more tries. He's like, I need another life. I'll buy another life.

So Shaq was Shaq, man. He brought a lot of excitement to it. He broke a lot of our games. Right. So, like, really, he was like, there's one of them you'll see on the commercials where he's getting these balls out. Right. He broke the sides.

Shaq don't realize that. He don't know. He don't know. But, man, I, you know, like, this was the first year we tried, like, adding celebrities. Celebrities, right. Because we had a lot of people calling,

hitting us, saying, we can do that. That's easy. And so he's like alright so come on to the show right so we had a few come and try it and it wasn't as easy as they thought I'm looking at mellow Carmelo Anthony just retired yeah what advice would you give him about retire about retirement um what can he expect you can expect it to be different He can expect it to be on him.

You know, I know you think basketball is on you, but you got a team, you got a lot of teammates. You got coaching staff, you got trainers, you got everybody to help get you to the gym. Right. Every day. You don't have nobody like that in retirement. Right. You still have your team, you still have the people that love you,

but, like, it ain't the same. It ain't the same. And so every day you got to, them feet got to hit that ground. Right. And what you want to accomplish in that day has to be on you, and it feet got to hit that ground. Right. And what you want to accomplish in that day has to be on you and it has to be set by you. Okay. That's the one thing I learned. Like when I play, we got wake-up calls on the road.

Right. I don't get no wake-up call. Nobody telling me to get up and work out, to eat healthy, to do all these things. That's just basic. That is without the work. This is just how I'm going to maintain my body after retirement. Right.

No one's telling you that. Right. And so, you got to realize that it's on you. You know what I mean? Like, when I played with the team, I went and got my chest scans

and my EKGs because it was scheduled. Right. Now I got a schedule. You know what I mean? So, once you realize, like, I woke up one day and I said,

oh, so this all on me? All right. Right. This familiar for me then. And so he got it. Do you think Dwight Howard should have been on the same field? He only got 75 slots. There'd be, what, 5,000 guys that play in the NBA?

Maybe a little bit more? Mm-hmm. 1,000%. I said the same thing. I don't know how a guy, he was a dominant big. In multiple years. Three-time defensive player of the year. But not just he got because he was big right he was no he was a dominant he was dominant i i really don't understand like i know a lot of people have a lot of things to say about

dwight howard as his personality or whatever people like to take a shot right i mean we all out here everybody can take a shot at whatever they want. But when it comes to that man, actual work, his body of work. Right. Like or dislike, he got the backpack on, he tried hook shots. But when the game, when they jump the ball. It's undeniable. It's undeniable.

He took that team to the finals. He did. This is, I mean, and I'm not saying that about, you can pick a lot of guys to be on this team. It's all subjective. It's all subjective. Right. Right? Depending on who's picking. I'm saying about you can pick a lot of guys to be on this team. It's all subjective. It's all subjective. Right. Right.

Depending on who's picking. But when you're talking about this, this generation, these last 25 years. Right. How many names can you think of? What Dwight Howard name is not in there. And I know T-Max should be in there.

Right. And other great players. But that was the Dwight Howard one for me was tough. Yeah. How difficult is it for you? You have a son. LeBron has a son. Now Melo. LeB is it for you? You have a son. LeBron has a son, not mellow. LeBron has two sons. You have son. We're going to talk about the later have a son play. How difficult is it for your child that bears your last name to play the sport

that you play? Gotta be tough because you know, you're getting your dad would have made that your dad would have done this. Your dad would have made that your dad would have done this your dad would have did that man. I didn't have that pressure. Did you have the pressure about how to hold a brother? You had it from your brother? Yeah. I never had that pressure.

Like I had an older brother was good. He wasn't Hall of Fame. He wasn't at the level of the Sharks. He wasn't at that level. And so I have no idea what Zaire is experiencing from that standpoint. Right. And I can't act like I know. But for me, and to me, like none of that really matters when you're in between those lines.

Right. And so having a dad with this name or in this sport can get you in the door. Right. Can get you looks. Right. And also can get people to talk about you. Yes. It works both ways. So for me,

it's about what you do when you get between the lines. That's what all determines if you shut people up or you keep them talking. And so as I don't understand my son's journey and I sympathize with, you know, I go and I look at him and I'm like, let me see what kind of hate he getting.

I'm like, ooh. I sympathize with this young man who gets hate for nothing. No one knows him. He's on his own journey in life. Right. And he's been, you know, whether it's me, whether it's Bronny, whether it's this player, this player, he's getting compared to them. And I'm just, that's life at the same time, right? You're going to be compared to a lot of different people

if you want to do something great. I had Ken Griffey on one time, and he said he kind of, he always saw his, go see his son play. He said, but it was tough on him. He said, because if his son made a mistake or he struck out, the people in the stands would say, well, you're not your dad. And Griffey one day said, he said, well, name five players who are. Ooh.

Ooh. So. Ooh. Put that in my notes. We get that to my son. Yeah. He said, well, name five players who are. But D, just imagine, how do you think your life would,

how different would your life have been? Like today's kid with the social media aspect, high school, college. You did have some social media later in your MBA, but I don't think you started with it. How different would your life have been? It's too much access. I got four kids now.

It's too much access. You better have more than that. Too much access. You better have more than that. Too much access, Shaq. It is. You can get to anybody. You got everybody's number. You know what it was, D-Wade? Back when you and I was growing up in high school and in college,

if you saw a beautiful girl in Miami, you don't know if she was from Miami or where she was from. You might not ever see her again. Now you just go on social media. You're like, oh, shit, I can get there. Well, I can get it here. Listen, I'm glad social media wasn't around. As I was a young boy trying to focus on accomplishing something that only a few can accomplish. You know how focused and locked, you can't have distractions. You can't. Not to be great like you guys were.

Like a LeBron. Like a Mahomes or Tom Brady or you talk D-Wade is different. I give these kids a lot of credit to be able to juggle both. Like I understand the great things about social media.

We get the benefits. But on the other end if you're trying to accomplish what I know a lot of these young men say or what they're trying and they get up every day to work their ass off and accomplish, this distraction is going to get in the way at some point when you're trying to reach that penthouse level in your sport. Right. Right?

You can get to the first level. You can get in the lobby. Yeah. You're in a hotel. Right. But there's a special key card that goes to the penthouse. Right. Right. Like you can get you can get to the first level. You get in the lobby. Yeah. You know, the hotel. Right. But there's a special key card that goes to the penthouse. Right. And it's a lot of sacrifice that you've got to have to get to that penthouse level. And a lot of guys won't get there because of certain things. That's a distraction.

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Subscribe today and you'll immediately be smarter and funnier than your friends. And who doesn't want that? Listen now on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. How many did you have to leave a whole lot of homeboys? Because everybody, you know, people

say they sacrifice, and you sacrifice a lot. Like, asboys? Because everybody, you know, people say they sacrifice, and you sacrifice a lot. Like, as far as your time, you know, you didn't go to, you missed a lot of your kids' things, recitals and piano lessons or whatever the case may be. You sacrificed a lot of that. But sometimes I'm noticing guys won't sacrifice a homeboy. Man, he was there from the beginning. Man, I can't let my homeboy go, but he holding you back.

He putting you in a situation where you can't climb to the top because he's holding you back yeah was it difficult for you to leave some of the homeboys even though you're like yeah bro we get we grew up together but where i'm ascending to it was and it is right especially when you're young when you're young man you're growing up and you're growing up in an in-providence community All you got is your homeboy right your family, right? And so y'all all have the same dream together right to a point where your dream become everybody's true, right? Right when you're the one who's and so man when I made it man My whole everybody was we made it right we in here, right?

And so you carry that you carry that mentality like, yo, we all here. We all made it. Right. And you try to allow access for everybody. Right. Because if you're that person, you try to allow access and bring everybody with you. Right. But we all know how that's going to work.

Right. It's only going to be, man, if you're lucky, you'll find a Maverick Carter in a bunch. If you're lucky. We're all ready. If you're lucky, you'll find someone who wants more than what just they're given right yeah because everybody when you get into the league you get in that situation everybody loves what they love the sneakers they get right they love the outfits they get right how many people you're going to find is going to go and be like yo thank you for for getting us here now i

gotta go get mine right away right anytime i once it's over right and it doesn't happen often and a lot of it too is you are not in a position Where you come to enough to tell these individuals? Hey Man, I might be able to buy you a gift to say, you know, thanks for being my homeboy Go watch right ego even a car because we got it like that But I can't take care of your entire life, right? That is that is your for your entire life, right? And so that's a hard conversation to have when y'all all have a dream. Yeah, we all grew up, man. I knew you wouldn't have anything, man. You used to eat at my house. You know, you sleep on my couch.

Yeah. Because you feel like, man, I feel an obligation. Yeah. And you don't got to most most time people get rid of stuff like that is when they got a woman to come in and she's like, oh, he can't be sleeping on the couch. Right. Your homeboy can't have to keep that because that's how it is. Right. And it can't it took my wife to come in and be like she was older woman. It came in like, what's going on in this Fred house? Y'all got going on. Right. What's up in this dorm room? Right. You know what I'm saying? And I kind of had to like, oh, you're right. I'm with a grown woman now. I had to clear shop a little bit. And so sometimes it takes certain people to come in to show you like, yo, like, what are you doing? Right. And, you know, hopefully it's not something that happens that's in a negative form to make you be like, oh, I gotta get rid of.

Right. And it's not about getting rid of her. It's like, hey, like I got here because X, Y, and Z. We all here. Hey, you want to go to school? You want to do something for yourself? You want to do something for your family, for your kids one day? You're gonna have a daughter. Like, you know, I used to talk to my brother, say, you got a little girl.

What you gonna show her? She looking at you to see how it is, what man she wants. So what are you going to do? You don't want to, you don't want her to be like, oh, he get money from Uncle Dwayne when he needs something. You want her to know that you get up every day, you go work, you go grind, and make sure she has what she needs, and that's what her man should do, whatever it is. However you want to raise your child. And so that's how I approached it, eventually.

Right. You got no dog in the fight. There's a lot been going on over the last three, four months with Ja Morant. If you as a player, former player, what advice could you, what advice would you give him? And what advice would you give him if you were his father? This was your first Ja Morant, Dwyane Wade's son. Yeah. What advice, what would you tell him? I mean, that's that's obviously a tough question but you know I what I try to do with my kids it's like I don't like I'm not trying to

I'm not gonna act like life is not gonna happen right okay you know I'm saying I'm not gonna act like some mistakes are not gonna happen okay try to minimize them you try them right that's our job to try to minimize but they're gonna happen actually you need some're going to happen. Correct. Actually, you need some of them to happen. Right, okay. So I'm not going to make this about shame on you.

Okay, this is a part of this journey that we're on. This is something that we can use as a learning lesson and learning tool. And my question to anybody is, what do you want for your life? Right. And so if you sit and tell me, because I know what Ja probably wants, he wants to be one of the greatest. Correct. Now, he wants to be one of the greatest. Correct. Now, you want to be one of the greatest.

Okay. Now let me open up the books to show you what the greats do and how they go by their business and how they separate this and that. Like, you know what I'm saying? It's more so of showing, all right, let me open up the book. Who are your favorite players? Oh, I love Kobe. I love LeBron.

I love MJ. Let me show you what the guys that have the statue, this is how they did it. And look, they went through stuff. Right. All these guys, all of us go through something. Right. But look how they, and so it's just about showing a man, like he's, Ja's 23 years old. 23.

He's a young man who's supposed to make mistakes. Now, do we want him to make the mistakes that he made? Of course we don't, but that's not our, we don't get to determine that. Right. And so it's on all of us. We don't want to make the same mistake twice. No, we don't. But if you make it twice, we don't want to make it three times. We don't get rid of you because you make it twice. That's not how this works. I like this. I like this. We can't do that. And if I'm your father, that's not, that's not my ministry. I'm here. I'm here for the long haul. Right. And so if I'm your father, okay, you've

made the same mistake twice. You know what? I've done the same thing. I've made the same mistake twice in other instances as well. Right. It just wasn't in front of the whole world right and so that's how i go in and that's how i parent my kids it's not i don't go in with shame on you because i know that when you got to make certain decisions you can have a lapse for one second it ain't got to be a whole 24 hours it can be one second lapse changes a lot changes a lot and i've had i've had them right and so you know i just think like i like I don't know Ja like that, so I wouldn't pick up the phone and be like, yo, young fella, he's not listening to me. Right.

Necessarily like that. That's not my ministry with him. But as someone who wants to see him succeed, go to the level that, man, Ja Morant is one of my favorite players to watch. If I'm going to spend my cash, Ja's on my top three players that I'm going to go spend my money on. Right. And so, you know, my conversation with him would be that.

What do you want for your future? One of your classmates, teammates, contemplating retiring. LeBron. Who? LeBron. And you want it on here. Let me get you another one. Let me get you another one.

Yeah, go there. Go ahead. Give me that. Give me that. Yeah. You're talking about the man just had 40, 10, go ahead. Go ahead. Give me that. Give me that. Yeah, you know. You're talking about the man just had 40, 10, and 9 with his last break? Yeah, yeah.

He's like, you know, hey. Okay, okay. I was going to make sure we were talking about the same. Yeah, we were talking about the same guy. But he said, you know, my body getting weary, man. You know, it's getting harder and harder for me to sum it up. You know, I'm playing on this 10. Let me get me a little sweet there. Isn't it getting harder and harder for him to sum it up?

And, you know, I ain't getting no younger. I need a little help here and there. So you didn't buy the part that LeBron was thinking about. All my money's still in my pocket. I ain't buying nothing. It's the moment after the game, man. He's frustrated. It's a lot.

Like, you know, like, obviously, what they came back from, shout out to the Lakers for making the moves that they made to help them make that push. And so, yeah, the conversation in the locker room may not be as funny no more because you don't have a lot in common with the next generation. Right, right.

Right, you get tired of the travel. The travel gets old because you ain't traveling around the world. You ain't going to South of France. Yeah, how many times has Ron got to play in the Sacramento? Go to Utah? It's only so many times that you want to keep doing that same route. So yes, when you look at

all of that, it beats you down mentally. Physically, we know what it is. He's a physical specimen but at the same time, physically, it's going to beat him down. Right. Okay. That's it. I don't know.

I don't know. I ain't going to ask him. I ain't going to say, bro, you for real? That's not my goal. But, like, I looked at it. I was like, okay, I ain't buying that. I know what after the season right now, would they ask you this question in this moment.

Right. But also know when he get away and he go ahead to Mexico or he go away to the south of France and he on his yacht for the summer, he going to look around and be like, okay, he on his yacht for the summer. Yeah. He going to look around and be like, okay, the king coming back. I'm getting ready. How many more years do you think LeBron can play at this level? It's crazy because we've never, nobody has ever been at their peak,

regardless of sport, as long as this man has been in his prime, so to speak. Yeah. Nobody's had a 20-year peak. Yeah. His injury. If he doesn't get injured he takes care of himself i mean he's a look at him yeah first of all yeah let's look at him all right one of his legs is two of mine put together he ain't built like a normal person right okay so that was god gave him that blessing yeah you built different right and so he has the

mental to continue to keep the mental strong. Right. That's one of the hardest parts. If you physically can play. Right. Mentally, you lose it quicker than even physical sometimes. Like mentally, I was done. Really?

I had two, three more years at a certain level. I could average about 12 to 15 a game. Right. I had the team off the bench. But mentally, because of the injuries, because of all the things. It beat you down things it beat me down where it wasn't i love the game i'm i can't wait to watch the game right but mentally and so lebron has been able to mentally tell himself you're not tired right you're not injured you're like he's

been able to mentally do it and i i got a chance to watch for four years like he wouldn't if he was hurt he never would he couldn't even talk that language in front of him like even it bro you hurt no i'm not hurt your ankle hurt no i'm not hurt because the mind is strong right his mind and so that's why i was strong that's one of his strongest tools it's his mind we know it from an iq standpoint right you and i look at him like oh man he has a crazy iq right no he intelligent, strong mind. And so that allows him to keep going. And so long as his mind stays strong, which is obviously gets harder and harder every year. Right. And his body stays strong.

I mean, he can average 20 plus for the next couple of years. Let's just say for the sake of argument, he doesn't miss those games with the groin in his first year in L.A. He doesn't hurt that ankle and miss. Let's just say for the sake of argument. Oh, you can't say that. If I don't have three knees, are we doing ifs now? You have three knees. Let's just say for the sake of argument. You can't say that. If I don't have three knees, are we doing ifs now? You have three knees, sir? You're in the league? Yeah.

I had one in college and two in the league. Are we doing ifs now? Okay. Because we're doing ifs then. Let's talk. Okay. How about this here? We're not going to do a year if. Okay. All right. If the ankle doesn't get hurt this year, the tendon this year, do you think the outcome is different

between them and Denver? I don't, I think the outcome is different between the Lakers. Wow. With him getting that time away, actually, we got a chance to see them grow as a team outside of LeBron. Okay, okay.

We got to see AD grow at that level. Obviously, when he on the floor, we was like top five player in the league. We got a chance to see what the D-Lo can bring and what Ulster Reese can bring. He actually really grew in LeBron's absence. The best thing that happened to the Lakers was LeBron's absence because it allowed them to not have to depend on him. Because when you've got a great player, you depend on that great player.

And so they had the rock, and they had something to play for in the middle of that. And so I think it was great for the Lakers. And that allowed him to come back. And if you see him when he came back, he was a different player than he was where he went out. Even though his numbers were still big, he wasn't leading the charge as much. Right. Right. He was allowing Reeves. He was allowing AD and all these guys to do their thing. And he was just kind of a shadow box until he needed to be LeBron. And so it was beautiful to watch. D-Wade, I think you did something not a whole lot of guys can do. Sacrifice?

You sacrificed. Now, it's one thing to sacrifice if we come together. But I'm already established here. I've already won a finals MVP. I've already the man here. And you're coming in my house and asking me the man here and you asking me to come you coming in my house and ask you to share you want to sit at the head of the

table when that's my head of the table. Now you want me to get out of my bed. You won't get the big bad. How were you able to do that? Everybody can't do that. The way everybody say that now, you know, everybody get in front of the camera and they say, oh, yeah, you know, now, you of the camera and they say, oh yeah, I sacrificed.

All day. But you know deep down, everybody can't do what you did. How and why? Well, why is easy. I wanted to win. Everybody say they want to win. Well. They be lying to me. Okay.

All right. We say it. Now, what's the action? And so, I wanted to win. Right. And the reason I wanted to win, because when I came in the game, this is what was said. Right. To be in this breath, in this conversation, you have to win championships. Right.

Every generation is different. The conversation surrounding guys is different. I didn't have the Steph Curry range. I didn't have the Dame. Like, I wasn't going to put up 30,000 points. Right. So for me to put my name and sign my name in heaven, I wanted my game to be an accumulation of it all. Right.

But it needs to be led by winning. Correct. For me. Right. And so that wasn't a facade. And when the opportunities came, I always put myself in a position to do that. Right. And so, you can ask anybody who work with me.

Maybe most people who walk in a room with me in meetings, and it could be a meeting for Wade Enterprises. I don't sit at the head of the table. I like to sit in the middle. I like to sit in the seats in the middle. I like to be amongst everybody and have conversations with everybody. I don't want to be at the head. It's lonely at the head of the table. Right. And so, when LeBron came and CB came, I was like. I don't want to be at the head. It's lonely at the head of the table. Right.

And so when LeBron came and CB came, I was like, oh, you want to sit at the head? Cool, I'm going to go where I'm comfortable with. Because here's the thing, I haven't been a star my whole life. Right. I played so many roles my entire basketball career. And I think that's one of the reasons why I look at myself as one of the greatest players, because I didn't do it one way.

I showed you how to be great in so many different ways and so many different times. My game changed do it one way. Right. I showed you how to be great in so many different ways and so many different times. My game changed and evolved so much. Right. Right? And so to me, that's greatness as a basketball player. Right. And I wanted to challenge myself throughout my career to see if I could do stuff different.

Right. Like, okay, 30 points a game, led the league in scoring. Did that, what's next? Finals MVP, got that, did, like, I'm all about, like, what's next? And so when the opportunity came in 2010 I was like okay this is another

challenge for me to play with somebody I never thought I'd play with somebody I admire so much but how can I play with a guy that I know is ball dominant

when I become ball dominant take on my challenge and so I just you learn how to play off the ball I learn you see the back cuts

yeah you got a bunch you got a bunch yeah yeah yeah, you. Did you? Change my game. You like Tony Parker and Ginobili with all this. You run an old Princeton offense.

Back door to everybody. Change my game. And you know what? To go back real quick, I'm sorry because I didn't say this. When you talk about the Hall of Fame, when you talk about Dirk, yes, change the game for his position. Right. Right?

Like right now you got people. The stretch. You got people in the gym right now trying to get that one tight hip up. Right. Tony Parker. I felt like Tony Parker was an amazing point guard, but he was like a, he was like a big man because when he got in the post, his footwork was crazy. When he got into paint, his footwork was crazy. Right. Like he got you up in numbers, all that. Right. And so just, just amazing to see like a point guard. But when he got to the paint, he became one of the best big men in the game. Right. No, a lot of people don't know that. Powell, when I play, I play with Powell one time and we got invited to Barack's President Barack Obama's 49th birthday party at the White House.

Right. And I got a chance to play with Powell. Kobe was like, don't get used to it. chance to play with Powell. Kobe was like, don't get used to it. Because Powell was hitting me with I was like, oh, Kobe, this is easy. I got to throw the shack. You're actually getting it back. So

I just wanted to throw that out about the Hall of Famers, man. Just so honored to be in a class with guys who changed the games for their position. I think I was one of the guys who came in and evolved it. Evolved. Evolved the game in my position and gave it just a little different look. Where are you on this?

Because somehow it's gotten skewed over the years. Because they've taken away from it. It's like if you don't have a ring, you can't be great. D-Wade, I believe you can be a great player and not have a ring. Because there are players that have multiple rings that aren't great players. And there are great players that don't have any rings so when did when did this happen that if you don't have a ring you're not a great player what when did that happen was it 2005 when did this happen i don't know when it happened um and you know man a lot of people have

what we have right here a lot of people have a microphone okay and that microphone is powerful right it is and so someone said this along the way and you said enough people started believing like yeah it makes no sense right like here here it is okay so i won a championship in nba i didn't win in college right they went in high school right so forth and so on so does that make me greater than carmelo because carmelo won in college. Carmelo probably won a couple state championships. Right? Like, it's different times we have an opportunity because our talent, because our team, where that time is there for you.

Right. Right? And you try to strike. That doesn't happen just because you're a great player. Right. The organization got to do their part. Right. Right?

You got to put the right team around you. You got to put the right talent around you. Like, if you look at Allen Iverson and the Philadelphia 76ers, they put the – they structured the right team around you. You got put the right talent around like if you look at Allen Iverson and Philadelphia 76ers They put the they structured the right team around him to get this man a chance to be his to be his individual Great self take the ball out And they did they roll hey you block shots at the rim Yep, X know if he thought to you you better shoot in 10 to 15 feet only right like they play their roles Right and so but it took the organization. It took the gym.

It took everybody to make sure there was the right talent around AI. Right. So you're telling me AI's not great if he don't make the finals run or if they don't bring in Mutombo, if they don't bring in these guys to open the floor for him, to defend for him, all these things? And so the concept of a great player is not great because he didn't win a ring.

Everybody can't win a ring. You'll have a different champion every year. But now the rings would be meaningless. If everybody won one, what's the value in that? There's no value in it. That's why it's such premium on it because everybody can't get one. It doesn't matter how great you are. You will not walk away with a ring just because you're great.

It's players that are way greater than me, and they won't walk away with three rings. That doesn't mean that I'm greater than them or that I'm better than them because I have three rings, right? Or because another player has one or two. Because you got players that got rings that ain't even, didn't do nothing to get those rings. So they make them, that's not

how it goes. Now I understand that when you want to see. We're making the field, okay. When you start talking about that pyramid, okay, first, second, third, rings matter. Well, because now here we go, let's go back to the hotel. It's a different room. Yeah. Right? Like it that pyramid, okay, first, second, third, rings matter. Well, because here we go. Let's go back to the hotel. It's a different room. Yeah.

Right? Like, it's a, hey, we all great. Yes. What'd you say? One ring group is going over here? Okay. What'd you say? Who got three rings going?

You know how it go. Right. And so I got a card for the three rings. I can have conversations with a couple guys in there. But I can't go to the four or five. There's certain rooms I can't even go in. So it's okay. Doesn't take away nothing from your greatness.

We can all sit in a room of the top 75, top 100. But then they're going to separate you from the rooms of champions. But your team's going to be in there with you. They don't bring champions in one person because it's not golf, it's not tennis, and so forth. So your team got to come in. The 06 Miami Heat. And so if they haven't put a team around you that allows you to be there or if your timing hasn't hit, it's timing.

Michael Jordan came around and messed everybody's timing up. Yes. LeBron James has been in the finals 10 to 12 years. How many opportunities do you get? And so I hate that notion because that doesn't mean that Dame or – and I'm not saying he won't get one, but right now, that Dame is not – you can't tell me Dame is not one of the greatest players that we've seen play this game. I

agree. If he walk away with no rings, does that take away what we've watched and Dame do? No, not for me. Not individually. Right. It just means it doesn't. Now, we know if he got the right team, he's not selfish. No. We know Dame gonna make sure other guys eat, right? Yeah. But he hasn't had the team that has allowed him at the right time to be better than the Lakers. I told him he needed to be more selfish when he had that 71. I said, you need to be more selfish.

You need to have got 80 that night. They started telling me like that. But let me ask you this. When you play with LeBron, you see him from a distance. Was he better up close than you thought even you thought he was from a distance? 1000%. He was better in practice than I thought he was in the games. What? I I didn't get a chance to to to watch the other goats. Right. Cuz there's multiple goats depending on what era you're in. But I did get a chance to watch this era, one of this era's goats which is LeBron. Kobe's one and LeBron's one. And when I saw

him in practice, it was a separator for me of good to great to GOATs. You cannot do the things that he did and how he did it. And so... So we take it for granted? Of course. Of course we do.

And it's not that we won't have another great player to come along. We just will not have another LeBron James. We're still talking about Jordan all these years later. Yes. Because we took it for granted in the moment. And now it's like when you watch the dunk contest. When you're there sometimes, you can't see what really happened.

Right. You got everybody looking for the instant replay. Slow motion, slow it down so you actually see what happened. Right. That got to look, everybody looking for the instant replay. Right. Slow motion, slow it down so you can actually see what happened. Right. That's what happens when your career ends. As the LeBron career ends, we're going to actually

start looking and seeing what happened and what he actually did. Right. And now we're going to be like, oh. Because right now,

we in it and we're seeing it in fast motion and we can't really see everything that he's accomplishing. If they were to redraft the 2000 and your class,

the 2003 class, obviously LeBron's going to go number one. Where's D-Wade going? If they redraft, so we had LeBron won, Darko, Melo, CB, you. If they redraft, so we redrafted. Like redrafted after

the career, like what point are we redrafting in? Like now as we're sitting here, or? Yeah, where we redraft, what point are we redrafting in? Like, now as we're sitting here? Or... Yeah, you know what? Yeah, let's... I think even if we redraft and LeBron's going to go number one. We agree with that. That's a consensus.

So, yeah, we go back and look at everybody's career. Okay. Where you think you're going? Where I should have went, probably, if you could do it. To Detroit? To Denver. Denver. So you should have been the third pick.

Yeah, Melo should have been the second pick. And Chris Bosh was the fourth pick, but, you know, when it comes to bigs, it's about what team needs that kind of big. Right, right. So, obviously, Toronto needed them. Miami Heat needed a big. They would have drafted Chris Bosh if Toronto didn't take them. I wouldn't have went to the Heat.

If you do it all over, I would probably go third to Denver. There's been a lot of speculation. I think Mello brought it up, so don't get mad at me. Mello said He said don't get mad at me. Don't get mad at me think Melo brought it up. So don't get mad at me. Melo said He said don't get mad at me.

Don't get mad at me. What more will my guy Melo say? Melo said he should have been rookie of the year. He should have been rookie. I heard that. So I didn't try to start nothing. He said it. Well, he said Elyse Cole. It's an argument. Yeah. He had an argument then and he has an argument now.

Takes nothing away from LeBron getting the record here. But let's look at what Melo did over there in the Western Conference. Okay, he had 21 points a game, six rebounds a game, almost three assists, shot 44% from the floor, and his team made the playoff. On a playoff team? Playoff team. Okay.

LeBron was 21, 21.9, five and a half rebounds, six assists, shot 43% from the floor. Team didn't make the playoffs. Co-rookie of the year. It should have been. Because they did it for Grant Hill and Jason Kidd. Yeah. Y'all showed us that y'all could do it.

Right. Co-rookie of the year. Right. If we're going by the numbers and how everything is. Right. Like, yeah, LeBron had more assists. Yeah. But when you look at it, he's doing this on a ready-made playoff team,

which is harder. Right. LeBron's doing it on an 18-year-old kid that's coming in to save a franchise. Right. They both deserved it. Right. Yeah. Melo ain't lying.

Yeah, it could have been. Okay. Listen, Melo ain't trying to take nothing away from Bron. Right. Melo was like, but I know I put the same effort, level of work in. But y'all didn't want to give it to him. He was in Denver. They didn't want to mess with Mello. He was wearing the do-rags.

They didn't want to mess with Mello at that time. But, I mean, if you look at it, at that time, it's been a few times where there's all-star games where at certain times you're like, oh, two people should. They deserve that. And it's okay to co-ed sometimes. You think they'll be co-MVPs? Well, I don't know.

The game's changing so much. Would they do one from the East versus one from the West? No. Why not? Well, I mean, they don't... You know what? Baseball do it, have an American League MVP, a National League MVP. Football don't do it. You have one MVP. I don't think they'll

do that in basketball. But it's not – why not? It's not equal. You don't play every team equally. You don't – like, it's not – so why are you giving out a – You think the West plays different than the East? Yeah. They play at a different time for sure. No, they do.

It's different. It's like, why not have an East versus – like, I understand how it's been. But if we break this down right now and all these new awards that's coming up, why not reimagine this thing? They ain't really got no new award. They just gave them some names. You know, you got the Lab Bird and the Magic Doctor Award. You got the Bob Coo.

No, but you get MVPs for the Eastern Conference Finals. I didn't get an MVP for the Eastern Conference Finals. Yeah, you're right. I just got it for the NBA Finals. So, like, there are new awards now added. It's more, you got more. Man, yeah, LeBron was showing up even unquestioned. LeBron got 10, we have 10 Eastern Conference Finals.

Yeah, it'll be a lot. Like, you'd get some scoring time. They're giving all these awards. They're giving Clutch Awards. You know how many times in the fourth quarter I was the leading scorer? You know how many awards I have? Wow. So if we're reimagining things, then let's reimagine it.

Let's get the MVP out for the East and the MVP out for the West. Wow. Shaq comes to Miami. You're already solidified as a player. How easy was it for you? How accepting were you of Shaq comes to Miami you're already solidified as a player how easy was it for you how accepting were you of Shaq like man, we getting Shaq it's Shaq I would be a fool

I would have been a fool and I would still be a fool if I didn't come in all ears my ears open, my eyes buck wide and listening to everything one of the greatest players, I mean, at that time, he already had three rings. Right.

One of the 50 greatest players of all time. Right. So far and so on. So I was like this. Yes. Yes. So when he said, Flash, hey, this is why I want the ball right here. Right here.

Oh, yeah. Listen, he let, Shaq is a very honest man to me, and our relationship is a one-two punch. Right. He came in, he sat down just like this. We sat down and it was very candid, it was very short. He was like, listen, Flash, this is your team. Wait, it wasn't Flash yet.

Yeah. He eventually got to that. I'm going to help you become one of the greatest to play this game. Right. I'm going to help you be a superstar. When I ask for the ball, throw it to this hand. It was a, we had a real easy relationship. If Shaq did it like

this, to that right hand, turn five, give Shaq the ball. What you want? You want to lie, big fella? I have nothing to, like, Shaq helped me and so me, like, my confidence as I walked out on that court. It's, you know, like, when I got the NBA, the Miami Heat, we won nothing. Like, nobody was checking for us. When I walked out there my second year and know, like when I got in the NBA, the Miami Heat, we won nothing. Nobody was checking for us.

When I walked out there my second year and Shaq was walking out there, my shoulders got a little back. My chest got up. You see my big brother? Right. You know what I mean? And so he helped me so much. He took my career that was probably going to go like this to right away.

And it was the confidence that he gave me. Think about it, man. One of the greatest I've ever said is your show, I'm gonna back you up, I got you. In everything. Man, I'm looking at you in your third season, you lead the Heat to the championship. You're the finals MVP. And y'all win four straight. You go 42,

36, 43, 36. That's a bad boy. 42, 36, 42 in. 42, 36, 42 in game three, 36 in game four, 43 in game five, 36 in game six. The haters gonna say I shot 20 fritos.

Yeah. They caught the points. The point. You were attacking a bad guy. You were attacking a fool back then. Well, I wasn't a jump shooting fool. I tell you that. I was gonna get him one way or the other. So what's going through your mind?

Because that one game, I don't know if it was game three. Game three, you guys were down. And I remember you saying like, man, I ain't going out like this. No, we ain't going out like this. I ain't going. No, that ain't about to happen. No, first of all, one thing we all want where we come from, we want some stripes in the hood.

Yeah, exactly. Back at the crib. Right, I need my stripes. Right. I'm sitting there, and I'm like, we ain't about to get beat like this. I know everybody back in Chicago. Everybody I know, they watching this game. Right. And I just threw that towel down.

I was just thinking of everything. I'm like, nah, I ain't going out like this. If I'm going to go out, I'm about to go out. Right. Letting these things fly. This ball about to go up, baby. I'm going to tell you that. And then they start going in.

But just the mentality to say, you know what, we're here. I don't know because I'm young, so I don't know if this is going to happen again. I'm not even thinking that way. But what I do know is if we go down 3-0, it's probably over. It's probably over. And so when we came out of that huddle, down 13, at the crib, I was like, well, all right, young fella. All the things you told yourself, if you get this opportunity, yeah, flash all these cool nicknames. Right.

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Because sometimes you can tell, like, man, the way you shoot around and warm up, I feel really good. So you kind of get a feeling that something special might happen. Well, so a lot of people, I mean, it doesn't make me a hero or hit work at all. But I was sick in the round before. Right. And so once we got to the first two games versus Dallas, I was still sick. Okay.

We got our butt beat. Right. But if you watch my numbers, I had, like, 25, 29. Dallas, I was still sick. Okay. We got our butt beat. Right. But if you watch my numbers, I had like 25, 29. Like I was in that range. Right. Maybe not a high percentage, but I was in that range. And I was like out there figuring things out. Right?

I was like, okay, this is where I can tag. This is where I can get my spots. So forth and so forth. So by the time we got to game three, now we're home. Confidence is a little bit more. I'm feeling better physically. Right. And so once I got to

that moment, like I was able to kind of pick the game apart because I've already had a doses of two other games of how y'all guarded me in the fourth. And so now it was about me just changing my mindset. I'm not doing the same thing. And so maybe I attacked a little different. Maybe I attacked a little sooner. All these things started changing as the series went on. And so it really is a boxing match. And they did us like this the first two games. They kept us like this. And then in game three, they were hitting us. Right.

And so I had to kind of change my disposition. I had the Floyd Mayweather on them. I had to go different shoulder. Yeah, okay. And kind of change up, try to change it up. And then we got a couple calls. We got a couple shots to fall. Changed the entire series.

Were you surprised that the Lakers traded Shaq to the Miami? Uh, yeah. Because I didn't really, like, it wasn't social media. I didn't really know about the beef. Right. The internal beef that people talk about. I still don't know. Shaq and I didn't talk a lot about that. That wasn't our relationship. And so... So when

he got there, he was like, man, F them Lakers. F this, F that. He wanted another ring. Right. But he wanted to be first. there, he was like, man, F them Lakers. F this, F that. He wanted another ring. Right. But he wanted to be first. Yeah, it wasn't no secret. Kobe can't get a ring before me. Right.

It wasn't no secret in Miami. We all knew. I remember we were 16 games into the first season. Right. Miami Heat 10-6. Los Angeles Lakers maybe either 10-6 or 9-7. Fact check me. We had a meeting.

Le'Veon Bashak, he went the fuck off because we had the same record as the Lakers at that time. You know what we did? We went on a 12-game winning streak. We lost one or two. We went on a 10-game winning streak. And we wound up having the best record in the league for a long time. But he didn't want to be at the same pace as the Lakers. He didn't come here to be average.

Right. And so, like, he demanded something out of us that allowed, obviously that pushed us to help us win that championship. Right. Yeah. So how excited was he to get that ring before Kobe? You heard his diss track? He didn't have a diss record that came out.

He did. He did. So there you go. Let's go back and look at the lyrics of the diss track. You got compared with because when he came there, there's like D-Wave about to be the next Kobe. Yeah, man. I like that. You ain't like that? Oh, why would I like that? I don't want that. You don't want that pressure? You don't want that? I don't want that. Kobe? You don't want that pressure or you don't want that? I ain't want that smoke. Kobe had three rings at this time. He's 20, what, 24 years old?

Yeah. He got three rings. I play the way I play because I watch Jordan, Iverson, and Kobe. Right. Now you're talking about, like, don't put me there yet. I'm two years in the league. Right. And so they did.

And it become like, I'm still a kid who's like, I secretly still want Kobe's autograph at this time. Yeah, I'm still a kid who's like I secretly still want Kobe's autograph at this time yeah I'm asking for the shoes in the back you know what I'm saying

I'm secretly like I don't even want to push up on him too much yet I'm like I don't know and so as I was trying to find my footing in the league

my second in the league they now they now pinning me with one of my favorite players a guy that I only played once the year before because he was injured

a second time and so now it's this inner beef that we don't even that I don't even know that's there that I didn't cause, that the media has caused. Right. Now we ain't talking to each other. So he coming at you hard. I mean, I'm not saying he wasn't, but it's going to be a little extra because y'all say that he next, I'm going to show y'all he's next. That's Kobe. And so what it did do is

it fast-tracked me. It brought out a little bit in me because I knew that my goal, I was like, all right, he has to look at me as an equal. Not saying that he think I'm on his level, but he has to get some sleep the night before he plays me. He has to guard me. He has to pick me up 94 feet. Whatever it is, I need the respect from him. And so that's kind of how I took it.

I didn't take it as, oh, yeah, I am the next Kobe. I'm in this role. No, I ain't. Y'all can have that. That's Kobe. No. And so I think I built my own sidekick role, what I like to call your sidekick. I think I built my own lane of how my sidekick tenure was.

I'm looking at your season in 2008, 2009. You became the only player to score 2,000 points, 500 assists, 150 steals, 100 blocks. You won the scoring title. Do you feel you should have won the MVP that season? Of course. But I also understand why LeBron won MVP. I think they won 67 games, 62

games, and he averaged roughly the same. I understand it, but as an individual player, yeah, that was my MVP. How different would your basketball life be if you had a regular season MVP on it? Would you look at your career any different? No, I'd just be in a few more conversations. Hearing it.

Well, right now, they got you as the third-best shooting guard behind Jordan and Kobe. Would you agree with that? I don't care. Like, until the next person come along and they make me the fourth or the fifth. It doesn't matter. You did what you did.

If we talking in a barbershop and we talking about rankings, yeah, I want my name to be mentioned with the greats. So if you tell me I'm third, I'm not first, so I'm mad about that. But if you tell me I'm third, I can respect the top two that's in front of me. But also, too, I understand it's all subjective as well. Right. Is it West? Was

Iverson a two guard? Do you love James Harden's style? Do you love this? Like, I mean, what are we doing here? Right. So for me, like, to be mentioned with the greats is all I ever wanted. To put a number on it, that number moves. Right. Maybe, I know we're thinking right now that Jordan and Kobe when it's

in stone, but like these numbers ain't going to let nobody pass Jordan and Kobe. I don't think thinking right now that Jordan and Kobe when it's in stone. They ain't going to let nobody pass Jordan and Kobe. I don't think they're going to let anybody pass Jordan and Kobe. We not. I know one thing about us. Our generation ain't going to let nobody come along because we're going to fight and defend Jordan and Kobe forever. Forever.

For me, man, in my position, and I'm very honest, I was a very great player from my abilities. I maximized all my abilities. That's all you can ask for. I maximized it. Because of injury, I wasn't able to get to the level that I knew I could get to. In my mind, I was in GOAT level of my mentality and my talent.

D-Wade doesn't tear his knee injury, doesn't tear his knee in college. D-Wade doesn't have the two knee surgeries in the NBA. And he plays 16 seasons. What's D-Wade's numbers? You're doing your GOAT conversation with me. You're doing what's your bad, what's your bad. Yeah, yeah. So I don't have to go basketball when I'm talking about D-Wade.

Well, I mean, like I said, we're talking about ifs. You take away the injuries away, I'm still playing basketball right now if I want to. Wow. Because it's the injuries and everything and the mental. But if I'm healthy enough, I know how to, like, you got to understand something about my game. Multiple ways.

Right. I played the game multiple ways. So even right now, even when I got older, I went to, I had another game that still was effective as an old player. So in my mind, even when I got older, I went to it. I had another game that still was effective as an old player. So in my mind, you motherfucking right. I was one of them dudes. You couldn't tell me in 06, 07, 08 that I wasn't going to where I wanted to go.

Right? Like, why not? I'm tearing the league is not hard for me. I'm averaging 30 a game in the NBA. And so forth and so on. I already won a finals MVP. I already won a championship in my third year. I did that. So in my mind, I'm very confident

and quietly cocky about where I'm going. Right. And then injuries stop. Boom, boom, boom. Right. And it humbled me real quick. When did you realize that you possibly because of the injuries, wasn't going to reach the ultimate player that you want to become,

that you was going to have to like, okay, I'm a great player, but I know I had so much more in me if I didn't have this injury? I mean, as you get older. So somewhere in that big three era. Right. Where I... You didn't look the same that 2014. That LeBron's last year.

I wasn't the same. Ain't no look. I wasn't. I lebron i wasn't the same ain't no look i wasn't i was getting shots all before all the game really oh man so we'll do a documentary later okay like all the all the knee injections and the shots and all that stuff man to get out there and perform like i did a lot of those things to be able to get out there i was my body had felt like it got i got smacked by a mac truck right and. And that's how I was playing, right? And I was doing everything to medicate myself to be out there. Right. And so, yeah, I realized that at a point, man, I think it was one time, like, it's just over the years.

Like, when I used to get past somebody, one step, pow, I'm at the rim. I'm body. I'm putting you in the rim. Right. Then it became one step, oh, I don't even get to this floater. One step, let me get to this side step. I can't even get back. Right.

It's the same. So you know these things. If you're a person who get out the shower in the morning, you actually look in the mirror at yourself, you know who you are. You talk to yourself in the mirror like I do. So I knew over time, I was like, oh, I'm losing a little of these steps. I'm not as explosive. I'm not as this and that.

It doesn't mean I can't still be great and I can't play this game. But I started to see it. And so for me, once I started doing see it. And so it, for me, once I started doing it, I'm like, okay, like, who's up next? Right. LeBron, you do more.

Right. I do a little less. Right. Because you know that you can't, you can't carry that same load no more. Yeah. It ain't the same. I can't get to that rim in.2 seconds.

Now it's like.4,.5. It's a little different. It can close in on me. Right. I can't be as great. And so, like, all these little things I started to understand

and I started to, and I started to calculate, take a step back, move your game this way, go to the post, go to mid-range. All these things. You've got to be mentally sharp in this game if you want to stay a long time. It can't just be about the physical, as you know.

How did you recruit LeBron to get him to convince him to come to Miami? Let me get some more of this. I didn't recruit LeBron. I didn't recruit LeBron to get him to convince him to come to Miami? Let me get some more of this. I didn't recruit LeBron. I didn't recruit LeBron. What do you mean? I mean, so how did you get him to come to Miami? Could I go Pat Riley and recruit him?

No, I wouldn't. That ain't recruiting. I would just say. So what did you tell him? What did you tell LeBron? What did you tell him? You told him something.Bron? He said, what did you tell him? You told him something. You told him something.

You made him some promises or something. No, I didn't. Like, I don't think no one would ever believe how all this happened. Well, tell us. No, well, it's going to be hard because it's going to take multiple people to tell you. Okay. Because I have a perspective. LeBron has a perspective.

Well, since you're here, I asked LeBron to accept my gift here. But when I get here, I'm going to ask him his you give us you give us how it played out to you how it played out to me was once again as i started off as we as stars in this league you're determined and you're you're picked on or you're lifted up by the championships you win yes and so you got a young player like lebron who he knows what he needs to do to be at the level that he is today right and so he knew at that time that he couldn't probably do it there right right at that moment right and so enter what can i do it at who can i do it with right previous years before that we all signed the same contract so we can give ourselves flexibility not

saying hey we're gonna play together in three years but hey we can give ourselves flexibility. Not saying, hey, we're going to play together in the next three years, but hey, let's give ourselves flexibility. And so that flexibility was like, oh, shit, D-Wade a free agent? Oh, Chris Bosh a free agent? So everyone started thinking different around that time. Right. And for me, it wasn't real until we got a call from the Miami Heat. And they let us know that they actually put money aside

or they can figure out a way to get three max players. Because at first it was just two max players. So the conversation changed when he made that call to say we can get three max players. And then LeBron and I got on the phone. And I just leave it at that. It's a lot of things that happen. Okay. And so then we got on the phone.

And we got on the phone because LeBron called and said, hey, let's get on the phone. Just like we did three years prior to that, LeBron, I, my agent Henry Thomas, his agent at the time, Leon Rose, we got on the phone. We talked about the contract situation. We talked about the five-year deal versus the three-year deal, the benefits. At that time, we were working together because we were all new at this. Right. We young dudes who friends.

Wow. So we were working together and like, yo, you're 20, you're this age, you'll be this age when that deal is up you older you need to sort of sort of deals you can get more money like this is how we were talking right we were young guys but we had a different view on things and so we kept talking throughout the process and when free agency came we had another conversation and that conversation led to huh we could do what we could play together and they just went from there. Even though they say we got a deal for three max contracts, did you think this was, like, could this be a reality?

Could this be realistic? No. We didn't see it at that time. Right. We didn't see, especially players, free agents, guys, three guys to go team up. Where was they doing that at? No. A team had to go get an older agent superstar or someone else and package them together and they all played together. That's what they did with the Celtics when they got Garnett,

kept playing with Paul Pierce. Or you got lucky. You drafted some guys and some guys. You know what I mean? Yeah, you got Kareem. You got Kareem and Magic. Kareem's there. He wins the regular season MVP.

They drafted Magic. Right. And then two years later, they drave word with the first one. There you go. How'd that happen? How the hell you win the irregular season MVP. They drafted Magic. Right. And then two years later, they drained Worthy with the first one. There you go. How'd that happen? How'd you win? How the hell you win the finals and then you get your first pick in the draft?

You know what I'm saying? Different time back then. As we stayed on wintertime, they were doing coin flips and all that in the back. Like, it was different. So, like, I never, first of all,

I never imagined, and I don't know if people believe me, I never thought LeBron and I would play together. I had a meeting with the Miami Heat about this before, two years before we ever played together. Right. Was, do you think, and I was like, 0.0000.1% chance that we would ever play together.

Right. Right? And because there was a lot of conversations out there. Right. And I never thought it was until I sat with him face-to-face and I seen that it wasn't about scoring titles no more for him it wasn't about all the things that you know the commercials and MVPs and all the things he had he had that but he was still empty inside and he wanted and needed something else for his career

right and me being one of his good friends me be one of the best players in the league me being a free agent at the same time me being in a nice city right same time it was attractive and it was sexy and so we had an opportunity to sit down and talk about it what did you think when you heard LeBron say not one not two

not three not four not five not six not seven hey I didn't I didn't I didn't take it seriously

anybody out there who took that serious like come on guys like we in a we having a parade right we get fans that's what media you do get the fans hype the fans hype you know we in there with our fans you don't know like we in there talking not one not you know i mean we in there we jacking we doing we doing we in the crib with our homies you know how you you put a little sauce on your

you add a little bit to it you add a little sauce too that's what he did he had a little sauce you know what i mean and then that sauce became oh we gonna hold him to it. You add a little bit to it. That's what he did. He added a little sauce, you know what I mean? And then that sauce became, oh, we're going to hold him to it. That's all. Like, we never say, we're about to win seven straight, but we knew it was going to be a problem. The big three, the hate and the vitriol you got. Yeah, it was nasty. Had you ever seen anything like it before or since?

Not in that way. I never, I actually never seen hate I heard about hate right heard about it from my ancestors yeah you know stories about my ancestors I've heard about it from my mom my dad my uncles never seen hate until LeBron decided to come to Miami right then I started seeing hate up close and hate is an ugly thing and so uh it was a like for us man like I think a part of us didn't understand like we're we're still young young right right who are playing this game of basketball we're boys we traveling playing together our kids

get to grow up together like we're excited about this and on the outside everybody in the world is calling us all these things right and so it wasn't a joyous year to play basketball at all. And I think that was the one thing coming out of that year, even though we lost in it. And I always say one of the best things that happened to us

is that we lost in the finals. Well, one of the best things that happened to us media-wise is that we lost in the finals. Because if we'd have won in the finals of 2010, we was going to be jacking. Right.

It was nothing no one was going to be able to say to us. We were going to be two. And so it humbled us one was going to be able to say to us. We were going to be two. And so it humbled us. It put us at our level and allowed us to focus on what was real and why we got together. It was reported that you guys all went away. You, D, you, I think Mello, I think Chris Paul, and LeBron.

And all your families went away. And you had a conversation with LeBron about it's okay, bro. It's okay. Bro, I need you to be you. No, I mean that's not how it happened. How it happened? Tell us how it happened. Well, first of all, it

wasn't a CP and it wasn't Melo. It was the trip that everyone's talking about was just my wife, Savannah LeBron and a couple other friends of ours. And that was the trip where we started having different conversations. That was right after we lost. We had a couple weeks away, and then we had this trip planned. And we started having different conversations about why we lost, how we lost.

Right. And I just was sitting there, as I always do. I sit and I listen, and I listen to, I heard LeBron talk. And everything that I was getting from LeBron in that year, even though he had a great year, and even in that moment, was still hesitation. And so for me, I was like, okay, if we're going to reach the level that we're going to reach and how I can help us is to take that hesitation out of one of the game's greatest players. Because I've watched him play, and I know how he plays when he has no,

I shot two in a row, D-Wade ain't having the game. Right, right, yeah, yeah. You know what I mean? Like, it's human nature. Hey, D-Wade ain't had a bucket in a while. Let me, no, bro, press on. You that dude. Go be that dude.

Wow. We going to do what we got to do to make sure that you good and we good. Because this is ultimately about what we all sat down and said we want to do. We said we want to win rings. No one said that I need an extra endorsement or you need an extra this. We wanted to win rings. So for us to win rings in this day of age, you have to be who you are. And that's, besides Kobe, is the game's greatest player.

And so I can't stand in the way of that. I can't let my ego and my pride stand in the way of that. And I said I was doing it in the beginning, but it was always like, hey, first year, I think we both averaged 25 a game. It was kind of even. Same shots, same this, same that, same possessions. Coach don't need to worry about that.

You don't need to worry about that. I've always played around multiple players. I figured out. And that was our conversation. And it happened after the trip. Right. It happened in the gym one day. Right. It was LeBron, Coach Fisdale, and myself. Right. And that was our conversation. And it happened after the trip. Right. It happened in the gym one day. Right.

It was LeBron, Coach Fisdale, and myself. Right. And I told him right there. And I just remember the look on his face. He was kind of like puzzled, looking at me like. You for real? And so, but at that point, I'm saying like, it had to be bigger than me. Mm-hmm.

Which was hard to do. Right. Because we all come in like check the name on the back right but I just had to look myself in the mirror and say this is not why you playing with LeBron James and Chris Bosh you're not playing with them to check the name on the back you playing with them to check the rings on your finger correct and so let's get to that what happened in the Mavs series Y'all better. Mm-hmm.

We got, um... Boy, you look... Shit, boy, you look at that. I might as well go and poke me a little bit. I mean, to be honest, we got outplayed and we got outcoached. If you go back and ask the players, you go back and ask Spoh, the coaching staff got outcoached and the players got out-played when it came down to winning. We didn't close out games.

Right? We had. Because one game you had a 16-boy lead. Game two at home, we got 15. Yeah. You don't lose that. We don't close out games, but that's players and that's coaches, right? And so we got out-coached by Rick Carlisle and his staff, and we got out-play Rick Carlisle and his staff, and we got our player by

Dirk and Jason Terry and that little J-Kid, but that little J.J. Barrera. Nobody give him credit. J.J. Barrera was the one who changed the situation. We didn't have no answer for him. Okay, Dirk, you know what you're going to do. Let's just, UD, make his

shots tough, make it hard on him. Try to make him not shoot 50%, make him have an off night, but he's still going to get 20. Jason Terry going right, you can't stop him. We knew all these things. But no one planned for little JJ to come off the bench and do what he did. Right. And I look at it and I say, not from an MVP as an award,

but from an MVP as a player who really helped push that series over, I give it to JJ because we didn't have no answer for him. Wow. And so we, as a team, like, obviously LeBron struggled. We talk about the average 17 points a game. Yeah. Players struggle. Right. And what sucked about it is because of everything that was

talked about and all this, but at the end of the day, me as a leader, Spoh as a head coach, we got to do a better job to make sure that he's not struggling. How are we getting him the ball in certain places to make it easier for him? Because you know as a player, all you need is one thing to go your way and turn everything around. We didn't do enough of that for a guy who was

struggling. For whatever the reason is, we all have had our struggles. As a leader, I looked at it myself. I was like, you didn't do enough, D. And you'll see a clip where I'm cursing Brian out. I'm in his ear. I'm talking to him. But that probably wasn't the way I should have done it. Maybe I should have done something else.

And so, we were more talented, but they were a better team. Pat Riley, I saw Pat Riley say something that players came in his office and demanded that they fire, that he fire the coach. It was reported. Yeah, I saw that. Yeah, you didn't do that? I don't remember doing it. Now yeah i saw that yeah you didn't do that i

don't remember doing it now not saying i didn't but i don't remember doing that right i don't i mean i i knew coach spo at that time right two years in i the one thing is is when when lebron decides to talk about everything on his documentaries or whatever he decided to do he would talk about what we we talked about Riley as a coach versus Spoh as a coach right in our meeting before we even played together and one thing I told him

you don't want Riley to coach this team ain't got nothing to do with Pat Lovell you don't want Riley to coach this team bro and even though Spoh was not experienced

right and we needed a coach that was experienced so we can win championships right away right we're gonna we're gonna help him right grow not experienced. Right. And we needed a coach that was experienced so we could win championships right away. Right. We're going to help him grow.

You didn't want Riley. No, you don't want Godfather to come down. I did. He did it in 2006. I experienced it. Right.

That was enough. Now we won. And you're ready for him to go back upstairs? Yeah, yeah, I'm ready for him to go back upstairs.

What do you think Pat saw in Eric with Coach Spoh to say, you know what? Nope, this is the guy. He can get it done. And he's turned himself into one of the best coaches in the NBA.

Well, if you, see, that's once again why you don't listen to players at times. Because if you listen to me when they first hired Spoh, I was like, what are you doing? This is the wrong decision. I remember when Mickey and Nick Harrison sat me down and said, hey, we're bringing up Spoh. Like, Spoh was in the video room, and then he sat behind the the bench and he was like, hey, we're going to hire from within and it's going to be Eric Spoh. And I was like, I'm looking for a big name coach. I'm a star. I'm like, who we got?

We're going to get Doc. Right. And I knew Spoh. I had a great relationship with Spoh because Spoh would work me out. He was my workout guy. Right. So I liked Spoh, but I didn't know Spoh as a coach. And so when he first got there, he was a terrible coach.

But he was a great guy to prepare you. He was going to work his ass off. No one was going to outwork him. Right. No one was going to be more prepared than him. He just had to learn when to call timeouts. Right. What plays to run out of timeouts.

What late game. Like, all these things that you've got to learn as a coach. As a star player, I had to go through it with coach. Right. What plays to run out of timeouts? What late game? Like all these things that you got to learn as a coach. As a star player, I had to go through it with coach. Right. And that's why our relationship is what it is today because we went through this. What it is. Right? We went through, thank you, this.

And we went through all of it because the journey, right? Right. Of a young coach. Right. And so the whole, we walked in and tried to get him fired. I don't know if I was in that meeting. Right. But maybe I was. I don't know. I don't remember that. I don't remember trying to get him fired. I don't know if I was in that meeting. Right. But maybe I was.

I don't know. I don't remember that. I don't remember trying to get him fired. LeBron leaving Miami. Yeah. Did you guys have a conversation? Did you know he was thinking about leaving Miami? And did you think he'd go back to Cleveland?

I didn't know he was thinking about it right away. Man, we just had a four-year run. That was not what I was thinking about. Right. I didn't think Cleveland was on about it right away. I mean, we just had a four-year run. That was not what I was thinking about. Right. I didn't think Cleveland was on the docket at all. Right. Once that letter came out four years prior, I was like, well, it's over for them. Yeah, yeah.

Appreciate that. Yeah, yeah. And so when we went into free agency that summer, I didn't think that we were – that we wasn't coming back. Right. Right? I thought we was going to retube. Right?

That's what teams do. They retube. Right. And so once I started hearing the noise on the outside and I started hearing Cleveland and I started seeing things, I was like, oh, there's some truth to the noise. Right. Some truth to the noise. Yeah.

There's truth even in the lie. Yeah, there's something in there. And I didn't even know it was a thing because we never talked about, hey, that was never our conversation. Right. And so when I did get the information from him that he was headed back to Cleveland, I mean, I took it like I take everything else. I took it on a chin because I'm not a selfish guy. I mean, I have selfish acts and selfish moments, but my whole being is not selfish. And so if that's what that man want to do for his life,

like, I support him doing it. I just got to now figure out my life because I had a whole different plan for how I wanted mine to go. Right. And, you know, one thing I told him in that moment, we were sitting outside the plane. I think even the camera crew might have got us talking

because we had just flew back in from Vegas before the announcement was made the next day. And we're sitting out there, and I told him, I said, man, listen, everybody's going to win no matter what you do. If you stay here, we all win. LeBron James stays in Miami, we win. You go to Cleveland, Cleveland's going to win. Ultimately, you got to do what's best for LeBron. And so if this is what's best for LeBron James, Savannah James, Bryce and Bronny, and Zoe wasn't at that stage yet. If this was better for your family, you got my, if you looking for blessing for me, you got my blessing.

Right. Right? I'm not going to hold you back. Now I got to go deal with my side. Because I had a whole different mentality. I opted out of my deal. I did all these things. Because I'm like, hey, we retooling.

Right. And so a lot of people like to say, like, was it a part of me that was a little pissed? Yeah. I'm human. Right. I don't want to lose the best player in the game. Right.

What do we do? Why did we lose him? Right. And also, too, now I got to figure out my future. Right. Right? Because I've given up a lot of my stardom and I've given up my place for you to step in and help lead us. Mm-hmm.

And so it took me a while. And Brian and I had a conversation later once before I got to Cleveland about that moment and how I felt. Right? Right. And how he felt. We later once before I got to Cleveland about that moment and how I felt, right? And how he felt. We sat down as men, and we talked about that moment, and we moved on from it. That was a difficult time for you because you gave up $20 million that wasn't repaid to you. Yeah. You don't get money back.

Hey, money don't come back, people. You can make more, but you ain't getting that money back. You ain't going to get what's left. I don't care what nobody tell y'all. You can't recruit that money. No. The current Miami Heat. I've never seen it. D-Wade, I'm a little older than you.

I'm a lot older than you. And I've followed the game probably longer than you've been a lot. I've never seen anybody like Jimmy Butler. I've never seen a guy play one way in the regular season and then play another way in the playoffs. I've followed the game probably longer than you've been alive. I've never seen anybody like Jimmy Butler. I've never seen a guy play one way in the regular season and then play another way in the playoffs. I've never seen it. Me neither. Not at the level of C.J.

No, yes. Yeah. How does a guy that's, you know, I mean, he's a good player. Don't get me wrong. But if you look at him in a playoff, you're talking about historic. He has historically great playoff games. How does he do that? Yes. Well, I i mean i don't know how he does it but what i would say what i learned um you guys welcome for me going to chicago by the way um what i say what i learned about jimmy when

i got a chance to be around him in chicago for that season is some players lead with their iq yeah lebron will break down a whole fourth quarter for you every play in the press conference and for this season is some players lead with their IQ. Yeah. LeBron will break down a whole fourth quarter for you every play in a press conference, and you're like, oh, man, he's the smartest basketball player ever because he has a high IQ. Right. Jimmy Butler don't lead with his IQ.

Jimmy Butler leads with his toughness. Right. Jimmy Butler's one of the smartest basketball players that I've ever been around. Right. Right? It's just how you decide to look at it. So when the playoffs come, everything slows down.

You get to learn everyone's tendencies and all this. So you ain't got to be traveling, playing all the different. Because you focused on one opponent. One opponent. This is one of the smartest players that I've ever been around. Also, too, in the midst of being a smart player, some players have that switch that they can turn on. Everyone doesn't have it, but certain players have it.

Jimmy Butler has shown us over his career, and you go back in all the playoffs, you're like, oh, damn, Jimmy was in that Eastern Conference final. Jimmy was in that. Jimmy was in that. He's been a part of teams. He saw players. Like, he's a student. He watched Derrick Rose. He watched me when I came in Chicago.

Like, he was everywhere I was at, Jimmy was at because he wanted that knowledge, right? And so you put his work ethics that he has that are second to none. You put the confidence that Miami give him to say, hey, you the guy. You the guy. Right? Like, think about it. All we want sometimes is

to be seen. Yes. Miami was like, yo, Jimmy, let me wipe this off. Oh, I see you. You crazy. Right. Alright, you go crazy, match our crazy. Let's go do this. You give him that confidence and also, too, you give someone who's smart

and Jimmy's like Jordan in this way. He's always looking for something to piss him off. So in the New York series, I was like, ooh, he had Tibbs.

He's all about Tibbs. He done made some stuff up about what Tibbs did to him. When Tibbs done did everything for him, but he done made something that Tibbs pissed him off in practice in Minnesota He was like it wasn't about the Knicks right it's about tears

So he has that he can go to that level where he can zone out and focus on one thing or somebody And so he just it's it's everyone can't do that right he had that switch right they say he's a tough Teammate to have coaches say he's a tough teammate to have. Coaches say he's a tough player to coach. Why? Because he's going to do it his way. You know, to be coachable, you've got to do what the coach says. Right. I'm not saying he's a

bad teammate or a bad person. Jimmy knows the game. Rightimmy knows the work he puts in the game right right he's very committed to that no one is going to work me no one is going to know this better than me not even you coach right so you can't just throw something out there to jimmy he's going to challenge you on he'll ask you why we do it he's going to challenge you right and you you want to you want your best players to challenge you that's how it makes you a better coach right but when you get a reputation in a in a in a space that they don your best players to challenge you. That's how it makes you a better coach.

Right. But when you get a reputation in a space that they don't want you to challenge, now you're a problem. You're a bad kid. You're a malcontent. Yeah. You go into a situation where they're like, oh, you're challenging me? Let me challenge you back. Right. Okay, that was a good challenge. Dap it up. Let's go.

And that's what he found. So he found a home and a place that they both got a little, Miami ain't for everybody. And Jimmy Butler is not for everybody. And so Minnesota, Philly, Chicago, they experienced Jimmy is not for everyone. Because Jimmy is going to challenge you. He's going to challenge your organization. And I'm not saying he's going to walk in and say, demand players.

He's going to challenge you to play at his level. He's going to challenge you to be where he is and work how he works and all these things. Right. And so no one likes to be challenged. Right. You're a problem if you challenge me. Right. Wake up with football every morning and listen to my new podcast,

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Because he would be a pivotal part of them winning that Super Bowl. I don't know why, Colleen. Catch the podcast, the NFL Daily with Greg Rosenthal every day. Subscribe today and you'll immediately be smarter and funnier than your friends. And who doesn't want that? Listen now on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your friends. And who doesn't want that? Listen now on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. You mentioned earlier that

you were very, very surprised that LeBron went back to Cleveland. Given that the letter that Dan Gilbert, the owner who had worked so closely with LeBron James, with the things that he said, because now all of a sudden it's not about basketball,

you made it personal. How is LeBron... LeBron is a the things that he said because now all of a sudden it's not about basketball. You made it personal. LeBron is a very forgiving person because there are guys that's taking shots at him that he's willing to embrace again. Like, oh, now, maybe we cool later for that. How is he able to forget? Because, you know, most people aren't as forgiving or as forgetful as he is, especially when you look,

if you say something to me in private, just me and you know, okay, cool. I don't rock with you no more, but cool. But when you put it out there for 25, 100 million people to read, nah, I can't rock with you on that level no more, bro. Yeah. Bigger man than me. Yeah. I'm petty.

Yeah. How did he set that aside? I don't know. And that's why I never thought Cleveland was in play. Right. You know what I mean? Not saying that I never thought that he was going to be in Miami forever. Right.

Like, you weren't thinking that way. But I never thought Cleveland was in play because I'm petty. And so if I was going off of how I would have done it, no, I'm not coming back to you. Right. But at the same time, man, LeBron has a journey. And it's bigger than a letter that Dan Gilbert could put out. It's bigger than what someone sitting across the table from you may say. It's bigger than, because he's been King James since he was 12 years old.

He has had a vision for how he wants this to go. And if you allow all these individuals to get in the way of your vision, then it becomes theirs, what they want for your career. Right. What he wants for his. Right. And so I looked at that move going back to Cleveland as this man, first of all, bigger man than me in that moment to go back. But it wasn't about Dan Gilbert.

It wasn't about the Cleveland Cavaliers. It's about LeBron James and his family and what he want to accomplish and how he see his career going. And so to be able to fly higher than most people, like LeBron playing has been at 40,000 feet since he took off. Mine hit some turbulence, then went down.

We landed. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I landed my plane back in 2019. He's been at 40,000 and higher since he started. And so to be at that level, Yeah, yeah, yeah. I landed my plane back in 2019. He's been at 40,000 and higher since he started. Right. And so to be at that level, you have to look above. And he looked above and got what he needed for his career. Right.

Yeah. I think the most interesting thing that you've done. I'm sorry. In his community. In his community, yeah. Because that was important for him. I promise, yeah. And I say that, and I'm sorry to interrupt, but I say that to say when he went back,

he implemented something that was bigger than basketball. Right. And that's when you was like, I see you. He implemented, I promise, yeah. And I say that, and I'm sorry to interrupt, but I say that to say when he went back, he implemented something that was bigger than basketball. Right. And that's when you was like, I see you. He implemented, I promise. Right. He implemented the schools, which now has implemented the housing. And it was about the community of Cleveland that he wanted them to feel like winners. Right.

Right? Yeah. And in the midst of it, yeah, we all have our feelings about how and why because we're human. But if I'm looking at it from his standpoint, I'm like, oh, I see you. Right. You up here. Right. And we all was like, we all was down here looking up like, bro, you shouldn't do that.

Right. D-Wade, I think you're a phenomenal basketball player. You've accomplished a lot. But I think your greatest accomplishment is the way you've embraced your child wanting to transition. That's not an easy thing to do because we all have, if you have a daughter, you have an idea of what you think your daughter was going to be or what you wanted to become. If you have a son, you have an idea of what you want, especially if you play sports. I want my son to play sports, be the doctor. If I'm a doctor, I want my son to be a doctor, lawyer, yada, yada, yada.

But for you to embrace Ziya, to embrace her journey, how did you come to? Because obviously you had to sit down and you had a conversation. She comes to you and she sits down and she says, Dad, this is how I'm feeling. This is how I'm thinking. This is how I'm thinking and you say what well It's not my journey Like I'm not not that selfish. I can't make your journey in your life about me. Okay, right like I just can't do that right like Yes, and I was telling someone this the other day. When Zaya was born, she was born May 29th,

which is Carmelo's birthday. Right. Right? Happy belated birthday. To my brother. Told some of my brother on his retirement, by the way. Told some, this, this right here. In fact.

Listen. By this fire? Thank you. Oh, hey. This right here. In fact. Listen. By this fire? Thank you. Woo wee. Um, so if y'all go look at it, I have Zion. LeBron has Bryce. Melo has Kyan.

All within about a two, three week span. All our kids gonna grow up hooping together. Right. Oh, we on. Yeah. Well, we gonna have three baby. We on. Yeah. So yeah, like obviously I had a boy. I had another boy. That's what you're thinking, yeah. Well, we're going to have three, baby. We on. Yeah. So, yeah, like, obviously, I had a boy. I had another boy.

That was my second boy in a row. I'm like, okay, this is what we do. We're a hooping family. And see what happens when you start making plans for other people's lives. Right, right. That's her journey. That's her journey. But you playing it out.

You playing it. Oh, you couldn't tell me we weren't going to be on the circuit right now, baby. We hooping. We got Wade in the back. You got the way Wade's on. Right. We doing it we doing it too right then I got to meet my child and a lot of people like to talk about Zaya's transition to me Zaya hasn't transitioned into anything she's but a kid and now a young uh going into young adult I've watched her go through life it hasn't been no transition for us right it's been a transition for the world.

But for us, I see the same kid that I've seen since May 29th 2007. Nothing has changed. Did you know, were there signs? Because, you know, boys can play with trucks, girls play with dogs, girls dress up, boys do this. So you

saw signs at a very early age that he's not like what I'm thinking a boy should be or what I was when I was that age. Yeah, I mean, think about this. I mean, you're in the locker room, I'm in the locker room. We don't, we ignit. I'm going to say ignit. And so I come from a culture of men throwing around the f word yes yes absolutely around the gay word yes just like it's high by right just throwing it around right and so

i have a child at home that we're basketball baseball we're doing what what you do right hey let's play this i have a child at home it's like, I don't want that. Dad, I want to take dance lessons. Okay, well, let's go to dance. I have a child at home. When I come home, she's got a shirt wrapped around her head. It's like long hair. I got a child at home that I'm watching wear certain things that's different than what I would buy for my son. Right. And so this is at three years old. So I'm in my home.

My wife and I, we have a conversation about it. Right. And for me, instead of walking in and say, hey, stop that shit, cut that shit, like people try to do, they try to stop you when you're doing something for you that they don't like. Right. So instead of me walking in a room and saying,

stop that shit, it was my job to sit back and say, okay, let's have a conversation with Zaya and let's see where this go. Right. And so my first conversation with her was about,

hey, understanding what you like to wear and how you like to be in the house. Right. Outside of this house, they're not ready for that.

Right. Right? I don't even know if we were ready for that. Right. And so we slowly just let her be who she wanted to be in our home. Is that your first wife or this with Gabby?

This is with Gabby. Okay. Be who you want to be in our home, and we're going to watch and we're going to learn along this journey. Because at that moment, I think, you know, and the thing that's a blessing in my life is that I got with my wife at the time I got with my wife because it exposed me to the world. Right. It exposed me to friends. I have some of my best friends are Jason and Adair. Everybody knows he's my stylist, Jason.

His husband is Adair. Right. I got a chance to be exposed to them early. And we all have our thoughts about, like, how we perceive people who, you know, are gay. Right. Who are man and man married. If it's woman and woman, we like that.

But if it's man and man, we have our perception. Right. So I got a chance to spend time with them, be around him, a vacation with him, all this and that. I'm like, what? This perception that I had. Right. It's not even a question in my mind. Those are my friends.

Right. I don't look at them. I don't look at any of the. They're married. They love each other. Right. They argue like we argue. All the same thing.

Nothing. And that's their life. I ain't living nobody else's life. So I had experience. Right. They argue like we argue all the same. Nothing. So that's their life. I ain't leaving nobody else. So I had experience. Right. And so in the midst of that experience through the world, because I was out of my community, I was out of what my uncles and my dad and everybody told me. I'm now looking at the world and I'm looking at my child. And so I got a chance to watch my child nine years before the world even heard about Zaya. Right. So when everyone started telling me what my child is, I'm like, how you going? I've been here a whole while. And I talked to my child.

Do you talk to my child? Because I do. Right. And so I sat down and talked to my child about, you know, as she was growing up, about the things she wanted. Right. And I tried to make sure that the things that she wanted, what she would work hard at, was presented to her, not what I wanted.

Right. And that's the problem with us is we're going to, and I would like to say this, because of the NBA or because of my basketball talents and because of all these things, I've been put in a position where I actually could wait and allow my kids to grow up. And I don't have to say, hey, I need help with these bills. Hey, you got to do this.

You got to be there. Because some communities, some households, they have to do that because of their circumstances. Right. We don't have time to figure out who you want to be and what you want to do right we had that figure it out on your time figure out on your time right and then now you get you get kids who's later in their life they didn't have the relationship with their parents early on because their parents had to make them whatever the culture was whatever the time was our time was different right so we had an opportunity to sit back and say, you know what? I don't want all my kids to be exactly the same. Right.

Anyway. So you know what? My three-year-old son at this time, Zion, let me see what Zion want to do. Right. And slowly but surely, Zion started growing. And we started watching. She's been unwavering. Ain't not a second.

This is Zion. Like, that's why, why like it's funny to me i'm like in the world i'm like everybody on the outside got something to say and the inside we're talking about school we're talking about um like like i sit down with my child we talk about hey okay so the doctor said this what do we got to do what like let's talk about your health let's talk about what the future looks like right i'm talking about real life things. Right. Because everybody on this outside got a perception. You ain't talking about that gossip.

Because the gossip is we all the same. Right. Tell me, let's go into all these communities in L.A. and you're going to see everybody's different. Right. Everyone lives different. Everyone is different. Everyone loves different.

Right. So because I'm an athlete and because, you know, I have a boy at birth, y'all expect that this boy's supposed to do X, Y, Z, just like Zaire had expectations. Y'all expect him to be an NBA superstar because I had him and blah, blah, blah. So everyone else on the outside have the expectations of my family and my kids. Right. How are you going to have expectations of my family and my kids

when I'm still learning and I'm still trying to… Are you still trying to figure it out? I'm trying to figure it out because I didn't grow up in this environment. So let me check myself. Because if I make it about me, I'm going to have a kid that's going to go through life that's going to be miserable, that's going to go through life. I think the statistics on kids,

especially in the transgender community, when it comes to suicide, it's very high. When you're not seen, when you're not seen just as a person who get up every day And work hard and grind we got a problem with it right right you got a problem when no one sees you So I got a kid in my house that I can't see and I don't take time to look at and see Then this kid is gonna feel unloved and unwanted

from it from the father whose Mother you guys know my my situation right my ex-wife is very public right the very public very nasty i am the parent in the house i have to see you i have to hear you right and so my child and i have a very open honest straightforward right between the eyes relationship about the journey who you are what you're experiencing because i don't know right because i've never experienced that and it was never shown to me that it was hey it was okay it was never it was never presented to me and so being in a position that I'm in as a father it's my job to understand to to be able to say okay everybody I don't

want y'all coming in on my life I don't want y'all coming on my daughter's gender my daughter sexuality that's not what I want. But because we're public figures and because I know it's other kids in the world like Zion, it's other dads in the world like me, and it will be forever because we all are not the same. Then I share a little bit of her journey, a little bit of our journey. Because we're both going on this journey that neither one of us knew we will be on. our journey. Right. Because we're both going on a journey that neither one of us knew we would be on. Right. Right? Like this entire journey. Right. And so I don't think about,

I think about the safety of my kids. Right. I think about the safety of other kids in the trans community. I think about, you know, how the world is trying to hush and exile our entire community like you do not exist. Right. As black people, do we know about that? Yeah, we do. Damn right we do. Right.

And we the main ones that are talking about the trans community. We the main ones that want to open and accept. And we want the world to accept us. Like, what are we doing? Right. And so I'm playing at a different playing field than most people who comment on my life. Right. Because I understand the position that I'm in.

A lot of black families in the communities, they don't see or hear, don't get a chance to hear these stories from us. Don't get a chance to see these things from us. And so, yeah, I'm sure to a lot of people, I look crazy. Right. I don't care about looking crazy to y'all. I care about making sure that I'm there for my kids. How difficult is it not to have the support of the other parent with what Ziya is going through?

And I think the thing is that probably what Ziya wants most is for her parents to understand the journey that she's chose to embark upon and be accepting of that journey that she's embarking upon. And you have accepted it, jumped on this thing with both feet, but it seems like she's getting some resistance from her mother. Is that difficult for you? Because you see it's hurting the child. Yeah, it's difficult. It's difficult for me, so I can't even imagine what it's like for her. Did she talk to you about it? Does she have a relationship with her mom? She has whatever relationship that she wants to have,

I assume. She's 16 years old. Yeah. And now she's getting older, and so, you know, the relationship is controlled by phones now. She lives, her mother doesn't live here. Right. She lives in my home. But you don't force Ziya to pick up the phone and call her mom. You don't force the mom to, like, call. Because, you know, sometimes, you know, kids, like, did you call your dad? My daughter came to live with me. My oldest daughter came to stay with me. And her mom would get into it.

You know how women get into it. And she'd go days without calling. I said, no, we're not going to do that. Pick up the phone and call your mom. Whatever you got going on, going on no matter how you mad at her she's mad at you we're not gonna do that you don't do that they don't have that relationship that's a different relationship it got to be both ways mm-hmm and you're talking about a kid like his eyes sees way advanced he's, she's way above what everybody thinks she is. You're talking about a kid who has experienced something that I don't even know

about when it comes to the relationship that she's had to try to have with her mother. She's been living with me since she was two and a half, three years old. Right. And as I had said very openly, like, my ex-wife ain't a part of all this. Right. And so what I will do is I will give credit to my wife who has stepped in and stepped up. Took it on that roll. And become a figure.

That's not her mom. You know what I mean? I know it's titled stepmom, bonus moms. Right. She's become a consistent figure in her life. Right. And as a woman who she, they can have conversations, talk about things that I just can't help her with. Okay. In the midst of all of what's going on.

I only know what I know and I only know what questions I can go out and ask. Right. But they have different conversations than I can. It's different trust. Right. And so, you know, I remember watching my dad step up and be a stepdad. And I didn't, I just knew it was a lot of other kids around. I didn't know really what it meant.

Right. But to be, that's a heroic position to be in. To step in to someone else's child. Yeah, yeah. And become an important figure in their lives. Yeah. And she has been in this journey because I would be lost. Right.

If it was just me and Ziya out here on this journey. Right. And so to be able to have not only my wife, to be able to have our community. Right. It allows us to be able to go through all this feeling like we have armor. You might be the biggest, Ziya and yourself might be the biggest advocate for the trans community. Because who you are. Yeah.

And you can put someone famous because like you said they're heard like man nobody know who you guys are nobody even cares about you but you give it a face you give it a name yeah let me ask you this d-way i mean because like you said you've had zia since she was two and a half and uh zaire your oldest son how was it being in the nba and being a single parent well Well, I mean, first of all, my community is large. Right. It's not nothing I ever, like, I didn't get divorced and be like, yo, let me get them kids.

Yeah. No, I was like, let me get in these streets. Get in these streets. Get in these Miami streets. Let me get out and get in these Miami. These Miami nights, I like that. What? I got, what?

The two kids at the crib? Hey, mama. Yeah. You free tonight? It changed everything. And for me, man, I wrote a book about it. Right. You know, how my life became bigger than basketball.

Because at that moment when I had to fight for custody, because it became I had to fight for custody. Because it wasn't just, hey, joint custody, let's raise these kids. Right. It became, for me, it was like, okay, what's the most important thing in your life? Is basketball more important than your kids? For you to get them the way you play, you're an NBA player, you're a professional athlete. For the judge to say, nah, the kid's going with him, do you know what that means? Oh, I know.

I know. Yeah. I dealt with it all. I've dealt with y'all. For a father to get custody of a kid is not an easy task. It's not. And I mean, it's a lot of, you know, a lot of things I can say about that. But I'm very thankful that I did get custody at the time I did, especially being Zaya's father. It would have been a way different journey for Zaya if... Because it seems like your ex is not as accepting

of her situation as you are. My ex don't live in my world, neither. She don't live in our world. Right. You don't understand that. So she doesn't understand. She's not around... She's not exposed to, like you said,

your stylist and his husband and some of the community that you've been exposed to since Zaya has undertaken this transition, this journey. I travel the world. Shannon, I go everywhere. I go to communities all around the world. I see difference in everywhere and everybody. I see different ways that husband

and wife live. So many different ways. Yeah, I'm vibing. I don't care what you do. I'm vibing. You cool? Husband, husband? You cool. We cool. You also you also you also have stuff. I'm also messed up, too. I provide. Right. So if she's not she's not exposed to the life that I've been able to write. It's a lot of people that I know that's not exposed. Now they become accepting of it because the love for me, my family, Zaya, or just because they feel like they need to be to stay in the fold. love for me, my family, Ziya, or just because they feel like they need to be just to stay in the fold. But when it comes to how I'm able to love and accept from what I learned growing up is because of my experiences and where I've been and the people that I've been able to get connected to. If you haven't been able to do that, if your passport ain't stamped, if your relationships ain't larger than the ones you grew up with in your community. Right. You're going to stay at a certain level of thinking and how it should be.

Right. The world looks so different than it did when I grew up in Robbins, Illinois. Right. And so the world is colorful, man. It's beautiful. It's unique. Right. And my daughter's a part of that colorful, beautiful, unique world.

And so why not embrace her? Just like I want to be accepted. I want to be embraced. Right. Right? We all want to be embraced and accepted for who we are right and so i don't when i look at my daughter i look at someone just like me that's trying to be accepted that's trying to learn that's trying to grow that's trying to

exist right in this world and i don't look at gender i don't look at sexuality i don't look at her choices and how she want to be when them doors close i don't want to know what you do right she don't want to know what we do right She don't want to know what we do. You know what I mean? And so it's my job to make sure along this journey as she's growing up that I sit with her. I have conversations with her doctor about hey, how does this journey affect my daughter?

How does it affect her mind? How does it affect her physical? Whatever it is. I need to learn instead of sitting there like, nah, nah, you ain't... Why? Why would I do that? Why would I? She's going to get to her life real soon. She'll be 18.

It's happening. So why would I stunt your growth as a human being while you're living under my roof? And I know one day you're going to better do what you want to do. So this is what you want to do. You want to play sports? You want to dance? You want to do this? Let me help you do it because we have resources.

We have people we can contact. We have people that, you know what know i mean that can open up doors and so for me man it's parenting is not making you in my likeness right you look like me that's enough that's it but you're not me right and so i got to get to know you and a lot of parents either don't want to do it because that's actually been apparent right can't do it because of circumstances. Can't do it because, once again, circumstances of how community is going to look at you, how the men are going to look at you at work. I understand the journey. I understand that everyone can't just be accepting

and open arms about it. I get it. But also in the midst of this, understand that you're stunning the growth of your kids. We have a small window when we have an impact on our kids' lives. Right, okay. Right, a small window that's ending in my life was I. She's turning 16.

Right. Yeah, as we go on, I'll still be, but that impact and that voice that I have. But you ain't gonna be up under your roof. She'll be out on her own, and then. So what am I teaching her? What lessons am I teaching her about the world that she's going out in?

Right. That the world only looks this way? No, baby, the world is unique. The world is colorful. So my daughter, she's going out in. That the world only looks this way? No, baby. The world is unique. The world is colorful. So my daughter, she's going out in this world and she's finding people that looks like her, that talks like her, that has the same dreams as her, the same thoughts as her.

Just like I did in the NBA. I found people that was connected with me. And that was my community. And so it's just a different community to me. And I just look at it different man man you mean you still me i mean you'll be blown up the other man the weather's well i'm listening i don't know how i'm always in pop culture man yeah you are you and gabby and well my wife your wife because she made the comment about you and her split 50 50

yeah can you can you can you get into that can you clarify what you mean? That's very unique. I don't know if I've ever heard of a situation, especially a married couple. Okay, we dating. That thing might be, you know, hey, I got the movie tickets, you get the popcorn and the candy. You know, if we take us out to dinner, you leave the tip, you do the valet. But she's like 50-50 household, and I think she kind of explained it. But I got you here so you can explain it. You know what I was saying? I was like, you know what's crazy? When you have, it's think pieces

that's going around the world about me and my wife. And I haven't given no color to this, but it's think pieces going around about me as a man. Make that man make his wife spend 50-50. What kind of man is that? I thought the same thing too deep with that.

You thought the same thing? Yeah, when you make up that, I said, how you gonna make that woman pay? He got all that cheese, he's making her pay 50-50. Alright, so let's talk about it. Let's talk about it. So the whole 50-50 concept. So I understand what 50-50 means. 50-50 means that everything in life, you got your half and I got my half.

Right. And we're going to put this shit together and try to make 100. Right. Okay? We're about to order a bottle with the groceries. You put in 100, I put in 100. That's how 50-50 goes. That's how we look at it.

That is not how our relationship works. All right? We don't... See, everybody thinks 50-50. They think, hey, if he getting a sandwich, you got to put 50 percent on that. Right. He got he got 100, 200, whatever people think I got. That's not how it works. Right. 50 50 in our household is first of all, let's say I have 20 to 50 responsibilities. Right. And my wife have 20 to 50 responsibilities. And when I say that, that means she has a mother.

She has her sisters. She has her dad, she has a lot of things that she's responsible for. Right. You know what she does? She pays 100% of that. Right. You know what I do? I pay 100% of my life.

When our life come together, my wife is a working actress who spends time away from the family to go work, do our job, feel. Right. We decided together, because I think I said one time when we was in Miami, I said something

about it being my house that I paid for. Uh-oh. My wife looked at me, she was like, you will never say that to me again when it's something

that we share. And so my wife was like, when we move to LA, I got half on it. You will never say my house again. Wow. She said,

you can say that in the arena. And so in our life, our home, 50-50, we purchased it together. Wow. She said, you can say that in the arena. And so, in our life, our home, 50-50, we purchase it together. Right. Our daughter, anything that goes on with our daughter, 50-50, we share it together. Now, there's some things I pick up versus some things she pick up, but she does something I do. I do something.

Right. If we take a yacht trip, we can do it 50-50, or I can do it myself. My wife is a working woman. Right. She's a boss and an independent woman of her own life. Right. She's like, I'm going to put, you know what, that little 200 that you was going to spend on this,

I'm going to throw something else on there and we're going to go on a bigger trip. Right. We're going to ball up. Like, this is my wife. Right. Right? Like, I don't know about y'all, but I like having a wife that's like, that's cool, you can do that. The house we live in, thank God, in nice house right whatever millions we could have had a house a

nice house on my 50 too right been it'd been nice right she was like no let me put something else on and let us live a little different oh yeah they got a little bigger so we probably shared three things in our life that we 50 50 on right everything Right. Everything else, I'm 1,000%, and she's 1,000%. Right. And so we decided that certain pieces of our life, we would share in it. But D-Wade, that works for y'all. Well, who, who, why does, why does it matter

if it's 75-25, if it's, if it's 85-15? That's your life. Why everybody is so consumed what goes on in everybody else's household when their household effed up? Well, listen, that's a whole nother story. And that's just the word. I don't lose no sleep. They're like, oh, man, you see that D-Wave make his wife. I mean, I was just saying, I was just joking. I wish I could make my, I don't make my wife do anything,

first of all. If I could, we wouldn't be in the headlines all the time. I'd be like, will you stop talking? You know what I'm saying? My wife is. She gonna respond now. You say something, you get out of pocket with her. Listen, my wife had this microphone way before I did. Y'all been watching Bring It On for a long time. Right, right. She been bringing it on for a long time.

So, like, when she say 50-50 and people take a clip of it, yeah, I understand. Like, I listen to all the pieces. I laugh. I'm like, ooh, okay, that's a point right there. I get that, but that ain't how we live. But I understand your point. They took it in this little interpretation.

50-50 everything. No, it don't work like that. I do all right for myself. But in certain moments that we want to do better together, we do better together. And first of all, listen, I told my wife, I said, hey, baby, listen, you're not about to be taking all this time away from the family, building your wealth while I'm spending all mine. Right. Well, I don't know where they do that at. All I know is, you know what I mean?

She come home and be like, hey, baby, hey, what's good? I move on from you. And I done spent all my cheese. Yeah, right, right. She done built all her cheese. She done built up. You know what I mean? Her stack went like this.

Her stack here. Yours went like that right there. You know what I mean? I told you how many kids I had before we started. Like, I had ex-wives. I got all kinds of stuff, right? Right. My cheese go all over the place. Right. She just built all her cheese and I'm spending all mine. started. Like, ex-wives, like all kind of stuff, right? Right. My cheese go all over the place.

Right. She just build on her cheese and I'm spending it on mine. Right. That's the way they do that at. You know, that's the... They don't do that the way... That's the yak talk. Yeah, yeah, you see?

You know, he don't put a dent in that bottle. You know what I'm saying? Ooh, I ain't do this by myself, though. I've been having a little swing every once in a while, but you done hit that thing about four times. So everybody think 50-50 means that, hey, baby, I need it. Hey, baby, I'm going to go get this sandwich. You got you got you got ten dollars on it. Right. Come on, y'all. Y'all got it.

Y'all got to be. Come on, man. Like y'all got to stop this. Y'all got to stop this small thinking. Right. I'm glad you cleared that up. But she did. She's like, oh, yeah, I signed a free note. Because what he had before he met me is what he had before he met me. Now what we accumulate together, that's what we got. That's what we rock with. Yeah. And that's the thing. Now, I told her the same way. I signed a prenup, too.

You a millionaire. You got money. You work hard for yourself. I think everybody should have a prenup. Why not? You get insurance, don't you? Right. I mean, I didn't have anything. I said, I'm going to sign a prenup. They're like, Sean, why are you going to sign a prenup? You ain't got nothing. I say, so, I mean, I ain't have it. When I didn't have anything, I said, I'm going to sign a prenup. They're like, Sean, why you going to sign a prenup?

You ain't got nothing. I say, so if I leave, I want 100% of my nothing. I don't want 50% of my nothing. Nothing. I don't want nothing. I want all of that. But what I don't want to do is if she decides to move on from me,

she got 200 and I got 10. Exactly. Exactly. Because I've been spending all my money on all these dance recitals, all these games, all these trips, everything.

And I'll just say, oh, man, take care of everything. I do. I take care of my mama. I take care of my daddy. I take care of boom, boom, boom, boom, boom. When it comes to me and my wife, I take care. And another thing, we go on trips. We go on all this stuff.

Y'all see the big trips. My wife would put on a big trip. It's a whole calendar year where I had to step in and I had to make sure that the relationship is spicy, that it's sexy, this and that. My credit card gets used through everything. You feel me? So yeah, we 50-50 in three. I got about 50 to 100 things that I pay for that I'm responsible for for everybody. So thank y'all for the think piece.

You have Zobby, your youngest daughter. Kavya. Kavya. Yeah. That you threw a surrogacy. And you said that you and your wife had a lot, a lot of miscarriages. And you had a conversation with her. You sat her down one night and said, baby, come on now.

I can't keep putting you through this. Yeah. Because you saw the pain and the anguish that it was causing her. Yeah, yeah. And as she's hurting, you're hurting even more because you know how bad she wants to be. Yeah, being a stepmom is fine, but there's something about your own. And you saw the pain that it was causing her and you said, baby, we ain't got to do this no more.

What was that conversation like? It was a tough conversation. As a man, you want to stay out the way and get out the way when it comes to this whole birthing conversation about kids because you won't do much. A minute or two. You get the fun part. You won't do much.

It took me a long time to even say that to my wife because I knew what was important for her and I also knew what was important for us. She knew I wanted a daughter. She knew I wanted to, you know, to grow my family. She knew I wanted to grow our family. Once we start having conversations about being a family and to watch her go down the journey. Um, if anybody know the journey, it's a lot of shots. Yeah. Um, it's a lot of doctor physics. It's a lot of things to make you feel like you're not, like that you're not a whole person, that you're empty, that you don't have this, that you don't have that.

It's a lot of... Is it because, did she feel less than a woman because she couldn't have a... But it's a lot of steps leading to that that make you feel less than. Yeah. Right, because it could take someone over here like this. They could have 12 kids. Yeah, yeah. And so being there, all the conversations with the doctors, Yeah. Right, because it could take someone over here like this. Yes. They could have 12 kids. Yeah, yeah.

And so being there, all the conversations with the doctors, all the conversations with my wife, all the pain, all the helping her take shots, all the watching her take shots, all the watching. For five years, the miscarriages, the... At the end of the day, for me, I was like, baby, I married you. I want to go down this journey of life with you. We don't know how long this journey is going to last. And so what this is doing is this is taking away from you.

This is putting your health in harm's way. This picture don't work without you. Right. So if it's no you, it ain't no expanding this family. Right. And so it became a point where we started becoming dangerous for her to continue to keep doing all the things she was doing for all the years. Right. And so that was a hard conversation for me to have.

Right. Because I'm not doing nothing. I'm just holding your hand. I'm just supporting. Right. I'm just listening. Right. My body's physically not going through any of these things.

Right. And so I don't want to step in in the way of our dreams and your journey. Mm-hmm. But at the end of the day, this journey don't, this picture don't. Not going to exist without you. This picture, no, we got to have a star in this movie. And you're the star in this movie. And so she listened because that's what it was about.

It was about getting to the ultimate goal of having, you know, our miracle child, having our daughter. Right. And every day I look at my daughter, man, I smile at her because she don't even know how much work went into getting her here. How much her mother wanted her. How much her dad wanted her and everybody around the doctors and the surrogate mother and all the people that helped her helped us get to this point where we're able to every

day wake up and hear daddy and hear mommy from my daughter. I'm going to get you out of here on this one, D-Way. There was some infidelity in the relationship or there's something that transpired. Was it harder for you to sit down and have a conversation and to tell her that something had happened outside the relationship or losing the finals?

Way harder to have a conversation with my now wife. Right. Who wasn't at the time, but my now wife about it like you try to think of everything possible because you think about what you're going to say and you're also thinking about how she's going to react yeah i mean you're thinking about it all right it's all scary one the whole situation is is scary enough right your public figure that's right yeah yeah yeah but you you've heard you know that this is going to hurt someone. You know it's going to hurt.

You know it's going to hurt. That you've been building a relationship with and a life with. Mm-hmm. Right? Yeah. And no matter what people say

on the outside or what people want to think, this and that, like, ultimately, like, you got to sit with you and you got to sit with this person and this is who you're going to be with. Right.

And I had to. I had to sit with my wife about this. Well, my now wife about this. And have this conversation. You told her before it became public. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I did. Because I don't know, D-Wade, if she'd have stuck with you,

if that thing had come public and you didn't have the conversation with her. Man, listen, let me tell you. I couldn't have gotten through that moment without her sticking with me. You know what I mean? We were in the playoffs, I think, even going into the finals, whatever year that was. Man, that was a rough time for me, playoffs. I think even in going into the finals that whatever you know, was man. It was that was a rough time for me bro. So you got a lot on your mind.

You got a lot on your mind. You're keeping you know, you're keeping something from people you love right? And it's heavy at night when it get quiet. Yeah uses you and your thoughts. Yeah, them thoughts is loud and you're in it gets it gets loud up in this mind. And so it came to a point where yeah way before you know and i tried to pussyfoot around it i tried to break up with her yeah hey you know things have been bad lately hey we've been having a little distance in our relationship anyway like i tried all that she kept showing up and so it hasn't been perfect it would never be perfect but that was nine years ago right and we

still we go to therapy right in the therapy right we've had shouts about it we've had regular conversations about it and so it's been something that is going to continue to be something that i have to work at and work on it doesn't go away because years come or because i say i'm sorry or whatever it is and so is that the hardest part of it anyway to know that you've done this and it's probably always going to be a source of contention it's always going to be something that could possibly be brought up it might be 10 years from now it might be 15 you guys might be 75 years old yeah and you still might have to well when it comes to my wife and I, yeah, that's hard. It's always there.

But when it comes to my son, that's hard for him. This is going to always be there. He's done nothing. Sustained as on him for no reason. And I think about that more than I... We're adults.

We're going to get through it or we ain't going to get through it. Right. Right. We're adults in this space. Right. This is a young kid. Right. Who has already got a negative impact next to his name.

Right. And he hasn't even had a chance to accomplish it. Right. And he already got a negative next to his name because of how he was brought into this world. And I think about that. I think about my, you know, son that bears my name. Right. And I think about my wife.

Like, of course, I think about all my kids. I think about it all. But ultimately, what I do know is at the end of the day, this is my family. This is my story.

Yep. We gonna get through this. How are we gonna get through it? Right. But we gonna get through it. You feel me? Yeah. And so, you know,

I think, you know, i think you know time distance space it doesn't help it um but it makes it it allows you to see things differently when you have time away from it and so my wife and i nine years later are in a different space where we even had different conversations about that moment about the future of my son, about how we want to incorporate, how we want to be. And that's just one aspect of this long journey. But ultimately for me it's all about making her understand that I'm continuing to grow,

I'm continuing to work on myself'm continuing to, you know, to work on myself. Not understand, but show her. Right. Right? And she's showing me. Right. This goes both ways, but in this instance,

but also two at the same time, love my kids. Right. This is my story. Right. And I didn't ask for it to all be this way. Right.

I don't know what's coming in the future, but right now, this is all mine. And so as good as it look, or as bad as it seems, it's mine. Right. And I'm thankful to even have the good in my life, and I'm also thankful to have the things that's a little uncomfortable to talk about and deal with and experience, because that makes you live a full life. Right. And so that's all I'm trying to do, is trying to figure out a way to live a full life together congratulations on the hall of fame

congratulations on the wine, wine sellers go out and get you a couple of bottles D-Wade, appreciate you bro thank you bro, I appreciate it We'll be right back. in all the big guns from NFL media like Colleen Wolfe. Subscribe today and you'll immediately be smarter and funnier than your friends. Listen now on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.