Club Shay Shay - Nightcap - Hour 1: Mike McCarthy future, Jets dysfunction, Bengals beat Browns

Episode Date: December 28, 2024

Shannon Sharpe and Chad “Ochocinco” Johnson recap the top stories from Week 16 of the NFL season including Mike McCarthy’s future with the Dallas Cowboys, Aaron Rodgers addresses the Athletic's article on dysfunction within the New York Jets organization, Joe Burrow and the Cincinnati Bengals defeat Myles Garrett and the Cleveland Browns and much more!03:18 - Pete Carroll eying head coach job in Chicago05:10 - The Bengals looking forward07:30 - Jerry Jones gushes about Mike McCarthy16:11 - Aaron Rodgers and the Jets culture24:10 - The MVP race is not over31:30 - Bengals vs. Browns42:44 - Lions vs. Bears49:10 -Falcons vs. Giants(Timestamps may vary based on advertisements.) #Volume #ClubSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Hey there, it's Michael Lewis, author of Going Infinite, Moneyball, The Blind Side, and Liars Poker. On the latest season of my podcast, Against the Rules, I'm exploring what it means to be a sports fan in America and what the rise of sports betting is doing to our teams, our states, and ourselves. Join me and listen to Against the Rules on America's number one podcast network, iHeart. Open your free iHeart app and search Against the Rules. Listen to Against the Rules on the I Heart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts.

What's up everyone? It's Justin Penick from John Boy Media, the host of the Football Today podcast with Bobby Skinner and Chris Rose. We roll three times a week on Mondays, on Wednesdays, on Fridays, breaking down everything you need to know about the NFL. We're gearing up for the NFL playoffs. I hope you can join us. Join in with us three times a week. Listen to football today on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever. You get your podcasts and you will be glad you did. The forces shaping markets and the economy are often hiding behind a blur of numbers. So that's why we created The Big Take from Bloomberg podcasts to give you the context

you need to make sense of it all. Every day in just 15 minutes, we dive into one global business story that matters. You'll hear from Bloomberg journalists like Matt Levine. A lot of this BIMstock stuff is I think embarrassing to the SEC. Follow The Big Take podcast on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you listen. Hey everyone, I'm Madison Packer, a pro hockey veteran going on my 10th season in New York. And I'm Anya Packer, a former pro hockey player and now a full Madison Packer stan. Anya and I met through hockey and now we're married and mom to two awesome toddlers, ages two and four.

And we're excited about our new podcast, Moms Who Puck, which talks about everything from pro hockey to professional women's athletes to raising children and all the messiness in between. So listen to Moms Who Puck on the iHeart Radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Happy holidays from me, Michael Rapoport, and my gift to you is a free subscription

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According to Adam Shepard, Pete Carroll has expressed interest in the Chicago Bears head coaching job and would like to return to the sideline next season. Three teams, the Bears, the Jets, the Saints are in the market for a head coach who can help reset their culture. Few coaches have had it more effective than Caroling doing that. Caroling is one of the four head coaches that led teams to both national championships and Superbowls. Barry Switzer, Jimmy Johnson, and Jim Harbaugh.

I like, I like Pete, but not in Chicago. They need an offensive. They need, look, they can get a defensive, but not in Chicago. They need an offensive. They need, look, they can get a defensive, but he has to go scour and get from a college, maybe even a college OC. Yeah. That's creative. That knows how to work with the skills of what Caleb Williams possess. He can't, he can't go get one of those conventional guys that he had in, in, in

Seattle, that ain't go get one of those conventional guys that he had in Seattle. That ain't going to work. Yeah. No, you know what I think? Now we talk about the Chicago job and I like what you said about Pete Carroll, who is a player's coach. I think the coach, I mean, the players will graduate to gravity gravitate towards him, but you do need a officer coordinator that has the creativity

that can, that can help Caleb Weir use some of, use his skillset to adaptability, you know, and what he's able to do. Yeah. Uh, another, another job. Now we talked about Mike McCarthy, right? We just talked about the night. Ben Johnson. Oh, I like that. You think about this, Ben Johnson, Dallas Cowboys, head coach.

You know, I haven't heard his, I heard his name mentioned before, but it was never with the Cowboys. I think Ben Johnson would be the perfect fit for the Cowboys and working with that and bringing some of that creativity that he does over there in Detroit. Now he doesn't have the same personnel to be able to do some of the things he did, but based on what you have and what he knows he has, there's strengths and the weaknesses of the players on that team. I think we will do some damage as that head coach.

Hell, matter of fact, head coach and offensive coordinator keep calling the players there in Dallas too. If the opportunity presents itself. When we win Saturday, we play Saturday, if I'm not mistaken. When we play and win Saturday, then we will take care of business. Y'all from the Broncos? The Steelers. Right now we focus on the Broncos.

Bronco country. We focus on the Broncos. Bronco country. Because after that game, Bronco who? I'm sorry y'all they got no, y'all talking about welcome to the jungle. Because after that game you not going to be. Y'all got. Yeah, yeah.

Hey that's, hey it's a jungle. It's a jungle now. No y'all we keep y'all. Believe that. It's a jungle now. It's a jungle now. It's a jungle now. It's a jungle now. It's a jungle now. It's a's a jungle it's a oh it's it's a jungle now

No, y'all we believe y'all. We'll be playing y'all that we going to my high And so what you think for the half country what you think for that matter of fact, I'm gonna go to that game Matter of fact, I'm gonna go to that game. Hey, hey Patrick 13, Jr. Do you realize gonna do it when they don't know what they have out there when they target PS2 huh their QB their rating is like 36.1 you come out better just throwing the ball in the dirt you have a high quarterback rating if you just threw the ball in the dirt already over so you want you want to bet some on a matchup?

Three bands. You don't want none. I owe you how much? Well let's double or nothing. How do you go through the bank? Double or nothing. Don't pay money from the bank. Double or nothing. Don't pay them back and say you owe them money. Give me double. Give me money. Don't make no money. I I want to give me double what I borrowed from you and I'll pay you back No, you ain't good for if you were good for it I don't have it for it though my money drawing interest in your pocket Doubling nothing. Mm-hmm Well, you know what double it up then one thing about it I'm gonna get out Don't you know, we'll double it up then. Cause one thing about it, I'm going to get out of here. Cause you know I'm good for it.

Well we ain't going to fight cause I, listen, I'm not going to jail. I'm not going to jail. You know what I tell people right here, if I can't get you up off me, you're welcome to stay. I probably get that ball like that for you. If you get on me and I can't get you off, feel free to stay. I promise you that. That's all I got for you. If you get obese and I can't get you off, feel free to stay there. But I promise you, I bet I'll make you turn me loose. Jerry Gushes on Mike McCarthy after the Cowboys win. This would be a very interesting question.

Hopefully Ocho can get connected real soon. Mike McCarthy's job say, yeah, I've never seen a team seem to be so happy with winning, what are they seven, they seven and eight now? I've never seen a team so happy to win seven games. This is the Dallas Cowboys, a team that has Super Bowl aspirations, have playoff aspirations, a deep playoff run considering the last three years. They've won 12 games. They've been 12 and five the last three years.

Now all of a sudden they celebrate the B seven and eight. And, and all of a sudden, I guess, you know, Mike McCarthy is back in Jerry's good graces, he told me he was surprised. He was, he was glad the way he got them guys to play. I thought that's what the head coach job was supposed to be. I thought that's what he was supposed to do. I thought he was supposed to get the guys to play hard every single game. I thought guys you collecting a check.

I thought you're supposed to play hard and show up every game. But I guess not in Dallas. I mean, if you're out of the playoffs, you're supposed to not play hard in the coach job to get you to play hard and to earn your check. That's just me, I guess we just looking, I guess we just looking at it, we look at it through different lenses.

It's gonna be very interesting. Do I think Jerry is gonna bring Mike McCarthy back? I do, I do. Because he loves the power. He doesn't want any to give up any control. And I think we all can say this, that Mike McCarthy is head coach in title only. Jerry still does everything.

Jerry does all the speaking. Jerry lets you know who's playing, who's signing. He doesn't have, McCarthy doesn't have any say over the final 53. He doesn't have anything in three agency. He doesn't have, McCarthy doesn't have any say over the final 53. He doesn't have anything in three agency, he doesn't have. So Jerry likes that. Nobody's that's gonna challenge him for his, or his opinion on things.

I mean, Jerry gets to go uncheck and I get it, he's the owner, but I don't think he does his coaches any service by emasculating them, by letting the players know that he's in charge and not the coach. And I'm just a firm believer that the teams that I've built apart that's been successful, and I've had a little success in a field

is that you have one voice, you have one sound. And right now, the one sound, and it doesn't come from the owner. It comes from the guy that stands before those guys on a daily basis in that locker room in that meeting room and And try to get those guys on one accord and it's just hard for me to believe that that will end up happening With what Mike McCarthy but it's not it's not the coach is Jerry Jerry has his way of doing things Jerry's not gonna change no matter how much

Us in the media we talk about it. No matter how much the fans talk about it. Um, Jerry likes it this way. He likes the control that he has. I think Jerry is more interested in, in, in, in money, um, that he is winning championships because it doesn't matter. They're the most valuable franchise, uh, in pro sports. So it doesn't matter if they win. It doesn't matter if they lose, it doesn't matter if they lose

because they're gonna make a boatload of money. They're $10 billion. So they're gonna make a boatload of money regardless. So with that being said, I don't think Jerry changes anything. And moving forward. But we'll see. We'll see what happens. I mean, it sure sounded like Jerry wanted

to keep Mike McCarthy, but things can change. I don't know. Maybe if they crash out these last two games, maybe Jerry changes his mind. Maybe, hey, they win these last two games. Jerry might give them a three or four year contract extension. It's going to be very, very interesting.

Um, what happens with Mike McCarthy and the Dallas Cowboys? Um, when these final two games wraps up, it's going to be very, very interesting. I'm interested to see. I think all of you guys have been interested to see. I think you kind of guys know, um, where, uh, kind of where this thing is headed. So it's going to be very, very interesting to see how these Cowboys and Mike McCarthy and Jerry Jones played out.

They've had a very, very disappointing season. I think everybody can attest that. I'm nobody surprised by that. This is not what we expected from the Cowboys. We thought this year they were gonna make a, no, I didn't think that, but a lot of people thought they were gonna make a deep playoff run because every year you hear this is the most talented team you know I don't think

they're talented that talented I think CD is a phenomenal wide receiver they need a running back Diddle has played better over the last six weeks of the season offensive line needs some improvements digs it good, but he's nicked again. Gonna be interesting to see how he comes back. They have some players, but I think they need to improve on the offensive line, defensive line, defensive line, get better in that interior, but we'll see. Is Ocho good?

Ocho, can you hear me? Yeah, we were talking about Jerry Gushing over Mike McCarthy. Do you think Mike McCarthy's job- You know, that's all a game. That's all a game. You understand an owner's behavior patterns when it comes to players, when it comes to coaches because you win a game or something happens good in a short time span, but they don't forget how they played the entirety of the season. Mike McCarthy's job is not

safe. Jerry Jones knows that. Gushing like that and saying nice things to have him thinking or to have the public thinking to draw attention not only to himself knowing that Mike McCarthy's not going to be the head coach next year is a it's full of shit. It's full of shit and he's done it before. He's done it with players and he's done it with coaches. This is, this is the one, two, three, uh, four time he's done something like this. I'm not going to bring up the names where he's gussed about them and said good things about them, including players.

In season when they're playing well and things have happened behind closed doors and they've been fired and they lost their job. So you think Mike McCarthy is going? Absolutely. He's not, not only, not only is he looking for another coach, he's not looking for a big name. He's looking for someone else who can be, I hate saying this and excuse me, I mean, no disrespect to Mike McCarthy, someone that can be a puppet, someone where he can

still be the center of attention, but he thinking, or he going to want to go in a different direction to see who we can have that can be the leader of men That can get them to winning like they did Like they did before the previous to the previous three or four before this year Well, they went 12 and five if I'm not mistaken over and over even though they lost in the first round of playoffs He's looking for someone else new He just is and in saying the saying the things that he said he's always saying good things He's always saying good things.

Like when they're winning or they win a game or they beat a certain team and all of a sudden that team, that Pacific Cowboys team all of a sudden looks like the Cowboys of the nineties when they won when they won championships. Like it just, it just, it just says anything. You take a grain of salt. Hey there, it's Michael Lewis, author of Going Infinite, Moneyball, The Blind Side, and Liar's Poker. On every season of my podcast Against the Rules, I take a broad look at various characters

in American life. The referee, the coach, the expert. My next season is all about fans and what the rise of sports betting is doing to them, to the teams, and even to my family. I'm heading to Las Vegas and New Jersey and beyond to understand America's newest form of legalized gambling. Listen to Against the Rules on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts.

What's going on everybody? This is Justin Penick from Jamboy Media, the host of the Football Today podcast alongside Bobby Skinner and Chris Rose. We're rolling three times a week on Mondays, on Wednesdays, on Fridays, breaking down everything you need to know about the NFL. We're talking about the MVP race. Is Josh Allen going to pull it out?

Lamar Jackson? Can Saquon Barkley even break the rushing record? Can the Steelers keep up their momentum? We talk about everything. We break it down. Stats, analytics, and of course Chris Rose is bringing his perspective on being a pro in the media world as well. Listen to football today on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts and you will be glad you did. Hope you could join us for the post-season run.

The forces shaping markets and the economy are often hiding behind a blur of numbers. So that's why we created the Big Take from Bloomberg Podcasts, to give you the context you need to make sense of it all. Every day in just 15 minutes, we dive into one global business story that matters. You'll hear from Bloomberg journalists like Matt Levine.

A lot of this boomstack stuff is I think embarrassing to the SEC. Amanda Moll, who writes our Business Week buying power column. Very few companies who go viral are like totally prepared for what that means. And Zoe Tillman, senior legal reporter. Courts are not supposed to decide elections. Courts are not really supposed to play a big role in choosing our elected leaders. That's for the voters to decide.

Follow The Big Take podcast on the iHeart Radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you listen. Hey everyone, I'm Madison Packer, a pro hockey veteran going on my 10th season in New York. And I'm Anya Packer, a former pro hockey player and now a full Madison Packer stan. Anya and I met through hockey and now we're married and moms to two awesome toddlers. And on our new podcast, Moms Who Puck, we're opening up about the chaos of our daily lives between the juggle of being athletes, raising children, and all the messiness in between.

We're also turning to fellow athletes and beyond to learn about their parenthood journeys and collect valuable advice, like FIFA World Cup winner Ashlyn Harris. I wish my village would have prepared me for how hard motherhood was going to be. And Peloton instructor and Ratchet Mom Club founder, Kirsten Ferguson.

And I remember going in there hot mess. So listen to Moms Who Puck, a production of iHeart Women's Sports and Deep Blue Sports and Entertainment on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of iHeart Women's Sports.

Hey, I'm Miles Gray. And I'm Jack O'Brien. We're the hosts of The Daily Zeitgeist, and we want to tell you about... Miles and Jack got mad boosties an NBA podcast from iHeart Radio. We nailed that. This is a weekly podcast about all the amazing moments

that keep all of us NBA fans coming back for more. Basically, if you love basketball and you like to laugh, listen to Miles and Jack got mad boosties on NBA podcast on the I Heart Radio app, Apple podcast or wherever you get your podcast brought to you by hypnotic. Oh, Joe, less than a week after the athletic published a story detailing the dysfunction within the New York Jets organization, Aaron Rodgers used his latest appearance on the Pat McAfee Show to address leaks to journalists. There are some interesting things that go on in every organization.

Some that would like to be left uncovered, but it seems like there are those that don't always get left uncovered. They get covered. It can't be the norm that so many leaks and so many people continue to have conversations whether it's getting some sort of anger revenge or even what people who are still in the building. Yeah.

And he say nothing was untrue. But anyway, okay. Obviously what's best for the Jets is not having those types of leaks all the time When you get when that gets figured out, it'll be a little easier to win That doesn't hurt that doesn't have a direct impact on players in the field But it does have an impact on the culture and the chemistry and overall energy of the building That's what needs to get better. I love how you talk about the culture and the energy

When that wasn't an issue with the mandatory mini camp That wasn't he didn't concern himself about culture. I Mean I'm trying to figure out how does he think a culture gets established? Yeah, does he understand how a culture get established Tom Brady was not missing many camps in order for the Patriot way, which was the Brady way, but it's the Patriot, it's a team, because it's the Patriots that started coming out

at the Super Bowl introduction as a team. Now everybody comes out of the team, because prior to that, they brought the offense out or they brought the defense out. The Patriots came out of the team, but Tom Brady was the foundation piece. Okay. How can Tom Brady show up the mandatory mini camp or OTAs and

somebody else not be there? Right. How does Peyton Manning, how does Ray Lewis, how does these guys show up? The great thing about a leader. And that's what I tell young people today, you can never ask more than you're willing to give. You can't ask somebody to do something that you're not willing to do your damn self.

So how do I tell guys, guys, we need to show up? Guys, we need to be here. Let's spend a little extra meeting time. Guys, go look at your, hold on, bro. You remember that mandatory mini camp we had? Yeah. Guys will look at your sideways. Hey, do you think he lost respect to his players, respect to his teammates?

You know, you think about how we view Aaron Rodgers on the outside. I'm curious of how the players in the locker room view him. Obviously, I've never played with anyone like that. It has some of the issues that he does have, says some of the things that he does say, misses some of the important things when it comes to the game of football. I've never been on a team with someone like that, so I'm curious how today's players, this era of type of no-nonsense, do-it-your-way, the kind of culture we have now and the type

of individuals we have in today's game, the young era, as I call it. I wonder how they view them as teammates. I'm not sure. I'm curious, yeah. Me from a distance? Yeah. Based on my experience, I look at Aaron Rodgers as an influence in the locker room,

not a leader in the locker room. What would you say influence? Not influence. The influence hasn't been good Now influence has been bad. It hasn't been good. It hasn't been good. It hasn't been bad. It hadn't been.

You tell me. Listen, they say you might be teammates, but you're not here to be friends. You're here for one job. And the job that he's there for ain't getting done. Yeah. It's hard when you played that position because you're normally you ask the guys you're asking, look at the teams that win and look at the leaders in the

locker room, look at Brady, look at Manny, look at a Lewis, look at those guys. They win consistently. They win because they do things and when they ask someone else to do it, it's not a problem because that guy knows this is exactly what Tom Brady is doing. This is exactly what Ray Lewis is doing. This is exactly what Peyton Manning is doing. This is exactly what John Elway is doing. This is exactly what Ray Lewis is doing. This is exactly what Peyton Manning is doing. This is exactly what John Elway is doing. Now I ask you to do something.

And you're not doing said things. And I know you're not doing said things. That's a little bit. I love it. Look, I love, I love, I love the things that I do about love about seven. And I wanted for my leader, is I wanted football to be the most important thing. Because you telling me, you telling me

you want it to be the most important thing to me. You say, Sheldon, I want you to study. Sheldon, I want you to be in the best physical condition you possibly can be. I want you to study. Sheldon, I want you to be in the best physical condition you possibly can be. I want you to give it your all. Mm-hmm. But that's not what you're doing. Right.

How can you ask a man to do something that you're not willing to do? That's every story. Yeah, stories are going to get out. I think more stories have got. But stories got out in Green Bay. That's how we found out that the Packers did not run the hiring, Matt LaFleur hired by Aaron Rodgers.

That's how we found out that, that, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, Murphy, Mark Murphy said, don't you be the problem. Yeah, on purpose. They leaked things. Things are leaked on purpose. Yes. Yeah. I mean, he knows, I mean, he should know.

I mean, you've been around the NFL long enough to understand how things get out. No, there's always a source. There's always a leak. And things that come out, they come out on purpose. There's a reason for it, you know? I think, I think, is that, and people like, oh, that's, you have to understand there's a reason why the Shepters and the Shums and rest his soul, Chris Mortenson and the Jay

Glazer, there's a reason why they have jobs. They fostered and cultivated relationships with individuals, be it players, be it coaching, be it owners, be it general managers. And so when stuff comes out, why are we shocked? Right. You heard it. You just didn't want to believe it because it was about your favorite team. It was about your favorite players. So you didn't want to believe it, but it was on the wall.

It does. Um, look, I had a great room. Adam Shepard. I came into the league together. He was in Denver. I used to go, I used to go to dinner with Adam Shepard and his parents when they came to town. I had that type of relationship.

Right. But you ain't get no football stuff out of Shannon now. Our relationship is our relationship. Hey, you came in, you were the rookie, I was the rookie together. Hey, we love, hey, that was the extent of it. I'm not giving you no information. I've had, for the most part, I've always had great relationships, be it Mark Kisler, Woody Page,

you know, all the guys that wrote for Denver. Bob Kravitz, Bob Kravitz, he writes, I think he's a columnist in Indie now. He was in Denver. I've always had great relationships with him. Um, Bob Travis, Bob Travis, he writes, I think he's the columnist in Indy now. He was in Denver. I've always had great relationships with them. They asked me, I'll be as honest as I possibly can, but you watching the game, but I'm not giving you no information of such and such as he's not, he's dogging it and he missed practice and he didn't come to meetings.

I don't do none of that stuff like that. I was on first take and I say, no, MVP is not over. It is not over. And that's why I always advise people. And I used to vote for a decade, I had a vote. I voted for the MVP. I voted for the all protein. I voted for the war,

so until, you know, offensive player of the year, defensive, so forth and so on. And I waited to the very end and I took it serious. And I obviously, you know, being in the studio, get an opportunity to watch all the games, I ain't just watching highlights I'm watching cause that's why I felt very comfortable. I took it serious. I'm not just going by, excuse me guys.

I'm not just going by names because I think the all pros team is serious because you talk about the best players, regardless of conference. So I'm just about your name. Your name means nothing. Nothing. I'm based it on play that year. I'm not trying to take away the, uh, the, the all pro team that you got selected on before, that's not what I'm trying to do, but if I don't feel you deserving of

that, that, that honor this year, I'm not going for you is really that simple. Yeah. But, uh, Lamar and I said this, I said, y'all got to look at Lamar's stats. I mean, the man has 37 touchdowns, four picks, and then you throw in his Russian total, so he's 40 touchdowns with like six or seven turnovers. You look at his passing numbers, that's what Aaron Rogers was doing when he was winning MVP. Going 40 plus touchdowns with single digit interceptions. That's what he's doing. Now I do think, and you can correct me if I'm wrong, Big Light, but hold on, he got a guy that's rusted 1600 yards in his backfield. So what are we going to do with that?

Right. And so I think that, you know, his numbers are his numbers. Now, right now, if I had a vote, I probably would vote for Lamar. Right. I would vote for Lamar. Is your vote swayed because of the performance that Josh Allen had? Yeah. Just like it was swayed when Lam? Yeah. Just like it was swayed, just like it was swayed when Lamar lost and it didn't, just like it was swayed when he played against Pittsburgh. Remember? He didn't play well. Right. This week he came back and he played better.

And you look at the last couple of weeks, Josh Allen had like 10 touchdowns in two games. How can it not? But we got to be fair. We got to evaluate it on what we we see they got two games left. I Do believe Lamar Jackson? Can we it'd be interesting to see I bet those odds for Josh Allen winning the MVP ain't what they started today I bet you that what are the odds now? Well, he started at minus 900 today, right I

Think he started at minus 900 today, right? I think he started at minus 900. You know what I don't like? I don't like the fact that when it comes to the MVP award, it's an individual accomplishment, but when it comes to what's necessary to win it, as far as the team success as well, they take that into account as well. Cause if we were talking about MVP from a statistical standpoint in stats, I look at Joe Burrow and why is he not in the conversation? And then everyone says, well, the team itself is losing. So therefore he's not, you know, he's, he's not, I mean, he, I mean, he go,

I mean, there's a chance, I mean, he doesn't make the playoffs. You never going to get the MVP on the guy that didn't make the playoffs. Right, right, right. But no, no, um, and that's the thing. I think, um, Joe has had a phenomenal season. Now had they have a, they had a record similar to, uh, Lamar's or they had a record similar to Josh Allen, we got to, we got a record similar to Josh Allen. Right. We have a case. We got a whole different discussion. Yes.

Yes. But I mean, the guy can be pleased and the guy was, what is they, he's seven and eight can be really... I know it's tough, but again, that's why I just said how the goalposts move when it comes to discussion on a trophy that's based on individual accomplishment and accolades on what you've done individually. Right. You know, so using the team success as a reason why you can't be in the conversation. It throws me off just a tad bit.

Because at the end of the day, what does those stats mean if you're not winning? Because at the end, and this is what I used to argue with, with, uh, with my cohost, uh, my partner on first, um, on, uh, undisputed, I said, still a stat award. You're not the, you go 15 and O and you got 3000 yard passing and another guy goes 10 and six and he's got 5,000 yard passing and 40 touchdowns and you got 3000 yards and 20 touchdowns, you're not winning that award. Go back and look, look at all those years Drew Brees was throwing for 5,000 yards, how many MVPs did he win?

You right. Yeah, it's a stat award, but I need those stats to equate the wins. Right. So if I'm piling up a bunch of stats, Ocho, and I ain't getting no wins, cause people go like, oh, bro, yeah, yeah, well, hell, you behind all you doing is you stat pad.

Right. Cause none of those numbers goes towards win. Right. Like I said, y'all don't believe it. Go back and look at Drew Brees and look how many, I think he got four or five, 5,000 yard passing season. But when you lose it, how can I give you an award like that? Because your stats doesn't equate to win.

Lamar's stats is equating to wins. Jared Goff, although he doesn't have, I mean, he had an outstanding day today. You look at Josh Allen, his numbers equates to wins. Right. Saquon, his numbers equates to wins. But I think the only thing that's really hurting Lamar is that he got a 16, almost a 1700 yard rush in his backfield. Right.

Who's averaging five and a half yards of care. He's got 13, 14 rushing touchdown. When I think about it, you know, chat, y'all might not like this and uncle, you might not like this. I mean, Joe Burrow hasn't been in the conversation for MVP all season long because of our record. Yes. Right.

Correct. But the last two games, these last two games after we beat the Broncos on Saturday. I'm telling you right now, I'm letting you know right now, you know, Patrick Surtain Jr, you got to deal with Jamar chase and T Higgins. So at Bowl Nicks, ain't nothing. You going to get nixed. That's what's going to happen. Well, we're going to go into Pittsburgh the following week.

We're going to win that game. And then when we make it and we, we have an opportunity to go into the playoffs because the football guys happened to bless us. That MVP conversation will have to change. There's only there's a good chance Ocho. It gonna hurt. Y'all beat the Broncos and then lose the final game of the season. It's gonna hurt. That's gonna hurt. That's gonna hurt Ocho so bad because I know you're gonna be happy. What I tell you. I told you. Yeah. And you'll lose that leg. But that if they go hurt, that thing will hurt like star.

They say brand new shoes. It is, it is. And that would probably, that would probably be another moment that I will get emotional on camera and I don't care who laughed and I don't care if they make me a meme because I still love and bleed and live the game of football. Oh Joe, you're Bengals defeated the Browns 24 to 6. Jamar Chase passed 1500 yards, breaks his own franchise receiving yardage record.

I told you who he was. I told you. Garrett, Miles Garrett, got his 100th sack before turning 29 years of age. He tied the great Bruce Smith as the fourth fastest to get hundred sacks Bingles next play at home on Saturday if I'm not mistaken against the Broncos, correct? And we against who Broncos Guess who gonna win that game and I'm a beater. Matter of fact, I'm going to the game. I hope it's cold

I hope it's cold cuz y'all don't do well in the cold. You don't realize like Denver gets cold in Denver, right? It get cold in Cincinnati cold. You don't realize like Denver, it gets cold in Denver, right? It get cold in Cincinnati too, just as cold. Yeah, yeah, we used to the cold. Joe Burrow, 23 of 30, 252, three touchdowns, zero interception, he was sacked four times. They ran the ball 52 times for 116 yards. Chase Brown, 18at, 91 yards.

But it was T Jamar Chase six for 97 and the touchdown. He's going to win the triple crown. Nobody's even close to him in touchdowns, catches or yards. So he's going to get that. T hat eight for 58, one touchdown. How you say that name? Louis Vias? Uh, how you say that name? Louis Vias.

Just, just, just say Yoshi. Yoshi had three for 53. Had a touchdown on Joe. Uh, Cleveland. Hmm. Yeah. Miles Garrett looking to get up out of there. Yeah.

Yeah. I mean, you're looking to get up out of there. Yeah. I mean, he's looking to get up out of there, Ocho. Most times, normally with a player like that, a player of his caliber that doesn't cause any problems, he comes to play week in and week out regardless of what's going on. You know what you're going to get out of him. You want to, you understand that as a team, as an ownership, GM, you understand that you're in a rebuilding stage. You're going to have to find a quarterback, one that you can build.

Yes. And that you're in a rebuilding stage. As far as Mal Garret is concerned, if you care about the individual as a player, allowing not, how do I say it, not keeping them imprisoned while you're in a rebuilding stage, do right by the individual because he's always done right by you. Now most times when it comes to business, they don't think like that, but you would think in this case, in this scenario, after what he's already said and what he's done for you and what he's given that organization in that city, you give him an opportunity

to go play for a contender. And again, go ahead. I would think, I would think and hope they would, they would do the right thing. Um, until they, until they rectify their situation at the quarterback position. I mean, it's going to take a King's ransom to get it. You're talking about a guy that's 29 years of age, uh, premier doesn't miss time. He gives it to you every game. He's great against the rush.

Obviously it's a premier pass rusher, which that's what everybody's looking for. He can play plays the run. He's durable. He doesn't give you any problems on the field or off the field. When you go to bed at night, you don't worry having to worry about getting a call, say it, Hey, Miles Garrett is in trouble. You don't worry about that. He's one of those guys.

You rest real easy knowing that he's going to be professional both on and off the field at all times. And you can respect that and you appreciate that. Um, but it's probably going to take two first rounders, uh, maybe even a player, a quality player that's on your roster and some others, maybe a second or a third, he's not coming cheap nor should he, because what, if you're giving up that level of player, Ocho, I need to be able to replace him with draft picks.

Now there is no guarantee you're ever going to get a player to replay, to feel, to be what he was. But I got, I'm more, the problem is with Cleveland, they're more than miles garried away, so I would come out better, Ocho, you know what I'm saying? Getting draft picks on a potential player to try to and build from there. If I was just a miles Garrett away, I was like, nah, I'm going to keep it. And if I just get one player, but there are a lot of players away, Ocho, especially offensively.

Yeah. I think, I think honestly, defensively, I think they're good. I think they're sound. If they could have some adequate, consistent quarterback play that can move their ass up and down the goddamn field and be able to facilitate the ball that we've seen from them in spurts when certain quarterbacks have been in there, I think they'll be fine. But I mean, just right now, it's not what it is. And I would hope they do right by Myles Garrett and giving him the opportunity to go and play for a contender.

And Cleveland played them tough for as long as they possibly could, Ocho. It's just that they're undermanned at the quarterback position. They look at it, they ran the ball 24 times for a buck 46. So you getting what? Five, six, you getting basically six yards of carry, Ocho. You can't complain about that. Four gave you 11 for 92. Your quarterback has great legs,

he's a mobile quarterback, not that accurate. But you know, they got a touchdown, got a callback with holding, they've got another big first down, got that callback for holding. They're, you know, they're okay, but they're ways away offensively, Ocho. They're ways, they're, you know, they're okay, but they're ways away offensively, Ocho. They're ways, they're ways away.

They need a couple of wide receipts. I mean, Judy is good, but I mean, Judy's like, bro, even he's thinking like, man, if I just had a decent quarterback, y'all see what I can do if y'all got a quarterback and get me the rock. Y'all saw that in the last three weeks, but he got three targets for 20 yards,

three targets, two catches, 20 yards. What are you supposed to do with that? But, uh, absolutely nothing. But this, this is a game, a game like this. If I were Judy, you know, when I, I think about some of the times when I had Gus Farah, you know, when I had Scott Mitchell, when I had John Kidner and understanding that, you know, the offensive, the, the, the offensive play caller was going to be a little different, you know, the ball coming offensive play caller was gonna be a little different You know the ball coming to me was gonna be a little different

So what I would do what what I would do is is always before I leave or break the huddle boom I Call it mind fucking the quarterback. He already has enough to worry about huh? You don't want to bother quarterback He has to come to the line. He has to go through his reject He has to go through his progression his pre snap stuff. So always when the play is called, right before I leave the huddle, I tap his hip. All right now I'm here. And just, just that, just to let him know if you want somewhere to go with the ball. I don't care what the play call is. Hey, I don't care what the play call is.

I'm here. You know the, and I ain't listen. And then, uh, you know how I am. I know you've seen the clip before. I come out the huddle and I line up and I see coverage and it's man whether it's off or whether he's on. The first thing I do, you can hear it in the entire stadium. Just alert the quarterback.

All right. Now when you hear that sound, you know what time it is. Just take a quick peek now. You ain't got to do much to take a quick peek. Now if I hit you with that, I got you. Yeah, I'm feeling 99% 99.9% of the time. I got you like life insurance. I got tail carps and all the time.

Listen, you ain't got to do that. You ain't got to go through all that bullshit. Now I got you understand that. Yeah. But Ocho got you. Understand that. Yeah. But Ocho, you saw this again. Joe got sacked and the ball came out. Don't do that. Don't do that, man.

Don't do that. Don't do that. Say it. No, I hear you, but don't do that. Come on now. I understand. I know you understand. What happened, Ocho?

You had a seven point lead. What happened? Yeah, the ball came out. Okay know you. What happened Ocho? You had a seven point lead. What happened? Yeah, the ball came. Okay. Pittsburgh, Baltimore. You see what happening is and see the problem with fans don't understand is what you do understand. Yeah, you had a 14 point lead, but what happens when you don't have that lead?

You had that lead against Baltimore. You had a 10 point lead. And then what happened? You threw a pick. Yeah. You fumble, boom. Now you had a seven point lead against Kansas then what happened you threw a pick yeah you fumble boom now you had a seven-point lead against Kansas City script sack scoop and score Pittsburgh you threw two pick and you fumbled it

that's what gets you beat you play in Cleveland you're supposed to Molly walk Cleveland that office listen it's still Cleveland that The defense ain't bad now. But the offense works. They back. Yeah, the offense is worse. But the defense is still more good. And remember, this is a division game.

This is a division game. And for some reason, it's always close. Hell, look how the Bills been playing all season. And look how they struggled against the Patriots today. So it's something about those games. Steelers, Ravens, always close. It's never really a blowout most of the time. So I mean, listen, the Browns had their hands full.

Listen, they had to play against the greatest banger receiver of all time. Yep. The greatest player of all time. The first receiver to ever have 1500 yards of the season. 15 touchdowns, wait, 16 now. They ain't never seen nothing like that. Young Bull, he from New Orleans. Oh, he putting the work.

Boy, hey, Mike Brown kicking his own self in the ass. I don't know why they play with him. I don't know. Anytime you have a receiver that comes out after the draft, after getting drafted, and the first thing he says is, before he say anything else, I'm breaking every motherfucking record y'all got. That's it. Well, he didn say anything else, I'm breaking every motherfucker record y'all got. That's it. Well, he didn't curse, but I'ma curse for him. Just add a little seasoning to it.

Huh, you coming in with that type of moxie. That's what the white folk call it. They call it moxie. Hey there, it's Michael Lewis, author of Going Infinite, Moneyball, The Blind Side, and Liar's Poker. On every season of my podcast Against the Rules, I take a broad look at various characters in American life.

The referee, the coach, the expert. My next season is all about fans and what the rise of sports betting is doing to them, to the teams, and even to my family. I'm heading to Las Vegas and New Jersey and beyond to understand America's newest form of legalized gambling. Listen to Against the Rules on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts. What's going on everybody?

This is Justin Penick from Jumbway Media, the host of the Football Today podcast alongside Bobby Skinner and Chris Rose. We're rolling three times a week on Mondays, on Wednesdays, on Fridays, breaking down everything you need to know about the NFL. We're talking about the MVP race. Is Josh Allen gonna pull it out? Lamar Jackson? Can Saquon Barkley even break the rushing record?

Can the Steelers keep up their momentum? We talk about everything. We break it down. Stats, analytics, and of course Chris Rose is bringing his perspective on being a pro in the media world as well. Listen to football today on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts, and you will be glad you did. Hope you could join us for the postseason run. you need to make sense of it all. Every day in just 15 minutes, we dive into one global business story that matters. You'll hear from Bloomberg journalists like Matt Levine. A lot of this boomstack stuff is, I think, embarrassing to the SEC. Amanda Moll, who writes our Business Week buying power column.

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Hey everyone, I'm Madison Packer, a pro hockey veteran going on my 10th season in New York. And I'm Anya Packer, a former pro hockey player and now a full Madison Packer stand. Anya and I met through hockey and now we're married and moms to two awesome toddlers. And on our new podcast, Moms Who Puck, we're opening up about the chaos of our daily lives between the juggle of being athletes, raising children, and all the messiness in between. We're also turning to fellow athletes and beyond to learn about their parenthood journeys and

collect valuable advice, like FIFA World Cup winner Ashlyn Harris. I wish my village would have prepared me for how hard motherhood was going to be. And Peloton instructor and Ratchet Mom Club founder, Kirsten Ferguson. And I remember going in there hot mess. So listen to Moms Who Puck, a production of iHeart Women's Sports and Deep Blue Sports and Entertainment on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by Elf Beauty, founding partner of iHeart Women's Sports. Hey, I'm Miles Gray.

And I'm Jack O'Brien. We're the hosts of The Daily Zeitgeist, and we want to tell you about Miles and Jack Got Mad Boosties, an NBA podcast from I Heart Radio. We nailed that. This is a weekly podcast about all the amazing moments that keep all of us NBA fans coming back for more. Basically, if you love basketball and you like to laugh, listen to Miles and Jack, Got Mad Boosties, an NBA podcast on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcast,

or wherever you get your podcast. Brought to you by Hypnotic. The Lions defeated the Bears 34-17 even without Montgomery who was sidelined with an MCL injury and Chicago Giebs finished with 154 scrimmage yards. 109 of those came on the ground and a touchdown while having four receptions for 45 yards. Jerry Goff finished today 23-32, 3-36, three three touchdowns zero interception he also set a career high passing touchdowns in a season with 33 with two games to go yeah oh Joe you watched the Lions go on the road yeah soldier feel and do what they want to do who go out there and have fun. Take Motown to Chicago.

I had to hit the temptation moves to celebrate. Throwing the ball all over the place. Jamison Williamson doing what Jamison Williamson does. Amon Ross Saint Brown scoring. I don't know what kind of celebration that was in the goddamn football. Yeah, y'all do what you do. I don't know if you're gonna get fined for it.

Hey, that was Jameer Gibbs, right? He was like doing a stripper dance or something on the floor. I don't do what they do it. Right now Minnesota got this dancing thing on lock. Right now Minnesota, they got the choreo. They got the soccer. Listen, excuse me chat for being rude. Excuse me for being disrespectful. Whoever the young bull is for the Minnesota Vikings that did the celebration, we copied the lady who did the freestyle. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah.

At the Olympic. Did the celebration. I don't know young bull name, but that to me is one of the greatest celebrations of all time. And they just hit the white flag a couple weeks ago. Yeah, that's what I'm doing. And then they had the lady,

the lady and the day they do it. And they had the live and everybody do it. I said, what that? Cause you know the live, but then we wanted to get it. Hey man, let us see it. Nah, y'all about to mess this up. No, if y'all, if you rehearse it and get it right,

we'll let you participate. But Minnesota got the dancing thing on lock right now. But I was very impressed with Minnesota. the dancing thing on lock right now. But I was very impressed with Minnesota. You mean Detroit? Detroit, Detroit. They, Detroit. No, I'm saying Minnesota's choreography.

But Detroit, Coach Campbell, it's okay to take a field goal, bro. All these fours and threes, man, come on, man. I love it. Come on, kick the field goal and go off 37 17. It's okay Oh, okay Hey, he's really trying to run the score man. He only me. He don't even see it, you know, hey Dan is playing balls to the wall. He's the definition

Sure a visual representation of I don't give a fuck. I'm gonna do it my way I'm gonna do it. I'm gonna yeah, listen, I don't know what um, what's the do it my way. I'm gonna do it, I'm gonna, listen, I don't know what, what's the word, what's the word they say? Not tendencies, where, analytics. I don't care what analytics say. I'm going against it. I like Dan, I know his players got to love him, man. Playing, playing with somebody like- They way on Taylor. We've been playing

Would you say don't you? Obviously, Caleb Williams was 26 of 43 34 to touchdowns. He was sacked to a twice Ocho they just got to do a better job. I mean the first four possession. Yeah, plus two fumbles. Yeah, and you're down I mean the first four possession plus two fumbles and you're down Because then they get going but you're not good enough to spot a team and to overcome that deficit You're just not Keenan Allen was sensational 9'4, Buck 41 a touchdown, Rome a douzay, 4'7, DJ Moore 7'6 They didn't run the ball nearly enough, but you fall behind like that So basically you got to throw that you got to throw the the running game out the window

But with the golf when you run the ball like they do play action out, bro If James and William lined up on your side Safety Jonathan Owens If your quarterback is playing outside leverage, so you know you got the gold ball cup, the only thing that can hurt you, if he get on the top of you at the post, you better get on your ham horns so he can get back.

I don't know what you looking for, but he can run. And here's the thing, Ocho, one of them put hands on him, so you don't make him check his feet. So by his fourth step, fifth step, he fools feet. And so while you, hey, you go back and look at it, when they showed all 22, when that comes, when Stevenson opens up and he starts digging, when he steps up left foot in the dirt and the head's not closed, and only look, it's open.

Yeah. It's impossible to look up at that point if you're not already going. You got to know when to go. You got to know when to go. Anticipation, skills as a DB is understanding what's in front of you, who's in front of you. You got to know your competition. You got to.

If I'm on Tyreek side, Tyreek, and I know the cornerback, and I know the corner's opening up and he's taking away his outside for the goal. Oh, Tyreek ain't leading me to the post. He might run the dagger. I'm going to stay so far on that upfield shoulder. So far up. You would not beat me out of position. No, sir.

Not today. You, you have to, okay. I don't think guys do enough of study and understand tendencies because there are certain things I was not going to let a guy beat me with. You're not going to beat me with your strength. Now if you got a counter move, cause I'm going to take away the initial move. If I'm in past protection, I'm going to take away your initial move. If I know you try to get up field, I'm going to open up, I'm going to kick. But bro, they let these guys, you know that guy runs four three.

And you just like, exactly bro, no, that's not, that's not Kenan Allen you practice against. Kenan Allen is looking to shake your ass up. Jameson Williams is looking to take the top. Understand what you're up against, who you're up against. You'll be just fine. But I think these guys, a lot of times I was like, they just going out there and say, okay, he a wide receiver, no bro.

Some of these guys can really dig and you better understand that or you're going to be smelling deodorant. Oh Joe, the Falcons defeated the Giants 34 to seven. Michael Pinnix Jr. Gets his first win. It's only the second time a Falcons quarterback had led a team to a double digit win in his first NFL start. This Matt Ryan did it in 2008,

Pinnix finished 18 or 27 for 202 and an interception that should have been caught. It Kyle Pitts right in his head. Kyle Pitts threw it up in the air. So, hey, yes, it was against, it was against the two and 13 Giants, but hey, it is what it is. It's a Giants, but listen.

Giants now. It's a start. It's a start for the quarterback. A win like today, it builds confidence. It builds confidence. It's a good thing but let's start. It's a start. It's a start for the quarterback. A win like today, it builds confidence. It builds confidence. It's a good thing for the young fella. I know people on the outside looking in, oh, you beat the Giants.

There's nothing to hoop and holler about. But still, it's a team win. It's a good start for Brother Pennings Jr. and his tenure as a Atlanta Falcons quarterback. So, wait, wait. Then who they got next, huh? Who they got next? Who they got next? Do they have a test?

Commander Sunday night. Whoa, now you got a test. The Falcons had two pick sixes, Jesse Bates got one, Jesse Bates the third, excuse me, and edge rusher Matthew Judon. It's the first time that the team has had two pick sixes in one game since 1983. Oh landed right in his lap, man.

Big Six is the one game since 1983. Oh, landed right in his lap, man. Yep. They ran the ball 38 times for buck 28. They tried to take a lot of pressure off of Michael Pettis Jr. by running the football, but he made some great throws. Calp is gotta make that catch. Yeah.

It's really that simple, Ocho. Ain't nobody else saying the buss about it. And that's the thing. When you complain, it's funny how this work, Ocho. Yeah. It's really that simple, Ocho. Ain't nobody else saying a bus about it. And that's the thing. When you complain, it's funny how this work, Ocho. Yeah. When you complain about the ball, the ball find you and then you drop it. It happens every time.

All the time. It does. See, I can say it and be honest, because it happened to me. It happened to me. I complained about the ball at halftime. I complained about the ball in the third quarter. And Carson just throw that mother fucker to me and It happened to me. I complained about the ball at halftime. I complained about the ball in the third quarter and Carson just throw that mother fucker to me and guess what I do?

Drop it. Throw it back at it. Cause I'm not focused. I'm not locked in. You know? Not seeing the ball all the way in. I haven't touched it in a while so I got somewhat of a little attitude, you know, about me. And the one time I complained about the ball and it does come, I drop it.

And it happens every time, every time. But in situations like this, the game only gets bigger. Oh yeah. You got a nice, you got a nice, you got a nice victory under your belt against a team. You were supposed to beat, you got an opportunity to relax. I got an opportunity to exhale. But now, you know, the commander's got something

to play for. Yeah. You have something to play for. They want to get, hey, look, they're already in the playoffs, but they want to try, hey, hey, we want to try to get a home game. Oh yeah. Falcons, you have something to play for.

You have a lead. You have a half game lead over the Bucs in the NFC South. When you're division, you get at least one home game. At least one. So I like this. Both teams have something to play for. We're gonna find out a lot. We've seen Jayden Daniels.

We haven't seen a whole lot of Michael Penney Jr. Ocho, but we've seen a lot of Jayden Daniels and he's been phenomenal the last couple of weeks. You wanna see if he can continue to scream. Oh Yeah Boy, what a jazz Jazz is good and terrible Hey there, it's Michael Lewis Arthur going infinite moneyball the blindside and Liarer. On the latest season of my podcast, Against the Rules,

I'm exploring what it means to be a sports fan in America, and what the rise of sports betting is doing to our teams, our states, and ourselves. Join me and listen to Against the Rules on America's number one podcast network, iHeart. Open your free iHeart app and search Against the Rules. Listen to Against the Rules on the iHeart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts. What's up everyone it's Justin

Pennock from John Boy Media, the host of the Football Today podcast with Bobby Skinner and Chris Rose. We roll three times a week on Mondays, on Wednesdays, on Fridays, breaking down everything you need to know about the NFL. We're gearing up for the NFL playoffs. I hope you can join us. Join in with us three times a week. Listen to football today on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts

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A lot of this Beamstock stuff is, I think, embarrassing to the SEC. Follow The Big Take podcast on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen. Hey everyone. I'm Madison Packer, a pro hockey veteran going on my 10th season in New York. And I'm Anya Packer, a former pro hockey player and now a full Madison Packer stan. Anya and I met through hockey and now we're married and moms to two awesome toddlers, ages two and four. And we're excited about our new podcast, Moms Who Puck, which talks about everything from pro hockey

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