Club Shay Shay - Nightcap - Hour 1: Pacers Up 2-0 on Knicks + LeBron All-NBA at 40

Episode Date: May 24, 2025

Shannon Sharpe, Chad "Ochocinco" Johnson & Cedric Maxwell react to Game 2 of the NBA Eastern Conference Finals matchup between Jalen Brunson and the New York Knicks vs. Tyrese Haliburton and the Indiana Pacers, and much more!01:46 - Introduction04:44 - Knicks v Pacers27:48 - All NBA Teams Announced54:30 - Mike Wilbon on LeBron being one of the greatest athletes(Timestamps may vary based on advertisements.)#Volume #ClubSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

You're listening to an iHeart podcast. I'm Michael Kassin, founder and CEO of 3C Ventures and your guide on Good Company, the podcast where I sit down with the boldest innovators shaping what's next. In this episode, I'm joined by Anjali Sood, CEO of 2B. We dive into the competitive world of streaming. What others dismiss as niche, we embrace as core. There's so many stories out there, and if you can find a way to curate and help the right person discover the right content, the term that we always hear from our audience is that they feel seen.

Listen to Good Company on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The Volume. Hello ladies and gentlemen, and thank you for joining us for another episode of Nightcap. You watched the Indiana Pacers do what they did the last series, go on the road and take a 2-0 lead going back to Indy. Yes they are, they're up 2-0, they're in the commanding position. You don't see this often but they've done it in back to back series. A commanding two old lead 114 to 109. Thanks to a red hot shooting night from Pascal Siakam, who had 39 big points. They have six guys in double figures like they normally do as a committee team.

And they win this ball game on the road. 114 to 109. Y'all know who I am. I am your favorite on Shannon Sharp, my partner and co-host Liberty City's own Bengals ring of fame honoree pro bowler all-pro that's Chad Ocho Cinco Johnson and Our special guest tonight joining us to break down this game Indiana 114 to 109 is the

1981 finals MVP He's a two-time champ, and he's out of the University of North Carolina at Charlotte, the number 12 overall draft pick in the 1977 draft. Here he is, ladies and gentlemen, Cedric, Cornbread, Maxwell. We'll get to a second how you got that name, Cornbread. I think I got a pretty good idea,

but we're gonna let you explain this to us. Please make sure you hit that subscribe button. Please make sure you hit the like button and guys go subscribe to the nightcap podcast feed wherever you get your podcast from. I want to thank each and every one of you personally for your support and your continued support. When Ocho and I launched this thing almost two years ago, we had no idea it would take us to the height that has taken us, but we could not have done that without you. So thank you so much from Ocho and I and the entire crew at Nightcap. Thank you and hopefully we'll get your continued support. Please make sure you check out Shea by La Portier.

We have it in stock. If you can't find it in a city or state near you, order it online. We'll ship it directly to your door. Please drink responsibly and stay safe. Go follow my media company page on all of its platforms, Shea Shea Media and my clothing company 84, with 84 being spelled out. That link is pinned in the chat. Supplies are limited and once they're gone, they're gone. So please grab yours before they're gone. Before we get to the game guys, I want wanna make an announcement.

Guys, we've decided to postpone the Nightcap Tour. We look forward to seeing you guys in summer of 2026. It's gonna be even bigger, even better. But Ocho and I have come to the conclusion that this is the best thing as of right now was to postpone the tour. We look forward to seeing each and every one of you in 2026. Some of you guys that have already got the tickets,

you probably received the emails and further instructions, but I wanna thank you for your support. Ocho and I wanna thank you, and everybody at NiteKal wanna thank you, but we postponed the tour until 2026. Now, let's get into this ball game. The Indiana Pacers go on the road. Now, remind you, they did this to the number one seed,

the team that won 64 games in the regular season. They went on the road to Cleveland and they took a commanding 2-0 lead on the road. And what did they do? People might've thought that was a fluke. They go on the road again in the conference finals and take a 2-0 lead against a very good New York Knicks team. And they do it 114 to 109 and again

six guys in double figures. Pascal Siakam was sensational tonight 15 of 23 shooting, three of five from the three-point line, 36 big points. Neesmith had 12, Myles Turner had 16, Nimhart had 12, Halliburton 14 and 11 and they got TJ McConnell in only 14 minutes. He gave him 10 big points That's six guys in double figures again, and that's normally how they do it Cornbread you've seen this team play against your Celtics over the years and this is how they normally do it They have might have one guy but normally it's a bunch of teams 14 13 16 19 and they did it again tonight When you watch this game cornbreadbett, what was it?

What is it that the nicks, that the Pacers are doing? Or is it something they're doing or is it something the nicks aren't doing? I think it's something that the subjects are doing. I mean, the subjects, that's who I wanna talk about. Yeah, I know you do. Something I think that the Pacers are doing. I think what the Pacers are doing really well,

they're moving the basketball and they move bodies. The body, the ball does not stick as much. And because of that, defensively, you cannot rotate and trap as much. That happens when the Knicks are playing other teams, the ball sticks and their defense becomes that much more fluid and they can do damage that way. So when you move that basketball and you move bodies, the Knicks don't move as

well defensively as other teams do. Watching this game, Ocho, I was looking at it early and I saw like the, the Pacers got out to a good lead and then the Knicks go on this run. And I'm looking at this game at the half. I'm like, Knicks, I think y'all in trouble. I think they are y'all in trouble. I think they are y'all in trouble. I say, because they've walked you down from 14 with under three minutes. And now you got a nip and tuck ball game.

And the thing that the Pacers do, they're going to play with, they're going to play with pace. They're going to push the ball. Whether you make the shot, Brad, or you missed the shot. They are pushing Halliburton and looking to get that ball ahead to Siakam, to Neesmith, Miles Turner, because they run the floor. And like you said, they do a great job of moving. And they don't have a guy that you say,

oh, I got to get him the ball. They don't have a dominant guy, a Luka or Jason Tatum, or one of these great shades that got to have the ball. So you don't know on a given night, it could be one of either six guys that can be their leading scorer and that's very difficult to defend yeah Jalen Brunson is averaging almost 40 points a game eight assists the game and he's shooting 54% yet they find themselves down 0-2 Ocho when you're looking at the Knicks and you I think you picked the Knicks to

win yes sir what is it that you see? What's been most disappointing for you? I mean, for the Knicks, obviously, I need more people to contribute. At the half, I mean, Jaylen Brunson doing what he needs to do, Mikhail Berges was okay. I know he came along in the second half, but the patience of winning collectively as a group, everybody's being able to contribute. I think it's too much pressure on Jaden Brunson to keep them in the game regardless of whether the Pacers can pass the ball and always keep the ball moving offensively.

The Pacers in transition running up and down the floor. I think everyone else has to contribute as well. Cat, I mean, what did Cat have tonight? Cat had 20 points on six of 14 shooting. 14 shots isn't enough. Not even close. Not even close. McHale Bridges had 18 shots.

Listen, now we down, now we down, oh two in a hole. I'm talking about we, I'm just saying, presumably because I picked the next to win this series. That goddamn Halliburton, man, listen, he was very efficient tonight, he only had 14 points, but still his shot selection, and when he chose to shoot. Oh, it's, it's. Chad, I'm sorry.

I'm sorry, Chad. Stick a fork in there. They're done now. They're done? Yeah, you're blind. They're done. Oh, whoa, whoa, whoa, Brad. I didn't stun it, did I?

Already? Yeah, no, they're done. I mean, I don't think that you look at them the first game they lost that psychologically It does a lot of damage, but then you come back and you play okay, and you lose the second gate Right. Where are the people that were rocking the something bust the other day when I was on it when when we did? They were trying to tip it over those same five people left out there like church mouse. So I think that you look at the Knicks. This is a team that plays with emotion.

What they've done, they take them. They've taken the emotion out. You said something about the pace that they were. Let me tell you what happened during 1984. I swear to God, it's how it happened. We played the Lakers in game three. They'd be so bad. We score.

I didn't even think magic took the ball out of bounds. He was right behind me. I was like, damn, did they take it out of bounds? But that's what great teams do. They don't allow you to get back in a position of resting. And that's what the Knicks want to do. They want to rest. But as long as you attack them and you make them play on the defensive end

and you make Carl Anthony times accountable, you make Brunson accountable on the defensive end. That is what hurts the Knicks. And who's going to look at it over there? Who's going to score after that? Right. Corporate, you said something very interesting. You said the team that plays on emotion and they lost that first game. I don't know if it was they lost the first game or how they lost the first game.

Because we hadn't seen a whole lot of teams lose games like that when they have such a lead with that amount of time on the clock. So it's like 1,447 when somebody has a nine point lead with like 50 something seconds to go in the ball game. And they lost that ball game and they come out and they really couldn't get any separation. They can never get built up a 10 point lead or 14 point lead like they did in game one.

So now everybody's in that building, they're waiting to erupt. The loudest I saw them is when Brunson hit that three and they get within three points with like 30 seconds to go in the ball game. Prior to that, they were like just like hoping something could go their way so they could get into the ball game.

Why are we so surprised by this? You're talking about what did they do when they played Cleveland? The same game. They get back at the end of the game and they won. Rick Harlow, I played with Rick Harlow as a young player. The same game they get back at the end of the game and they won Rick Carlisle I played with Rick Carlisle as a young player Yeah, he was always somebody who got at it and he was at a high pace and you may guys accountable

He does that with this team that the next have is the fact that you look at that pace routine They have championship DNA. We're has it, Siakam has it. Who over there on the Knicks has that championship DNA? Who are you going to fall to at the end of the day? And I think that's the huge problem for them. They are a team right now that's played with great emotion. And they've been lucky. They were lucky to beat the Subbix twice

in those first two games in Boston. But now. Chickens have come home to roots now, but Jalen Brunson and game two, 36 points, 11 assists on five made threes. Only MJ LeBron has more 35 point Tennessee playoff games in the Eastern conference, Jalen Brunson, like I said, in games one and two, he's averaging almost 40, 39 and a half, eight assists on 54% shooting. I don't know if it's over, Cornbread.

I think in order for them to have a chance, they've got to win game three. They got to win game three. Did you see the score? Did the score man is over? Poked him up. We've seen them go on the road. You always talked about your granny. What she did. When she went to check me, what did she do?

She stuck a fork in it. Yeah, she stuck a fork in it. She's like, yeah, baby, it's done. See, if any blood came out, it wasn't done. That's what the Knicks are. I thought that I really hated the Laker fans and the Laker fan base. They have nothing on the arrogance of the Knicks when they, when they won. These jokers haven't.

And I said that to Steve Mason, I said, Oh, I'll tell you what, act like they've been there before and I said, Oh, hold on a minute, they haven't. And last time they won the championship, I was in high school. It was my senior year. I'm going to turn 70 years old. So I'm not saying anything bad about them. They played hard. I like what Brunson does. I like what they've done with their team. But I just think the Pacers right now are the better of the two teams executing, especially at the end of the game and when it really counts. They've done it twice.

Yeah, I think the thing you're going to go ahead on your way. I'm going to say cornbread. You're not giving the Knicks any chance to come back regardless of how the Pacers play, despite how they looked the past two games. The Knicks, you know, for for that matter, you don't give them any chance to come back and make this a series. Chad, let's go unless I want to drink beer, but that's that's better case. OK, it means you.

I just don't see them getting back, especially on the emotional end. This team plays, I like the way they play. TIPS has them playing hard. But when you get an Indiana team playing the way they are right now, going home, smelling blood, smelling blood, what we've seen this team do so far this year, when they smell blood, they turn the sharks. These Memphis has been big knocking down shots. This isn't like, you know, you know, I'm not wishing them bad luck,

but I just see again, one team that executes a lot better at the end of those games and they've won two games and we don't, we shouldn't be surprised. And I think the thing is it was, it was concerning for me and Ocho, you and I talked about this with Jota other night, is that you got what you got from Kat. You got 30 plus points from Kat. You got 43 points from Brunson and you still lost. And so if my big gun, hey, corporate, you know like, hold on, y'all two big guys just went off and we still beat y'all.

What's the likelihood of y'all doing this four or five, six times, six more times? The likelihood is not, Jalen Brunson averaging 43, I don't see that happening. Cat averaging 36, I don't see that happening. And we saw what happened tonight. The difference is they're so dependent on Brunson. You see the Pacers, you don't know who's gonna be

their leading scorer night to night. You can bet 98% of the time, their leading scorer is gonna be Jalen Brunson. It was the opposite of that. No wonder you have one of the top-rated shows. You were analyzing this thing. You wouldn't think you were a damn Laker fan. You really weren't.

And you know, I hate you because of that when I ain't a Laker fan I'm a LeBron fan well I don't care if you you still wearing that purple and gold and I hate to see I mean I used to be a Celtic fan you know growing up blood was my favorite player join join the crowd did come Come on back. Let me say, come on back home. Come on back to your base. Okay. Don't worry about that. And I love LeBron. I think he's done so much for this league. And then, and I, I'm kind of like you.

I kind of wonder why people hate on him so much for what he's done. Especially when it's off the court, you know, all the things he's done on the court, but off the court, he's been brilliant. He hasn't been in any trouble. He's gotten kids to go to school. He's done on the court. But off the court, he's been brilliant. He hasn't been in any trouble. He's got new kids that go to school. He's a great role model. So again, I don't understand that hatred for LeBron, although I did hate magic like that and I still do today.

So that's a whole nother story. And you look at it, the Knicks, Miles Bridges played 45 minutes, OG played 36, Jalen Brunson played 39 and that's a far cry from what they did the other night. Now obviously the game went into overtime so you had an extra five minutes so you got 48 minutes in regulation plus another five that's 53. But those guys played heavy minutes. I'm surprised that more guys didn't play heavy minutes. Like OG wasn't in the 40s. Cat wasn't in the 40s. Josh Hart only played 29 minutes.

I thought Josh Hart, he's really, Josh Hart does a little bit of everything. He rebounds, he plays defense, he scores, he assists the basketball. He had one assist, he had one steal, he had one block, and he had six rebounds and six points. If he does not put his fingerprint on this series in these next two games, I, I, I, I,

Hey honey, give me, give me a broom instead. I need to give him a broom. If they don't wait. And, and I love Josh Hart, the thing I love about him, he could have played during the eighties because he's, he's tough minded. He goes in, he's scrappy. And against the Celtics, he had an imprint on all those games,

knocking down shots, getting rebounds. But in this game, this last game, Tosh Hart wasn't even effective. And he is the heart and soul of what they do emotionally. And they don't get it from him. Who else are they going to get it from? Yeah. And you know, he only, he has six points, but he got two of those in the last 36 when he got that late layup.

So I was surprised that, I mean, cause you got 20 from Bridges. Okay, I can live with that. You got 16 from OG only on 11 shots. You got 20 from Kat on 14 shots. He needs to be somewhere around 18 to 22 shots in his damn self. Jalen Brunson, you know, he's a volume guy 13 of 27

He did what he was supposed to do Jalen Brunson did what he was supposed to do now I'm thinking of Josh Hart gives you somewhere 14 like he normally does like we know he can Like you said, I agree with you crumb cornbread his imprint six rebounds That's not nearly enough one assists one steel one block That's not the Josh Hart Josh Hart is somewhere around eight to 12 points a game, double digit rebounds, like seven to nine assists, if not a triple double. And he's that versatile. You add add-ons to that, getting steals, mixing it up.

In this last game, essentially he was never involved. And that's not the way he, because you know what he is? He's an energy guy. He's a an energy guy. He's high energy guy. And when you don't have the energy guy go over there, giving you points or, or rebounds or something like that. It's not now what you need to do. Oh, Joe, go over there on that bench.

Go down that bench. There's about five or six other guys out there. Find me, find me two or three points. Can you find me any points out of that? Kibbs is only, but here's the thing cornbread when oh Joe we talked about this stuff tonight with Joe They only gonna play seven guys eight guys at the max Yeah, and you know Mitchell Robinson He's he's only gonna get your put backs and you'll get your law so you're not running any offense for him

So you really can't really count on him say Mitchell Can you give us 10 to 12? Are you gonna run five alley-hoops five lobs and you gonna get five put backs? I don't think so. So they look to file him to break the next momentum. I was surprised he played as many minutes as he did. Think about it he played more minutes than Kat. You know I've never seen a guy as petrified going to the line. I mean you would would think that that is as best as the last meal. You think it's actually cute. He don't want that ball.

He don't want to get out. He can't. And it's smart for what, and this is what I love about the faces. Look how smart they play. Yeah. And then the key stretch there, Robinson was in the game and they came in and they filed it and smart, smart teams it. And smart teams do that. You guys play football.

You know what momentum is. Absolutely. If you either have it or you don't, if you don't have it, all of a sudden you look your ass out. And this is the best way I think the Knicks right now are pretty much that way. Yeah, I'm surprised that Mitchell Robinson played his many minutes. he played the same amount of minutes as Josh Hart he played them one more minute more than Kat. Miles McBride played 25 minutes and they only played eight guys and you go look at you go look at the Pacers they played one two three four five six they played 11 guys. Yeah yeah yeah I mean you see you see

yeah that's it that's it. Fresh bodies. Which so funny. There are about six guys over there on that bench. They score about as many points as I did tonight. I mean, they, they, they might want to be here with me because those guys were never involved in the game. Oh, so you know how it is. Sometimes you have guys who are real players and some guys you can have who are perpetrators. Some guys know when the big games happen, I've seen you, I've saw Shannon play before and in the big games, hey, look, you're stepping up, but then there's some guys in the big games, they don't want to be, they don't want that ball, but they don't want to get around it.

I'm Michael Kassin, founder and CEO of 3C Ventures and your guide on Good Company, the podcast where I sit down with the boldest innovators shaping what's next. In this episode, I'm joined by Anjali Sood, CEO of Tubi, for a conversation that's anything but ordinary. We dive into the competitive world of streaming, how she's turning so-called niche into mainstream gold, connecting audiences with stories that truly make them feel seen. What others dismiss as niche, we embrace as core.

It's this idea that there are so many stories out there and if you can find a way to curate and help the right person discover the right content, the term that we always hear from our audience is that they feel seen. Get a front row seat to where media, marketing, technology, entertainment, and sports collide. And hear how leaders like Anjali are carving out space and shaking things up a bit in the most crowded of markets.

Listen to Good Company on the iHeart radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Yeah, so what do you think? What do you think TIFF does? I mean, there's only five or six or six or seven players on like I'm saying that actually played. Does he does he change up the lineup? Does he add a lot of people to play so you can get those two or three points

that you might need that can help you down a stretch? What is the yeah, Tim's isn't like that. Tim's was in Boston with Paul Pierce in that group and they go with the rotation and he saw it. This is the people who got him. This is what he's done. And these are the people he's going to go with. I mean, I'm looking over there at that cell at the roster and I'm looking at the Knicks and I'm trying to think right now, I think why are some of those Nick, uh,

you know, old school players probably on the floor. Right. I mean, I'm looking at some of them guys. I was like, damn, why, why is that dude players probably on the floor. Right. I mean, I look at some of them guys, I was like, damn, why, why is that dude right there on the floor? Maybe he should get grabbed one of those guys. My good buddy, Bernard King, he could score some points. Now, Bird Dog, Bird Dog Knees bad.

Nah, nah. Hey, hey, Carl Brand, you know, Bird Dog Knees was bad when he was 29, 30. You know, they shot that at 65. I saw him walking out of the arena. I was like, damn man, I've got back. And I hated them as a player too, but I really felt bad when I sort of think of seeing, seeing some of the things right now that have happened. But the Knicks, they're going to have to find a formula or going to have to grab

one of those guys at the end of the bench and try to get the spark. Tibbs is going to have to change what he does because what he's doing right now with the two games you're close. Did you guys know close comes in horseshoes and nuclear war? That's the only, that's the only way horse clothes comes in. And I just don't think that this team right now has enough at the end of the day. Going in. It's like when I saw you enough at the end of the day going in. It's like when I saw you looking at the stat sheet before we came on, uh, you know,

Shannon, you were looking down like somebody had just on the stat sheet. You know, I said, dude, what's wrong? And, and, but if you notice, look at the team that have deep benches. Look at OKC. Look how many people, look how many people Minnesota play. You see OKC playing 10, 11 people. Indiana playing 10, 11 people. You burn them out because Tims play those guys heavy minutes in the regular season.

So you can imagine now they went, they, now they had a short series with Boston, but they had a very long series with Detroit and they had to play heavy minutes, even though it was a short series, they played heavy minutes. And so now you come in physical, physical minutes. Yeah. That's the thing you talk about. You add physicality in with, with long minutes, man, that doubles the output of what you're talking about being physical.

And there's something called expectations. So you see the Knicks didn't have these expectations when they played Boston. Boston was the prohibitive favorite. Now, how does it feel? You're no longer the hunter. You're the hunted. Yeah. Oh, as they say, when we play all fun and games until the damn rabbit gets the damn gun. Yeah. That's how it goes out. So I look at this

team and the Knicks were, they played well. Detroit had a chance to beat them. Boston had a chance to beat them, but they played well enough that they won. Now, as you said, they are the darlings of the city, right? The darlings of the city. So now the expectations you talk about is on some of these guys' shoulder. And it looks like it might just be a lower heavy right. First time going to the NBA finals and since what? 25 and a quarter century.

Oh, everybody's talking about that. oh man, this might be our chance to get our first championship in 50 plus years. Everybody's looking at that. And so you're looking, you're looking past Andy. Oh, like Andy's looking at it like, hell, this is our first chance to go to the NBA finals in 20 plus years too. We ain't never won one.

You're right, I love the look on John Stark's face today. I don't know. We ain't never won one. You're right. I love the look on John Stark's face today. He was just crippled over. And these were the same guys in your guy, Burmarchy, text me after the game that the Knicks won the first two. Text me and said, keep your head up, big fella. Or makes you laugh, makes you cry sometimes. It absolutely will. The All-NBA teams were just announced.

On the first team, All-NBA, Giannis, Antetokounmpo, Shea Gildgeis Alexander, Nikola Jokic, Donovan Mitchell, Jason Tatum. Any surprises there? No, I think those guys, to, uh, Tatum was great. Shay was the envy and you can look at Yocage. Is Yocage right now, maybe the best, maybe the best player that one of the best players we've seen at that position. And no offense.

I love Kareem. I love Kareem. I love, but when you look at Yocage, his body of work, what do you say? Yeah. Yeah. He said he's turned into a monster all of a sudden. I love, but when you look at Jokic, his body of work, what did he say? He said he's turned into a monster all of a sudden. I thought you was about to say maybe he's the best player in the game. I can say you could drop that maybe.

Oh yeah, no. He is the best player. Now he's working on, when he's done, the question is where do we put it? Because you mentioned, you mentioned Shaq, you mentioned Russell, you mentionedq, you mentioned Russell, you mentioned Will, you mentioned Kareem. Okay. Elijah one Moses, whatever the case may be, I'm just named six guys who many

believe are six of the best centers to ever play the game. David Robinson, wherever the case may be, when it's all said and done, where are we going to put Nicola Yocich? This is why I will change it. He is the best player right now. But what he doesn't do, he doesn't control the defensive end. That's what made, that's what made Elijah Juan to me.

And I played with him. Oh, he's the best, Elijah Juan's the best defensive center ever. The greatest player ever to play the game is Akim Elijah Juan. Let me tell you why. Because he did it on both ends. Mike controls his man defensively, his man, but a king controlled the game

on both ends of the floor, like nobody else has ever done both ends. Not one day Russell controlled it on the deepest of it. Uh, you know, we'll control it on the office a bit. Um, um, you look at all the other, but you look at Elijah Juan, there is nobody like that young African that I played with that was, I thought he was killing lines the way he played. He was a beast. He was a beast.

He was. He was special. He was special. Cause like you said, he could do it all. He, hey, the fade away, he had the drop step, he had the moves. Ah man, hey, fake here away, he had the drop step, he had the moves. Ah man, hey, fake here and next thing you know, he's dunking it over there.

I mean, and the defense have been. But that's right. And then add defense to that. He is blocking shots. He's leading the league. He was leading the league and still, he's one of the few guys in the NBA history that had a quadruple double.

Right. Quadruple double. And remember the first one that they had, Cornbread? He had it, and they ended up taking a rebound away from him. So he didn't get it. He came back the next night, two nights later, and got another one. I'm going to do it. You know what?

You want to take it from me? I'm going to show you how to get it done again. Yes. The second team, all NBA team, Jalen Brunson, Steph Curry, Aunt Edwards, LeBron James, Evan Mobley. You remember the way they used to do it. They used to take two guards. They used to take a center and a small and a big.

Now they say it's positionless. You might have five guards be all first team, all NBA. You might have five bigs be first team, all NBA. Because if you look, you basically got, you got three, three guards with a Brunson, Curry and a Ant-Man. And then you get basically got, you know, two forwards, uh, LeBron and Eby Mobley. The game has, the game has changed from what I knew. Uh, in my, my era, you know, I had one three for my entire career.

I look at Steph Curry right now. Steph Curry, as much as I, you know, think about him, he changed the game. He has changed the game. I talked to his dad and I said, man, I, your son, I hate the fact he's changed again, he's destroyed the NBA the way. And his dad said, you know what? There are a lot of shot takers, but not a lot of shot makers. And when you think about that boy, his quick release, his handling of the basketball,

I didn't see it coming. I asked his dad, I said, did you see him being that good? He said, no, I didn't see this. So the second team you picked up, I think you could, you know, could easily say that that qualifies Chad Hungren for the guy I might want to put in there because of the record that Minnesota had that might happen But they did have another guy to make it The third team all-in BA selection was Kate Cunningham because he was an all-in BA selection

He gets another 45 million dollars added to his max contract that he signed last offseason. Oh Joe Tyrese Halliburton Okay, James Harden Harry's Halliburton, okay. James Harden, uh, cat Carl Anthony towns. And last but not least, Jaylen Williams. So, uh, okay. See did have two guys to make the all NBA team. And remember Lou Dora made the all defensive team. So they got three guys.

That's one of us on all NBA selection, two on basically the offensive side, the other two on the other one on the defensive side. Here's the thing that I love about that. But I'm at eight is the fact that the NBA rules, salary caps is going to destroy that particular team because you can't keep that team together. No, no, no, no, no, no. Oh, okay. See, so you're going to make it so that, you know, I love super teams and then like

the Lakers when they're winning obviously, but love You know, I love the dominant teams like that But you know now because you have the salary cap structures and the aprons that they talked about Okay, see is not gonna have all those gaps. They're gonna they made it cost-prohibitive. They didn't want any more super teams anymore Why why you love super teams? But they but corporate, Corbree, see, that's what I tell people, see, cause a lot of times they tell, oh, LeBron did, I said, there were always super teams. What the hell do you think the Lakers were? What do you think the Celtics were in the eighties?

They were a super team. You talk about Byrd, McHale, Parrish, DJ, they had tiny Archibald one year. They had Bill Walton, who was the sixth man. I've been stopping. Who I got traded for. They had Bill Walton, who was the sixth man. I've been stopping. Who I got traded for. Oh, Bill Walton, yeah. Damn.

That hurt. That hurt. And you got Magic. Think about it, you got Magic, Kareem, James Worthy. You got Michael Thompson. Yeah. You got Jamal Williams. Come on, people.

That was a super team. See, here's the thing. People like, if people. That was a super team. See here's the thing. People like if you if the if the general manager put a super team together we're okay with that. We don't want the players to say well you know what I like corn bread. Hey man I like bread too and Ocho what you think about going and enjoying bread over there such-and-such. No they don't like that. But if a team but if the general manager puts it together we got no problem with that. Well, how do you feel right now?

You're also feel about what happened in Dallas. Dallas goes away and gets the rental. Luca. I like that big fella. How does that taste? The boy, uh, I think you're really Luka. And then they turn around and they get the kid from Duke. This is definitely be dangerous next year.

They are. If they can get healthy and you got Carrie urban coming back, that turn around and they get the cue from Duke. This is definitely be dangerous next year. They are. If they can get healthy and you got Carrie Urban coming back, that team could be really dangerous. And to me, what it does is pushes the Lakers that much further down. I don't want to see. Hey, but let me ask you this. The Mavericks do have that first pick. Now there's going to be a conversation

sometime in the coming days between Giannis and Milwaukee's front office. Would you be willing to part with that number and overall draft pick for an opportunity to bring Giannis and pair him with AD and Kyrie when he comes back? Bye bye, first round draft choice. Look, I don't know what Cooper might do, but I know what Yannis is doing. So if I have a chance to do it and reset my program, and if you're Milwaukee, you know, you're going to lose Yannis.

Yeah. I go out, I make that trade. I grab some pieces and I get ready for the future. But you know, in that case, yeah, I make that deal all day because we know what Yannis is capable of doing. He's a proven product. Shannon, Ocho, that's what he is. He's a proven product.

He's not, he is not a bus rider. He's a damn bus driver. Hold on, Conrad, I got a question for you. Let's say they didn't get rid of Cooper flag, right? Does go to the bucks. Does Yannis come in and automatically make the Mavs a championship contender? Absolutely. I think, yeah. Yeah, because one thing he's going to bring in that physicality, that's something that the Mavs have not.

So you say you get, if you get him, you get Anthony Davis and you get Calabria. Those guys healthy and together being all day. I'll look at the math right now and I'll come here and by that noise, I'm I said, fire, Nico, fire, good luck. Good job, Nico. Good. Oh, here's a question I have to ask you though. Since you're a pretty physical guy,

are you gonna go ahead and grab the guy who came to LA and take him out and run him up and down the beach? You gonna go out and grab him? You saw him. He been in the gym. He eat his wife preparing good meals for him. You see that. You see his body.

He's starting to look good. You can, you know what? You can prepare a meal, but Oliver Miller, when he played down in Phoenix, they had a monster going near. He was running the fight. He had a ball boy going, getting them hamburgers. So until I see him in that position position Luca, you know, he has to be in shape and I would eat and look He's around the place where you're gonna get in shape in their life the stars the bodies the bronze James the best We've seen right now standing shape. You're there. I mean I grabbed one of you guys right now, so man I get you really involved. Just take me on a program and wrench him in to get my body in shape. I got you. OK. OK.

But you know the thing, Cormbray, and I tell people this all the time, it's easy to get in shape in the off season. Yeah. It's like, if a basketball player is getting in late at night at 3 o'clock in the morning and making the right decisions. I ain't going to eat no pizza. I'm not going to eat nothing fast food.

I'm not going to eat anything processed. So that's the problem that the guys have. They get out their game and they grab chicken and it's not baked or it's not roasted. Shannon, that's not true. That's not true. I ate a bunch of bubbles, but now they have meals prepared for them after.

They don't want that. No, a lot of them eat it. A lot of them come off the, a lot of them come in on the bus and they have meals which are prepared for. So the guys don't eat like we did during the eighties. 1984, playing, getting ready to play the Lakers. I had a Big Mac, a super size, my fry, a large orange soda. And this is before the damn game.

So that's how we ate during that time. Yeah. Now players have an opportunity. orange soda and this is before the damn game. So that's how we ate during that time. Yeah. Now players have an opportunity. It was, I look at these guys now, they have, they have a chef in the morning. They have dinner, they have lunch cooked for them. They have a dinner after the game. I mean, I don't even know why they get per damn. I mean, to me it's, it's, it's amazing the way, and I love it.

I'm not jealous at all. I love the way our players are being taken care of. Oh Joe, we had this conversation. Think about it. In the NFL, they get breakfast prepared for them. They get lunch prepared for them. And they get dinner prepared after they meeting and to take home with them. Yeah.

How can you be out of shape? And with all that state of the art equipment they got, they got physio, they got massage therapists, they got cryo, they got infrared. Cornbread, they got every, I'm talking about state, when I say state of the art, I'm talking about 50 and $7500 million facilities. There is no reason. Hold on, but you know everything you just said, Cornbread too, everything I just said, they have the state of the art of everything, they have everything you just said cornbread to everything. I'm just saying they have a state of all the everything they have, everything that they need at their beck and call.

But for some reason, I don't know why more injuries, injuries are more prevalent today. Everyone seems getting hurt. I remember back in the day, and matter of fact, I'm not too far from you. I remember back in the day, you used to play outside when you were young and you go in the house and get your glass of water during the summer. No, what's your mom? What's your grandma and your mama told you? Go drink water holes on the side of the house. Absolutely.

I don't understand what the problem is. Old school. And I, and, and here's the thing I look at the Boston Soviets have one of the best players around be Jason Tatum. Yeah. The thing I felt like Jason Tatum got hurt. It wasn't because he didn't train hard enough. I just think he played too much basketball.

He played during the Olympics. He played during the championship. And here's my true belief. If you don't rest your body, your body's going to rest you. And I didn't get the end. And you have the, you, you've seen it before when, when you and I played, I know when I played during the 80s When we got through playing the boys who tell us man take three months off. Don't do yeah

We tell you now these guys go year-round and Unc and Ocho I tell you this is what I hate I hate the fact that they damn changing jerseys and laughing at each other I hate that. Oh my God. I hate that. I hate that. There's nothing I hate more than that. Nineteen eight, 1983.

We're playing, we're playing the 76s in the exhibition game in Knoxville, Tennessee. We went and we won the game. We went and got in the restaurant. We went there and ate. The 76ers got there after us. They saw that we were there. They hated us so bad. They left the damn restaurant. Didn't even eat. That's how pissed off they were. Yeah, because in 81, they had y'all down 3-1 and y'all came back. You remember that, Brian? They remember building. We did. and y'all came back. You remember that, Brad?

They remember building, we did. No! Ha ha ha. Watch this, this is how it goes off like this. They did. They, I thought the Boston Straggler, Andrew Toney, I thought they had y'all. I thought they had you, Brad.

He was absolutely a beast. He was. And I'm talking to, I was talking to a couple of, of the 76ers guys, motifs in particular, he said, man, I've never played in a more physical series than we had there in the eighties. And those were just great series that if you go back in YouTube, these games won by everyone was one by one or two points, two points. Last five days we played the separation was about six points.

So yeah, they were physical games. I understand it's a different era and I love these guys, but man, the money that these guys make now. It shouldn't be, it should be no issue. And I don't know if I've ever seen this before. You had four unanimous selections on the all NBA team. Yonis was a unanimous. He got a hundred first place votes. Shay was a unanimous. A hundred first place vote.

Nicola Jokic, a hundred first place votes. Jason Tatum, a hundred first place votes. A hundred? Come on, man. Somebody got to have some balls and break away from that. Please. Ain't nobody could go a hundred percent. Shannon, you're an O tell no. Ain't nobody go 100% of nothing. Come on. Let me ask you a question. Let me ask you a question. What power

forward you giving a vote and taking it from Yannis? What guard you taking a vote from and giving it to? What guard, what Shay you taking a vote from Shay and giving it to somebody else? Okay. What big are you taking a vote from Nicola Yocas and give it to JT? You know what when when you're right and then Shannon you write You you're right, I can't argue with that those are points with your ballot But I guess it's just hard for me to see a guy get a hundred percent of anything. You're not, for people to say this thing like, you know what? I work 110% can work 110% can't do it.

That's all you get. That's all you got. A hundred percent. No, you, you worked a hundred percent. That's it. Jason Tate was named all NBA first team for the fourth straight year. Cornbread. It doesn't look like it's going to be a fifth consecutive year because he's not going to, he went to the same surgeon that did Kevin Durant. Now, if you remember Kevin Durant, it happened in June of 2019. I'm still learning. Kevin Durant, you know, 2019 rolls around, he doesn't play.

2020 rolls around, they go into rolls around, he doesn't play. 2020 rolls around, they go into the bubble. He doesn't play. So he took off a total of, if I'm not mistaken, about 18 months. Now, I'm not saying Jason Taylor's gonna take off that amount of time, but if you look at Kevin Durant, if somebody didn't tell you he has suffered a torn Achilles, you wouldn't know it. Because he picked right back up where he left off. I totally agree with you, but here's the difference.

One is age. Jason Tatum is 25, 26. 26. When what happened, when you think of Kevin, when they heard that he was almost 30 something. So you guys- Yeah, he was 29, 30. I always said as a broadcaster,

I see guys fall down when they're in their 20s. I said, oh, he hurt. The damn bonus ain't even formed yet. His muscles still form. I think Tatum is recovery will probably be easier because he's a yacht lot younger and he doesn't have as many miles. But I don't like you. I don't, I don't foresee him coming back, you know, for this coming year, because I

think that if you look at this team, perhaps Stevens has an opportunity right now to reset and he's going to have to reset because of the salary structure. I'm not sure if it's going to be. Prozine. You're saying coming back. That's one not coming back. Wow. Wow.

You got, you know that I know that you got, um, now the question is, are you bringing Derek white and holiday back? Cause they both got big salaries. What are you going to do with Al Horford? Okay. You're probably going to keep JB because you're going to be without JT. But I'm not so sure that when JT comes back, it's hard having two players making 300 mil.

I'm Michael Kasson, founder and CEO of 3C Ventures and your guide on Good Company, the podcast where I sit down with the boldest innovators shaping what's next. In this episode, I'm joined by Anjali Sood, CEO of Tubi, for a conversation that's anything but ordinary. We dive into the competitive world of streaming, how she's turning so-called niche into mainstream gold, connecting audiences with stories that truly make them feel seen What others dismiss as niche we embrace as core It's this idea that there are so many stories out there and if you can find a way to curate and help the right person

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Yeah. But what happened to Yannis this, what happened this year with Luca this year, all bets are off now. I totally agree. Anybody can be moved in this league now. You know, don't get too stuck up on being around. You might be moved. So and Brad Stevens, because he's going to have the flexibility of when he won a championship, Joe Mazzullo is a great coach. Can Joe Missoula have team right now that is going to probably struggle a little

bit coming out of the gate because you don't have that great player. So I think it's going to be a total reset. I believe it's going to be a facelift for the South. And then on top of that, you have a new, uh, a new, uh, and you know, the, regime and you know that he pays six six billion dollars for this six point one yeah so I mean I know that's chicken chains you and your brothers but you know for me yeah I know that's why I don't understand why I can't I can't find a dollar and I can't kill one hey I take do I take the point one. You keep seeing, man, just give me the point one.

I'll be happy with that. Hey. But I think the thing is what the teams, this Luka trade, it tells me, I don't know what it tells you, Ocho, I'll be interested to hear what you and Brad think, is that teams like, we're not going to let y'all degrade players hold us hostage. We'll move your ass. Because y'all had too much power I

mean don't get me wrong superstars have some power they've never had the kind of control that these guys got right I heard bird talking bird said they didn't run nothing by me hey I just I go in the locker room but I got a new teammate. They'd ask me. No, that hold on a minute. That's a lie. And I get it out of, I get it out of my choke. I love, I love Larry. But when I got traded in 1985 or 86 with Bill Walton, they ran that by Larry. And he signed off on it.

And he signed off on it. Oh, brand damn. I'm not believing you. You're saying a lot of stuff, but players, players did have a little bit of power, but now they have so much more because they are a commodity. They are. This is, this is a fortune 500 when you get one guy right now. So I mean their ability to control games, to manipulate teams, teams been over backwards, you know, on the road right now.

You know, when I was in the NBA, we had to wash our own road uniforms my first couple of years. So, yeah. Yeah. You know what Charles Barkley said that? Yeah. Guys will go on a two week road trip and there were some guys who were so nasty,

they wouldn't even wash the uniform. You would grab that uniform and you could throw it up, throw it down on the floor and it would stand up by itself. Stand up on it, yeah. That's how I feel about that. He was like, you ain't go out. Why would you want to guard that smelly guy right there? So, I mean, it was a different time.

I appreciate what the teams are doing. I appreciate the players. They are tremendous athletes, but I tell you what, I would, I'd be hard pressed to find some guys right now as you talk about, and don't know all that smoke. They don't want these. They, they, they look, they, they come in and they talk a lot, but they know those guys want that smoke. But see back there, hey, you could be talking all kind of crazy to somebody.

They swing on you back at it, but you know, back there you wasn be talking all kind of crazy to somebody. They swing on you back at it. But you know, back there, you weren't getting five or fifteen hundred. Now they put a fine on you. Now you might lose a million, two million dollars, corporate. This guy's like, no, well, what's the million dollars? So got making a 70, 80 million dollars. What's that? I give it away. No money. I know you I know you're not.

But I'm just talking the way the league is now. How many times we see Dre my get Dre my get a fire. He's been fine over a couple million dollars a couple million he's giving money back so so guys aren't afraid now you start talking about that money but I don't think no guys want to fight Ocho. I don't know if I want to fight no more. We saw Shannon we saw Shannon at the Laker game. I think there you go. There you go. I won't no smoke. I won't no smoke. You know, when you walk when you take a put on the floor, it's no point into a guy. Yeah. Oh Joe, come on now. You know, I look down. I'm like I ain't on the court I

Make sure I went on the court. I do I do a Halliday today. I run up on the court nobody you don't Joe didn't even want some that's smoke you know you want that smoke Smoke was coming out his ears You don't look I was dressed don't choke better have a $4,000 cardigan on I was you know I was like Yeah, I know. Hey, Smoke was coming out his ears. I ain't want nothing. Ready? You know, look at how I was dressed, don't you? Man, I had a $4,000 cardigan on. I was, you know, I was like, I ain't want nothing. Well, you had a what?

You know, a little cardigan, a little something I had on, you know. Hell, okay. Well, I ain't want nothing. You know what? Your grandma's slipping right now. And up in heaven, talking about, you got the $4,000. You're talking about the cardigan. So many stories

about how much money you guys didn't have. And now you're talking about you all had a cardigan for $4,000. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Hey, hey, Cardbread, you from the South. You know what money wasn't flowing like it is now. Couldn't do it at all. My father would grab my, my father would give me a dollar

and he asked me next week, didn't I get a dollar last week? I was like, damn, how long you think that dollar gonna last? So it is a different thing. Let me ask you this, Cornbread. Tell me how impressive you think this is. LeBron James made his 21st All-NBA team at the age of 40. And this is what he tweeted. He said, All-NBA at 40, low key crazy to me right now.

Sitting here watching the playoffs and just thinking about it. Bless beyond. I can't even imagine. How impressive. Do you think we'll see another player like LeBron? No, no, no, not, not because the genetics, the circumstances, all the stuff, the will to win. The work ethic.

That's what, that's what makes him to me, the goat. When I started thinking about, Oh, I know you turned your head. When I said that you. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I like that. Go ahead. Talk about, I'm going to sit back. I'm just going to listen.

Go ahead. Only reason I say that is because of what he's done over this whole period of time. The number of points, everybody talks about his losses and the playoffs. Well, he got there. Don't, don't, don't forget this wrong, but Michael Jordan, his first couple of years got swept, swept, didn't win, didn't win a game. So I think that the goat conversation to me is really different, but I am a huge fan of who LeBron is and when he's done on and off the court.

But at this age right now, to be relevant in the NBA, just be damn relevant. It's already, oh wait, oh, just crazy. All right. This is what Mike Wilbon had to say earlier. We know who Mike Wilbon is. He says, I'm not going to sit here and say that LeBron James has to be considered better than Magic Johnson. That's garbage.

I'm not going to say LeBron James has to be considered better than Magic Johnson. That's garbage. I'm not going to say LeBron James has to be considered better than Bill Russell. That's garbage. I'm not going to sit here and say LeBron James has to be considered better than Kobe Bryant. That's garbage. LeBron James is one of the greatest players of all time in all team sports. I'm sorry if that's not good enough. Turn the page, get over yourself. In other words, I'm not going to proclaim and support

and wave LeBron James' flag for greatness, but if I say he's less than number two, that's not good enough for you, to hell with you. Well, I mean, if you're not gonna say, so why would you say he's number two if you're not gonna say he the greatest? If you're not gonna say he's better than those guys that you mentioned, why would you even say anything

about him being number two? Yeah. You know, I think that people going to say he's better than those guys that you mentioned. Why would you even say anything about him being number two? Yeah. You know, I think that people like to say, because you're in the conversation, you made one of the best points. I think I've ever heard when you did your, uh, Hall of Fame speech, when you talked about, you know, your brother. Right. And then that, and I'm not a cheerful person and I don't like you.

I didn't like you that way. When you said that I am not the greatest player in my household, that's to lean told me who you were as a person because of Mike, because of what the bronze chains the way he's been brought up, you know, mother, mother doesn't know his father, what he's done, how he's educated himself. I look at the totality of who that man is and when he's done on the basketball horizon, he's playing, there are guys right now who's playing with who, he's 20, 25 years old.

He's old to be their dad. Crazy. Yeah. Well, we ain't going to say say yes they daddy, but we Go with the DNA test might be out there one day. No Hey, you know, it's funny though on the corner red We you think about it I think about the conversation when it comes to the greats when it when it comes to sports two greats like this in Basketball you talk about football you come to the greats you talk about Tom Brady's and your Steve Young's and your Petsma Holmes.

The Jordan LeBron conversation to me is one that will never end. That's based on preference on who someone likes. And I think the conversation itself is something that will continue to go on and on and on and will have a never ending story because there's so many variables that go into it and what people to them makes that individual their goal. It's like one of those things that I personally would stay away from because it's never ending debate. It's like three things that I've always stayed away from when it comes to being on a certain platform or any platform for that matter because it's never ending. Race, religion, politics, and politics. It's never ending race, religion, politics and politics.

It's a, it's never ending and they can go on and on. And depending on who you talk to, you could be there for 24 hours because there will always be something to discuss and something to talk about. And that, that, that the broad, the little broad Jordan debate man is, is, is just one that just never see the light of day. Here's the beauty about that. That he's in the conversation that he's in the conversation. If you're one of the top, one of the top five players that ever to play the game.

Yeah. That's enough for me. I don't need no more than that. You don't need to be whoever the best. No, he's one of the top guys that ever lays his shoes up. Although he is the Laker now and I hate him because I hate him because of that. I still respect him because it's just like Magic Johnson. I don't like magic, but I respect him for what he's done for, you know, the people

and the black people in the communities, what he's done for the people who have AIDS or entrepreneurs, all that stuff. I respect him for that. Now, if he, if I would do this, if I wouldn't give him, I wouldn't give him a glass of, if he was on fire, I wouldn't pour the water on, I drink it. Cause that's how I hate that dude. I just wanted to tell you, look, it's easy to say that because I think Michael, I think Wilbon does have a great

relationship with Jordan because I've heard him have other takes on other being the greatest. When he talks about Boxers and he talks about Ali and the other sports that he said that he feels very comfortable saying this, but it just so happens this discussion that he's not gonna say that. That's his boy. Come on. That's his boy. Okay. I'll just say it because I've heard him have other discussions where he had no problems. I love Michael Wilborn, but that's his boy. Mike is his boy. Mike in Chicago.

Michael Wilborn in Chicago. You can't go against that man. And I get it. Yeah. Say that. Yeah. Because a lot of time when people ask me a question, I'm biased. Yeah, I play with John Elway. So y'all want me to say, no, come on now.

My brother, in certain situations, I'm biased. I'm not going to be able to. I can't separate it. Most of the time, I can. I can be objective. But in this situation where I'm talking about a family or something like that, I'm biased. No, I can't separate it. Most of the time I can't, I can be objective. But in this situation, when I'm talking about a family or something like that, I'm biased.

No, I can't separate it too. I walked in the room my first year, my second year in the league, I was average 18 and 10. There was a white guy that came on the court for our first practice and I gave him a clap like this. Great white hope. And it was Larry Joe Byrd. Let me tell you what, by the time that practice ended, I went to the

first black person I could see. I said, you know what? And then white guy can play down there. So I learned the thing. You don't judge a book by its cover. You really don't. And you know, God's the funny guy. God doesn't give me one, but God gives me the two best white players ever to play

together in bird and McKale. And I dare say I might have the white, the best white team ever. When I think about if I get those two and I put Cabot check in there, I put Dave Cowers in there, I put Pete Marvig in there, all white teeth. I got it. I got it. I got it down hands patting basketball. So I was prejudiced as a player, but my God, those guys could play the game at a high level.

You want to talk about this? Michael Beasley also chimed in on the Jordan LeBron debate. With Jordan, they don't talk about negativity. But with LeBron, we watch his good, his bad, we watch his ups, his downs, and he's been so great, we don't have anything else to say. So we talk about his son. Well, here's the thing. During his era, there was a social media like it is now.

Oh yeah. That's the kicker. Oh, you know, you and, you and Ochoa, you know how social media is. Absolutely. And all over the paper. Social media, you'd have never read about some of the things, some of the people have done and said, a social media has changed the landscape for any athlete out there. And if you don't understand that, then you're a fool out there.

I'd said that, I mean, Joe Mazzola said, I want to insulate Jason Taylor. I said, Joe, you can't. He said, I said, because of social media, that man got five, six, seven million people following him every time he's doing every commercial out there. God bless, but you cannot have the good without the bad because social media is so big now. It absolutely isn't. And Jordan said it, but say he don't know how he could have handled social media.

Cause think about how he's done, you know, how he's been able to scope his life. Now he's been in a bubble from the first, from 84. I mean, he doesn't know what it's like to have a normal life. He can't go anywhere. He can't go to the movies. He got to rip the whole movie theater out. He can't go to the, he can't couldn't take his kids to the skating r movies. He had to rent the whole movie theater out. He can't go to the... He couldn't take his kids to the skating rink. He had to rent the whole skating rink out.

So, LeBron is the same way. I mean, LeBron moves a little bit more freely than Jordan. I mean, because you really never saw Jordan at events like what you see LeBron going to a high school basketball game or pulling up at a college game. It's just so hard for him to, for, to be, I wouldn't, I wouldn't want that. LeBron loves the social media. He dictates any acts in a way that he is able to orchestrate some of the

things with the social media. That doesn't happen when you talk about LeBron, when you talk about what happened on with Jordan. Jordan was looked at as this guy. And from then on, he didn't worry about it. You said, and then you saw how he was exposed when it was the last day. I had my parents on my podcast. He said, he said, let me tell you right now. He said, Michael Jordan's a damn bullet.

He said, we played him and, and I was on his team that time and we beat him. And then after the game, he said, there was a locker room. He said, uh, Michael was standing there and he said, Michael, how you like the mass kickers we gave you today? And Michael said, if you keep talking, I'll kick your ass. Well, my buddy Rob, Robert Parris said, look, you and nobody else. They brought up, walked up to him and said, you know what? I got rings already before I got here.

So there was some exposure to who Michael Jordan was as a player. I admire him. He's from North Carolina, from Wilmington, right down the street from my hometown, the Kinsons. I understand who he is, but nobody would have ever thought that we would have had a guy that would become that big, that big in basketball. And I played with the birds. I played with magic, but none of those guys would ever rank what Jordan has done. No standpoint of being on that route.

Mount Rushmore, except maybe LeBron James, the shoe because car bread. You remember like guys had shoes like, uh, uh, most of them alone and the ice man, they weren wore Nike. Nike wasn't that big back in the late 70s, early 80s until Jordan took it over. And then you had the weapons, the cons. Byrd wore the cons, Magic wore the cons. Dr. J made the cons really famous.

But when they retired, okay, the shoe went away. And nobody else rocked it, the weapons and the Jordan, the Byrd and the magic and that. But Jordan, Jordan ain't dribbled a basketball in 25 years. And he still got the number one selling shoe. You right about that. And people say that right now about his ex-wife, Juanita. How the hell do you try to go date her

when you walking up in his shoes? Are you, hey baby, whoa, what you got on your? Whoa, whoa, take your shoes off. They'll come before you come in here. So, man, you guys, you know what? Let me tell you this before I go. You guys have been brilliant. I am so appreciative of being on your show.

Can't wait to come back. Thank you, bro. When I see you two young black men working and doing what you've done, man, to me, I just look, you're young, you're black, you're brilliant, and I always remember who you are. And that's why I love both you guys. So, yeah. Corporate, I appreciate that, man.

Thanks for coming on. Thank you. When you get another moment, start back by. Because probably when you come back by, the Lakers probably be having... Hey, oh Joe We spent like 20 minutes trying to get him sit up with the camera talking to him wife talking it through it Right. He had his camera. He'd been on there for like an hour He's just waiting wait, so he'd been there for an hour. That was corporate backs

Well the 1981 finals MVP over the Houston Rockets when they had a Moses Malone On that team. I'm trying to think all the players that they had on that team. I think they had uh Who else was on that team? Moses Malone I'm trying to think I don't think uh Rodney McCray was on that team yet. I think that he was on the 86 team, but uh The Celtics beat them in six games.

But uh, yeah, it was great to have cornbread on, man. I know, I mean, like I said, I used to follow the Boston Celtics. That was my team, Larry Bird was my guy and it was great to have cornbread on. So cornbread, when you get a chance, stop back by. I'm Michael Kasson, founder and CEO of 3C Ventures and your guide on Good Company, the podcast where I sit down with the boldest innovators shaping what's next. In this episode, I'm joined by Anjali Sood, CEO of 2B. We dive into the competitive world of streaming.

What others dismiss as niche, we embrace as core. There's so many stories out there and if you can find a way to curate and help the right person discover the right content, the term that we always hear from our audience is that they feel seen. Listen to Good Company on the iHeart Radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. You're listening to an iHeart podcast. you get your podcasts.