Coffee Convos with Kail Lowry and Lindsie Chrisley - The Menendez Brothers: Fine As Fu**

Episode Date: October 3, 2024

CC375: Kail and Lindsie watched the new Netflix docu-series Monsters: The Lyle and Erik Menendez Story and share their thoughts. Lindsie finds a Tiktok about genetic similarities between parents and siblings facinating. Kail is apalled at the charges a women receives from a night of drinking. Today's Foul Play involves an Apple Watch doing more than expected. Check out our Instagram @coffeeconvospodcast for more! Thank you to our sponsor!  Kiwico: Get 50% off your first month on ANY crate line at kiwico.com/COFFEEProgressive: Visit Progressive.com to learn moreStitch Fix: Get started today at StitchFix.com/coffeeconvosRoBody: Memberships start at just $99 for your first month at Ro.Co/COFFEECONVOS. Medication costs are separate. Rx only.Rocket Money: Manage your expenses the easy way by going to RocketMoney.com/COFFEECONVOS

I hate gift giving and receiving. Receiving gifts is so weird. What do you say thank you? This is coffee convos with Kale Lowry and Lindsey Chrisley. I really want you to be in your feels Kale. That does not interest me whatsoever. I feel very attacked by you. A spirited discussion about motherhood, friendship, family, and life in the public eye. I'm just not with the fakery anymore. There's a fakery bakery around here. Here's Kale and Lindsey. Good morning. Good morning, Kitty Kat. Good morning, Kitty Kat. I love that hat. First of all, I have to tell you what I did this morning. Go spill beans. I went all the way back to 2021. Coffee Cabos podcast, the archives, the deep dark web.

Coffee Commos podcast, the archives, the deep dark web. And I listened to our episode with Scream Queens about the Menendez brothers. And I just want to say that we were following this case. I was following this case. You started following this case a long fucking time ago. And so I just want to remind everyone here today, how long we have been covering the Menendez brothers. Oh, the level of investment ma'am. Like I was so committed that I was watching all nine parts of that documentary that came out on Netflix before I came to Houston. Like the way I laid on my couch all weekend long.

But what's so funny is that you initially did not want to cover that case. Like you were just like not interested until you were interested. Yeah, because it just really didn't strike my interest. I'm like, okay, these boys were out there acting like Beverly Hillbillies and shot their parents up. Like there's no, they shot them. So like what are we covering? Until you realized, oh wow, this goes much, much,

much deeper, which I want to say there. So there's a lot of updates in this case. And we don't have to go super heavy into it right off the bat. But I do want to just touch on these before we move on with this episode is that there are several revelations, if you will. revelations, if you will. So the Menendez brothers have responded to the Monsters docu-series, I guess, by Ryan Murphy on Netflix. And they are heavily upset. They are deeply upset by this. And then evidence has been found and there's just a lot of things going on. So first I want to talk about the Variety did an article and I have it right here on a statement that Eric made. He says, it is with a heavy heart that I say, I believe Ryan Murphy cannot be this naive and inaccurate about the facts of our lives so as to do this without bad intent. So he wrote that in his statement. I, I do

want to say this and I'm just going to play devil's advocate because this, it's easy for me to say this on the outside. I'm not Menendez brother. I'm not, you know, in, in best like in the case, right? I do think that Ryan Murphy was trying to portray all of the different narratives that were kind of spun about this case. And so I think it was more, the docu-series in and of itself was like the different perspectives. I don't think that he was saying, this is what happened. Do you get what I'm saying? I feel like it did a really good job of covering all of the perspectives, all the angles.

Yeah. And then I also, I just had a question for Eric and Lyle. Like how did they watch it? Like did they get it in prison? No, no, no. Because I am, I'm pro Eric and Lyle, get them the fuck out of prison. If you're going to let Gypsy Rose walk free, y'all got to really deep dive back into the Menendez brothers because one, they didn't

get a fair trial. Two, it was a mistrial the first time. Their second one was not a fair trial. And then they're not going to do a third trial because it costs upwards of $25 million of taxpayer dollars to do a trial like this. So I don't, I am pro Eric and Lyle, but what I'm saying is like, how did they get a copy in prison? Like, do they have TVs in their cells? Like, how does that work? I wonder since it was about their case, if they were granted access to it. That is so interesting to me. Like, I would be so curious to know how that works. And I really don't think that like prisoners have Netflix subscriptions.

Right. Like, right. So I like was that a request at like, and also are they being represented pro bono at this point? How are they getting press releases out because those like that costs money to have PR like I'm so interested in invested in like the inner workings of like, very high profile people in prison, like, how does that work? They are not able to make money from prison, but like, are they? I just have so many questions on that side of it. But so also, one of the menudo members came forward and said that Jose Menendez actually sexually abused him as well,

which is one of which is the boy band that Jose Menendez actually sexually abused him as well, which is the boy band that Jose Menendez signed during this time. I think it was like before or in 1989. And so this person has come forward and corroborated the sexual abuse. And then also a letter was found by a cousin of the Menendez brothers that Eric had written describing that the abuse was still happening eight months before the murders. And so that is new evidence. And so I do hope that they do get some sort of, because it's the least that the fucking government can do, is like give them some sort of payment

for their suffering because they were not offered a fair trial and they should not have been in prison this long. This is the same exact type of story as Gypsy Rose, but they were a lot younger than Gypsy Rose even was. I just, I don't know. I think this is where you and I like the Rovers about to meet the road because I think they're where they're supposed to be. Really? I do. I think that it's very clear what they did. They did it with intent. It was premeditated. And I believe regardless of the abuse, that is absolutely awful. It doesn't justify.

You can't fight evil with evil. I mean, I do agree with that. But do you not feel like this was... I mean, I think they've been in prison 33, 34 years. Like you don't think that that's like enough time served for all the trauma, like, their entire existence has been trauma, like there's not been one little piece of their lives. And so like the, the parents created monsters, like, the

mother knew about the sexual abuse that was going on and did nothing said nothing. So many people in their own family knew about it and did nothing, said nothing. So like, do I agree that they should have killed their parents? Absolutely not. Do I feel like they could have walked away and never looked back? Yeah, I do. But at the end of the day, like we can't we don't know what it's like to be sexually abused all the way up until you are 18 years old, up until eight months prior to the murders.

We don't know what it's like to be raped by our dads. No, and I think that's something that we can never understand. And so it's a conversation that we really can't have because we can't get in the minds of somebody that that has happened to. But at the point that that's going on, I just wonder why they didn't feel comfortable enough or were they so scared that they wouldn't talk to anybody about it outside of the house to get them the help that they needed to remove them from that home. But they did. They did ask for help. They asked family members for help. Their family members knew about it. Eric wrote about it to a family member. They essentially did ask

for help and nobody helped them because you have to keep in member, they essentially did ask for help and nobody helped them because you have to keep in mind, I'll say allegedly for the purposes of not wanting to be sued, allegedly Jose was isolating them and alienating them, weren't allowed to have really great friends, weren't allowed to have these deep conversations with anyone outside of the family. But also we're talking about someone who had millions and millions of dollars in the 80s. So Jose Menendez, if I remember correctly, signed the Menudo boy band for like $30 million in 1989 or 1988, somewhere around there.

So we're talking about, especially in the 80s and 90s. Like we're talking like, people today don't even and 90s, like we're talking like, people today don't even have that kind of you know what I mean? So like we're talking about someone who's so powerful and clearly if one of the menudo I think his name was Roy. Let me look it up really quick. Yeah, Roy. Rossello Rossello. I don't know if I'm pronouncing that correctly. He came forward and said that, you know, the sexual abuse was happening, but he's

just now coming forward, which leads me to believe that there was, I mean, some level of power and it's sort of like the Diddy situation, like, nobody was willing to go up against Diddy up until now up until Cassie open, you know, open Pandora's box. I agree with you when you say that you don't think that they should have ever killed their parents. I 1,000% agree. But do you feel like 33 years is enough time when you have to consider all the abuse that they endured? I do think that that's a significant amount of time. At this point, they've spent more time locked up than they ever spent out. I don't know how you can put a proper timeline on people's lives regardless if they're like

evil human beings, right? And they did the crime, so they have to do the time. Do I think that they should maybe, I wish the system allowed some type of offer for like rehabilitation or something for these. But they did. They have done a lot of work in prison. I mean, a lot of work in prison. I mean, a lot of good in prison. I think that they really took the time

to do what they need to do for themselves and just to potentially get back into society and be productive members of society. I think they've done a lot of work in prison. I wanna pick your brain on the therapist. Well, so the therapist, Dr. Ozil, I think he was trying to play, he was doing a Diddy move, Jose Menendez move

by basically saying like, I'm going to record these tapes and you're going to invest your money that you are going to get from your parents' murder and you're going to invest in this company that I have and I'm not going to tell your secret. That's what I think was happening. I wholeheartedly agree. And I was having a conversation with somebody the other day about this documentary because they were also watching it. And I said, is it not like by law that a

therapist has to report something like that? Like, why was he not charged? something like that? Like, why was he not charged? He did lose his license. He can't, he was no longer a doctor after that. But I don't know. I think that the, and do not crucify me if I get this wrong, but I think that getting a psychologist's notes or therapy notes in general is pretty difficult because you have, um, patient client or doctorpatient confidentiality. It's the sort of the same for like a lawyer,

client confidentiality, but I think for doctors and therapists, I think it's even harder. I don't know where the line is drawn because we know that if you're a danger to others, they have to report that, or if they believe that you're gonna be a danger to yourself, or like child abuse or anything like that, others, they have to report that. Or if they believe that you're gonna be a danger to yourself or like child abuse or anything like that, I think they have to report. But I just wonder when it was so specific to the parents,

I don't ever think that Lyle and Eric would have killed other people. I don't know about that. And I also am very curious to know why they didn't mention the sexual abuse to the doctor. I mean, I know that because originally, if it is accurate, the therapy was court ordered because of the burglaries that they were committing. And so the court ordered for this to happen. And so maybe they didn't feel like it was

necessarily a safe space to talk about the abuse and they were only going because they had to. But we know for a fact that they did reach out to family members. And I don't know. Like, here's the thing. I feel like I, as an adult, a 32 year old adult, have certain people that I tell certain things to. And there are just certain people that I may get personal with, but I'm not telling them all of the nitty gritty details. They may know the gist of something.

And so I just don't know that that can be held against them. I think that they were really young and we know that like boys don't develop as fast as women do. I just am really curious to know was he charged with anything Dr. Ozeal? I don't it didn't say anything about him being charged with anything on that documentary. I just feel like when you have these confession tapes, at what point do you say, okay, these boys went out killed their parents. They are a threat to some sense,

right? Like, was it a very targeted situation? And do I believe that they would have gone out and killed someone else? Not necessarily. But the fact is, is they did kill two people. I actually recently just got a package from KiwiCo. and KiwiCo is actually launching KiwiCo clubs to engage kids on a journey of seriously fun learning. If you guys know me you've heard me talk about KiwiCo before and I've actually gifted these crates to my kids schools because I just I love them so much. Kids will learn the fundamentals through hands-on projects and progressively build their skills with each new project they work on. I actually just got Jackson a box.

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but he wrongfully shared information about the brothers with Smith. Another client. Yeah, another client. Yeah, and that was- It wasn't actually because he had the tapes or anything like that, or even like blackmail essentially because you're like blackmailing them into, okay, so that's really interesting. In the documentary, it went into that and how- He was charged with a variety of offenses.

Does it say- It says that he was charged with, but I guess it was the Consumer Affairs Board of Psychology charged Ozeal. Okay. So they weren't like criminal charges. So what that would have been, would have been the fact that he breached patient client privilege with his other client. So that's why he would have lost it. But to me, I'm like, there should be some type of criminal penalty for

him not reporting that. You know what? When I was watching Monsters and Eric has the meltdown and ends up telling his, I don't even want to call it a meltdown, like a psychotic break or just like the guilt was eating at him. So he confesses to Dr. Ozeal. It reminded me of the Skyler Nielsen murders where one of the murderers of Skyler like had a breakdown, like a psychotic break and like told everything. That kind of goes against, this is just my opinion, but that kind of goes against what people were saying about the brothers being sociopaths because I feel like if you're a

sociopath, you don't have that level of feelings. But I will say this, I will say this, and I'm standing 10 toes down on this when I say it right now, may change in the future. I do think that Lyle has more sociopathic tendencies than Eric. I think that Eric, if it's a spectrum of sociopathic tendencies, they may have some tendencies, right? But I definitely think that Lyle is further along on that scale. I was about to say before you even said that, that I think one can be a sociopath without the other one being. Or maybe they both, but just very different levels of it, because I think Eric having a really hard time with this or a harder time than Lyle. And then ultimately confessing to the therapist, I definitely think speaks volumes about where

his head was at and also how distraught and how they talked about their parents. They loved their parents and this was such a conflict like internally is so interesting to me. Like they definitely struggled with their decision and what they were doing. I definitely think they struggled with it, but I, I'm not a doctor though, so I can't really speak to me. Like they definitely struggled with their decision and what they were doing. I definitely think they struggled with it. But I, I'm not a doctor though. So I can't really speak to that. It's just my personal opinion based on what I know.

I mean, I believe the end result of both the parents being dead regardless of who was the orchestrator or not, like they both contributed to that, right? I would have liked to see them tried separately, though. What what what do you think would have been the difference? Because I feel like when you have one that's like a ring leader, and the other is, I feel like more of a follower, and kind of went along with it, that maybe one of them should have

been charged with first degree murder and one should have been charged with manslaughter. Oh, that's interesting, especially because I think, again, don't quote me on this, it was determined that the final blows came from Lyle. Yeah, I just as a mom, because I think initially when I first had heard about this case, I was so conflicted about one whether I believed the sexual abuse occurred. And obviously, as time went on, I wholeheartedly believe that that was absolutely occurring to the level it was occurring. As a mother, I definitely I do believe that Kitty could not handle her kids.

I 100% believe that but to allow knowing for for Kitty to know about the sexual abuse and do nothing about it and not protect her boys like I would go out on a limb and say I hate her. I absolutely do hate her. I think she was a horrible mother. And I believe she very much falls into the stereotype of a woman that's married to a man that has access to a ton of money. And she was very aware of a lot of things and she was okay with whatever was going on as long as her lifestyle was supported.

That is just so foul to me. I mean, not allowing anyone to go down the hallway when your husband is going upstairs to take showers with your children. Like that to me is just beyond, I can't wrap my head around it. Like I just truly can't. How sad is it that she makes them dinner in this documentary and they're afraid that she's going to poison them? Why is that though? What was that about?

Because she hated them that much. Would that was that? She said that she that that she had love for her children. Like she she birthed them, but she didn't like her kids. And she didn't want to be a mom. I did hear rumors are on another documentary, something along the lines of like her wanting to have a daughter, but she got two sons. And then she was like, she can't control them. They're out

of control. Okay, because you raised them like they, I do believe that there is a nature versus nurture aspect here. But I think if it wasn't for those two people as parents, they would not have turned out the way that they were. I also think that one of the boys definitely struggled with his sexuality. But here's the thing. Here's the thing. Now let's talk about that for a second. I believe, again, my opinion, most people that are gay are born gay. I believe that wholeheartedly. Nobody has to agree with me. That's fine. We can agree to disagree. I think that most people are born that way. I do believe that some people choose that

and that's perfectly fine too. I don't give a fuck either way. I don't know that I believe that Eric was born that way. I think that he truly struggled with the fact that he loved his father and was confused because of the sexual abuse. I don't necessarily think he was born that way. I 100% agree. And I think because that was what he knew, he should have never had to know that.

But because that is what he knew, it was, and it makes me sick. Like it gives me the ick when I'm about to say this, but it was what he became comfortable with. Right. And I think he even talked about it and we don't obviously know how true, um, that portrayal of the monsters docu-series was, but when, um, he's talking to someone in that documentary, like the, theactment, saying like that's, he doesn't

know what it is. He doesn't know what his sexuality is. He doesn't know why. He doesn't know if he likes it or why he likes it or, you know, whatever, because he's not sure because he did allegedly sleep with another man, I guess, in high school. And it was nice and it was fine, but he doesn't know if he actually likes it. I don't think that that's fair that his dad essentially created this whole question surrounding his sexuality. If he was going to be, if he was gay, let him be gay by nature, not because you confuse the fuck out of him.

That's not fair at all. But so the fuck was he? The dad was, yeah. I mean, what was... How are you gonna say something like that? Number one, number two, to go into a bedroom with your wife, the mother of your children, to boys that you are sexually abusing,

and to bring up a question about the sexuality. Also, he was cheating on his wife with another woman. And males. Yes, and to say that his concern was the fact of one of his boys having AIDS. And she goes in the hallway and tells him to pull down his pants to check out his private area to see if there's like anything visible there.

No, I believe the reason the dad questioned that was because he knew that he had intent to continue sexually abusing those boys. And he was afraid because he was aware that his son was sexually active with another guy. And he didn't want to contract anything. Jose himself was also also sexually active with other males. Yes. But he wasn't going to admit that to Kitty, so he couldn't sit here and say, oh, well, I'll be the one to bring in AIDS into this home.

He's going to put the blame on Eric because if Jose contracted it, he would have given it to Eric because that abuse was still happening up until eight months before the murders. So it was easy to place the blame on Eric when really it was himself. You know what was really sad to me? At the end of the documentary, when they go and pick them up from where they had been housed

and they put them in separate vans, right? And they weren't aware that they were going to two different places and the bands go like two different directions. And they're like, where am I going? Like, where is he going? We're going in opposite directions. Do you think, I mean, I know that it's like standard protocol

to not be housed with someone that you were like a co-conspirator with in a crime that's like standard but these boys I feel like they were all that they ever knew I definitely think it was unique circumstances and normally I would agree like especially and like maybe couples that kill together or like friends that like I would agree I do think in this particular because I do think that certain cases have to be looked at with the unique circumstances like you have friends that I would agree I do think in this particular because I do think that certain cases have to be looked at with the unique circumstances.

You have to look into them. I do think it was cruel and unusual punishment for them to have been separated. I agree with that. I mean, they were housed in the jail where they were together, I think, just in different units. So why couldn't they have gone to the same prison in just different units? Yeah, I agree, Especially just given the circumstances because I don't think that everything is black and white.

I mean, I say that all the time on this podcast. I just don't, this case specifically needed to be treated as such. Coffee Convo's podcast is brought to you by Progressive Insurance. Let's face it, sometimes multitasking can be overwhelming. Like when your favorite podcast is playing and the person next to you is talking and your car fan is blasting all while you're trying to find the perfect parking spot.

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It broke my heart, but I was very confused by it because the depiction in the documentary made it seem like he was fully bald on top. He was. But at that age, how do you get that bald? I would guess probably because if Jose himself didn't have, if he didn't have balding and it wasn't, there wasn't like a genetic factor, something tells me it was like stress, vitamin deficiency, just by happenstance. I'm not sure, but like to go to the lengths of having like an actual like implants put in your head so that you can secure this to pay. It's not like just like a regular wig or like a regular situation.

I mean, that's, imagine you were like 20 year old, 21 year old going through that and you're that cruel. Oh, and the fact that it wasn't about his son's appearance and like how his son felt, right? It was about the perception of the family and him not having hair and how he wanted to get into politics. Yeah.

It was like very grandiose, like narcissistic, I feel. Like the emotion. I couldn't imagine like my son being 20 years old and going through that and me not being more concerned about his emotional state of having that issue. But narcissists can't have that. And I definitely think that was this was a very severe case of narcissism, like almost like conditional like no, it was conditional love. Like you have to be a certain way in order for me to love you.

But when I love you, it's going to be a sexual abuse, which is so fucking weird. Do you think that narcissists can actually love though? I think they can love to their own. Like, I don't think to a narcissist, just my opinion, I don't know this to be a fact. I've done no research on it. But from my experience with a narcissist, I believe they can love to the ability of what they believe love is. But I don't think that they actually know what love is. I don't know, because I also, every time I look it up, the differences between sociopath,

psychopath, and narcissist, I'm like, I remember and then I don't remember. I feel like a narcissist can love to a certain degree, but only as long as they benefit and it's very much like can be discarded at any point. But then I think that's not love. Let me see. But to them it I don't know because can a narcissist love you? Oh

It says it's important to remember that narcissists can and do love but their love may never be the same as a healthy unconditional bond. So it says people with narcissistic personality disorder have traits that are in opposition with the ability to love another person, at least in the way that people without narcissistic personality disorder understand love. So this includes a lack of empathy, sense of entitlement, and a tendency to exploit others for personal gain. So they can, but just not in a healthy way, I guess. So like Kitty said, she felt love towards her kids, but she didn't actually love them.

Because to me as a mom, you don't love your kids if you're not willing to protect them from sexual abuse from their own father So to me you loved the idea of them you loved them because you were their mother But you didn't really actually love them to me. That would be like more of like a narcissistic in my opinion I think that You can never truly have a healthy relationship with somebody who is a narcissist like On various different fronts, right? Because if you're a normal operating human being,

you have the ability to like unconditionally love someone. A narcissist does not have that ability to unconditionally love because everything for a narcissist comes with a condition. Oh, wow. You know, so it's like, I love you if, and like all these conditions, right? So Jose to his kids and also Jose to Kitty.

But I also think that Kitty had traits of narcissism as well. I agree. And I think the boys also did. Yeah, for sure. And maybe sociopathic tendencies, but that I believe was nature versus nurture. I don't necessarily think they were born that way. I don't think they were either.

I think that they could have been very productive members of society had they been raised right. Agreed. And I actually saw an article on CBS that says that one of their lawyers tells 48 hours that new evidence corroborates those long standing claims, lessens their culpability and argues that Lyle and Eric

should have been convicted of manslaughter instead of first degree murder. And if they had been, they would have received a much shorter sentence and been out of prison a long time ago. That's the letter that I was talking about and also the Menudo member coming forward. But I guess for me, how does, while I understand the letter that I was talking about and also the Menudo member coming forward. But I guess for me, how does, while I understand the letter, what I don't understand is how does that change the circumstances of the fact that it was a premeditated killing?

Because I think that there are, I don't want to say exceptions, but I think that this proves that there was absolutely sexual, because before I think there was questions surrounding whether or not the sexual abuse actually happened and whether or not they actually endured what they said they were going through. I know that Abramson, their attorney, I think it was Eric's attorney, right? Was questioned whether or not she made up that defense because her previous case had the abuse excuse that I guess could not be corroborated, but that client was acquitted. questioned whether or not she made up that defense because her previous case had the abuse excuse that I guess could not be corroborated, but that client was acquitted. Don't quote

me on that, but I believe that's what happened. And so when enter stage left Abramson on this case, how could you prove that this was going on? And so they didn't have the evidence, one, of another victim coming forward, which now they have, and then two, the letter that details that this was happening eight months before the murder. So, I mean, we're talking almost an adult person being raped by their father. That to me, I mean, you have to think of the psychological implications that that would have on somebody being raped by their dad for essentially their entire life. So, I think that that's why it would lower the charges to manslaughter. That's so interesting to me. I just wish.

What was Gypsy? Gypsy. Because essentially, don't quote me on this. I do not. I don't want to be fucking crucified for this, but like, Eric acted with Lyle, right? They both did it. But is that not similar to Gypsy? Eric and Gypsy would be in the same sort of position. But also Gypsy and Lyle, because Gypsy was the ringleader and so was Lyle. So I just feel like if we're going to be able to use case law then I feel like these two should have been tried sort of similarly. I mean I would agree. What was Gypsy charged with? Let's find out. Because I feel like if it was first degree murder she wouldn't have been eligible to

be out. Second degree murder. Okay. So that's very different than first degree murder and very different than Manswater. The Menendez brothers were charged with parasite. But could that not have been second degree murder or because they actually did the killing and Gypsy didn't? Correct. Okay.

Yeah. Do you feel like they should have been tried separately and one should have gotten a different? Now that you say that, I would say maybe, but I also feel like, again, this case is so unique and there's so many layers to it that I just don't know. I don't even know that Lyle and Eric would have wanted to be tried separately because they were so close. And like, I think they were, they're the closest brothers that I've ever like known of in my entire life. Like when Lyle was willing to protect Eric to the point of killing the parents that were still sexually abusing, you know what I mean? I just don't

know that they would have even, I don't know that Eric would have wanted Lyle to be charged with a heavier crime than himself because that's how close they were. But I think to fairly represent Eric, I feel like his attorney should have gone to bat for him to say, maybe he didn't want to because technically you have to listen to your client. You're being paid by the client. So maybe they discussed that because I think in the monsters documentary, they started to talk about that in one of the episodes and Eric wasn't having it. I just feel like you're doing a disservice to yourself at that point. But like maybe they were like going to ride it till the end.

Like whatever happens to you happens to me. Yeah. And there there absolutely was like, in my opinion, mentally ill. And I believe that was that was by nurture. I don't believe they were born that way. And if you're killing your parents, there's definitely some, I mean, I don't care if it's because, yes, it was premeditated, but like also, no, it wasn't. Like, I don't think that it was so far premeditated. I think it was like, and I did write down in my notes when

I was watching the docu-series, like had something happened that night that they actually killed their parents, would it have postponed the murders altogether or would they have just like not done it at all? Like if something interfered? I feel like it was happening regardless. You don't? I don't know. I have no idea.

Like I truly, I just wonder like if something interfered, like would it have postponed it or would it have? Because here's the thing, they didn't plan very far ahead. I mean, it was premeditated to some degree, but I don't know that it was premeditated down to the last detail because like they really didn't think very far ahead at all for this being premeditated, which is why I think it falls into the like, this like weird category of self defense. But I think premeditated is very simple. Like it's any meditation on doing something heinous

like that, regardless of how well thought out it was or not. I just want to talk to them. I'm going to kill my parents. Let's go get guns. To me, that's premeditated enough to say like this was premeditated first degree murder. I just want to talk to them. I want to get into their heads and I want to do the work. I just want to know something that nobody else knows. I need to know. I need to talk to them. I need to understand more. We'll never understand. I think my fascination with the Gypsy Rose case has completely gone out the window and I couldn't care less. But cases

like this one, I think will live rent-free in my head for the rest of my life. The images of them live rent-free in my head at this point. When I like new photos of them surface last week, I don't know what I was expecting like I was born in 1989. So obviously, what 33 or 34 years have like passed, that's how long they've been incarcerated. I don't know why I was under the impression that they would still look like the photos of when they committed these crimes. I just want to say that in his prime, Eric Menendez was fine as fuck. You would have dated him?

Absolutely would have fucked him for sure. Oh, so just fucked? Yeah, I wouldn't have been approved by Jose Menendez for sure. It would have been on the low. I want to just say that he could have modeled. I don't know why Kitty and Jose would not have wanted their son to model, but he would have been top tier and they have the connections and resources to make that happen. So I'm just very confused by like, I know

they wanted to go into politics, but also for reference, they are now 56 and 53 years old. They did not get to procreate, which may have been for the best, but just saying, I think that they've served their time and they also didn't get to have any chance of a normal family at all ever. They were 18 and 21 years old, which is very different from 23-year-old Gypsy Rose. I could talk about Gypsy Rose for days. I'm not going to. Let me Google Eric. He's kind of fine. Then, I'll put then because I don't think he's cute now.

Are you going to date him if he gets out? How old are they now? 53 and 56. Oh, I can do that. No, because... Oh, I can do that. But why was Eric good looking back then? He really was. And honestly, the glasses, they suited him truly. You liked it. I did. I thought it was a good look for him. I've been seeing a huge influx in our group asking questions about Ozempic and Wigobi, also asking where people can find it because it seems like so many people cannot get their

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I have to tell you about this TikTok that I saw. And I don't know why I have, like this has never crossed my mind before, but it was a question. Are you more related to your siblings or your children? What do you think? Like genetically speaking, like DNA wise? Yeah, like if you, so same mom and dad, right?

Okay. Let's say you have like one biological sibling. Are you more related to that sibling? Are you more related to your child? DNA linkage? Wow. What an interesting question. Well, I think you're more related to your sibling, right?

Because you get 13. Depending on the chromosomes, if you and your sister or your brother or whatever, depending on which chromosomes you get, because you get 13 from each parent, you may have some of the same exact ones where with your child, yeah, I would guess my sibling probably. So this video says your siblings, you have the exact same parents if you're full siblings. Your children have your DNA mixed with your partner's DNA, who you aren't related to. You would think that it was an easy answer. The easy answer would be your children, but you share more DNA with your siblings.

Well, what's even crazier is if you have an identical twin, your identical twin is biologically by DNA, essentially you're one of your parents. Wait, what? Elijah's mom is an identical twin, but by the DNA, his aunt, his mom's identical twin by DNA is also his mother. If they were to do a DNA test, that's his mom. It would match her the same way it would match to his mother? Almost.

Yeah. I think so close that it could be his mom. That's so crazy. So your kids are fraternal twins. Does that mean that they have like more DNA similar than if they were just siblings from the same biological parents? No, so they're just like fraternal twins are essentially regular siblings born at the same time.

Okay. So nothing about their DNA is going to be more or less than just like a regular sibling, like you and your siblings. So Verse and Valley and Rio are all like in equal standing as far as DNA is concerned. Yes. But Elijah has first cousins and his mom that are identical twins. Identical twins actually freak me out. Identical twins are so fucking fascinating.

I mean, all twins in general are fascinating to me, but this whole sibling thing is kind of trippy because... So I wonder if my half sister, Michaela, would be roughly the same DNA to me because we only have one parent to my child. Like, I wonder if that would actually be... Oh, that's interesting. Isn't that interesting? Yeah. So like you would be equally...

Related to my sister, to my children. That's so interesting. Can you get the DNA tested and do like research for us? Yeah, absolutely. I will. Can I call like Hulu and ask them to film it as well? Yes, I think I would be down for that. I would love that. Can I tell you about this fucking... I need Kristen to play this video.

So we recently went on tour. We went on a couple tour dates. Thank you so much for joining me for three of them. I absolutely loved that. But with that being said, I know that there were drinks involved. I don't drink. I know you do. However, I need to know your thoughts on this particular video because this is not Rage Bait. I wanted to make sure it wasn't Rage Bait before I fell for it and then also brought

it to Coffee Commons podcast. I need to know your thoughts here because I think that you do working working lunches, right? Like you maybe sometimes have a margie or a little margie or a little mojito. I need you to listen to this and then I want you to react. Okay. Okay. I just needed to do this now because I just got home and tomorrow I feel like I just won't care anymore. We went to dinner here tonight in Dallas and I'm not going to say the name of it because the food was exceptional. But when we got the bill, normally I don't look at bills. I'm just like, yep, sounds good. Here's my card. I know that sounds ignorant, but whatever we got at the bill.

And I like in my head knew that we only got like a hundred dollars worth of food, which food was great. So how did we get to $530? Let me tell you, and I need just, I'm doing this because I just need justification or like if this is normal, if you've ever heard of this before. So I'm going through it, right? Okay, so Haley and I got,

well, Haley got three, because I only got one, there's four on here. Lalo, Blanco, Skinny Spicy Margaritas, right? $14 plus prep, $3 what I was like when we get to further you'll understand I was like what's prep and he was like oh it's the shaking of the margarita I was like you charge three dollars to shoot the margarita so our Lalo Blanco margaritas were $17 that's fine right just put $17 don't put prep so then we go further down and we get to the Fortaleza,

sue me if that's not how you say it, Fortaleza Blanco, $32, okay, great, it's fine, some drinks are $32. The prep for that specific one was $13. $13 to shake the margarita. Then, tapachico is $7, okay, whatever. All right, moving on. Then another gal got a Casa Dragonas Blanco, the V of them, $28.

That's fine, right? Her prep was $15. Then she got a double, which was $22. So 22 plus 15, 53 plus a double, 75. $75 drink, $75 drink. So I, oh, what? So I was like, also, wouldn't a double

be half of what the drink would cost? So it was $28, so it should be $14, not $22. And he was like, well, wouldn't a double be half of what the drink would cost? So it was $28. So it should be $14, not $22. And he was like, well, normally in a double, they like put more in it. So I was like, so a triple. So then it, what? Okay. So anyways, all this to say, what the F. This place charges to shake your margarita.

Ma'am, I need to know your thoughts here because for me as a consumer, I'm going to fight that because cool, if you want to charge $25 for a margarita, then just fucking charge $25 for margarita. Do not include what the prep cost is because that's insane. I have never heard of that in my entire life. That was in Dallas. So we just came home from Dallas. And so that's why I was like, I have to tell Lindsay about this.

I kind of believe it. I feel like everything in Dallas is super expensive. So I, I do believe it. I could never imagine bartenders make a minimum wage, right? Like hours. I don't think always. I don't think always. Only tips. I don't think always. Are it only tips?

I think it depends. Let me just clarify. Do bartenders make minimum? First, the federal minimum wage for hospitality workers is $2.13 per hour. So employers have to at least pay that. And then it says second, the average hourly wage for a pay period after factoring tips must be at least $7.25 per hour. That was as of January of 2024. So I think, no, they don't really nest. And they don't make what other minimum wages are for other occupations. So I almost feel like this is illegal, number one. Number two, no way in hell am I paying for you to shake something that's on your menu. Also, that negates the tip because now that I paid for you to shake it, now like we're

good. Well what sucks is like that's not the bartender's fault. That's the establishment's fault. So you're putting as an owner of this establishment, you're putting the bartender in a really fucked up place because now it's going to be taken out of their tip and it's not their fault. You know what I mean? That's, that's insane. I've never heard something like that. I would love to know anybody who's listening if you've ever been charged for something like that. Also, here's an idea. Get some sort of mixer because if you're going to charge $13 for the mixing of this margarita, get a machine that

does it so that it doesn't take away from your your employees tips. I do believe the drink prices on those like margaritas and stuff because if I go and get a mojito somewhere, it's like $16 but there's like a lot of ingredients that go into that and they're expensive ingredients, which I'm fine paying that but at the point that I got a receipt and there was a shake charge on there. No, the fuck we're like we're in a dispute. Like I'm gonna pay with my amex and then I'm going to dispute these charges. Right? Absolutely.

Absolutely. Wait, so you don't drink anything at all? No. No, I don't. I just I also would probably tip the tender but but also just but also just view the. I would be like, I'm absolutely not paying for the fucking wear and tear of shaking this glass. That's not happening, but I will- Wear and tear. You might as well put the wear and tear of glasses on that fucking receipt because what the fuck are you doing?

That is so insane. So let's talk about money. Let's talk about Rocket Money because I have some subscriptions that I actually forgot about and need to cancel, but I'm not going to do it myself. I'm going to have Rocket Money do it for me. Rocket Money will cancel subscriptions for you that you otherwise would have had to spend your own time doing and you don't have to do that anymore.

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saving members up to $740 a year when using all of the apps features. So stop wasting money on things you don't use. Canceled subscription saving members up to $740 a year when using all of the apps features. So stop wasting money on things you don't use. Cancel your unwanted subscriptions by going to rocketmoney.com slash coffee combos. That's rocketmoney.com slash coffee combos rocketmoney.com slash coffee combos. I do have a little brief update that I wanted to tell you about. Remember we were talking about that Kentucky sheriff who allegedly killed that judge? Yes. So I see this article come up and it says Kentucky

sheriff who allegedly killed judge faced allegations of ignoring deputies abuse of women in his chambers. So it says the sheriff who allegedly shot and killed the rural Kentucky judge in his courthouse chambers was accused in a federal lawsuit of failing to investigate allegations that one of his deputies repeatedly abused sexually abused women in the same judges chambers. The man that shot the judge has been charged with murder in first degree. And the preliminary investigation said that this man shot the district judge multiple times following an argument inside the courthouse. And this judge had held his judgeship for 15 years, died at the scene of the crime.

And the sheriff, he surrendered himself without any type of incident. Let me get this straight, just so I have a full understanding. Yes. So women were being sexually abused, sexually assaulted. In this judge's chambers, allegedly. Oh, inside the chambers. Yes, yes. By the judge or by another sheriff?

By another sheriff. And the judge ignored it? Allegedly, that's what's being said. Allegedly ignored it. I'm going to start a rumor and say probably also participated. If he ignored it, there was some other involvement going on, is my opinion. So there is a lot of alleged things that have come out about this case that the judge was involved with a minor child. Also, the sexual abuse that was allegedly happening in his chambers was to have a woman

perform sexual acts in those chambers with the sheriff to not make her serve time. Okay, so here's the thing. What's really, really concerning and scary and I don't even know what else is that that sheriff that shot him probably felt like there was nothing else he could do because when you're talking about judges and sheriffs, I mean, we're talking like murder level coverups, murder level type of crimes where generations and money and power all keeps things quiet and private and on the download, everything is swept under the rug. That sheriff, I'm not saying that it's okay to kill

somebody, but I'm guessing that that sheriff probably felt like there was no other option because if he went to go get help, that was his head on the line. Where do you go get help at that point? Because you can't go to another jurisdiction. Well, I think that from from what I'm understanding, because a lot of people have messaged me about this, that this is like a very small, like rural town. From my understanding, I get like the depiction of like Mayberry. I don't know what that is. Like Andy Griffith, you know, like that show. It's like a really small town where like everybody knows everybody. Sort of like the Murdoz. Yeah. And allegedly, there's a lot of corruption in this area, in the legal system. And I would agree, there's a lot of corruption in this area in the legal system. And I would agree, there's no justification as to why you need to kill someone. But like what actually was going on that the sheriff was aware of that felt like he needed to go through these links.

Like he literally shot him, killed him, and then self-surrendered. Well, at that point, and I'm not saying, again, I'm not justifying murder, but if that was in fact happening, like the sexual assault and sex involving a minor and things like that, what was the alternative? Because nobody was going to look in that direction based on what you're telling me. It sounds like something like this had to have occurred in order for people to actually do a full-blown investigation and for people to want and feel safe to come forward. That's what's so scary. It should never have to be like that, but when there's power and money in small towns, I don't even know what the alternative would have been. I just think it's a very unfortunate situation and I don't agree with the decision for the

sheriff to shoot him. I think there's better ways to handle things, but I don't know how he possibly felt that he felt like he needed to go through those lengths to do that. And now his life is like forever over. Maybe they'll find him. Maybe they'll give him a lesser charge. Maybe they can't prove it was premeditated and he won't get first degree murder. I'm going to keep following and I will keep you guys updated.

And on that note, we have foul play. Oh shit. Oh no, I'm scared. I'm scared. Okay. My husband and I recently got Apple watches. Yes, we're late to the game. Actually, speaking of that, I need a new one. Anyway. Anyway, we were still learning how to use them and what all the different buttons do. One night we started fooling around and things got really hot and heavy. After a while, I started hearing

a weird noise slash siren sound and we had no idea what that was. But it stopped. So we continued doing our thing. Well, it happened again a few minutes later. All of a sudden my husband's phone rings and it's a freaking 911 operator. Apparently he kept holding the side button of his watch down because of the position he was in while we were getting it on. And it called 911 twice. He had to explain that both calls were an accident.

Then she said, so are you sure everyone and everything is okay? I really wanted to chime in and say, no, ma'am, I'm not okay. I was so close to finishing, but your call ruined it. Lesson learned, remove all devices before getting it on. That is so funny. So I do think that Apple needs to like get it together when it comes to that, because if you have the square Apple watch on and you do this, it happened to me at the gym. I didn't call 911, but it would definitely fuck up like my workout stuff by hitting that button.

And so then I turned the watch so that it was on the other side. It's just like a mess. They do need to figure that out. But could you imagine like, what if you were like making noises and calling 911? Like that would have been humiliating. And it would be recorded. It would be like a 911 recorded call the way that if I was a 911 operator that I would play that to all of my friends. No, literally. I'm telling everybody about it.

Also, when you're like doing the deed, where's your phone? Oh, on the nightstand face down. I double check it to make sure it's not like calling anybody. S-I-R-I, like don't say it, don't nothing. Like I need to make sure it's on DND. No, like we're going into straight up focus mode. Yes. Like no one's calling, no one's ringing through.

There's going to be no accidental calling, no accidental answering. No accidental 911 dispatches. We are going to check all situations. Last thing on this, our Apple watch is still a thing because I haven't worn mine in forever to the point that I need to get a new Apple watch. I feel like I loved it whenever I wore it and I don't really know why I stopped wearing it.

I think that they are, I've actually seen more people recently wear them than I ever have. And I think there's so many like accessories to make them cute and like go with the outfit, like athletic bands, like jewelry looking bands. I think they're really cute. I do want to get a new one now that because I think I have like one of the first generations of them. So it's like pretty old. So yeah, I definitely think that I should start. I also need to like up my activity situation. And so I feel like an Apple watch is where I'm going to go. I think I'm going to get a new one. I think I'm not mainly used mine because I used to be like a big walking girl and I want to get back into it, which is why I even thought about getting a new Apple watch. Yeah. It could be able to count my steps and feel like I've done something like productive and

productive for the day. But also if I'm out walking, I don't want to carry my phone. So I like the idea that if anybody needed to get me and I was out on like a three mile walk that they can get to me. Yeah. I also love that. I actually, so at Luxus school, you can do car rider fence pickup where you have to walk or bus.

And I've always been like, he's always been a car rider or I pick him up at the fence. And this morning was the first morning I physically walked him into like to the fence. And I know it was like such a short, very, very short little walk, but I got a couple steps in and I felt good about it. I feel like I need to start doing that.

And I think the Apple watch might be a good, I know there's like Fitbit and other things, but to your point with the calling feature, I don't want to carry my phone and I don't want to be scrolling on social media while I'm trying to, you know, go on a walk or like whatever. Like we're trying to be with nature. So we don't need, you know, so are we going to get new Apple watches? Is that what we're trying to be with nature. So we don't need, you know. So are we gonna get new Apple watches? Is that what we're gonna do?

Okay. And we should buy you more bands. Ooh, that's cute. That's a cute idea. Yeah. Okay. Second person says, hey ladies, I'm a long time listener and I have a great foul play story. I will try to be vague on somebody's tales

since I work in healthcare. Ooh, scandalous. I am a healthcare provider and routinely perform women's annual GYN exams. For women over a certain age during the exam, I will ask them to bear down to assess for prolapse. Wait, what? So basically, like, you know when they say to bear down,

like when you're in labor? Yeah. So she's doing that when they get to a certain, when women get to a certain age to see if there's any prolapse in, you know, their like uterine walls or like their cervix or anything like that. Wait, does that happen when you get old? I think so. I think also like a certain number of children. I didn't have, I just had my annual like a couple of weeks ago. They did not ask me to bear down. So something tells me they didn't have concerns. But yeah, I, I want to die before this happens to me. So

yeah, so same. So this person says anyway, anybody who goes to like a GYN appointment and looks like this, what the fuck are you doing? Because I'm never like I look homeless when I go, okay. So I'm doing my exam like normal and I get to the can you bear down part and she lets out the loudest and longest fart that I've ever heard. My face was unfortunately very close to her bottom half when this happened. I mean, I felt a breeze ruffle my hair from this far. It was that bad. It smelled awful. The patient did not speak. She did not flinch. She did nothing to acknowledge this enormous fart. I immediately backed up locked eyes with the nurse who had tears in her eyes from holding holding back her laughter. Somehow I managed to quickly finish my exam, ask the

patient to get dressed, step out of the room without laughing. When I managed to quickly finish my exam asked the patient to get dressed step out of the room without laughing when I went back in the room to finish the visit neither of us mentioned the lingering fart smell. Needless to say, I started pulling a little more putting a little more distance between myself and the patients during this part of the exam. Thank you both for keeping me entertained during my long drives to work every day. Okay, but here's the thing. Dr. GYN, just where

like we're gonna need you to wear a mask because I can't even imagine just like the regular smells on a regular day. My hairstylist in New York recently or makeup artist in New York recently told me that it's also the feet smell because you have to put your feet on stirrups. And you're either shoeless or sockless. And so the feet smell and then also regular odor vaginal smells. And now you're asking women to bear down.

There may be some fart smells, but like let's just wear a mask. I'm mortified for her. I think I would have cried. I wouldn't have laughed. I would have cried because I would have been so overwhelmed with what she just described. She's better than I am.

Okay. If I was the patient in this situation, I would have absolutely addressed it. I would have been like, oh my God, I'm so sorry for my asshole. I'm so sorry I just ripped ass. Like I truly apologize. I don't think that in a situation like that, I'm probably going to make it more awkward. So it feels like less awkward for me because now the entire situation is awkward like I've effectively shit on you and also I'm gonna be like I'm sorry for my asshole.

Yeah 100% I don't know what this patient was thinking. And can you imagine like being that put together and then just going in and ripping like the worst fart ever? Well that just leads me to believe that like, sometimes the people that are most put together are not actually the most put together. Yeah, because like if you're getting ready for that type of appointment, you know, it's a distraction. Like you're trying to distract me from what's really occurring, which is you have gastrointestinal issues. Goodbye, I can't with you anymore. Thank you guys for always supporting our show. Please subscribe and review on

the Apple podcast app following right on Spotify or listen wherever you get your podcast. Don't forget to follow us on Instagram and join our Facebook group to connect with us in our community. Full video episodes are now available on Kale's Patreon to join visit www.patreon.com slash Kale Lowry. See ya. Patreon.com slash Kale Lowry. See ya. I love reality TV on Pluto TV.

Same, and I love that it's free. It gives me the freedom to watch Bravo's Real Housewives Vault Channel. I'm totally free to watch Bad Girls Club. I'm free for Jersey Shore. Love and hip hop, I'm free all day. Survivor, I'm free all night. With hundreds of free reality shows,

you are totally free to watch what you love on Pluto TV. Pluto TV, stream now, pay never. I'm Laura Lee. And I'm Manny Amue. We're OG social media influencers, beauty gurus, and absolute besties. And we host full coverage. We dish anything and everything pop culture, all the hottest tea, the juiciest gossip, beauty and fashion advice,

and we literally have the best celeb guests. So follow, rate, and review your new favorite podcast full coverage with us, Laura Lee and Mani MUA on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen to podcasts.