Cognitive Dissonance - Episode 494: Knowledge Fight

Episode Date: October 28, 2019

Thank you to Jordan and Dan from for joining us for this episode.    Make sure to check them out  

This episode of Cognitive Dissonance is brought to you by our patrons. You fucking rock. Be advised that this show is not for children, the faint of heart, or the easily offended. The explicit tag is there for a reason. recording live from glory hole studios in chicago this is cognitive dissonance every episode we blast anyone who gets in our way. We bring critical thinking, skepticism, and irreverence to any topic that makes the news, makes it big, or makes us mad. It's skeptical, it's political, and there is no welcome mat, although there probably should be for episode 494, since we have in-studio guests tonight. We've got Jordan, and I'm taking my notes, Dan is what it says, from the Knowledge Fight podcast.

Are you sure you didn't write it down, like, because Dan is part of Jordan? Well, you know what, I'm not 100% sure. This topic has come up on our show as well. I will be honest with you, this is a concern that we've had many a time. I see, I see, okay. Welcome to the show as well. I will be honest with you. This is a concern that we've had many a time. I see. Okay. Welcome to the show, guys.

Thank you. Thank you guys very much for having us. We're really glad to have you. We're really excited to have you in the glory hole. In the glory hole. Deep inside the glory hole with the Knowledge Fight podcast.

A bunch of people, a bunch of people that listen to our show were like, you guys have got to have these guys on your show. Like, you guys talk about Alex Jones. These guys know everything there is to know about Alex Jones. You should talk to them.

I have so many questions. We have a lot of questions. First one, did he bang that cheerleader in Texas when he was 13? Are we talking about the Satanist cheerleader? All right. Here we go. All right. Because we don't believe it, but we're, you know, we're not.

Dan's just like, no, he didn't. No, you don't believe him. What a shock, you know, we're not. Dan's just like, no, he didn't. I'd be like, no, you don't believe him. What a shock. He's not a believable person. Are we suggesting here that Alex Jones

is not a believable, he's not a reliable narrator? Oh gosh. It is a, it's unconscionable to imagine that somebody could betray our trust like this. We have to start the show.

We're going to ask you about your show in a second, but to frame everything, to frame the entire conversation, I feel like we've asked this of many people on our show when we've played Alex Jones clips. Is he a crazy person or is he a fucking liar or is he both? I'm going to actually ask you individually.

So I'm going to ask Dan first. Dan, crazy, liar, or crazy liar? Crazy liar. I mean, I think the question itself is kind of like uh it's a distraction almost even from the like why he's doing what he's doing or why the effect is what it is is almost secondary to the actual effect that he has what he's doing yeah that's a great point but i've gone through so much of listening to him that is just insane and so much that is clearly intentionally lying. So I'm pretty confident it's both.

You think it's both? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Jordan? I would say that it is, at any one point in time, one of them, at least. Like, as we've gone through different... The unequivocal answer. As we've gone through the unequivocal answer as we've gone through

different eras there's almost epochs of Alex where it's like he spent a year in the wilderness being just crazy and then

from 2002 to 2004 he's just a giant lunatic you know point of order though in those times that he was being just crazy that he was also

not being honest during those times so so he was a crazy liar yeah he just happened to be a crazy liar okay he aired more on the side of crazy during this time okay again to frame the show let's talk about what you guys do every week on your show sure we um we do a thing where we just talk about Alex Jones too much. My God. The end. Thank you guys so much for having us.

We gotta get out of here. You guys nailed it. I became fascinated with Alex Jones a while back, and so I just decided that I was going to start really looking at him as an example of people that I think suck. And I'm lucky enough that Jordan and I were hanging out. We're friends.

And he came along for the ride with me as we explored him together. And so we just do a podcast where I listen to Alex's shows from the past and the present day and pull some clips and I play them for Jordan. He has no idea what I'm going to play for him. And then he screams at me. So it's very much.

I like my contribution to the show is very quickly explained. I got to say, when I listened to it, it reminded me of the dollop. But if the dollop only did Alex Jones every week. It's an exhaustive character study. Exactly. Of the dollop.

Yeah. I want to ask, what is it about Alex Jones that grabbed you like that? I mean, he is a fascinating character, but I want to know what it is about him as a character that you're like, this sustains me. Well, I don't know. At this point, I don't know.

It's either this or cutting, I guess. But why choose Alex Jones? Initially, It's either this or cutting, I guess. I don't know. I don't know what to tell you. But why choose Alex Jones? Initially, I had listened to some Alex Jones stuff when I was a younger dude. And I listened to it for entertainment. And I thought it was funny how he'd yell and scream all the stuff, all the meme stuff that you hear, like, he's turning the frogs gay and all that.

Right, right, right. And so I had this image of him in the back of my head as kind of like a principled libertarian Ron Paul guy. Did you use the word principled? Oh, we were young once. In a conversation where Alex Jones was also being discussed. He has too big a beard to be a libertarian.

There's no way he's a libertarian. I said I had the image that you were saying. I'm trying to explain I was wrong. And I'm trying to point out that you were wrong. I'm trying to explain I was wrong. And I'm trying to point out that you were wrong. He's cautiously walking this backwards. You see, I once

was hit in the head with a brick. That's almost an Alex Jones story. I had that image in my head from much younger days, and then as the election was coming up uh of 2016 uh prior to that uh you know clips of alex would start being played around and i saw these clips of him and he's just yelling and like uh like really religious and into trump and it

just confused me and so i started listening to it more and as i listened to it i just found more and more things that were fascinating that were so much worse and so much different than the public perception and the the things that are talked about about him and so that's kind of what sustains me is just like that stuff that you would never find unless you listen to all of his show um and that's and that's something i want to talk to you about because i've never, I will freely admit, I'm a clip guy I've never heard Alex Jones in these digested sound bites. What we get is

there's an intern the saddest intern in the world who has to watch Alex Jones' show every week at Right Wing Watch and then he clips the best part of it for us and then we listen to that that's the only introduction. Or once in a while,

Alex will say something clippable on Twitter and they'll share it on Twitter. And so we don't, I don't have the full Alex Jones experience because I don't know I could do it. Yeah, most people shouldn't. Yeah. I absolutely can't.

Have you ever, have you listened to a full Alex Jones show? Never, not once in my life. Good for you. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I even wrestle with the question of whether or not what we do is entirely worthwhile. I've wrestled with that question about every piece of my life.

Yeah, yeah. Well, there's a certain amount of like, are we being irresponsible in somehow bringing him to even more people that wouldn't otherwise pay attention. I don't think they're going to be convinced. Yeah, that's the thing. And we've struggled with that too, and we've had a lot of people say, you know, I never

even heard of Dave Dobbenmeier before you guys played him. We did an episode about him. You know, people will say, I never even fucking heard about him until you played him. And I'm like, that doesn't mean that he doesn't have, you know, people that listen to him and people that share him and people that need to hear. Well, I mean, Dave does it.

Dave has hilariously like 300 people on YouTube. It's the best. Have you ever watched a full Dave Dobbin, Meyer? Oh my God, no. We've never watched a full anything. Wow. Like we just, we're just clip guys. So for us, it's like, what's the clip say? And we listen to the clip,

but we don't like it. I can't think of anything. We never watched a full Jim Baker. We've never watched a full. You're missing out. No, no, we're not.

No, we're not. I can't imagine. No. And you know, another thing we've never done either, we're Atheist Show. We've never read the Bible.

And a lot of people are like, you never read the Bible. Like, I don't fucking have to to know it's magic. Like, I'm cool. You know, I don't have to watch all of Jim Baker to know the buckets are a lie. You know? No, that's fair. Like, I don't fucking have to to know it's magic. Like, I'm cool. You know, I don't have to watch all of Jim Baker

to know the buckets are a lie. You know? No, that's fair. Man, but if you're not reading the letters to the Thessalonians, I don't know what the fuck you're doing here. Get out of my fucking house.

That's what I'm saying to you right now. Read those Thessalonians. Until you read Thessalonians, your atheism is invalid. Right, right, right. It's like, I've only seen the end of The Great Pumpkin.

And I was like, I don't think pumpkins fly. But, you know, until you see the whole thing, how do I know? Charlie Brown. So, in the last, I want to say, so you guys have been covering Alex Jones for how long? Just about three years now. January, I think it'll be three years. January, three years. So, very close to three years.

I think it'll be three years. January, three years. So very close to three years. Alex Jones really has evolved into, now he was an Obama hater, right? Hated Obama. Big time. Hated everything about Obama.

Two documentaries about him. Real quick, Obama was black though, right? I just wanted to check on that. I don't know if that has anything to do with it. It wasn't on his birth certificate. I will do the glass half full. He was half black. That is a point that Alex makes quite frequently. I will edit that out of the show.

So anyway, but Alex hated Obama. And we had watched a bunch of clips about him back in the day when he hated Obama, he hated everybody. He also did, he also, you know, had it in for anybody who was as was liberal so he's been a he's been a conservative he's never changed really changed his stripes from conservatism that i know but he also hated george w bush oh did yeah he was very much against bush

he was against the war in iraq pretty hard wasn't he yeah he's pretty he was pretty convinced that bush did 9-11 so So there's, you know. You don't go back to liking a guy from that. There's nuance to his. That is a huge party foul. Okay. What are you, Ellen? Come on now.

First of all, I said coats on the bed in the guest room. Not knock down two times. Okay, fine. bed in the guest room not knocked down too okay fine alex uh tells stories of back when uh w was uh like the governor of texas uh when he was when w was there in texas he alex and him would run into each other and they were adversarial and you know george hw bush was the one who said new world order right one of his speeches and so's his kid. So obviously he's part of the Illuminati. So he's always hated him. That one actually might be true though.

Alex is a conservative in like that Ron Paul kind of way. He always supported Ron Paul. Yeah. So he hates the GOP. I thought you were going to say Jews. And then I was like, yeah, no, those two.

Yeah. Yeah, he hates. So he hates the GOP. Well, at that point. He then I was like, yeah, no, those two. Yeah. Yeah. So he hates the GOP. Well, he used to, he used to, because now he is 100% on board. Like he is a thousand. I mean, you listen to him talk in any clip we get of him. He is a hundred percent. Trump is fucking ejaculating down the back of his throat, like a fucking smoothie milkshake. Like there is no going back from how hard he is sucking his dick. And so anything that Trump does, and that's, sadly, that's every single pundit that is religious on the, that we cover. They don't, they don't have any, there's no apology. There's no, oh my gosh, I can't believe Trump did this thing.

There's none of that. It's all just, oh, it's a big giant plan and yada, yada, yada. Trump did this thing. There's none of that. It's all just, oh, it's a big giant plan and yada, yada, yada. Is Alex Jones, is his thought process that you can tell that everything is an orchestrated thing by just like all the other Christian people.

They think Trump is orchestrating everything. I think so. I think that's a fair assessment. I mean, I think I quibble mainly with just the premise of it, which is that I don't think any of them actually believe Trump knows what he's doing. This is the lying part. This is the lying part. I think they're all saying that he has some sort of plan,

but they all know that he's an idiot. Like he's sundowning. He's dying in front of our eyes. Like, I don't know what else there is to say. If you are not an idiot, you can see Trump and go like, oh, I get it.

Like, it's not hard. But for a guy like Alex and like the conspiracy theories that he sells, right? He lives on this world of hidden meanings and hidden players and strings that are being pulled. I would think that something like the Trump administration, which is both incredibly unlikely

and inscrutable day to day in terms of its motivations. Like the only way to make sense of that to some degree is a conspiratorial worldview. How much of a gift is the madness and chaos of Trump to someone like Alex? Well, I think you would think it would be a much greater gift. I think it's turned out to be a pretty terrible thing for him. For Alex? Yeah. Oh yeah, absolutely. Because as much mileage as he could get out of critiquing the Trump administration and all of that stuff, he now has to make excuses for it. And you can only say that there are globalist plants within the White House so many times before it just becomes uncompelling.

And I think that's the trap. You would think so. But it's happening with alarming regularity in the House of Representatives. That's true. Well, it's perfect for him. Like during the campaign, it's perfect for him. Like during the campaign, it's perfect for him. He wants to be a fan of Trump during the campaign because that's all kinds of shit you

can throw at everybody and everybody hates Hillary. So hooray, we're all having a great time. When he actually won, then he, because he's a Trump supporter, Alex has to then defend all this insane shit. Right. And he has to get rid of everything that he's ever believed in order to bend over backwards for it. So if Trump had lost, he gets to continue hating Hillary forever and ever and ever. That's your preferred outcome, which I think everybody on the planet agrees would have been our preferred outcome. So he's just fucked. I got to ask, though, because huge conspiracy on the right that covers, that we cover constantly is QAnon. What is his thoughts on QAnon?

It's so interesting. He's kind of against it. Oh, really? But he's also teased, like, trying to lure some of the people who believe it over to be like, hey, I've got my own version. He had this guy named Zach who he pretended was... I have Z-Anon. Exactly.

Honestly, literally that. Zach. Zach. he had this guy named Zach who he pretended was I have Z or none exactly it's almost honestly what no what Zach it is Zach it is Zach it is 100% Zach what

shut the fuck up yep shut the fuck up space command you got it oh my god it's Z or none yep

he claimed this dude was like that's two levels higher than X is none X is Q and none Y and none Y and none what yeah and a lot of this stuff And X is non. X is QAnon. Y Anon. Y Anon. What?

Yeah. And a lot of this stuff that's sort of the central parts of QAnon belief are things that were discussed on Alex's show prior to QAnon existing. Right. Like, that's not to say that it has anything to do with the actual QAnon, but, like, the whole idea that there's a counter-coup going on behind the scenes against Hillary Clinton and the Democrats who are trying to do a coup, there's a lot of that within the QAnon stuff. That was all stuff that was articulated in 2015 on Alex's show.

So he has a lot of the same ideas, but he resents the success of QAnon because he's not making money off it. Well, all right. So I want to ask this question then why does somebody like alex jones matter because i think he does i think i think i think you would agree he does or it wouldn't be fascinating he is this he's become this kind of larger than life crackpot figure but he's not totally crackpot he's like the fringe is blending into the mainstream yeah so why is what is it about somebody like alex jones do you think that appeals to us in in you know in broad terms and and why does somebody like alex jones matter uh i mean the thing that i say on the show uh most often is that he's just the weakest link in the

right wing propaganda chain the reason that he's so fun to listen to is because he's bombastic and he says ridiculous nonsense and within that he hides his kernels of and it's okay if we ethnically cleanse you know it's like that you know he's like turn in the frogs

and if you want to kill the Kurds you know he's like turn in the frogs guy and if you want to kill the curds I mean it's not that big it's even you know and so so it's really not

we're doing it right now no it's cool yeah we're fine with it he makes it really overt like he makes it really transparent you can see a lot of the tricks

that other people are better at through him he's like a bad magician yes like a really bad magician. Pick the top card. Any of the top cards.

It reminds me of that too. The other thing is that he matters so much now because the more we see what happened to right-wing media after Trump, how they've all headed more towards Alex, I think it's made it concrete that if you scratch the surface of all those slicker propagandists

at Fox News and stuff like that, you will find that they believe, if not the exact same shit that Alex does, very similar shit. Well, one of the things that we were talking about recently is, we were talking about the deep state, the idea of the deep state.

And when there was the whistleblowers, the couple of whistleblowers, I had said, Tom, I said, you're poisoning the well with this deep state language that we're hearing. And we're not just hearing it from the fringe anymore. And I think Alex Jones was one of the pioneers of that idea.

And if he wasn't, he certainly was an early adopter. And so he's been sort of talking about the deep state for a long time. And that is a pervasive thought that works its way all the way through all the right wing pundits that we cover, which are Christian moan mainly. And then, you know,

you'll hear Tucker Carlson talk about it. You'll hear, you'll hear, yeah, you'll hear Sean Hannity talk about it. You'll hear Glenn Beck talk about it. These are people who wouldn't, might,

might not have talked about it, you know, four years ago. So it's a, it's a different, it might not have talked about it four years ago. It's a different day when it comes to news media now. To that point, I wonder, I genuinely wonder, is the concept of the fringe

as a dismissible set of ideas no longer the case in our new world, new media environment? I don't know. Because it used to be that the fringe was on the fringe. The fringe set of ideas no longer the case in our new world and new media environment? Like, I don't know that the, because it used to be that the fringe

was on the fringe. The fringe and the mainstream didn't interact. Now, there is no, I don't know what the fringe means anymore.

Me neither. Right? And I said that like, and we all laughed, but like, I wonder if because the way that media has changed,

the consumption of media has changed, the democratization of media has changed, like this idea that like the fringe as being a dismissible group of minority views, that's no longer dismissible. And does Alex gain some credibility from that shift if you think that shift is real i think that the the fringe is still dismissible maybe but it's less like as there's more and more media options um and independent media is so kind of easy to produce compared to yeah it is in the past sure is welcome to glorious studios this place is great. I love it. This is a huge step up for us. We're very happy to be here. I think that the...

You guys have a fucking globe in here. This is the nicest place I've ever been in. That is a globe bar. Thank you very much. If you open that up, there's liquor in it. I feel like an explorer. Jordan's kind of globe.

It's where he stores his bitters. I like it. I like it. There you go. I wouldn't mind an old-fashioned if you're offering. Yeah. I would if I could.

I would if you could make one. We could pour you bad spiced rum. You love bad spiced rum. I did put that on my Instagram. That's true. I just think that there's so many options now

that the fringe is probably like so obscure that you wouldn't know what it is. Like Alex is the fringe, but he's also the successful fringe. Yeah. Yeah. But I guess that's what I mean. It's like, cause, cause he has had conversations with our current president. It is hard to say that he's truly fringe then.

And he's got, he's the, the, his, the power of his voice is such that when bad shit happens to Alex Jones, it hits every major media cycle. So he must be important enough to be reportable. He must be important enough that the president's going to talk to him. Important enough to get a story on NPR and This American Life. You know what I mean? Very difficult to say, truly fringe. My theory on that is that because the right wing has now has to essentially fight reality

at every turn because if you just look at reality if you just look at it you're like oh well they're wrong. So they've gotten more closer to the fringe because they're fighting reality all the time. It used to be you could accept some of it.

And so Alex, who has always been fighting reality, who has always been seeing pink elephants flying across his face at all times, he seems on the fringe until you realize that once everybody starts denying reality, you wind up at Alex. It's kind of the Overton window aspect. Yeah, it is. So you said successful. I want to talk about Alex's success because Alex has had a pretty bad couple years in the terms of success. So he got...

He would disagree with that, but I think he's lying. I think he's lying too. Well, because he's a crazy liar. Wait a minute, does he still think he's successful? He says he's doing as well as ever, but he's also currently running a everything must go sale. Yeah, well, yeah.

Performance indicators kind of disagree with his own assessment of his performance. He's got a whole set of lizard people he's selling. Everything's okay, but if anyone wants a jelly-used coffee table. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Very much that. Very much that. Check out the InfoWars store now on Craigslist. By the way, I'm on Fiverr.

If you need anybody to move stuff in your house. I got a strong back like a gorilla. Do you need a Yosemite Sam impression? I'll do it for you. Please. If you want to know what's better, I'll tell you it's beef. Voice actor Alex Jones.

He could have been a great voice. One voice. One voice. You don't want to hear the other voices he has on the show. He's currently in the middle of a series of commercials that he's doing where he does a very racist Chinese impression.

Oh my God, really? Oh my God. He plays a dragon called Fentanyl. It's very awful. Imagine how bad it is. Oh no. These are the things you don't get in the right wing watch clip. Oh no. You can't do that. You can't even allow to do that. Yeah. It's pretty offensive. He's really insane. He's not doing well.

But you look back, you roll back the clock to Trump. I would say right as Trump got in, I think that's probably, and I think my timeline's right. He had millions of people or at least a million people on YouTube that were subscribed to him. He had Twitter, a huge Twitter, a huge Facebook.

He was constantly pumping out tons of disinformation every day through tons of different channels, social media channels. He had multiple videos being posted. They had many shows. They had that Paul Joseph Twatson or whatever his name is. He was doing stuff. Nice. So there was a bunch of,

at least one person liked it. I liked it. Jordan liked it. I liked it. Thank you, Jordan. Let's not go too far. Jordan, Jordan, Jordan. Me and you, buddy.

Me and you, buddy. Cheers. Cheers to it. Cheers. Cheers to it. And he told me to roll it back there, but fuck you. Anyway, so,

but seriously, he had a huge, huge fucking following. like a following that like we could make fun of him and he would just be like ha ha ha piss ants go away and i mean like even large celebrities could say shit about him it wouldn't matter because his following was fucking enormous and now he's not on many social medias and he's not on youtube his i mean you really just gotta gotta go to alec jones's site right or does he like not on YouTube, I mean, you really just gotta go to Alec Jones' site, right? Or does he broadcast on BitChute or something?

He did that for a bit. He has his own video service now that he's trying to pretend is gonna be to serve all of the people who get kicked off places. Free speech warriors unite! Exactly. So far, it's all just his employees though. You can never take my YouTube!

Yes, we can actually do you can very quickly take my youtube please give it back yeah that's exactly what happens the real interesting thing is if you go to his own youtube uh clone type of thing like his own version um he has like sections of it for all of his employees and like alex's videos himself have like, you know, maybe 10, 20,000 and up views. But all the rest of his employees are just no one's watching any of their stuff. Six views. It's mom. Yeah.

Mom and her club. I just put up a video of my cat. It very clearly demonstrates that people are not so interested in the rest of the content. They just like him. Yeah. Yeah. But yeah, he's doing way, way worse than around the election time.

Did that change his demeanor at all through how he's approaching any... Because we saw an interview with him after he was taken off of YouTube. And oh my God. The big weepies? Well, it was that one guy who was like interviewing super successful people

and he just happened to catch Alex Jones at the wrong time when he was kicked off YouTube. Do you remember? That's actually one of our favorite clips. Patrick Bet David? Yeah, yeah. So he takes a bite of an apple and in the middle of the bite, he just starts saying, life's very fragile. It's so funny. It's so funny.

The interviewer is telling him about a time that he lost his voice and couldn't run his business. And Alex is like, life's so funny. It's so funny. The interviewer is telling him about a time that he lost his voice and couldn't run his business. And now he's like, life's very fragile. Such a prick. So you know, you know what we're talking about.

Big crunch, big mouthful. But he was like weepy sad eyes the whole time. Talking about how he's ready to die. He's ready to die. That was amazing. I mean, it was, I've already won. I'm ready to die. I've already won. Yeah, that's exactly what he said That was amazing. I mean, it was, I've already won. I'm ready to die.

I've already won. Yeah, that's exactly what he said. The globalists know what I've done. I've already won. And you're just like, you've already won what? You won a fucking one-way ticket off YouTube.

That's not like a, I mean, he's got a bunch of boats, so I'll give him that. He won me. Is he going to keep those boats? Definitely not. Okay. No, no, no.

Alex, this is for you. Enjoy those boats while you have them. Maybe smash up Derby the boats. You know, just get a couple people to run them into each other. You could make the argument, I guess, if you're crazy,

that he has won in the sense that he's distorted a lot of the discourse. He's destroyed reality. You know, like, if that's what he was talking about, then I agree, but also hate him for it. Yeah, I guess you're right.

Well, I want to ask you that. So we've kind of hemmed and hawed around whether or not Alex Jones matters, but he's had an effect. There is an Alex Jones effect on the world, on media. He's not an insignificant, to your point, he's not insignificant. He has had an effect. He has warped conversations that people, I mean, a guy stormed into a pizza parlor with a gun.

Like, shit has happened in the world because somebody is angry on YouTube. And that's the, like, the less tragic consequence of some of his actions. Like, you know, he's getting sued for the Sandy Hook, his Sandy Hook behavior. Can you tell us exactly, like, I mean, in a very brief sense, what that whole thing is about, the Sandy Hook thing? And how great it's going for him. Like, why he's being sued

and what the suit is. I mean, you don't have to be like super legal about it. Just a short brief. I'm very bad at legal stuff. But the long and short of it is he covered Sandy Hook in such a way as to say

that they were actors and the kids didn't die and the parents were actors. So that sort of coverage which I certainly believe counts as defamation. And if you don't, you can listen to our show. We are currently in a

six month long, going through every day of the 2013 period where he did that. So yeah, you can... Anything that he says, we have the receipts in exhaustive and granular detail. We set out to explore

the Sandy Hook coverage that he did, and now we've ended up... Where we're at currently is at the time of the Boston bombing, and what we're realizing is actually someone should be suing him for that. Yeah. What did he do during the Boston bombing that's so grievous?

He created so many just hoax panic kind of. It was these two guys. They're black pack packs. Oh, so like Reddit then. Yeah. Reddit did. Yeah. Okay.

He really pushed those narratives and amplified them to a level that was deeply irresponsible while the country was trying to process the aftermath of the attack. But with the Sandy Hook thing, the families are suing him for this. And we talked a tiny bit before we started that there's, you know, he just lost this appeal. And these are just sort of his stall attempts that he's doing. He's trying to get the case thrown out on free speech grounds and courts are ruling against him. And then he appeals the ruling

to get it thrown out. And then that is, it just keeps happening. He's just trying to stall the process really far down the road, partially because if he has to go to court, it's going to be a complete disaster for him. Oh, yeah.

So he's trying to stop it. He's trying to stop it before it even... Oh, yeah. I see. All of his actions lend to the appearance that he's very desperate for this not to move forward. To me, it reminds me a little bit of that

idea of a guy spending all of his money on a great divorce lawyer just so he won't have to pay any of it to his wife. He's just spending all of this money on like obfuscation law and all that stuff

so that whenever they do finally win because of course they will, he's going to be like, well, guess what? I spent all of my money. Half of nothing is nothing. Exactly.

Right? Like, he's just, he's just a dick about it. Right? And he can't be feeling good after that dude who wrote the No One Died at Sandy Hook book

just had to pay, what was was it $450,000? Well, tell me about that. I don't know about that. His name is Jim Fetzer. He wrote that book, No One Died at Sandy Hook. And just, I think it was like last week he lost the case and had to pay. Good for him. Yeah.

Fuck you, dude. Yeah, for sure. That dude is real messed up. Was he an Alex Jones fan? No, I don't know. He's a crazy dude. Okay, so he's an Alex Jones brother. He might be an Alex Jones source. Spirit animal?

Alex Jones spirit animal? Yeah. So the free speech thing is what he lives and dies on, right? And so I mean he... So long as it's his speech and nobody else's. As long as he is allowed to say anything and everything, it doesn't matter if your free speech exists at all. So I want to ask you guys, like, where do you guys stand on the free speech, the broad.

Hate it. Free speech debate. Shut it down. Pass. Hard pass. Oh, Jesus. Because, you know, like, he may screams and a bunch of people have now screamed and they get kicked off of, you know, he screams and a bunch of people have now screamed and they get kicked off of, you know, different platforms

that this is a denial of their free speech. How do you guys feel about that? If you want a constitutional argument for that, there are 10 million billion of them everywhere. Like, there's no way that you can avoid the fact now that it's obvious. The First Amendment doesn't apply to private corporations. You can put it in your terms and conditions that you get kicked off if you violate your terms and conditions. That's normal. That's how it works.

Losing him is a positive for the society. So, I'm fine with him getting kicked off. I take a position more of like, since I try and research him and engage with his content, I try not to take too much of a stand on that stuff. Like early on when we were doing the podcast, I was very strongly in like, we're looking into this. I want to deal with this as it exists. I'm not advocating for him being kicked off anything. I'm not trying to censor him or shut him down. But as time has gone on, I've found too many instances of things are like, this cannot be acceptable. Like there's just too

many times that he crosses lines for me. So just give me, if you can, a short rundown of sort of the most damaging stuff that he does. Because I know I can name a couple of things like, you know, like make, like when he talks about, um, when he talks about certain celebrities being like blood drinkers and things like that, like that, that, that lends them the, uh, the sort of visage of Satanism, you know what I mean? And that, and that satanic panic bullshit that permeates our society. And I know he's a huge pusher of that. I know he's anti-vax.

Yeah. permeates our society. And I know he's a huge pusher of that. I know he's anti-vax. Yeah. And he's also like anti-science in like weird ways too. Oh, yeah. What other stuff?

Is there more than that? Because that's all I'm aware of. What flavor are you looking for? Oh, wow. Do you want to go with extreme white nationalism? Because he's got that in spades. I think of it more as like... Hey, you can't say that.

They don't have it in spades. Yeah, not in that sense. Oh, I'm sorry. I'm sorry. Is that something you can have in spades? To your question, or you're bringing up the blood drinking thing, I think that that also is a much larger issue

than just like evoking the image of Satanism in as much as like the way he characterizes his enemies, these quote-unquote globalists, constantly drifts into archaic anti-Semitic tropes, like the blood drinking dates back to the blood libel. Yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely. That's just one of the examples of the ways in which

his conception of his enemies match up with deeply anti-Semitic history or the protocols of the elders of Zion. There are just things that he cribs wholesale from the protocols in his characterizations of how the globalists want to control society. And you can find them if you pay attention to it.

So I think that there's a danger in the way he demonizes his enemies in just like, in ways that if you are antisemitic you'd be like I recognize that yeah there's a signal that's a Jew I can hate

yeah I see there's that and I think that that does a lot of damage to just people

it prepares them for being closer to antisemitic leanings than they would have been otherwise. You accept it under the terms of,

these are the globalists. And then when someone's like, yeah, you think it's the globalists, let me tell you, it's actually the Jews. You're more ready to be walked down that path. So like if listeners listen to Alex Jones for entertainment, just for the sheer, just wild wackiness of it,

is some of the danger of that to your point that it kind of lays an intellectual groundwork that will feel familiar to other types of bad arguments? Maybe. I don't want to judge anybody for doing that, though. If they want to listen to it for entertainment and they're, you know...

Sane. I don't want to judge them for it. I would politely like them to stop. Please do not do that anymore. I think there's better entertainment. Yeah, absolutely. I just mean, is there a worry about that? The good place is on again.

I don't know what to tell you. I don't know what to tell you. Don't listen to Alex Jones. I think if you cruise like message boards and like listeners of his shows back when there used to be places, more places where

they would interact, one of the things you'd hear very constantly from them about how they got into the show was they say things like I used to think he was hilarious, I would listen to the show, but then I started looking into the things he was saying and I realized he's right about everything. Meanwhile, they didn't

look into any of the things he said. He just kept saying the same thing. Yeah, and he keeps saying like, you can look it up. He just kept saying that he... The same thing. Yeah. And he keeps saying like, you can look it up. And they just assume that that means they have looked it up. Well, if I can look it up, then I did look it up. Right.

So I know it. Why would you lie to me about something I could look up? Yeah, exactly. What? It's a bluff. It's a perfect bluff. Only a crazy liar would do that.

They would never give them a radio show. I got to ask though.. I gotta ask though, I gotta ask though, how much is, how much of it is dangerous bullshit and how much of it is harmless bullshit,

right? Because like, like I know that I've heard his clips before and some of the shit he says is just harmless bullshit. If he's talking about Bigfoot, that's harmless bullshit.

Now granted, it does get people thinking like, well maybe they're lying to us and I know that there is some sort of like disinformation, like creep that can happen because of that stuff. But it's a minor thing when you're talking about like the real dangers of being unskeptical. It's all just, it's like, okay, yeah, but who really cares? It's the real danger is like that person convinced that person not to vaccinate their child. Like that's a real danger in comparison. So, you know, if you were to just judge it, just throw out just how much of it is dangerous bullshit and how much of it is just fucking dumb bullshit and like not that dangerous.

I mean, see, the thing about that, though, is like you and I, we can talk Bigfoot all day, but I know you don't have an undercurrent of like, here's the metaphor. Bigfoot is the Jews. Wait, how do you know? That's a good point. Okay, fair enough. Fair enough. We've listened to enough Project Camelot. Exactly.

I'm just saying, you ever see Bigfoot pick up the bill? You offered me a beer, so I assume you don't think Bigfoot is Jew. I'm sorry, Cecil. I love the idea of Bigfoot being a Jew, though. It's my favorite thing ever. He's just a director in Hollywood.

He's run some big banks. I'm just... Alright. More control of the media. And this beef He runs a big bank somewhere. All right. Yeah, I know. You control the media. And this beef jerky company. Yeah. Okay.

So I do understand what you mean. But I was listening to your show and you guys were talking, he was talking about a clip, like, and this may not, you guys listen to so much of him, so you may not remember this, but there was a show you were doing

where you're talking about, he's having this dumbass conversation with talking about he's having this dumbass conversation with himself. He's having this dumbass statement like, back in my day, when my dad was a young man, he could take a train from Houston to like the moon in an hour. And now

it takes four hours. And he used to go 150 miles an hour. I'm just like, there was no train. And I'm like, there's literally no train in the United States that ever went 150 miles an hour. I'm just like, there was no train. And I'm like, there's literally no train in the United States that ever went 150 miles an hour. That's not a real thing. Like, that's like,

you know, we don't have, we've never had high speed rail. But it did go faster than they do now. Trains have slowed down, at least passenger trains. So he's talking about something that's true,

but exaggerated. But that is harmless bullshit. Yeah, right. So some of it is just harmless bullshit yeah as as the person even then he's using it to demonize the chinese government alone good point we good point back in my day we used to drive fast and the chinese are killing us like i don't i don't understand how relatively harmless bullshit he can't even he can't even like compliment a meatloaf without being anti-Semitic.

I would say as the, you know, since I listened to a ton of it, I would say it's maybe, if you don't look at the subtext of it, it's probably 60% harmless bullshit

and 40% like, uh-oh, this is, this could probably hurt someone if they actually believe it. I see. Yeah, I mean, his most damaging stuff he does is by calling every act of terrorism by a white nationalist a false flag.

Sure. Oh, that's horrible. And then at the same time, though, he will get into this apocalyptic, like, we're already past the point of civil war, fellas. We got to go out there and do stuff politically. We got to go out there and really take it to our enemies and put them into the ground and dig their graves under six feet and we need to make sure that they stay there and then bury them. Politically.

And it's like and then because he's already said that any racist white nationalist terrorism is a false flag, then his listeners are like, well, I guess if we do this, then he's gonna say it's a false flag and everybody just gets to keep doing this bullshit. That's terrifying.

He's popularized the false flag idea so much. We cover people who think hurricanes are false flags. Sure. He does too. Does he? He believes in weather guns and shit. Of course he does. I love it.

Why wouldn't you? Okay. What doesn't he believe? He claims he doesn't believe in aliens, but he does. Where does he think the life extension technology comes from? Interdimensional demons. That is, it's an interdimensional demon. Oh, so he's an alien.

No, I'm not an alien. It's an Ike thing. It's a David Ike thing that he kind of believes. Kind of. He used to be friends with David Ike, but they've had a falling out since. But yeah, you would always bring in David Icke to be like, I'm not crazy.

I'm not David Icke, which is a bad foundation for a friendship. Yeah, that is a good run. Look at me. I'm not an alcoholic. I hang out with Tom. Jesus. It was weird when we started opening our shows

with you just being like, well, at least I'm not Jordan over here. Let's move on. Holy fuck. Is he right about anything? Yeah, I mean, he has some positions we found over the years that we can get on board with. He's in favor of drug legalization, at least specifically weed. Yeah, nominally.

One of the things we have found in his past that we were really like, yeah, right on, was he's super against civil asset forfeiture governments taking their shit. Now, of course, he is advocating that the government takes over land.

He's real against it now. He's really pro-civil asset forfeiture. He's real against it now. He wants to build a wall with stealing people's land. Oh, yeah, he's pro-wall.

Oh! Yeah, because the eminent domain shit that they're talking about. Yeah, so he's flipped wall oh yeah cause that's yeah cause the eminent domain shit that they're talking about yeah so he's flipped on that

we found like almost every position we had that we saw from him that was like yeah alright is now kind of

gone like he's he's contradicted himself on so many of his like foundational issues like he used to be a big like

they're gonna put us in FEMA camps kind of guy and then now he's like well these immigrants that are, like they're going to put us in FEMA camps kind of guy. And then now he's like, well, these immigrants that are coming in, we kind of got to put them in camps. It's like,

hold on, man. They're not FEMA camps though. So it's fine. It's fine. They're also not real people. Right. To him.

Yeah. Absolutely. And then he was always a big posse commentatus guy, you know, like, I don't, I've never heard of this. I don't know what this is.

It's the, you can't use military in civil, like domestic law enforcement operations. I see, okay, okay. He was super against that. That was like a red line for him. Like, we will start a war over this. It would be literally his crossing of the Rubicon. Yeah, and now he's like, yeah,

Trump sent troops to the border. Didn't matter to him. No, no. How is he spinning the border. Didn't matter to him. No. How is he spinning the impeachment then? It's a hoax. Wait, no. The impeachment is a hoax? It's a hoax. You fools.

You guys thought there would be more. All of these whistleblowers are fake people. It's probably James Clapper in disguise who is making this whistleblowing complaint. He just went, Hillary's in the somewhere. And it went off. That's how it works.

And then now it's changed into it's all John Bolton just being mad that he can't start a war so he's lashing out at Trump. Oh, God. What? Yeah, there's a lot of

various excuses he's making but they're all fake. Now, admittedly, that one's one of the more reasonable ones. I was just going to say, admittedly, John Bolton is sulking somewhere because he could not start a war. That's true.

I guarantee that. It's important to build bullshit with some truth. John Bolton's just in a Starbucks like, fuck that guy. To be equally fair, he's very likely to get his war. Oh, yeah. No, yeah.

He's definitively going to eventually get a war. Now, the Kurds is a big thing that has sort of really separated the right wing. I mean, not so much the evangelicals, because evangelicals are just still like, come on my chin, Trump, whatever you can do.

We love you so much. So there's nothing that he can do to push the evangelicals off. But is there anything that Jones is saying about the Kurds that is different than, no,

you're shaking your head, so no. No, it's bad. Okay. You'd think he would care. Like, it seems like he should, but he does not. That's the epitaph of humanity.

Yeah. You'd think they would care. It seems like they shouldn't. Someone carve that, like those big-ass Nazca lines or whatever somewhere. Put that somewhere. We tried to kill it. Just smooth over Mount Rushmore with that.

Just right. We gave it hell. Just put that there for the next group of... His initial take on the situation in Northern Syria was that like, hey, Trump said he was going to bring the troops home. And so that was his like, this is good. And then he talked to one of his geopolitical experts, this guy named Joel Skousen.

I noticed you didn't use any air quotes when you said experts. I did this hand gesture, though. Okay, that's good enough. It's still condescending. Okay, all right. Expert. Yeah, gesture though, which is still condescending. Okay, alright. Expert. Yeah, alright. He's the nephew. He's graduated past Scarecrow. This dude's

the nephew of the big anti-communist W. Cleon Skousen, who wrote The Naked Capitalist. He's a mess. But this dude came on and he was like, yeah, you think this is going to be people coming home and the troops coming back, but it's only a few troops and it'll cause a huge situation that'll probably lead to more troops coming in. So Alex was like, aha, Trump's

been set up. And then by the next day, he was like, Trump is all right on this one. He's just all over the place. He doesn't have a really consistent um principled stand even on something this serious yeah um and it's really really frustrating to listen to because it the present day sucks so much you know you know that it's people are are living these experiences that he's lying about and and misleading people about um and just it uh's, it's not fun. Yeah. It's troublesome. It's a lot less laughs after I finished a sentence like that. Yeah, no,

we've been, we've been, Tom and I, we did a live stream when the, the elected Trump and we had a live stream. We, you know, we thought it was going to be the most fun.

It was going to be fun. We were like first woman presidents. Amazing. And then we jumped into an alternate universe that we don't like at all, it turns out. But shining moments in this universe are Alex Jones being sued. Yeah, that was good.

Shining moment. Hopefully that eventually goes to trial. We were excited that he might lose everything. That would be amazing. Because I know that the lawsuit is huge and it's the shit he did was fucking egregious yeah i mean there's a video of him saying that they were all actors like he really the only argument he can really make is you know based on this free speech nonsense that he has

um and then like statute of limitations stuff and i think that they've pretty decently established that he's reiterated these claims since the time of the, like, the clearest video of him. And this isn't the first time he's gotten legal shit because we covered a Chobani thing.

Sure. Where he's just like, before he's like, Chobani will, like, turn you gay. And then the next week, he's like, Chobani, delicious.

You know, it's like, he's got a big spoonful of it in his mouth and he's like, they've never done anything bad there. That guy's amazing.

When, when they sued, when Chobani sued him, he got on air and he was like they've never done anything bad there that guy's amazing when uh when they sue when chobani sued him you got on air and he was like i will fight this or i will die trying you have my word and then like three days later i have settled the lawsuit yeah i would like to apologize to hamdi ulakaya he's a great man the worst part about that is that that is inexplicably the moment where a fucking billionaire decided to be a decent human being

and settle for the apology Hamdi could have fucking taken everything from him at that moment and we wouldn't have had to deal with any of this

or at least taken a good chunk yeah enough of it to really could have really fucking muzzled them you know what I mean could have really

seriously muzzled them and it might have you know to be honest that could have saved somebody else some heartbreak later on. You know what I mean? Well, and the issue too was,

it wasn't that like he was saying that Chobani turns you gay or something like that. He was talking about Chobani importing migrant rapists. Okay. Like, he was xenophobic. It was awful.

And that could have been a time when Alex could have learned his lesson about like, you can't do stuff like this. Yeah, there's some line. Yeah. Some crazy line. And since he was able to sort of get away with it with an apology and whatever settlement

they ended up making, he feels totally emboldened to continue down those sorts of lines. It just sucks. But every time he gets pressured, like really pressured, like the deposition. Yeah.

He was just like a totally different person. That's why like, it's like, is he crazy or is he lying? Like, I have to feel like he's lying because when he's under

real pressure and has to be serious, he's like, all right, so I know, like the same thing with his custody battle. Like his divorce,

he's like, all right, that shit's all made up. You guys should not be paying attention. Do what I do, my voice is like this. That means I'm lying. He's like, all right, that shit's all made up. You guys should not be paying attention. Do what I do with my voice like this. That means I'm lying.

He would quibble with you in that his lawyer was the one who said that it was a character and he himself did not say that he was doing a character. He gets off on a technicality. This guy literally

represents you. True. To be fair, we just listened to an episode today from the 23rd of October where one of his lawyers was a guest and said the N-word twice on air.

Excuse me? Yeah. What? His lawyers are crazy. Yeah, yeah. We're playing a great game here. Who is his lawyer? Roger Stone?

Jesus Christ. Roger Stone is way too smooth for that. Roger Stone would get you to say the N-word. He would check you. Wait, wait, wait. What just happened there? Did I just say the N-word. He would check you. Wait, wait, wait. What just happened there? Did I just say the N-word? Am I more racist?

Yeah, it's nuts. Okay, what's your favorite? I'm going to start with Jordan. Jordan, what's your favorite Alex Jones clip? You can't use the Apple one now because we talked about it earlier. So you got to think of something else. I can start.

I can start with my favorite one. Sure. And it's not human intelligence, I think is my absolute favorite. When he flips his shit, he's talking about the life extension technology. Yeah, yeah. And he's going nuts and nuts.

And he starts out really calm, but at the end when he starts screaming, it's not human intelligence. There were tears pouring down my face. We laughed and we cried and we had just such a great day. That's my absolute favorite. Do you guys have a...

I can think of mine probably. I like the ones where there's like insanity mixed with a little bit of humanity. I think it's important to remember that he's a person. And like there are moments that are kind of like, oh, that's cute. And it was one time when he was getting back from a commercial break. And he was like talking about how someone brought in donuts. Oh. Someone brought in donuts.

And he's like, someone brought in donuts. I just ate two of them. It's too good. And then there's a pause. And he's like, stop it. But I appreciate it. It's just so good. The delivery,

like, it's so amazing. There's another where he's eating. That's what I wrote down. Okay, go, go,

go, go. There's one where like, he clearly was eating hot peppers during a commercial break and he comes back and he's sweating and burping

and hiccuping and he's like, go, go, go. It keeps, it keeps almost like regurgitating the peppers because he's like, he's like, oh my God. It keeps almost like regurgitating the peppers. Cause he's like, he's like,

so now next we're going to go. And you can hear him like, like spitting this stuff up and he's wet as a beat. He's sweating. And he's pouring. And I think he just fucking like down like two hop of gyros. Are we sure it was peppers and not booze? Yeah.

Okay. That's fair. That's fair. That's fair. He's not able to control that machine at all. It was amazing. I think mine is... So one of my favorites, I like esoteric Alex. Sometimes he gets really, really drunk, and then we'll just ramble about his theology,

which is, I don't know, a hodgepodge of Lord of the Rings novels and fucking... Christian identity? Yeah, yeah. And white nationalist propaganda. That's what it is. Yeah. And so he had this one long thing

where he's drunk, it's the end of the night, he's talking to people, and he's like, there's really just four ways to learn. You got race memory. You got your answer. And none of got your hands and none of them were reading zero of the four ways were read none of them he rambles and then he's talking to like his

producer who's in the room not drunk at the time and uh which is great so then he's just like uh you know the best way to learn is to learn. Oh, fuck yourself. I will say I also love anytime he like shows the papers on his desk. Like they're like, like look at the evidence and then they like pan over.

It's a bunch of printouts from the internet. Oh yeah. It's like, I printed Yahoo News. Not even that though. It's not even that though. Cause it's like some dude's blog.

Yeah. No, it's like when your grandma prints an email and mails it to you. You're like, okay, all right, you're in trouble. Ooh,

you got a printer. Show off high class. What, uh, if you guys ever had to, so I know he's got, he's clearly got a fan base. That is pretty rabid.

And I will say like, no, they're not. In my experience, they are not. Well, in this American life where all those people started going after that guy who lost the kid. I mean, you guys heard that.

I'm sure you heard that. Yeah, absolutely. They went after that guy who had that, you know, he's just a dude and he had to move several times. He had a bunch of people who just like would not stop. Totally. You guys go after Alex Jones all the time.

Do you deal with anybody who's... No. Really? No. Almost nothing. I think we've gotten like maybe... In three years, we've gotten a few angry messages,

but very, very seldom. I don't know what the deal is. I mean, I... We just barely ever tweet. We don't engage on social media all that much. Like even though we have, you know, a decent-sized listener base, and, you know... And email the way they can reach

you and all that, so they don't bother. Almost nobody. I thought this, like, very early on in the time that we were doing this, I think if we were more angry, then maybe people would try and like, fuck with us. Or if we were women. I think those two possibilities, then some people might try and, like... Can you imagine if we were women. I think those two possibilities then some people might

try and like or if we were angry women? Yeah. No. I mean it's if we were You wouldn't be president.

That's for people. If we appeared to have some sort of easily exploitable weakness like like anger. Yeah. If there was something

that they could latch their cruelty upon then we would be easy targets for them. We don't really fall into like the people that the internet If there was something that they could latch their cruelty upon, then we would be easy targets for them. We don't really fall into the people that the internet crowd goes buck wild and being dicks to. That's the only thing I can come up with in terms of why we haven't. Either that or secretly no one actually listens to a show.

That's my other theory. The other possibility is that they just don't exist. Or they just pass you off as mainstream media type people that just don't, you don't get it, you'll never get it, you'll never understand it,

you'll never do the research. Yeah, but even those sorts of people, like that is something you'll still see people yell at, like you get accused of being a Soros operative or something. Oh yeah, that's happening.

It's very, really? Congratulations. You guys are sorry? Oh, that's nice. I wish we've gotten that check, but he keeps putting us off. I haven't got... I will cash.

George, if you're listening... George, I will eat your ass. I don't care, dude. Whatever you got, you give me a job. I'll do it. The first answer is yes. I don't care

what the question is, George. Put fucking cigarettes out of my ball. See if whatever you want to do, George. I'm your guy. Back when Alex was still on Twitter, I tweeted,

I noticed the Infowars DMs were open. And so I got really drunk one night and tweeted at them. Just sort of a bring it on kind of thing. And did not get a response. Nothing. I've always sort of figured that it's in their best interest

to not publicly recognize us at all. Yeah, you don't want to go out to the critics like that. Yeah, it would only elevate us. Right. And we would probably end up coming out in the lead of an actual argument. Sure, sure. It just, yeah, it's weird, though. We know they know we exist.

Yeah, that's for sure. We know they know we exist. The Adan Salazar. Yeah, one of Alex's longtime producers followed us on Twitter and we never tweet. So it's like, well, that's kind of a dead ring. And one time I was listening to Alex's show. Our old sign-off used to be

basically just making fun of how Alex one time admitted on air that he probably killed a guy. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. What? Wait, what? That doesn't even make it into our favorite clips at all. Yeah, he's saying that,

he's talking about like, I've never killed a guy and then there's a long pause. A long pause. Like a long, I'm contemplating my life and the choices that I've made that has led me to this point.

Hold on a second. That's not something you should have to even say out loud. Like, I've never killed a guy. He's trying to say, I'm not that bad a guy. I'm made that has led me to this point. Hold on a second. That's not something you should have to even say out loud. Like, I've never killed a guy. He's trying to say, I'm not that bad a guy. I'm not that guy. I don't kill anybody.

And then he pauses. Long pause. And then, wow, there was that one guy. Oh, shit. And it didn't seem like a joke at all either. It seemed like a real fucked up moment he was having.

But we made that the sign off of our show just to make fun of him. Right. And like a couple months later, Alex is on the show and he's like, there's a big new media lie

going around about how I killed a guy. They're like, are you listening to us? No one else is saying that. No one is talking about you. It's just us, man. I like the idea.

That could be a coincidence, but I like to imagine that he... Yeah, that he spends... Every week he downloads your podcast. Oh, he doesn't have enough time. He's enough of a narcissist, though. Yeah, that's true. But we just put out

seven plus hours of content per week, so he doesn't have a chance. Very dumb. Very dumb. In the sort of podcast universe, we did a show on 9-11 truthers. And it's not this show. It was a different show that we do.

We do another show called Citation Needed that nobody's ever heard of. But we do that show. And Tom wrote an essay about 9-11 truthers and he literally copied the Wikipedia. I mean, he didn't copy it, but he wrote an essay about the Wikipedia. What's on Wikipedia?ikipedia because the show's about wikipedia and so we all made fun of it ha ha ha blah blah blah blah and on wikipedia they essentially don't debunk every

single one of the major theories yeah so we got tweeted at like four or five times by people who like clearly listen to our show or listen to the scathing atheist type podcast that are 9-11 truthers that are like, you didn't cover the WTC falling into the burning building and it fell down and never got caught on fire and it didn't actually do it. And it was a controlled explosion. I'm just like, where the fuck are you people from? And it's funny because like, like even, even though we try to get rid of all the anti-vaxxers who listen to us too, like go away. If you're an anti-vaxxer,

just don't listen. I don't want you to listen to our show. We'll still once in a while get like a negative review on iTunes. Be like, these guys think that vaccines don't cause vaccine injury or something like that. So it's like, I'm just surprised that there's not a,

a group, even a small group of people out there. Do you guys get negative reviews on iTunes? A little bit. We've had a couple. But those are more like personal. They just don't like a guy. Actually,

never mind me. All of our negative reviews are like, Jordan's bad for this show. And I'm like, Jordan yells too much. I don't disagree with you. I don't disagree with you.

Jordan understands. This poor bastard. Yeah, there's very little like on those reviews that I've ever seen. I don't look at them too much. It's not like Alex Jones

is super awesome or something like that. No, no. I think, I think my other theory about that is just we're, we're too dense. Like you can't, you can't really pull sound, sound bites from our show. It's hard. So you would have to, to get angry about our show, you'd really have to listen to like a 20 minute chunk. And if you're listening to a 20 minute chunk, you're either not going to be angry at the

end of it, or you're going to be bored and just go somewhere else. Yeah, right. You know, it's like that. So after a while, you're like, oh, I'll get them tomorrow. Oh, you're going to get that tweet. Oh, you're going to get it. sort of online interactions come sort of from the shows that I wrote a blog about

how Soros didn't work for the Nazis in World War II, which is one of the things that Alex says about him. Yeah. And in response to that, I've gotten tons of comments on it that are very coherent.

Very smart, smart people saying I'm dumb. You're dumb and shoes are bad. Basically. And so each one, I would try to reply to and I made sort of a game out of it where I'd be overly polite to these people

and explain why they're wrong about whatever they bring up. And I found that it just deflates people. Like they don't, they want you to get mad. Yeah. And it just. That's the whole game. You're not playing the game. Stop it.

Yeah. That is a huge thing that he did. I remember seeing that as the main thing that everybody talks about about Soros is that he used to work for the Nazis.

Yeah. He was in HR. Yeah. He was like, okay, I'm George. I'm in benefits. He's in the hard right. And you get none of them.

That's an easy job. We have an experimental health plan. Okay. Seriously, though, like that's the big thing. That was, and that's, it's funny too,

because it's bigger than, it's bigger than Alex. Yeah. It's bigger than Alex because there's a lot of people out there who believe that stuff. Glenn Beck certainly was in that tip a little bit.

One of the things I think is particularly cowardly about it is Alex on his own show will scream about Osiris work for the Nazis and all that particularly cowardly about it is Alex on his own show will scream about how Soros worked for the Nazis and all that, but when he went on Joe Rogan's show, Rogan pushed back on that idea that Soros worked for the Nazis, and Alex

because he didn't want to fight with Rogan, because he has a much bigger audience, and he's subservient to him, he's like, well, it's an open question. Yeah, but that's what I mean by him being a liar and not crazy, because if he was crazy, he'd stand by that because he wouldn mean by him being a liar and not crazy because if he's crazy, he'd stand by that because he wouldn't be able to understand

that this is crazy. Yeah. But every time he gets pushed on this shit by somebody in a position of authority, he backs the fuck down. He's like,

oh, that Chobani guy is going to sue me? Turns out I don't believe that migrant rapists are making yogurt. I mean, it turns out,

I will say that Alex has one of the biggest cases of daddy issues I have ever seen in my entire life. That's true. Yogurts? I mean, I will say that Alex has one of the biggest cases of daddy issues I have ever seen in my entire life. Every situation that we've ever seen him in where there's a male figure of authority, he turns into a fucking puppy dog and he will do anything.

Well, as long as they signal approval. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, he'll do anything for their approval. Yeah. Wow. And so, the worst part about all this entire thing so far is that you listened to Joe Rogan too.

I was just like, holy shit. That's the roughest part. You really put yourself out there for this show. We've got to give the listeners what they want. You really put yourself out there. To be fair, I mostly only listen when Alex is on. I've still never listened. That's the great part of my job on the show.

You have an amazing job. You don't do any work. I don't do anything. That's the great part of my job on the show. You have an amazing job. You don't do any work. I don't do anything. That sounds amazing. Somehow this asshole You and I, Dan, simpatico. Simpatico.

Who worked so hard had some part of his success saddled to my lazy ass just because I can screech right apparently. And on that note, guys, where can we find your podcast

if we're looking for it on the internet? Well, knowledgefight.com is our main website. And then, I guess that's our only website. Our main website. That's the one centered out of Maine. We've got a continental... That sentence made me feel like a real asshole.

What about our secret website? Knowledgefight.org. No! You guys should buy pizzagate.com or something. That's got to be taken. Yeah, I'm imagining that one's been well covered. So guys, we'll put a link on this week's show notes to your main website and your secret website.

Perfect. And we'll also put a link to your Twitter and other social medias. Guys, it was absolutely so much fun to have you in the studio. So here's the thing. If something big happens with Alex Jones, we'd love to have you guys back in. Love it. Just to chat about what's happening with him.

You know, like, especially if this lawsuit moves forward or if he like eventually storms a pizza place with an M60. We'd love to have you guys back on. Perfect. Awesome. We'll bring some clips. Yeah. This is great. It's been great. Thanks for having us. Thank you so much. China has total respect for

Donald Trump's very, very large brain. They call her Pocahontas. I am the chosen one. You are fake news. Okay. I am the least racist person. Look at my African-American over here. Look at him. It's a camera.

Grab him by the pussy. Stop it. Well, Tom, it wouldn't be a week of this show without This Week in Trump. And we really only want to talk about one thing because we talked a lot to the Knowledge Fight guys tonight and we want to talk a little bit about what happened this week

where several Republicans, very, very sad, that they passed a law previously when they had control. I know, I know. That they had a law passed that excluded members and kept things behind closed doors. And they were the ones who put this into place. They were the ones who did all this work. And now they're very, very mad. Well, we should all be concerned according to Lindsey Graham. And we should all kick down the doors of a very secure area where they're not allowed to have say cell phones and other stuff. And 13 house Republicans derailed the deposition of a defense department official by storming into the secure suite

and refusing to leave from what I read today. And again, I don't know if this is true, but this may disqualify them from any security clearance in the future, that this action could seriously change how they're treated in the Senate. And some of these people actually had access to this meeting anyway. They just did it as a stunt. They just did it as a stunt. The whole thing was a stunt. The thing is like, anyway. They just did it as a stunt. The whole thing was a stunt. The thing is like if 13 regular dudes did this,

right? If 13 just me and you and 11 of our friends. I don't have 11 friends. Me and you and 11 prostitutes. Let's say me, you and 11 people we hired as extras for a commercial. Okay. You're phrasing prostitute differently than I was, but still.

We're not quibbling over semantics here one's got a SAG card one's got a gag card it's different Tom it's different if you get the old prostitutes they could have a SAG card too

they could well I'll tell you what I'm not that old and I got a SAG card right in the water again oh Jesus well at least they got to test that first yeah like but if me and you and like 11 people Right in the water again. Jesus. Well, at least they got to test that first.

Yeah. Like, but if me and you and like 11 people storm this, we'd be arrested. We would be arrested. Yeah. Pulling this kind. I mean, there's no doubt at all whatsoever because we don't have a right to have access to this. They don't have a right to have access to this space. This kind of like bullshit political theater nonsense is in violation of the law.

It's just clearly in violation of the law. They have no more right of access to a room that they don't have a right to access than you and I do. But some of them actually did. But they didn't have access. They didn't have a right

to bring in a phone and to try to film it and things like that. And, you know, the thing is, is like this is exactly what's wrong with our government, which is when we take away rules

that have been in place for a long time and we replace them with, well, we got the house, we can do whatever we want. And then suddenly you don't have the house anymore. Now you're going to scream and cry. You know, what did you expect that the other team was going to be like? Yeah, we're just going to put it back the way it was

because we want you to be able to interrupt our shit, but we couldn't interrupt yours. Yeah, well, you know, like, how many times have you heard heard that, like that phrase? And it makes me laugh so much. Like when Trump was elected, how many times did you hear, well, elections have consequences. Sorry, you don't like it, but elections have consequences. And it's like, well, all right, well, the Democrats won the house. And so now they're going to do this shit. And you know what? Guess what? Elections have consequences. And this is one of the consequences of this election. We should respect the fucking rules of the Senate. And we should respect the rules of the house.

And we shouldn't try to change them for our short-term political gain. Because at some point, we're not going to be the guys in charge. And everybody needs to fucking do that. It's the same reason I'm not a big proponent of like, I don't know, let's just add some more people to the Supreme Court. I'm not either. I'm not either because you're going to have fucking 100 people in there. Right. Because the other guys are going to do that. It's like the whole machine breaks.

Yeah. When you're just like, throw more wheels on it. Yeah. Yeah. What we're going to have to do is eat shit forever and be scrupulous. Right. Right. And the problem is, is that when we don't change the rules, what do we do?

Do we go back to being scrupulous? Do we go back to saying, okay, it's important to us that this rule was in place. Let's put it back in place the way it was. Should we go back to those things that we thought were important then that they used to go do closed door shit? Yeah. I, you know, I don't know. I, I genuinely don't like there's a part of me. It's like, look, I mean, at some point you have to say like some cats are out of the bag right now and there's no more stuff in that shit back in. But what we don't do is continue to exacerbate it. Like what we don't do is continue to extend it and like,

you know, like, for example, like, I don't think we're ever going to have a world where there's not like executive order, right? Yeah. There's going to be, but,

and I don't think we can ever reel all that shit back in. I don't think we can undo the rule changes and these kinds of rule changes. But what we can do is like put policies

and laws and procedures in place that, okay, this is it. At least this is it. This is the new line. This is as far as it goes. We don't cross it. Yeah.

You know? Yeah. Like this, this is a great example of like ridiculous political theater that fools nobody that can read, right? If you can read an article at all, written by anybody other than Fox News, like you are not fooled into thinking

that like the Republicans are breaking the doors down to offer the American people transparency into a secret tribunal of justice. Like that's the narrative they're trying to play out for people. But it's a narrative like nobody that can read is buying. This is just a straight pander to the base of people whose minds were already made up anyway. Sure. You know, there's a lot of the testimony that's come out this week that has

been very, very damaged. One of them was an appointee by George Bush that came out and was the person who was really pretty much in charge of a lot of the stuff that was happening and was taking a huge step back away from it and telling them everything that was happening. And it was really damning information. Yeah. The envoy, the special envoy to Ukraine was just like, I've been in, I've been a career civil servant for like multiple administrations, starting with the Republican administration. And it's like, yeah, it's clearly a quid pro quo. In fact, there's kind of two of them.

There's the White House meeting that they, the public White House meeting that the Ukraine wanted. And then there's the $400 million of taxpayer money, by the way, for all those people that like, you know, it blows my mind too. Like all those people that are like the hardcore fiscal conservative yahoos who are like,

oh, I don't spend my money on poor people. You know, like those people are always fucking screaming, but they're the same fucking, out of the same mouths. They're just like, ah, you know, this is just how the game is played.

Yeah. This is just, when it's your side, that's what you say. Right. Yeah, that's what you say. What do you think about the chances of impeachment at this point? I mean, clearly in the House, I think it's a done deal.

It's a done deal. Yeah. But do you think that as time goes on, they're wearing anybody in the Senate down? So many of them, no, no, I don't. I would like to say yeah, but I don't think so. I think this is a real dangerous game to be playing politically. I think it's probably morally the right decision. I don't know. And it's probably politically the right decision because at some point, if you don't act, you also just look weak and ineffective. And obviously, you can't afford to look weak and ineffective. So I don't know how we avoid this.

Yeah. So I don't know how we avoid this. And I was thinking to myself, I wonder if this wasn't an opportunity by the right to say, OK, give them this. Know that the House will impeach. Know that the Senate won't. Know that this will rile up the base on the right at a pretty opportune time for the election. Yeah. My worry is that like, there is a group of people who will say, you know what? Buy gum. You're not going to slander my president. Oh, there's, yeah, there exists.

Absolutely. So those people are now going to be more motivated than they were before. Yeah. You know, I do worry about that. If the left doesn't,

all that has to happen, this whole election cycle is a goddamn done deal. If the left turns out. Yeah. That's all that has to happen. The left just has to show up and it's ours for the taking. Yeah. I mean, admittedly, admittedly, to be honest, the, the, uh, the polls are terrible in his favor at this point. They're not great in his favor. When you talk about what like independents are starting to lean toward impeachment. And that's not going to, that's not going to carry it. That's going to carry over into voting season. You know, the diehards are never going to want to impeach him.

And the diehards aren't in control, a majority control, very tenuous majority control in the Senate. So they will not impeach him. So that's not going to happen. But you got to understand that, that even the that even the independents now are starting to be polling very high to be like, we need to impeach this guy. Yeah, I just wonder, because we have such a short memory, I wonder if the impeachment fails. Well, that and a possible declining economy

would be a huge blow. Oh, declining economy is it. I think a declining economy would be the death knell of his presidency yeah right because there's nothing else to get excited about yeah and the um success of the economy that was really a carryover from the obama administration in a straight linear curve if you look at a graph yeah it is a straight linear curve and all they did was shit money into the system to try to prop it up that's all they did i've shit money into the system to try to prop it up. That's all they did. Absolutely. Shit money into the places where they knew that they could prop it up.

Yeah. That's all the Republicans ever do is spend, spend, spend, spend, spend an immense amount of money to try to give the richest people tax cuts and make it look like the average guy has good wages. And isn't that kind of like, if you look at history and you say like, all right, well, you know, didn't, wasn't W the guy that gave everybody $300? Yeah. I'm going to give everybody $300. He like just gave everybody a bunch of money to try to stimulate the economy. You know, Trump. He was like the Andrew Yang.

Not the Andrew Yang. It's a third once. You know, it's just, it is sort of amazing that if you watch the spending of the fiscally conservative party, it tends to outpace the Democrats. And if you look at like the growth of the national debt under the Republicans,

it tends to outpace the Democrats. And somehow we still spin a yarn. We still are in the economy is strong under Republicans. Somehow people think economy is strong under the Republicans and the Democrats spend, spend, spend, spend, spend. Even though you look at all the budget deficits, you look at all the money that it just disappears when it's under. You hear people say like, well, I'm for fiscal responsibility, but I'm socially liberal. I want

to be like, well, so you're a Democrat. Yeah. Yeah. I don't even, okay. Yeah. You're a Democrat. Right on. Cause I remember when I first, I used to say that too, a long time ago. And it just, and then I just started paying attention to the numbers and I was like, oh my gosh. Yeah. No, they are just, there's just more fiscally responsible. Yeah. So do you think, what do you think? What do you think about the impeachment? Yeah, I have a very similar, similar thought process. My hope is that,

you know, I've been to some, I've been to a lot of rallies this year. I've been to, you know, maybe six rallies throughout the year. And there's a sentiment. I mean, I'm in a liberal bubble. I'm in Chicago. I'm in a liberal bubble.

But there's a sentiment where this long after everything's happening, this long after, you know, he's gotten away with a lot of stuff, there's still thousands and thousands and thousands of people who show up to these things. I'm leaving work early. I think it's tomorrow or next week. I don't know which day. It's in my calendar to go protest Trump. Trump's coming to Chicago. I will be there. I I'm actually, my wife and I are packing sandwiches and we're going to go protest Trump on our lunch break. And then we're going to go back to our office, but I'm going to go protest him. I'm going to go. And it's going to, it's not just going to

be me. It's going to be thousands of people will be out there. I know we're in a little bubble. I get that, but I've seen protests all across this nation. People are still energized. So we want to thank our patrons. Of course, we want to thank all our patrons, but we want to thank most recent patrons, Suck It Trebek, Noel, Alex, Casey, Eli Bosnick's favorite sex friend, Eric, John, and Bane of me.

Last week when I said the, it was the great Dandini. Okay. But it was just that. I messed your name up. I'm sorry. Dandini, the great Dandini. That was last week. So we give away mugs to one out of five new patrons.

We don't give away mugs to every patron. So if you don't hear your name here, when I read your names here for the mug winners, you don't need to send us a message. We're only giving them away to the people who won mugs. One out of five new patrons. There's two winners this week. Alex and John, send a message not to Dissonance Pod, send it to Ian at dissonancepod.com. Ian will then forward it along to Tom and Tom will send out your lovely mug via stamps.com. So we got a bunch of messages this week. We want to mention that this week is,

you should be expecting an Eventbrite ticket if you got accepted to come to the pizza party on 7th. If you did not, I'm going to also send a message to all the people who applied who did not get in. I'm going to send a message to you, a sorry message that you didn't get in. And I am going to hopefully have you guys apply to the next one. We're going to hopefully do another one soon. We're not sure when, maybe in the spring sometime we might do something. But we could only get 30 names. So one out of six people that signed up wound up getting in. So we're going to have 30 people at the pizza party here on the 7th.

Expect a ticket this week, early this week. People who were accepted and who won and the people who didn't, expect an email with our apologies that we just couldn't feed everybody. But we want to thank everybody for signing up and we are looking forward to that event on the 7th. up. And we are looking forward to that event on the 7th. So we got a message from Aaron and Aaron sent in an image and it's just really disturbing. Just super disturbing. I don't like this one. I don't like it either, but we're going to post it on this week's show notes. Don't look at it. So we got a message. We got a message from Russell and Russell was saying that he grew up on Chicagoland, in Chicagoland, raised and eating good pizza. And then he winds up having to go south of I-80. And south of I-80

is an absolute, it's a desolate hellscape south of I-80 in Illinois. I mean, it's genuinely a horrifying experience. But he went south of I-80 and he's basically buying garbage pizza the whole time he's down there. And he says that he went to Southern Illinois and a bunch of people were like, oh my gosh, you got to come on out to the brand new top-notch pizzeria. And it was, when he pulls in, it was Monocle's pizza, which is horrifying pizza. And it is from the middle of the state. That's the middle of the state pizza. It's really bad.

It's genuinely bad. It's like cardboard pizza. It's one of those soggy cardboard pizzas. Oh, it's really bad. Genuinely bad. It's like cardboard pizza. It's one of those soggy cardboard pizzas. Oh, it's so bad. Oh, so we got a message from Ron. Hitting children

is illegal in over 50 countries worldwide. Wow. More than two that I had heard about. I didn't know that. Yeah. So,

I know that I got beat as a kid. I got beat with some weird shit too. I got hit with some... Yeah, my mom used to beat me with whatever was available. So like she would just smack me

with weird shit. Dalmatian. So she hit me with a drumstick once. Oh no. Yeah. And she hit me, she hit my brother. Like a drum drumstick

or like a chicken drumstick? Not an ice cream cone or an actual chicken drumstick. An actual like, like hurdy, like drummer drumstick. She beat the shit out of me with it, man.

It fucking stung like a man. And I remember it was so funny. Cause I was getting my ass whooped by it. And my buddy's sitting there laughing his ass off next to me. Cause he's, he's watching me get hit. And she turns and she looks at him and she waved that fucker in his face. She's like, and you're next. And he was just like, like, he just quieted right the fuck up. Cause our parents back then they were equal opportunity abusers. Turns out, um, my mom also, when we were putting up the Christmas tree. Because our parents back then, they were eco-opportunity abusers, turns out. My mom also, when we were putting up the Christmas tree

when I was a kid, my mom, she was so mad at my brother, my asshole brother I don't talk to anymore. She grabbed the center, you know, balsa wood

and she broke it over his back. She hit him so hard it broke over his back. He was a teenager at the time. So it's not like he was like a three-year-old and she fucking punted him. But he was a teenager

and she fucking swung it. She swung, she fucking swung for the fences and broke the damn thing over it. What was it? You know, the center of those fake Christmas trees,

you know, like the center pole. It was made out of wood, like a cheap, and it was hollow. Okay. And it just snapped like right in half.

But I used to also get the belt too when I was a kid. All the time. I got the belt all the time when I was a kid. My dad didn't do very much, but he was a belt guy. Yeah.

It was a belt. It was a belt for us and it was a belt a lot. So yeah, I was a bad kid. But yeah, I used to get beat and yeah,

you shouldn't hit your kids. Don't hit your kids. What the fuck's wrong with you? So this is a message from Jerry telling us how bad pizza is in Washington, in Seattle. He has a story here. One of them, I'm sorry. Go ahead, go ahead.

One of them was covered in spinach, no meat. I love that he's appalled by the lack of meat on a piece of pizza. This is my kind of guy, though. But this next slide is great. The other one was covered in slices of pizza. This is my kind of guy though. But this next slide is great. The other one was covered in slices of potato. What the fuck

is going on? Oh, that's a Heath Enright pizza right there. Potato on your pizza? Oh, Heath would eat the shit out of that. Heath would eat that. Heath would fuck it first and then he would eat it. So I will say this, the worst pizza I've ever had in my life was in Las Vegas. Really? Yeah. So when I was 21, I worst pizza I've ever had in my life was in Las Vegas.

Really? Yeah. So when I was 21, I just turned 21 and I went out there with a very close friend and we were eating at like buffets and all kinds of stuff like that just to like, you know, cause you know, that's what you do. And this was like, this was a long time ago, 25 years ago. So I was like, you know, it was, it was, you know, there's a bunch of places to eat, but then like, it wasn't that, it wasn't that cheap to be out there.

So we went to a couple of places off strip to eat. Sure. And we went to this one place and we ordered a pizza and the pizza came out. And I know that you've had this, like it's a pretty regional thing. You remember the like square pizzas they used to have in cafeterias here in this and that are just really bland and they're like gross and undercooked. It was like that, but imagine half the flavor. It was undercooked.

Everything was blonde. The dough was soft and gross. And it tastes like, I mean, it seriously tastes like ketchup on there or something. It was the worst tomato sauce. We took one bite out of it. My buddy brought it back and demanded his money back. He was like, I demand my money. The guy's like, you already ate part of it. He's like, we had to try it to know it was absolutely disgusting.

I want my money back. And the guy's like, I'm not giving you your money back. And he stood there for almost an hour arguing with the guy. Holy shit. And everybody that came up, he kept on holding the pizza and be like, this is what you're ordering.

It's garbage. And like, he scared away enough customers. So the guy gave half his money back. That's all he gave was half. It was half. That's all we got back. Jesus.

How about a fucking customer service train? It was the worst, but it was genuinely the That's all he gave was half? Half. It was half. That's all we got back. Jesus, how about a fucking customer service training? It was the worst. But it was genuinely the worst pizza I've ever had in my life. Worst pizza I've ever had was in this studio. Oh, Roots. Oh, that Roots pizza in Chicago. Roots was the worst pizza I've ever eaten. Roots pizza is not, it's a Chicago pizzeria,

but it's quad city style. So they cut it in these big long strips and they take their, they grind they grind their, their Italian sausage. I don't mind Italian sausage in chunks, but when you grind it down into a thin powder and then you spread it on your pizza and all that grease, it was just the most, it was, it was genuinely like we only ate the crust. Do you remember like we ate the crust and we threw the pizza out? It was that bad. It was appalling. Yeah. Yeah. So we got an email from Travis and Travis sent us a rather long email about the problem of following the Beto plan with respect to eliminating the tax exempt status for

churches. And the concern Travis has, and I think it's well-rooted, is that if the government gets into the business of deciding which messages a church is sort of allowed to say with or without losing their tax exempt status and the government is sort of de facto penalizing certain types of speech. And so what would then prevent a government which is not friendly to certain issues that I like to penalize other churches? And I think I am generally sympathetic to that concern. I do think,

however, that for the LGBTQ community, it's no different than the African-American community or any other minority community. We have to have some social standards where we decide that we want to live in a certain kind of country. We want to have certain types of freedoms. We want to have certain kinds of equality. Yeah, we don't want to not discriminate. And if you want the, because the thing is, it's not penalizing to say you have to pay taxes.

What it is, is not giving somebody a free present, right? So, and that's an important distinction. So if I don't buy somebody a present, if there's three people in a room and I buy two of them a present and I don't buy the third person a present, I didn't penalize the third person because I don't have to give anybody a fucking present, right? That's the nature of presents.

The nature of a free gift is that somebody doesn't fucking earn it. And I know that the theory behind the 501c3 tax-exempt status is that they give back to the community. And I think that a reasonable person can say, well, if one of the things you give back to the community is bigotry, that's not something the community is willing to accept.

Yeah. And so you don't get the free gift. That's that. Like, not getting something for free is not the same thing as levying a penalty. And I think that there's a distinction there that's important. Yeah.

Travis also says, the repeated, will you raise taxes on Elizabeth Warren is not directed at the tax increase itself. It's the attack is aimed at her unwillingness to openly state the fact that she seems to imply a lack of candor. What else is she going to be forthright about? And he says, I wish that she would just tackle

it head on like Bernie said, when he said, yes, tax will go up, but overall costs will go down. Bernie Sanders came right out and said it. Look how often he gets attacked for it. Like never. But Warren's campaign sometimes has an aversion for it. The problem I think with Warren is, and I think it's a good one. She's the front runner, number one. And two is there's a reason why she's not saying it like that. And it's because it's easily clippable because these debates are super easily, easily clippable. And you, you're going to see these attack ads that say, yes, I will raise taxes. You know, they're, I guarantee, you know, yeah, Bernie's not getting attacked by it now because there's not a Republican in the race. Yeah. But wait until there's a Republican in the race. Wait until Bernie's the only candidate.

That's going to be the only thing you hear is that clip of him saying, yeah, taxes will go up, but costs will go down. And I guarantee you they're not going to keep the costs going down part. All they're going to keep is the yes, taxes will go up. And it's going to be some really sad voice person with ominous music saying Bernie Sanders is going to raise your taxes. What will you do? What will you do when you don't have money to feed your children because you're paying into the

Bernie Sanders free government health care for all plan and you're looking at your starving baby as they die in your arms. But they won't really because there's free healthcare. You could have taken them to the hospital where they would have gotten nutritional supplements.

It's not now. And I get what you're saying, Travis. I would like her to be honest too, but at the same time, it's like, it's a dishonest question because they keep asking the same question and they are literally looking for a Republican soundbite when they ask it.

I think that's the case, yeah. We got a message from Ron. asking the same question and they are literally looking for a Republican soundbite when they ask it. I think that's the case, yeah. We got a message from Ron. Ron thought I called Heath Ian and he said, did you guys just out Heath? Look, here's the thing. I'm going to out Heath right now. Heath's real name is Heath Enright.

And I'm sorry, Heath. I know you're trying to keep that a secret. This big like, oh, that's not my real name. My real name is something else. It's Gabriel, this big like, oh, that's not my real name. My real name is something else. It's Gabriel, blah, blah, blah, or whatever. No, his real name's Heath Enright, guys.

So I'm sorry. I just outed you, Heath. It's Heath Enright. I did want to talk about this. We talked last week about the Kurds. And we said that basically Trump was abandoning the men who fought alongside you. And the Kurds actually have a very gender integrated military. And so it's men and women fighting alongside.

So yeah, we wanted to mention this. This is one for the troops who sent this in. So thank you very much for the correction. It's absolutely true. You see tons of images of Kurdish women. Yeah, that was my gaffe and I apologize. Tons of women out there. This is a message and I do want to clear this up. This is from Christian and he says,

hey guys, out of curiosity, what style of Chicago pizza do you mean? There's thin crust, there's stuff, there's deep dish and I have different thoughts on each. And so he's wondering what we're talking about. Here's the thing. I genuinely think that the thin crust pizza in Chicago on average is better than the thin crust pizza I have out in New York. I think that the thin crust pizza in Chicago on average is better than the thin crust pizza I have out in the, in, in New York. I think that they're comparable, but they're not that I think that the pizza here is a little better. Um, the, I'm not a huge, uh, cheese, the stuffed or whatever that stuff is. The one that with the, with the, with the sauce on top, I'm not a huge fan of that. I get that maybe once every three years and then realize why I didn't order it for

the past three years. I'm not a huge fan of it. I don't really like it. My very favorite pizza in Chicago is the deep dish pizza that we get at Pequod's. So Pequod's pizza is a deep dish pizza. They make it a little weird. They put the cheese underneath the sauce and it's not a ton of cheese. It's just enough cheese, just like you would normally put on a pizza. And the sauce gets a really great caramelized flavor and the actual ingredients cook because they put that on top. And so the ingredients are caramelized too, and everything winds up tasting delicious. So that's like my favorite pizza in Chicago is the stuffed, or not the stuffed, the deep dish. But I also very often will order the thin crust too. I like thin crust pizza, but I also, I also very often will order, um, uh, thin crust too. I like thin crust

pizza, but I'm not, but I'm not a fan of the, the one. And that's what they always say. It's like, it's like, um, uh, what is it? It's a, it's a straw man. They always make it seem like the one that we like is the one with all the mozzarella cheese and the sauce scooped on top. And I never eat that. Yeah. I think I order a stuffed order a stuffed pizza yeah but probably maybe once a year once every other year something like that yeah and some and i and admittedly there's one or two places that do it okay yeah um lumel nadis is okay um i think gino's does an okay job so there's a couple of them but again i would much rather have a gino's thin crust pizza to be honest with you that's that's more typically what's ordered's ordered. I think the confusion comes from that is what is thought of as Chicago style. Yeah. So that's like what's

kind of the namesake pie, right? But I don't think if you're here, that's what Chicagoans eat. Yeah. Like if you're a Chicagoan, that's very unlikely to be- The food you eat. What you eat on a Friday when you ordered pizza. Yeah. And I would almost guarantee this. I've never ordered one to my home. No? I've never ordered. I've only eaten them at places. Because

when you order them at your home, they show up and they have literally juiced the entire thing they put on. And it's like falling apart. It's a total mess. I would only, if I was ordering it, I would only eat it in a restaurant.

There's no way I would order that from home. And I would, and I would say, I'm probably 50% of the people who do ever eat it, probably would never eat it if it wasn't at a home. Like another place that I really like too, in Chicago, another really good thin crust pizza is Rinali's. Rinali's is an excellent- That is a great pizza. And Rinali, another really good thin crust pizza is Rinaldi's. Rinaldi's is an excellent-

That is a great pizza. And Rinaldi's is an excellent thin crust pizza. I think Gino's East has an excellent thin crust. Giordano's, which is across the country, excellent thin crust pizza. So there's plenty of great thin crust pizza. Pat's, Nancy's, great thin crust pizza here in Chicago.

And then there's also really good deep dish. You've got to find those places. Those places are harder to find. Pequod's is the number one deep dish pizza in the city. But when it comes to the other stuff, like Tom and I aren't connoisseurs. We don't eat it very often. Nope.

If I do get it, I get it. I like Lou Malnati's if I get it. Yeah, Lou's is probably the best. They've got a good crust. Lou's is the best, I think, if you're looking at them. Lou's is the most famous. And Lou's doesn't fucking, like Giordano's is the one that puts

a fucking six pounds of mozzarella in theirs, and you're just like, you're not going to the bathroom for a week after that. Nobody actually gets a Giordano's stuffed pizza locally. But it is funny, because that's the one you can mail out. That's the quintessential... That's the one you can mail out.

So we got a comment on our blog that said we should look up frack gel, and I haven't realize that. I didn't realize that. Yeah. That's the one you can mail out. So we got a comment on our blog that said we should look up frack gel and I haven't yet. So, but if you like gels, you can go to adamandeve.com. I don't know that they have frack gels, but you can get 50% off almost any item,

a bunch of free stuff and free shipping. What should you do? Just enter Gloria checkout and it's not a glory hole that you would drill in the ground to frack in. do. Just enter glory at checkout. And it's not a glory hole that you would drill in the ground to frack in. So we hope you enjoyed our mid a week episode. We released the Thursday episode on the family. We watched the family on Netflix and you can send a message to us at dissonance.podcast at gmail.com. Let us know what you think of that episode. It's a movie review episode. If you have

other ideas or things that you think we should cover, let us know. Send us a message. We want to thank Jordan and Dan from the Knowledge Fight podcast. Great guys. We had them in studio. Really great guys. Local guys. And we had a really fun time talking to them. We're excited to have them back on. We're hoping in the beginning of the next year, they're going to come back and we're

just going to do clips with them for like a while. Because we just had a blast chit-chatting with them. Really cool guys. Check'd be great. Because we just had a blast chit-chatting with them. Really cool, guys. Check out their podcast, Knowledge Fight. Fun podcast to listen to. They put out a ton of content. So check it out.

We'll put a link on this week's show notes. It is episode 494. So that is going to wrap it up for this week. We are going to leave you like we always do with the Skeptic's Creed. Credulity is not a virtue. It's fortune cookie cutter mommy issue hypno babylon bullshit couched in scientician double bubble toil and trouble pseudo quasi alternative acupunctuating pressurized stereogram pyramidal free energy healing water downward spiral brain dead pan sales pitch late night info docutainment leo pisces cancer cures detox reflex foot massage death and towers tarot cards psychic healing

crystal balls bigfoot yeti aliens churches mosques and synagogues temples dragons giant worms atlantis dolphins truthers birthers witches, vaccine nuts, shaman healers, evangelists, conspiracy, doublespeak, stigmata, nonsense. Expose your sides. Thrust your hands. Bloody, evidential, conclusive. Doubt even this. The opinions and information provided on this podcast are intended for entertainment purposes only. All opinions are solely that of Glory Hole Studios, LLC.

purposes only. All opinions are solely that of Glory Hole Studios LLC. Cognitive dissonance makes no representations as to accuracy, completeness, currentness, suitability, or validity of any information and will not be liable for any errors, damages, or butthurt arising from consumption. All information is provided on an as-is basis. No refunds. Produced in association with the local Dairy Council and viewers like you.