Cognitive Dissonance - Introducing "Talking Ship" - A new podcast hosted by Haeley and Tom

Episode Date: February 9, 2024

     

record press record we're in it now no backing out now girl this is it get in the zone i'll throw you off get in the zone can't even look at you can't even look at you all right all right what she says before second and after often during kind of a lot. Try to be very serious. I'm trying to be very serious.

All right. You're not very serious. That's on me. She also says. Welcome to Talking Shift. I'm Haley. And I'm Tom. And today, we're going to talk about a bad relationship article. I don't know wherever you could find a bad relationship article on the internet, love. Yeah. So it was like one of the things when we were like talking about doing this show was just like, you know, what kind of sources would we use? And, you know, like, are we going to like run out of material?

Is it going to get boring? You know, like, and it turns out that there's just endless material out there. That's like bad relationship advice articles, Reddit posts, you know, like videos, books. It just, the media that just gives people terrible relationship advice is endless. Endless. All you have to do is follow the clickbait because like the world is absolutely chumming the water with bad relationship articles. Oh, yeah. And sometimes by really, really well-known authors. Yes. Like distressingly well-known authors. So like there is a ton of variety out there.

I don't think we're going to run out of it. No, we're going to be just fine. But according to this article, there are only three varieties of sex for married people to have. Okay. Oral. Vaginal. No, no, no, no. So this is from yourt have. Okay. Oral? Vagina? No, no, no, no.

So this is from yourtango.com. Like the scientific like... The scientific think tank over your tango? Yes. Yeah, right. And it is called The Three Distinct Types of Sex Happily Married Couples Have.

Subtitle, How to Keep Passion Alive in a Long long-term monogamous sex life. Okay. I feel like monogamous and sex life is already redundant, right? Doesn't monogamous already refer to your sex life? I don't know. I feel like it does. Like what else would it mean if it wasn't referring to sex life?

Well, you could have a different type of sex life. Sure. Monogamous relationship. I don't know. It doesn't make a difference. It's a type of sex life. Sure. Monogamous relationship. I don't know. Like, it doesn't make a difference. It's a distinction without a difference. Exactly. Yeah.

You're just. I'm already picking a net, though. Yeah. I'm going to pick a lot of nets here. You're not going to have to try. Okay. This is horrifying. It is.

Okay. So, it's quite long, too, actually. So, I did edit, like, some large chunks of it out that I will TLDR for everybody. It begins, a good sex life is crucial to keeping love and passionate monogamy growing in a relationship. It's the glue that holds it all together. Sex releases the hormones that make us feel good. Testosterone for men and oxytocin for women. I already have problems here. Exactly. I was just going to say two sentences in and I'm already like, wait, what? Okay. So men don't have oxytocin. They don't feel loving hormones. For the record, I am not an endocrine

woman. Women don't have any testosterone. But also like, right. Yeah. Like I don't have oxytocin like i just don't like like like there's no afterglow for men i'm just like bonding feelings whatsoever no you just feel more like like you get more testosterone i don't know one way or the other that's why like you know testosterone there are so many teenage boys that are, like, so jacked. Right. Because, like, they have all the testosterone jerking off constantly, right? Like, because, you know, they're already full of testosterone. Right.

And it increases when you have, like, sex life. Right. Many of them have, like, healthy sex lives with themselves. Right. For sure. You know? And that's why they're so huge and jacked everywhere you go you never ever see you know like a skinny teenage boy yeah yeah and i i love that we're

establishing from the outset of this article that like we are going to draw some hard biological essentialism differences between men and women in terms of like sex and what they need. So like already we're starting off and being like dudes be getting testosterone, the ladies be getting the feeling chemicals. You know what I'm saying, guys? Just wait, just wait. It gets better.

Two sentences in, two sentences in. It gets better. I've never had a loving feeling after sex for me. I just never. Like all the cuddling and the afterglow, that's just like, I grit my teeth through it. I just want to lift weights the whole time. Right. Now we all know it is often the case that sex is almost always on a man's mind and he is generally in the mood anytime, anywhere, and anyway. But for a woman to build her desire and

fully enjoy the sexual experience, she first needs to feel special and cherished by her partner. Was this written in the past? This feels like this was written in the past. Oh, this was recent. Yeah, this was recent. This was, I don't know. That like, that old, those, yeah. December 9th of this year. Holy fucking shit. Those like old tropes that like dudes just always want it. Dudes always 100% of the time. Women don't ever really want it. And women don't really enjoy sex. You've got to like try really hard, you know, as a physical experience. Women are not into sex is what he's saying. If you have something like if you have enough emotional attachment, you'll like

grit your teeth through basically. Oh we're getting there this gets better she yearns to be wanted and responds best when a man pursues her with devout intensity regardless of the relationship stage or length men hate you know when you show them affection and pursue them i know that like that's why I ignore you exclusively at all times. Gets me so hard. Yeah. This is based on the fact, that is the word that is written there, that men and women experience attraction differently. Sure. This will all start to become a little more clear in this next paragraph as to like why this is the way it is. Okay. Men feel physical attraction first, then the emotional and mental connection follows.

Women need to feel connected mentally and emotionally before they are ready for a physical encounter. This is why romance is from Venus and sex is from Mars. Oh my God. Can you guess who wrote this article? This is doctor, not a doctor, John Gray. Yes. Yeah.

This is fucking this guy this is the guy who basically wrote an entire book in order to make his wife like feel that she was required to fuck him more often right yeah he wrote an entire book just because his wife was not banging him enough right and like to guilt her into doing it by the way like well because it's not to her into doing it's just science right it's science right oh my god so like that book is insanely pro like we should totally do like like a patreon like bonus series because there's so much in that book it would have have to be an entire series. We should like chapter by chapter for patrons. Breakdown men are from Mars. Women are from Venus. That guy's not a doctor. I just have to say it again. He has an honorary doctorate and he claims that as his title,

he is not a doctor. You know, like when you get like one of those like honorary degrees from like Joe Blow University, you don't really get to then use that to walk around and be like, no, I have a PhD. Whatever. Speak for yourself. If that happens to me, I'm totally doing it. Dr. Haley in the house. Jesus Christ. So then I, you know, just kind of summarize it a little. So then it goes into a bunch of overly detailed descriptions of early relationships, courting, flirting, behaviors, flowers, attention, sexting, and very particularly and specifically female grooming and dressing habits. But no mention of that for men, of course. Right. And also your basic, hey, you used to like talk to each other.

B.S. Like, remember talking like you should talk. You should maybe try that sometime. Weird. I love when these relationship articles about like the breakdown of like sexual attraction over time where it's always like, hey, you know, it used to be when we first got together, it went like this and now it's like this. And it's like invariably it's some dude who, to your point, is like he's wearing socks and Crocs, right? Like he's showering every third day. He's not, he can't

be fucked to stop, you know, to turn off the game or do something and like actually spend time the way that he did when he was courting the woman that he's now pissy about not fucking him anymore. Right. Right. Like people stop spending like pouring and lavishing time on other people. And then they wonder like, well, why do things feel like they've changed? Because your behaviors have changed. When you went on a first date, what'd you dress like? You know, like when like you and I first met, I was showered. I had cologne on. I dressed nice. Like I lavish you with time and attention and affection. I stayed up all night listening, you know, and talking. And you know what I still do? I shower every day.

I dress nice. I very often put on cologne. And I stay up all night talking to you and lavishing you with attention. I know you're saying like you had to like put on like a suit every day or whatever. But you know, like even like my pajama outfit that I'm wearing right now, like there's an effort for it to look cute. You know, like I do my hair. Right. Even if I'm staying home. That's what I'm saying. Like I still want you to think I'm wearing right now. Like there's an effort for it to look cute. You know, like I do my hair. Right. If I'm staying home. That's what I'm saying. Like, like, I still want you to think I'm pretty. Right. I still want you to think I'm like interested in you and that I'm attractive. Like I work out every day and yeah, like, yeah. So get the fuck out of here with that stuff. Like,

well, we all got lazy and it had an effect. So then the article goes on to explicitly say that everyone stops doing all of that stuff as a rule. Yeah. In relationships. Everyone completely stops that as a rule. Seven years in.

All right. Yes. Seven years in. Haven't stopped. As couples settle in together and the hectic daily schedules take precedence, our priorities slowly shift.

We don't indulge in as much quality time together or strive to meet each other's needs. Yet this is the precursor to great sex. What happens instead is that men tend to forget their feelings and women tend to forget their sexual desire. No, what? I have never forgotten my feelings. That is not a thing. Like men are not feelingless, stoic robots. That is like also so fantastically old school.

And I'm sorry, but like men can also forget their sexual desire too. I know relationships where that has happened. Like maybe there's something going on, stress, like whatever. where that has happened. Like maybe there's something going on, stress, like whatever. 100%. It can happen to anyone

and like women can forget their feelings. Right. Too. Like it's just beyond binary to where it's like, like literally, like this fucking chucklehead

implies we are from two different alien planets and we just happen to like to bone each other on this one. Right. Like we are not the same species we are not the same animal we don't have the same like desires and drives and like you know yearning for connection and closeness and sex right you know like yeah i don't understand like like like men are like this and women are like this well and i like that it says like invariably or like inevitably, like as like life takes

hold, priorities shift. And I like I wrote that down because it's like, well, priorities shift to what? Like when you're dating, you still have to do all of your life stuff. And then you have to add on the effort and work of dating somebody and meeting somebody and courting them and all that. So like it's not more work to date within a relationship than it was to date outside a relationship. It's actually in a lot of ways, less work to date somebody within a relationship. So like, that just seems like this guy calling his

own marriage out and being like. That whole goddamn book is that guy calling his own marriage out. Like we, yeah, we really, we're definitely going to do that. We're going to do that. We're going to take that bullet for you guys. Well, for the ones that pay. For the pay. Right, yeah. Not just for like. We're like our real friends, you know.

Sometimes when tension is brewing in a relationship, one partner will want to stop having sex. But the best thing a couple can do is focus on creating better sex. Because when the sex gets better, suddenly the whole relationship can improve. And it can never work in the reverse, apparently. The sex has to be good. I feel like his advice is bang mad. Yes. But the sex is what's going to fix the relationship. Right.

Fixing the relationship won't fix the sex. Right. Yeah. I i 100 think that's backwards that's why i said it the way that i said it and like listeners can't hear but with the look on my face that i was giving to you well i said it like are you fucking kidding me because i feel like we've already covered that you know oh yeah but like his suggestion really is like hey listen to his wife because he's writing this to his wife. All of these things are sideways to his wife. No, no, I think he's divorced at this point in time.

Yes. And he's just writing this for your tango.com. I think he's writing this to justify that, like his behavior, because like the guy's a fucking scumbag from from what i'm to understand about he is just heating up the same leftovers over and over again and selling them to like a new a new audience audience you know so every so often he pops up with this crap out of nowhere that's like this like same old hash you know he feels like the relationship version of like like that eternity soup you know where you just oh yeah just keep adding more yeah he feels like the relationship version of like. It's like that eternity soup, you know, where you just. Oh, yeah.

Just keep adding more. Yeah. He feels like the relationship version of like, what's the deal with airplane food? Oh, yeah. Okay. This this shtick again. Yeah. This fucking shtick again.

Yeah. Men be like this. Women be like this. You know, whatever. I wish you guys could see me when she did that. Because she did this little like, bop to the left, bop to the right. When she did like, men be like this, women be like this. It was kind of great.

Yeah. This isn't like the best medium for like someone that's like. Animated? Yeah. When I talk. All right. Then in the article, we jump straight into comparing sex to food literally out of nowhere. Cool.

Everything I've read up to now is the vibe of everything I've read up to now, which has how much to do with food? Nothing to do with food. Now it's everything has to do with food from here on out. Don't write hungry, dude. It's like, don't shop hungry. Like, I feel like I'm not going to be sympathetic with this guy. But like right now in this moment, I feel him. Don't shop hungry. Like, I feel like I'm not going to be sympathetic with this guy. But like right now in this moment, I feel him. Don't write hungry.

So he writes. And remember, there are three types of sex. So three. Three. OK, I'm going to write down the letter. Just as our palates crave a variety of meals to keep our bodies functioning well, we also need to incorporate a variety into our intimate relationships. There are three types of sex happily married couples have to keep their relationship strong.

How much of a variety would you say three is? That's not a lot of variety. If you had to eat three foods for the rest of your life, since we are going with food here. Right, since that's the analogy. Yes. Yeah, that's breakfast, lunch, and dinner. Would that be variety to you? No, no, and dinner. Would that be variety? That's not variety. Do you? No. Okay. No. No. And I'm scared because I'm a child. So I'm like, all right. So hand stuff?

I'm writing it down. I'm like, there's not a lot of variety. I can get to four without blinking an eye here. One. Okay. Healthy home-cooked sex sex this style is the basis for a regular healthy sex life it usually occurs a couple times a week and generally takes about 30 minutes and the martian ensures that his venusian has the time she needs to relax build up to her desire, and experience orgasms. Because like, as a guy, I don't want the experience, like,

presumptively in there. It's not just that like, No. Nobody, no man needs to be touched or like, anything. I don't need to feel good. I don't need any ramp up here

and I can just be like, No. No foreplay whatsoever. You are expected to show up standing at attention and just put it in. Right. That's it.

That's all you can do. That's your only job. I'm not 15. Like, I'm not 15 on a bumpy road. That's not how it works. Sorry. You just reminded me of stupid jizz in my pants wind blows in yeah yeah that's how there's like a four-year period of your life four or five-year

period your life where you're like oh yeah it's raining outside you're like well that doesn't relate in any way no i'm gonna have this song in my head all night. Okay. All right. Two, fast food sex. Oh, God. This is going to get bad. This is, yeah, this gets so bad. This sounds greasy. It sounds like lubey. Okay, so although junk food would not be good for us as a regular diet,

it can be tasty, and sometimes it fits well into the schedule. The same is true for quickies. This three to five minutes given whenever he feels the need for sexual release and she's not in the mood is a great gift that a woman can bestow on her partner and will go a long way to ensuring he continues to feel his love for her oh i don't like any sentence that like every phrase is a problem like every what the fuck she is explicitly not in the mood for the quickie no and also if she doesn't give him the quickie he won't love her anymore yes that's the implication holy fucking. Why would you write that down? If you thought that thought, you should go

outside and stand in front of a bus. Maybe when he first wrote his book. Okay. Fine. People were weird thinkers back then. Sure. But he wrote this at the beginning of December of 2023. No, this is

like some fucking... He wrote this two weeks exactly before christmas this is not a christmas present this is not a christmas present also like sex that you don't want to have is not a gift you give someone oh no that's rape yeah yeah that's fucking not good i mean it's coercive like you know date rape kind rape. That's a fucking huge problem. Yes. Like the idea and like, you know, it's become like kind of a thing, like a joke. It's like, oh, like on your birthday, you know, like we'll do this thing or that thing.

Like, like gift sex is a weird thing. Like that's a weird, like not a good, weird thing. Like the Sopranos did it for comedy. Lots of things. Oh, yeah. He only gets a BJ on his birthday. He only goes down on her on her birth. Yeah.

And it's like, it's like, that's, that is like not good. Like we need to stop reinforcing that with jokes. We just stopped reinforcing that with fucking articles like this, that like sex is a gift you give somebody and not something like together we mutually enjoy. Okay. But you know, like give it a second. Okay, I'm sorry. Because he makes up for it here.

Oh, sure. I'm sure he does. Also, he will want to reciprocate quickly by giving her the cuddling she needs regularly. Three to five minutes of cuddles. To feel loved. This technique can work very well so that never again will he feel rejected

and she will always be able to count on him for affection. That made it worse. You said it was going to get better. I feel like you misled me. Maybe. Oh my God. Maybe. It's funny because like, I don't know between the two of us, I don't know which of the two of us has a higher need for platonic physical affection. I have a very high need for platonic physical affection. Yeah. Because you're a person.

Yeah. Like, I'm not just like, oh, God, I guess I'll cuddle you. But like, you know, it would be so like weird and like womanly if you wanted me to hold your hand or hug you. Right. Or give you a kiss. Right. That would just, that would, like if, if my wife, you know, was affectionate with me and I liked

that, that would really make me gay, I guess, or whatever. I know. I don't understand it. I'm not much of a man because I like it when my wife rubs my back after a long day. I know. What? I know. What?

Yeah. You can't take a bubble bath ever either. Right. You know, it's just not allowed. Disallowed. Disallowed. Disallowed. You can't enjoy things in the world like that because they're not scratchy and rough and hard and poking into you. I don't want to wear hair shirts and burlap.

Yeah. Like anything that's like, you know, like comfortable. What the fuck is wrong with these people? Warm and snuggly and soft. Like that's all girl stuff. You know, like you get sandpaper and splinters. That's it. How much like embedded misogyny and homophobia is built into that one fucking paragraph? Like so much, so much because like it suggests that like, I mean, along with the rapiness, the rapiness. Yeah. There's nothing

good. Like not even accidentally. No. And then the comparison to fast food just also, like I said, it makes it greasy. It says it's unhealthy. Yeah. And that it should not be part of a regular diet, right? But it should be like given whenever he feels the need for sexual release. And earlier in this article, I don't know if you you remember but he's always feeling that need for sexual release so like and they're having do we have fast food all the time or do we not yeah right because it's like a couple times a week for like the like your regular yeah for your regular

like home cooking sex you're having sex two to three times a week that includes foreplay the sex that includes her right like honestly no sex that includes her is a couple sex two to three times a week. The sex that includes foreplay. The sex that includes her. Right? Like, honestly, the sex that includes her is a couple to two to three times a week. Yeah. And then there's also whenever he feels like just like banging away at you, but he'll give you a quick cuddle afterwards. Well, it doesn't say afterwards. It just says. Or also cuddle you.

He will cuddle. He should cuddle her when she wants to be cuddled or something. Well, no, not when she wants it. Just regularly. Regularly. You know, that could be like once a week. Well, it's time for a regular cuddle. Yes.

It's Thursday, 7.15. Oh, you're prescient. Oh, no. Oh, God. I don't want to be prescient. Look into the future here. This is a problem. Number three is gourmet sex.

You would think after the other two and, you know, the longest description because I I did a dot dot dot also. So I cut like a paragraph out of that quickie thing. Uh huh. Oh, boy. You know, so like that was by far the longest description of like sex types or whatever that he he put in this. He spent more time on the quickie.

That's ironic. I know. I know. Right. Like to the point where I was like, dot, dot, dot,

none of this needs to be said. Gourmet sex indulge in this style of sex. At least once a month, a woman needs to be wind dined and romanced. Just like in the early days and nights of the relationship. No excuses. Put it on the schedule. Remember the adage, if mama ain't happy, then nobody's happy, which I just want to know is incorrect because it's if mama ain't happy, ain't nobody happy, but whatever. Whatever. He's wrong about a lot of things. Among all the things he's wrong about,

the guy can't even get a simple added, okay, fine. Yeah. Of course, a romantic getaway is wonderful, but if money is tight, then send the kids to grandma's

or trade babysitting evenings with the neighbors. That is gourmet sex. That is the description of what's supposed to be the fanciest. Like, when you're doing, like,

gourmet cooking, right? Yeah, So, like, say, like, you're going to put a lean cuisine in the microwave or whatever. Sure. Fast food, you know, quickie meal. Sure. The lean cuisine would take longer to make than his sex though, by the way.

Yeah, that's true. The directions though are pretty brief. Right. You know, put in for this long, maybe stir it somewhere in between, put it back. Who knows? But like, it's just throw it in the microwave. If you want to cook a gourmet meal, right? Like, or even just a single gourmet dish.

What do the directions look like for that? They're elaborate as fuck. Right. It's elaborate. You know, many ingredients are listed out. Many recipes. And shopping trips. Yeah.

Like the whole night. Oftentimes prep days in advance. All he did was basically say, take your wife out on date night. That is gourmet sex. Which isn't sex, by the way. That's a date. It doesn't include sex at all. Yeah.

Thank you. I was like, what I wrote down is dating isn't sex. And then just like question marks. Like, I'm just very confused. How is the type of sex? The third type of sex is go on a date. I don't know. That's not sex.

Like if I, I don't know how it's supposed to be like to dinner and dancing. And then we're just like, that was such a great night. And then we come home and we're tired from dinner and dancing. And then we go to sleep. I did the wine and dine portion that he's referring to. And you, I guess, in that scenario were wined and dined. I still don't like that phrase. Right.

It assumes this like you're coercing me to like, yeah, I guess, in that scenario were wined and dined. I still don't like that phrase, right? No. It assumes this like weird directionality to things. You're coercing me into like, yeah, into feeling things for you or something. Right. So I don't like any of that, but I'm just like kind of going along with his thing. But none of that involves sex. No. The third type of sex isn't sex. I'm like, oh my God, we went out to dinner and a movie. I need a cigarette after that. God damn. That was some good sex. Wasn't the best? You would think too, like the gourmet sex. I need a cigarette after that. God damn. That was some good sex. Wasn't the best. You would think too, like the gourmet sex. I was kind of like, all right, well, the first kind of sex is sex that involves like both partners. And the second kind of sex is date rape in a marriage. And I'm like, well, what is gourmet sex? It's going to be some sting level

shit where it's like, you know, six hour shit where you're just like, all right, I got to call a doctor if this lasts any longer, you know? Like, well, I was kind of like getting ready. I's like, you know, tantric and like shit where you're just like, all right, I got to call a doctor if this lasts any longer, you know, like I was kind of like getting ready. I'm like, what is he going to suggest next? Like, go and take your wife out on a date. Yeah. Clearly nothing to do with sex. No, it's to get one of the other kinds of sex after the date. That's right. That's it. It's, it's exactly right. It's like, you need to do this other. it's it's exactly right it's like you need to do this other and in his mind onerous checklist shit like okay you got to treat your wife now hear me out guys i know you guys are all from mars yeah you got to treat her like a person i know crazy i don't want to do it either but otherwise she's not going to let you in her vagina like you can't get in her vagina if you don't pretend she's a person they hate that

huh guys that's like what he's writing down but it's also it's just like it's an onerous task for you right to like treat me well right and like lovingly and cuddle with me and stuff or like i don't know maybe take me out to dinner Like, that's an onerous task for you. And it is also an onerous task for me to have sex with your body. This is what he assumes. Yes. How awful is John Gray's body? All right. No, I'm just saying, like.

Like, you have to assume that it's somebody. John Gray only went down on his wife on her birthday. That's all I'm saying. That's it. Because, like, seriously. She is not into it. He's lived an entire life. Because like, seriously, she is not into it. He's lived an entire life where like,

God, women do not like fucking me. You're doing it wrong somehow. I'm writing a book about this. There's got to be a reason. Right. I bet they're from another planet. You know what I mean?

Yes. So, in conclusion, the key to passionate monogamy is remembering and acting like we did at the beginning of the relationship.

The only thing, the only single sentence he has written in this entire article that I do not disagree with. When the man takes action to be romantic and the woman responds with appreciation, a euphemism for sex, our bodies release the hormones that drive our sexual feelings, period. So one sentence in this is, yeah, remember and act like you did early in your relationship. Always good advice. You know? Yeah. When your hair was on fire for someone and how awesome that felt, like you can keep that going. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. I fully 100% believe in that as like an ethos of my life right like yes yes that is a true easily for us to believe because like we do that on purpose right we're living that like and it is like but what what i think all of these guys miss is they treat

it like it's work they all treat it like it's work you've got to fucking remember i gotta put in my goddamn calendar and i gotta be like oh my wife's a person i gotta write down do you like not enjoy going out to restaurants or something because you have a penis right i fucking love bringing my penis along to restaurants you know but you know what i mean like it's just like do you not enjoy like fun things and like nice things and good times because you have a, again, it's still like all things like nice and beautiful in the world are for women. And if you like them, you're a girl. Yeah. Right.

Yeah. You just, it's like, oh, it's not manly enough for me to go to the museum. What? I mean, I know men created a lot of this art, but obviously. No, anyway. I'm horny all the time. That's what I meant to say. I'm horny all the time. Yes.

Yeah. You're a walking penis. Penises don't eat at restaurants. I'm wrecked constantly. Yeah. It's terrible, actually. What the fuck? We are doing this book.

We are 100% going to do this book, patrons. This is the best thing we'll ever find. Oh, my God. But seriously, though, like, do men not have fun, like, on a date, too? Like, why does anybody do it? Right. Well, I think, genuinely, I think that what he is suggesting is all of that is a pretense to get in your pants. And that none of that was ever real. And that what, what I really think is advice to men here boils down to is look,

remember how you were lying and it was a great big pretense. And then you got in her pants and now she said, I do. Well, look, if you want to stay getting in her pants, you're going to have to keep lying. I really feel like that's a subtext here, but like that says everything about John Gray I was gonna nothing about me I love doing like the places I've taken you on dates are places I love going I need to sit down with John Gray and have a talk with him about like appreciating like all the good things like in the present moment he's in yeah and living within the present moment that he's in because like,

it's pretty cool here and there's probably good food here at a restaurant, man. You know, like we got like steak and scallops and shit or something, you know, like you get to have something fancy and you get to have somebody clear away your dishes and wash them for you. And like, it's nice. Go to a better restaurant. It's nice. Right. To like have nice things. I don't, I don't get it. I don't get, I don't. Like, it's just always looking forward to getting boned or something. Like, that's all it looks forward to.

It's missing everything along the way. Everything. That's fun, enjoyable, and beautiful. And as a result, it's the least sexy thing possible. John Gray, it is the journey. It is not the destination. Journey that counts. You heard, it is the journey. It is not the destination. Journey that counts. You heard it here on Talking Ship. And I had to add in, yeah, like the little,

the little like about the author thing at the end. Dr. John Gray is a leading relationship expert whose books, including Men Are From Mars, Women Are From Venus, have sold over 50 million copies in 50 languages in 150 countries. He helps men and women better understand and respect their differences in both personal and professional relationships. The grumpiest thing about that is how much richer he is than I am. Oh my God, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. He's got a swimming pool and I don't. And I'm fucking mad about it.

I'm just straight butthurt about this. We're going to have to get more patrons so that Tom can get a swimming pool. Yes. Because it's Tom's idea and totally not mine to get the swimming pool. I didn't put that idea in there. Don't let John Gray have a better pool than me, guys. That's not right. We can't let that.

The world can't be like that. It's not right a better pool than me, guys. That's not right. Yeah, we can't let that, like, the world can't be like that. It's not right. This is how the terrorists win. It's not right. So, you'll have to increase your patron, you know, like, contributions anyway to hear us tear apart Men Are From Mars, Women Are From Venus as bonus material, because that's happening. I'm going to order the book on Amazon, like, right after we're done here. Get two copies, girl.

Yeah. Get two copies. Here we go oh shit all right so that's all i have for today that's enough i am fucking spent i've spent my three to five minutes i don't know like i don't feel like i was cuddled adequately oh you owe me. I owe you. I'll wine and dine you. Yeah.

Gritted teeth, I guess. Yeah. All right. If you have any questions, comments, or suggestions for us, you can email us at Talkingshippod at gmail.com. And if you want to become a patron, and apparently here are, you know, review of Men Are From Mars, women are from Venus bonus episodes. You can go to Patreon dot com slash Talking Ship podcast. Right. Well, I think genuinely, I think that what he is suggesting is

all of that as a pretense to get in your pants.