Cold Case Files - Evil in Huntington Beach

Episode Date: February 4, 2025

When the body of a woman turns up in a field in Huntington Beach, CA, in 1968, police simultaneously seek a killer and the identity of the victim herself. It takes 52 years for detectives to solve this dual mystery and expose a vicious predator. Dipsea - Visit Dipseastories.com/COLDCASE to start your free 30-day trial! Thuma - Go to THUMA.co/COLDCASE to receive $100 off your first bed purchase! 

Hi, cold case listeners. I'm Marisa Pinson. And before we get into this week's episode, I just wanted to remind you that episodes of Cold Case Files, as well as the A&E Classic Podcast, I Survived, American Justice, and City Confidential are all available ad free on the new A&E Crime and Investigation channel on Apple Podcasts and Apple Plus for just $4.99 a month

or $39.99 a year. And now on onto the show. The following episode contains disturbing accounts of physical and sexual violence. Listener discretion is advised. When Anita went missing and we hadn't heard from her, every time the phone would ring, we would hope and pray it was her and it never was. And that's when panic started. They all felt something was wrong. It was her, and it never was. And that's when panic started. They all felt something was wrong.

It was devastating. When the fire department arrived at the scene, they found out they had a cadaver in the field. It was very obvious that her throat had been slit. I received a call from a woman who said her ex-husband came home one night around that time frame covered in blood. This is the lead I'm looking for. We were worried about Anita.

We wanted to know what happened to her. She would have tried to contact someone, especially her mother. There are over 100,000 cold cases in America. Only about 1% are ever solved. This is one of those rare stories. It's March 1968 in Huntington Beach, California. Earl Robitaille is a retired Detective Bureau commander with the Huntington Beach Police Department. In the 60s, we were in the middle of the hippie generation. Huntington Beach was the fastest growing city in the United States. We would attract kids from all over the country.

We had Hollywood close by and that whole thing. There were all these little cultish kinds of juvenile groups and some very devious people in Huntington Beach at that point in time. Two miles away from the surf and sand of Huntington Beach, three boys make a grim discovery. David Deerking is an investigator with the Orange County District Attorney's Office. It was a Thursday afternoon. Officer Tom Quick responded from the Huntington Beach Police Department regarding a woman that was found in a plowed farm field near Newlin in Yorktown.

He was discovered by three young boys that were playing in that plowed field and they thought at first she could be a mannequin. The fire department responded and found a obviously deceased female face down in a ditch in that field. The first guys on the scene knew they had a homicide, there's no doubt about that. She was young, 20s to 30s. She was covered with a lot of blood, but it was very obvious that her throat had been slit.

It was a very nasty her throat had been slit. It was a very nasty wound that went across both jugglers and the windpipe. It appears she's been sexually assaulted. Police know how this victim was killed, but not who she is. No purse, no wallet, and no identification was ever found for her. She was dressed as if she was going out. She had a leather jacket, black loafer shoes, purple capri pants that were pulled up but not secure.

She had a flowered blouse that had been torn open. All the clothing, there were no tags. There was no identifying anything. So the prime question is who is she? It's December 1, 1967 in Augusta, Maine, two and a half months before the unidentified body is found. Laurie Kurian and Monique Poulan are Anita Poteau's nieces. Anita was born on March 9, 1942 in Augusta, Maine. She had six brothers and sisters.

She was pretty rambunctious. Anita was a really good aunt. She was really nice to us and would play games with us. Everybody enjoyed being around her, had fun with her. Growing up in small town Augusta, Maine, the Pateau brothers and sisters were part of a tight-knit family. When I knew that Anita was coming over, I would be really happy to see her because I knew that we would get a chance to talk and have some time together. Anita Pateau is 26 in 1968 with a fun-loving and rebellious spirit.

Anita was a very outgoing person, very outspoken, bubbly. She liked to laugh and tell jokes. Anita really liked music and going out dancing, and she liked the Beatles. She had a bit of a wild side. And Maine was pretty low-key, pretty boring. People in the 50s and 60s, when they graduated high school, would either go work at the mills or the factories or work at a restaurant or shops that were around. Anita got a job waitressing at a local restaurant,

and she stayed there for a little while. Then she would get another waitress job wherever she could. At one of her jobs, Anita makes some new friends with exciting plans to get out of their small town and head for California. Being from Maine, California always sounds, you know, nice weather and lots of fun and different atmosphere and nice big cities.

And we just didn't have that in Maine. And that's why she wanted to go out there. It was a big deal for her mom that she was going to California. That seemed like so far away. Her family really didn't want her to go. They didn't know how safe it was going to be. Back in Huntington Beach, it's 1968 at 6 p.m.,

two hours after the unidentified body is found. Stephen Mack is a retired homicide detective with the Huntington Beach Police Department. The investigators realize now that they're working with Jane Doe, a victim that is unidentified. When you don't know who the victim is, it's exponentially more difficult because you have no starting place. The crime scene also presents challenges to investigators. The crime scene was in a wide open agricultural area, little chance of anybody seeing much of anything.

What we had is a muddy, plowed up field that had had heavy rain the night before that had started early. The officers noticed tire tracks in and out of the field. They were very obvious because of the rain. There was evidence that a car had traveled onto that plowed field and made a complete circle. And it had stopped on the top of the ditch area

where this victim was found. It was apparent that she had been dragged from the passenger side of that car. What I was doing is I was kneeling down to get an oblique look at these tire tracks that had been left there by the suspect car. The officers immediately cast those with plaster repairs so they could be matched to a suspect tire if the suspect vehicle could be found at a later time.

Next, investigators methodically searched the area where the victim was found. The grid search at the scene is almost mandated today. Not so much back in that time. There was a lot of stuff collected and one of those items was a cigarette butt that was very close to where it appeared the body had taken place. While a team catalogs physical evidence, investigators look for other ways to identify their Jane Doe victim. The investigators had flyers made up and they had drawings of the young lady, our victim,

and then sent them out to every investigative agency they could think of. The police department in Huntington Beach contacted 1,100 residents, had 225 contacts with either potential suspects or those who may have info, and 10,000 all-point bulletins were distributed throughout 13 of the 50 states. There was a theory that she got picked up at a bar. Every beer bar, cocktail lounge, business establishment was contacted. One individual identified her as a patron of his bar and that she was a regular who came by from time to time.

Everybody's elated. We finally have a lead. Jody Hines-Klan is a former senior forensic scientist with the Orange County District Attorney's Office. For our Jane Doe, there was a bartender that recognized her picture. And the bartender said, yeah, she comes in here. What at first looked like a solid lead soon crumbles. The bartender calls and says, I hate to tell you this,

but it wasn't her because she just came in the bar today. It was disappointing. We still had the physical evidence. We had the clothing of the victim. But the only thing that developed from her clothing at the time were the loafers she was wearing. Our guys traced those back to a small manufacturing company in upstate New York someplace and found out that they were sold on kind of a regional basis.

So that was, you know, something to keep in the back of our mind. It might well be that she was from that area. The chance of a swift conclusion to the case is dashed. The autopsy confirms that the victim had been viciously assaulted and raped. We were dealing with a slashed wound that did all of the damage in one fell swoop. It wasn't like multiple stabbings that you get where there's that emotional reaction of a lover's quarrel. No, I would assume that she had very little notice that something fatal was going to take place.

I can't think of a worse way to have your life taken. You've been raped, you've been beaten, and a knife comes to your throat and takes your life. The one interesting thing was that her toxicology levels, she had no alcohol or drugs in her system. That sort of takes you away from her having a drink with the person that ultimately took her life. It's February 1968 in Augusta, Maine,

one month before Jane Doe's murder. Anita wrote a letter to my grandmother. That is the envelope that the letter that she sent came in. That is the envelope that the letter that she sent came in. She said she was doing well in California. She really liked the weather. And that she had taken a trip to Hollywood to see the Stars' homes. She was living with this woman who had two boys.

She was working at a restaurant and she really liked it. She said that she was dating someone who was a long-haul truck driver, and he had been taking her with him sometimes. Anita said that she was going to write in a couple of weeks and send pictures, and this was the only letter that we ever got from her. We started getting worried about Anita

when we didn't receive any other letters after that. So we started trying to contact her. The address on the envelope was Whittier. So my uncle decided to contact the police and have them do a check on her at that address. So my uncle decided to contact the police and have them do a check on her at that address. When police got to the house, the house was abandoned. The house looked like it was a commune

that a lot of people lived in because they left a lot of stuff in the house, but nobody's there, and that's all we knew. My uncle filed a police report, a missing persons report. He also tried to contact the hospitals, mental institutions, shelters, any place that he thought that she might be. Then the family wanted to try to figure out a way to get to California to see if we could find Anita. But we didn't have the money to do that. In 1968, there

was no internet, there wasn't cell phones. So it was really hard to locate people back then. Months pass without so much as a call from Anita. The silence takes a toll on her mother. It really affected her mom. She was a very sad woman after that. And every time the phone would ring, she would hope and pray it was her. And it never was. Unaware of Anita's family's search, police in California take an unusual step in hopes of identifying this Jane Doe.

They had an open morgue showing where anybody could come down there and look at her body. And so she was kept for an unusually long time at the coroner's office with the body under refrigeration. No one was able to identify the body. After 15 months, investigators run out of hope. The unnamed murder victim is unceremoniously buried, and the case goes cold. It was kind of confusing growing up, listening to all the stories, and then my mom and her brothers and sisters trying to figure out what happened to Anita. Over the years, Lori has been conducting her own investigation. It's now March 1998 in Augusta, Maine, 20 years after Anita Pateau goes missing.

Once I got older and had gone to college, computers had just come out. My dad asked me to try to find her. So I contacted America's Most Wanted and the Salvation Army Missing Persons. Everybody wrote back and said that they couldn't find anything on her. So I contacted Social Security, and a couple of months later,

I received a letter back. Her social security never hadn't been used since 1968. I mean, you need it for a job. So she's working that would have shown up. Is Pride and Prejudice the book you keep coming back to? Can't get enough of the simmering tension between Elizabeth Bennet and Mr. Darcy book you keep coming back to? Can't get enough of the simmering tension between Elizabeth Bennet and Mr. Darcy? Well, get ready to experience this classic tale like Never Before, brought to life by one of Dipsy's irresistibly sexy British voice actors. Experience Jane Austen's most brooding bachelor like Never Before in Dipsy's very spicy, immersive audio. Dipsy is the female-founded

app that's changing the world of spicy audiobooks. Created by women for the female gaze, it offers a tantalizing library of over 1,000 steamy stories, all crafted by professional writers and narrated by top-tier voice actors. Whether you're in the mood for a rugged cowboy, a Scottish sailor, or even the god of the underworld, Dipsey has characters that will set your imagination on fire. The app's user-friendly interface makes it easy to explore your favorite romance genres, from contemporary and historical to dark, sports, western, romantic, and sapphic stories. Dipsey releases new chapters every week, ensuring you'll always have fresh, exciting content

to enjoy. And right now, Cold Case Files listeners can get an extended 30-day free trial. Just go to dipsystories.com slash coldcase to start your free trial. That's D-I-P-S-E-A stories dot com slash coldcase for 30 days of full access for free. Visit dipsystories.com slash cold case for 30 days of full access for free. Visit dipsy stories.com slash cold case. It's now April 9 1996, 28 years after Anita goes missing. I kind of started figuring if Anita hadn't used her social security number, then she probably wasn't alive. Family members started getting older and having health issues. Anita's mother, my grandmother, was getting sick and she ended up passing away in 1996.

I wanted her to know where Anita was before she passed away, but that didn't happen. She was just baffled that she never got resolution, never heard from Anita. Very confused, very saddened. She was very depressed, especially as she got older. After Anita's mother passes away, Anita's niece, Lori, enlists her teenage daughter,

Dakota, to help search for Aunt Anita. Together, they find a Jane Doe website dedicated to finding missing persons. It was amazing how many people were also on there for the same reason, looking for loved ones and trying to find out information. And my daughter found someone that looked like Anita. We just thought, you know, how many people are going to look like that? I contacted Whittier Police to see if they could help me figure out if that was her. And they told me they didn't have time to do that, and that I would have to contact a private investigator

and have them look it up. But we didn't have the money to do that, so that wasn't an option for us. It's now winter 2000 in Huntington Beach, California, 32 years after Anita goes missing. A new detective reopens the Jane Doe investigation. I dug the case file out in late 2000 and began reviewing it. There wasn't a lot to go on at the time because there were no eyewitnesses to this.

I was apprehensive and even somewhat worried that it would never get solved. This was the only cold case I worked where we didn't know who the victim was, which made it that much more difficult. Eventually I went to our crime lab where we dug the evidence out on Jane Doe's case. Going through the evidence, we found the cigarette butt as well as her clothing. I asked the technician to see if there

could be some DNA extracted to put into CODIS, which is a combined DNA index system. He was able to locate both male DNA from the cigarette butt and Jane Doe's DNA from her article of clothing. Both of those were put into the system hoping to get a match. After a couple of days, I heard from the technician that there was no match. It was disappointing to me. You want that magic bullet that's going to identify everybody. It's now 2002, 34 years after the murder. And after striking out with the DNA, Detective Mack changes tactics.

That's when I reached out to the media asking them to run the story again, trying to generate interest and jog somebody's memory. Homicide is a business of long shots. If you don't take the long shot, you're not going to get the results. The media coverage generates a lead to a potential suspect living 148 miles north of Huntington Beach. to a potential suspect living 148 miles north of Huntington Beach. I received a call from a woman that lived in Bakersfield who said her ex-husband, who was a bartender at a seafood restaurant slash tiki bar in town, came home one night around that time frame covered in blood. That really got me excited. So my partner and I jumped in our cars and drove up to Bakersfield to interview her. She gave me all the information I needed to identify him.

I ran his background, found that he had committed a murder once before up in LA County. He was found not guilty by reason of insanity. I'm thinking this is the path I need. This is going to take me to the guy. When the woman called from Bakersfield and told me about her ex- husband who was a bartender in town, I remembered that there was speculation by the detectives in 1968 that Jane Doe could have met her attacker in a bar and that they left together. The connection between a bartender at a business in town and a dead girl in town caught my interest. So I found out where he lived. I did a lot of late night surveillance on his residence trying to see what he did.

He's 34 years older or so at the time, but I still want to know who he was. In 2005, Detective Mack decides to get a DNA sample from this new suspect so he can test it against the DNA recovered from the cigarette butt. So I sat out in front of his house until he put his trash at the curb. I went and took the bag of trash out of his trash can, took it back to the police department, had the DNA section, go through it. They found some drinking straws in there and they were able to get male DNA,

but not enough to make a comparison. Max partner takes a more direct approach. He decided to just go knock on the guy's door and talk to him. He was very cooperative with them, submitted his DNA, which ultimately led to him being cleared. And he was no longer the focus of any investigation. Over the years, investigators routinely check their DNA profile of the suspect to see if there is a match in the national database.

There's no hit. The identity of Jane Doe also remains a mystery. We have a suspect that's unidentified. We have a suspect that's unidentified. We have a victim that's unidentified. And hopefully one will lead to the other. By 2011, a new DNA technique emerges that gives investigators hope. Familial searching and genetic genealogy are avenues for DNA investigation. Genetic genealogy is the use of DNA testing to assist in identifying blood relatives. The more DNA you have in common, the closer related you are. They begin by looking for

Jane Doe's relatives. You're looking for a first degree relative, a father, a brother, or a son, and that's the way familial works. Compared to basic DNA testing, the Familia method requires a relatively higher amount of high quality DNA. The technology that's used for genetic genealogy is called SNP technology. It stands for single nucleotide polymorphism. So when a SNP profile is developed, they look at over 100,000 of these single points

on your DNA. So you can look at genetic traits, disease risk, ancestry, it says everything about a person. We wanted to do a SNP testing, but we needed a lot of DNA for it to work. We had a lot of the suspect DNA remaining from her sexual assault kit, but Jane Doe was a little bit bigger of a problem.

There was not enough DNA material from the victim to send out for a SNIPPLE profile. In March 2019, nearly 51 years after Jane Doe's murder, investigators seek out another source for Jane Doe's DNA in order to finally determine her identity. So the next stop was to see if we can get it directly from her body. And we thought, well, we could exhume the body, but it's going to be a long shot. The more time you let pass, the more degraded the body and the skeleton is going to be.

But we thought it was our only option. So we got to the cemetery. We saw that she was buried in a wooden coffin and it was just reduced to splinters and her skeleton was exposed. I was a little bit disappointed to see the condition of the skeleton, but we were able to use her femurs to send out for testing. Testing skeletonized tissue is a very time-consuming

process. So after it was submitted to the laboratories, we were just waiting. As detectives await the results, they look for a familial link to the killer. We sent suspect DNA out for a SNP profile, which was then uploaded into the Family Tree DNA database. They discover several matches that could lead them to their suspect. You get a candidate list of potential relatives to your suspect. Now you have to start building trees. So we had all these trees printed out, huge legal-sized paper taped together in big sheets.

So we found the common thread of a marriage in the family that produced four sons. They're all second cousins to the relative we found in the database. So they're the right generation and they're about the right age. This is it. We found them.

The killer is one of these four brothers. I got a text from Jody saying, I think it's one of these guys. I was excited. Now we had to methodically decide which of the brothers it potentially could be. It was imperative to do whatever we could to obtain DNA samples from each of the brothers. The test results show that the killer is almost certainly Larry, Danny, Michael, or Johnny Crisco. The four males, they all had some connection to California in the 1960s. So the first process was looking at criminal histories, and you're obviously looking at

the age that they would be at the time of the murder. You know, are they alive? Are they deceased? And unfortunately there was only one living brother and there were three that were deceased. The first thought is, you know, how are we gonna get DNA evidence from deceased potential suspects? Do they have any children that we might be able to obtain DNA? Or is there an autopsy that might have some tissue samples? It was a daunting task. You just play the hand of the card you're dealt.

So you have one living suspect and you have three deceased suspects. What do you do? And you develop a game plan to figure out which one it is. Detective Deer King looks for a way to get a DNA sample from Danny Crisco, the only brother still living in 2019. He starts by staking out the man's home. There was this three-day surveillance and ultimately we got trash outside the house and ran it back to the Orange County DA's office who have this rapid instrument and then at three in the morning I get a call from my

supervisor and said it's not the suspect. The living brother was eliminated as a potential suspect and now we knew that one of the three deceased brothers had to be the killer. There was only one brother that had an autopsy. We were able to secure those tissue samples, and that eliminated him. Investigators learned the third brother, Michael, was stationed in Vietnam at the time of Jane Doe's murder. So he's crossed off the suspect list.

And that left the last brother. Johnny Krisco had to be the killer of Jane Doe. We were able to get archived microfilmed copies of his criminal history. He had a whole wide variety of different arrests from minor traffic stuff all the way to mayhem and child molestation. He was arrested at age 16 for morals

or a statutory rape charge. Also, he was married three times and he was living in Orange County for over a year, which would have been through the time of the homicide. But we had to have concrete proof. And so our thought was, how can we get a DNA sample from him? He's been cremated.

There was not an autopsy, but he did have cancer. And we found that he had a medical procedure in 2007 and there was a biopsy taken. We called the hospital and the hospital administrator said we shouldn't have any samples for him. We don't keep samples this long. And we asked, please just go and look. And she called back and said, oh my gosh, we have a sample for this guy. Yep, you can have it. DNA testing biopsy samples is actually very complicated. They're preserved in formaldehyde and then placed in a paraffin wax.

So it was another challenge that our lab had to go through. Technicians succeed in extracting stable, high-quality DNA from the biopsy tissue. And using that, we were able to develop a profile that matched our crime scene. Finally, after 52 years, we have a name of the person that killed this unnamed victim. So obviously, the question that we were looking into is where did Johnny meet the victim? We made it to the finish line. We were able to identify

Jane Doe's killer and it's exciting. We know who committed this murder. Create an Oasis with Thuma, a modern design company that specializes in furniture and home goods. I just received my Thuma bed and I absolutely love it. I'm getting more interested in filling my home with intentional quality pieces that will last a lifetime and that includes my new solid wood bed from Thuma. So not only is it the most gorgeous bed I've ever gotten, but it might be the last. By stripping away everything but the essential, Thuma. So not only is it the most gorgeous bed I've ever gotten, but it might be the last. By stripping away everything but the essential, Thuma makes elevated beds with premium materials and intentional details. Thuma has mastered the perfect balance of form, craftsmanship,

and functionality. With over 17,000 five-star reviews, their bed collection proves that simplicity truly is the ultimate form of sophistication. What sets Thuma apart is their use of Japanese joinery techniques. Each piece is crafted from solid wood and precision cut, creating a silent stable foundation that's built to last. An assembly just takes five-ish minutes with no tools required, just one hand-tightened screw. This was seriously the easiest assembly I've ever had. If you've ever had to put together a traditional bed, you know about the endless tiny screws and the hours of frustration, which is not the most relaxing. Not only does it assemble in a snap, but it's just as easy to disassemble so your bed can move with you anywhere. Thuma's commitment to quality doesn't stop there. Their beds are Green Guard Gold certified for cleaner indoor air and they come with a lifetime

warranty. With clean lines, subtle curves, and a minimalist style, the Thuma bed collection is available in four signature finishes to match any design aesthetic. You can even add a customized headboard upgrade. Whether you're renovating or redesigning, Thuma has you covered. Transform your bedroom into a serene retreat with Thuma, where simplicity meets sophistication. To get $100 towards your first bed purchase, go to thuma.co.co.uk. That's t-h-u-m-a dot c-o slash cold case to receive $100 off your first bed purchase. Further investigation places Johnny Crisco in the vicinity of the crime back in 1968. And there was a history of him working at bars as bouncers.

So we thought maybe he had worked at that bar as a bouncer and she went in to have a good time. Having identified the killer, the team turns back to unraveling the mystery of Jane Doe. They finally hear back from the lab about the victim's femur. They were unable to get successful results from the femur. The DNA was very degraded. And so now everybody was round-tabling, well, what else can we do?

And then I think it was Jody who said, hey, why don't we just reprocess her blouse? We were always told that with all the testing over time, all the blood off of her blouse was consumed, and it wasn't an option for DNA. But we want to know for sure. Fortunately, the sample has been refrigerated for 33 years, and investigators submit the decades-old blouse

for DNA testing. So we were able to get a usable quantity of DNA that we could send out for SNP processing and we received a match list of genetically connected people to our Jane Doe victim and we started the process of building the trees. They find the names of a handful of individuals who could have been related to Jane Doe. Then they search old newspaper obituaries from all over the country, looking for those names. What they find breaks open the case.

Constance Pateau was her name. She died in 2016. The obituary listed one of her siblings as missing since 1970, and her name was Anita. 1970's good, but we're missing someone from 1968. But the decision was made that night to attempt to contact some of these family members to see if that was a viable lead or not.

In June 2020, back in Maine, Anita's sister Ann gets a phone call from Detective Deer King. It would have been 930 on the East Coast. We made a round of calls and talked with Ann. She immediately told us that Anita was missing from 1968. And at that moment, it was like, oh, my gosh, this looks like it's the real deal. Our victim was Anita.

It was a surreal, exciting moment for everybody connected to the case. I was working and I kept getting a phone call from my aunt Anne. So I answered and she was like, I got a call from a detective in Huntington Beach, California last night. They think they have Anita, and I was shocked. She's crying, I'm crying. I really never thought that I would ever know what happened to her. And then we sent some photographs to show the person

that we were trying to identify, and they said 100 million times that was their sister. It was very overwhelming when we got the news, and we were trying to get as much information as we could as to what happened to her. It was heartbreaking to know that she was killed that way. For him to do that to her and leave her there in a ditch, that was hard. The family also has to come to terms with the fact that Johnny Crisco will never face justice.

I wish he would have paid for what he did, but I think it was justice in the end. He died of a tumor in his throat that blocked his airway. He slit the throat of a woman and then later died with a tumor in his throat. We felt it was a little bit of karmic justice if you can have that in this case. 52 years after the body of Jane Doe was found in Huntington Beach, Anita's family finally holds a memorial service

in her honor. It was really heartwarming. We are really glad that she's back with us. We had the place crying. It was just something that we never thought we'd see this day. I elected to travel with her remains to the memorial service. And it was extremely special to not only me,

but to the family and to see the closure and to meet these people that were 3,000 miles away. I just want everybody to remember her as this fun-loving woman. She didn't have the chance to really live her life because it was taken from her, but she was finally found and brought back to us. And that's all we really wanted.

She's here. Hey moms, have you ever felt like there's more to motherhood than what we're told? Then you need to check out our podcast, Moms Ask Why. Hosted by Chelsea Jules and Brittany Whitney, Moms Ask Why dives deep into the tough questions surrounding motherhood. Our mission? To educate, inspire, and empower moms like you to take charge of your children's health. With real talk, expert insight, and actionable advice, this is the podcast every mom needs in her playlist.

Because sometimes the best way to be a great mom is to ask why. Follow, rate, and review Moms Ask Why now on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen to your podcasts.