Cold Case Files - I SURVIVED: Somebody's Trying to Kill my Brother

Episode Date: January 20, 2024

In August of 1978, 14-year-old Lisa Gilbert and her 13-year-old brother, Randy, were attacked by a stranger in their newly built home in Lansing, Michigan. A good samaritan helped catch their attacker but started a years-long struggle to keep him behind bars.Progressive: Multitask right now. Quote your car insurance at Progressive.com to join the over 28 million drivers who trust Progressive. 

An A&E original podcast. This episode contains descriptions of sexual assault and violence. Listener discretion is advised. As a 13-year-old, you don't even think of things like this. You didn't see this kind of stuff on TV back then. You didn't hear about this in the news. No, I don't think any 13-year-old could ever think that something like this would happen. In August of 1978, 13-year-old Randy Gilbert and his 14-year-old sister Lisa were

living in a newly built home with their dad and stepmom in Lansing, Michigan. What I was like as a 14-year-old was just an average teenage girl on a summer break from high school. I didn't have a whole lot of friends that lived in the vicinity of the house so I was pretty much to myself. I like to sit and watch tv or listen to music. My parents had just recently gone through a divorce. There's six of us kids. I'm the youngest of six. Us kids were split up through the court system. My father remarried. I wasn't where I really wanted to be. Made the best of it. It was just Lisa, my sister, and I that went with my father to a new school district,

new town, new home, new stepmother. It was tough. It was tough. But, you know, didn't know any better at the time. You know, he just kind of went with it. Lisa and Randy were on summer break. Both of their parents worked during the day, but the kids were old enough to stay home by themselves. Back in August 16th of 1978, I started out my day.

We always start our day is to call our stepmom, let her know that we're up, and then we go about our business, do whatever we want to do, whether it's chores, if we had laundry to do, watch TV, listen to the radio. On August 16th, Randy was grounded, and at 3 o'clock in the afternoon, we were to call our stepmom and to check in for the day. She'd ask, you got your chores done? Yes, we got our chores done. And then she'd be home a little bit after 5.30.

August 16, 1978, I was out just doing my thing, exploring. I knew it was getting close to that 3 o'clock check-in time. Didn't wear a watch, didn't really know what time it was or whatnot. I went out around the side of the house to call him to come home because I wanted him right beside me when I called my stepmom. Because, of course, he was grounded, and I just wanted to make sure he was there in case she said, okay, well, where's Randy? Then I'm not lying to her, so he's right there.

When I came back around the house, there was a car in the driveway, and so I proceeded to go through the garage, and this gentleman was standing inside the door, inside the door that goes into the house, and he says, is your dad home? And I said, no, he's working right now. And he says, okay, so what time will he be home? I said, quarter after six. Well, with us just previously building this house, I thought that maybe it was a construction worker coming to repair something.

So it just really didn't phase me that this was a bad person. So he says, do you have a phone number that I can get a hold of your dad? And I said, yeah, I can go get a paper and pencil. So I walked in the back, back into the door that went into the kitchen and I proceeded to open up the drawer to get a piece of paper and pencil. And that's when he came around to the right side of me and held a knife at my throat and said, don't say anything, don't scream. If you don't say anything, you won't get hurt. This is I Survived, the podcast where we talk to people who've lived through the worst things imaginable. And all the tragic, messy messy and wonderful things that happen after survival I'm Caitlin van Maal

the first thing that went through my mind when this first happened is now I know why my stepmom wants us to call at 3 o'clock every day I've never felt it's hard to describe how you felt, you know, especially for a 14-year-old. You're not expecting something like this to happen to you for number one. But then number two is like you were never taught how to get out of a situation like that.

So then after that, he proceeded to take me into my dad and my stepmom's bedroom, which was on the first floor. He gathered up knee highs. Back then, we used to wear knee highs. Knee highs and ties. My dad was a car salesman, so he had neck ties. So he gathered some of that up, and so then he shoved a whole bunch of knee highs in my mouth and put a tie around it. He took my arm or my hands and tied them behind my back,

and then he tied my feet. But before he tied my feet, he had proceeded to take off all my clothes, and then he raped me. And then I was on my stomach, and, you know, he would rub my back, and then I wasn't thinking too much of it because I was just basically thinking in the survival mode, you know, of, like, how am I getting, you know, what's next?

I need to stay alive, okay? Then he took the belt off my shorts and started to strangle me. Well, the belt broke, and so then after that, he was behind me. He's still sitting on my back, and he took his hands, and he strangled me. Well, I got to the point where I blacked out, and I saw like little teeny, you know, stars and stuff. And then that's when my brother walked in the back door. You know, and if it would have been 20 seconds, 30 seconds more, I would have been dead if he didn't walk in. Lisa heard the screen door slam shut and knew Randy had come home.

Randy, completely oblivious to what was going on inside the house, was coming in from the pond and didn't notice anything unusual. When I came around to the front of the house, I noticed a car in our driveway. At the time, I just thought, because it was a new house that we had just built, we have had people coming in, fixing things, repairing things. That has happened a few times. I just assumed that's what it was. So that day, I just noticed the car in the drive, walked in the house through the garage,

and the house was just really, really quiet. I didn't hear any workers, didn't see anybody. So I was just kind of walking around the house a little bit. And I saw a guy come out of my father's bedroom, which was by the main entrance of the house. And the guy looked at me, said, hi, how you doing? And I just was kind of froze standing there, and I said, I'm fine. And he walked in front of me and kind of quickly turned around and grabbed me from behind and put a knife to my throat. He was bigger than I was. I was a little guy, you know, a scrownwny little 13-year-old boy that was pretty skinny.

He was an adult, you know, and I was a kid. And, of course, kind of being scared and in shock of what was happening, he says, I'm not going to hurt you. And I believed him. And he asked me where my bedroom was. I told him it was upstairs, which we asked me where my bedroom was. I told him it was upstairs, which we were real close to the stairs, and he said, you know, take me to it, as he's holding me with a knife to my throat. So, of course, led him upstairs, getting to the top of the stairs, started feeling really, really uncomfortable, like, you know, this isn't right,

this shouldn't be happening, you know. I started to struggle a little bit bit and we entered my bedroom he put me down on the floor sat on my back held my arm behind my back one of my arms and at that time I felt him as you can describe it as sawing at my neck with a knife, cutting at my neck, slicing my neck. At that point, I had a free hand, and somehow I was able to grab the blade of the knife at my neck, and somehow I got it out of his hand. And I remember throwing it to my right,

and there being a bed there, I believe it went under the bed. It was when he picked me, you know, not picked me up, but I was still on the ground, he lifted my, put both of his hands around my neck and was strangling me to where I couldn't breathe. I thought of just giving up, just play dead, pretend I'm going to close my eyes and pretend I'm dead and maybe he'll leave me alone. But I wasn't pretending.

I had no control over that. And I was unconscious at that point. While I was passed out, he recovered the knife, and then he stabbed me twice in the chest. One stab wound punctured my lung, and as I heard one of the doctors say, the other stab wound actually kind of scratched my heart. It was that close.

The man left Randy, thinking he was dead. Downstairs, Lisa was returning to consciousness. She didn't know where the man or her brother were, or what had happened upstairs. She got up and went to the bathroom to hide. I started out with just thinking, just be quiet and he won't find me. I had pulled

the laundry basket in in front of me. But then when I heard my brother scream, that's when I thought, well, this could be the time I could get out and get some help. And so I basically got, you know, crawled out, like I said, still with my hands tied behind my back, and then went to the front door and opened up the door with my hands still tied behind back, and then went to the front door and opened up the door with my hands still tied behind my back and just proceeded to run like the dickens out to the street, screaming, somebody's trying to kill my brother, somebody's trying to kill my brother.

You know, I was hysterical. I was still fully naked, hands tied behind my back, the necktie around my neck, and blood coming out of my nose because of when he strangled me. I stepped in front of the, by the first car, and he just like, I shouldn't say he, I don't know if it, to this day,

I don't know if it was a male or a female, slowed down and then went around me and then continued going down the road. And I said, I'll be damned if the next one's gonna get by me. So I jumped in front of the truck and he said, I'll be damned if the next one's going to get by me. So I jumped in front of the truck, and he stopped, but he saw me prior and was slowing down anyways. But then that's when I ran over to the driver's side

and proceeded to tell him, you know, hey, somebody's trying to kill my brother, somebody's trying to kill my brother in the house. And then he just automatically said okay and then went and pulled in the driveway. As James Regan, the man in the truck, pulled his car into the driveway, their attacker was leaving the house.

Donald Miller got in the car and he took off out around the driveway, which we had a basketball hoop, and he drove around and that was all dirt. Jim kept repeating the license plate number because he did not want to forget it. Even when he went into the house to see, to find my brother or do whatever, he kept repeating it then and then in between he would ask Randy questions like, you know, are you okay? Lay down, relax, ambulance and

the police are coming and then he started repeating it again. So it was like, you know, are you okay? Lay down, relax, ambulance and the police are coming. And then he started repeating it again. So it was like, you know, he tried to tend to Randy and then just kept repeating it because he said he didn't want to forget it. Their attacker had left Randy for dead. But Randy had survived having his throat cut and being stabbed several times.

When I woke up, I looked down at my chest, and blood was oozing out of my chest. At that moment, I'm like, I didn't know what happened then. I was covered, and my whole torso was covered in blood, and I just ran out of my room. And the upstairs had two bedrooms. It was my bedroom and my sister's bedroom, and then just ran out of my room. And the upstairs had two bedrooms. It was my bedroom and my sister's bedroom, and then we had a bathroom in between.

We used to have a telephone, a landline, in that bathroom, and I remember going to the phone and picking up the phone, hitting zero, zero, trying to get something, but the phone was dead. I couldn't get anything. So I ran downstairs and went right for the front door to get out of the house. And once I got to the front door,

I opened the front door and there was another man standing there. And he said something to the fax, oh my God, lay down, lay down, you're bleeding or something like that. So I remember laying down just kind of in the doorway. And the next thing I knew, another gentleman come up. And it was Kenny Dorn, our fire chief, who I knew personally.

And he said something to the fact that, oh my God, Randy, what have you done now? Or what has happened to you now? And when I saw Kenny Dorn, I knew I was safe. I knew that, you know, this other guy wasn't a bad guy. I was safe. And I believe I collapsed again at that point. I Survived is brought to you by Progressive Insurance. Most of you listening right now are probably multitasking.

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Multitask right now. Quote your car insurance at Progressive.com to join the over 28 million drivers who trust Progressive. Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and Affiliates. National average 12-month savings of $744 by new customers surveyed who saved with Progressive between June 2022 and May 2023. Potential savings will vary. Discounts not available in all states and situations. In addition to James Reagan, Delta Township Fire Chief Kenneth Doran was driving by the Gilberts' home and called an ambulance. It didn't take long for more people to stop, and a neighbor was able to give Lisa some clothes. She had clothes in the back seat on the floor or whatever, so they put clothes on me until, you know, I got to the emergency. But then we got into the ambulance, and that's all I kept saying is,

is my brother going to die? Is my brother going to saying is is my brother gonna die is my brother gonna die is my brother gonna die and I just remember him laying on the gurney and just picking his head up and saying I'm okay sis I'm okay sis and the very next thing I knew I was in an ambulance and that's where I heard my sister for the first time I hadn't known I didn't know she was even home. I never saw her. I never heard her. I didn't know anything about what had happened to Lisa, but I knew she was in the ambulance and crying out for me because of what had happened to me.

But I didn't know anything happened to her. At the hospital, Lisa went one way and Randy went another. And then we went to the hospital, and they had to do all kinds of tests on me. And he immediately went into surgery because he had been stabbed twice in the neck and one inch from the heart. And so he was immediately into surgery and then I was in a

room where they had, like I said, do all the testing. And then they called in Officer Kina, which was a female officer. And she had been there just like briefly under a year. And I was going to take a vacation. And they said, no, no, we need you. So she came into the emergency room, and she was with me from day one. I stayed overnight just to make sure that everything was okay with me. All my tests came back and everything like that. But they just wanted her with me

because they had to take pictures of me where I had strangle marks around my neck from him strangling me. When he did strangle me, it broke all the blood vessels in my eyes, so all the white parts in my eyes were, like, red. And he had proceeded to leave hickeys on my breast, and my inner thighs were bruised. Around the ankles had some bruises where he had tied them, you know,

and then they came loose and everything. And, of course, around my wrist and stuff where I, my hands were tied. Denise, like I said, Denise Kino was with me from day one and she's with me till this day. If I ever need her for anything, she's there for me. She's like a second mom to me. While Randy was being treated for his injuries, he found out what their attacker had done to his sister before he came into the house. When I was in the hospital, I had hundreds of people, it seemed like, coming in and out, doctors, police officials,

and so many people came in. But I remember when my sister walked in for the first time and I saw her and I could see her eyes were like pure red and she looked like something had happened to her. And that's when I found out what had happened to Lisa, was after we were at the hospital. Pretty tragic day. Something I relive.

Something I relive every day of my life. But we survived it. Like Lisa, Randy also had an officer assigned to him that helped him through everything. Eaton County, I want to say they kind of assigned an officer, a female officer to Lisa after this incident and a male officer to me. And they would check in on us all the time because they're still after this. We were still home alone at times. These officers would stop by not only on duty but off duty. And for Lisa, it was Officer Denise Keena who really, really helped her.

And for me, an officer, Dave Bankhead, would stop by even, like I said, off duty, hey, you want to, I'm going up here to this store or something, you know, you want to ride along? And they were sort of like a victim's advocate, I guess, that they really didn't have back then. And they made us feel safe again. James Reagan, the man who first stopped to help Randy and Lisa, was able to tell police the exact license plate number of the attacker's car. It belonged to Donald Miller. He was arrested later that day. That's what I was told is he was caught at 530 that afternoon on August 16th, 1978.

The man that attacked my brother and I was, I called him Donald G. Miller. He doesn't like to be called Donald. But like I said to the people here, he lost his privilege with me. He wants to be called Don G. Miller. I was happy because I was scared that if he didn't get caught, that he'd come back and get us. He would find us and finish us off, you know? Donald Miller had already been suspected in the disappearance of his fiancée, Martha Sue Young, in 1977, but that case had gone cold. There were several other

disappearances in the area that police thought were connected, Marita Chuket, Wendy Bush, and Christine Stewart. When Miller was arrested for attacking Lisa and Randy, police immediately started to investigate him for the disappearances. They had little hope the women were still alive, but at that point, only Marita Chuket's body had been found. I have learned that Don Miller may be responsible for multiple murders. Probably hard for a 13-year-old to comprehend all that at the time.

But I remember feeling that, oh my God, this guy was really, really horrible. He really did bad things, not just to my sister and to me this just wasn't something that happened to just us you know this this guy's a really bad guy and and they caught him and I was very thankful for that a lot of the details were I think Lisa and I were both protected of over the lot of the legal stuff and and the bad bad stuff I think we were protected by a lot of the legal stuff and the bad, bad stuff. I think we were protected by a lot of it and weren't told a lot of things and such. While police were investigating his involvement

in the suspected murders, Miller went to trial for attacking Lisa and Randy. The trial for Donald Miller started probably less than a year. I think it was in May of 1979 and we did it out of town so he, so we could all have a fair trial. I do remember the trial. I remember having to go to the courtroom and I had to identify him. I remember that being very scary Even though I knew I was in a safe place I was surrounded by safe people But I recall the first time I saw him when I had to identify him in court that I was I was angry

First of all, I was mad because he was wearing a suit and I didn't think he deserved that But I had to point him out of a room of people and describe what he was wearing. And I had to look at him again. And that was tough to take. Again, I was a young teenager that this just happened to. And I guess I hoped I'd never have to see him again. That was what I thought.

I was afraid that he was going to get up and come after me sitting in the witness stand. I tried not to look at him. Once I identified him, I was removed from the courtroom and I believe my sister was as well after she identified him. We were protected. We didn't sit in and listen to the whole trial. When it was our turn to speak, our turn to testify, we were brought into the courtroom, went directly to the stand, answered a bazillion questions, and then when we were done, dismissed or excused, we were taken out of the courtroom.

That's all we were, I don't want to say allowed to see, but again, I think it was for our protection. We didn't need to see all the details, what had happened. Donald Miller was convicted for attacking Randy and Lisa and sentenced to 30 to 50 years in prison. When he was convicted of 30 to 50 years, I felt, thank God, I'm never going to have to see this guy again. It felt like a lifetime.

It seemed like this is a lifetime for me. He's put away forever. He could have given him a life sentence. I would have known the difference. That's how I felt. I could put this behind me. So I thought, you know, he's going to be put away forever. It seemed like forever.

It sounded like forever. Police were still looking into Miller's involvement in the four suspected murders. Only the body of Marita Chiquette had been found. The other three were still missing. According to the Lansing State Journal, if prosecutors had gone ahead with the cases and actually won a conviction for any or all four cases, which was a long shot, his sentence would run concurrently to the 30 to 50 years he was

already serving. It wouldn't add a day to his sentence. So in exchange for telling police where he put the three missing bodies, Miller was allowed to plead guilty to his sentence. So in exchange for telling police where he put the three missing bodies, Miller was allowed to plead guilty to manslaughter. He was a horrible person and he always will be a horrible person. That's just who he is. The plea bargain deal that was struck, and I don't know all the legal, you know, it's just from what I know is from what I picked up, there were four other victims, and they didn't have all the bodies of the victims. And back then, back in the late 70s, you know, we didn't have DNA. We didn't have the technology to solve crimes like they have today.

So it was more difficult, and I get that. But he got a plea bargain deal for admitting, showing where the other bodies were, and I believe that deal was struck for the other families to be able to move on or be able to put it to rest. I get that, but I don't think they thought back when they made this plea deal. They didn't think about today. They didn't think about right now. It was kind of tough to take. I don't understand how you can give somebody a break

that has done such horrible, horrific things to human beings. I get it for a prisoner that might have done a B and E or a third time DUI. They can be rehabilitated. I get the rules for people like that. But for a serial killer, the things that he's done, I just don't, I can't understand the plea bargain and the breaks that he has gotten. After the trial was over, it was hard for Lisa and Randy to go back to their normal lives as teenagers.

I feel that I was just, I want to say I feel that I was kind of robbed of a normal childhood, but I really don't know what a normal childhood would have been. I mean, I know it's not a normal circumstance, but I've had to learn to deal with this. I've, school for an example, after this, my grades were horrible. I couldn't concentrate in school. I was always distracted with this from just the thoughts in my head to the people that,

the kids in the school that, you know, we didn't get picked on, but we got the, oh, there's that boy, or oh, there's that girl. And I guess that kind of goes back into the trust issues, you know, when I made friends, do they, are they my friends out of pity? Are they really my friends? Are they just, you know, everybody looking at you, everybody knowing what happened to you? And it was tough. I wasn't happy after that day. Trying to get through high school, people used to make fun of me and make their comments. And I had one particular friend that would always stand beside me

and tell everybody to shut up, be quiet, don't pick on her. It wasn't her fault, you know, that kind of thing. So he's always been my best friend ever since then. Randy and Lisa were and still are very close, but still have never fully talked about that day. My sister and I never really sat down and discussed things. I know what happened to her now. She knows what happened to me,

but we've never really sat down and discussed our real feelings about that day. Most of that, I think, is my fault that I can't deal with it. She's always been pretty open to wanting to talk about it or if I'm ever ready to talk about it but I haven't been able to. We were still young. A lot of stuff was kept from us, you know, hush-hush. They basically treated it like, you know, pick up the rug, shove it underneath it and put it back down. It's okay. It's done and over with, you know, type of thing. So it never got brought up a lot except for when we, you know, we're going

to court and stuff like that. But after court, you know, it's done and over. Let's not talk about it. But Lisa did want to talk about it. And she found it healing to share her story. Where I feel at talking about it is a healing process. And maybe that's why I'm so strong now is because I've gone to a support group. In fact, it was the support group that Martha Sue Young's mother started just after she disappeared. So it was, I went to that for a while and that helped a great deal. Just to stay strong. I mean, that's why I wanted to do these shows is because it can happen to anybody.

Because I didn't think it was going to happen to me. That's the last thing on my mind. 14-year-old, summer school, sitting home, cranking the music and, you know, just sitting there enjoying my summer. And this is the last thing I thought would happen. In 1997, two years before Miller would have his first parole hearing, a group of victims' family members and officials, including prosecutors from two different different counties was formed.

They were called the Committee for Community Awareness and Protection, and their mission was to keep Miller in prison. While researching how to keep him behind bars, they discovered a record of Miller having a garrotte in his cell, a strangling device made out of a shoelace and long buttons that act as handles, and made sure he was prosecuted for the weapon. He would have served his sentence by now. He would have been out of jail by now if it wasn't for a weapons charge. He had made a weapon in prison, a garrotte choking device, which he used on all of the victims. He didn't use a device on me. He used his bare hands. He used a device on my sister and the other four.

For somebody who's in prison for what they have done and is still in their mind constructing a weapon, that says a lot. We were able to bring him up on charges for that, and that is why he's in prison today. He's not in prison today for murdering four women. He's not in prison today for what he did to my sister. He's not in prison today for what he did to me.

He's in prison today only on a weapons charge. And I don't think a lot of people know that. Today, Randy now has kids of his own, and the attack has made him very protective over them. I have shared, not in detail, I kind of left that up to them. They know what happened. I kind of had to fill them in a little bit because I was very protective of them.

Dad, why can't we go do this? Dad, why can't we do this? Dad, why are you always so protective of us? As they got older, I had to explain all that to them. And they totally get it, they understand. I've left it up to them whether or not they want to know details I would tell them I haven't had to do that yet but they're learning now a lot of things that have come up in the past

couple of years they're doing they're learning a lot more about it and they're very supportive they're very understanding. They're very understanding. In 2018, Michigan state legislators passed a bill shortening the time between parole hearings for inmates from five years to one year. It was intended to give prisoners more opportunities for parole, but it was a huge blow to Randy and everyone that doesn't want to see Donald Miller back on the streets. All these parole meetings, you know, I have to assemble a team of supporters. We have to sign letters. We have to meet with the parole board. We have to do a lot of things to fight his parole.

And it takes a lot out of you. It's fortunate that I got the last five years to try to kind of live a normal life for five years, you know, enjoy life, just relax a little bit, but then when we found out about this law change in 2018, here we are back to, I have to do this every year, annually. We did introduce a bill to the legislative committee. Myself, Doug Lloyd, our Eaton County prosecuting attorney, went with me, along with our state representative, Angela Witwer. We submitted this bill that would grant us back the five years for criminals like Don Miller. This isn't designed for every criminal, but for criminals like Don Miller,

we're asking to please give us back that five years. Like I said, I can't fight this every year. I'm getting tired. On March 11, 2022, Michigan Governor Gretchen Whitmer signed a new bill allowing the 10-member parole board to extend the time between parole hearings to up to five years. Randy was there when she signed the bill into law and is grateful he didn't have to fight this on his own. The group of people, Doug Lloyd of Eaton County Prosecuting Attorneys,

he took on Lisa and I, not because it's his job, but he took us on to help us fight this on a personal side as well. He and his team at the Eaton County Prosecutor's Office have made us feel so safe. They have our backs. They're, I can't even put into words. They've given me strength. It was until I met Doug Lloyd

that I really didn't speak publicly about this. I kept a lot of it bottled up. Working with him, Angela Whitwer, our state representative, I've been working with her recently, and it's sort of therapeutic for me, knowing that I have people like them to help in the legal way. That gives me strength. That keeps me going.

I couldn't do it without them. I wouldn't be doing this without them, probably. But they've made it not just their jobs, they've made it personal, and I'm greatly appreciative of that. As things currently stand in his case, Donald Miller is scheduled to be released from prison in 2031. I've had dreams, bad dreams, and they're all about fighting for my life. So it's not, you know, it's never going to go away. But I, like I said, I can't stop my life and live every day, you know, in fear. Oh, if he gets out, then I will be in fear. I will, yeah, more scared than I am now. Because at least I know he's in jail and he's not going to come around.

I play it over in my head a hundred times, you know, like what if the day he's released and I'm in the supermarket and boom, there he is. All these scenarios have gone through my head. They go through my head constantly. What am I going to do? I really don't know what's going to happen, but I do know I'll come out on top. I'm not going to ever let this person hurt me again.

I'm not ever going to let this person hurt my sister again or anybody else for that matter. That's an obligation I have. He's a very sick man. He is, in so many words, a piece of shit to me and will always be that way. And as far as I'm concerned, he can rot in hell. If Don Miller is released,

or I should say when Don Miller is released, he will kill again. This is my opinion. it's what he does, it's what he did. He's still going to be young enough to be dangerous, he's still going to be dangerous. I strongly believe that there's probably going to be a little revenge from him towards me. Today, Randy is a volunteer police officer and bus driver. My life now, middle-aged man, I guess. I have a family, loving family, very good, productive family, children. I drive a school bus part-time, which I absolutely enjoy,

because it gives me my summers off. I have a summer home that I visit and spend some time to try to relax there. I'm on the Sheriff's Department for Eaton County. I am a volunteer. I volunteer all my time, and it's my way of kind of giving back. Eaton County's always been there for me and my sister.

I'm a lieutenant in the VIPS department. That's for volunteering in police services. I was actually, two years ago, volunteer of the year in my department. And I give back to the community that way. I just, it's hard to say what's normal and what's not what I do, you know. I just, day by day, you know, things are good. Things are good. Lisa is also a bus driver. My life now is, I've been married to my husband for 17 years, been together for three years prior to being married.

I am currently a school bus driver. I transport disabled children to and from school. I love my job. I love seeing the different types of disability in kids and how little things can just make their day. We transport any between Down syndrome, autism, they could be blind, they could be in a wheelchair, whatever, but it's just, it just touches me to know that I can make them happy, you know, with their transportation to and from school.

Randy and Lisa are still very close and each credits the other for their survival. I only look at him as a hero because he saved me and he looks at me as a hero because I saved. If it wasn't for him walking in the house, I would have been dead. If it wasn't for me getting out, we both would have been dead.

So we both feel that each other are the heroes, that we ourself are not. Well, I have mixed emotions about that, actually. I believe had I not walked in at that moment, you know, my sister probably wouldn't have survived. But on the other hand, I feel a lot of guilt because I was supposed to be home. You know, I wasn't supposed to be out wandering, doing things. I was supposed to be home. And had I been home, this may not have happened. I've carried that guilt to this day, probably always will.

I'm so thankful that she did survive. I guess I've become a lot more protective of my sister and as I become a, you know, young adult, so when I really started realizing how special she is and how thankful I still have her and I don't take that for granted. We still had our moments as, you know, a brother and sister growing up,

even after this, you know, we still had our battles, but there was always that special connection we have. To speak to someone at the Rape Abuse Incest National Network, call 1-800-656-HOPE or 1-800-656-4673. You can also live chat with someone at RAINN.org. That's R-A-I-N-N dot O-R-G. I Survived is hosted and produced by Caitlin VanMol and Law and Crime Network. Audio editing by Brad Mabee. For A&E, our senior producer is John Thrasher, and our supervising producer is McKamey Lynn. Our executive producers are Jesse Katz, Sean Gottlieb, and Shelley Tatro. This podcast is based on A&E's Emmy-winning TV series,

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