Conan O’Brien Needs A Friend - Billy Eichner Returns

Episode Date: September 26, 2022

Actor and comedian Billy Eichner feels over the moon about being Conan O’Brien’s friend. Billy sits down with Conan once again to discuss making an authentic gay romcom with Bros, taking control of his own career amidst a changing culture, and what he owes to the iconic Joan Rivers. Later, Conan wallows in distress over his wife’s healthy grocery selection.  Got a question for Conan? Call our voicemail: [phone]. For Conan videos, tour dates and more visit TeamCoco.com.

Hi, my name is Billy Eichner and I feel over the goddamn moon about being Conan O'Brien's friend. That's the angriest anyone's ever said that. Wow. How you feeling today? Over the goddamn moon! I am so fucking grateful. Thanks for throwing me a bone. A crumb. Oh.

Hello and welcome to Conan O'Brien Needs a Friend, the never-ending quest to find someone who will meet with me outside of a podcast studio and share a bowl of soup. Everyone in here, have you noticed this? Everybody in here talks a good game. Yeah. That much happens outside the podcast studio. And the times that I reach out, well, let's just say I don't hear much back. Really? There have been a couple of times where you've actually had a thing with the guest like, oh, I'm really going to talk to you and we're going to go out to dinner and that kind of thing.

And those have not happened. Yeah, exactly. And that's something I learned in the old late night game. I'd get fooled because they'd come out, you know, would welcome the guest and the guest would come out, the star would come out and they'd lock eyes with me and smile and embrace me and sit and hang on every word. And those are all the cues that you get in high school when someone really likes you. But I'm in a fake environment. Yeah.

And so afterwards I'd think, you know, it really likes me, Harrison Ford. He thinks I'm the bee's knees. He hung on every word. And then later on when I see him squeezing avocados at a round and I jump out and say, it's me, your old buddy and hug him. Suddenly I'm getting karate chopped in the throat by a rugged leading man. Oh, man. That's not right. Now, some people have said, don't jump out at people and hug them.

Right. Right. Approach quietly and introduce yourself as a grownup. But no, I think the flaw is not with me. Well, you said in the very beginning, you want to share a bowl of soup. So I think that's problematic too. I don't think you should text people and be like, hey, you want to share a bowl of soup. Something that involves slurping and hunched shoulders.

And germs going into the same bowl. It's just, I don't know. You got to get a new approach. Yeah. Why don't you do what everybody else is doing and play pickleball or something? Yeah. You know what? I don't know this pickleball thing.

And I've had people explain it to me. My sister-in-law is deep. And I know that it's become kind of a mania. Yeah. Everyone's playing pickleball. My only question is, do you have to take off your shirt? What? Why?

Well, I know. I saw a photograph somewhere of people playing pickleball and they were all stripped to the waist. Where? Just the fellas. But I thought, well, I can't take off. I think that was hide the pickle. What's that?

I think that was hide the pickle. You always go to the same place. You dirty, dirty man. I just want to make sure that I'm, I always have to be dressed like in a suit. Right. Whatever I play. Oh. A full business suit.

Like a business suit. Yeah. No, I don't know that. I don't know anything about the game. But people go nuts for it. Yeah. Sweeping the nation. Well, it sounds like a room full of non pickleball players.

It's hard to get anything going here. I played it a couple of times. I'm sorry. I mean, I have played it with like my sister-in-law is really into it. And when you get into it, you get into it. I think it's like playing tennis, but it's not as much movement. And so it feels like you're, it's still athletic, but it's not like, it's not tennis. Is it just boomer tennis?

It might be kind of. It's slacker tennis. Yeah. I think it's tennis, but there's no one has to really move or, and at any moment, you can just walk away, but still insist on getting paid. And it's doubles usually. Wait a minute. I switched topics.

It became about the economy. These kids today. This reminds me, and this is just completely random, but you know that Sona used to play dodgeball. Yeah. Yeah. Did we talk about that here? I don't think we did.

I think it was, I think. I only knew about it because of your book. The started post-dodgeball life. When Sona, you know, back in the day, pre-podcast, this is before you met your husband, the wonderful TAC, Sona was in a dodgeball league. And the thing I remember the most is every time I asked her, how did it go, she'd say, oh, I got red carded because she was constantly losing it on people. And this is something that I want to explain because people listen to the podcast

and they've had people come up to me and say, oh, you know, Sona's such a saint that she puts up with your foolishness. Oh, you want to destroy that right now. No, no, no, not destroy it. But people have this idea that, oh, Sona's got a book out that's doing really well. And Sona's this. New York Times bestseller. What they don't...

I'm an author. Really? Is New York Times bestseller really a way to tell how a book's doing? Oh, wait. It says here it's exactly the way to tell how a book's doing. It's actually New York Times, which is a watch store in Times Square. It's on their bestseller list. No, but she's had all this success and she's, you know, she's got her own...

You're probably selling foods now on the internet. No, not doing the least amount of work I can. But anyway, people don't realize that Sona has a terrible temper and it just... When they're... You can hear it snap. Had. You had. Now, did it go away?

Be honest. There's very few people that could bring it out of me and you are one of them. For the most part, I'm pleasant to everybody else, except when... Like this? I'm just putting a finger up to make a point. I know. But you do things and you just like press these little buttons and you know what to do. And I start to see red.

But be honest, would you say that when you would lose your temper, this is before this wonderful life that you have now, you'd really... I go fucking crazy. You go fucking crazy. And I've seen it happen. I never got physical. I never got physical.

I never got into a fight. We've talked about this on the show. I've yelled at a lot of people. Yeah. And you know, yeah. But I think now I've seen her transform. I haven't seen that side of you in quite a while. I do breathing exercises now.

That's serious. I do breathing exercises. And this is for your temper? Yeah. Have your kids seen it? Have they seen mom lose it yet? No, no. I really don't want to lose it in front of them.

Like if I'm on the road and I'm driving and someone cuts me off or like upsets me, I just immediately just start breathing. If someone pisses me off. I've been in the passenger seat with Sona when someone would just slightly cut us off. And what she says, what she always says, which is the clue that she's been triggered is, really?

She goes, really? And then she suddenly your Jean Hackman in the French connection. You're driving about 150 miles an hour through 1970s New York, which is strange. Yeah, she actually changes the time space around us. And you're going under that raised subway that's no longer there.

And yeah, exactly. And she's like, we're here and then we're going. And I'm with her. A national treasure who could be lost in any moment. But anyway, it's horrifying. But you're not that person anymore. I'm not. But can you admit that you do things sometimes

to just rile me up? My guest today is a very funny actor comedian, guys. We got to get going. I know, but you know you do. You know you do. Nope, not at all. You know you do. Nope, he's doing it right now.

He's doing it right now. Maybe a little less Gabby Gabby right now. Oh, go, Sona, go. Unleash. Go. It's like the whole, maybe. Let it out. Maybe you should just.

I think the cones is laughing at you. I think the cones is laughing at you. I'm going to breathe. Maybe a little less Sona talk. That's a breathing exercise. Yeah, I think you're giving birth. You're like a hobo sleeping under an apple tree. Well, that was a good pie I stole.

Oh, you're the worst. You know that you are the worst. You know that you are. That's OK, though. I'm the best at being the worst. My guest today, very funny actor and comedian, you know, from Billy on the Street. Now he stars in the hilarious new movie, Bros,

which he also co-wrote and produced. I'm excited he's here with us today. Billy Eichner, welcome. Billy, first of all, I adore you. And I'm so thrilled that you're here. Thanks for coming on on the podcast. I was like a good boy doing my research today, not that I have to, because I know you so well

and I've been a fan for so long. And this little tidbit comes across my page as I'm scanning through info on you and bio stuff that you were a waiter for a while. And I was thinking, you as a waiter would terrify the shit out of me. I was a terrible waiter. And so I didn't last long.

I waited tables in New York when I was a struggling actor. You know, a lot of my friends were doing that. So they got me a job waiting tables. They were all pretty good at it and I was terrible. And then I remember the manager after one of my first training days, I sat down at the bar and I was just, my brain was fried.

I have so much respect for waiters in Manhattan, especially, I mean, I'm a native New Yorker. I love New York more than anything, but we can be awful, you know, especially, you know, the rich ones. And I mean, that's just the truth. I experienced it. And then I saw, I sat down at the bar at the end of the day

and the manager came up to me, this very nice young woman. And she said, you had a really hard day, huh? You know, because she saw I was struggling. Yeah. Yeah. And I did and I quickly kind of pivoted to being a bartender, which was a much better job. Well, that's the other thing is a surly bartender, there's something cool and edgy about a surly bartender.

And it makes sense to me because you're asking for your alcohol and if they're, they treat you badly, it somehow makes sense to me. Yeah. Well, here's your alcohol. The bartender. The bartender has power. Yes.

You know, like people want that drink. There's only one of you or two of you, so they want your attention. It's kind of, it's a much sexier job. Yes. Tom Cruise and Cocktail. I was just thinking Cocktail because we're the same generation.

And also all I think about is that movie Cocktail. All the time. You know, it was also from that movie Cocktail, Kokomo. Yes. By the Beach Boys. Yeah. We're gonna take it fast and then we'll take it slow. That's where we want to go.

Way down to Coca. The Mewba, Jamaica. All right. Anyway, they all vote for Trump. So fuck them. Oh no. I think most of the Beach Boys are MAGA. Yeah.

The Beach Boys are proud boys would be a fun game to play. Not John Stamos probably. He plays the drums. The Beach Boys, it's the only rock group I've ever gone to see where they were. They all came out and they were wearing blue blazers. By the way, the only rock group you've ever seen is the Beach Boys.

No, no. They had blue blazers. They had blue blazers. And they weren't and I never did go see them. You know, I was painting a little bit of a word picture there. I see. But I think you as a waiter, I just find,

if you came up to my table said, what do you want to hear about the specials? Do you want to hear about them? I'd be so intimidated. So you just tell us what we're going to eat and then I'm going to leave the money and not even eat it. What do you want to beverage, you fucking asshole? What do you need, an extra spoon?

Go fuck yourself. I want to compliment you because you can't. Well, that's all we have. Well, I've been waiting to hear that. But you're not even curious what the compliment is. I love that. No interest. You're just happy it's a compliment.

No, first of all, I've known you a long time, always consistently hilarious. And then you did this podcast way back in June of 2019. So that's like a long time even before COVID. And when you were on that podcast, first of all, you said you had mixed feelings about being my friend, which is fine. I've evolved.

You've evolved. Yes. The culture has evolved. You know, during COVID, I sat around, I did some real soul searching and I said, maybe I am OK with Conan O'Brien existing in the world. Well, so one good thing came out of COVID. Yeah, exactly.

Nobody, on that podcast, you described this project that you were working on. And let me tell you something, everybody does that. I mean, you came on and you said, well, I have this dream, which is you wanted to make this movie. And you wanted me to make a romantic comedy, you know, a gay romantic rom-com. Yeah.

And I thought, OK, yeah. But everybody says they've got a project in mind that's going to be available someday in the future, if all goes well. Right. Here you are now back on the podcast. And you've made the movie and you're promoting. We made the movie.

It is coming out. It's not only coming out. It's coming out in a wide release made by Universal Studios and thousands of theaters all over North America and then, strangely, the world. Right. Except the countries that are homophobic, which is interesting.

Wait. There won't be a Saudi Arabian premiere of my gay rom-com anytime soon. That's where I wanted to see it. Well, I'm sorry. No, I did. I called the Cineplex Odeon in Saudi Arabia and I said I want my ticket to Brose.

No. The Billy Eichner groundbreaking rom-com. You booked the ticket. And they were kept saying it is not available. And I said that's a glitch. No, not a glitch. That's just how it is in certain parts of the world. But I'm happy that it's getting released elsewhere,

where they don't hate gay people. But this is landmark because, first of all, I mean, I want to talk about the whole arc of your career because that's the kind of time we have. Yeah. I've booked six hours for this. I'm going to need more than that, but OK. No, I looked into it.

Six hours will cover it. But I'm very excited for you because your mission statement with this movie was you said you're not interested in depicting a version of queer life that is palatable. And I thought that is so intriguing and fascinating to me. Talk about that a little bit.

Well, Brose, which is the rom-com I have coming out, produced by Judd Apatow, who, as all of you probably know, has made some of the funniest movies of the past 20 years, Bridesmaids and Trainwreck and 40-year-old Virgin. And the list goes on and on. And I wrote it with Nick Stoller. And Nick directed it. And he directed Forgetting Sarah Marshall and Neighbors.

And these guys have a great legacy of making great comedies. And Nick came to me back like five years ago and said, I want my next movie to be a romantic comedy. But I think it would be cool if it was about a gay couple. But he acknowledged that he's not gay. And he asked me if I would write it with him. And I could start it. It all went well.

And he would direct it. And I said, obviously, yes, a huge opportunity, one that I never saw coming in my life. But the first thing I said to Nick is, even before I knew what the story of the movie would be, I said, it has to be authentic. You can't just make when Harry met Sally and think you can just swap in to gay guys

and have the story play out the same way. Because it wouldn't. Because yes, there is a lot of overlap in straight relationships and gay relationships. But also, it is a little different. Two men together is different. And there's a lot of comedy to be mined from that. And also, a lot of poignant moments

and more thought-provoking moments. And it's just a different experience. And I think a lot of the LGBTQ characters we've seen, and we're seeing way more, obviously, than we used to, especially in streaming and in indie films and on the internet, of course. And that's fantastic. That is a wonderful thing.

But so much of it is done with an eye towards making us these cutesy two-dimensional characters that really are nothing like the actual gay men I know in my life. Or like me. I watch a lot of those shows and a lot of those sitcoms. And even when they're very funny, I think, I don't know who those people are.

Those are gay characters designed to not freak out straight people. And I give straight people a lot more credit than that. I have a lot of straight friends. My show, Billy on the Street that I've done for years, has a huge fan base among straight people. Conan, you are theoretically straight. You've always been a fan.

You know what, I go in and out. I don't know what that means. Everyone does now. You find some guys attractive, I think. And you've spoken very openly about it. I'm very open about there are men where I totally get it. And Brad Pitt, I just think that's a really good-looking guy. And then I call him, and it gets weird.

Right, exactly. And then you're, well, I won't go there. But I just did. I went there in my head. But yeah, I just thought, I don't think we're giving straight people enough credit. Funny is funny. If you make a really funny Judd Apatow movie

that happens to be a gay couple, then straight people will love that. And it's not only funny, it's kind of fascinating. Because you're getting a peek into a world, a culture of dating, of love, of sex that you think you might know, but you don't really know. And that was really important to me. I thought that would be exciting and hilarious.

And I'm happy to say so far, when we do early screenings of the movie, a lot of the audience is straight. Most of the world is still straight. And they love it. It's really funny. It's just a fucking funny movie. OK, watch the language.

Why? Because I'm gay. Yes. It's OK when straight people swear. DJ Nova. What? I said every curse word on here. I think I've pretty evolved.

But I still believe that gay people shouldn't swear, but straight people should. Hi, I'm Conan O'Brien. And I just got cancer. Welcome to Newsmax, the new home of Conan O'Brien. The only thing I've carved out is that swearing is only for straight people. No, but is it possible that the first wave of representation

in sitcoms needed to be that way, that there needed to be an evolution, or there needed to be a first wave that was more, I want to just say, user-friendly for people that starting in, I don't know, the late 80s, early 90s. And this is the way it kind of maybe had to lay out, where now we can get the point where you, Billy, can make a movie that really is telling it

from a real point of view, as opposed to, let's water this down. Yeah, I mean, it makes sense. There has been an evolution. And I'm really grateful that when I went to Judd and Nick and I said that I wanted it to be really authentic, it's a Judd Apatow movie. His movies are wild and raunchy and fun,

and also very heartwarming and uplifting. And I just said it once, I wanted it to be all of those things, and there's no reason it shouldn't be. And they said, yeah, let's just go for it. If it's honest, it'll be funny and relatable to everyone. And we're just in a weird industry that made two movies about a talking hedgehog before they made one gay rom-com.

You know what I mean? So I have my own hedgehog movie coming out. No one worried about whether or not Sonic the Hedgehog was relatable. We made 50 movies about dinosaurs, prehistoric, extinct creatures, and we never made one gay rom-com. Nobody said, God, I hope that velociraptor is endearing to straight people.

Good point. So the velociraptor is going to rip off the kid's throat and then shoot acid into his eyes to blind him. No one ever said, is Middle America ready for dinosaurs? But that's the question that lingers over a movie about two actual human beings who walk the earth, meeting and falling in love, and driving each other crazy the way people do.

Thinking right now, because it's something I want to address, is that there's so many people out there that would look at you right now coming out with this movie and having the career that you have that would say, OK, Billy, how do I get where you are? How do I achieve what you've achieved? And one of the things that you've done that I'm a big believer is that you took control.

You know, I went to Northwestern. I was a theater major. You know, I just wanted to be kind of a typical actor. I never even thought of myself as a writer or a comedian. Then I got to New York. I mean, I grew up in New York. And then after college, I went back to New York to start my career, quote unquote.

And you know, there's millions of people trying to be actors. And I realized very early on that if I just stood in line waiting at this open call with hundreds of other actors for like the regional tour of Brigadoon or whatever it was, which I didn't even want to do, although shout out to everyone in the cast of the regional tour of Brigadoon. They're wonderful. I don't want to do what you're doing, but shout out.

I find the way you've spent your life a waste of time. That's not what I said. That is not what I said. But it's just not what I wanted to do. Yes, yeah. I'm never ending purgatory. No, I'm kidding. Please, this is on me now, not on you.

I know. Seriously, I love the current touring cast of Brigadoon. No, I don't know if that's even tour. But I'm not here to talk about Brigadoon. Let me get this straight. So Billy's new movie is called Brigadoon. It's about a magical land. Wait a minute, I got that wrong.

So I basically started to write for myself. And I was good at it. And I had a live stage show that I did in New York, which is where the Billy on the Street video started. I would show those videos on a screen. This is before YouTube even existed. This is like 2004, 2005. But then an interesting thing happened

where a lot of folks in the industry would come and they would acknowledge that I was talented or that they thought I was funny, that the audience was laughing a lot, that I was unique, and this, that, and the other thing. But it was always, you know, we don't know what to do with you. Or you're very New York. And a lot of times in both overt ways and subtle ways,

I was sent the message that I was just too gay. I was being openly gay on stage. I was talking about gay sex. Now everyone's talking about gay sex. But this is 2003, right? This is back when you were losing roles to dinosaurs. Exactly. Dinosaurs were fucking on screen,

but I wasn't allowed to do it. Brontosaurus on stegosaurus was fine. Yeah, that was fine. A lot of fanboys jerking off to that. But two actual humans, I mean, sex, who happened to be meant was alienating. So that message was sent to me many times. But then what happened was the internet came along

and I put my videos online, and after a little while, they went viral and very viral. And I was able to point to all of those people in the industry and say, hey, I'm not to this or to that. This video has millions of views. These views aren't coming exclusively from gay people watching a New York City. Look at the comments.

They're coming from all over the country and all over the world. And that's when they finally put me on TV. I needed those numbers to point to and say, hey, I have proof that I am not this little niche thing that you assume I am because I'm gay. Do you ever think about, let's say, somehow there's a whatever, wrinkle in time

and you're born in the 30s or whatever, you come of age in the 40s or 1950s and you have all the talent and ability you have now. But there's no internet. There's no YouTube. There's no way to you yourself take control. Do you know what you would have become? I don't know.

I think about that all the time. And that weighed really heavily on me during the movie. And if you see the movie, I don't want to give it away, but I do speak to this at one point. I'm 43 years old. So when the movie comes out, I'll be 44. So I'm kind of in this interesting midway point between a generation of LGBTQ people and gay men specifically

who really saw the world change. Like when they grew up, it was such a repressed time. A lot of them probably can't even imagine the world that we live in today. Even though there are still problems and we're still fighting for our rights still. The evolution that has occurred is really remarkable. They lived through the AIDS epidemic.

There's a lot to unpack there. Then you have a younger generation now and you see them all over the place of LGBTQ people and Gen Z queer kids, which is amazing. But they stepped into such a different world, such an evolved, accepting world. And again, a world where thanks to Clarence Thomas and other like fucked up homophobic,

self-loathing weirdos, we're still fighting for our rights and our rights are still very fragile. But again, that generation, a lot to do with the internet, came of age in a time when things were, if not easy, a lot easier. And I'm kind of weirdly perched in between these two generations that have had a very different experience being LGBTQ. And I wanted the movie to speak to that in a way

because we need to acknowledge, and by the way, I'm making the movie sound like fucking out of Africa. First up, it sounds so fucking serious. This is a funny, shut up, it's not a movie, everybody. It's dinosaurs, it's Sonic the Hedgehog, it's everything you want it to be. But just speaking about it seriously for a moment because it is a historic movie,

you do have to acknowledge those generations of people. And Hollywood, especially an industry which has so often padded itself on the back for being progressive and gay-friendly, quote unquote. It's a cliche to say that everyone in Hollywood is gay, that it's this progressive lefty culture. But really, when you look at the actual history of it, just voting for a Democrat doesn't mean

that you are treating LGBTQ people correctly on the day to day. And what you see in Hollywood are generations of actors who were stuck with one of two choices, be incredibly bold and come out of the closet publicly and have your professional dreams disappear. Because Hollywood did not give opportunities to people, they did not believe gay could play straight,

they did not believe gay people, that the majority of the audience wanted to see gay people at all, they made people uncomfortable. If you did get a role, it was horribly stereotypical, you were the butt of the joke, and that was for many years the best you were gonna do. Or you had to live some Rock Hudson style life where if you wanted a big career as a movie star or TV star,

especially if you wanted to play straight roles, which were the only roles that really existed at the time, you had to live this weird double life, pretend you were dating women publicly, and then secretly live your secret gay life that you were not supposed to talk about, that you could go live in some weird gay enclave somewhere when no one was looking, when the cameras weren't on.

And I can only imagine, that's the best those guys could do, that's what they were offered, like those were their choices, but what horrible choices to have to make, right? And now I don't have to make those choices, right? And bros is really a moment to celebrate the fact that we have come a really long way, that the entire movie is made up of openly LGBTQ actors,

the entire cast, it's a first. This movie is a first in many ways, and that's one of them. And that's when you look at the history of it, you know, a 20 year old queer kid now who may not know the history, may say, oh, all right, well, I see gay people everywhere, they're all over my phone, they're all over TV. But if you know the history of Hollywood,

especially major studio filmmaking, that is huge, that is a huge moment. It's very hard, I mean, and also, I think you're making the point, and I would agree that it's impossible to expect someone who's 20 or 22 today to completely understand, because they just haven't lived it. I do get inspired by that generation though,

because I always thought I was very bold and outspoken, but they really push the boundaries, especially when it comes to sex and being very open about it and queer sex and gay sex, and I sometimes see what's posted on Instagram from my younger gay friends, and I'm like, wow, okay. Oh, so suddenly you're the old school mom. No, exactly, woo!

No, I'm like, oh, I don't think that's appropriate. I'm like, Mrs. Garrett, oh. And they're like, 2D and Natalie running wild on roller skates throughout the house, and I'm like, girls, I don't know if this is okay. But it is okay, you're the modern Mrs. Garrett, I love it. I've always wondered, what is Billy?

You're the Mrs. Garrett of our time. That nails it, yeah. You nailed it. IP Charlotte Ray, we both went to Northwestern, by the way, and if only Mrs. Garrett were alive to see bros, put that on the poster. But no, the younger kids, the younger queer kids are inspiring me.

It's like, okay, we can have a few sex scenes in bros and people will embrace that, and it's actually really fun and exciting, and it's okay. We don't have to be scared of that anymore, and I'm happy, I need that push from that generation myself a little bit. You know, you were talking about the beginning, you're meeting all this resistance,

you're making these videos, but you don't know, you know, I certainly have this throughout my 20s. Is this gonna work? Am I gonna make it? Yeah. I had it into my 30s, like, is this gonna gel? Do I have a career?

It's terrifying. And you still really haven't answered that. To be fair, you know, it's like, I have not, and that's how it feels to me all the time. But I know that early on, you did have people that saw something, I know Joan Rivers saw something in you early on, and she really encouraged you, right?

Yeah, yeah, she was the greatest. She, my first real TV job was a pilot for Bravo that did not get picked up, because in 2006, if you were gay and wanted to be on TV, they shipped you off to Bravo. Literally. It was like an LGBTQ orphanage. It was like, oh, you're talented, but you're a gay man.

I'm just fishing and shoving you into a giant FedEx tube, and then putting Bravo on it, and dropping it in the mail. That's literally, and it was so odd, because I was on stage in New York doing this sort of Billy on the Street style persona, which I eventually captured in the videos that we did, but that started on stage,

so it was this very absurdist, subversive thing that I was doing. It was not Bravo, right? But simply because I was gay, they were like, all right, well, maybe Bravo will do something with you. That was always the answer at the time, which is very funny, but also when you think about it kind of fucked up.

I remember pitching a few shows to Comedy Central at the time, and the shows revolved around me, so they would revolve around a gay man. One was a scripted show, one was Billy on the Street, I think, and what was said to my face was, well, you're brilliant, we think you're hilarious. We obviously can't do that here,

but I think if you go to Bravo, you'll have a home run. Like someone said that to my face, thinking that was like a helpful thing. And then years later, he actually apologized for it after I was successful. But, so, I always do award points. I've had people say terrible things to me in the early 90s, and then come back later on,

and admit, own it, and say I was wrong, and then later come back and say I was right. It just keeps coming. And this is my dad, by the way. Oh, it's a vicious cycle. There's the old twist ending. So, this episode was brought to you by Oh Henry. So anyway, so sure enough,

Bravo did put me on a pilot in 2006, and the pilot was called Joan Rivers Straight Talk. And the idea was it was a primetime version of the view, but instead of Barbara Walters and four different types of women, it was gonna be Joan Rivers and four different types of gay men. Talking about pop culture and politics,

a panel show, basically, and they cast me on the pilot, so Joan came to my live show. I auditioned for it, and she really liked me, and then she came to check me out on my live show, and she really just loved what I did. She really got me. And we did that pilot, Andy Cohen was on that pilot

before he had his own show. He was on the panel, Elsie Granderson, who was a sports columnist, I believe, and broadcaster, and another guy. And it didn't get picked up, unfortunately, but it was an amazing experience, and I got close with Andy Cohen, who's still a good friend,

and I got really close with Joan. And she really became a mentor to me. I mean, I could go on and on about how insanely supportive she was for no reason. The pilot didn't get picked up. She had no reason to deal with me, and yet she really was so helpful. Joan, this was a few years before Joan

had her resurgence, if you remember, and Joan had been blacklisted from a lot of the late night talk shows. We know this story, and she hadn't done The Tonight Show in many years, and Letterman hadn't had her on in many years. Just to refresh people's memory, who don't know, it was because she had been a huge star

as a guest on Johnny Carson. A guest host. A guest host, that's what I mean, a guest host. And that was appointment television, when Joan Rivers was gonna host The Tonight Show, and Johnny Carson was taking a break, and we're going way back into the 80s, but it was an event,

because she took the oxygen out of the room, she was so funny, and it was a huge event, and then she went on to do her own show, and that was seen as a betrayal. Yeah, she did one of the first shows on Fox, right when Fox started, she did her own late night show. Johnny wasn't leaving the show, his own show at that point. So Joan, when it did her own show,

and he got extremely mad, and basically had her blacklisted from late night TV for the rest of her career up until, I don't know, like 10 years before she died. And so, she did have a career resurgence though, and Letterman did have her back on, and Fallon had her on The Tonight Show for the first time many years, Kimmel had her on,

and no one knew who I was at that point, and Joan told me, she said, I'm about to do all the late night shows for the first time in decades. Put your Billy on the street videos, put some of your favorite ones on a DVD, and make copies, and leave them at my apartment, and I am going to bring the producers

of all of those shows, your DVD, and tell them you have to know this Billy Eichner guy, watch these videos. She had been blacklisted from late night talk shows, which was so heartbreaking to her for decades, and on her first time back making the rounds, she reached out to me and said, I'm gonna drop off your DVDs

and let these people know who you are. And years later, after she died, when I ended up doing Letterman myself, and doing Kimmel myself, I remember the showrunners at those shows said, you know what's so funny? A few years ago, Joan Rivers was here, and dropped off DVDs of you,

and told us about you before we knew who you were, and which is just an incredible thing to do, it was so generous. Well, it's clearly she, I mean, first of all, this is someone who knew talent. She had, I mean, her own story is so incredible, and what she had to put up with, and what she had to overcome.

There are people who are very passionate about how it should work, and when they see someone who's good, they really feel compelled to get the word out on them, which is a great quality and not always common. I've spent a whole career trying to crush young talent. Yeah, and you have. I've successfully, there's so many,

so many very talented young people that have never made it because of me. That's right. And this was just me feeling insecure, and I don't regret it, it was part of my strategy, and it helped elevate me to crush them. Congratulations. Thank you.

Thank you. You did it. Yeah, so many people, you'll never, ever see them, never know who they are. I tried to crush you many times, remember? Good luck, asshole. Here I am, in spite of you, in spite of you and the blocks of Raptors

and Sonic the Hedgehog and the guy who rents Comedy Central and Verjay Novak, I'm still here. First time I saw Billy on the street, first time I saw Billy on the street, I was like, he's good, a little too good. He must be sought, he must be sought. And remember all those attempts on your life

and you didn't know who was behind it? Yeah, that was you. Well, I'm honored, honestly. I spent hundreds of thousands of dollars. But let's be honest, you have it to spend. Oh my God, I have it. I've read the headlines, Conan. You are rich, my God.

Can we talk about this? Yeah. You were always rich, but now, I think you've bought three countries or something? You are very well. I owned, I inherited a few countries at birth. Okay, and that's just something people should know. As a child, and this is very unusual

in an Irish Catholic family, but I inherited nine islands in Greece. Yeah, and I've been holding on to them and then I sold them. Yeah, you are a very wealthy man. I respect that about you. I was actually thinking this because who says that? I respect. You know, not a big fan of Trump,

but then I found out that he had some money and I do respect that. But you've earned your wealth. He got it from his dad and he's also a horrible person. My father gave me nothing. So, nothing. Nothing. But here's what I wanted was a hug.

Here's what I was going to say. Because there are, you know, there's a question of whether, there's a question of whether, you know, straight people will go seabroos, right? There's like this big question mark hanging over the movie and I really hope straight people do go seabroos because it's really, really funny and we need you to go see it, right?

Because we want to make money at the box office so that people keep making these movies and, you know, we prove to the world that, you know, this is a good thing, we need more of it, that this is a, you know, a worthwhile venture to keep making movies about gay people. But instead of a lot of straight people going, Conan, we could just have you buy one $20 million ticket.

I'll do it to go see it. I'll do it. And that's as much as we need. That's our whole opening week at right now. Yeah, exactly. And Rainforest Wood, that's all it would take. I'll do it, thank you. No, but also, you know, let me reassure you,

first of all, you claim I have all this money, Conan will tell you, I've made some terrible investments. Yeah, you have. Really, really bad investments. I bought up all the VHS machines about eight years ago because I thought that was coming back. I've done some terrible, terrible. I had to loan him a lot of money.

Yeah, she loaned me money. And I'm his assistant. Yeah, yeah, I have, but she has it now because she's got all the money. Off his back. Yeah, and also, you embezzled from me, and you're not even a good embezzler, but I'm so stupid about money that you got away with it.

I told you I was embezzling. Yeah, and I didn't know what that word meant. And that's why she's not in prison, because they said she did tell you she was embezzling. I was like, well, I didn't know what it meant. I love them, but she just had warm, fuzzy feelings. I'm all embezzling about you. But no, I'll tell you, first of all,

Billy, in my opinion, and I believe this passionately, you are funny first. Before I know anything else about you, you're just funny. And in my experience, that is what everyone's hungry for. They're hungry for a movie or a television show or a moment or performance that is funny. You're also a talented actor. And I know I have not seen this film yet,

but I'm going to go see this movie. Thank you. And I know that you are going to be very relatable and this is going to be good, and it's going to be very funny, but also touching in moments. And I think that that is the home run. You're super talented.

Thank you, thank you, thank you. Yeah, no, and it is, it's weird to say about my own movie, but I've now watched a lot of, you know, early audiences at screenings react to it. It is a really fucking funny movie. Like, it is a... Again with the language. It is a...

Well, I'm sorry. A straight person swears. It's okay. I think we've established... Didn't George Carlin say that? I think so, man. I think so, man. I think so, man.

I think so, man. I think so, man. I think so, man. I think so, man. It's so weird. What a weird hill for me to die on. Yeah, only straight people. Everything, you're like, I haven't pissed, yeah.

But just like, you know what? This is one thing I'm not backing down on. After 30 years, this takes you down. Yeah, it's like... I just think only straight people should swear. I don't know why I'm Nixon again, but I believe only straight people should swear. Those are the current topical references

that you listen to this podcast to hear. I meant Cynthia Nixon. That's what I meant. I never said Richard Milhouse, but this is how Cynthia Nixon talks now. Why? Because she's gay. I'm not leaving Conan.

Not all lesbians talk like Richard Nixon, regardless of what you think. Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha. You're tired of that old trope. Exactly. You're so tired of that troll trope that all lesbians talk like Richard Nixon. All lesbians talk like Richard Nixon

and all gay men fuck like LBJ. It's just not true. Ha ha ha ha. It's just not true, no matter what. Halderman wants you to think. Hold him in her up and let's all get in the car and go see Thelma Louise. That's the story for us, boys.

And we'll get back to the water again and get that safe crack. What a strange joke. What a weird, what a weird run. Joke, yeah, what a weird run. You're like, don't worry, Billy, you're relatable. Just like me and my lesbians sound like Richard Nixon material. So relatable.

You're welcome, Middle America. You're the next Jeff Fox word. I'm worried I just hurt bro's. We're going to be like, I don't want to go see that. Nixon's a lesbian in this movie. He's being ranked by a dinosaur? Pat Nixon, Fox Sonic, the Hedgehog, and bro's. That's the first LGBTQ rom-com.

What's happened to Apatow? He's lost his mind. Damn, you know what? This is why your movie is going to be great and you're just going to do well is because you are a man. You were funny in another worldly supernatural way. And it doesn't, that's the thing that I think comes first. That's what you have.

And then you're using it, I think, to tell this story. But you know that rule number one is the work. Oh yeah. And when Nick Stolar and Judd and I sat down and started working on the movie, no one ever thought this is a historic movie. It's the first gay this or the first gay that. We didn't even know at the time.

We just said, what happened to great comedies that make people laugh out loud consistently for an hour and 45 minutes that also move you and or feel good movies? That genre of movie has disappeared. I grew up with all these great romantic comedies, as did Nick and as did Judd. They're straight, I'm gay, but we bonded over our love

for movies like Moonstruck. And when Harry Met Sally and Working Girl and broadcast news, which is like one of my favorite movies ever. Me too. Absolutely. And Tootsie. And they've stopped making those movies about straight people. Forget gay people.

They don't even make that kind of sophisticated, really funny, smart, moving film about straight people anymore. They've never made them about gay people. So in a way, bros, while being historic and very new, because it happens to be about a gay couple, it's also a throwback to those types of romantic comedies, which they simply do not make. And when I watch an audience, watch bros,

that's the experience they're having. And on top of it, it's also unlike anything a lot of people have ever seen because of the LGBTQ of it all. But they're also just realizing, oh, wow, it's so fun to go to a movie theater and be swept away by a movie like that. Are you able to connect with that moment? When you think about all you've been through

and all the years where it wasn't happening and you're out on the street, literally out on the street trying to make it happen. And they're trying to put you into a FedEx envelope to send you to Bravo. And now you're having this moment. Are you able to connect to it? Because isn't it given that you can?

Right. You would understand that. Because I mean, part of being me is that I really care about doing a good job, especially with this movie. Like the pressure is on for me personally. It's my first big movie. But then I also have my whole community waiting to see how I'm going to represent them.

And then I have the industry waiting to see how it's going to do. So there was a lot of pressure. Any movie is a lot of pressure, right? Especially comedy. It's really hard to make a lot of strangers laugh. But this movie had all these other things that were on my mind too.

But you know what? This was such a special rare experience, this movie. And I did think about all those generations of LGBTQ folks in Hollywood who did not get this opportunity, who would just be shocked to see that this was happening. And the fact that I was getting it and this whole cast of openly LGBTQ actors that we were getting this opportunity.

And there was a moment we were filming me and Luke McFarlane. He plays my boyfriend in the movie. And we were filming a scene, this sort of classic New York rom-com walk and talk on Central Park West. And we were filming it. And I thought, this is Tom Hanks and Meg Ryan. This is Woody Allen and Diane Keaton. This is all those movies I grew up watching,

like all those New York rom-coms. But it's about two gay guys. And no one has ever had this experience. It's being produced by the same studio that makes Jurassic World and Fast and the Furious and the same guy who made Bridesmaids and all these movies that I love. And I thought, I literally told myself,

you better fucking pause right now and look around because this is special. Like this is a magical thing. And you get to be a part of it. And you need to take five minutes to stop worrying about it, being good and all the things you want it to be, which is very hard for me. But you need to just live in this moment

because it really, it's very unique. I'm glad you did that. I'm glad you had that moment. And then I screamed at the crew to get back to work. And let me have my magical moment. What are you eating? The moment you get that profiterole. We're not paying for that slap.

The moment is for me, not you. Look, you had me because that was a nice moment, but then you were cruel to people who work for you. I'm sorry. And that is my mantra. Oh, I thought you were going a different direction. Quiet, Sona. I'm speaking.

There we go. OK, that makes sense. No, I didn't do that. I know. We know you didn't do it. And I didn't really ever treat you badly, Sona. Quiet. Please, cut her mic.

And make sure I tell people because we don't even really talk that much on this podcast. We don't. It's funny. It's not like the late night show, where I always end by saying, oh, and here's where you can see. It's it's not really about projects so much.

This I definitely want to get the word out because Bros is in theaters. It's coming September 30th. And only in theaters. Don't be a lazy bitch. You got to get up off your couch. You got to actually leave your house and go to a movie theater to see it.

But I am telling you, that's what makes it an incredible experience. I think we've all convinced ourselves. I did too, especially during COVID, that watching a movie at home is the same. Or maybe even better. I am telling you, I have now sat through all these screenings of Bros at multiplexes all over the country.

We have forgotten how much fun it is to sit in a dark theater with strangers and escape our bleak anxiety-ridden lives and all the horrible headlines and just lose ourselves and laugh for two hours with hundreds of people in a movie theater. Oh, I've, the times recently that I've gone back into a movie theater, I've been ecstatic.

It is. I love it. It is so fun. Yeah. And this movie especially is a really special one to experience. It really is historic. And you know, I really hope everyone checks it out.

Well, they will. I will. I'm looking forward to it. September 30th, which is in just a couple of days. What did you say? Don't be a lazy bitch. I think that's the motto here. Don't be a lazy bitch.

All right, Conan retired, that lazy ass. I didn't retire, I'm talking to you, I'm not at home. That's true. Eating cookies? I want to be, but I'm here getting the word out on Bros. I'm working as hard as I ever did. I want to buy those Greek islands back. I had to sell them.

Hey, it was so strange because sometimes I have this overwhelming impulse. And we've talked about this sooner where I want to tell someone I'm proud of them. And I think that's weird because if I'm proud of somebody, it usually is reserved for, you know, I'm your dad or I was instrumental at the beginning. No, I've famously tried to crush your dreams at every turn.

But I really am. I'm proud of you. You're a very good person. I think you're a really principled creator and you're very talented. Thank you. And you're doing something. Yes, it's important, but your work is also very good.

And so it's an honor to sit with you. Honor to sit with you. And you were all jokes aside, a real early adopter and a real early supporter of mine. And I really have always appreciated it. Oh, thank you. It's funny because we make these jokes and then I can just imagine people thinking,

Conan really tried to have Billy killed. That was such a strange choice. Honestly, I could use the headlines. So lean in. You don't know what I've been through as a gay man. I couldn't get married. I couldn't have children. And then Conan O'Brien tried to assassinate me.

That's the stuff you always had to cut out of Billy on the streets was ninjas attacking you. Yeah, which you should have kept in, by the way, because that was the I thought very funny. Really funny bit. Billy, continued success. Please come back. Thank you.

I love it when you're here. And I'm so happy for you. Thank you so much. Thank you, everyone. Go see bros. I just want your opinion on something. I've been very happily married for a long time now to my lovely wife, Liza.

You've known Liza for a very long time. Gourly you've met Liza. Wonderful. Wonderful person. She's right. And whatever this is, she's right. OK, well, here's my problem. So we grew up differently.

OK, we grew up differently. Oh, yeah. She grew up in a very sensible home. OK? She has one sister. Everything, when you go to their home, it's very sensible. They're lovely people. They're sane.

Everything's just so. And you contrast that with the way that I grew up. And again, I love my parents and my siblings. But there was a lot of us. And when my parents would go to the grocery store, they would, first of all, before we could go with them, they would have to buy a lot of food. And then when we could go, we, of course,

were just terrible rotten kids. And we would just throw, because there's so many grocery carts, because there's so many people in the family. My grandmother lived with us. And we would throw all kinds of crud into the grocery cart that we could process junk food. And my mother would try to weed it all out at the checkout line.

But of course, you can't. It's too much. And she's weeding some of it out, but we're sneaking it back in. And then we get home. And there's literally just awful cheese-flavored puffed up stuff made by, filled with chemicals called dipity-dapity doodoo's. Stuff that they later found out was just chock full of dangerous toxic chemicals.

And it's now in a landfill somewhere. But anyway, so that was the kind of way I grew up. And we were voracious eaters. And still, you've seen me eat, Sona. It's terrifying. It's terrifying. It's like, yeah, you eat like you have siblings looming over you wanting to eat your food.

So anyway, I was the other day, hanging out with Liza. And she just mentioned, she said, yeah, I'm off to the market and get some stuff. And I went, great, great. So I'm just, whatever. As you do, you regress. And I'm getting hungry. And I'm thinking about her coming in with bags and bags

of just food. And I'm forgetting that I married this sensible person. And so I'm imagining there's going to be Doritos and Captain Crunch and just a giant, a giant roast turkey that's got gravy on it already. And there's going to be some Swedish fish. And then there's going to be like three milkshakes and a couple of hamburgers that have been, you know.

Oh my god, you sound like you're high. I'm just, yeah, exactly. This is, she comes in and she's all happy. And I'm like, oh, good. What'd you get? And she said, well, I got some fresh almonds. And I got some blackberries. You know what?

Liza, isn't it right? No, but then I found out in her defense. And so I'm like, what? What? And then I found out that she went to the farmer's market. But still, even if I went to the farmer's market, if I got almonds and blackberries, I would, I don't know, on the way home, I'd stop at a 7-Eleven.

And I'd force them at gunpoint to make me a ham sandwich using pieces of Slim Jim. I would do something to, because I couldn't do it. So now I'm getting really hungry. And she went, oh, it's fine. You know, I see her eating a couple of nuts. And hmm, I'm drinking a little tea with it. And then I'm having my blackberries.

And everything's just, and I know that her parents would be like, oh, yes, good for you. You know, yes. You're so angry. And you know, we, her parents were like, well, there's two of us, so we'll have two children. And that just evens things out. Now we have six almonds for each of you.

Oh, and let's have some tea, and that was good. Everyone take a nap. This goes first. But first, I'll walk around the pond. Oh, this goes to you. And in my family, it's, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, ah. Do you resent Liza for getting so much attention and love from when she was young and you had to share it with?

Yes, doctor. Yes, okay. So this is not about almonds and blackberries. Well, it kind of is. Because when you're hungry and you're 6'4", right? 198 pounds of pure muscle. Okay, well, I've been to your house, and you guys always have a lot of good food.

I know, I was just in this moment looking at, it was just making, I was looking at these almonds, raw almonds, not even salted and roasted. Oh, okay, that's problematic. Because roasted and almond, that might have some dangerous nutrients in there. Oh my God. You are charged.

No, I'm just, am I wrong? And so I actually, She cares about your health. I cupped my hands and I put some almonds in there and I put a few blackberries. And I really did feel like I was someone who had been, my plane had gone down three weeks ago. And I had wandered through,

through, and I was about to die, but I found a couple of nuts and a couple of berries. And I was like, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And just was stuffing them into my face. Oh man. And people came, were coming over then and they were like, oh, hey Conan. And I'm like, and I had blackberry in my lips.

So I was like, ah. You know, when a vampire sees a crest, I was like, don't touch my blackberries. And of course she's perfectly fine. She was like, oh man, am I stuffed? If she brought home Doritos and like a ham sandwich made of Slim Jims, you would have eaten it. You would have been really happy.

Then afterwards you would have been really upset at yourself, wouldn't you? No. I would have blacked out in a referee. I remember when you and I. I would have awoken in like with a sensual high. I remember when you and I ate the McRib ham sandwich once. Oh, that was, okay.

Well, let's not get in trouble with a major company. Is it, are there the, why can't we talk about McDonald's? I love McDonald's, but the McRib is garbage. Let's not get in trouble with a major company. That's the weirdest thing I've ever heard. I've never offended a major company. I don't ever want to hear it from you again. Let's not get in trouble with a major,

you wouldn't even name the name of the company. I am loving it. Apology. I am loving it. Oh my God, I'm in trouble with a major company. Do-do-do-do-do-do. Don't do this. I'm loving it.

What a sell out. You're such a sell out. Oh my God. Oh my God. You're the most weenie I've ever met. I will not offend any group of white men that have formed a corporate concern for profit. They shall be protected when coronavirus needs a friend.

Oh my God, that's why you're mad at Liza. She didn't bring home a Big Mac. Oh my God, I could have killed a Big Mac. Man, that company does it right. Always have and always will. I'm a Burger King fan myself. Yeah. Well, them too.

You can't go wrong with those big companies. I'm a Taco Bell boy. Yep. You know who's good at drilling for oil? Texaco, in my opinion. Keep at it, fellas. Get that liquid gold. Yep, any who.

No, I think my wife's right. And in her defense, she was just going to the farmer's market. But she's always been that way. I think on our first date, I said, do you want to get lunch? And she said, oh, I'm OK. I just had two walnuts and some green tea. And I almost jumped out a window. Because for me, lunch involves at least four whole hams.

A family of pigs. A family of pigs. And they've been dipped in caramel. Oh, my God. Anyway, my apologies to my in-laws and my wife. And to McDonald's. No. No apology to McDonald's.

Wait, what? I said the McRib was garbage. It's not garbage. That's pretty bad. It's not, liar. Do, do, do, do, do. I'm loving it. Keep making those McRibs.

Whatever you do is right. Well, anyway, now on to Bell Helicopters. Maker of military helicopters and damn good ones. We're done. Stop. All right, I'm done here. Good. Conan O'Brien needs a friend.

With Conan O'Brien, Sonam of Sessian, and Matt Gorely. Produced by me, Matt Gorely. Executive produced by Adam Sacks, Joanna Salatarov, and Jeff Ross at Team Coco, and Colin Anderson and Cody Fisher at Year Wolf. Theme song by the White Stripes. Incidental music by Jimmy Vivino. Take it away, Jimmy.

Our supervising producer is Aaron Blair, and our associate talent producer is Jennifer Samples. Engineering by Will Beckton. Additional production support by Mars Melnick. Talent booking by Paula Davis, Gina Batista, and Britt Kahn. You can rate and review this show on Apple Podcasts, and you might find your review read on a future episode. Got a question for Conan?

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