Conan O’Brien Needs A Friend - David Byrne

Episode Date: July 24, 2023

Talking Heads frontman David Byrne feels carefree and buoyant about being Conan O’Brien’s friend. David sits down with Conan to discuss his Scottish heritage, the inspiration for the iconic oversized suit, and telling the story of Filipino First Lady Imelda Marcos in his new Broadway musical Here Lies Love. Plus, Matt Gourley shares his training regimen as he prepares to return to the soccer pitch. This episode was recorded on 5/11/23. For Conan videos, tour dates and more visit TeamCoco.com.

Hi, my name is David Byrne. I feel carefree and blunt. About being Conan O'Brien's friend. Oh my God. Now, is that really how you feel or is you on some kind of medication? No, no. I haven't had medication quite a while. Hours. It's been hours. It's been hours.

Hey there, welcome to Conan O'Brien Needs a friend. We're gonna have a good time. Today I can just sense it in me bones. Okay. I'm like an old C salty that way. I feel things in me bones and I feel that this is gonna be a good one. So now how are you? I'm good.

I think if you were a C salty, I feel like it's not, it's not like a cool, easy life though, right? No, it's not. Okay, all right. No, I'm a hard, tough man that's grown up on with the sea breeze and me push. Okay. The wind blasting across.

No, the, uh, the ocean. What? Well, I'm just gonna take issue with some of these terms. Wait, Tom, what did you just say of something in your push? Yeah, the old push, the old face. Yeah, and then you're saying sea salty. That's, there's a salt and there's a sea dog,

but there's nothing called a sea salty. Okay. Oh, I'm thinking of the cracker. Oh, I think it's a cracker called sea salty. That's what you are. Actually, I'm thinking of a saltine. Yeah. Yeah, I think I'm kind of a, I'm like a saltine.

I feel things in my bones. Yeah, that makes a lot of dry. Yeah, and I'm crispy this way. That no one's really enjoyed since about 1950. Eat it when you're nauseous. Yeah. Yeah. Can you even find saltines anymore?

Oh, of course. Are they out there? Yeah. Because they know that everything got so specialized. Every, you know, you go to the store and all the crackers are so like, oh, this one's made of, you know, this kind of seed mixed with that kind of seed. And, you know, it's all boutique bullshit nonsense. You just need to crumple it up into your soup and only a saltine would work.

Or like an old lady has to have them in their purse. Yeah. Yeah. Hungry, you look thin. Oh. I don't know. They say that you look thin. Yeah.

You look sick. Oh, you look sick and thin. Yeah. That's a great thing for people to walk around saying. Yeah. I think I'm gonna say this, and I don't know if you can relate Gourley because I'm older than you, but when I was a kid, I felt like there was, if you wanted a cracker,

you had a saltine or a ritz. Or a graham cracker. I know, but that's different. I'm saying if you wanted like a salty cracker, you had to say, I apologize. Okay. Great, you're really in my flow today. That's terrific.

Okay. Incredible. I wish we had a band together so we could suck at the same time. Anyway, my point is there was basically two types of each kind of food. That's what it felt like to me. And if you wanted a powder drink, you would get like, do you know what I mean? Yeah. They'd be like a lemonade. There'd be get like, do you know what I mean? Yeah. They'd be like a lemonade. There'd be one kind of lemonade or another kind, but that was

it. There's 750 types of each kind of food now. So that's why I feel like saltines must be getting squeezed out and I worry about them. You really worry about saltines? Well, I did for a second. Now it's gone. Okay. That makes more sense. I mean, if you're like staying up late worrying about Salty. No, when I say I'm worried about something and this includes worried about like my parents' health or how anyone in my family or anyone in my life is doing, I'm talking about a momentary sensation that quickly passes the second I see my reflection. Although we've been talking about Salty's for a good few minutes now. God damn it. What a great crispy cracker. I know they are good. You can't beat them.

Well, I think that if they cornered the market on crackers and then everyone got fat, people were like, maybe we should make crackers with better ingredients than like cardboard with salt on it. Well, that's just saltine coming out again. That's all great. I say, I like them in my soup. It was fine. Yeah. Did you guys ever play that game where you eat a bunch of saltines and you try to whistle? That was good times. Oh, and it comes shooting out and it looks like shrapnel. Uh huh.

Yeah. I love that game. Yeah, we should do that. Uh, no. What's not? Okay. Never do that. Okay.

Wait a minute. I'm going to tweak your idea. Okay. Slightly. Okay. Okay. So I took what you said and slightly tweaked it. Uh-huh, yeah, we'd be great in a band together. You're right. I know. Trust me. Yeah. You with your Asusophone, me with my sweet

Stratocaster and personality and personality. And personality, yes. I mean, problematic personality. Hey, I'm America's sweetheart. Oh, no, it's true story. It used to be. I'm gonna tweak your story. Listen, Julia Roberts was America's sweetheart and then they notified me recently that it has been passed to me. Is this like people sexiest person alive? It's kind of, but it's not done by people magazine.

It was just a given that Julia Roberts was America's sweetheart for like 25 years. It went from her to you? I swear to God, I was as shocked as you guys were. I thought it was a gas bill. And I just opened the envelope and it said, Julia Roberts is no longer America's sweetheart. Now it's you, Conan O'Brien. And there's all this responsibility. Who sent it? Yeah.

I looked into it and it seems pretty legit. And I don't want to talk too much about it. Really? Oh, you looked into it. It seems legit, but you don't want to say who sent it to you. Was it by any chance sent by Conan O'Brien? It just said CEO Brian. Okay, yeah.

It said CEO Brian and it smelled of alcohol. So it's possible I wrote it late at night and mailed it to myself. And it had crumpled up saltines in it. It had saltines in it. What I thought I thought it was glitter. I was like, this is exciting. And I started waiting around the room

and just saltines everywhere. But anyway, if you're curious, yes, I'm now America's sweetheart. Oh boy, America really is at the end of its rope. Forget the democracy thing. Forget, forget January 6th. Forget the threat against our whole system of democracy. I think this is the end. This is the final blow. Yeah. All right. Well, very excited about our guest today. Very cool to talk to this gentleman. My guest is an Oscar

Grammy and Tony award-winning musician. He's, isn't that most of the awards? What does he not have? You said, Emmy, Grammy and Tony. No, I didn't see Emmy. Emmy.. Oh, he does. Oscar, Grammy, and Tony. So he's an architect. He doesn't have what you have. He's right. He's a loser. He's a god. He's a god. He's a god. Yeah.

Man, I feel so bad for this guy now. All those awards, but not the wonderful Emmy, which is really the king of all the awards. Anyway, he's, of course, the, was the lead singer and guitarist for the talking heads. This summer, he's bringing his musical, Here Lies Love, to Broadway, with performances starting on July 20th. David Byrr, welcome. Well, first of all, I want to start by asking you, I am here at the serious studios in Midtown, New York. Did you ride a bike here? Yes, I did. Yes, I did. You're on. And did you, in fact, strike that woman with your bike? Um, I'm just curious because I know that you are an avid biker. I'm a biker. I love riding a bicycle, a friend of mine, uh, his, my favorite saying is that he has is

now no one's ever had a bad day on a bike. But is it practical here in New York City? Can you get around pretty well, relying on the bike? I can get around really well. I live in Manhattan. Manhattan's not that big of an island. And usually most of my meetings and work are below Central Park, let's say. Yep.

So it's pretty easy. I've gotten used to it. I stay in the bike lane. I mostly stop at red lights. I've never had a serious accident. I'm very lucky about that. Yeah, I wouldn't advocate and say, oh, just, you've never done it before. Okay, just jump on a bike and get in the traffic.

Right. Yeah, I would not. I would say that to someone I didn't like. I have an idea. Yes, if you see some guy coming right at you, going the wrong way, stick your hand out. But you know, with the e-bikes now, it's tricky. I don't know if you have that, but when I'm in Manhattan now walking around There are these people that are delivering food and they'll go by on a bike

I can't even hear that's going 60 miles an hour in the bike lane. I don't know if you've encountered that I have certainly encountered that sometimes going the wrong way So when you're crossing the street or whatever you don't expect them to kind of blindside you. Right. It's, there's a little bit of an enforcement problem. Well, I wanted to start talking to you and I know that there are unusual circumstances if you're growing up, which is you lived in Scotland. They've just gone for how many years? Not very many.

Family all left when I was two, moved to Canada, moved to suburban Baltimore when I was around seven or eight. But you had a Scottish accent for a while. Oh yeah, yeah, and yeah, the kids couldn't understand me. And so I would think what's going to make someone in elementary school feel more like an outsider than having a fixed Scottish accent. That must have been, I mean, first of all, that is something that right away, if you're a kid and you're sensitive, you feel, you must have felt like, I need to overcome this.

How do I do? How do I fit in? Yeah, and kids at that age, they wanna fit in, they wanna be like everyone else. It's not like, oh, I'm my own person, I do my own thing, I talk my own way, I do kids are not ready for that. So I'm sure I lost the accent within a couple of years or something, but right away, you know,

I didn't talk the same way as the other kids. My parents eat, holding their knives and forks at the same time. Animals. You're eating blood sausage. Yes. You can't have anyone come over. Yes. We called it black pudding. Yes. So I would think, I mean, I do think sometimes, although these things can be painful when you're a kid, being too well-adjusted comes with a price. And I think feeling a little bit like an outsider maybe has some advantages when it comes to maybe you having an interior life thinking, what can I find that's mine and then that turns out to be music.

Yes. Music is very healing. For a person who feels a little bit of an outsider trying to figure things out, can't quite fit in music. Yeah, the rock music is all like, wow, there's people out there kind of like me. Where are they? Right. They're not here, but I know they're out there.

They're not here. They're not here in one of the radio. What instruments? Because I'm obviously guitar, but there are other instruments that you dabbled with as a kid. If you can call a with as a kid. If you can call a tape recorder an instrument. Now you can. Okay then I did that. My parents were not like showbiz pushy but they were supportive.

So my dad had a tape recorder and I wanted to start playing with it and doing things I'd heard about like cutting up tape and rearranging the order of the stuff on the tapes and editing and doing all that kind of thing. So he, you know, let me do that. Yeah. Supportive in that way. It was really nice. And I think you dabbled in violin accordion? Did you play accordion for that?

No, I had a friend who played accordion. I played violin. And then at some point, I connected with a friend and he played accordion. I played violin and ukulele. And we played on the street sometimes. And I did a little bit of, well, you might call it aquabatics. Mainly I just stood on one leg. You stood on one leg as you played.

Yeah, as I played and looked at the, that's very jethro tall. He used to stand on one leg in, I mean, aqua long. Exactly. He'd stand, one of the thinking of Ian, Ian Anderson. Is that a thing? Yes, we'd stand on one leg and play in this very dramatic pose and play his flute solos. I think my gesture was meant to be a little more ironic. Like, look at what I'm doing.

Look, isn't this amazing? Uh-huh. And yet, I was really just standing with one one for it. Well, clearly you're act evolved. It's not like in the early days, in the 70s at CBGB's, people were like, you got to see this guy. He stands on one leg. How's the music?

I don't know, but I haven't listened to it. I've met an older acquaintance of yours, Jerry Harrison, and bumped into him a couple of times and told him how much talking heads meant to me, meant so much to me. Thank you. And I have a very clear, crystal clear memory that would have been, I wanna say maybe 1983, 84 somewhere around there.

I'm in college. And of course, I'm obsessed with late night with David Letterman. And he has you guys on and you play burning down the house on Letterman. And it was my whole world of things that I loved coming together in one moment, which rarely happened when you're at that phase. There was so, there was much less entertainment back then. So the fact that, I remember, I think Dave chatted with you a bit. You came over to the interview chair, either before after the song. He was talking to you and I thought, this is everything I like in life in one place at the same time. I remember what I've seen replace of that chat.

It seemed to go very, it was a very odd chat. It was. I was very nervous and they were fairly stupid answers. I don't think I remembered watching it and having no judgment about it, which is just that's you, this is Dave. I don't, you know, this is what's happening at this moment. I love the performance of the song, you know. You know, so fascinated by, you know,

talking about the beginnings of that band. I never realized until recently that Psycho Killer, which is the first big hit, was the only the second song you had ever written. Yeah, yeah, it was kind of an experiment to see, can I really write a song? Wow. I got help from some of the others. We did, and people seemed to like that one. Yeah. And then I thought, oh, it also sounded so different from anything else at the time,

to me. It just was so, it was, and I know that you were trying to, I read an interview once, where you said in Psycho Killer, you were trying to, I read an interview once, where you said in Psycho Killer, you were trying to almost as a thought experiment, saying, what if Alice Cooper and Randy Newman wrote a song together? Exactly. And Michael, what a fantastic. First of all, who approaches songwriting

with that kind of idea? I liked them both. Yeah. Well, you know, you like both, both it's like cooking, put them together. I like onions. I like ice cream. They must be good together. I'm curious.

So you wrote that song, things start to take off and then you just have this phenomenal success. And I, I think the rare thing that you guys pulled off was the group was very commercially successful. It was the soundtrack for a lot of people of late 70s, early 80s, but also very highly regarded and respected at the same time, which doesn't always happen. It doesn't always happen. We were kind of determined to do what we did, but I think we're also pretty lucky at that, be around at that time where that kind of thing was accepted. There's a certain amount of luck involved. Yeah. I like it when people acknowledge luck. I mean, yeah,

or we were in back at CBGBs. We were kind of in the right place at the right time. Other bands were playing people were coming to see them, record companies coming to see them. We didn't plan that. Do you ever think to yourself, I do in comedy and think, what if I was starting now? I would you do? What would you do? What would I do if I started now? How would I, because there's so much out there? How would I, how would I make it?

And I'm not sure that I would. I'm very lucky that I, yeah. There's a lot of music out there too. Yes. The streaming services and everywhere, I just filled, filled with music and you wonder, how I still find lots of things that I like, but I can imagine for a lot of people, it's like, well, it's just too much. I think that your people are overwhelmed and then they get siloed. I just want to listen to these three It's just as in news you don't have to hear an opinion you don't want to hear anymore Because you can just watch your same thing is happening

I think in music and in comedy you can just seek out These are the seven things that give me comfort and you will not run into anything that might challenge you Which is kind of scary. There's such a nice evolution too with your, with your band was talking heads that the music kept evolving. It didn't, it felt like almost, if I'm, if I'm not mistaken, there was a determination to not do the same thing twice. Exactly. And I'd grown up as a music fan in the late 60s, early 70s. Who did you like? Oh, you know, I like the temptations. And James Brown and the Beatles and the Rolling Stones and the Who and, you know, all these

acts that were around. And a lot of them, not all of them, but a lot of them from album to album, they devolve and do different things. And try these odd, adding these odd sounds and odd ideas into their songs, and I thought, that's what you do. You can get away with it. Yeah. Yeah, and look, they're successful. And so I thought, well, okay, if they can do it, that's the way to go, if you can get away with it. Was there pressure after Psycho Killer from record label to say, like, that was great, Do that again. Because you didn't. There was probably pressure after some other things like maybe maybe when we did some successful tours or something like that, there was more like, that's good. You're doing good. Just stay on the

road. Yep. That can be fun, but kind of deadly after a while. Yeah. Famously the road in my limited experience with it, it is thrilling for just a little while. And then you see, you understand why people become addicts and alcoholics, you know. And cause you're on a bus and you're really amped up after a show and you wanna come down from after a show, and then it's time to get on a bus,

and it's not a good rhythm to live in consistently. Yeah, you just watch the movies and start drinking. I mean, I do that now, but I'm not even touring. So this is, I'm realizing now this is an intervention, they've called it. I've got no. When did you, I mean, obviously you've always had a strong inclination to combine, there's the music, but you've always, in a way that I feel like

very similar to David Bowie, you've always wanted it to also be a great theatrical experience. You've wanted it to, I mean, I remember the giant suit and stopped making sense and how arresting that was. What a great idea that was. And so you've have your physicality in the way you moved and then the suit and how they're fighting each other but also complementing each other and it burned a hole in my brain at

the time and I think for a lot of people it did but where did that sensibility come from do you think think? Were you always interested in that? In making it visual and theatrical? Little by little. I think at first, I mean, again, growing up, seeing like David Bowie shows and some other kinds of things, I realized, oh, that is a thing that can be done. You can do a kind of theatrical show with where costumes or whatever, that's not completely out of the question. But I thought, no, but we don't know what to do.

So we started off trying to take it down to ground zero and not do anything. Just wear a street clothes on stage and not have any kind of look. Of course, not having a look ends up being a look. There's no way you can't escape it. So after a while, little by little started incorporating things, a little bit of boob and this and that, more and more, and a little bit of lighting at first, we had no lighting. We would say to the, we'd go into a club and just say, just turn them on when we start and turn them off when we're done. Really, really an on-off switch. Just someone with an on-off switch. Basically, yes, I'm just, I'm sorry, I know you want to be creative, but please, we're

not ready for that yet. Living here, I started seeing kind of downtown experimental theater, things like that people doing different things. And I saw various kinds of performances and whatever. And I thought, oh, there's all different ways of doing this. It doesn't have, I don't have to be like the various rock stars that I know about, that I might love, but there's other ways of doing things. I didn't necessarily copy those other people, but it kind of opened up a world of think

outside the box, think of what you can do. And we'd finished a tour. I was in Japan talking to a friend over there. And I said, I'm not sure what to do on stage for our next tour. And this guy said, well, being kind of facetious, saying, well, you know, in the theater, everything has to be bigger. And I'm thinking about what I'm wearing

at that moment I was thinking what I'm gonna wear. So I drew thinking about what I'm wearing at that moment. I was thinking what I'm going to wear. So I drew on an app and a really big, really big suit. And now being in Japan, I was also thinking of the kind of traditional theater there, like this genre of theater called No. They wear these very wide shouldered outfits. Yeah, and they look kind of flat when they turn to the side. It's like a big rectangle in front with a head in the middle. And the shoulders are very obviously very square. Yeah, very square. And I thought, do that not have it look Asian, but have it look like a kind of business

person suit. I don't know what that means, but I thought that could be nice. It feels like it means something. Did you feel that the glasses also were part of the aesthetic, you know what I mean? Or was it just I need to see? No, no, I didn't wear glasses then. Yeah. And you did in some videos. Yeah, I did in some videos, but just for the look.

They didn't have any glasses in them. I don't think. Yeah, it was just for the look that I thought this person, this character, you start there, but then as the, you need to, as you evolve and start playing with things, you start adding more and more, but it starts very stripped down. Yes. I didn't know what to do. So thought, that's eliminate everything. No, guitar solos. Maybe they're just hint of a guitar solo. Wait, let's we're going to wear our street clothes. The lights are just going to come on at the beginning and go off at the end. Right. All those kinds of things. No choreography.

All the sort of takeaway, everything. And see what's left. We kind of did that musically too. It was kind of, let's remove all the extraneous musical elements. So we only play what's absolutely necessary. And then you can start to add other things, can creep back in. When the band breaks up, I think the last time you played together was at a rock and roll Hall of Fame induction. Yeah, yeah. How did it feel when you guys were up there together? It was fun, but it was tense. I remember there were some musical mistakes that drove me around the band. She's really now.

Here? Yeah. The pluses and minuses of being in a band. I have always really admired the decision not to reform the band because I've always thought when something happens and it's pure and then it's done, there's a real beauty to stepping away from it. Is that how you have felt? I love collaborating with people, but being with a band is, yeah, I have to say,

it's really wonderful. You're like a family, you're like a little team, a little army, all those kinds of things. But then after a while, it gets all the kind of all the kind of negative stuff in a family is there as well as the positive stuff. Right. Who took my tooth brush? Yeah. Yeah. Do you have to chew like that? Yeah. I think it was Lauren Michael said to me once there was describing, I don't know if it was Rowan and Martin or some famous comedy team, but he said, when you're down and out and you're working your way up in the clubs, you look at your partner and you think think, thank God he's up here on stage with me at this dive. But then when you hit it the huge big time, you look over at that guy and you go, what the hell is he doing here? It's just human nature, but also things run their course. Yeah, it's run their course. Did you ever work with a team like that?

No, I mean, I worked I was I've always been very collaborative with a team like that? No, I mean, I worked. I've always been very collaborative. And I started out as a writer, and I was a comedy writer for a long time, and that was very collaborative. I enjoyed that, but when I started performing, I've found that, oh, I'm kind of a control freak.

And it's easier when not everything is a collaboration. So it's the yin yang. You want it to be the way you have it in your head. You want to hear it the way you hear it in your head, whether it's comedy or music, it's a struggle. The collaborations are great, but then there's those moments when you think, can I just tell everybody exactly what to do? And then of course, your Mussolini. Yes. Who did not make it in comedy, by the way. I remember being like that at various points, being a control freak, and so it has to be this way, has to be this way. And we're going to do it again. We're going to do it again. Yeah. And years go by and I've realized, you know you know, whatever the phrase is, you catch more flies, you get more sugar or whatever it might be.

Flies go into sugar and die. When honey can cover sugar, no. So I'm not making this any better. But it matters. I know what you're saying. It's supposed to be like, you catch more flies with honey than vinegar. Something like that. So I knew this.

Now I'm a control freak. We've got to get this right like that. So I knew this. Now I'm a control freak. We've got to get this right. Yes. So there's a fly. Okay, I'm sorry. I would like it if we just completely broke down over this, got into a fight and then you left.

It was over this same. I'm gonna go look this up. Yeah, exactly. I'm going to the New York Public Library. Why don't you use your phone. I want to go to the library. I don't trust the internet. It's stealing my soul. This is just apropos of nothing, but just because you mentioned that. Are you kind of a lot of it? Are you comfortable with technology? Are you comfortable with internet phone or I use it? I mean, I use the internet. I use have a mobile phone, of course. But I'm not on social media.

Right. I'm kind of suspicious of what that does to people. There's other things that I'm kind of suspicious about. The big tech companies know so much about us and therefore are kind of manipulating us in various kinds of ways. It sounds, I mean, the way I say it, it sounds like science fiction, but it's more like manipulating you to stay on their platform and buy stuff that you don't bring out. Yeah, in subtle ways. Yeah. Do you ever use a typewriter? Just I have, but I don't use it anymore. I know you, we all did use a typewriter. I still use a typewriter because I love the look of them. The same way I love the look of a guitar, I also love the look of certain kinds of typewriters, and I love having them around. And there is a little niche cult out there

of people like me that still type people letters and put them in the mail. I'm sure people love getting a letter. They love getting a typed letter, even if it's quite abusive. I've written the creepiest, most abusive letters, people like you type this. This is incredible. You seem like you would maybe fall into that pocket of sometimes, you want to write a bike, you want to keep it simple. Yeah, to some extent. To some extent, I feel like, enjoy your life and you don't have to obsess over all this

stuff. So I want to talk to you about Herely's Love, which is this project that you've been working on for quite a while. And now it's going to get its premiere on Broadway. Finally. On July 20th, this is what fascinates me is the inspiration for this or the starting point was your interest in a Melda Marcos. Exactly.

Now tell us how, because that is not, again, I have learned to expect the unexpected from David Byrne. But when I say like, it's gonna be a musical and it revolves around a Melda Marcos, I think. I can't say after that, oh, that old idea again. Another musical about a Melda Marcos, please. Yes, all those songs about shoes. So where did this come from?

How did this germinate? It goes back before that, not very often, but a few times I went to Disco's when there was a live act playing. And a live act playing in a disco meant they would come in with a little tape, but they're backing tracks, with their music on the tape, put it in. So it was like a karaoke thing. It'd be like Grace Jones or Gloria Gainer or Frieda Payne or different people who had hits in those days.

They would stand on a little platform. The tape would play and they'd dance around and sing live, but the music was pre-recorded. And I thought, oh, that's pretty nice. It's a really short set. It's like 15 minutes because I don't only have maybe two hits. And then I heard the DJs that in those kind of places saying there's an arc to the evening, where we take the audience on a journey dancing, and maybe they're doing other things, but it's an arc. And I thought, what if the arc was a story? What if you could tell a story using those songs that they're singing?

Or just filed that away. And then when I read that Amel de Marcos, that former First Lady of the Philippines, loved going to Disco's. She had a mirror ball installed in her New York townhouse. She turned the roof of the palace in Manila into like a dance club. I thought, oh, here's a kind of somewhat eccentric real life person who lives in that world.

Yeah. Maybe this is the person whose story could be told, told that way. So I started doing research. And what did you, so what did you find out about, I mean, for the longest time she was held up as this, if you don't know much about people, you just know the caricature about them. But did you become more sympathetic at all to Melda Marcos, the more you learned about her, or no?

Oh yeah, I think anybody who's writing about another person or some situation like that, you have to try and empathize and understand what drove them to do what they did. If you don't, if you just say, oh, she's a bad bad bad bad person, then story's over right there. So you have to try and understand it. For her, yes, there was a story. She started all, there's a little bit of her ex-territches story. Poor girl from the poor side of a very influential family. So she watched her relatives, her richer relatives, and she would have to serve them tea and things like that. And she thought, why are they? Why them?

Why them? Why not me? And so she became kind of ambitious and kind of clawed her way. Up there she was very beautiful, won some beauty contests, Marity Young's Senator got in there, and yeah, lots and lots of things happened after that to make, to long story short, she did go to a lot of discos. And in the end, she and her husband, her husband declared martial law. They put the country under martial law, which meant that press has muscled. Any dissidents can just be rounded up. Bad things happened. And eventually the populace revolted, but in a very peaceful way, they held an election, but it was kind of a fake election. And like someone else we know, they claimed they won when they hadn't. And people just turned out on the streets everywhere and

just said, no, no, no, no, no, enough. Enough. We're not having this. And that might have been the end of it. They might have just said, who were you to say? The generals started defecting. And the Cardinal in the Philippines, his name was Cardinal Sin. He defected. That's almost, you can't write that stuff. I couldn't hear his mouth out. What? I'm Cardinal Sin. He defected. That's almost you can't write that stuff. I thought, what? I'm Cardinal sin. Yeah. But oh, no, I can't say that. People will think, oh, you made that shit up. Right. Yeah. So then eventually, yeah, after four days, nobody got hurt.

They gave up in the US Marines came in and airlifted them out. So it has a happy ending. But the Marines came in airlift. How does that have to be ending? Well, yeah, happy ending for the people there. Whoever. Now there's other stories. The Marines are left to drought and stopped. They said we're going to, you be go to Hawaii and which they did.

But she said we need to stop at the PX and Guam. She dropped $60,000 at the PX on the way out. I think what is at the PX and Guam that's so great. I know it's a big base. But yeah, she gets $60,000 worth of string cheese. I wonder. Beef jerky. Yes, I am.

Yeah. So, so you know, what's to me is, so you have this story. Do the song, does the music then come out of the story? Does that, would suggest, or how does that work? How does this symbiotic relationship between the story and the music happen creatively? Wow. And I demand you to teach it to me. So I can do it. Since I was now saying okay this story is gonna be set in a disco Mm-hmm and

One of the audience to be like I would be in a disco Hearing in the performers up on little platforms on the side So we have to have it that kind of energy a lot of the time telling the story. So yeah I went to fat boy slim the yeah musical artist said, you have to help me do this. This is a little bit outside of my wheelhouse. We want to really sound like dance music. It worked. And to me, it felt like the kind of buoyant energy you get from dance music, I thought, that

must be what it feels like to be a powerful person like this, to be the president's wife and you can kind of do whatever you want. You know, I had a friend that saw a previous showing of it and was called me and was completely blown away. Just said, this was the greatest experience and it was immersive and it was fantastic and the music was great. And so I'm really looking forward to it. I am, and I don't wanna pay for a ticket.

That's the other reason they had you on. Well, Vic, yeah, there's people kind of range. We can range that. No, no, I don't think you understand. I want you to pay me to, no. Uh, I like to show up late and I'd like the show to stop when I show up and I'd like a light to hit me. Okay.

As I make my way out, these are things that I demand when I go places, which is why I've never invited anywhere. Um, I'm glad your friend liked it. It is a lot of fun. I made a sound like it's a lot of it's a history lesson, but the history comes through with all the dancing and music and everything. Your creative process, do you find that you do the best work, say in the morning at night or at night, or is there no rhyme or reason to your creative engine?

I found that I've fallen into a routine where the morning I get up and try and empty my inbox of emails, never happens. But then by after lunch, I can start to work on whatever I really want to work on. And it's kind of like, if there's more emails coming in, forget it. Yeah. This is, I mean, they've done studies that say that there's so much creativity. It's really not that much. In a given day, someone might have two hours of real creativity.

I agree. And then after that, everything is busy work. And I get fascinated by this stuff. So, you know, Hemingway used to say, I'll get up, he get up very early in the morning and he would, he said, if I get right to it, I have about, I'm think he said to maybe three good hours. And he said, then I know the tank is done or almost done. He said, but I always leave.

I always stop knowing what the next thing is gonna be to make the beginning of the next day easier. Oh, I see. Which I thought was really like a kind of a cool trick. Yeah. He didn't go to empty. He went to, there's still a little bit left and I'm going to stop here. And then the rest of the day was swimming, fishing, unfortunately, drinking way too much, but he would do whatever it is that he were boxing, you know, some, some cubist painter. But, but he didn't,

the next day, he could say, okay, I know, I have about 15 minutes where I know what I'm doing and that will get me, give me the momentum to get going again. That makes perfect sense. I think I'll probably do that too and then have some kind of administration work in the creative thing, like let's do some line editing,

let's maybe just try and figure out some rhymes in a song that didn't quite work. Like go back over it and see if you can fix it a little bit, but not the heavy lifting of coming up with something on a blank page. You have said before that you think you might be somewhat on the spectrum. Is that something that you still believe? Not so much. Yeah. I still have moments when I interpret things that people say

very, very literally, or when somebody says something and I take it literally, and they say, you couldn't tell that I didn't actually mean that. Right. And I go, no, I heard what you said. Right. Right. That can cause problems. Look, it caused problems now because I don't think I have this theory that sarcasm didn't really exist until about 1925. And that people used to say exactly what they meant.

And then they would fight duels over it. And now things have evolved to the point where 98% of what people say to each other is wiseassery and you know what I mean? And I, you know, not, you know, it's sarcastic, it's meant to be, you know, oh please, what I meant was the opposite. Exactly. And that's that's a trouble following that less so now. But yes, I'm as I got older, I felt more socially comfortable. But yeah, there was a time where I felt fairly socially awkward, but I did not feel I'm happy. I just felt like, well, this is the way I am. Yeah. In New York, when you're moving through the world and you're on your bike, you are quite recognizable and you're a big deal rock star. How does that work for you? You are. You're an iconic artist and I don't know how comfortable are you with David. Can I grab a selfie?

Sometimes that's okay, but it's often, you know, there's an advantage. If I'm on the bike, like today, a man said, hi, hi, David, I'm from Warner Brothers. I didn't know him. It seemed like a very nice man. But I thought, I'm not really ready to have a conversation right now. The red light changed and, oh, I was gone.

You just take off on the bike. Not in a rude way. I said, good day to you, sir. Good day to you. I have a nice day. I'm going to be like, this is a podcast. So I just want people to know that, David's been sitting on a bike the entire time and at any moment if the conversation

goes away that he's not pleased, he's riding out. Yes, the light changes. Yeah, why is there a traffic light in here? I also want to dimension, we have a mutual friend in John Mulaney. Oh, yeah. Yeah. I'm a door. I just adore. I think he's a brilliant, brilliant mind and just thrilled to know him.

How did you and John Mulaney come to be friendly? Through the director of Hair Lies Love, Alex Timbers. He's a theater director. And he directed a thing that John Malanian Nick Holdt did called Oh, oh, hello. Oh, yeah, I've seen that show. I love that show. Yeah, he directed that and said, David, they like to sometimes invite someone up on stage. Will you let them do that? I said, oh, sure. So I did. I was one of the kind of ringers in the audience that they bring up and they become part of one of the...

Was it the tuna sandwich? Yeah, the tuna sandwich thing. And they do that. And of course, they're all in like wigs and... Prosthetics. Procedetics and all kinds of stuff. So I have to say that I got a little confused. Who's which one's John? Which one's Nick?

Which is John? No, it was a surreal moment of my life too, which is a really, I mean, it's a very, it was a really funny show. Those are both brilliant guys. And then the same thing they heard I was in town. They said, would you come and be the, the, the, the, the stooge that sits in the audience and gets called up. So I got called up and it all, they're both weren't dressed as these

old men that are obsessed with steely tan and live on the upper side. And it is the most specific kind of comedy. And then, of course, there's this bit that they want you to participate in where they lure you into mentioning this tuna sandwich and wouldn't you like some of this tuna sandwich. And it is one of those moments in my life anyway. And there have been many, I'm sure there have been many in yours,

where I leave my body and I observe what's happening. And there's part of me that thinks you have leave my body and I observe what's happening. And I, there's part of me that thinks you have a very odd life at this moment, Conan. You're up on stage. It's Malani, Kroel. They keep referencing steely Dan and they're trying you to mention tuna fish sandwich and we're at a Broadway theater. I don't understand what's happened to my life.

So it sounds like you have this similar experience. I had a very similar experience. Yes Giant Tune of Sandwich comes down Here's and really the whole stage smells like tuna. It really does I smelled like tuna fish for days afterwards. They wouldn't let me fly commercially for a while I like that you're good friends with John because I'm obsessed with whatever this line is between comedy and music. I know that there's some kind of visceral connection between the two. I've always been in comedy but fascinated with music and tried to play music and been frustrated and I always thought the grass was always greener. In the last kind of show I did,

I was exactly stand up, but there were quite a number of parts in the show where I would just talk directly to the audience, kind of like a community would do. And sometimes I got laughs. And so I got a little, little tiny taste to that. I loved it, but it was terrifying. Yeah. As a musician, you have this whole group of musicians and you have the song and everything that just kind of structure is it's a structure once you get on that roller coaster structure or whatever you want to call it. Boom, you're you're supported. Right. You just ride it. Right. Whereas if you're just standing there. If and and you're trying to make people laugh or pay attention at least if they don't, it's like, well, we're in trouble now. Yeah. Yeah. I'm always, I mean, I do think there is a connection in that I had to do something today and got up in front of this crowd and I could tell it was tight and I always think what time is taught me to be patient and find the rhythm of the room. What's find the rhythm of what's happening in this room? And then I can work

with that. And I imagine that it's somewhat similar in music where you need to where are these people now that we're playing for and how do we connect with them? So when you find the rhythm of the room in that way, do you then go, oh, I have to completely change what I was going to do. I'm going to jump and do this other thing. Well, I, a big, I love mistakes. It's just joyous. I grew up watching Johnny Carson tell a joke that would bomb on the tonight show. And I would see his eyes kind of glim, there's gleam in his eye. and then he would have, I mean, there's a, there's one segment I really loved where he told a few jokes in a row that didn't work out well and then he reached up and there was a microphone hanging above his head that was catching. He wasn't

lawved. He was, he was done with the boom and he grabbed the boom and pulled down and said, is this thing on, is this working and And then said Walmart, clean up in aisle five into the microphone. And he was basically just calling out the fact that his routine was not going at all well that night and having fun with it. And I thought that's the monologue I remember. He probably got a huge laugh.

I have a question. My, I have a friend who often tells me, David, don't laugh at your own jokes. And I've tried to stick to that, but sometimes I can't help it. It'll tickle me and I'll just start giggling at my own jokes. Now sometimes I find like, if I'm an audience,

they love that because it whatever breaks the fourth wall or whatever, and they go, they're in on it. Yeah. Other times it's like he's just having fun by himself. We're not included here. I'm I disagree with your friend violently. Well, okay. If you were here, I would fight this person. I don't, sometimes, if I'm laughing at my own joke, I'm the only one laughing. Yes. But at least there's someone there enjoying it.

And I, so, I, and people around me will say, I'll come and you're cracking yourself up there, and I'll say yes, I am. And I'm only on this earth for a little time, and I'm delighted with myself at this moment, and I don't care that none of you are I want to make sure that I let you go on time because I know you've got you are an important man with places to be but this has been a real Joy it's been a joy and an honor. I want to make sure I get the word out that

here lies love premieres July 20th. We're in previews before that. Right. Where we're that means we're still getting some bugs out of it. Mm-hmm. But it's it's the full show. And on the night when which I come, I will show up late, the show will stop. Spotlight will hit me and I will slowly walk to where I'm gonna be seated standing and then the show resumes. That's right and we'll have some shoes for you. David Byrne, this is like my dream come true. Thank you so much for being here.

Thanks for having me. It's fun talk. This come true. Thank you so much for being here. Thanks for having me. It's fun talk. This is cool. Thank you. I believe our sound engineer Eduardo has something he likes to say. Yes, is that the correct term? By the way, sound engineer? Sure, audio engineer, sound engineer.

No, it won't work. Okay. He said audio engineer, I think that's what you want, right? Either is fine. Okay, no, that's not true. I can do it. We know. Our microphone guy.

Yeah, perfect. A talking man. Yeah, a talking man has something he'd like to say. What's up Eduardo? I have some exciting news to share about a gentleman at this table who's going to be making his triumphant return to the soccer field in a couple of weeks. Well, I know it's not me, because I never got on the

soccer field. That's not true. I've seen your remote in Mexico. Oh, that's true. You get on the soccer field. Who did I play with? Giovanni Lassan. Oh my God, that's right.

Yes, but yes, you were right. It's not you that's gonna be making your return. It's Mr. Matt Gourley, who I believe is training for, do you want to talk more about this? Training. Well, boy, I mean, I've been since hitting 50 wanting to get a bit back in shape, eat healthy, and go to the gym and exercise, get my cardio.

And I was, how should I put this? I know you don't think of me as the most athletic person and trust me, I don't either. Kenneth, so funny you say that because when I think of you going to the gym, I picture a gym from 1910 and you have a friend. Who? Yeah, you have that one of those,

yeah, those jiggling belts, but also you throw a medicine ball. And then there were some wooden pins that you toss around. But I did play soccer for a number of years when I was a kid and and actually played club soccer and all-star soccer believe it or not. And I am going back Eduardo plays and he got us on a team called Mellow Yellow. Oh wow. Yeah, exciting. Yeah. And it's in your favorite city of Pasadena. I do like Pasadena. Man, Pasadena in August though, this summer,

it gets hot, that's a frying pan. I know, and I am not good in the heat, and I might not be good at soccer. What, first place? I encourage you to watch Conan's remote. I mean, do you have any tips for? I don't remember. I shot so many remotes over so many years

that I have dim memories. I'd have to rewatch it. How many times have you played soccer? I think you watched it. I don't think I have dim memories. I'd have to rewatch it. How many times have you played soccer? I think you watched it. I don't think I really played soccer. It was soccer was not my sport. My legs are way too long. So for any kind of message to get from my brain to my feet,

it takes like four days. It's like a Flintstones bit where they, you know, they hand a note to a bird that has to take off. You'd be better off shouting the message to your feet. Exactly. Yeah. So I, I don't remember that too well, but I, I know that soccer is not my sport. Although I admire it, I, I think they're probably the best athletes because they run constantly. And, and are they? Oh, oh, well, yeah, I got that.

I, I think so. Them and hockey players. Yeah. I mean, I don a hottest. And are they? Oh. Oh, well, yeah, I got that. I think so. Them and hockey players. Yeah, I mean, I don't understand. The hockey players cover their... Right, we are. We have helmet on. You're a hot artist with the soccer players.

We are, okay. Is that true? I think so. Okay. Yeah, that's why I watched the World Cup. The what cup? The World Cup. The World Cup.

The World Cup. The World Cup. Yeah, she watched it by the wild. The what cup? The world cup. The world cup. The world cup. The world cup. That's where all the, yeah, you watch it with bottle alters. So I think that's good. Are you feeling, what's the process if you're getting into shape? I run on a treadmill. I run about four miles a week. And then I do a little bit of strength training.

And then I've tried to change my diet. The only problem I haven't been able to fix is cocktails. I still got to have my cocktail. That's a lot of sugar. There's a lot of strength training. And then I've tried to change my diet. The only problem I haven't been able to fix is cocktails. I still got to have my cocktail. A lot of sugar. There's a lot of empty calories. Are there steaks? Like, if you compete against the other teams,

do you guys win a trophy? Oh yeah, yeah, there's a trophy. But I'm nervous. You know what I found? You can go buy the trophies. I know I pass trophy stores all the time and I just go in and buy them. My shelves are filled with amazing trophies

Oh, this is a trophy wife. We get a trophy wife That's a big deal big deal here on Los Angeles. Yeah, so what's the plan? So you're getting there I'm a little nervous because I've never been a great endurance guy I can sprint pretty well and I'm tenacious mentally, but I think my body's gonna give out pretty quick Especially if it's hot so we'll see how long has it been since you last played soccer? Yeah, I've never seen you stand up. No, I don't. I swear to God. All these five years we've been working together and he's always seated and I saw you once on the sidewalk and you were in a rolling chair. Yeah, that's right.

It's just traveling from an office and you were just shoveling yourself along. I played, like I said, when I was kid, and then I joined soccer in high school, but they didn't really play me. It's usually not a good sign. What's on your team, Eduardo? Now, how good are you, Eduardo? I'm okay. I bet he's pretty good.

Yeah, that means he's really good. Why don't you give me the benefit of that doubt? Let me try that. Ask me how good I am. How good are you? I'm okay. Ooh. I think you're exaggerating.

Huh? Huh? I'm sorry. So if one was to play soccer, does that make them hot? Does the tail wagged it up? You're back to that. Um, yeah, I'm sort of stuck on that one. I like to be thought of as hot and I'm curious

if I played soccer and you didn't know me and you saw the guy my age playing soccer on the field in super short shorts. Oh boy. Like really short. I think I'd be like, why is his coordination off? And then because these guys are they're running for such a long period of time and they don't they're just wearing a shirt and shorts and like long socks. You know what's funny? And I'm into...

I would be okay with it. I would play if I could be on a pony. No one else is. I'm the only one. I'm playing polo while I'm playing polo. So I'm playing polo. And I have a big like a mallet. But everyone else is running, but I'm on a pony.

And I mean a very small pony. Like my legs are dragging. What are you on a pony? I don't know. I just, I like the visual of Conan's going to play. And he's paying for all of our jerseys and he's paying for all the snacks, but there's one caveat. He has to be, he's, he brought a pony with him and actually I have like seven ponies because it's so hot. I was going to say the pony's probably would pass out in the I would put camelbacks on them, you know, that bikers wear and have hoses going into their mouths

so that they're constantly drinking nutritious waters. Maybe you could be our team manager. Maybe a sona can be our team mom, and you can be the manager. I wanna be, I wanna lose it all the time. I wanna be someone who gets to give a yellow card. That's a rest. Yeah, I'd like to be a wrap.

And I would just be thrilled. I would love that. I gets to give a yellow card. That's a wrap. Yeah, that's the very reason. I would just be thrilled. I would love that. I would like that on the podcast. If one of you gets out of line or says something I don't like, I can just toss cards around. You're the one who needs that kind of thing. I'm above the law. No, you're off sides.

I'm on a pony. Soccer. Well, I'm, listen, I'm looking forward to it and maybe I'll come check you guys out. He said not meaning it. Yeah. So does that you go. I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I it and maybe I'll come check you guys out. He said not meaning it. Yeah. So does that you go I did. I did. I'll go the gosh. Oh, yeah. Clearly she wants to get a look at her old coworker in the soccer gear

We're in cleats, shin guards and other things that you wear when you play soccer. No, I'll come. I'm close Yeah, I we've talked bad. I know which park you're gonna go to you. I'll come, I'll come cheer you guys on. I'll chopper in. Okay. Chopper in. Yeah. It's Pasadena. Oh, I can't be expected to drive all that way. I need to call my chopper. Are you gonna land the chopper in the middle of the field? And so many people are gonna get cut up by the blaze. Oh, man. Hello, everyone. Why are people screaming? What's all this blood about?

I'm gonna land on the field with no permit or anything and tear up all the sod. Oh. They do call it sod, don't they? It's artificial turf, which I'm... I call it sod. All right, well listen, good luck to you. Thanks a lot.

And I do applaud you on this effort to get in shape. I think that's great. Thank you. And trust me as a guy who maintains himself in perfect condition, you're gonna enjoy it once you get to where I am now. You said perfect. Yep.

10, 10, 10 out of 10. Okay, established. Hot me, over now. Conan O'Brien needs a friend with Conan O'Brien, Sonom of Obsession, and Matt Gourley. Produced by me, Matt Gourley. Executive produced by Adam Sachs, Nick Liao, and Jeff Ross at Teen Coco, and Colin Anderson and Cody Fisher at Your Wolf.

Themes Song by The White Stripes. Incidental music by Jimmy Vino. Take it away, Jimmy. Our supervising producer is Aaron Blair and our Associate Talent Producer is Jennifer Samples, engineering by Eduardo Perez, additional production support by Mars Melnick, Talent Booking by Paula Davis, Gina Batista, and Britt Con.

You can rate and review this show on Apple Podcasts and you might find your review read on a future episode. Got a question for Conan? Call the team Coco Hotline at 3-2-3-451-2821 and leave a message. It too could be featured on a future episode. And if you haven't already, please subscribe to Conan O'Brien Needs a Friend on Apple Podcasts, Stitcher, or wherever Fine Podcasts are down.

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