Conan O’Brien Needs A Friend - Maria Bamford

Episode Date: September 18, 2023

Actress and comedian Maria Bamford feels excited about being Conan O’Brien’s friend (if he needs her friendship). Maria sits down with Conan to discuss her new book Sure, I’ll Join Your Cult: A Memoir of Mental Illness and the Quest to Belong Anywhere, the compulsion to consider everything and to share everything, being trained in the Suzuki method of violin, and the roadblocks of getting treatment for an eating disorder. Plus, Conan and his team celebrate the 30 year anniversary of his debut on Late Night. For Conan videos, tour dates and more visit TeamCoco.com.Got a question for Conan? Call our voicemail: [phone]. This episode was recorded on 8/8/2023.

Hi, my name is Marie Bamford. And I feel excited about being Conan O'Brien's friend if he needs my friendship. Also don't want to Conan O'Brien. Why is everyone laughing? You gave it such a build up like it was gonna be something revolutionary. You did weird voices with your mouth. I warmed up and went, I'm then I went, hey there.

This is Conan O'Brien. Welcome to Conan O'Brien, needs a friend, the podcast that gives and gives and gives. And then eventually gives out. That's the key. Sitting here with of course Matt, Gourley Matt, how are you? Hi, I'm good, thanks.

Usually I introduce Sonah first, but I thought I'd flip it up. Oh, okay. Show you that I'm agile, I have an agile mind. Sonah, how are you? Shake things up. How are you? Introducing Matt first.

Yeah, you never know what's gonna happen here. Keep it fresh. Keep it fresh. How are you? I'm good, I'm not bad. I'm cool. Okay, all right, very good. But do you want me to say more?

No, I think that's adequate. You know, you did the minimum amount that you should do. I am fine and you. I think AI is, do you think AI can ever replace? So everyone's talking about what AI can do. Yeah. There already are AI podcasts of, say, a Joe Rogan and I'm sure there's already been some of you.

You think so? Yeah, I think this is very easily AI-able. I don't know. My mind is so hard to program or categorize. I could see algorithms being confused by my magical brain. Really? The listeners should know that Sonan are just sitting in a room with an AI machine right now.

I think the two of you are not AI-able, but I think I am. I sound true. And I just go, oh, God, boo, boo, boo, boo, boo, Corydum, like that's what I do. And that's why. You're right. Yeah.

We could probably just take clips of Sonar. Oh, absolutely. You know, oh, boy, huh. Oh, really, really? That's what you think? Yeah. And then we just split our salary. Well, I would retain it all, I believe.

Oh, what's in it for me then? Oh, nothing. You get nothing. And I get more falcons. I really got into falconry over the summer. Yeah. Yeah. You did. Wouldn't be great if that was something I got into. And I had the, the glove and I had a whole bunch of falcons and they had the little blinders on. And I had the jackets that they wear when they should do that. No, you'd be the least falcony guy that's ever falconed because you'd just be like this the whole time like covering your power. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I'd wear a, you know what people wear when they're fencing. I'd wear one of those complete cages around my face.

And and the falcon would be rolling his eyes a lot. Oh, good. They put the, put the blinders, they put the blinder on just so I couldn't see it roll its eyes. That's what they're there for. I would have sarcastic falcons. Sarcastic passive aggressive falcons. Anyway, I've always been fascinated by the idea of falconry. Should do. Have you ever done it?

No. I think we did on late night, we did so many animal segments over the years that I know I've probably had, I'm sure I've had a falcon on my shoulder and a falcon on my arm, fans can look for it and I sure it'll come up instantly. Whenever I say no, I've never done blank, instantly someone can find it on the internet.

So yes, I'm certain that I've done it on television, but no, I don't even know how I would actually, to be honest with you, I don't even know how I would actually to be honest with you, I don't even know what it is. I think it's a thing now actually in the LA area like a sort of thing that hipsters can go do and stuff. Hipsters do everything that comes from another time and has no use.

Do you know what I mean? Like churning butter, axe throwing, axe throwing, surgery. I want you know, I want a hipster surgeon. When it's time for me to have surgery, I want a hipster to do. These are authentic rust laden tools from the 18th century. Exactly, yeah. These are, no, and exactly what we do surgery before, the way it was done before the 20th

century, because all got so sterile. We do it with these rusty tools. And we all grow weird beards and we don't clean them. And then the oily beard hair falls into your open wound. Yeah. Fuck you hipsters. No, I'm not doing that. No, we're not doing that.

I thought we were doing that because you guys got a little. That's half of Matt's friends. You got to admit. No, I don't have hipster friends. You don't have hipster friends. Come on. No, I don't think I do. I think I have pretty square friends.

Okay. Yeah. Well, some squares are also hipsters. I guess that's true. Maybe. I don't know. You can't judge yourself from within. Huh?

What? What are you guys talking about? You know what? You've tried to sell that poster to college campuses. You can't judge yourself from within and it's a cat hanging on a limb, or it's Einstein sticking out his tongue. I bet I could sell that to him.

You can't judge yourself from within. You know what'd be great to just come up with terrible slogans and try and sell them to college campuses. You would be so good at that. You're the one that you knew you had to be. Yeah. And then there's a turtle, bumping heads with another turtle.

Just try to sell those on campus. Watch yourself get married. I mean, just, what's the image? No, the image never has anything to do with the sale. Yeah, like a glass of water. Yeah, it's just that glass of water. And then the saying is whenever you think you were, that was a glass of water. Yeah, it's just that glass of water. And then the saying is, whenever you think you were, that was what it was.

And it's just a Volkswagen. It's a yellow Volkswagen. Tomorrow is yesterday's idea of what you ate. And then it's a baby elephant sleeping, wearing a sombrero. We're gonna sell that to somebody. Yeah, we really have to do that. I'm merch.

I'm smelling merch. I want more. Can you do another one? These are fun. Yeah. Well, okay. Come on, make me laugh. Clown.

This AI is working pretty well. It is working really well. It gets him. Sunshine is the regret you used to know during daylight. And then just put underneath it through. You can just put anybody's name underneath it. You know what I love to do is just is sell a whole bunch that are like shit's going down. Gandhi. That's good. You know, that's what I want to do. Who farted? Fakare.

Back that shit up. Jane Austen. I want to sell those right now. We're on it. Right? Isn't that the way? Back that shit up. Jane Austen. Right? Isn't that the- Isn't that- Back that sh- Back that sh- Back that sh- Shut up!

Jane Austen. Okay! Hahaha! Hahaha! That's what we absolutely have to do. We're gonna get sued by everyone's estate. Oh come on. They're not paying attention to you.

Oh, okay. Fair use. The copyright is a spider. Everyone knows how Jane Austen talked. Yeah, if anyone knows it's you too about copyright law, there we go. We're good. I'm crying. I'm actually crying a little bit.

The fact that shit up got me really good. Drop it like it's hot. Oh. Melville. I'd hit that. I Hit that Mary Todd Lincoln Oh my god We're gonna sell these we should and I don't see any legal or moral reason why we should I don't think there could be Because you can do anything with those historical figures if you've liked what I've just said

Right to me, Cara, of Make That Postor, dude. At 22, 22, Scooby-Doo Avenue. Uh-huh. Yeah. And I'll get right back at ya, postage included. No city, no state.

Oh, come on, man. Yeah, state of cool. Oh. City of here and now. Yep. Shabby-Doo Ding Dong. Habescoba Day. city of here and now. Shabby-Doo Ding Dong, Habescoba Day, Adavute-Doo-Doo. I got a pull-a-plug on this. I'm the one person.

My wife is going to have me attach to a machine and then pull the plug. She's going to have the plug inserted just so she can pull it. And I'll be perfectly healthy. Yeah. Smart. All right, we gotta get into it. Yeah. My guest today is a hilarious comedian

who starred in the Netflix series Lady Dynamite. She now has a new memoir titled, Sure, I'll Join Your Colt, a memoir of mental illness and the quest to belong anywhere. ["Maria Banford"] Maria Banford, welcome. ["Maria Banford"] I've talked to so many comedians either on late night, but especially on this show.

And they talk about these early jobs they've had. These people have had some really crazy jobs. But you had one that you talk about in the book, where it's early, you're trying to get into show business. It hasn't quite gelled in stand-up yet, and you get this gig doing some kind of a star trek show at Deep Space Nine. Deep Space Nine, but it's a live show that you did at a mall. Yes. And, okay. Paramount had a subsidiary named did it a mall? Yes. And okay. Paramount had a subsidiary named Paramount Park. So I'm sure has been dissolved in a man named Stan Ranet. And he's always a Stan. Stan would tell us about fantastic new gigs. We're doing a Jack of the Bronx promotion. You and a Klingon want to go out and we drive out to Pomona and stand around

saying things like greetings. I am Major Lankar of the Planet Bejor. And get the fuck away from me. So you had to memorize all this stuff? Uh, I was, I can sometimes be half-assed when it comes to certain jobs So stand up I really care about but that one I I know I could have gone deep into the Bajoran history and Star Trek itself. I did not you didn't do it in makeup and stuff. Oh, yes. This is my genetic makeup. Do you speak of oh spirit gum? genetic makeup. Do you speak of spirit gum? Oh, so you had to, if any kids said to you, a nice mask, you'd have to say mask.

Oh, what do you speak or a creature that kind of stuff? Yes, oh, yes. Well, that's what I did. No one told me to do it. Did you go, oh, you go off. Natural gift. And what is the, in the book, you talk about going off script a bit. Yeah, yeah, which was really funny. Well, because the, in the book, you talk about going off script a bit, which was really funny. Well, because I did read a little bit about those jorns and it turned out they were kind of,

what I felt like it was sort of the World War II Jewish experience of that realm. And so, and this is sci-fi. It's not real, but you decided to go deep into that and then bring that to the mall and tell kids about it. Is that correct? My parents, the last I saw from them, I was in the attic of my parents' house. Yes, we had houses! We were not animals. Oh, you have a wrinkly face.

We are not too different to you and I. And I was playing with my paper dolls. Yet all I have left is my parents says this bloody paper doll. I heard this scream. You were saying this to kids at a mall. Listen. Hey lady, I just want some jolabies. Yeah. I got a 45 minute shift. I got to keep their attention. We're in the That would have my attention Oh You think I should be with a fringy Because you'd like to see what would come out from us

What what child What? What child blew it up? You just... Think of all the kids out there right now that are gonna be stand-ups and write books like yours because they went to the mall one day. Oh, there's a fun alien. How dare you look at me? I was molested by a grogga! Nine tentacles it was! Even though I felt a little pleasure, that pleasure. Wait a minute, what?

You kind of liked it somewhat. The infusion of the trauma is that you can't feel the shame of pleasure. We've got to get this to the Star Trek people. This is good stuff. This is very good stuff. No, but I want to acknowledge that the Star Trek, it is a real world and I did not need to poop on it. Why don't you do it?

I think you should. It's not like when you do a show you have to acknowledge the native land that you're having. It's fair game. Now you do a start track You do you acknowledge this is all taken from Gene Roddenberry Let me issue and up okay first of all an apology apology you have to tweet out an apology number one I have to find out what I did wrong that's the supposed to think when you do an apology say what is it that I did Maria You know thing when you do an apology say what is it that I did Maria you know you know no because then I have to that's what I do then I repeat what the person says that I did you know paraphrasing and

that then I take that in and then I order a book about it and then say, I bought this book, is that a book to get? And then they usually say, yeah, I mean, I didn't really, it wasn't a big deal to me. I was just, I didn't think you would read this. So wait, I'm really, the torture you put yourself through in the smallest ways and you're such a lovely person. I want to lift that burden from you. I do. I'm not going to. No, no.

But I, you know, there's a delightful safety in OCD in feeling, you know, that feeling of like, oh, if I did just the right thing, then you can find relief. It never happens. I never happens. I'm at ease wondering, but no, yeah, I'd like to, I like to feel like I I fully executed the best. I'm sorry.

If you have you had to apologize for things publicly? Oh, sure. Yeah, my pretty much my whole career. But it's been, I think of my 30 years as one long, one long apology, one long backing out of a cocktail party. You want to give it another shot right now? Just a little more coverage. Okay, but America, you know, I meant well. My mom at the end of her life was just sort of like constantly saying, sorry, sorry, sorry.

You know, just sort of like a water off a duck's back like, I'm just going to keep going and apologizing as I go. Whoops, it's not a bad strategy because sorry sorry sorry sorry sorry sorry it means that you're gonna get it right sometimes. Yeah, it's not a bad it's not a bad default. It's a good thing for you to just sort of do now. Yeah, I don't think so. Okay. Now we're in an interesting time as we've record this because the writer strike is going. Money, let's talk about it. Well, wow, you really lit up, right?

Oh my God. Yeah, people are fighting over money and all kinds of stuff. And so, but one of the things about the writer strike is that there's this rule that, and we all want to do the right thing, that podcasts, you know, can't promote certain projects, but I am allowed to talk about books that I love that people have written.

And that's why I wanted to talk to you because you've written a book, Sure, I'll Join Your Cult. And which is a fantastic title. Sure, I'll Join Your Cult by Maria Bamford. And you are adored you are a beloved stand-up comic and you wrote a Fantastic book and I just wanted to say start off by saying congratulations and to everyone listening right now Go get this book. It's fantastic and there's so much to talk about here because your whole career has been You are so open about what you've been through

and man you've been through a lot. Well listen, I like to, well, monetize self-real, yeah, I like telling everybody everything and it turns out that's a cash cow. So, so you're going to say monetize your pain. Yeah, well, or just like, have you ever read the book, the giving tree? Yeah, yeah, where, which I'm trying to rewrite it as the giving condo. But all there was was the shade of the condo. You can lay in the shade. You can't come in because you sold it to Russia. But the giving tree, the premise is the tree gives everything until finally all there is

this stump for the little boy to sit on who is now an old man. And yeah, I have nothing left to give except, you know, stories. I do like, I like open book accounting. That's one of my last things I have to give. I'm a multi-millionaire. I am worth $3.5 million in assets. So that's multi- and you know, so I feel like my dad passed away, which means he was a physician.

I am white, it was generational wealth. So I'm, I'm doing okay over here. And I think the one thing I have to give is full, you know, full disclosure. Full disclosure. Yeah, full disclosure. Yeah, because I love companies that do that, Chobana Yogurt, where they taught everybody in the company got to take it counting classes and then find out what everything in the

yearly report means So there's actually some way you can argue wait for a raise or to go. Oh, that's why I'm paid that I'm listening. Yeah Listen, I go a different route than Chabani. See, I go more of a, I don't know, let's say Vladimir Putin route. Yeah. It's no one's business. How much wealth there is in the walls of the Kremlin?

No mysteries. And uh, yeah. If people ask any questions, they just go away. Yes. There's a lot of poison, poison in the muffins. Yeah. Oh, by the way, Gory, have a muffin. Uh, whiteboard. Whiteboard.

Whiteboard. Whiteboard. Whiteboard. Whiteboard. Whiteboard. Whiteboard. Whiteboard. Whiteboard.

Whiteboard. Whiteboard. Whiteboard. Whiteboard. Whiteboard. Whiteboard. Whiteboard. bit of like a, because I found that, I find this stuff fascinating and not because I know anything like I don't know anything about money, nor do I know if I'm doing the right thing or the wrong thing. But it is such an emotional topic. I find it, you know, people get so mad or so embarrassed or so shamed, including myself, like every time I see my account and I'm just like, mm, it doesn't matter what they're saying. You know, oh, you're in the same amount.

Oh, dear. Like, it doesn't, yeah, it's the emotions don't match the numerics. It's interesting. It flips, it can flip so quickly from the flip between gratitude that you have something and rage that you don't have more of that thing is so instantaneous and it's such a human thing.

You know. For somebody asking, have you ever been asked to do something for free? Oh yeah. Right. So which, sometimes, you know, if I think, like sometimes let's say, and this is a current schtick I'm working on, but Grimis,

why I know Grimis, it doesn't even matter who the person is, but sometimes you get a text from a famous person at a Ron Binti on a Saturday night who says, you know, in sort of a business you up. And let's just say it was Grimis, which is the limo-mel-space between the hamburger and marimek cheese.

Do you remember Grimis? He was yeah, love He was the purple guy in purple, but didn't he represent the shakes the milk shake? Well, didn't they just put out a grimace shake in Commemoration Yeah, he's definitely doing well grimace is that finally having his moment. Yeah, and I love grimace But then Grimmis it hey, do you want to work on this thing tomorrow? And I know. Grimis the character from McDonald's, it's a place

hold. It's a placeholder for someone I know Vladimir Putin. Oh, I see. I see. Okay. You could have just said someone I know. Why are we talking about grimace? Because it has to have the weight and the celebrity and the authority. And the fear involved, the inside involved of meeting someone as powerful as grimace, face to face in your own living room. Like there's some sort of like your nash ache a little bit. And I basically, and also, the minute you said grimace, I know it's celebrity you're talking about.

But go ahead. So I, you know, I texted on with friends in debtors and on this, which is a 12 star program, which is a lot like Tony Robbins. If Tony Robbins was a small, it was about four or nine. And talk like this. Anyways, and I said, you know what? I really want to get paid for this. And so I asked, I asked Grimmis for about 800 bucks.

And 300 bucks was to pay the venue that he wanted to use paid for this. And so I asked I asked Grimitz for about 800 bucks. And 300 bucks was to pay the venue that he wanted to use in my neighborhood. A hundred bucks would be the tips for the barista to keep it quiet. 200 bucks to, oh no, 100 bucks for the person who we were going to commandeer and to doing something with us. And then 300 bucks for myself because I have an addiction to clogs. Anyways, this all sounds for by the way, this all sounds very reasonable. Reasonable. So now, Grimis, who I adore, I think the way he paid out the money was in hundreds in a very slow fashion.

Passive aggressive. Yeah, in a way that suggested he did not have the money. And I know that's not true. Can't possibly be true. No, Grimis. I mean, now that money from the shakes and yeah, it's not grimace, but you know, I would yeah. Billion served, right? So I just, yeah, it's that kind of thing where I think I need to have empathy for Grimis because obviously they're hurt. Like they're hurt by me asking for money. Like there's something offensive of me asking for money and then, you know, and also, I'm, it's just interesting. Whether or not it means anything.

What's it for a charitable event? No, no. Oh, okay, that's so different. Oh, wow. I do a lot of things and I don't want to, you know, shoot my own horn, but I give and give and give. Yeah. Somebody charitable causes, but that I get, I understand.

Sure, I'll show up and and do the thing. And here's my argument with charity kicks. I am often asked by a fan. The people they're trying to get money from are not fans. They are very wealthy people in Napa Valley or somewhere where I recently did a benefit and bombed so hard because people in Napa Valley, they've had some wine, they don't want to hear about schizophrenia research and my chunk on suicidal ideation. They would like to have how a mandel come up as soon as possible. And that's why that's why I refuse to do benefits.

Because I just think it's, I'm hurting people. I got to a point and there's no way around it, but tell me if you agree, performing for people who are eating. No. That's the thing that when I hear chewing and I hear silverware and gulping when I'm trying to tell a joke that I sweat it over, I'm very unhappy. Thanks a lot, Gourmet. Gourmet is also eating a massive cobbler right now with a big wooden spoon. Yeah, it feels sad. And if there's, I mean, I don't know, if some people are enjoying themselves,

for me, I feel like it's like a, a gig where it's like combat duty where I'm like taking a bullet for somebody. And so it's like, it's unnecessary and everybody's suffering. I think it's right and healthy for you to say, okay, here's what I need in return. It's not outrageous. You just wanted to pay off some people and you wanted some clogs. That is very reasonable. Thank you so much.

Well, and I just, it is also fascinating. Just I'm a comedian who, you know, I'm in the middle of the pack or whatever. So the opening salary for comics has not gone up in the 30 years that I've been working. So people are still getting a hundred bucks a week, to a two hundred bucks a week. And I think many, I didn't know that.

And so I started asking people and I was like, say what? Like, because I'm, I'm making tons more than that, you know? I mean, depending on what city I'm in. But let's be honest. Yeah. It's also a Oklahoma and not so much. Not a draw.

Not a draw. I won't be back. It's fine. Do you realize you're crying right now? Yes. Lots of tears. But I find it very interesting, including for myself, like there is no reason I should ever feel afraid or angry about money ever again, ever again.

And yet I do all feel like this weird thing. Also with Grimis, like I did not have to do the gig. I could have said no, because I got friends. I got enough love in my life. What is it that's pushing me to feel like, oh, I gotta get the prestige or the bright, someone to pay more attention to me, which is so sad, which I loved about a John Malini special of like,

now I just need to get a little more attention. That's the only thing I need. But yeah, so and that's weird too, you know, like, and it's about greed, you know, greed of attention, but greed of, you know, which I think is a part of our society in terms of why are the rich getting so much richer and why, anyways. I'm sorry, I fell you just said and also from your book, which is you are constantly, I mean, just now you're talking, you're analyzing society, but also yourself, but also what does money mean? There's so much that you're thinking about all the time and it all goes back to this,

I want you to say compulsion. Yes. To think and consider everything. Yes. And you talk a lot about OCD and how you've been battling OCD really your entire life. Yeah. I mean, now it's not so bad because you know, once you find out what the thing is, you know,

you go to it and then they go, oh, that's just that. And you go, oh, once you put a name on it, you take away its power. Yeah. Yeah. So, yeah, I have intrusive OCDs, which usually are taboo thoughts. So whatever is taboo in your society, you know, when you were a kid, you told your mother, yes, because it's in the book, you told your mother that you had these thoughts of harming the family. Yes. And she said, book you told your mother that you had these thoughts of harming the family. Yes. And she said, honey, it's okay if you're gay. Well, now you just added a whole set of.

Yep. That's how that's how a gay person comes out. I'm thinking of murdering the family. Yeah. And somehow being homosexual was worse in the 80s than being a serial killer. Right. I can't be more like Ted Bundy. He's had for a sexual.

Now, at least like the ladies, you say, you say that your mom, because you talk a lot about your mom and you talk about how she was kind of, you think one of the catalysts or one of the, maybe moving forces behind you getting into show business. Totally. Why, how? My mom, well, she loves things that are shiny, but she also, and this is something I realized after she passed, I was like, she had like style,

like she knew what was the best thing, and now I realized, oh, she just chose to see everything she got as the best. So this microphone is just darling. No, you can tell it's quality. It's made, it's handcrafted by someone in the water. Oh, I love it, Conan. I love it.

I'm a lucky kitty. But that's actually a lovely quality. Yes. So how does that translate into you wanting to go into show business? Well, because she was often distracted, which I think may have been a result of not getting enough calories, but you know, I was sort of like, it needed to have some shine on it. So my sister became a physician. That seemed to get her enough attention like, oh, well, my, my older daughter is a, is a doctor and she has four children with her husband, Mark. And

then, you know, and then it was sort of me on my end. It was quiet for a number of years. Oh, Mary is just figuring it out. She's just figuring it out. But like, oh, my God, as soon as, you know, she has been, well, the first TV spot I got was on your show, you know, that's a 1999. I think. Yeah. You came on late night. She's on television.

Like, she would just light up about, yeah, consumer or anything with a, yeah, she loves status, love status. I have, I have talked about this in the before on the podcast, but I have this picture on my desk that someone took when I was at an event, it was my parents, it was probably 15 years ago, and it's both of my parents laughing really hard, because I'm on stage in the picture, I'm not in the picture,

it's just both my parents laughing really hard. And I asked someone, showed me that picture and I said, can I have that and And I framed it. And I keep them on desk because if anyone ever needs the reason why, and it's very primal. Yeah, you are. But it is, see those two people that made me laughing? That's why.

That's why. That's the whole thing. And as you know, I'm wondering if it's, I guess I've in your book, you make it clear that when you get up on stage and you get that kind of approval and laughter, it does resonate because you've felt it before. It's when you were a kid and your parents were going,

yay, it feels. Hey, get on the bus for Papa. Yeah, it's the same dopamine head. Oh, it's just delightful. I don't know if anybody you've heard of Suzuki violin or it's a way people teach their kids music and it came out of Japan. And it all is all about if you teach a kid early enough, they can do anything. So you start at two years old, you will have a weirdly, you know, talented, whatever it is. Very unhappy.

Yeah, perhaps unhappy, dependent on. Now for dance. But you can, you know, kids can do anything. So, and you talk about this in the book because you did Suzuki violin. What age did you start? Three. Now whose idea was it your mom and your dad?

Well, they said, I mean, you can do dance or or violin and I didn't really know what either of those were You're three. I was three. So I said one at the V sound and then Start doing that. No, what little did I know what she said which I didn't understand that either said you cannot quit and two year or 12 years old And I didn't understand time and how that worked. But yeah, I mean the great thing about that, it kept me off the pipe, off the pole, and also... Actually, it's something you could use on the pole. Yeah, I mean kids are incredibly malleable, and if you look as a parent that you're pleased at the actions that they're performing, whether that's factory work in a chicken parts situation,

or you will do it. You will continue to do it and get back at it. How good did you get at piano using this method? I got, I mean piano violent, yeah. I mean, be funny if you got really good at the piano. That'd be very strange. You know, weirdly good, where you go, oh, wow, that's crazy.

You know, where I think I got to book eight out of 10 and I went to the interlock in music camp, international music camp in... Did it give you any joy? Not really. I did not enjoy it. The part I liked was getting up on stage. I liked that part.

And then I kind of like the feel of victory. Like if I whooped somebody, like if somebody didn't do well, and then I did well, like, which is monstrous. And what I like more was getting laughs and stuff because I did some theater and stuff as a kid and speeches. Yeah. But then I moved to Los Angeles.

There were two other comedians who are female doing acts with violence. And so I said to myself, I think I can kick this to the curb now. Any young women? Any young women. Well, I think any young women genuinely love to play. And Jack Benny famously played. I played much, I think, better violin than he let on.

Right. But it was part of his act as well, which is everyone hates my violin playing, you know. Right, that's a good act. There's so many themes you touch on in the book. Food is one of them. Yes, food. Let's talk about food.

Take me through your food journey, because it's been fraught. Fraught? Well, I mean, I think you know, and I've talked out there community, you know, said I was Bluemick, which Bluemick,ia is one of the ways you can be bleemist just binge and then purge through exercise. You don't necessarily have to have been a vomiting purger.

So maybe I don't count to some people because it is a competitive sport. Um, and I did. And what? A little vomiter, eh? Oh my God. You get into treatment and people are like, uh, and I did, and we, Oh, vomiter, eh? Oh my god, you get into treatment and people are like, so I mean, have you blown out your exophagus? Like it does get, I mean, are you really a heron addict?

Like it always gets competitive at that point. This is so fascinating to me because this is what human beings do. Everything is a competition. You could be on a raft in a boat with three other people starving to death in the ocean because you've been at sea for, and you're drinking your own urine for six weeks. And people like, you call that skinny?

Yeah, I do. Look at this over here. My pelvis is cutting through my skin, all right? People, there's something. Some people like, yeah. So you're saying that you're in treatment and you're getting attitude from people that don't think you qualify. Oh, shit.

Yeah. Yeah, no. Like, yeah, what, what are you here for? I, I worked at a grocery store so I could binge carrots and my, my skin could turn, you know, orange, you know, that type of thing. I, yeah, it was, it was bad enough that I was unable to get stuff done, you know. So, I was unable to leave my dorm room when I was in college. And so I called the suicide hotline, said hello.

And they gave me the number to overeaters anonymous. What? A white woman was bullying my cottage start. Anyways, so it's not that interesting of a story. And in fact, I've told the comedians and they're just like, yeah, that's everybody's, well, then everyone has a needing disorder. And I'm like, well, okay, fair enough. I don't think you should be looking

to other comedians for sympathy. Because they're, it's where the, we're all the worst people. So that's the first problem. Hey, that's not funny. You got to punch that up. Yeah, yeah. The part where you call the suicide hotline. No, no, you don't end there. You punch it with this. Okay, you're talking on the wrong beauty. Well, and it 988, if you need to call it, but sometimes there is a 45 to 90 minute wait. So call anybody. I called Hertz,

Rhonda card, South Pasadena, California. They picked up on them first ring. Um, anyways, just FYI, 988 is not always, uh, are you being serious right now that I am being told this is important because you've been through this experience and you've had very dark thoughts. And this is something to take seriously. Yeah. Uh, 988 is the number you call if you're having suicidal thoughts or fear of hurting yourself or someone else. And, uh, but, but if you don't get them, or fear of hurting yourself or someone else.

But if you don't get them, do you really believe that you should call anyone else? Oh, I think, yeah, lower the bar to accessing mental health because there's such, I don't know, I think it's such a low to bullshit like they have all these memes going, hey, you asked for help, you know, tell someone. And it's like, you can act in an appointment. If you have insurance for six weeks, six to eight weeks, and it's like you can act in an appointment. If you even have insurance for six weeks, six to eight weeks and then only see you maybe four times if you've had a traumatic event and that event you couldn't only have a therapist like a chisers notorious for this where they can only see you once a month.

Even if you have a shit ton of money, you can throw money in the street, burn it. And then sometimes there's some shitty. I went to, I went to the hospital too, because I was concerned about myself for a night, for a three, three day hold. And I thought they took my insurance, turned out they didn't. They said they needed all the money and cash which made me laugh in retrospect because isn't spending an enormous amount of money on something that's gonna be worthless a sign of mania but but it was not good

It wasn't great like if you look in the back of the New Yorker and there's all those mental health care places If you read about experiences people have had there, it's just a holding take. I went to this one place where it's very expensive. They said they had yoga classes, a pool, you get there, nothing's going on, nothing's happening. It's a lot of carbs, there's hash browns, you will put on at least 20 pounds and the pool is closed.

Pool is closed due to insurance concerns. This is most motels, I've stated. Most motels. There's hash browns and the pool is closed. Pool is closed due to insurance concerns. This is most motels, I've stated. The most motels. There's hash browns and the pool is always closed. Yeah, well, that's why. I think you went to a motel. Hampton, hampton, hampton in. But just, yeah.

Yeah, but I think you can feel like you've been gassed sometimes like, oh, am I not getting the right care and just know it will be shit. Like, and be surprised if you get anything a little better than, you know, if you get any eye contact, you know, just, I just, I hate that thing where it's like, hey, you with the ongoing trauma in the schizo effect disorder, get on my side!

Take a walk! You know, and it's like, it's not that easy. Nor is it always pleasant. One of the things that you do so well, so effectively is, and effective is a cold term, because I admire the way you do it. You're brutally honest about all these painful things you've been through, and you never, you're always funny too at the same time.

You manage to get the salty and the sweet mixed up very beautifully, and I think that's edifying. That's helpful for a lot of people, you know? That's my current thing in terms of all the department line, but now I call the anti-abortion people because all their literature says life is a gift. Have them take the time to prove it to you. I recently called, hi, I'm not pregnant, my mother was, and that's sausage bitch. She kept it. Now it's 52 years later, what's the plan? I would really like to be placed in a loving home. That's beautiful.

I've got some phone calls out like to make. I think we all have some calls with like to make. But yeah, and I think we can also still be there for each other a lot more that the peer advocacy I've just trained to be a peer advocate and a lot of you can have lived experience to take a test and then be paid to work in the mental health system If you have lived experience with addiction or mental health and I think we can help each other a lot more by being, you'll be more open with it and then also the availability of like, hey, yeah, you don't have to go into a hospital necessarily or find the right therapist, which is a thing in Los Angeles, like, you've got to see this guy.

He's a psychopharmacologist. He's on retainer. So it's five grand a month, but I see him on a helicopter pad. And he really helped. He helped grimace so much. Yeah. Yeah. And I love grimace. Let's be clear about that. Well, you know, that's the other possibility is that we used to live, and I always think about evolution, we evolved and we evolved to live in groups of about, I don't know, 50, 60. All of us would live in a small area

and the postman would come in when he brought you the mail and sit with you and you'd offer him a piece of coffee cake and you'd talk for 20 minutes and there was a lot of that kind of bonding. Yeah, if... I don't want my postman to come in and there's no coffee cake. But get for 20 minutes and there was a lot of that kind of bonding. Yeah. If I don't want my postman to come in and there's no coffee cake. But get to know the names of your barista.

Who knows what they've been through or taken at a, you know, community college. Like I feel like that is genuinely can be like, I mean, I try to mention I'm bipolar everywhere I go so that you don't have somebody needed something just because I think that that kind of, yeah, safety net of, yeah, you're surrounded by people who can help and who wanna help. Everybody wants to feel useful. Everyone wants to have an IRL experience.

So. So you've been diagnosed with bipolar too. Yes, which is the that's the the easier sort of bipolar from one of my part. So you've had a competitive conversation with someone who's bipolar 1. Oh, bipolar 2. Well, that must be a nice holiday. So you've never had psychosis. I was told to murder by my dog. And you've been in several psych warts. Talk about that in the book. Just two different ones.

Glendale, Advenous Psychiatric Medical Center. I was in West, Psych West. And then I was at the last and seen us still in business. Do not recommend it. You just gave them a bad yelp review. Well, no, no, I never give bad reviews. I always feel like everyone's having a hard enough time. Well, here's the thing, the psychiatrist there, who has since retired.

He, when I went in, yeah, I got to see a psychiatrist, which is amazing. And he, not only, he Googled me during the session, but then played some of my act back to me and said, oh, you're pretty funny. Unless I say I'm Richard Pryor, you know, like I'm, wait until I've left. You know, if I'm having some sort of experience

where I think I'm somebody else I'm just assume Well, maybe she's a comedian like maybe she's like because I think I said I was a comedian Which is always a terrible idea to say in a Hospital circumstance, but I yeah, isn't the first thing you get tell me a joke. Oh, yes Or wherever seeing you or you know and all the jobs have that sort of thing, you know, I know I've heard people say, if, you know, you're an administrative assistant. Oh, oh, like, you know,

that's not as you don't get any questions. Right. And you have a lot to say. Yeah. When you go to these places and you're in that state, are you ever thinking about comedy or looking around and thinking? No. No. No. I mean, if you're having a emergency event for any sort of, whether that's a physical or a mental issue, you're not, yeah, no, no. You're in a completely altered

state. Yeah, just, yeah, no, I wanted to, I wanted to die. I was not feeling good, yes. So, no, it's like something's broken or you don't go, you know, this pain. I know somebody take notes on this. I mean, maybe you are. I worry that I would, but I'm deeply, I'm like, how could I use this?

But I did pain, you're describing, to be honest with you, is a pain I have not felt. So I cannot relate. Yeah, I hadn't, and I hadn't felt that either. I don't think I had felt that, of just like your brain, I wasn't there. I wasn't there. And that feeling of like, oh, there's no me here.

And yeah, I just did not, like every moment was excruciating. I was so grateful when they came around with the meds. I was just like, oh my god, knock me out with a hammer. And they don't do that anymore. That was the 60s. But yeah, that ended with the three stuages. But that was really nice.

Like Jonathan Winters, he had had, I think a few psychotic episodes. And in the 60s, I think they would just, everyone was just, there was just a big jar of allium. And then they would, they'd just numb out. And he was there for months but my friend I have a friend who's friends of his and I was so out of it

I was like he's like I'm calling Jonathan. He'll tell you it's gonna be okay, and I'm like okay Oh God I could barely talk, but he was like oh never good shrink. I said well talk, but he was like, well, you know, good shrink. I said, well, yeah, just keep going. I can do it. Just keep going, which is really the only advice anyone can give you. It's also that generation depression era, World War Two fighter pilot keep going. Yes, but sometimes it's the right advice to get, like pull yourself together and keep going. Well, and I think that that is the experience of like a suicidal depression really has given

me empathy for people in my life who have committed suicide. I think there's tremendous guilt, but also sometimes people are angry at people who commit suicide. And that you just don't know the level of suffering someone has experienced. And anyways, I don't know why I'm laughing. That's an appropriate. That makes you kind of a monster, I think. Oh, owch.

Owch is not the appropriate response to me calling you a monster. Hitler, you're a monster. Owch. Stolen your Satan. Ow. Oh, hey, you. Stalin, you're Satan. Oh, hey, oh. Oh, spicy. You said that one of the causes of your break was you lost your dog.

You were really connected to your dog. Yes. Blossom. Blossom. The awesome pod. Blossom. He asked downtown. She said super. Yes, a long time. A long time, the awesome pug. Blah, sun, me, a stunt, she's a super. Anyways, you guys don't know it. What was that? It was a song.

He read a song for every dog that you get. He read a song from. And she's a beautiful girl. And I was, I think I was kind of going into a hypomaneic state. And so, but one of the things I did is I forgot to put a ramp back to our back of our backyard. And so she fell on Louise did out to the beach. She was around nine years old and

she died. And it really sucked. And I felt so ashamed. And the great thing is that if you do anything horrible, you can Google it and someone else will come up and so I started talking about on stage people were like, I sat on my rabbit. You know, like put on purpose. Yeah, oh no. Oh, but that's how I took my rhythm out. Well, I thought it was the quickest way.

I said, you're going to get a little sit down, Mr. But everything miserable has happened to somebody. Yeah. Somebody's left the baby in a hot car and then you know written a book bottom is now on tour and that's the great thing about the internet is that you can find that you are never alone. Yeah. But yeah, that was just I felt so awful. But you know, it is, it is, I mean, we all, I know you have a dog, you

have Oki. I have Oki. And you have Margo. Margo. You know, it is, I mean, we all, I know you have a dog, you have Oki. I have Oki. And you have Margo. Margo. You know Margo. Yes. Yes. And I have two dogs, and you get really involved in these animals.

And in a way, you get more involved because you feel like almost you can have them. I don't know. They don't, they're just always there for you. You know, I'm never sarcastic with one of my dogs. You know what I mean? It's just like you, I love you. It's just all the emotions are very pure. That's the difference between a dog and a cat.

I feel like I'm always there for my cat. And she's very sarcastic with me. Oh no, counts her assholes. Yeah, but this one, she's such a plus size model. Oh, let's beat them. She's a sassy lady. Did she put on a kit meal? She puts on fish nuts and then eats them.

Maria, I want to say something about you, which is you're a terrific comedian and I think you're a really brave person because you just put these things out there that I think would be difficult for a lot of people to talk about and you're honest about it and you're, you, whatever alchemy you're performing to make it funny, something nice for other people but also informative, that's a real gift. So thank you.

Yeah, seriously, thank you for being here and for doing this and. Yeah. Thank you so much for having me and it's been a bit of delight. I'm sorry, I didn't get to talk with any of these other lovely people who seem what what are you guys doing over there? Well, that's the thing. We don't know who they are. Yeah, we've never understood. They just sit back there. I'm actually not listening to this podcast. I have another podcast. That's Eduardo and Eduardo designed this studio. Really? Yeah, and did and he asked to be paid and I said, come on, I'm a friend.

We're buddies. You're buddies. Yeah, no. I paid my parents. I paid my parents to work for me. Oh, that's nice. Yeah, no. They didn't get union rights, but they were in one of my

specials and I paid them 900 bucks a piece as well as gave them dinner. Oh, wow. Yeah. It's really nice of you. Spent every penny. I had my parents interned for me and they never got paid and I said they'd get college credit and I never gave it to them. I had them doing like yard work. It wasn't even my yard or anything associated with the show. No, it's just

I was just exactly yeah my 94-year-old dad was weed whacking when he took both of his legs off Anyway, he's doing well. He's a happy torso Maria Bamford. thank you very much. Thank you, Krabby. I think we're celebrating recently a very special anniversary. Yeah, we taped a little bit ahead, so I don't know exactly when this is going to come out, but today is September 13th and my whole career and late night started on September 13th, 1993. So it's been exactly 30 years. Wow. Since I started and it feels like a

luck because so much has happened. It feels like a long time ago, but I will always remember that day that we did our first television show, and a lot of young people don't know or rightly don't care, but at the time it was kind of, who is this guy? I was a complete unknown and hadn't been on television, and so people were, I think half the audience was tuning in just to see someone

try to jump their motorcycle over a canyon and fail. But I have very fun memories of the show. It was a really fun first show. It was electrifying to get to do it. You were a baby. I was 29 when I auditioned. And then I had just turned 30 when I got the job and then we put it together very quickly in a couple of months and I do have to get this all down on paper someday because it is

a wild story. But with the help of really talented, funny people and got a good crew together, some of them are still with me today. Jeff Ross, still with me. Mr. Frank Smiley, still with me. Paula Davis, Gina, of course, Batista. And it has, and Andy, I still see Andy almost every day because he does his podcast here in the building. And so we see each other a lot and And he was out there with me And he had been hired as a writer and immediately I thought this guy. I just want him next to me Because I'm I'm going to them the nose cone of a rocket into space

I'm probably gonna get killed I'd like to have this funny guy next to me and so that was a blessing So there was no original plan for you to have a sidekick. No, there was no original plan for anything. And the whole thing had to come together very quickly. But that first show, we worked really hard. Robert Smigel, my original head writer, he and I had this vision of what we wanted. And we worked very hard. And Jeff Ross was there helping us make it happen. And he was instrumental in the whole operation. And we decided that we wanted this very silly kind of sense of humor.

And we worked so hard, we had pre-tapes, we had everything just lined up. So we knew our first show was gonna be good. We knew it was gonna be loaded with a lot of good stuff. So people subsequently said, oh, you must have been terrified that day. And I remember thinking, no, I was just excited to get going. Really? Yeah, I was. I was excited, I was so excited to get going because the whole summer people were like, who the fuck are you? And that was my mom. So we can have that, you know, how heard about you? From my mom, I was away at college and she said, this is the new guy they're putting on.

Conan O'Brien. And then she really liked you. She watched the show. Well, that's nice. I didn't have a TV at college or I would have tuned to it. It was a different time. No one had... It's funny.

I go back to colleges now and they have televisions and computers or whatever. I just, I didn't have a, of course, there weren't televisions when I went to college. We had curfew top radios. But anyway, it was a really special day. And so it was just funny to wake up today and think, hi, I had some texts from people saying, wow, 30 years ago today, and that changed my life completely. Yeah. Obviously lots of ups and downs, but just I wouldn't change a thing.

Been very fortunate. There have been different eras or sections. And so I went through that whole late night thing and then Sona, I don't meet you till really the end of the late night thing in the beginning of the tonight show. Thanks for your help with that. Oh. So I knew like you were blaming me. No, not people are.

A lot of people. Yeah, okay, okay. Oh, I didn't know that. Oh, I'm sorry. Oh, you were the one thing that changed. Oh, okay. Everything was going along swimmingly. Then I came along.

Like, I can help. Oh, no, look out. You showed up and then that whole era, like the tour and everything at TBS was and this podcast and meeting you, I mean, I just, I know it sounds sappy, but I cannot believe my good fortune. I just keep meeting new people that challenge me in different ways and I get to have more and more fun. It just seems like I am off the charts blast. So half your life you have been a figure. No, that would make me 60. No. Oh, I'm sorry. Oh, yeah. Yeah, we're putting on a press release that I am one third

of your life. I am 30 years ago. Oh, we're putting it my my my publicists had this idea this morning. I'm going to 44 now. Do you want to go back at the opening of the segment and say we recorded this in 1998? Okay. Yes, I do. Okay. Well, I think President Clinton's doing a bang up job.

I just want to take a second to say, no. Yeah, I'm 60 now and I was 29, 29 winning audition then 30 when we did the show. Yeah. And it's so funny when I look at clips now from that first show or that first year of that first show, I can't believe they let that guy on television. He's so young and goofy and my hair was insane.

I don't know why, but I feel like, you know, you found your stride very quickly too, though. I mean, I feel like you started and everyone just started talking about you. That's true. I heard about you from my mom, but then it was all of my friend's circles and we would just watch and eat it up.

I would never tell you probably enough what a fan I was of you. You have never mentioned it. I've mentioned it at least once. We've talked about this. Yeah, maybe in my sleep. I think you might. No, I really, really.

Well, you know what's interesting, and I actually think this is the way things should be, but most of what we heard about back then because there wasn't an internet was we just heard from TV critics who were not happy. And so we heard all this negativity and the network wasn't happy. And so we were only mostly just getting negativity. And then I remember the first summer that we, you know, we made it through the fall and this long dark winter and a lot

of criticism and it was tough. And then we made it to the summer and kids got out of college and they came to see the show live in Rock for our Center and suddenly I'd walk out and the audience and Robert's Michael I talked to him about this here remembers it too starting in June I'd walk out for the monologue or for the warm-up and the crowd would go crazy and we're I would think is there someone behind me? You got that you want? You can't, you can't, you can't, you can't, you can't, you want to see it. But I had no idea, we had no idea. We had no idea. And it was so nice to finally,

and then of course I all went back to school on the fall. Oh, do you think that it would have, you would have read stuff if people talked about it? Because you're very big on not reading. No, but I would have, it wouldn't maybe would have, there are all these young performers today, comedians who were watching then, who tell me who are so established and good,

and they tell me that they were watching then and really liking it, and my reaction is always to a hater, a millennia, or a Nick Crowler, any of these people. Why didn't you tell me? And they're like, that was a kid. Idiot. We didn't know, I thought everyone hated me.

And I did, I sent letters it. We didn't know. I thought everyone hated me. And I did. I sent letters. I shredded all the letters. If there wasn't cash in there, I shredded them. But 30 years. That's truly remarkable and impressive. Yeah, and it is an amazing, because it won't, I don't ever see anything like that happening again.

Really, it just takes someone who no one has ever really heard of and then make them host a story to franchise. Well, also, I think the thing, the television business has changed so much that at the time, now there's so much television that you're always, you can go home at night and you can watch 10,000 television shows literally and all these streaming services

and they could be populated with people you've never heard of. You can go on the computer and watch YouTube clips and it's everybody you've never seen before. But this is back in this other era where literally there's, well, there's two late night shows

and now there's gonna be this third one. So we're giving a third person in America, a chance. Who shall it be? What's the population of America? About three hundred and forty million. All right, who should it be? Lauren Michaels, what do you think? Well, I think maybe Conan O'Brien done. Let's see. We'll need another man. Yeah. Yeah. And so it's just so weird because it's crazy. It's crazy. I shouldn't have had that chance and got it. And I've just been, and then as you know, Sonah met my, Matt Liza shooting a remote on the show.

So that would never have happened. And you met your husband because of the show. And I'm married Matt Gourley because he's here on the podcast, which wouldn't have happened if it weren't for the show. Other people on the show would marry each other and met because of the show. Like there's babies because of the show. Oh yeah.

Many people made babies at 12, 30 at night. Heck, that. Yeah. Because there was nothing else. So many people used to say, yeah, I watched you last night because that was up fucking it. I'd say what an awful phrase. That's too much.

That's the key to your longevity is that you're an aphrodisiac and then you made another generation of people. Yeah. No, I think they made it very clear they were having sex when a cat stepped on the remote in the TV camera. God damn it, I can't finish. Why? Cause that idiot's on's all hairs going everywhere.

It's ways jerking around. He's talking too much. His voice is weird. That comedy is abrasive and strange. And this is you talking with an accident. All right, well, very, uh, feel very fortunate today to just have to, to, to have been around for this ride. Yeah.

And now goodbye for him. Oh, no, wait, that was unforeseen. Well, I just felt like I should ride off now. No, no, no, no. Okay, I'll stick around. Okay, all right, okay. I have a house. Yeah, I've seen it to myself.

Kona no Brian needs a friend with Kona no Brian, Sonom of Sessian and Matt Gory. Produced by me, Matt Gory, executive produced by Adam Sachs, Nick Liao, and Jeff Ross at Team Coco, and Colin Anderson and Cody Fisher at Earwolf. Theme song by The White Stripes. Incidental music by Jimmy Vino. Take it away, Jimmy. Our supervising producer is Aaron Blair, and our Associate Talent Producer is Jennifer Samples.

Engineering by Eduardo Perez, additional production support by Mars Melnick, talent booking by Paula Davis, Gina Batista, and Britt Khan. You can rate and review this show on Apple Podcasts and you might find your review read on a future episode. Got a question for Conan? Call the team Coco Hotline at 669-587-2847 and leave a message. It too could be featured on a future episode. And if you haven't already, please subscribe to Conan O'Brien, Needs a Friend on Apple Podcasts, Stitcher, or wherever Fine Podcasts are down.

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