Conan O’Brien Needs A Friend - Michelle Obama

Episode Date: March 18, 2019

Former First Lady Michelle Obama feels cautiously optimistic about being Conan O’Brien’s friend.Michelle and Conan sit down to talk about Michelle’s memoir Becoming, childhood inspirations, embarrassing her kids, spending time alone with Chipotle, putting the right people in office, and the loss of anonymity.Got a question for Conan? Call our voicemail: [phone].For Conan videos, tour dates and more visit TeamCoco.com.This episode is sponsored by FX - What We Do in the Shadows, SoFi (www.sofi.com/CONAN), Calm (www.calm.com/CONAN), Campaign Monitor (www.campaignmonitor.com/CONAN), Fracture (www.fractureme.com/CONAN), Hair Club (www.hairclub.com/CONAN), MeUndies (www.meundies.com/CONAN), Capterra (www.capterra.com/CONAN), and Audible (www.audible.com/CONANOBRIEN or text CONANOBRIEN to 500500).

Hi, my name is Michelle Obama, and I feel cautiously optimistic about being Conan O'Brien's friend. Hello. Welcome to Conan O'Brien Needs a Friend. This is Conan O'Brien. This is a very special episode of our podcast. We're on a flight to Milwaukee, and the airline has kindly let us set up our podcast equipment, I think in violation of most FAA rules. Today, I'm going to be speaking with former First Lady Michelle Obama, and we are really looking forward to having her on our little show as a guest. I'm joined, as always, by my trusty team of sleepy ninjas, Sona Movesesian, my assistant. Hi, Sona. Hi, Conan. How are you? I am so happy that I get to go on this trip. I have never been so happy to go on a trip with you. Have you met the First Lady before? No. I've worked with her a couple of

times, but you haven't met her. I've gone to a lot of the events where she is, but I've only stared at her from far away. Yeah, that's creepy. Don't do that. I'm going to get our security removed. Yes, and Matt Gorely, of course. Not sure what role you play in this whole thing. I'm literally the producer. That is my role and title. I've never really been in the business a long time. In television, I've never really known what a producer does. I know what I do. This is a thrilling mission, though. I'm so excited to be on board. Now, I want to get right to the point because we don't have time to waste. We're going to be interviewing Michelle Obama. This is a big deal. We need to act like professionals. Okay? Now, yes, we've... You're telling us. Well, I am, frankly, because we can get kind of loose and we can get kind of goofy, and

by we, I mean you too. I'm sort of the anchor, but this is talking to an international icon, someone who's beloved around the world. As I said, a former First Lady, someone who has one of the biggest selling books in the world right now, certainly. And we're going to be talking to her. And I want you guys to be on your A game, you know, because we're going to be around Secret Service. We're going to be around a very professional staff. I'm sure Mrs. Obama has a professional staff. And then I'm going to be stumbling into town with you guys. But you know, I've got this hipster producer. Not a hipster. You have a little latte-making machine that you keep in your back pocket. I don't. That's true fact. And you drive a unicycle to work every day. And you're wearing tweed underwear right now. That is true. From the late 19th century. That is true. Love the

chief. And, Sona, you can be a little unprofessional at times. Is that true? I wholeheartedly disagree with that assessment. What do you mean? I think I could work for Michelle Obama. I'm going to ask her for a job. Are you going to do that during the podcast? Yes. Just cut in and say, I'd like to have a job with you. You know, they're going to look into your past. Yes. I'm assuming you have a criminal record. Why would you assume? Why would you hire a criminal? When I met you, I wanted to help you. I wanted to raise you up. Oh my God. I taught you English. You've done none of those things. Okay. Well, we've established two things that we know for sure, which is that Matt Gorely wears tweed underwear from the late 19th century and rides a unicycle. And that's Sona, I taught you English. Now, let's move on. Now, let's do this

professional podcast. Yeah. Anyway, we're very excited. And again, like I say, all I'm asking you do is sort of just follow my lead. You know, I've interviewed presidents, prime ministers, members of the G7 summit. No, you haven't. Well, some of that is true. But I never talked to prime ministers or members of the G7 summit that I just threw in to sort of pat out my resume. And I'm embarrassed. Yeah, it's very easily checked. Yeah. Clearly lied. Okay, well, sure you don't want to follow us. You've got balls, Gourly. I know, give you that. You've got big tweed balls. Too lie ever. Yeah. All right. I believe the next voices you'll hear will be us talking to Michelle Obama. This is so exciting. It really is. Yeah. And you're welcome. Oh, God.

Anyway, here we go. Let me let me put this interview in context. I've met you many times. I've been at many occasions with you. And you're always a professional. And the epitome of class, I've never seen you happier than I saw you today. We just we were in a we are still in a high school in Milwaukee. And you were talking to young students about going to college. And there's a lot of, you know, kids from all different backgrounds, kids that are not certainly not affluent, and maybe think that college isn't a possibility. And I watched you talk to them. It's the happiest I've ever seen you. Yeah, you really, I mean, it just seemed like this was religious for you. Yeah, it's my happy place. It is

my my my mission, my passion. Because I was those kids, you know, we were those kids, you know, you know, and most of those kids are those kids, kids experiencing doubt. This is the toughest time in their lives when they're trying to figure out who they are and where they're going to go and transition and fear and doubt. And I've been there. And I figured that to whom much is given, much is expected. And if I can be a voice to give them some guidance and some insight and some hope and some possibility and to show them I was you, because kids need to see visually where they can go. And I am I am that journey for them. It's like I was sitting in those seats and now I am here. Well, here's what I saw. I saw these kids sitting in a small circle in this

high school in Milwaukee. And I saw them there. You can see the gears turning in their head and thinking, wait a minute, if I'm sitting here, and I'm talking to Mrs. Obama, why can't I do anything? Which is a really amazing thing to witness. You can see the light go off literally in their souls. Yeah. And they start sitting up a little taller. And the the the ideas start spinning. But that's why visuals are important. Experiences are important because you can talk and talk and you can read about it. But until you see college, right, and you see the people doing it, and you sit in on a class and you see, oh, you're an idiot. And I can be an idiot too and still get here. Or this is hard and you failed or you stumbled, you had

fierce kids, all people, but kids in particular, they need to see it before them. I represent that for these kids. This is what blew me away. I got the book becoming and I expected to learn a lot about you. I didn't expect to relate to as many things as I did in the book. I am the whitest man in America. You always say that. I've met whiter. Really, name one. I am a sickly white. And the white community has rejected me. It's like too white. Too white. Too white for us. Send them back. Send them back. It doesn't work for us. But there's so much in your in your book that is about this is something it's a little bit of a religion for me, something that I'm religious about, which is people have a tendency to look

at someone who they believe has made it and they don't understand everything it took for them to get there. And they don't see the insecurity. They don't see the stumbles. They don't see what I thought your book did really beautifully and you telling very good stories is you told all these stories that took me from south side of Chicago, Euclid Avenue, second floor to the White House. And I understood it. It's still mind boggling, but I understood it. And it is amazing to me that I mean, and then there's little details in there like you were 70s television, 1970s television, Mary, Tyler Moore. I didn't realize the Mary, girl, it's like Mary, she had a job and a voice and she wasn't going home and cooking

dinner. I found her fascinating. So you connected to Mary, Tyler Moore. Yeah. And she was she dressed well too. She's very cute and sassy and she was still feminine, but had her own voice. And, you know, a lot of this is hindsight looking back on why was I so drawn to her? Why did I cuddle up, you know, after that was the Carol Burnett show. And that was sort of the lineup right there. So it was family night too. But there was, you know, in hindsight, she was she was new. Her character and I loved her in the Dick Van Dyke show. So there was something about her energy to that just felt new because each character was not the traditional. Even when she was Lord Petrie, she was not the Ozzie and Harriet kind of she wore pants. She

danced. She was a show girl. She was as funny as him. You know, she was an equal in the roles that she played, which was not necessarily the case. But I think that the point that you make about connection and the fact that, you know, people see folks like us, people who are famous and think, you know, you've never had hardship. That's because we're taught to hide all that. Yeah. You know, there's a lot of famous people spend all their time trying to pretend like, Oh, I was supposed to be here because we're all kind of insecure about all of us are whether we should be here anyway. So we've been taught just just fake it, you know, rather than, No, why don't you show people who are now looking up to you

the truth of the path in the journey. I think that and I think about those kids we just talked to about how unfair is it of them for me to present myself as already done as sort of this untouchable being when they're trying to get here. It's like, if I really want to help you get here, I have to be honest with you about the struggle so that when you hit it, you don't give up, you know, but we spend our time pretending. So we don't share anything with each other. We share what I say are our stats. Yes. What school did you go to? Yes. Tells you nothing. Right. You know, tell me about your occupation. Give me that title that you put that tells me nothing. When LA it's what are you driving? Oh, God, you know,

you got Alexis, you got a Tesla, you know, then I know who you are. Well, no, you don't. You know, nothing but the stories of what you watched when you were little. Right. You know, what music did you listen to? What was your grandfather like? Who was your most frustrating relative? When did you fall first? Right. You know, what was your what was your what was your most prominent memory when you were five? Yeah. And a lot of people asked me, how did you remember all that? And it's like, well, it's not a lot. It's just that I learned to value what I remember, that every memory, even not being able, why I remembered not being able to spell the word white, why that thing in kindergarten stuck with me is telling

to sort of who I am. Right. That's more telling that story, you know, tells you more about me, the tenacity that I had and the sort of insecurity that I felt and sort of the vision that I had for who I needed to be even at four and five. That follows through. I'm consistently that person. There's a part in the book where a friend of yours says, why do you talk like a white girl, which is something people say to me to this day. So I could I could relate. But but the fact that that that hits you so hard that that really stuck with you. To me, it's my theory has always been people that are sensitive to hurt, sensitive to exposure, you know, sensitive to I'll be seen for less than what I should be. They'd work extra hard

to cover it. And those people end up becoming wildly successful. Many times, you and I have both been at parties where every famous person in the world is there. And I always want to sort of ding a glass and stand up on a table and say, can we just all admit that we were horribly insecure nerds when we were kids? No, they'd be occasional, you know, LeBron James will say, I don't know what you're talking about. What are you talking about? Yeah, but I think that is the gift of you telling this story and telling it in a way that is so relatable, which is again and again and again and again and again. That hurt. Yeah, you got your feelings hurt when you, you know, when I first became a public person, and I read things about myself

that weren't true. I had a physical reaction. I was sick, and I could feel it physically in my chest when you write about people thinking, well, she seems bossy, she doesn't see, she seems kind of like she's domineering, a lot of the misogynistic sexist, racist, whatever you want to say, stuff that happens when people are projecting on to you. And you are very good at saying, yeah, that hurt. Yeah, because for whatever reason, we've sort of act like we should pretend like it doesn't. You know, now, being First Lady, I felt Barack and I, we both had things that hurt us that disappointed us. But the truth is that people are like, well, why are you talking about it now? Well, because when you're the president and the First Lady,

your job isn't to sort of be psychoanalyzed, sort of help me through this. I mean, I very much felt my role as a parent to the nation. It's like, I've got to have my stuff together. This isn't the time for me to lick my wounds because we got stuff to do here. They're military families that need help. They're kids who are trying to go to college. They're kids who need to eat healthy. I'm okay. I can deal with this. So we're not going to make that the focus of these eight years. But now that I'm away, you know, I feel it's important for people to read that chapter. Chapter 17 was the hardest chapter for me to write because I, for the first time, had to go back and read all of that stuff, which I purposely didn't. I learned to guard against

myself. I don't think I could do what you did. But there's a visceral reaction you get just from reading that chapter. There's stuff I have not, I mean, I know for you, you went back and read things that people wrote about you that just were not true, you know, cruel, baseless, but it's everyone's working their own agenda. You find out at the end of the day it has nothing to do with you. It has nothing. You are the prop that they are using in that moment. You are just part of the game.

Yeah. You know, and so. But you went back and you read it. I read it because I wanted, I knew when I was outlining the vision for this book that that chapter needed to be pivotal. Right. For a couple of reasons. Number one, I want the nation to remember that we do this. Yeah.

That this politics thing and a lot of stuff you read, it's a game, you know, and everybody's in on it. And you can't tell who believes what, but people are playing a role oftentimes. There are plenty of good people in it who are doing it for the right reasons, but we cannot buy into the political definition of who we are. Who we are in politics as a nation is not who we really are because people are jockeying for power. I want people to remember that. I also want people to remember it's like, all right, we're now gone. We're fit.

The country, whatever we were going to do is done. And all the things we were told, be afraid of them, be afraid of this, be afraid of healthcare, be afraid of blah, be afraid. Now what? Because what that shows is that there's always going to be somebody telling us to be afraid of something. And they're still telling people to be afraid of Barack Obama. He's not the president anymore.

And what was going to happen? What are we clutching about? And are we clutching because of race? We have to own what we're clutching. Are we clutching because he had a different name? Were we clutching because he had different ideas? We've got to get out of our own way in this country. So I felt for people now who view me as beloved, especially young kids who didn't know us in

those times, those kids in those rooms, they were babies when we were in office, right? I want them to know, yes, this Michelle Obama that you now know and love, that is selling all these books and nobody has anything bad to say about, didn't just a few years ago, was a terrorist, evil person who was going to take your carrots and ruin the land. We were just there. So don't buy into that stuff when people do that to you because they don't even believe it half the time. No, it's true.

I've experienced viscerally people going through phases where people think one thing about you, then they think a different thing about you. And at the end of the day, what I always say to myself anyways, keep your head down, do the work. And if your heart's in the right place. That was our motto. That was our motto. That's really when people say, what do you mean by when they go low, we go high?

It's essentially all you can do. What you told those kids Conan today, and you were amazing with those kids, by the way, is you go back to the basics. You show up in the world as a good person with the values that you were taught. And all of us were taught those values. Some haven't quite fully digested them. But we all know them, show up with kindness, do the work. And Barak was always like, all we can do is roll up our sleeves and do the work.

And so that chapter, as you know, led into me coming into the White House with a very clear understanding that I just probably more quickly and efficiently, because I wouldn't be given the benefit of the doubt, I needed to demonstrate to the nation that I can do the work. I work hard and I work smart. And let me just show you. And in the end, I have to count on the fact that what I produce will define me. And so that's what it means to go high in the end.

Don't seek revenge. Don't harbor resentment. Just do the work. I have to say, there's one, there are a few things that I was looking for in the book. I'm a grudge holder. I try not to be. But I'm a grudge holder. Let's put that on the table.

We'll just put that on the table. And you said something to me. I didn't like, no, it's not about you. And then you made me do those push-ups. You made me do push-ups. How dare you. You made me do push-ups at an army base. That's in our video, by the way.

Yeah, I know. I'm embarrassed. You made me do push-ups once on an army base. It gets the best laugh, too. I love to see Conan try to use his body, don't they? I've had so many moments with you just over the years. Casual moments where I could see that you were a human being caught up in an absurd situation. And I remember sitting with you at a White House Correspondence Dinner.

And one of the biggest honor at the White House Correspondence Dinner is that you get to sit with the first lady. So I got to have dinner right next to you. And everyone I know, their minds melted. They loved it. They wanted to know everything. The one thing I remembered saying to you is I remembered saying, so do you know what you're going to do after? This was, I think, maybe halfway through the second term.

I said, do you know where you're going to go afterwards? And you're sitting there and you're eating your dinner. And you said, well, you know, I think we want to stay. And I want us to live, I think, in Chicago. Of course, that guy has other ideas. And you just went over to the president. And I was like, that guy? That guy's the president of the United States.

But I could see that. What's his name? Yeah. And you were just, but you said it the way my wife refers to me. She's like, well, that guy thinks we're going to the mall to get pizza, California pizza kitchen. But that guy doesn't know the real score because the kids and I have been talking and we're getting steak. That's exactly how it is in our household. But I loved seeing that.

I loved seeing that you and the way that you, as a mom, just dealing with your kids, the way your kids keep you guys in line. Like really, mom, they're embarrassed by you in moments. Oh my God. Hugely embarrassing. You know, imagine showing up to parent teacher conference with a 20 car motorcade, you know, and police officers yelling at the teacher. Move out of the way.

Presidents on cat people on top of the roofs, you know. We had to parent by creating this cocoon of normalcy in a pretty crazy abnormal world. And I describe it as like, what do you do when your kids are a toddler? They bumped their head that first time and they look to you to figure out how to react. And if you're all freaked out, they'll cry. This is hard. If you tell them they're okay, then they're like, okay, well, I guess I'm okay. We spent eight years just going, it's okay.

You'll be fine. This is normal. Just go to school. You have guns. Men with guns. Hey, you know, you're safe. This is your reality now. You have food.

So don't complain to me about, you know, so it was very much keeping them in their reality, making sure we went to the parent teacher conferences and that we went to their games and that we were sitting on the sidelines with them and that they had sleepovers. And we had kids sleeping over at our house and that takes work. Your house being the White House. Our house being the White House. Just trying to normalize things here. Yes, our house being the White House, which by the way, my kids were like every other kid.

It's like, why would people want to come here, mom? It's like, it's the White House. I guarantee you they want to come and watch a movie. No one wants to come here. I was like, you are wrong, my friend. But their view was, I don't want to be here. I'm here all the time. I want to go to X's house, which I always found was a healthy sign that they weren't

obsessing about this, that they were curious about other. But I am in awe of my children for the way they have managed this whole thing with poise and grace. There's a resilience that they've had to develop. I mean, we've given them so much more than any of us have ever had. They have met the Pope and the Queen and they've done things that just no kid would ever do. But they've also had to sacrifice a lot of their childhoods living in this glare and being the subject of some of this nastiness themselves and learning at a very young age,

how do you recover from that? How do you steal yourself from, because my kids weren't like us. Me and Barack, we were in our cocoon. We were in our bubble. We'd escaped to do an event and come back. They were the ones going out into the world every day trying to be regular little girls standing in the ice cream line or at others. There's a time when Malia talks about going on a class trip and she was a sophomore.

They were at one of the museums and another class of fifth graders recognized her. And the teachers started gathering around her and they started taking pictures. And she had to take it upon herself because the teachers weren't stopping this. No grownups were taking charge. No grownups. They were engaged in the, she gathered them around and she said, now I'm very excited to see all of you, but I'm here with my school. And so I can't take pictures with all of you.

She took the moment to be gracious to try to address them, but then to move them. She advanced herself. And that's how my kids have had to operate. Strangers approaching them and being angry if they don't want to take pictures. Imagine trying to have your first kiss or sneak a cigarette and you've got your own page six. They've had to learn how to steal themselves and then come out not being resentful, not being cynical and still being curious about the world. My hats off to them.

I had a, as a confession, I had a horrifying child moment in your and your husband's presence. There was an event in Washington, DC that my, that I was asked to host. Was it the Easter egg roll? It was a Christmas, it was a Christmas show, a Christmas in Washington show. And by the way, just, well, maybe you do, maybe you don't, but it was, it was one of the, I say, oh yeah, I remember that all the time. And I say that to my wife about the wedding. But my, my wife, what happens just, I'll tell you from the other side of your cocoon.

I was a performer, my wife and my, my daughter and my son came and they were much younger. And my son, they lock it down. So my wife thought she was going to go out and get some food to keep his blood sugar up. He was about six or five. You can't move once the president gets there. And they said, no, no, no, the first lady and the president will be here in, it's all locked down. They'll be here in three hours, but no one leaves. So we were all locked in and there's a moment where we all get in a line with the other performers to meet you.

And we get in the line and that's a long line to meet you. And my son starts to melt down and he starts to lose it. And he starts to, I can see him, he's getting irritated and he's, he hasn't, and I said to Liza, my wife, you got to give him some, and she said, I didn't, I didn't bring anything. I didn't bring anything. And we've been locked out. We're all locked down. And they're all locked down.

They will let me get out. And my son Beckett is starting to lose it and lose it. And I said, Beckett, Beckett, you got to come down. We're getting closer to you guys. I see you and your husband graciously taking pictures with people. Our line's getting closer and closer. And my son goes, I don't want to meet them. I don't, I don't.

And I said, listen, Beckett, calm down. We're about to meet the Obama's. We're about to meet the Obama's. And he went, I don't want to meet the Obama's. And he just, cause he was in a back and he sat down on his bike. He's like, I'm hungry. He sat down on his bike. I don't want to, I don't want to, I don't want to, I don't want to meet anybody.

I don't want to be on the side. And then I, this is the best part of the story. You know who's in front of us in line is Justin Bieber. Now this is Justin Bieber. And I do remember this. This is Justin Bieber at maybe 13, 14. He turns around and he puts his hand, tries to diffuse the situation. He puts my hand on my son's head and rubs his hair.

And he goes, chill out, dude. And my son whips around and looks at Justin Bieber and says, don't you touch me. Suddenly my wife finds, at the last second, a piece of candy at the bottom of her purse, which all moms have. It's all dusty and linen covered. She shoves it in my, in my son Beckett's mouth. He eats it. You can see the sugar hit his blood.

Seconds later, Mr. President, so nice to see you. Ah, Mrs. Obama, you look lovely. This little. I'd like to introduce myself. I just want you to know what you did to children and moms in those receiving lines. You know, it, it's crazy. This is the kind of stuff we had to think about. It's like, because we don't know what our presence did in the land, you know,

but we know we, we come in hard, you know, heavy motorcade shutting down everybody. That's why people were like, you think you want me at your wedding. You don't, you don't, you don't want me to show up with my dog sniffers and blocking down your mom from getting down the aisle. I mean, it is a heavy presence for sure. So thank you for. I just wanted you to know. Putting up with it.

What you did to me. But you survived. You were so resilient. You know what? And we talked about resilience. The last chapter of the book in becoming as Conan is resilient. And I really, I really didn't see that coming. That was a delightful cause.

He inspired me. You know, there's a moment, there's so much in this book. I read the book and you talk about these time that was, you work so hard. You have worked so hard in your life. And today, one of the young people, one of their questions was, will you run for president? And I almost wanted to, I know your answer is no, but I almost wanted to jump up and say, they've done enough. They did more than their share.

Please have, you know, enjoy. And you're doing great work, but there was a part in your book where you talk about, you would have, before you entered this insane world, you would go and you would sit in your car and you would eat Chipotle. And by the way, Chipotle, if you want to buy in on this, this is the time to do it. Run the ads. Run the ads. And cause I understand you really love Chipotle.

I did. It was a respite. There you go. I don't know whether I love Chipotle or I just love the time alone with Chipotle. We're going to edit this so you say, I love Chipotle. And then I'm going to get all the money. That's how the business works. Got it.

No, but I'm wondering, can you have that now? Can you, do you ever get time to go and could you get away? I know you have security and everything. There's a lovely moment at the beginning of your book where you make yourself a grilled cheese and you're by yourself and it's after the storm. It's after everything. And I thought, I'm wishing you more of that. I'm wishing you.

There is definitely more of that for sure. I mean, as I explained to the kids today, we will forever have security, Barack and I, so there will always be a presence. But you know, in the scheme of hardships, you know, I mean, that is not one I would list. Right. We have a wonderful team of people who are like family to us and they make our lives convenient, oftentimes sacrificing time with their own family. So, you know, that's not a hard thing to give up.

So there are more moments like that and there will be more. Right. You know, there are many, many chapters. There will come a time in life where those same kids will be like Michelle Obama who, you know, they will, they will forget about us and they'll move on to the next thing. We'll be fine with that. What Barack and I talk about that we do miss is, and you understand this, is the loss of anonymity.

And that's something that, you know, most people don't understand how valuable anonymity is, being able to blend into your environment and not be the center of it, but just to observe it. Because that's really where, and because I love people so much, I love casual conversations with people. I loved, while I love my time in the car alone, Chipotle, I loved also what you learned standing in a grocery store line and overhearing someone's conversation, you know, watching their interactions with their loved one and not being the watchee but watching and taking that in and understanding

life and the observations that come, you know, most of your interaction with your partner is about what you saw, what you experienced over the course of the day. For Barack and I, that's still very limited because we're not able to be exposed in an anonymous way. I'm realizing, as you say it, you can't eavesdrop on someone else's conversation. You can't eavesdrop. And when you think about, as an entertainer, as a comedian, so much of your material comes from that.

Yes. Just watching people live their lives. Right. And we're always watched at this stage. And both Barack and I, what you learn about the world comes from that, which is why, another reason why I wouldn't run. Right. You know, I don't live a normal life.

I used to and I am a very, normal is baked into me because of how I was raised. But I also know the life I've lived for the last 10 years is no longer normal. Yeah. So I don't know as much as I would want to, to be in a position of leadership to kind of know what are you feeling because you can't experience life behind attended window in a car. You know, so we, we sacrifice that and that's not a complaint. But if I'm going to be a leader, I got to be in there.

I got to be able to be in there overhearing people's truths and really being able to see their pain without it being filtered through the veil of me, you know. And that's why I think it's important eight years is enough. It is enough. It's time for new ideas and people who've been in the Chipotle line and people who are struggling in ways that we just because of the nature of what we've done, we don't do that anymore. Right.

You know, we need fresh, real, clear eyes in this stuff. That's why we're investing our time in training the next leaders, the next kids who were still out there trying to figure out now, they have the passion, but how do you do this? Right. You know, how do you be, if you want to be in public service, how do you do this? That's why a lot of these seats get transitioned back and forth among the same people because the kids in those rooms have no idea how to get from their seats to where we are. It's our responsibility to help expand that base of people who can serve.

Kids who don't, so you don't have to be networked or come from a family or be wealthy in order to be president, you know, but right now it's like a lot of jobs, you know, the president gets to be the president because he was born to the president, you know, or had a lot of money. And so we want to start training up kids who see life in a broad way. How do you develop a campaign? How do you raise money? You know, how do you hold office and do it ethically, you know, how do you fill out the

right forms? How do you hire the right people? I was amazed by the way, I was amazed that you and your husband had to pay for all the food at the White House. And of course, you were very ethical about it and you made sure there's a budget for some things, but it's shockingly small, and then you have to pay for all the food. And you noticed once that your husband, the president was really enjoying, he just casually said, oh, that sushi we had tonight was really good.

And they said, we'll get it again, fee, Mr. President, then you realize you're paying for it and they're flying it in. And you said, we got to knock that off. It's like, it's not that good. It's me love tomorrow. It's not like it did. That guy is not worth that. That guy doesn't get that sushi.

He doesn't need all that. I swear to God, I mean, if I was going to run for president, I think half the reason would be that I thought it was free food. It was like, nope, nope, you pay for it. And you talked about having to figure out like, oh, yeah, no, there's a budget for like toilet paper, you know. How much have you used versus how much is used by guests and, you know, yeah, no, it's an expensive proposition to serve.

Yes. Period. Now living in the White House is one, and again, people don't talk about it because yeah, don't complain about living in the White House. It's like I tell Malia and Sasha, you can't complain about being the first daughters and having security, kid, go to school, you're fine. But it's important for people to understand the sacrifices that not just the president and first lady make, but anyone, regardless of their party, who chooses to hold public

office. It's a government job and it's hard and it's thankless. And just like I felt about families in the military where we want people to serve and we want to go to war, but we really don't want to understand the full sacrifice of the service members and their families, you know, before we trot them off to a war that maybe could have been avoided because it does impact their lives in ways. We don't talk about it because we're taught, be stoic about it, you know, it's an honor to serve.

And yes, it is an honor to serve, but it's important for people to understand the sacrifices that all of these families make. And again, not to not hold them accountable, but to understand that this isn't just a cake walk. It's not just, oh, now you do it. No, you do it. Don't you want to do that again? It's like, no.

It's really hard. I think because we also have a reality show, we have this reality show culture now that people can look at the presidency as well, that's the person who got the rose from the bachelor. Yeah, right. That was a great episode. That was a great episode. You know, no, no, no, it's actually an incredibly difficult job.

That whole Supreme Court issue, whoa, it was dicey and we recovered, you know, yeah, no, it's not a reality show. It's real life stuff. I mean, when I was campaigning for Hillary, the main thing I wanted to communicate to the electorate in the speeches that I made was that this is a really hard job and it is serious. And it requires a level of knowledge of history and patience and you have to be a reader and you have to be someone who can handle stress and you have to watch your words.

I mean, you know, we live in a time where tell it like it is and it's like not when your words can start wars and shift markets, you know, there is a responsibility to be careful with them and it wasn't shade. It wasn't, it was really just for the voters out there as you're thinking about these things as someone who's been here, just let me tell you about this job because it's real. And when Barack was in office, you know, this is my opinion, he made it look really easy and it's not. So we should all know that as part of the electorate, that we should understand that

we have a responsibility to put people in office who are not only ready and passionate about it, but have immense skills to do this really hard job for a long time. Are you going to be really involved in this, in this next election? You know, my, what, what I have said, because I'm not interested in politics, because I also think, and I've said this before, that sadly in our country, when you put an R on D on you, you immediately alienate most of the country with, with whichever choice you make. We're in those times right now and my goal is that I want to be able to reach as many

people as possible. I don't want people to stop listening or to take what I say differently if it's the truth just because I'm a D, right? Because there are a lot of Rs out there that I love and respect and I want to, you know, if I know something, I want Republicans kids to know about college. I'm not one of these people who are like, either you're on my side or you're not. I think you can do that better outside of politics. But I will do everything that I can to emphasize the importance of voting.

Because in the end, that's what we have to do. You know, whatever your belief in we is, we are just a country where the percentage of people who vote in all elections is just woefully small. It's depressing. It's depressing. So to the extent that I will be involved in politics, you can say it's really just continuing to educate the next generation, these kids, all these choices are their future, you know. Everything that's happening today, those kids we just talked to are going to be dealing

with it. We're going to be rolling ourselves off to the retirement home as anonymous as we want to be. People are like, Michelle Obama, who? I don't think that's going to happen and I'm not getting into wheelchair. I want to be a burden. I'm going to push you. I want to be a burden.

I'm going to be there to push you. You're going to be there to push me around. I'm going to come find you and guys are like, remember when you said Conan, you weren't going to be in a wheelchair? You know what's nice? I will tell you this. You said that you lost your anonymity and you sort of kindly included me in losing my anonymity and yes, I'm a known person and I do get recognized when I go places and I

say hi to people and I take selfies, but it was so refreshing today to be anonymous because when you walk into a room with Michelle Obama, you're anonymous and it's fun. Do you know what I mean? This is like, they're just all about you and then there's like, what's with that Belgian woman who's with you? This has been a huge delight and I know how hard you work and I want you to go and get some Chipotle. I want you to get the money that Chipotle owes you for mentioning them multiple times.

I want really nice things for you and your husband because you read this book and I encourage you to read it because it's a fantastic book and I said this to you in all sincerity. So relatable and you read it and when you're done, you think these two people have given, they gave everything and this is long before you were in office, both of you, you and your husband were giving of yourselves long before you got into office and I think that you've earned the right to go sit in a car right now and have some fast food and then go binge watch Sex in the City or whatever it is you want to do. Sounds like a great Friday.

Yeah. I'm on. I will have your people. They're very powerful. You can. And I can have you. And obviously you have a deep relationship with Chipotle. I have, let's just say they have never actually paid me for anything.

Well, they should. You know what I have? I have a deep relationship with Chipotle now. Oh, you're right. Glad to be of help. Yeah. Glad to be of help. Thank you, Chipotle.

My best to you, your husband and your amazing kids. Well, you've been an amazing support to me over the years. You don't think that, but my whole team still remembers our trip, the work that we did with military families, the gracious way that you were always open to our initiatives and your family is amazing. And I consider it, I will take the optimism or the cautiously out of my feelings about our friendship. That's nice.

So I moved the puzzle piece just a little forward. A little more optimistic about being Conan O'Brien's friend. But you said it with great caution. No, no, that was, that was a, that was a dramatic pause. Oh, that was dramatic pause. All right. Okay. Optimism.

Optimism. Thank you very much. Thank you. Thanks for having me. Okay. Wow. That was quite a day. We are headed back now to Los Angeles, back to our home.

And that was an intense day. I love talking to her on the podcast. She was really delightful to talk to you, but there was just, the whole day was, started with us going to a high school in Milwaukee, having a round table with a bunch of high school juniors. And that was fun because we walked into the room, they didn't know that Michelle Obama was coming and they freaked out and that was just fun to watch. That was delightful.

And then we went into the podcast. We were in a little classroom off to the side and I thought you guys behaved very well. Yeah. We were the stars of that interview. Yeah. You could hear us maybe giggling in the background. That's okay. You were there for moral support.

Yeah. I really was just in awe of her eloquence and just the conversation you guys are having. I mean, it was quite nice to. Was it somewhat in awe of me as well? Yeah. Oh, Trisley, you guys had a wonderful rapport. I really, really enjoyed it. And I know we joke around in this podcast, so I am joking right now.

Yes. No, I really did feel that way. I loved her before. I love her even more now. I am in awe of her. Did you get a nice Michelle Obama hug? I did. I honestly, after we recorded the podcast, she was nice enough to take pictures with

us. And then at the end, she hugged both me and Matt. She initiated those hugs. She did, because I wasn't sure if I could. And then she leaned in and I just closed my eyes and lost myself in her, like, just warm embrace. I'm still there. Very nice.

Probably a healing hug. I feel 10 years younger. You look better today. Thanks. After the Michelle Obama hug. Thank you. Yeah. I recommend it.

You both look better. Thank you. I honestly don't know how she does it. Every minute of her day was packed with stuff to do. Yeah. You know, wardrobe changes, and I thought you had a busy schedule, but, you know, really. I think I am just as busy and have just as much impact as former First Lady Michelle Obama, and I think I'm deluded.

That was a long day for you, though. Seriously. It was. Three major events. Yeah. Well, then after the podcast, there was, we got to take a little break and we went into this place, and it was the perfect choice because they had cheese curds. Oh, man.

They were back the 10 years on me that Michelle took off. Michelle Obama made you 10 years younger with her hug, and then you undid her healthy embrace with cheese curds. Boy, are those amazingly good. Oh, my God. They bring over, it's a, I don't know what else to say. It's cheese curds that have been deep fried. Is that right?

Yeah. Yeah. And then we're all going to Cedar Sinai in L.A. now, straight to have our, yeah, our arterial system scraped, and it was, it was delicious. Then headed back. I got a chance to meet Michelle Obama's brother, Craig Robinson, very cool guy, and then got to meet Michelle Obama's mom. That was fun backstage, hanging with her.

I asked her, you know, did you like, are you proud of the book? She said, oh, I'm very proud of the book, but she sold me out. She sold me out. She was going on and on about how Michelle Obama sold out some of the texts that she has written, Mrs. Obama over, you know, in which she's not that impressed with, you know, some cool thing. She projected those on a huge screen during the whole event. Yes, exactly.

Yeah, that's amazing. She sold out her mom again during the event. Then the event was really fun, a terrific crowd. Yeah. And then it was over. How did you guys like being in the motorcade? Oh, my God. That was fun.

That was so cool. Yeah, I wouldn't know. Oh. Oh, you weren't in the motorcade, were you? No, I wasn't. They let us, it's called folding in. They gave me a lime scooter, and I had to follow them. That's right.

That's right. It was a Michelle Obama signature lime scooter. It was elegant. Yeah. And well, you didn't experience this, Matt, but Son and I were in a car and they said, we'll fold you into the motorcade. And so our car just got in, and then we just sort of zipped along, which was fun. And then at one point, we just got into traffic.

And that was funny because we just slowed down like everybody else, and the sirens didn't know good. Yeah. Nothing. And then I just thought, this is hilarious. It's hilarious to be in a motorcade with sirens going, and then you just hit really heavy traffic in Milwaukee, and now nothing you can do about it. No one's above traffic.

I was trying to take video of it. It didn't look at all like a motorcade. It didn't look like a motorcade. No. There were sirens. And then at one point, we all slowed down in, you know, mid-city, Milwaukee highway traffic, and it got kind of into gridlock. And then the policeman just turned off their sirens, and everyone just said, and then I've

rode by on the scooter. Then yeah. And you went by on your scooter. Suckers. Yeah. See you later, assholes. See you later. And then I will admit that I was pretending that, no, I've not been folded into Michelle

Obama's motorcade. She's been folded into mine. And that gives you a little window if you're listening into my delusional madness. And what we're dealing with. Yeah. Yeah. But anyway. Yeah.

And I mean, she had like tricked out SUVs, you know, they're bulletproof, and yours was just like. It was bullet welcoming. Just doesn't. This bullseye. They gave me an old Chevy with bullseyes on it. Conan's in this. You want to take a pop at him, go for it.

This is the world of podcasting in 2019. It is. Can I say something? I think what people noticed listening to this podcast is that you and Mrs. Obama have a really great rapport with each other and listening to the two of you have conversations and interact with each other is really actually fun and nice to listen to. Yeah. And it's a it's a funny thing that I didn't quite expect, but when I read her book, there's

a bunch of things about her personality that I could relate to, you know, about being sort of young and anxious to succeed and a bit of a box checker. But then your life taking this weird turn that you didn't expect for me that was getting into comedy, which I never thought would happen, you know, I think I was trying to head towards being on the Supreme Court when I was not bad. But you know, as I was a very intense young fellow who was worked really hard and never thought that I would have a career in comedy. That's with less.

And then my life took a crazy turn. But just just I was really impressed with how honest she is in the book about things in her life and her marriage and in raising children that there is something in her story for everyone to find. I found that too, just listening to the event and fact that they go to couples therapy together and the relationship between Barack Obama and her. And I was texting my wife going, you'll never believe who does this thing as well or whatever. You know, I think she'd go to couples therapy.

You and I, Gourley. Yeah. OK. Actually, I think the three of us should go into therapy together and just talk out and you know, we should do we should we should have it on the podcast because you could get out your issues with me. Sometimes you feel like I'm putting you down when I'm when I am. Yeah.

And that's when I feel like you are. You could talk about some of your you may have issues with me. I have no idea. I feel I have a 10 year head start. Yeah. And I have a lot to unpack. So I'm down. I'm down to do that.

All right. Are you are you OK with me telling another person all the stuff that you have said to me over the years? Yes. About me calling me a vampire. Please. Let's not get into that now. This is a very classy podcast for doing.

Said I stole babies from a marketplace. We're going to hit this all out. This is a Michelle Obama special podcast. This is a big deal and said I floated here. Please. In a basket. Please. Please.

My dad survived a goat attack. Please. None of this is true. Anyway. Classy podcast today. Michelle Obama podcast. And I will not have it ruined with scurrilous rumors about it's well documented about my insane behavior and I have it ruined with us repeating things that you have said.

Please. Please. Got to kind of nip this in the butt. We've got to scrouch this now. Well, I have a question. Yeah. Where does this podcast go from here because this is quite something. Well, Vladimir Putin in a rowboat.

I was just chatting his shirts off. Yeah. Shirts off. Is your shirt off too? Yes. My shirt would also be off. If he takes his shirt off, then I have to take my shirt off. So now I'll just be on the shore.

Yeah. Far away. I told you. Yes. So you don't have to see our, our torsos listening in the sun about this. You're like, this is a professional podcast and we got to you and Vladimir Putin shirtless in a rowboat. Yeah.

So you did that though. Yeah. I suppose. No, I'm proud of, I'm proud of you guys and I'm proud of our whole podcast team. Aaron Blair, Vectin over here, Adam Sacks, the maestro, and of course, Britt Kahn who who made this all happen. And yeah, I'm just proud of my team. I, I joke around a lot, but we have a very good unit here.

You guys are very good at what you do and I'd like to have this last part erased. We're like the SEAL team six of podcasting where strike team were in, we're out. Yeah. That was, no. Yeah. No, we're not SEAL team six. Yeah, we are. No.

We are the Walmart greeters of podcasters. We are. I don't know. I'm like mad. We, we are aging. We just stand around where the dirty does it. It's not quite clear how we add to the overall profit of the endeavor as like as greeters. You don't know.

We just don't know. But the important thing is we did it together as a team. Good work team. Oh, and let me say briefly, if you enjoyed today's podcast and you're a first time listener and you checked us out, check out some of the other Conan O'Brien Needs a Friends episodes and subscribe. Yeah. Plus you nothing, plus you nothing, but a little bit of your trust, but the returns

are staggering. Wow. Staggering. That's just, that's just ruined it. You don't forget what I said about subscribe to the others. The support on this team is staggering. Yeah. That's true.

Yeah. SEAL team six. That's right. Well, SEAL team five, once we get rid of girly. Oh, wait a minute. Now I quit. Yeah. You're on an airplane.

I've got a parachute. Yeah. All right. Well, there you go. That was our Michelle Obama podcast taped in Milwaukee, Wisconsin, and we'll see you on the next one. Yeah. This has been fun.

Thanks for tuning in. Conan O'Brien Needs a Friend with Sonam of Sessian and Conan O'Brien as himself. Produced by me, Matt Gorely, executive produced by Adam Sacks and Jeff Ross at Team Coco, and Chris Bannon and Colin Anderson at Earwolf. Special thanks to Jack White for the theme song, Incidental Music by Jimmy Vivino. Our supervising producer is Aaron Blair, and the show is engineered by Will Bekton. You can rate and review this show on Apple podcasts, and you might find your review featured on a future episode.

Got a question for Conan? Call the Team Coco hotline at 323-451-2821 and leave a message. It too could be featured on a future episode. And if you haven't already, please subscribe to Conan O'Brien Needs a Friend on Apple podcasts where wherever fine podcasts are downloaded. This has been a Team Coco production in association with Earwolf.