Consider This from NPR - Did Charlie Kirk's killing shatter Spencer Cox's vision of politics?

Episode Date: September 21, 2025

Governor Spencer Cox of Utah, who has been in the national headlines just about every day since Charlie Kirk's killing, has long wanted to bring community harmony to national politics. That outlook comes in part from his upbringing in the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints.The governor was a critic of President Trump during Trump’s first term, but later endorsed him after the president survived an assassination attempt. Will Charlie Kirk’s killing change Cox’s approach?For sponsor-free episodes of Consider This, sign up for Consider This+ via Apple Podcasts or at plus.npr.org. Email us at [e-mail] episode was produced by Avery Keatley, with audio engineering by Ted Mebane. It was edited by Ahmad Damen and Sarah Robbins. Our executive producer is Sami Yenigun.Learn more about sponsor message choices: podcastchoices.com/adchoicesNPR Privacy Policy

mourners filled a football stadium in Arizona to remember conservative activist Charlie Kirk. Well, good morning to everybody. Welcome this morning. We're so thankful to have him here. We celebrate the life of our friend Charlie Kirk. Kirk was slain on the campus of Utah Valley University. And in the aftermath of his death, Utah's Republican governor, Spencer Cox, was shaken. We are endowed by our creator with certain unalienable rights. The first one of those is life. and today the life was taken. In the days following the shooting, Cox urged the public to take down the temperature,

to consider the human price of political violence and the precarious balancing act of the American experiment. This is certainly about the tragic death of Charlie Kirk, but it is also much bigger than an attack on an individual. It is an attack on all of us. It is an attack on the American experiment. It is an attack on our ideals. Like many politicians from Utah, Cox's political views are shaped by his Mormon faith.

My dear brothers and sisters, it is a joy to be with you. Russell Nelson, the president of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, addressed polarization directly in a landmark sermon two years ago called Peacemakers Needed. I am greatly concerned that so many people seem to believe that it is completely acceptable to condemn, malign, and vilify anyone who does not agree with them. Nelson urged his flock to choose peace over contention. I urge you to be a peacemaker now and always. Consider this. As the Republican Party solidifies under President Trump, is there still room in the party's tent for Trump? traditional Mormon politicians like Governor Cox.

From NPR, I'm Scott Detrow. It's Consider this from NPR. Since the assassination of Charlie Kirk, Utah's governor, Spencer Cox, has been appealing to Americans to consider our common values and humanity. It is a view that is guided by his faith and one that is being increasingly shouted down in national politics. Atlantic staff writer McKay Coppins talked with Cox as he navigated the fallout of Kirk's shooting, and he joins us now. McKay, welcome. Thanks for having me. I want to talk about what Cox has been saying.

And in your article, you put that into a really thoughtful context of the history of Utah, the founding of Utah by its original Mormon settlers and the idea that they thought of this as an American Zion. Can you talk about that general idea and how that is still reflected in prominent LDS politicians talking about Utah today centuries later? Yeah, there's always been this sort of exceptionalist idea to Utah as a place, as a state, as an idea. right? The Mormon pioneers who settled the territory had been driven into the desert, essentially, from a campaign of state section persecution in places like Illinois and Missouri, and had settled Utah as a place that they wanted to be a haven from the political strife and violence and sin that they believed characterized the rest of the country. So that idea was always there in Utah. And it's still reflected today. You know, in recent years, many of Utah's political leaders have made a concerted effort to position and sort of brand their state as a model of cooperation and consensus building and compromise. They call it the Utah way. They've hammered out a number of state bills and policies that are sort of de taunts in the culture war on issues like LGBTQ rights and religious freedom, immigration, the environment. And in that kind of political context, people like Spencer Cox and Mitt Romney and John Huntsman, sort of more moderate and genteel Republicans, have been able to thrive while the rest of the National Party has sort of moved away from that brand of republicanism.

Yeah. And it is fair to say that's what Cox seemed to be thinking and talking about when he made that remark that got of a lot of attention that I had hoped that this person wouldn't be from Utah. And I should say that was paraphrase. Well, I mean, it's basically what he said. And, you know, when I talked to Cox about that, he sort of rushed to clarify that he wasn't saying that because he hoped the shooter would be a politically convenient scapegoat. But that really wasn't what he meant, which is this place, this state was supposed to be a sanctuary from this kind of politics. And there is something, I think, really unnerving for Spencer Cox and a lot of Uton's to say. see that this kind of wrathful, bitter, mean, frightening turn that's taken place in our national politics has arrived in Utah as well. Yeah. You know, Cox's campaign, this disagreed better campaign that he had been on, and obviously he's gotten a lot more attention in the last few weeks.

This is the latest in a lot of very different ways that various prominent Mormon politicians from Utah have tried to counter the MAGA-type drift of the Republican Party and the way that national politics has gotten just a lot more nasty, right? What do you make of the fact that that these various attempts kind of hit a wall when they go beyond Utah? And even as you report within Utah, within Utah politics, the current discourse is becoming more and more prominent. Well, you know, it's interesting. I actually profiled Spencer Cox last year for the Atlantic and I spent a lot of time talking to him. And even then last year, as he was running for re-election, he kind of confided to me that he was worried

about what was happening in Utah politics. You know, he had this idea, this idealized vision of Utah, and he was seeing the conspiracy theories and the extremism kind of leach into his state, and even to his own campaign, his primary campaign. And what he said to me last year was there's been a breach in the bulwark. And I think that with this shooting, with the very bitter recriminations that have followed, I think Spencer Cox is realizing even more than ever that this kind of attempt to circumvent the magification of the GOP and promote a form of conservatism that is not rooted in grievance or culture war is really not very fashionable in this moment, right? And it's worth noting that researchers who study these things have seen actually a decline in Latter-day Saint representation in Congress. You've seen people like Jeff Flake of Arizona who retired rather than tried to run in a Republican primary during the Trump era.

And I think one of the driving factors in that is that the kind of stereotypical Mormon brand of republicanism is just not well represented. or very popular these days in the Republican Party. Have church leaders continued to try to take the same path that Cox is taking in this moment, trying to create a bulwark almost of an ability to disagree but get along? Yeah, in fact, I think a lot of people would say that Spencer Cox is sort of taking his cues from a lot of the messaging that's been coming from Latter-day-Saint religious leaders. The current president of the church, Russell M. Nelson, who's 101 years old, has spent kind of these last years of his life and tenure, repeatedly hammering this message that

Christians are called to be peacemakers. And he gave a kind of totemic talk on this subject several years ago called peacemakers needed, calling on Latter-day Saints to avoid the increase in bitterness and anger in our politics to try to build bridges of understanding across political divides. And this is a very kind of top of mind discussion within Mormonism, not just in politics, but in churches, in the pews. I hear about it almost every Sunday when I go to church. That is Atlantic staff writer McKay Coppins. Thank you so much. Thank you. This episode was produced by Aver Keatley with audio engineering by Ted Mebain. It was edited by Ahmed Dahman and Sarah Robbins. Our executive producer is Sam Mianagan.

It's Consider This from NPR. I'm Scott Detrow.