Consider This from NPR - How Gabby Giffords is grappling with the rise in political violence

Episode Date: June 20, 2025

Last weekend, Minnesota state Rep. Melissa Hortman, a Democrat, and her husband, Mark, were shot and killed at their home by a man impersonating a police officer.The attack comes amid a rise in political violence. Last year alone, Capitol Police investigated more than 9,000 threats against members of the U.S. Congress. Former U.S. Congresswoman Gabby Giffords knows the horrors of gun violence only too well. The Arizona Democrat was shot at a constituent event in Tucson in 2011.Now a leading gun safety advocate, Giffords speaks with host Mary Louise Kelly about how she is handling this moment and her thoughts on addressing the problem of gun violence. For sponsor-free episodes of Consider This, sign up for Consider This+ via Apple Podcasts or at plus.npr.org. Email us at [e-mail] more about sponsor message choices: podcastchoices.com/adchoicesNPR Privacy Policy

Last weekend, Minnesota State Representative Melissa Hortman, a Democrat, and her husband Mark were shot and killed at their home, a targeted attack by a man impersonating a police officer. The attack comes amid a rise in political violence. Last year alone, Capitol Police investigated more than 9,000 threats against members of the U.S. Congress. But this week, an email landed in my inbox, subject line, an assassination in Minnesota. The email was a fundraising pitch to support efforts by Democrats to fight gun violence. What caught my eye was who was making the pitch. Gabby Giffords, the former Arizona congresswoman who, as her email notes, knows the horror of a targeted shooting all too well.

—County's going to be working a shooting. We've been informed Gabriel Giffords is involved. —The shooting left six people dead. —Including a federal judge and a nine-year-old girl. —And injured 13 others, including Gabby Giffords. —Police say he shot 14 others, including the congresswoman, before bystanders tackled him. In 2011, Giffords, a Democrat, was shot in the head at a constituent event outside Tucson. Since then, Giffords has dedicated her life to calling for action on gun control. I'm Gabby Giffords. I'm from Tucson, Arizona. January 8th, 2011 changed my life forever. I was a congresswoman. I was shot in my head while me was in situance. I couldn't walk. I couldn't talk.

That's Giffords speaking with me in 2022 after the school shooting in Yuvalde, Texas. She has recovered from her wounds, but Giffords does not have full use of the right side of her body, and she struggles with speech, with language. Our lives can change so quickly, mine did when I was shot, but I never gave up hope. I chose to make a new start, to move ahead, to not look back, and I'm fighting to make the country safer. It can be so difficult but I tell myself,

move ahead." She co-founded Giffords, an advocacy group that has worked to promote gun safety for 12 years now. Melissa Hortman, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend,

Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giffords's friend, Giff possible. Gabby Giffords was friends with Melissa Hortman. In a post on Instagram honoring Hortman, Giffords wrote, we must protect our democracy from those who try to destroy it with a gun. Consider this. The targeted killings of Representative Hortman and her husband last weekend are the latest in a cascade of political violence in this country.

How is a gun safety advocate who's experienced these horrors firsthand grappling with this moment? From NPR, I'm Mary Louise Kelly. This message comes from WISE, the app for doing things and other currencies. With WISE, you can send, spend, or receive money across borders, all at a fair exchange rate.

No markups or hidden fees. Join millions of customers and visit WISE.com. T's and C's apply. This message comes from the BBC with World of Secrets Season 8, The Killing Call. The Murder of Indian music star Sindhu Musayala at the height of his success sent shockwaves around the world. Who wanted him silenced? Search for World of Secrets from NPR. Gabby Giffords has struggled with talking since she was shot outside a Safeway in Tucson in 2011. Since then, she's dedicated her life to fighting

for gun safety through her advocacy group, Giffords. She joins me now, along with Emma Brown, executive director of Giffords. Welcome to you both. Thanks so much for having us. Gabby Giffords Thank you very much. Emma Brown And I want to add a note on how we are doing this interview. The Giffords team suggested that we pose specific questions in a specific way to enable Gabby Giffords to give fuller answers. So what you're about to hear is me asking some of those questions, and then, when needed, following up and asking additional questions

of our own. I want to start with Melissa Hortman who is the who was the Minnesota lawmaker who was killed along with her husband. Gabby Giffords I know that you were friends with her. Yes Melissa Horton perfect perfect perfect. Yeah Gabby met Melissa several years ago when we were working to pass gun safety legislation in Minnesota. So when she was the speaker of the Minnesota House, she and Governor Walz helped us get a red flag law passed in Minnesota as well as an expanded background checks law. It is a really devastating loss that obviously also hits very close to home for Gabby and for the origins of this organization.

LS. Speaking of getting legislation passed, this month marks the three-year anniversary of the passage of the Bipartisan Safer Communities Act, which enhanced background checks for young gun buyers, it increased funding for mental health services, it did a bunch of other things. Congresswoman, are you optimistic about further meaningful change on this issue? I'm optimistic. It will be a long hard haul, but I'm optimistic. This week on Tuesday was actually also the 10-year anniversary of the Charleston shooting. So Gabby and I actually were in Charleston to mark the 10 years with Mother Emanuel AME Church.

And Gabby got up at the service. And Gabby, do you want to share what you said? Hope and faith. Hope and faith. Hope and faith. We think about the tragedies that pile up from guns in America and often the last thing people think of is hope and faith, but it is really hard. But I was sitting there in that church on Tuesday and Gabby was up at the pulpit and she said, hope and faith and you could hear the room inhale. Yeah. I started this conversation by talking about the email, the fundraiser email that I received from you, Congresswoman, this week and you signed that email with courage, which says a lot. Do you not ever want to give up?

No way, Jose. Move ahead to not look back. I hope it's our inspired to keep moving forward no matter what. You know, Gabby says the words move ahead a lot. It's part of a lot of her speeches, part of the words that she has relearned. And there's actually a little bit of an origin story to that if you'd permit me telling it.

When Gabby was a kid and a teenager, she loved theater, specifically musical theater. And one of her favorite shows was Annie. The sun will come out tomorrow, so you've got to hang on till tomorrow. That one. Come what may. Woohoo! That's right, that one. Yeah, that's very good.

Clapping. Yeah, yeah. And so she and her mom, Gloria, would sing that to one another when she was a kid. And then when Gabby was shot, she was in a coma for some days after the shooting. And her mom, Gloria, sat by her bed and held her hand and sang to her, tomorrow, tomorrow. And that essence of the hope that there

may be a tomorrow that is different, the courage to move ahead is really at the core of the work that we do and how Gabby approaches the work. And as a side note, the bullet that entered her brain impacted her ability to speak. You know, she wants to, she knows what she wants to say but she can't get the words out. It actually didn't impact her musical ability,

which is a miracle. So she has perfect, she has perfect tune, far better than, far better than I do. And her recall and her ability to sing has remained untouched. And maintaining hope in the face of the shooting after shooting after shooting in this country is beautiful. I will note that the last time we spoke, that was three years ago, and that was in the aftermath of the shootings in Yuvalde, Texas that left 21 people dead. We're here today because of the deadly shootings in Minnesota. Investigators in Minnesota are still trying to figure out what the motive may have been. We do know that the man who has been charged had multiple guns

in his vehicle. He had multiple AK-47s in his vehicle. There is no evidence though that they were acquired illegally. There's no criminal history that would have raised a red flag and prevented the purchase. What laws would have prevented this? What laws would you like to see changed? Yeah. It's a great question. Better gun laws and background checks. Yeah, it's a great question. Better gun laws and background checks. Yeah, that's right.

But there was nothing in his background that would have, as I say, set off a red flag. Right, yeah, so there's still a lot to understand about the details of the shooting. But I think we need to ask ourselves, how is it that somebody who was that dangerous, who had a list of legislators on him, who was driving to their homes to hunt and kill them

was allowed to roll around with at least three AK-47s and a handgun and military gear. So that, you know, I think is the fundamental question and your question about what policies would have prevented this is a good one and I think we'll know more about that as we get more details on this. And Gabby, I think one thing we would also just point out is that something that surprises

people a lot about this issue is how much progress we've made. Just like you don't think about hope when you think about guns in America, you don't think about progress. But in actuality, Gabby founded this organization 12 years ago. And in that period of time, we've passed over 700 laws at the state level to further gun safety. And you just heard her say, better gun laws. And that's because, you know, in states that have stronger gun laws, fewer people are dying.

That's been proven now. SONIA DARAGOS Last question, and this is for you, Gabby Giffords, and it's about the long view. It has been 14 years since you were injured. What have you learned from your experiences over those 14 years? To be grateful for friends and family. And to live every day to the fullest. Hope, hope, hope.

Yeah. That is former Arizona Democratic Congresswoman Gabby Giffords, and Emma Brown, the executive director of Giffords, the advocacy group she co-founded to promote gun safety. Thank you to you both. Thank you for having us. Thank you, thank you, thank you. This episode was produced by Lauren Hodges and Mia Vincat with audio engineering by Ted Mebane.

It was edited by Justine Kennan, Adam Rainey, and Nadia Lancy. Our executive producer is Sammy Yennegan. Thanks to our Consider This Plus listeners, who support the work of NPR journalists and help keep public radio strong. Supporters also hear every episode without messages from sponsors. You can learn more at plus.npr.org. episode without messages from sponsors, you can learn more at plus.npr.org. It's Consider This from NPR. I'm Mary Louise Kelly.