Consider This from NPR - Project 2025: Political winner or loser?

Episode Date: September 5, 2024

Project 2025 - you've probably heard about it. It's a roadmap from the conservative Heritage Foundation for the next Republican president.It's also been a major talking point for Democrats on the camp...aign trail. Donald Trump, meanwhile, has tried to disavow it and distance himself. That's because the plan has attracted negative attention over the ultra conservative policies it endorses like overhauling and eliminating some government agencies, firing thousands of civil servants and a mass deportation campaign. Project 2025 was created to help the next Republican President execute an extreme conservative agenda. Now it's also become an attack line for Democrats. For sponsor-free episodes of Consider This, sign up for Consider This+ via Apple Podcasts or at plus.npr.org.Email us at considerthis@npr.org.Learn more about sponsor message choices: podcastchoices.com/adchoicesNPR Privacy Policy

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Starting point is 00:00:00 Project 2025, a 922-page blueprint to make Donald Trump the most powerful president ever. Project 2025. It is a conservative agenda created by the Heritage Foundation, a conservative think tank, and it's a roadmap for the next Republican president. He'll round up American citizens, use the government to punish his enemies, put the crazy and corrupt in power forever. Overhauling the Department of Justice, giving Trump the unchecked power to seek vengeance. Less free, less fair, less American. The plan has attracted negative attention over the ultra-conservative policies it endorses. Policies such as overhauling and eliminating some government agencies, firing thousands of civil servants, and authorizing a mass deportation campaign. Despite all that being aligned with Trump policy priorities, the former president has been trying
Starting point is 00:00:58 to distance himself from Project 2025 for months. I don't know what the hell it is. It's Project 25. At the same time, Democrats have seized on the sweeping agenda on the campaign trail. Because we know Donald Trump has a very different plan. He has a very different plan. Just look at his Project 2025 agenda. And they've seized on it in campaign ads. Project 2025 is a plan to return America to a dark past. They have told us exactly what they're going to do. The goals in Project 2025 are clear.
Starting point is 00:01:42 It should be subtitled, How to Screw the Working People. That's how it should be listed. Consider this. Project 2025 was created to help the next Republican president execute an extreme conservative agenda. Now it has also become an attack line for Democrats. From NPR, I'm Mary Louise Kelly. It's Consider This from NPR. Typically, you don't hear campaigns talking about their rivals' transition plans. But like so many other things, this election season this year is different. The conservative agenda, Project 2025, has garnered massive attention for its extreme policy proposals.
Starting point is 00:02:39 Many, as NPR White House correspondent Franco Ordonez says, were made for a Donald Trump second term. It's effectively a transition in waiting run by some of Trump's closest allies from his first presidency. And it really dates back to his disastrous first transition back in 2016. When he took office, he was widely criticized for being unprepared. Trump actually picked former New Jersey Governor Chris Christie to make the plans. But Trump tossed all that work out when he was elected, and they really had to start from scratch. Okay, so this is designed to avoid that scenario again, to actually have a plan should he have a second term? Exactly. His allies didn't want that to happen again if he wins a second term. So they got to work and they got to work well before even the primaries, drafting plans for the next, quote, conservative president. And I will note, to be clear, that's exactly what they'll say now. It's for any conservative president. But all along, it was written with Trump in mind. They've told me it was the embodiment. He was the embodiment of the program or the movement. You know, and they pulled together a huge personnel database. They also
Starting point is 00:03:49 compiled a list of executive orders that can be rolled out on day one. But what folks have really found to be so controversial is this 900-page pro-Trump plan to overhaul the American government. And I got a copy here. Boom. It's 900 pages. Yep. It's really a wish list of conservative policies that Trump would be able to choose from. It calls for mass deportations, eliminating the Department of Education, stricter controls on abortion, and slashing climate protection. All of which would be controversial and worthy of conversation.
Starting point is 00:04:24 It's so interesting, though, because transition planning, unless you were a political reporter inside the Beltway, usually would not capture this much attention. I mean, is part of the reason this one has been so prominent that Democrats have spent so much time talking about it. I mean, it really is. And they really did talk so much about it and they had a really big impact. I mean, they have been talking about this for months or at least working on this for months. They actually saw some online chatter in the spring and saw an opportunity to kind of tie this to Trump politically. They zeroed in on some of the most controversial parts that we've been talking about, abortion restrictions, politicizing agencies, gutting the civil service, allies got involved. Actress Taraji P. Henson brought it up at the BET wards. That really added fuel to the fire. Pay attention. It's not a secret. Look it up. They are attacking our most vulnerable citizens.
Starting point is 00:05:22 The Project 2025 plan is not a game. Look it up. And for Democrats, it's really the gift that keeps on giving. I mean, it was a big part of the Democratic National Convention. Comedian Kenan Thompson even carried out a cartoon-size version of Project 2025 to make fun of Trump and the effort. Y'all remember this big old book from before? You ever seen a document that could kill a small animal and democracy at the same time? Well, and Trump, as we said, keeps trying to distance himself. Why has that not worked? Yeah, I mean, he said a few times that he knows nothing about it, and that he disagrees with
Starting point is 00:06:02 what's inside it. I mean, he even touted the project's demise when one of the main top editors stepped down. But really, the work was already done. And those involved are made up of loyalists and allies and former Trump officials. And we're talking about high-ranking officials who are likely to be candidates in a second Trump administration as well. And look, even two years ago, Trump was at a Heritage event, and he told the group that their work was going to be essential going forward. This is a great group, and they're going to lay the groundwork and detail plans for exactly what our movement will do and what your movement will do when the American people give us a colossal mandate to save America.
Starting point is 00:06:48 And that's coming. So Trump keeps disavowing, denying, distancing himself. Has it worked? Are people buying it? Well, I mean, it is true that this is not Trump's plan, but it is a plan for Trump. I mean, one way I look at it is it's taking Trump's policy goals, the one he talks about on the stump all the time, and creates a legal roadmap to execute them. But you are right that the denials, they didn't seem to temper expectations. In fact, they seem to have fueled
Starting point is 00:07:18 attention. Democratic strategists argue that public awareness of Project 2025 has actually only increased in recent months as he's been talking about it. And now it's a regular part of Harris's stump speech. One other thing that intrigues me, Franco, Donald Trump does not shy away from controversy. He likes stoking controversy. Why does his approach, his handling of this seem so different? Yeah, I do find that interesting because you're right. He doesn't run away from controversy.
Starting point is 00:07:49 You know, for him, attention, any attention is good attention. But this truly has hit a nerve with Trump. I mean, allies have told me that Heritage simply got ahead of their skis and started to try to drive the political message. And Trump doesn't like that. Also, Trump likes to keep things simple. He uses slogans that are more memorable. He even ripped up the Republican policy platform from his convention in Milwaukee and turned it into a list of bullet points. At the same time, Trump does see how Project 2025 is resonating with voters. You know, often it really seems that Trump is focusing solely on his base, but he has some made or some moves to try and appeal to certain voters like women and independent
Starting point is 00:08:34 leading voters, especially in key states like Michigan, Pennsylvania and Georgia. I want to end with where things actually stand. Trump says this is not his plan, but he does have a plan. He's actually or was chairman of Cantor Fitzgerald, a financial services firm. You know, it is notable that neither have ties to Project 2025. McMahon's appointment, though, actually also adds emphasis to the work of another group, a competing group, per se, America First Policy Institute, that I am told is very involved in some of the transition work. She is on the board. But seeing how Heritage got on the wrong side of Trump, America First Policy Institute is being very careful not to do anything to antagonize Trump. And Piers Franco, Ordonez, thank you. Thank you so much. This episode was produced by Tyler Bartlam with audio engineering by Ted Meebane and Neil T. Vaught.
Starting point is 00:09:50 It was edited by Megan Prats and Courtney Dorning. Our executive producer is Sammy Yenigan. And one more thing before we go. You can now enjoy the Consider This newsletter. We still help you break down a major story of the day. You'll also get to know our producers and hosts and some moments of joy from the All Things Considered team. You can sign up at npr.org slash consider this newsletter. It's Consider This from NPR.
Starting point is 00:10:20 I'm Mary Louise Kelly.

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