Consider This from NPR - Tariffs are a tax. Are you already paying it?

Episode Date: July 16, 2025

It's been over three months since President Trump announced very big across-the-board tariffs on imports from nearly every territory on Earth–including uninhabited islands. It's a move he said would revitalize the U.S. economy.Since that splashy White House announcement, the tariff rates have been a wildly moving target. Ratcheted up - then back down - on China, specifically.Overlaid with global product-specific tariffs on categories like automobiles and copper. Partially paused after the stock market tanked.Through it all, the tariff rate has remained at or well-above 10 percent on nearly every good imported to the U.S. And if you've listened to NPR's reporting since April, you'll have heard many voices make one particular prediction over and over again – that American consumers will pay the price.If American consumers are going to pay for the tariffs, the question is: when ? For sponsor-free episodes of Consider This, sign up for Consider This+ via Apple Podcasts or at plus.npr.org.Email us at [e-mail] more about sponsor message choices: podcastchoices.com/adchoicesNPR Privacy Policy

It has been over three months since this. My fellow Americans, this is Liberation Day. Waiting for a long time. That's when President Trump announced very big across-the-board tariffs on imports from nearly every territory on Earth, including uninhabited islands, a move that he said would revitalize the U.S. economy. April 2nd, 2025 will forever be remembered as the day American industry was reborn, the day America's destiny was reclaimed, and the

day that we began to make America wealthy again. From the very start most economists and CEOs had a very different prediction. Larry Fink, head of the investment company BlackRock, summed it up succinctly. Most CEOs I talk to would say we are probably in a recession right now. Now, since that splashy White House announcement, the tariff rates have been a wildly moving target, ratcheted up, then back down on China specifically, overlaid with global product-specific tariffs on categories like automobiles and copper, partially paused after the stock market tanked. And through it all, the tariff rate has remained at or well above 10%

on nearly every good imported to the U.S. And if you have listened to NPR's reporting since April, you will have heard many voices make one particular prediction over and over again that American consumers will pay the price. Like Jay Foreman, whose company makes toys like Tonka trucks, Lightbright and Care Bears. Those tariffs will start to affect the price of goods. Once you get above 10 percent, that's going to be a pass along. Or Julie Heckman, who heads the American Pyrotechnics Association, a fireworks industry group. And of course, she had a fireworks pun. I would anticipate that most people are going to get a little less bang for their buck this year.

Or Nobel Prize winning economist Paul Krugman. You know, once it becomes clear that these are here to stay, no, it's going to end up being American consumers paying it. Well, if American consumers are going to pay for the tariffs, the question is, when? Consider this. You probably haven't noticed a big tariff impact yet. We'll look at how they're winding their way through the supply chain and where they could pop up next. From NPR, I'm Elsa Chang.

When you walk into NPR headquarters, one of the first things you see is a big map of the country covered with little blue dots. Each dot represents a local public radio station. That's the NPR network. I'm Katherine Maher, CEO of NPR. With federal funding for public media eliminated, your network is under serious threat. Help us plan for the road ahead at donate.npr.org.

Hi, it's Katherine Maher, CEO of NPR. Federal funding for public media has been eliminated. That means that the NPR network is moving forward in an uncharted future. But our commitment to you will never waver. Please give today to support the kind of journalism that democracy relies upon. Make your gift at donate.npr.org. Thank you. You know those things you shout at the radio or maybe even at this very NPR podcast? On NPR's Wait Wait Don't Tell Me, we actually say those things on the radio and on the podcast.

We're rude across all media. We think the news can take it. Listen to NPR's Wait Wait Don't Tell Me wherever you get your podcasts. It's Consider This from NPR. What is happening with prices and tariffs? President Trump spoke to reporters at the White House on Wednesday, praising the money that the federal government is collecting from import taxes. Already, we've brought in over $100 billion. We'll be bringing in hundreds of billions of dollars.

And the tariffs really haven't kicked in that much other than automobiles and steel. Now, many American businesses have contributed to those billions as they're paying the tariffs, and the costs are starting to show up in store prices. So what does that mean for back to school or even Christmas shopping? Well, NPR economics and retail reporters, Scott Horsley and Alina Seljuk join us now to help

answer that question. Hey to both of you. Hi. Hello, hello. Hello, hello. All right, Scott, I want to start with you. How big of a windfall is this tariff revenue for the government and where is that revenue coming from exactly?

It's substantial. Last month alone, tariffs brought in $27 billion, which is four times what the government raised for import taxes during the same month a year ago. Wow. Now, the president would have you believe all that money is coming from other countries, just as he once promised that Mexico would pay for his border wall. In fact, while foreign suppliers might absorb some of the cost, it's US importers that get the tariff bill. And this week's inflation data shows that some of the cost is now being passed on to

US consumers. The Nonpartisan Tax Foundation calculates this amounts to the largest tax increase in more than three decades, but it's a sneaky tax increase because you don't get a bill from the IRS. Instead, the cost just shows up in the price of everyday purchases at Walmart or Best Buy or the like. The Tax Foundation estimates that tariff-driven price increases will cost the average family $1,300 this year and $1,700 next year.

Okay, and Alina, so people are already starting to pay all of this right now? Yeah, to some extent. Price increases are only starting to show up at the big stores, but shoppers may start to notice them more at smaller stores. It's the small sellers on Amazon or your mom and pop shops that are having the hardest time covering the higher import bills from increased tariffs. Even though the biggest tariff hikes are still on pause, even with a 10% tariff, shop owners are having to front

thousands of dollars in cash for their shipments, and they're having to make difficult choices. Do they still ship more? Do they hold their products in China and wait? Or is that too risky if tariffs skyrocket after August 1st, as Trump has threatened? The irony is, while Trump is warning of even higher tariffs on August 1st, forecasters say that might not raise a lot more money for the government.

For one thing, the president has a habit of backing down on his tariff threats, but even if he does follow through and boost the tariff on goods from Europe, for example, from 10 to 30 percent as he's threatened, that doesn't mean the government's revenue would triple because beyond a certain price point, people just stop buying those imported products. No sale, no tax income. We saw that this spring when the tariff on goods from China briefly went to 145 percent and the cargo traffic basically dried up.

Any kind of tax has the potential to sway people's buying decisions. And the higher the tax is, the bigger that distortion's likely to be. Right, OK, so maybe businesses might pause shipments if tariffs skyrocket. Is that already happening, Alina? Yeah, talking to retailers, they seem to have three strategies for tackling tariffs. Number one is to stockpile products

that got shipped in advance of tariffs and slowly sell them off. Number two is pay the higher tariff on shipments and eat some of that cost for now, delaying the big jolt to shoppers. And the third strategy is to raise prices now because you don't have any stockpile or cash cushion to eat the tariff. And depending on the store, people are doing a bit of column A, bit of column B, bit of column C. So you're seeing some stuff going up in price, like electronics, clothes, toys, and especially appliances that are facing extra steel and aluminum tariffs. But prices aren't soaring

dramatically across every store, at least not yet. At least not yet. You're saying not yet, because I guess it is going to come. You know, I'm currently watching back to school shopping for higher prices. And there's an interesting dynamic playing out. A lot of retailers are putting huge value on this back to school season because they're worried that the holidays are just not going to be that great. And the idea is that more and more shipments from China or other countries are going to face higher tariffs.

Prices will rise. And shoppers who are already feeling jittery about spending are going to tighten their belts. And so retailers think maybe let's sell stuff for back to school while the going is good, get those dollars locked in now, and gird up for whatever happens in the winter. The Port of Los Angeles, which is America's busiest, Executive Director Gene Seroca had a bleak forecast. Lower inventory levels, fewer selections and higher prices are likely as we head into the holidays.

He's saying Shipments saw a bit of a pause in May as Trump seemed to shift his position on tariffs and now importers are catching up, presumably, to stockpile before August 1st. OK, well, Scott, the tariffs are one big piece of the president's agenda of course, but another big piece is the Republican tax cut that passed earlier this month. How do these two items fit together? Do they? Well the money the government collects from tariffs could help to make up for some of the money it's not going to collect in income taxes. So you could look at this

as the government taking money from one pocket and putting it back in the other. But about 60% of the savings from the tax cut go to the wealthiest 20% of taxpayers, while the cost of the tariffs falls hardest on people towards the bottom of the income ladder. So, the government is taking money from the pockets of blue jeans to put into the pockets of Armani suits. Economist Alex Durante of the Tax Foundation says that's not likely to be very popular. If you were trying to convince the vast majority of Americans that you have their best interests

at heart, a policy that is going to raise taxes at the bottom and then deliver a lot of benefits to the top, I think that's kind of a hard sell. The Federal Reserve came out with its latest beige book today. It's a roundup of economic Federal Reserve came out with its latest beige book today. It's a roundup of economic conditions around the country and it uses the word tariff 75 times. Wow. It says we're likely to see higher inflation towards the end of the summer as more of those tariff costs are passed along.

Okay. Well, speaking of the Federal Reserve, President Trump was reportedly considering firing the Fed chair, Jerome Powell. What's been the reaction to that? Yeah, this is part of an ongoing pressure campaign by the White House, which wants the Fed to lower interest rates. Trump says he talked about firing Powell with a group of GOP lawmakers last night.

Now, it's legally doubtful he has the authority to do that, but just the news he was thinking about it caused a brief sell-off in the stock market, and the president quickly backed down. That is MPUR's Scott Horsley and Alina Seljuk. Thank you to both of you. Thank you. You're welcome.

This episode was produced by Eric Orion and Connor Donovan. It was edited by Rafael Nam and Courtney Dornan. Our executive producer is Sammy Yennegan. It's Consider This from NPR. I'm Elsa Chang. This summer on Planet Money Summer School, we're learning about political economy. We're getting into the nitty gritty of what government does with things like trade, taxes, immigration and health care.

So politics and economics, which are taught separately, they shouldn't be separated at all. I think you have to understand one to really appreciate the other. So what is the right amount of government in our lives? Tune in to Planet Money Summer School from NPR, wherever you get your podcasts. At Planet Money, we know that economic jargon can sometimes feel like speaking another language. Yeah, like arbitrage, alpha, autarky. That's just what's in the news these days. There's also absolute advantage, aggregate demand, aggregate supply, and this is just

the ace. Oh, animal spirits. That's a pretty good one. Planet Money from NPR. We help you translate the economy so you can understand the world, wherever you get your podcasts.