Consider This from NPR - "The Return" tells an ancient story that still resonates today.

Episode Date: December 6, 2024

An epic poem and an epic reunion come to the big screen. The Return looks for new meaning in Homer's ancient story of Odysseus' return to Ithaca — and to his wife Penelope. We talk to co-stars Ralph Fiennes and Juliette Binoche. For sponsor-free episodes of Consider This, sign up for Consider This+ via Apple Podcasts or at plus.npr.org.Email us at [e-mail] more about sponsor message choices: podcastchoices.com/adchoicesNPR Privacy Policy

Here's a story for you. A warrior king has just washed up on a beach. He's been gone for twenty years. His wife, the Queen, has been waiting, pining, for his return. And this is all unfolding on the island of Ithaca. Yes, we are talking about The Odyssey, the epic poem by Homer. So many years. Why? Would you still love the man I had become who couldn't return? Forgive me. That's a clip from the new film The Return, starring Juliet Binoche as Queen Penelope and Ralph Fiennes as King Odysseus. The two have been separated by war and chaos for so many years. When they finally come face to face, in Ithaca, it's a reunion in more ways than one. For Odysseus and Penelope,

of course, but also for the actors who play them, because it has been 28 years since Fiennes have shared the screen. I'm still here. You'd better be. Don't depend on it, will you? That little bit of air in my lungs, each day, gets less and less. The 1996 drama The English Patient. That was the last time Ray Fiennes and Juliette Binoche were co-stars. Consider this an epic poem and an epic reunion. Come to the big screen.

We talk with the stars of The Return about finding new meaning in an ancient homecoming story. From NPR, I'm Mary Louise Kelly. The Indicator is a podcast where daily economic news is about what matters to you. Workers have been feeling the sting of inflation. So as a new administration promises action on the cost of living, taxes, and home prices, the S&P 500 biggest post-election day spike ever. Follow all the big changes and what they mean for you. Make America affordable again. Listen to The Indicator, the daily economics podcast

from NPR. It's considered this from NPR. The new film, The Return, picks up at the end of Odysseus' journey. He's spent the last ten years trying to get home to Ithaca. He's finally back. No one knows who he is. And, at least for now, he wants to keep it that way. Because the Ithaca he left is not the Ithaca he's coming back to. There was no king. He sailed the Troy years ago. Took the best men with him. None of them came back. Who do you serve now? The Queen Penelope and her son. No man at her side?

All year they've been turning up from miles around, waiting for her to choose. Has she? She's strong. Keeps them waiting for her husband to return. Lyle Reif-Fiennes and Juliette Binoche are the stars of the return and they are both here with me now. Welcome. Hi. Hi. We pick up at the end of Odysseus's story. After long years fighting the Trojan War, long years trying to get home to Ithaca, Refines,

give us a taste of what Odysseus has been through in those years. He's been at war for 10 years initially, and then a further 10 years traveling, all kinds of adventures, meeting witches and monsters and all kinds of obstructions. and the wrath of Poseidon is the main reason why in Homer Odysseus has not returned. In our film, you don't know that all gods and monsters are gone. But what the director, Oberto Pasolini, wanted to emphasize was the cost on his soul of being away for so long, fighting, killing, probably committing terrible atrocities as a warrior at war, and then ongoing, he's been with other women in his travels, but he's a sort of wreck of a person in our film

when he is washed up on the shore of Ithaca with all this sort of inner landscape of battle, war, adventure. Yes, you could say he's betrayed his wife, but I think he's just a man who's been lost for a long time. Juliet, what has Penelope been doing during these years? We know she's been doing weaving, a whole lot of weaving. Yes, but also trying to have a sense of sanity, being on her own as a queen and seeing, you know,

the royalty going down so much because people are starving and the suitors around her trying to get the power and bringing up her son and expecting her husband to come back one day but not knowing where he is. So there's a lot of anxiety in her, as well as a lot of hope. And in this script, Penelope is somehow different. It's not just the waiting wife being a saint. She's a woman with feelings, with needs, and fighting those feelings of anger and feelings of feeling abandoned. And so that was so interesting to play because it felt complex and it felt very modern.

It's not simple. It's their complex characters. Let me take us to the moment when after 20 years Penelope finally comes face to face with Odysseus. Where have you been since you left Troy? Traveling, drifting. Did you hear my husband in your travels? He must be dead. The man who left would never have stayed away from his son, his wife, his people.

Perhaps she's afraid. And we're left wondering, does she recognize him? How could she not recognize him? Who does she think she's talking to? It's not very clear in the book, is it, whether she recognizes him or not. But I think, how could she not recognize him? They were married. She knows his voice.

I'd like to leave it to the audience to decide. And, Uberto, the director has been really cautious in editing that scene in order to have the choice. I kept watching your eyes, Juliette, but I was trying to figure out when were they going to flash? And I would think she's got it, she's there. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, that's the art of the director and editor,

to find the right place to, whether to cut it or not. When I played it, I think I knew you had seen me. I knew it and I knew she decides not to call him. She talks of him as did my husband do this? Who is my husband? Have you seen my husband? But as we played it, I knew she had seen me, but neither of us are prepared to self-identify to each other. There's a sort of weird thing holding us back because the distance, I thought that was a wonderful piece of writing that we are held back. I can't say it's me and she can't say I

know it's you. Yeah she can't say but yeah she's furious that he's not able to come and say here I am, I'm back, I want to save you, I'm gonna protect you, we're gonna have a plan and that's why when she decides to go for the bow the challenge is so big. She's going to challenge everyone. It's like, okay, you playing that game? We're going to play that game now. Well, to explain the bow, the bow is this giant bow that only Odysseus in his

youth could string and shoot through. What is it? 12, 12 arrowheads? 12 axe heads. Axe heads. Yeah. The perfect shot. And I'm, as the audience, I was left wondering, can he do it? This is, this is a wreck of a man.

How is this one going to end? We've talked about how Odysseus and Penelope were separated for 20 years. In a way, the two of you, Juliette Binoche and Ray Fiennes, you were separated for longer than that. It has been 28 years since we have gotten to see you both on screen together, 28 years since the English patient came out in 1996. What has this reunion been like? A joy. Well, we've been friends over the years, but when this project brought us together, I think

we both recognized there was a kind of, it felt inevitable. Well, and you said that in a passive way, like when the film brought you together, but I was reading, you were involved first and you thought, I know who Penelope needs to be, who needs to play her. Well, actually, yes, I was involved. Don't say no. Please take it as it was your idea. He's always saying that it's Hubertu, I'm director.

I'm the idea. It makes me really feel bad. I'm teasing you and now you're taking it personally. Come on Rave. Rave. The the it's sometimes that you can't see the thing that's in front of you. That's just human blindness. So I couldn't see that Juliette Binoche had to play Penelope with me.

That was a door opened, a crack in a window by our director. But when the shaft of light carried her name hit me, I went, yes, yes. Well, it was the right call. Ray Fiennes and Juliette Vinoche, this has been a great pleasure. Thank you both so much. Thank you for having us. Thank you. Thank you very much.

They are back together, as you just heard, starring in the new movie, The Return. This episode was produced by Catherine Fink. It was edited by Sarah Handel and Jeanette Woods. Our executive producer is Sammy Unigan. Thank you to our Consider This Plus listeners who support the work of NPR journalists and who help to keep public radio strong. Supporters also hear every episode without messages from sponsors. You can learn more at plus.npr.org.

It's Consider This from NPR. I'm Mary Louise Kelly. Want to hear this podcast without sponsor breaks? Amazon Prime members can listen to Consider This sponsor-free through Amazon Music. Or you can also support NPR's vital journalism and get Consider This Plus at plus.npr.org. That's plus.npr.org.