Consider This from NPR - Trump is slashing the number of refugees. What does that mean?

Episode Date: November 3, 2025

Every year the President of the United States determines how many refugees can enter this country. The law says he must consult Congress on this number. But last week President Trump announced just 7,500 refugees would be admitted in the coming fiscal year – a 94% cut from the 125,000 cap set by President Joe Biden.Sharif Aly leads the International Refugee Assistance Project - an organization that helps refugees and other immigrants navigate the legal process of resettlement. The International Refugee Assistance Project is also challenging Trump’s suspension of the U.S. Refugee Admissions Program. Aly joined Consider This host Juana Summers to discuss how this historic drop means for the US refugee resettlement system.For sponsor-free episodes of Consider This, sign up for Consider This+ via Apple Podcasts or at plus.npr.org. Email us at [e-mail] episode was produced by Jonaki Mehta, Connor Donevan and Karen Zamora, with audio engineering by Becky Brown and Simon-Laslo Janssen. It was edited by Courtney Dorning. Our executive producer is Sami Yenigun.Learn more about sponsor message choices: podcastchoices.com/adchoicesNPR Privacy Policy

Moses M. was just a kid when he escaped a civil war in the Democratic Republic of Congo and then survived a massacre at a refugee camp in neighboring Burundi. My tribe of Bunyan Malanga tribe was being persecuted at a time. Moses M. spoke to NPR on the condition that we do not use his last name to protect his relatives who were trying to seek protection in the U.S. as refugees. In 2007, when Moses was 13, he and his family, he and his family, family moved to Boise, Idaho. We're one of the lucky ones that were also selected to be able to resettle in the United States. He had to learn a new language and adapt to colder weather. Trying to navigate a new life here was really hard at first, but it was better than being

in a refugee camp somewhere in Africa. Fast forward to present day, 10 years after resettling, Moses is now in real estate. He's married and a father to a three-year-old boy and a six-year-old girl. I am an American citizen and a father of two, and I like to think that I do contribute to the community that I'm a part of here. That is exactly what President Jimmy Carter envisioned when he signed the Refugee Act into law in 1980. It was a pivotal moment that shaped U.S. refugee policy and granted pathways for resettlement. Here's Carter that same year. We are the most generous nation on earth in receiving refugees, and I feel very deeply that this commitment should be.

be maintained. Ours is a country of refugees. According to the Migration Policy Institute, more than 3 million refugees have been admitted since 1980, and the number of refugees admitted to the United States has never dipped below 10,000 admissions a year, even after the 9-11 attacks or during the pandemic. Until now, on President Trump's first day in office, he halted the arrival of refugees coming into the United States, except for Afrikan or. South Africa's white minority. Trump said the country, quote, lacks the ability to absorb a large number of refugees in a manner that does not, quote, compromise the availability of resources for Americans that protects their safety and security and that ensures the appropriate assimilation

of refugees. Here is Deputy Secretary of State, Christopher Landau, on why white South Africans were the exception to the pause. Some of the criteria are making sure that refugees did not pose any challenge to our national security and that they could be assimilated easily into our country. Then last week, Trump announced that only 7,500 refugees would be admitted in the coming fiscal year. That's a 94% cut from the 125,000 caps set by Biden. Moses's uncle and cousin are among the many people who are now being turned away.

They had hopes of being able to have a good life. You know, their son could get medical. attention and can also get a chance to be able to go to school. My family is religious and we believe everything happens for a reason, but knowing that they won't be able to come anytime soon because of the decision of one person is kind of heartbreaking. Consider this as the Trump administration drastically cuts the number of refugees that will admit to the United States.

What does that mean for the entire U.S. refugee system? From NPR, I'm Juana Summers. It's consider this from NPR. Every year, the president of the United States determines how many refugees can enter this country. The law says he must consult Congress on this number. But last week, when President Trump announced reducing the number of refugees, he did so without. Congress. Sharif Ali leads the International Refugee Assistance Project, an organization that helps refugees and other immigrants navigate the legal process of resettlement. The International

Refugee Assistance Project is also challenging Trump's suspension of the U.S. refugee admissions program, and he came into our studios to talk to us about it. So just on a very practical level, where does this leave the thousands of refugees who are already in the pipeline to come here to United States? It really leaves them in shambles, quite frankly. They are currently have went through a very extraordinary vetting process to come into the United States. We have clients that have been calling us that have been in tears. They just want to come to safety after years of persecution and conflict. The law that established the current system of refugee admissions in this country is something called the Refugee Act of 1980. Can you just walk us through what that law guarantees refugees?

Well, that law allows for refugees to come into the United States through. a process that includes a vetting process, that also includes a determination by the president of where refugees are coming from. After going through that process, there is a resettlement agency that helps facilitate that settlement into the United States. That resettlement process is approximately six months to a year. Refugees are provided support for housing, English as second language, learning, opportunities for employment, and support from local communities to help them integrate into society. And part of that law, as I understand it, it requires that the president consult Congress on the number of refugees that he determined should be led into the United States,

which this administration did not do. The Trump administration says that's because the government is currently shut down. Do we expect lawsuits? I can't tell you right now. However, it is a complete movement away from historical precedent and the law. The law actually requires the president and his cabinet members to consult with Congress. So therefore, I do anticipate there will be a challenge to this. I cannot tell you who or what, but I do anticipate a challenge. What do you say to those who might make the case that it shouldn't be America's job to take in refugees? There's a challenge right now with how people are scapegoating refugees and immigrants for the problems that exist in America today.

If they are economic problems, refugees contribute economically. If people are afraid of their safety, refugees are the most vetted immigrants that come into the United States. If people are concerned about the change in their culture, if you look at any major city across the U.S., you are enjoying the cuisine of people who have come into this country from a variety of different places. You're enjoying the art, the music, the contribution to those communities. And what we're doing is we're closing ourselves off from the rest of the world at our own detriment, economically, culturally, and honestly morally. This is a humanitarian commitment that we've established in the 1980 Refugee Act, something that has been based

in our American values of welcoming people, regardless of what they have went through, to find a new home in America to be a place for their safety, a place for their contribution. Now, there have been, of course, waves of refugees at various points across U.S. history, but am I correct that this is the first time that one ethnic group has been giving preference? And we're, of course, talking about the white Afrikaners from South Africa, which are the same group that implemented apartheid in that country? That is correct. And this is one of the concerns that the resettlement agencies have.

We're not here to discuss the validity of Afrikaners, but what is afforded to them should be afforded to all people, considering that they are the most vetted people that come into this country. So the concern that many in our space have, including our organization, is that we're basically putting a door to all those who are not Afrikaners to this country, which, which really incites concerns about racism and xenophobia. Sharif, as you think about these new restrictions on refugees in the U.S., is there someone that comes to mind that you think about,

who you worked with in the past, who maybe wouldn't be able to come into the United States now? Yeah, actually, there's quite a few. But one of them that I'll share with you is one of our clients that is currently part of the Pesito v. Trump case. His name is Pesito. And he is a father who fled from Congo. with his wife and daughter.

And after the January 21st, they were told that they were no longer going to be able to take their flight coming into the U.S. And they had shared with us that they felt like after so many doors had been closed in front of their faces, they finally thought when they got approval to travel that they were going to embark on a journey to a new home. And this is after years of fleeing violence in Congo, staying in Kenya to try to settle themselves. and they finally were told that, no, your travel is not allowed into the U.S. Thankfully, due to the injunction we received early on in the Pasito v. Trump case, he was one of the 80 individuals that was allowed to come into the U.S., and that litigation is ongoing. However, he has communicated to us and told us, you know, how thankful and grateful he is that he's been able to come into the U.S.

He's so thankful that his daughter is able to go to school now without fear for her safety, that him and his wife are able to pursue work and opportunities to have a dignified life here in the U.S. And the amount of gratitude that I've seen from him, along with so many other refugees, just indicates the passion that they have and commitment to serve in the U.S. in a manner that any person here would be proud to have them as their neighbor. That was Sharif Ali, president of the International Refugee Assistance Project. This episode was produced by Janaki Mata, Connor Donovan, and Karen Zamora with audio engineering by Becky Brown and Simon Laslo Janssen. It was edited by Courtney Dorney. Our executive producer is

Sammy Yannigan. It's Consider This from NPR. I'm Juana Summers.