Consider This from NPR - What are the wider repercussions of the U.S. bombing of Iran's nuclear sites?

Episode Date: June 22, 2025

The U.S. joined Israel's war on Iran and over the weekend bombed three of the country's nuclear sites, including Fordo, located deep inside a mountain. In the aftermath of the bombing, Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu congratulated Trump on the attack. Iranian foreign minister Abbas Araghchi tweeted that the U.S.'s attack would have "everlasting consequences." The move by the Trump administration is a massive escalation, and brings the U.S. into direct conflict with Iran. How will Iran respond and what are the wider repercussions? NPR's Andrew Limbong speaks with journalist Robin Wright, author of "The Last Great Revolution: Turmoil and Transformation in Iran." For sponsor-free episodes of Consider This, sign up for Consider This+ via Apple Podcasts or at plus.npr.org. Email us at [e-mail] more about sponsor message choices: podcastchoices.com/adchoicesNPR Privacy Policy

On Saturday night, President Donald Trump made a stunning announcement. A short time ago, the U.S. military carried out massive precision strikes on the three key nuclear facilities in the Iranian regime. The U.S. joined Israel's war on Iran and bombed three of the country's nuclear sites, including Fordow, located deep inside a mountain. The strikes were a spectacular military success. Iran's key nuclear enrichment facilities have been completely and totally obliterated. Trump then urged Iran to seek peace. Iran, the bully of the Middle East, must now make peace. While cautioning that the U.S. has more firepower at its disposal. There will be either peace or there will be tragedy for Iran, far greater than we have

witnessed over the last eight days. Remember, there are many targets left. In the aftermath of the bombing, Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu congratulated Trump on the attack. Your bold decision to target Iran's nuclear facilities with the awesome and righteous might of the United States will change history. On Sunday morning, Iranian Foreign Minister Abbas Araghchi

tweeted that the U.S.'s attack would have, quote, everlasting consequences. Consider this, the move by the Trump administration is a massive escalation and brings the U.S. into direct conflict with Iran. How will Iran respond? And what are the wider repercussions? From NPR, I'm Andrew Limbaugh. This message comes from WISE, the app for doing things and other currencies. With WISE, you can send, spend, or receive money across borders, all at a fair exchange

rate. No markups or hidden fees. Join millions of customers and visit WISE.com. T's and C's apply. This message comes from the BBC with World of Secrets Season 8, The Killing Call. The Murder of Indian Music star Sindhu Mooseala at the height of his success sent shockwaves around the world. Who wanted him silenced? Search for World of Secrets from BBC podcasts.

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Robin Wright is a journalist who's written a number of books on the Middle East, including The Last Great Revolution, Turmoil and Transformation in Iran. And she joins me now. Hi, Robin. Hi, Andrew. Did this bombing by the Trump administration surprise you? I think there's been momentum over the last three or four days headed in this direction. So it kind of became inevitable.

The scope of it, I think, was a surprise that the United States went after three targets. And of course, we don't know the extent of the damage yet, but this is clearly a military setback for Iran's nuclear program. Let's talk about endgame here from both President Trump and Netanyahu. Is there any daylight between the two of them there? Well, Prime Minister Netanyahu has repeatedly talked about regime change. His defense minister has said that the Supreme Leader could no longer exist. I think that Israel implicitly has broader aims than simply military.

And President Trump made clear in his address to the nation that this, he hoped, would be a one and done and that Iran would come back to the negotiating table immediately and basically surrender. Now, remember, Iran does have a right to a civilian peaceful nuclear energy program as a member of the Non-Proliferation Treaty, but the bottom line is that both the United States and Israel want Iran not to have any capability to enrich uranium for any purpose. So there's a gap between the two leaders in Israel and the United States. And it's unclear how each of them might proceed if Iran doesn't cave.

Iran is used to taking the long view. And sometimes I think here in the US, we kind of forget the scope of history. I think that's a fair assessment. You know, there's that adage that the enemy also gets a vote. Is that something we should be keeping in mind here? Well, absolutely. First of all, Iran or the Islamic Republic since its 1979 revolution has survived an eight-year war with Iraq. It faced many different challenges politically, economically,

militarily, and the supreme leader is still in power, the system still exists. And you have to look at the broader society and culture. The majority of Iranians are Shiite and the religion is based on the idea that it's better to die fighting injustice than to live with injustice. There's a minority mentality in Iran. Ethnically, Iranians are a minority in terms of their Muslim sect, they are a minority. So there are on many fronts that instinct of survival and feeling like you're perpetually the victim and that you need to stand up against those attacking or repressing you. All right, I wanna zoom out a bit.

Who were the winners from the attack on yesterday? Outside of Israel, I'm wondering like, what is China thinking today? China has watched as the United States was bogged down arming Israel for the war on Gaza, its attacks on Hezbollah in Lebanon. China's also watched as the United States has been engaged in rearming Ukraine. Several presidents in the 21st century have talked about China really is the priority and the greatest threat long term to the United States and there has

been nothing to hamper China which has territorial ambitions when it comes to Taiwan too. What about Russia? Iranian drones have been a key weapon used against Ukraine and Iran's foreign ministers now headed to meet with Putin. What's Russia likely to do next? It's very interesting. And that's a good question because Iran has been critical to Russia's campaign against Ukraine. It has provided hundreds, even thousands of drones to Russia, and they have been used brutally against

Ukrainian civilian targets, some military as well. And the question is, can Iran provide more drones to Russia? Or has Russia built up a capacity with the help of Iranian technology on its own to continue the kind of drone attacks that have been critical in the war in Ukraine. So Russia has been an ally of Iran, but they are also very different kinds of governments. And even Vladimir Putin doesn't want to see Iran, which is not too far away, have a nuclear capability. And that was the one thing the world's six major powers agreed on in 2015, even though there were tensions back then over Ukraine and Russia's occupation of Crimea. There's a lot of attention today on whether Iran might retaliate against US service members

or soft targets in the region. But Iran has always fought in a sort of asymmetrical fashion. What do you think we should expect now? Iran since its 1979 revolution has used asymmetric tactics over and over against what it views as its enemies. It used the first suicide bombs against Israel in Lebanon and then against two US embassies and the Marine peacekeepers in Lebanon in the 1980s. It engaged in hostage takings, including some of my friends in Lebanon and as well at the US embassy in Tehran. It has gone after Saudi Arabia's oil facilities. So it is not going to engage in reaction that is tit for tat in terms of military sophistication.

It has the ability to go after regionally, whether it's some of the 40,000 US forces in the Middle East or US and Israeli targets elsewhere in the world. Knowing Iran as well as you do, what are you going to be keeping an eye out for the next couple days? I wouldn't be surprised if Iran retaliated in some way and then sent a message that it didn't want to see a war escalate. I think Iran wants this over. I think it wants diplomacy. The problem is even if all parties get to the negotiating table, can they really come up with an arrangement that all sides can accept? So that's really

the most important thing. This conflict will not end militarily. It has to have some kind of diplomatic outcome that will ensure there are no further flash points about what Iran is doing militarily. That's journalist Robin Wright, author of The Last Great Revolution, Turmoil and Transformation in Iran. Robin, thank you so much. Thank you. This episode was produced by Avery Keatley, who was edited by Sarah Robbins. Our executive producer is Sammy Yenneken. It's Consider This from NPR.

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