Consider This from NPR - Why The Epstein Documents Matter

Episode Date: January 4, 2024

Several hundred pages of documents were released Wednesday in a lawsuit brought against Jeffrey Epstein. They include the names of dozens of powerful men with alleged connections to Epstein. Bill Clinton, Donald Trump, magician David Copperfield, Prince Andrew and more. Most of those publicly named — many of whom are already known to have links to Epstein — have denied any wrongdoing or knowledge of Epstein's criminal activities.Epstein died by suicide in prison in 2019.We make sense of the newly revealed documents and discuss why the Jeffrey Epstein case still matters.Email us at [e-mail] more about sponsor message choices: podcastchoices.com/adchoicesNPR Privacy Policy

There's an old quote from Donald Trump that resurfaced in 2019. It was newly relevant because Jeffrey Epstein, the well-connected financier, had just been charged with sex trafficking of minors. I've known Jeff for 15 years. Terrific guy, Trump had told New York Magazine back in 2002. He's a lot of fun to be with. It is even said that he likes beautiful women as much as I do, and many of them are on the younger side. In 2019, Trump, then president, was asked about that quote after the new charges against Epstein. Well, I knew him like everybody in Palm Beach knew him. I mean, people in Palm Beach knew him. He was a fixture in Palm Beach. I had a falling out with him a long time ago.

I don't think I've spoken to him for 15 years. I wasn't a fan. Whatever Trump's relationship with him, he's right that Epstein was a fixture in wealthy and powerful social circles. That's what comes through most in the newly unsealed court documents related to Epstein that came out on Wednesday. There aren't bombshells or smoking guns, but there is more evidence of just how effectively Epstein cultivated his social network. Julie K. Brown, the Miami Herald reporter whose investigation into Jeffrey Epstein brought fresh attention to his crimes,

told WHYY's Fresh Air that he used that social network to prey on women. He would say to them, look, you want to study this. You want to be a model. I'm going to help you be a model. And then they look on the walls of his home and he has pictures with Bill Clinton and, you know, all kinds of famous, powerful people. And they really believed that he was going to help them. Consider this. Jeffrey Epstein made it a point to have friends in high places.

He used that proximity to wealth and power to commit his crimes and to shield himself from the consequences. From NPR, I'm Juana Summers. It's Thursday, January 4th. It's Consider This from NPR. Hundreds of pages of documents were released Wednesday in a lawsuit brought against Jeffrey Epstein. They include the names of dozens of powerful men with alleged connections to Epstein. Bill Clinton, Donald Trump, magician David Copperfield, Prince Andrew, and more. Most of those publicly named, many of whom are already known to have links to Epstein, have denied any wrongdoing or knowledge of Epstein's criminal activities.

Epstein died by suicide in prison in 2019. To help make sense of the documents, I talked with Julie K. Brown, the reporter we heard from above. Her reporting from the Miami Herald in 2017 and 2018 led to fresh charges for Epstein and identified nearly 80 of his victims. So before we start our discussion, Julie, I just want to make clear, the fact that people were named in these documents doesn't mean that any of them face allegations or evidence of wrongdoing. They are identified as having social connections to Jeffrey Epstein. So given that, I just want to start by asking you for your reaction to what we've seen released so far. Well, it's true that a lot of them are only listed as or known as for their social connections to Epstein, but there are many that worked for Epstein and also helped

recruit young girls and women for Epstein. The latest batch, now these releases have been ongoing now for five years. The Herald first sued for this case to be unsealed in 2018. And we've had to fight, you know, legally to get what little pieces of the case that we could. So this is what we're told is the final batch of documents. And over the years, of course, we've learned a lot more as a result of this lawsuit, as more and more names come out of people who were in his circle. And also remember, Epstein could not have done what he did all by himself. He had people who enabled him either directly or indirectly. So I think that the latest release in particular is an important step for the public really understanding what happened and why so many young women and girls were abused. Have you been in touch with any of Epstein's victims? And do you know at all

how they're feeling in this moment with this latest release? Well, I know that they want the truth to come out. They feel that this has been hidden for too long. And certainly part of the mechanism in our system that has hidden a lot of what has transpired is our court system. I mean, there are people out there, Julie, who are probably saying, we already know this. There is not anything new here.

But I gather that you would argue that it's important for these documents there, Julie, who are probably saying, we already know this. There is not anything new here. But I gather that you would argue that it's important for these documents to be public, that it's important for people to see what is in it. Why is that? Well, define new. No, there's nothing in here that says so-and-so committed a crime or so-and-so actually had sex with a certain person. But these are people that clearly knew what Jeffrey Epstein was doing. They were either socially connected with him. In a couple of cases, we know of people that even talked openly about the fact that they

knew Epstein was recruiting girls. Now, does that mean that they were guilty of anything? No, but I think to dismiss this because there's nothing salacious or criminal in it is really short-sighted. I don't want to lose sight of the fact that this case and Epstein's convictions stemmed from him victimizing young girls, children, but his crimes and these documents are also about relationships among rich and powerful people in our society. Can you explain how those very relationships may have helped him prey on his victims? He was a bit of a braggart. I mean, we suspect that he may not have known some of the people that he claimed to these girls that he knew.

He would say, for example, I just got off the phone with Michael Jackson or whoever. I'm just using that as an example. He would tell these girls that. And then, of course, they would be in his mansions and they would see photographs of him with world leaders and famous people. So he took advantage of that in order to, if nothing else, to intimidate these girls. And that's how he used his status. And anyone that socialized with him and who had dinners with him or visited his islands or went on his airplane had to see him with some of these girls and young women and had to see the way that he operated. We've been following the release of these new documents, and there are still more to come.

Julie, can you help us look ahead to what might be coming out in the future? This has all been a mystery even to us because they've been sealed for so long. So we really don't know for certain. But one thing that we know from what's been released so far is that these documents do tell a story. They tell a story of a man who had influence, who had power, who had money, and he was able to use all those things to abuse hundreds of girls. And we need to really examine how that happened and why it happened. Because unless we do that, these kinds of cases, the sex trafficking that happened here is going to continue to happen. As we mentioned, you have been covering this story for years. What do you think the legacy of the story of Jeffrey Epstein is?

Well, I hope the legacy is that people don't accept this kind of justice in America, that rich people, powerful people, wealthy people should not get special treatment. People who are vulnerable and who don't have a voice in our system are often prosecuted more fully and rigorously than people who have power and money. And that really is something that this story is an example of. And I think that, you know, we all have to question how that happens and why it happens and our system needs to change. Miami Herald investigative journalist and author Julie K. Brown. She is the author of Perversion of Justice, The Jeffrey Epstein Story. Julie,

thank you. Thank you. This episode was produced by Connor Donovan and Kai McNamee. It was edited by Courtney Dorney. Our executive producer is Sammy Yannigan. It's Consider This from NPR. I'm Juana Summers.