Couple Things with Shawn and Andrew - 316 | The End of One Chapter, The Beginning of Another

Episode Date: June 24, 2026

In this episode, we unpack what it actually feels like to hit the New York Times bookseller list- the surreal high, the crushing pressure, and the most stressful stretch of our lives. What looked like success on the outside came with chaos on the inside. Was this the end of a chapter… or the beginning of something entirely new? OUR BOOK IS AVAILABLE NOW! https://thecouragetocommit.com/ Branch Basics! If you want to try the Premium Starter Kit, you can get 15% off at https://BranchBasics.com with our code EASTFAM. Goodwipes! Head to https://goodwipes.com/EASTFAM to snag your free pack of Goodwipes. Lola Blankets! For a limited time, our listeners can get 40% OFF select Lola Blankets products with code EASTFAM at checkout. Just head to https://LolaBlankets.com and use code EASTFAM. We love you guys! Shawn & Andrew Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

What's up, everybody? Welcome back to a couple things. With Sean and Andrew. Today, we are talking about our book yet again. That's right. And everything we did, the last three months. And then we're going to decide, was it worth it? Was it worth it? We're also going to be answering some questions that we did not get to during our live show. I think the last podcast we published was our live therapy session with Dr. Deloni. Yes, which was awesome.

Let us know if you want to hear some of the other conversations from tour. We had a blast out there. Also, Chicago, so sorry. Dude. You're so sad. And that was the second event in the Midwest that we haven't made. That we were not able to make. I think that's the second event we've ever not made.

No. Both of which have it. Okay, let's just back up so we can fill you in if you haven't been following along. Last week, our book finally went live, which doesn't make any sense. because we've been talking about the book for the past eight months, and we've been pre-selling the book for the past... Long time. Six months.

Long time. We have been writing our book, The Courage to Commit, for the past four years. And let me just say, I am so proud of our book. I think our book is actually, like, a really, really good book, and I actually think it's a really important book. And I am not a big book person. I am a very harsh critic and I don't like a lot of books. I think ours is really good.

That being said, the process of pre-order, the process of touring, the process of marketing that we have done for the past six months, has been one of the most challenging tests, period. And it's ironic because we wrote this book about commitment. And so you were committed to having the whole rollout process me dialed in, which it was. and we have been prepping for this for two years, writing the book for four, and we are proud of how it turned out. Someone recently commented that it's like going through a college course,

and it's awesome because it's so dense. And if you have purchased the book and you want to be a part of the book club that we'll be rolling out here in the next couple weeks, then you can join the Facebook group that we can link down below, which will be really fun. We'll kind of be going chapter by chapter through the material and continuing what the pre-launch was.

but it's ironic because we were pretty committed to the process. And I got to say that it was taxing on our marriage, not in like a scary way, but we found some stuff out about ourselves and about each other. Would you find out about yourself, Andrew? Okay. I'm curious. I don't think I have ever seen my husband as stressed as he was for this book. in life, you guys, in life.

I do feel like it was some of the most stress that I've experienced. And by the way, I get that all things considered, publishing a book and talking about it is not the hardest job in the world. No. But there is a unique stress. I would call it a near torment that happens when you have poured your soul into this book that feels like it's kind of a calling. Yeah.

It's like, we talk about things like values, mentorship, goal setting, grace, belief, all under the umbrella of like committing so that you can have a life full of calm, depth, joy, and meaning. See, we got our talking points down. We only took that's four years. But it's like we felt so passionately about what we wrote. But then. trying to, I don't know, convince people to read it.

That wasn't interesting. It's like a really difficult process. And then you tag on to that, the pressure that we felt from the outside. To sell it. Yeah. I mean, frankly, again, there's worse problems. But frankly, anything with Sean's name on it, there's high expectations, both from her and from the people who have helped make the project.

possible so the writer the agents the publishers the whole PR team um the people who helped endorse it like there's a lot of people bought in and you're like the way sean and i's working relationship is is i feel like there's a certain set list of tasks that i need to do that makes it excellent and we were just clocking through those and to a certain any extent, Sean was like, I'm proud of how the book turned out. So whatever the results and outcome is, I could care less. And in my mind, I'm like, well, I want to make sure that we're continuing this path of excellence and we're living up to these expectations. We're playing our role on the team. Okay, I have to tell you guys about something we've been completely

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I will say we had a lot of like come to Jesus moments in the past six months where everything we preached in the book kind of got tested to a certain extent. Yeah. Like our values, our priorities. In the past six months, there were probably five or six different times where we had heated conversations where I was like, babe, I'm proud of the book and that needs to be enough. You know, like we need to just be proud of the book and not be worried about. the sales and the lists and like all of that I'll be honest at my best I was I was there with you at my worst I was I was just catastrophizing and collapsing everything into what we did with

this book so I mean I spent the last two and a half years going to school so that we could write a really good book and then you're like okay sweet. We have only to then be told by the publisher that we're not going to put your doctor on the cover. So here's the story. I thought, man, if I'm going to publish a book, I feel like I need to have some sort of credibility or authority to do that. And so I was like, all right, I'm going to go back to school and get my PhD. And you already have a civil engineering undergrad degree and an MBA.

Yeah. But in the work we do. From Vanderbilt. In the work we do, like we do pop, we do podcasts. We do a lot of videos. now writing a book. Like, I'm realizing that there is a certain subset of people who listen to what we have to say. And that's a responsibility that I want to steward well. And so I was like, I'm going to go back to school, get my Ph.D. And I didn't. In psychology.

I didn't tell the publisher about this. So I go through all the schoolwork. I mean, I'm talking about while we're in Paris during the Olympics, while we were in Japan last summer. While we were having our third kid. Yeah. our third kid. I would be doing late night school work during this whole period. And so I get it.

And we had a call with our publisher. You had to give your oral defense. Yeah. In Singapore. Yep. Last summer where we didn't have Wi-Fi. Actually, we should, yeah, I had to do it in some. And you got kicked out of a conventional.

I forgot about that. And you had stye from your stress that had swollen your eye shut. Yeah. We should do a whole video. on that whole process. You guys. Honestly, that was one of the richest experiences that I've had, and I learned so much.

And honestly, it was mission accomplished for what I was wanting to do as far as, like, I don't know, just having the ability to cite your source as well, build a logical breadcrum trail of an argument. We have so many plan Bs now. Like, if we need to quit social media someday, you can go be a therapist.

I can't do a therapist. You could be a pilot. Yeah, I could do that. Yeah, so that's a whole process. Okay, so you go through, you get your PhD. And I finished all my schoolwork, and then the next week we had a call with the publisher. And I was like, I can't wait to tell them. They're going to be hyped.

We're going to have Sean Johnson and Dr. Andrew East on there. Part of it was I was so excited because my grandfather was a PhD. And I'm like, he was never really excited about athletics, but he loved academics. Yeah. And so we get on this call with the publisher. I'm like, guys, good news. I just finished my PhD. We could put doctor on the cover.

And they're like, nope, we're not going to do that. On to the next topic. And we're like, I was just, I was just, I was just, like, didn't even spend two seconds thinking about it. I kind of understand it. Like, it's a branding of like Sean Johnson and Ainder East. Like, it's more recognizable than like Dr. Andrew East. But it was as your wife and as your supporter. I was kind of like, ooh.

Which I should have asked on the front. And before we... Is that the only reason you went and got your doctorate? Was to write a good book. Well, your wisdom from your learning wrote such a beautiful book. It's like a good, you know, we could talk about my deep-seated insecurities, but we won't unpack that right now. Wait, I have to share a story, too, about your doctorate.

I don't know if you remember this, but do you remember when you got the official, like, I graduated? So, Andrew and I got invited to come into Vanderbilt University for the, you know, for at this huge outsourced consultancy meeting. So we were part of, we were two of the consultants that they brought in for the future of Vanderbilt.

And it was one of the coolest experiences we've ever done. So cool. The mastermind, the creativity that we got to all, we were in a room filled with people from all over the world. And one of the heads of Vanderbilt was there. And at one point, Andrew's like,

I'm so sorry, but like at one point in our day, I'm going to have to dip out for an hour to go give my final defense and see if I like get my doctorate and so you leave and we continue like our you know meetings and I'm waiting itching as your wife to like get a text from me like I'm hated or I didn't or I got it that was top five nerves for me by the way that morning oh baby that was top five ever life moments of being nervous also crazy the way that we would possibly do that It doesn't make any sense. We were like,

we were like nose deep in being hired by Vanderbilt, and you're like, sorry, guys, I just got to dip out for an hour instead of like focusing your entire day on that, whatever. So out of nowhere, I hear the door opened, this big convention room meeting that we're all in, and Andrew walks in, and I was like, I don't know what this means.

I didn't get a text, I didn't get a call. Like, I'm trying to read your face. We're in this room with the athletic director of Vandy and all the people who run the school. Yeah. And someone that you respect a lot, kind of like whipped around and looked at you. And he's like, so? That was fine. And you're like, I got it.

And it was so, it was such a beautiful moment where everybody in that room who was so entrenched in the academic world was so proud of you. Yeah. That was really fun. And to see Candace and then just like embrace you, I as your wife was so excited. That was like a really special thing to experience. One thing we've become a lot more aware of as parents is what we're actually bringing into our home. We think about the food we eat, the products we use on our bodies.

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with our code EastFam. That's 15% off the premium starter kit at branchbasics.com with code Easefam. And after you purchase, when they asked you where you heard about them, make sure you mentioned a couple things. The publisher didn't care though. Yeah. All the heads of Vandy made up for that. Yeah.

That was also, that was happening right as we were finishing the final manuscript for the book. So there was just like a lot of overlapping things going on during the last home stretch of this book. And then literally like the amount of subscriptions we've been paying for to like do all this, the emails and all the rollout of getting this book in front of people. There's just like, you know, you're highly invested. Yeah. And I learned about myself. You're due to sit in securities. Yeah.

that I learned about myself that I have a trait that can be really good when it's applied to only my individual goals and can be really bad when there's other people that are also handcuffed to this that like if I say I'm going to do something I will go to my grave to do it and I said that we were going to do X, Y, and Z for the rollout of this book. We ended up doing 50-some-odd podcast. We traveled literally all across the country. We did all these TV shows. We did all of these, you know, like we're talking dozens of emails,

dozens of social posts and whatever. Like that's our normal. Obviously, we usually publish videos, but to craft them all towards this one peak moment of publishing week took a lot of planning, which I'm proud of how we did it. But I'm not proud at the cost of of having you also be a part of that weird thing

that I'm like, hey, we're going to do this. It wasn't even weird. I saw a different side of you, which I've also, like I've always seen it. So it wasn't like it was new. But you know when we filmed Special Forces, how there was a side of me that came out and you're like, oh yeah.

like it makes sense now. It's almost like I saw that same exact intensity in a different light. I don't think I've been able to apply that in many areas of my life. Like in marathon training, yes? No. Well, sorry, in marathon running, or I'm like, I started to see I'm going to finish it. Yeah. Right?

Like, whatever that stubbornness is is how that applied here. I said no to the marathon running because, you didn't know what you're committed to there you weren't you weren't sure if you're committed to the marathon in the NFL but there was such an intensity at like making sure we got this done and at no point let off the gas and said this is enough like you you had to cross the finish line in a sprint which I respect I don't think I forecasted how much it would be consuming I hope We're not speaking too vaguely.

Like, I hope this makes sense. The past six months of, like, selling the book, like we said, we believe so wholeheartedly in what we wrote, but didn't realize early on that it doesn't matter if you believe in it. You actually have to, like, now go convince people that they should read it in order to read what it is you believe so wholeheartedly in. And we are not good at that. We're not people who like to go. say, oh, we wrote this.

You have to read it. Like, that was really difficult for us. And there's a lot of books in the world. Yeah. Trying to make a little bit of noise about your book is really, really difficult. But so we got through the six months, got through the doctorate, got through all of this stuff, got our book published, had a wonderful team behind us. And in this past week, when it went live, we spent the entire week.

how you would say is like on tour where we did four shows in like six cities with press so we flew to l.A. and did a bunch of press in l.A. just Andrew and I and then we went to back home to Nashville for a show which was great that was the live therapy session with john deloney which was super fun and adam doly did live music. Then we went up to Philadelphia, had another awesome show, did more press, went from Philadelphia to New York.

That was my favorite one. I'm sorry, but because we had Jimmy and Megan join us, and then Marshall was there. In New York. Yeah. Yeah. So Jimmy,

the third writer of the book, came to New York, which was super fun. We actually got to interview him live on stage, which we should publish that one. That one's incredible. Just to hear

the dynamic of how it all worked. And then it was in New York after we did a bunch of press because that was like launch day, official launch day, that we got trapped in the New York airport for six hours trying to fly to our last show in Chicago. And there were tornadoes that were in Chicago, like messing with flights, obviously. And then also happening in New York, they had some sort of system outage. So American Airlines security system went down. TSA went down.

Newark, JFK, LaGuardia, and there's no way to get out. And we were just sitting there like... Stressed. Well, guys. Yeah. So, like, you can see, there's a lot of moving parts

that lead to a lot of stress. But, yeah. It keeps going. Yeah. So then we ended up having to cancel the Chicago show. To anybody listening who was a part of that show,

we are so sorry. We're still working on reaching out to each of you and making up for that. Then we had to go back to New York City after we got home for more press. We were doing the Today Show, NBC News. We did Wolf Blitzer while we were in New York, Access Hollywood, e-News, all these things. But this time, we decided, since we'd been gone from the kids for almost a week, we decided

to take the kids, which was super fun. It was a blast. We're like on the Today Show and all our kids are outside the windows, like waving with their uncle and grandma. We did the Empire State Building, Statue of Liberty, M&M's door, Times Square.

Do you feel like the book came out of cost of family time? Because I feel like, to your credit, where some of the tension was, was Sean was, in a lot of ways, the last two months, the biggest advocate for, like, preserving our normal routines and rhythms, that we talk about in the book. And I was advocating for,

we have this thing that I want to, like I was literally in my mind seeing all of the compounding, like things that we put into this thing. Yeah. And I'm like, well, we're going to see it to the finish line. Yeah. We will.

And I will make it happen. And so I feel like to your credit, though, you never let, never let down. And I hope by us sharing this, you can realize like, I'm not saying there's a right way or wrong way to go about your goals. Just know that they come at a cost and what you commit to, just understanding where the priorities lie through those is really helpful in setting expectations and communicating to the people around you.

And Sean and I had a lot of conversations about, hey, if we're committed to the book launch, then it's going to come at X, Y, and Z cost. and then there was not necessarily alignment on where the priority of that was. So, okay, this might be one of my favorite products that we've ever talked about because it's one of those things that once you try it, you immediately wonder why you've been living without it. I know exactly what you're talking about. We are talking about good wipes.

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And they're not just for the bathroom either. We've used them for quick cleanups on the go, in the car, after sports, while traveling, you name it. I also love that they're made from plant-based materials and are actually gentle on your skin. They just feel better than anything else we've ever tried. If you haven't tried them yet, now is the perfect time because good wipes wants your booty to have a sensational summer. Buy any two packs of Goodwipes at your favorite retailer. Text them your receipt and you'll get reimbursed for one of them almost immediately. For all the details, had to goodwipes.com slash EastFam.

Again, that's goodwipes.com slash EastFam to snag a free pack of Goodwipes. I will say I think you did a really good job at concentrating all of the work into our normal hours. And if they ever bled over, I would say it was at an... expense of our time, you and I's, not our families, which is totally fine. Like, I would prefer that. So you would always finish work in time to like have family dinner and spend time with the kids and do drop-offs and pickups. But then it was consuming a lot of our time that we usually, in our daily rituals and rhythms, preserve for us after the kids go down, which we've been laughing that it feels like a million pounds has been lifted off our shoulders and out of our brain the past week.

And I feel like we've been sleeping more than ever because our brain was so preoccupied that I was like, I have so much mental space now. I don't know what to do with it. We like each other again. Was that ever? That was in question. No, the other moving part to this was, I literally wrote this down. I was like, note to future self. Do not schedule any big, optional work obligations during the months of June, August, or December, where the school is, school season is coming to a close or starting in August

or the holidays are in December. And we had in the school activities that, you know, there's a lot to do. There's like the into school play. Drew was in it. It was adorable. There was like the last day of school. There was like the field day to go to. There was a water day.

There was, you know, go visit them for, there was just a ton of stuff. that pulled us out of our normal routine that we're trying to juggle all these things. There's just been a lot going on these last 18 months. And I realized the value in having nothing that preoccupies you and having a clear mind where you're not thinking about, oh, shoot, I got to do X, Y, and Z, and what if I did this, and I got to talk to this person and try this strategy. I just would like to preserve that in these next four years where we have kids who are changing so much every day.

I'm like, you do not get these days back. And my focus, I hope that I can preserve this. And the next four years is like, I love our day job. I love putting out podcasts, putting out our short form videos, putting out YouTube videos. I'm going to try to just contain it at those things because that's enough and that's good. and you know not everything's worth the cost but you're the project man i know i know there's a bigillion things that i give them give them three weeks we'll see we'll see but this has been fun yeah and also thank you lexie my uh jenny mama jay papa jay caroline caroline megan jimmy so many people

have helped us finish this project and stay sane throughout it all. I apologize for where maybe I overdid it in certain areas. And I appreciate your grace and forgiveness. Thanks for all your help. Sean, I apologize for where maybe I overdid it. Okay, maybe I love you. I love you too. I love you too. And I'm so glad that we're going to continue to learn about each other in new ways. You too. And yeah, I feel like we learned a lot. So this past week, while we were in New York City with our kids doing the final rounds

of our like book tour and book press, we were in Central Park with our kids, Andrew's brother and his mom. We were getting street vendor popsicles. The kids got SpongeBob SquarePants popsicles. And just like sitting in the... the Central Park and it was gorgeous when we got a call and it was our publisher and she's like well I just got an early copy of the New York Times list and we made it we were number 10 of 10 but we freaking made it we did which was a goal that we had what did you feel in that moment

like I wanted to go take a big nap we should share that video is fun I will say I don't know the New York Times list is such a something it's so sought after it is such an honor and I think because how would I put words to this I think Andrew and I have had this interesting opportunity and experience for the past probably seven years where we have been single-handedly approached by publishers more often than not saying we don't care what you write about just write a book because we know it'll sell. And the amount of times we've turned down the options and opportunities of writing books just to write them about drama and gossip and marriage and like things that we didn't feel like we had an authority to write about has been like a test of our strength and our values.

And I think because we actually decided to write on our own a book this time about something so intentional and so meaningful to us, this just felt really vulnerable. And I felt like New York Times meant a lot to us because having the recognition that we actually wrote something that's good and it was interpreted as good was just validation that we really wanted. We didn't need the validation. Had we not had New York Times bestselling, it would have been fine. But to have the validation that like you'd done good kid felt really good our my emotional arc was oh my gosh we need to make this list and just white knuckling yeah that idea to being stressed out they're like oh man there's zero chance we make this list to realizing the only way we're ever going to make

this list is if we go all in which you felt that phase to then realizing like literally the last 10 days. It's actually a beautiful bliss that I've experienced several times in my life when I was getting recruited at college, when I was bouncing around the NFL, and now this was a third time of letting go and just realizing, wait a minute, that's not why I did it in the first place. It's not why I did it in the first place. And you realize, like, the cards will lie as they fall, you know, or fall as they lie, whatever the saying is. And just like in college football, like it was better that things didn't happen as I envisioned them on my timeline. Just like in the NFL, the same thing, the lessons that you learn along the way. This was another example of like,

ah, there's like a humbling step back of kind of just remembering why you got into it. And it was a, it is an honor to be on the New York Times. It made three bestseller list that I know of, including New York Times and USA Today. And Barnes & Noble. And I guess, yeah, maybe four. What's who the one? Oh, Amazon. There's another one.

It was number one on Amazon. Yeah, so maybe five. I don't even know. That's a silly thing. Like, you're just hyper-focused and fixated on this one thing, ruminating about it. Also, because you taught me how to do this. Let's take a pause and say that again slowly and be proud of it. Our book made five lists.

charted. How freaking cool is that? Congratulations. We made USA Today's all nonfiction list, which is crazy. We're number 28. All books. We're number 28 in all fricking books. So here's what we learned. Again, we did workshops.

Like the amount of stuff we put into trying to make these lists is absurd. So we did like this two day workshop where they teach you about the different lists and what they represent. USA Today, we made this list of like all time books. for that week of all categories, meaning of all the books that are out there, which sold the most copies. We were number 28 of 150. Pretty fun. Amazing. And so there's nuances to it because like companies might buy a thousand copies of a book or 10,000 copies of a book or whatever. And so that would obviously put you high on that list. But what New York Times represents is kind of like New York Times is quality. Yeah, it's kind of like the true cultural,

impact. So like it's not just one company buying 10,000 books. It's 10,000 people who are interested in that topic. And it's also a subjective list where people where those choosers are actually reading books and deciding, yeah, cultural influence. What do they want to be influencing culture today? And that's the one where we were like, it's not about sales. it's about truly what it is you're putting into the world. And that's one that was crazy. And then to see it on the front page of Barnes & Noble on their list, and then to see number one of all new books on Amazon,

and then to see it as the number one in leadership and management, I think. And then self-help. And it was just crazy. I was like, oh, my gosh. We actually wrote a really good book. This was another revelation I had that is part of the reason why I wanted to get my PhD and part of the reason why I wanted to write those goals is you ever feel like your ideas are crazy like yes no one understands my ideas and I guess I needed some external

validation that like I'm not crazy you know that like this was a decent idea to write in a book and I don't know why I can't just like be content I will say we spent how many years writing it a long time the first time it clicked to me where I was like I think we're very biased because we wrote it, but this is a really good book, was when we made of the audio book. I was reading it and I was like, this is really good.

Yeah. Anyways, we've been ranting a lot. We want to say thank you. Thank you for being supporters of us on this journey. This has been a wild journey, a four-year-long journey coming to a close. We actually fly out tonight in a couple hours

for our very last stop of this book tour, which is in Seattle. And then we will come home and put this baby to a close and keep telling people about it because we love it, but the chaos is done. Are we going to do the tour questions in another episode? We will.

Okay, fine. Also, we have potentially some fun content coming back around. I know we have talked about the book so much, but towards the end of this year, there might be another series on this channel. Just keep watching. It's going to be fun. I don't even know.

Oh, yeah, I do know what you're talking about. You think that's real? I think we got it. Are you serious? I think we're. That would be so freaking high. We'll see. Oh, buckle up, guys.

I am so excited. That's the first time I'm hearing about that. This is the other thing. Sean and I have only talked about the book. I'm over here wheeling and dealing in my lanes. Andrew's wheeling, dealing with his. Andrew doesn't even know what's about to come for him the end of this year. We have more projects, guys.

You know what's funny? We travel all the time, and somehow airports still find a way to humble us. Every single trip. I'm carrying a coffee, a water bottle, my phone's somehow at 2%. Andrew's asking where it's boarding passes, and TSA suddenly wants my laptop out immediately. Honestly, you're doing well if your phone's at 2%. Usually it's dead. That's why I've become obsessed with our noble carry-on.

It actually feels like somebody designed luggage for real travelers instead of just making another box on wheel. First of all, it has a built-in flip-out cup holder, which sounds small until you're standing in a security line trying to hold three different things all at once. And wrangle some kids. That is so true. It also has a charging port built right in so you're not fighting strangers for the one outlet at the gate. And my favorite part is the front laptop pocket.

You can grab your laptop in seconds instead of digging through your entire suitcase while everyone behind you just stares you down. Plus the 360 degree wheels glide so smoothly. It actually rolls next to you instead of feeling like you're dragging a cinder block through the airport. Ours is the black one and honestly it looks so sleek. It's one of those bags that makes you feel way more put together than you actually are. And unlike most luggage, there's no zip. or it actually has a secure latch system that's much harder to break into, which gives us real peace of mind when we're traveling.

Noble is the number one rated luggage brand on Trust Pilot. Comes with a lifetime warranty, a 100-day money-back guarantee, and a free three-day express shipping. Upgrade to luggage that looks better, last longer, and travels smarter. Head to nobletravel.com for up to 46% off your entire order. That's N-O-B-L-Travel.com for up to 46% off. And after you purchase, they'll ask where you're. heard about them please support our show and let them know we sent you that's all i got thanks for listening

guys thanks for reading um we're not going to be doing an extra ordinary amount of book content from this point forward um it would be fun to read some of your reviews if you guys get around to reading it uh but we're going to definitely be slowing things down as far as the hard messaging for that so uh thank you for your patience and that's how we got i'm andrew i'm sure Until next time.