Crime, Conspiracy, Cults and Murder - Ep. 14 | Missing 411 | The Most Haunting Missing Cases

Episode Date: October 30, 2024

Missing 411 cases refer to mysterious disappearances in national parks, documented by David Paulides. Often, people vanish without a trace under odd circumstances—search dogs fail, sudden weather changes interfere, and those found have no memory of what happened. The unsettling question remains: What’s causing these vanishings? Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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If you're ready to turn your hard work into measurable results, go to maximus tribe.com. That's maximus tribe.com. Crime, conspiracy, cults, serial killers, and murder. All things that I love to consume, and I know you do too, you sick-minded, beautiful freak. And today we are going to be looking at some interesting murders that have all occurred in the boundaries of the United States National Parks. Have you ever heard of Missing 411? Of course you have you here. I know most of you probably have.

But for those of you who haven't, it is a series of books written by former police officer David Politis, big fan, by the way, about mysterious disappearances in the national parks. And the name Missing 411 comes from a list of 411 people missing from national parks. And it's also the number you can call to report a missing person requiring investigation. So in today's video, we are going to be covering

some of the most intriguing disappearances related to the 4-1-1. And our first one is called Bigfoot Steels Children in the Woods. This is a story about Dennis Lloyd Martin and Tranny Lynn Gibson. And we begin our search for the missing in Appalachia.

Yes, I say Appalachia because my boyfriend is from Appalachia and they say Appalachia, not Appalachian. Don't come at me. Specifically, in the Smoky Mountains National Park nestled between Tennessee and North Carolina. Smoky Mountain National Park

might be one of the most beautiful places to visit in the continental United States. It boasts gorgeous mountain ranges, dense forests, flowing waterfalls, and miles and miles of hiking trails, including the Appalachian Trail. Or Appalachian, whatever you want to say. This means that millions of people visit every year. And while most get to enjoy the park, some may never leave. And our first case occurred on June 14, 1969, at Spence Field.

The Martin family had spent the night on the 13th at a cabin within the park. Dennis Martin, along with his father, William Martin, his brother Douglas and his grandfather Clyde had decided to go for a hike and ended up going to Spencer Field. And this field is high up on the mountain with plenty of tall grass growing all around it and very thick vegetation surrounding the area. It also crosses the border between North Carolina and Tennessee. So William and Clyde would sit down and allow the kids to play around once they reached their destination. And while they were resting, another family would come by, which coincidentally they would have the same last name as the Martins, Martin. And they would come up and ask if their kids could play together.

and of course William and Clyde obliged. And over the next few minutes, the family's children would play in that tall grass and everything would be fine. But that was when one of the kids suggested that they played hide and seek. Don't play hide and seek in the forest, in the woods in Appalachia. Don't do it.

So when the game began, all the children would sprint off into different directions, including Dennis Martin. And he was seen about 50 feet from his dad on the edge of the field on the Tennessee side. So roughly five minutes would go by, and all the children would eventually come out except for Dennis. And his father would naturally become immediately concerned.

When he saw Douglas' face, he knew something was wrong. So everyone in the field obviously began to search the immediate area, screaming his name and looking behind every tree and bush. But Dennis was nowhere to be found. And at the time of his disappearance, Dennis was wearing a bright red shirt. He was roughly four feet tall and weighed about 55 pounds. He is also described as having brown hair and brown eyes.

So the authorities were naturally called and an extensive search began. But as the search continued, there would find no trace of Dennis. The park rangers began by asking people in the immediate area if they saw Dennis or saw anything that was suspicious. But everyone would reply that they had not seen the boy. And around 5 p.m. on July 14th, only a few miles away from where Dennis went missing, the key family would begin a hike near Rowan's Creek in Cade's Cove. While on their height, they heard, quote unquote, an enormous sickening scream and they would walk a few hundred yards in the direction of the scream to see if something was wrong and if they could help a man and his children and they were

they were trying to photo the deer they were following the deer up rowans creek and and they heard a child scream the father ran up there and he saw a man dart into the woods And he described him as, Uncamp. And Mr. Key would go on to investigate the scream by himself, just in case it was like a dangerous situation for his family. But when he reached the area where he thought the scream had come from, he would see a man in the bushes who darted off into the woods.

So he quickly turned and left the area thinking that that was extremely weird, and then he would learn only a few hours later that a boy had gone missing. In that area, hours before he saw the man in the bushes. While this is incredibly strange, it will be incredibly important later. Mr. Keyes would even go on to state, But it wasn't a bear, it was a man hiding in the bushes. It was definitely trying to hide from us. Which sounds suspicious as fuck.

So the search for Dennis would move on well into the night, but be hindered by a very large rainstorm, causing the search to stop for a night. And in the morning, an extensive search party was planned to begin operating the next day. And when June 15th came, one of the largest man hunts for a missing person ever seen, would form in hopes of finding Dennis. In total, there were 30 Boy Scouts, 51 Ranger students,

and three helicopters, including two helicopters sent from the U.S. Air Force. On top of all that, too, there was a group of green berets that arrived from Fort Benning, and later that week, 40 more green berets would be on the case. It's completely wild that the case ramped up to this degree in less than 24 hours.

So over the course of the next few days, the search would grow immensely, like I said, gaining hundreds of volunteers a day until the park service had to literally tell people to stop showing up. Talk about people coming together, though. That's awesome. At its peak, though, there were 1,400 searchers helping to try to find Dennis. Even the FBI and the Coast Guard were called in to help with the search. But one thing that was odd was that in the official National Park Service report, the reason that the FBI was called was not directly stated. Because foul play had not been suspected yet, So there was no need for them really to be involved in this investigation unless the FBI and NPS knew something William Martin didn't.

But the FBI would later conclude that Dennis was not abducted, despite his father's adamantly telling him that he believed without a doubt that foul play was suspected. But despite the NPS and FBI suspecting that foul play did not occur, they would conduct numerous interviews with people in the surrounding area, including Harold Key. What's even more strange is Harold's interview and the circumstances surrounding it. According to the FBI, when they reached out to Harold, he agreed to meet with investigators at the park. But when the time for the interview arrived, he never showed up to the park. Instead, the FBI would run into him outside the park and continue the interview there. And during this interview, Harold once again claimed that he had no idea of the boy's recent disappearance, but called the authorities anyway because of the strange man and the scream he and his family had heard.

Furthermore, Harold's son would later tell newspapers that he had seen a bear or someone running through the trees in the same area where his father saw the man in the bush. But despite all the evidence that was presented to the NPS and the FBI, they concluded that Harold's sighting and Dennis's disappearance was in no way connected. So much so that they didn't even bother to investigate the area where Harold had that sighting. Which is so stupid. NSP Ranger Dwight McCarter, who was well-respected and NSP's best searcher at Great Smoky National Park stated that it was possible for a man to carry a small child from where Dennis was located to where Harold spotted the man in the bushes, which is extremely prevalent. Even other people within the NSP, such as Harold Sherman, a research associate

of the experienced services program, a branch for older NSP employees, wrote literal letters to his superiors and news outlets of his beliefs that Dennis was in fact abducted, stating, I am impelled to ask you if you know whether or not there have been or are any questionable characters in this region. Camping out in the wild in this area, like hermits, squatters, such an individual may not be connected with the boy's disappearance at all. But I feel that a sex maniac, so-called, does exist in the vicinity and could have trailed the body. I hesitate to write any more as my conscious mind is trying to reject such a feeling. I see something red and something being carried or dragged. Are there any caves in the vicinity?

A stream may even run through it or part of it? I am always tormented when impressions come to my conscious mind trying to tell me that they couldn't possibly be true. But I get a feeling of sudden panic on the pot of Dennis. What happened to him occurred suddenly, unexpectedly, and he could not or did not cry out. He seems to be struck down by something. The area is rugged. I don't know why I gave him that accent, but I feel like it's right. It's right. And I agree with him.

I agree with him. Go luck! I don't know, I turned into Jerry Sandfeld. Also, I'm sorry, I gotta put on my glaces. I can't, I can't fucking see. And things continued to be weird to say the least as the search has concluded. And the case would unfortunately go cold.

First, both the NPS and the FBI kept Dennis's father, William, in the dark about Harold Key's sightings. It also seems like they kept the general public in the dark about this as well. William didn't actually learn until the Key family's sightings until the NPS went public, which is fucked. They also didn't inform him of the FBI interview that took place after they told him his son's disappearances had no foul play involved. Furthermore, many people have requested an FOIA, which is a

Freedom of Information Act, request on the Dennis case from the FBI. And this request has conveniently been rejected, including David Politis. Shout out, you're awesome. What's even more odd is that despite publicly stating the siting, the NPS never created an official report. about it. So the only way to know about it is through the newspapers. There were also numerous psychics called to cover the case. And some were even saying that he was alive and to check the trees for the body. But what's next might be the most damning information of it all. In 2011, David Politis drove to interview William Martin and Dwight McArthur to see if they had any unreleased information on the case. And from William's interview, we learned this. When Dennis

disappeared, he was literally within 50 feet. or less of William. His brother Douglas also never saw anything strange in the woods. William and an NPS fire prevention officer hiked from the Spence Field to the area where Harold saw the man in the bushes in 90 minutes flat, confirming that someone could have carried Dennis down the path. They also saw no caves and no evidence of anybody living there. Mr. Martin actually spoke with Harold and learned that he and his family saw a man carrying somebody over their shirt. shoulder along a nearby ridge at the time of Dennis's disappearance. What? And he also learned that the local newspaper purposely omitted and changed this information to say that they saw a bear. Mr. Martin would

state that the head of the park services was merely just a figurehead and receiving orders from someone else explaining why so much information was neglected and hidden. Furthermore, the lead FBI agent Jim Reich on the case took his own life only four years after Dennis' disappearance. Lastly, William firmly believes that his son was kidnapped by somebody waiting in the woods. He stated, There was no way his son could have gotten away as fast as he did without people finding him. And based on this interview, it became extremely clear that the FBI and NPS were working closer together than people had thought.

They both withheld information and the people assigned to each case by the agent's had odd events or information surrounding them. Like, to not tell the family of a missing child that a man was seen carrying someone over their shoulder is extremely odd, to say the least. It was almost as if they knew that Harold Key had seen something he shouldn't have and that they wanted to investigate it privately or something.

I love conspiracies, but it's just, I, like, I can't even imagine as the family of Dennis just not having any answers and knowing that you have been kept in the dark, like how could you not think? think of the most fucked up things, you know? And that theory would be further backed up by Dwight's interview, and here's what we learned about that.

Dennis still believed that a man could have easily carried Dennis away from Spencefield and threw Rowan's Creek with ease. And when asked about why the FBI and NPS were downplaying Mr. Key's sightings, Dwight states that the FBI wouldn't have any knowledge of the woods. So dismissing the idea that a man could have trekked from Spence Field up to Romans Creek is not that crazy. The NPS, however, Dwight reaffirms that he has walked that area numerous times and knows for a fact that it is a hundred percent possible. And Dwight stated that it was odd to have the green berets come and set up and enter the woods armed. In the 1970s, even NPS Rangers were not armed.

And previous instances, when the National Guard got involved, they were usually unarmed as well. Additionally, in the case of Dennis Martin, the green berets didn't even interact with the NPS. rangers. And Mr. McCarter confirms that there were wild men who live within the park, which is terrifying, and that they purposely did so to avoid human contact. So when Mr. Keyes saw a man in the bush, it was technically possible for him to see a wild man just hiding in the bushes. He also stated, though, that he didn't believe that a wild man would have taken Dennis as the only wild man that he knew of resided on the opposite side of the park from where Dennis disappeared. So the disappearance of Dennis Lloyd Martin is one of the most puzzling,

appearances to ever occur? Like, how could a little boy avoid over 1,400 searchers, highly trained green berets, and experienced park rangers who know every nook and cranny of the park? Additionally, it seems like the military FBI and NPS knew something that everyone else didn't. What's new, though? And it's not crazy to believe that the FBI would get involved, as foul play would have to be ruled out. But why would they purposely dismiss Key's sightings. And why would the newspaper alter what Keyes family saw? Also, why did the green berets go into the woods armed? Maybe they were tracking some killer in the area, and when Dennis went missing, they pulled all of their efforts into scrubbing the area. It would also explain why

there was such a significant response from military branches and investigative agencies. Or, maybe they knew something was in the woods and were scared to encounter it. But let's look at similar disappearances that have occurred in the same area. Our next story details the disappearance of Treeney Lynn Gibson. So on October 8th, 1976 in Great Smoky National Park, only six years after Dennis Martin's disappearance, Trene Lynn Gibson vanished from hiking on a trail. On the 8th, 16-year-old Trene was hiking to Clingman's Dome with her high school class, starting from Andrews Bald on the North Carolina side. She hiked with Robert

Simpson and a group to Andrews Bald, but the then turned around to walk back to the bus. And at 3 p.m., about three quarters of a mile from their final destination, Trunny would vanish. And in the area of her disappearance, the trail was marked and she was in full view of other hikers. And following her disappearance, the NPS began a search for the missing girl

and started doing interviews of the students to see if they had any information to offer. It is safe to say that what occurred before Trinney's disappearance was odd to say the least. In multiple interviews, Trenny was last seen on the trail bending over, looking at something and turning right off the trail right before vanishing.

Furthermore, a fellow student, Anita Rounds, claimed that she had vanished from the trail completely. And it's important to note that the surrounding area was miles and miles of thick vegetation and forest. And next to the trail was a small stream and a slight rocky slope. Anita Bounds would say in an interview, She was on the trail when I last saw her.

I looked away and when I looked back, Trinney was nowhere inside. I should have been able to see her. if she went up the trail. I checked the area where Trinney was last seen. No trail leading off, very rough, small stream, brush and trees, yelled, but no answer. And the search would begin on the eighth

but was hindered by weather, which is very strange because that happened to Dennis as well. Not that that's all, but it's very weird. It's very convenient weather. And following the day that Truny disappeared, the NPS really didn't do much to aid in the search. We already hated at this point. It became such a problem

that a Swain County Civil Air patrol commander, John Maddox, had to call the NPS and complain about how he had people on standby and couldn't move forward unless they gave him the okay. And unfortunately, the NPS, would you know it, wouldn't respond to Maddox and his crew of over 40 searchers. Two doctors, 14 pilots and five planes all waiting to help search for Trinney had to be completely called off. And the search for Trinney lasted from the 8th of October through to the 22nd, during which time 300 volunteer searchers just combed the hills of the Smoky Mountains.

The army and US Marine Corps, along with helicopters and tracker dogs, all got involved and they produced some evidence. Search dogs had found her scent at Andrews Bald and headed toward the Forney Creek Trail. Furthermore, investigators would find shoe prints matching in size and style of the shoes that she wore on that day.

she disappeared. And they would find those footprints at Double Springs Shelter, which is about four and a half miles away from Andrews Bald by the trail and about a two-hour hike away. And even more strange, according to some sources, search dogs found her scent at Klingman's Dome and then Collins Gap, which was in the opposite direction of where she was last seen and far east of Double Spring Shelter. And the FBI would briefly get involved, but like Dennis's case, they aligned with the opinion of the NPS, sorry, and said that there was no suspected foul play. And a psychic would eventually be brought into this investigation as well and would say that they saw, quote, unquote, Tren is sitting in a hollow in what might be a bear den or something,

rocky area, not a lot of undergrowth, several very large trees, lots of acorns on the ground. I don't know if that's what they sounded like. I don't have a name or anything to go off of, but that's what I picture, you know. And in April, her father would ask for another search by the NPS, but was told that only 25 people would be allowed to conduct a small survey of the area, meaning that the final search for his daughter would be small and non-intensive. NPS. So how was it possible that Trunny was able to walk 10 plus miles through rugged,

thick, vegetative forest and mountainous terrain to each location without being seen at at all, by the way. We could even say that after she turned off the trail where her friends last saw her, she could have found another trail and hiked to the destinations where the evidence was found. But another question would then be brought up. How would she remain undetected despite being on extremely popular trails? Like I said, in the beginning, hundreds of people walk through these trails daily. Surely one of them would have realized that a girl who had just walked past them was the one that went missing. Furthermore, she would have been torn up and dirty, which would have caused much more attention to be on her by onlookers. Another question that remains in the case as well

is what did Truny see in the woods that would cause her to go off trail and why she would choose to go off trail instead of running to her friends if it was something dangerous or I don't know, you know, like did she see someone that she knew? Skinwalker. Or did something in the woods coax her off trail? Skinwalker. I just think it's skinwalker. I'm just, I'm scared. You won't catch me. You won't. Catch me in them woods, all right? And luckily for you, there are theories for both, so let's get into those. First theory is that she was being stalked

and was kidnapped off the trail. A man by the name of Kelvin Bowman, what a stupid name, was shot in the foot of Trunny's Yard after being caught creeping near her house. And later on, student testimony claimed that his car had been seen tailing the bus on the way to the hiking trail.

Another possibility is that a classmate on the hike along with her, lured her off the trail. As we mentioned earlier, Trene was walking with Robert Simpson before turning around. And the two of them had been known to hang out outside of school and when she disappeared, she was wearing his brown jacket. And when he was questioned about her disappearance,

he said that after she left, he himself had gone off trail tracking a bear. Okay, I just don't believe anybody at this point. Furthermore, after she disappeared, Trinney's hairbrush would be found in his car. And after other students' testimonies, it was found that it would be extremely unlikely for her to leave her hairbrush behind because she always had it in her pocket.

Which like, you could say that they hung out and stuff and that she would just leave her stuff in his car. I feel like that's just very, you know, coincidental. It's not like that big of a thing, but, you know, still suspicious. All right. Still suspicious. But in addition to all that, there were two recorded instances of Robert saying pretty heinous things to Trinney's sister, quote unquote. If Calvin Bowman has Trinney, he will kill her. If he doesn't have. I think she might have run off with some horny hitchhacker. Like, who the fuck says that about their good friend that just went missing and can't be found? Like, that's so fucked up.

There's too many theories in my head. Let's go on to other ones. So the final theory is where Dennis and Trinney's stories potentially match up. Both stories obviously involved something going wrong in the woods. That is heavily suspected to be kidnappings. Dennis was hiding in the woods and disappeared later in an area just below where he was lost, seen, a man spots another man with something over his shoulder running along the ridge line. And Trene was last seen bending over looking at something in the woods.

And then strangely went off trail. And while searching for Trene, the dogs would pick up or scent in areas miles apart and only accessible through trails or dense, dense forests. Both children had also obviously never been found. The closest thing to being found was a footprint in the Double Springs shelter. But other than that, nothing. Both involve the FBI and the NPS, claiming that foul play was not a factor. Yet both agencies stuck around to continue a private investigation. Furthermore, two divisions of the U.S. Special Forces were involved in the search.

And we know that the Green Berets were armed during the search as well, but it is unknown if the Marines had firearms. Finally, both disappearances occurred within a very short period of time within each other, and were in very close proximity to each other as well. And in the search log, searches wrote that they were searching Cades Cove, which, if you recall, is the exact area where Harold Key saw the man in the bushes shortly after seeing the man running on the ridge. So looking at the evidence presented in each case, it looks like the disappearances could have been

caused by the same thing. Many people have theorized that both disappearances are because of Bigfoot or Wild Men. Despite Dwight McArthur stating that it wasn't likely a wild man that took Dennis, all evidence points to someone being in the woods and running off with him. And same for Trinney. There was no way a 16-year-old girl who had just been bust in knew her way around the woods enough to follow the path that she did. It had to be something or someone that led her or carried her through the woods, which

is terrifying to think about. It would also explain why Trunny was lured into the woods while special forces were called and armed in both cases. and why the FBI and NPS both did private investigations withholding and changing information released to the public. It's because there is something in the woods at Great Smoky National Park. And whether it is a man or a beast, it has a propensity for stealing children. And while the idea of Bigfoot is crazy, many believe that the Smoky Mountains are home to the creature. Even David Politis himself is a big believer and plans to appear at numerous Bigfoot conferences,

and talks. But it is tough to say what happened to both victims. But one thing is for sure, there was some shady shit occurring in the woods and in this investigation. But alas, my heart goes out to the families involved in this. And I hope that one day these kids can be found because it's absolutely heartbreaking. And the conspiracies around it are also heartbreaking to hear about. But until then, be safe and be vigilant. And that brings us to our next stories. So as we know, With Politist investigates many cases of missing persons from seemingly all areas of American history. And he takes a particular interest in those that offer no clear answers. Like many, he entertains the idea that perhaps there are answers beyond the scope of what science, as we know

it, can explain. He explains why some people go missing and are never found, and some of the very strange ways that people are recovered, whether before or after they succumb to the elements. Or the unknown. Some of these fascinating cases involve people who have gone missing and are found after their location is revealed to a family member in a dream. This concept is bizarre, I know, but how far-fetched is it really? Because I know I've had some dreams that were kind of like premonitiony and I've scared myself, so who knows? But without further ado, we are going to look into some of these cases that David Politis has

in detailed and we can come to our own conclusions. First up, we have Gustav Dill. This episode sponsored by Forkfall. Most meal delivery services promise healthy food, but look closer, and you'll often find cheap industrial seed oils hiding in the ingredients. Forkful does things differently. Forkful delivers chef-prepared meals made with premium ingredients you'd expect at a great restaurant, from center-cut filet mignon to wild-caught lobster mac and cheese,

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Over 50,000 high performers have already broken through their plateaus. If you're ready to turn your hard work into measurable results, go to Maximus Tribe.com. That's Maximus Tribe.com. Nessled quietly along the banks of Siskoi Hana River, Duncanon, Pennsylvania, is a small town where time seems to flow a little slower. The kind of place where the air is thick with the scent of pine from the surrounding forests. And in the early 20th century, Duncanon was little more than just a dot on the map. Though its community was living and breathing apart from the rapidly industrialized world outside,

every face here was familiar. and the steady pace of the river and the railroad marked the rhythms of daily life. With under 1,500 people as of the 2020 census, this sleepy little town still feels like it's suspended in time. It's still surrounded by the wilds, with state parks nearby and game lands for hunting to the northwest and south, and the river to the east. Residents even have access to the Appalachian Trail nearby. One can only imagine what it must have been like to live in this region in the early 1900s,

before four-lane highways cut their way through the terrain, like long, ugly scars. In this very place on a November day in 1916, Gustav Dill, a man of modest means, but strong character, went out on the river for the last time. He and his buddies went on a hunting trip with the goal of crossing the Susquehanna. Sorry if I'm saying that wrong,

but plans would go awry when the boat flipped, and its occupants would be tossed into the river. Gustav would be pulled beneath the water, and unfortunately Gustav did not know how to swim and his friends would not be able to save him. Despite the best efforts of rivermen dragging the river for days with grappling hooks in hopes of recovering Gustav, there was unfortunately no luck. And the week or so after efforts had concluded and the hopes of finding Gustav had waned, his wife would have a dream in which every detail of his location was revealed and even witness his funeral. So she would implore people to help her pick up the search again.

But to no avail. It was only when a couple of old rivermen who took pity on her, skeptical of her claims to say the least, agreed to take up the search again 10 days after the boat accident. And within five minutes of casting their grappling hooks into the river for the first time where Gustav's wife indicated, Gustav's body was recovered. And this story seems like the kind of tale that would make national news, or at the very least, the front page, right? A woman had a vision of where her husband's body could be found after his boat overturned,

like, what? That seems like a really big deal. But the only reference we could find of this was a small block from the third page of a newspaper, the Atlanta Georgian. And it says this. A dream of his widow led to the finding of the body of Gustav Dill, a Duncanon who was drowned in the San, in the Susquehanna River, there when his boat was overturned. Experienced rivermen had dragged the stream missing, so they believed no current or eddy in which the body might have been lodged. Efforts were discontinued 10 days ago. Several nights ago, in her dream, Mrs. Dill saw every circumstance of the finding of the body, and later the funeral of the drowned man. She was unable at first to prevail upon any person to search for the body. Finally, two old Rivermen, incredulous but full of pity,

what? Agreed to take upon the search again. Within five minutes after the man had thrown in the grappling irons, the body was hooked and wrought to the surface at the place indicated by Mrs. Dill. No interview, no nothing, like this woman, literally a miracle happened, and that's That's it. That's it. Anyway, that's, I think that's like amazing and very interesting. And this happens like more than you think. Let's get into the next one. Alice May Mathers.

Another city would also have the quiet serenity of its streets disturbed in 1963, when 12 year old girl by the name of Alice May Mathers went missing. Mission is a city that is carved out of a place amidst the forests and the forest cover mountains in British Columbia. Also, I can say this now because I live in Texas. That's where I lived.

That's where I lived. I lived in Abbotsford, but I actually just, I was living in Mission and I love it. I literally lived in the woods and it was awesome and I miss it, but I love, I love Texas as well. It's great. Anyway, it falls southeast of Vancouver and north of the Fraser River and neighbors the Golden Ears Mountain, which I've climbed on many occasions. Alice May Mathers was a 12-year-old girl who lived with her family on the outskirts of Mission British Columbia, Canada. And on June 9th, In 1969, she disappeared under circumstances that would later reveal a chilling crime. Alice had spent the day visiting her married sister, who lived about a mile from the Maithers' home. That day, she borrowed an electric mixer from her sister and planned to use it for baking when

she returned home. However, Alice never made it back. When she didn't arrive home as expected, her father traced her steps back, but found no sign of her. The Maithers family and friends and neighbors began searching for her immediately. And soon after the RCMP, or Royal Canadian. and mounted police. And there would also be an additional hundred volunteers helping to search for Alice. And the primary search area would be the dense woods surrounding the Mather's property. And obviously

the route that Alice would have taken to get home. And early in the search, dogs would be brought in to pick up Alice's scent. And the dogs would trace her trail from her sister's house to the nearby Lohyd Highway, where the smell would abruptly end. And this discovery raised the possibility that Alice could have been abducted. And the Mather's family would grow, increasingly desperate as the days passed, with no sign of Alice. And two weeks after Alice's disappearance on June 23rd, 1963, her mother would have a vivid dream. In this dream, she saw Alice lying in a gully or a pit, lifeless on a rock. The dream was so absolute and unsettling that she shared it with her husband the following day.

And unable to shake the image, Mrs. Mathers insisted that they searched this place. So the Mathers sought help from a friend who was very familiar with this area. Mrs. Mathers would describe the area from her dream, and together they would travel to a gravel pit about 14 miles from their home. And they would begin searching opposite sides. And it wasn't long before one of them found a small figure lying on a rock, just as Mrs. Mathers had described. The figure was severely beaten and unrecognizable.

But the clothing and pair of new shoes was identified as Alice's. And this was no accident and there was no mystery here. Alice was murdered. And an inquiry into another case that tied in with the Mathers case turned up two suspects. A pair of brothers, 30-year-old Kenneth Lloyd Meeker, and 35-year-old James Leonard Meeker. They'd kidnapped her along her walk home, grabbing her from Low Heat Highway. And fibers were covered from under Alice's fingernails, matched those in a jacket and trousers recovered from the home of Kenneth. And hair on Alice's body was also similar to that recovered from a blanket at the house.

And neither brother spoke asked if they had anything to say for themselves, because they're pieces of shit, but both would be charged with capital murder. Though Kenneth was the one who had done all the killing. In a document containing the names of those sentenced to death in Canada between 1867 and 1976, Kenneth's name appears on page 217, though the result of his trial was life imprisonment. These deaths are undoubtedly horrifically tragic, but there is an air of mystery around them. What happened to Gustav wasn't a mystery. People saw what happened.

And what happened to Alice had been a mystery, but the mystery was solved. The mystery is how both of these people had women in their lives that had dreams that revealed where their bodies were. Gustav's wife and Alice's mother. Like, how does that happen? Is it just a wild coincidence or is it supernatural? We'll never really know. But subconscious perception could be the answer.

Both women may have subconsciously absorbed information from their surroundings or conversations that they consciously processed. The human brain is constantly taking in vast amount of sensory data, much of which we don't actively notice. It's possible that during their waking hours, they observed subtle clues, such as landscape, weather patterns, or even patterns in the search efforts, that their conscious minds just overlooked. And in their dreams, these pieces of information could have been synthesized into a coherent message or image, which then manifested into a dream, which guided them to the bodies.

And many people boast about the power of the subconscious mind and its ability to translate input from all senses and multitask when the conscious mind is focusing on one thing at a time. And one other interesting potential answer is a scientific concept that, well, kind of crazy, has become an accepted fact. Quantum entanglement. Quantum entanglement is a newer idea. Definitely to me. I've not heard of it much,

just looking into it like for this case. With examples being yin and yang, or protons and electrons. Essentially, when two things are subject to quantum entanglement, when you do something to one, it affects the other. As said before,

this happens with protons and electrons. And the idea of yin and yang is also similar to this. In fact, when the wave functions, of entangled photons was visualized, it appears very reminiscent of yin and yang. So can people be linked in such a way? Who knows? I'm not a scientist, nor do I pretend to be, okay?

I got A's in science in high school and whatnot. That does not make me a quantum entanglement professor of sorts. But it does feel almost like when they say two twins are physically linked. And when one is hurt, the other feels it, you know? It makes me think a lot, you know? I think a lot, go outside of myself and everything. It's very interesting, but I think it's really awesome that these women were able to find their loved ones and kind of have that closure that the other cases didn't. Which brings us to our next case, the Oz effect.

So on March 14th, 2014, a man by the name of Dr. James McGrogan would disappear outside Vale, Colorado on a hiking trip. He and three other of his friends went on this hike. And after some strange things happened, he disappeared. Dr. James McGrogan was a man in excellent shape. He was a 39-year-old physician and someone very familiar with the outdoors and hiking. With his three friends, as I said, he decided to go on a hiking trip and do some skiing. They gathered some supplies at a store nearby, and they would also rent equipment at a place called Confluence Coyacks, where they took gear and began their long hike into the Holy Cross wilderness.

The route started from the town of Vale to the Iceman Hut, the path being about six to eight miles long. However, the elevation of this hut was around 11,000 feet due to it being up a mountain, which is a lot. Okay. I come from the mountainous Rocky Mountains up in BC, alright? I know elevation, right? That's really high. And it's a popular area for hikers nearby since it's very scenic and nature-oriented.

And in the right weather, it's perfect for skiing, which was the point of the group's hike. And they carried supplies such as a split snowboard, a blanket, a GPS, a cell phone with an extra battery, a shovel, and medical supplies, with some additional gear as well, just to ensure that everything went smoothly on the hike and that they were prepared for anything that might happen. So during the hike at around 10 a.m., the group decided to take a rest at one of the stops due to their lack of experience compared to McGrogan. McGrogan would state that he still had energy and told the group he would meet them at the next rest stop, to which the group agreed, because he was experienced and he knew what he was doing. So there was no worries of him really

needing help. So after the group rested, they got all their gear packed up and they began to make their way to the next rest stop to meet him. But as soon as they got there, they would realize that McGrogan was not there. Confused, they thought that he may have gone further just being impatient waiting for the group. So they continued yet again. And after hours passed and around 5.30 p.m. After searching all day, they realized something was very wrong. So one member of the group decided to hike all the way back down to notify the Eagle County Sheriff's Office. which then, in turn, led to a five-day search trying to find McGrogan. And what confused the searching party and his friends was that McGrogan was extremely experienced.

How could he have just disappeared out of nowhere? Sure, there was snow on the ground, but it was packed. But it was packed so firmly that it was impossible to lose sight of where you needed to go, especially for a skilled hiker and skier. And no phone calls were exchanged, according to David Politis. But according to a Facebook post that we found, it says, McGrogan's cell phone pinged once the day he went missing, but after that, it went dead.

But these are conflicting reports, so I will leave it to the expert David Politis. So a search team and three helicopters were sent over the 1800 square mile area to try to find James McGrogan. But still, there was no evidence as to where he had gone. Strangely enough, footprints should have led the search to find him, only like light flurries were falling from the sky. And there was absolutely no way the tracks could have disappeared entirely. But after five days of searching, he was nowhere to be found.

So unfortunately, they would call off the search. But during the search, there were reports of eerie silences in the area tied to the phenomenon that they called the Oz effect, which involves a complete silence in an area, like almost unnatural. No signs of wildlife, no signs of moving brush or trees, just complete. silence, which is horrifying. And this feeling can also bring on a sense of being watched or a detachment from reality. And researchers claimed that the silence was extremely eerie. The supernatural silence gives the body the feeling that something is very wrong. But after 20 days after his disappearance,

his body would be found. Four and a half miles away through two gullies. Over a 12,000 foot mountain in an area where they completely didn't expect to find him. And he would be found by three hikers at 9,950 feet in elevation in Boot Falls, where search and rescue would later recover his body. It was on an ice sheet. Supplies such as a split snowboard, a blanket, a GPS, a cell phone with an extra battery, a shovel, and medical supplies, with some additional gear as well, just to ensure that everything went smoothly on the hike and that they were prepared for anything that might happen. So during the hike at around 10 a.m., the group decided to take a rest at one of the stops due to their lack of experience compared to McGrogan. McGrogan would state that he still had energy

and told the group he would meet them at the next rest stop, to which the group agreed because he was experienced and he knew what he was doing. So there was no worries of him really needing help. So after the group rested, they got all their gear packed up and they began to make their way to the next rest stop to meet him. But as soon as they got there, they would realize that McGrogan was not there. Confused, they thought that he may have gone further just being impatient waiting for the group, so they continued yet again. And after hours passed and around 5.30 p.m. after searching all day, they realized something was very wrong. So one member of the group decided to hike all the way back down to notify the Eagle County Sheriff's Office, which then, in turn, led to a five-day search,

trying to find McGrogan. And what confused the searching party and his friends was that McGrogan was extremely experienced. How could he have just disappeared out of nowhere? Sure, there was snow on the ground, but it was packed, but it was packed so firmly that it was impossible to lose sight of where you needed to go, especially for a skilled hiker and skier. And no phone calls were exchanged, according to David Politis, but according to a Facebook post that we found, it says, McGrogan's cell phone pinged once the day he went missing, but after that, it went dead. But these are conflicting reports, so I will leave it to the expert David Politis. So a search team and three helicopters were sent over the 1800 square mile area

to try to find James McGrogan. But still, there was no evidence as to where he had gone. Strangely enough, footprints should have led the search to find him. Only like light flurries were falling from the sky. And there was absolutely no way the tracks could have disappeared entirely. But after five days of searching, he was nowhere to be found. So unfortunately, they would call off the search. But during the search, there were reports of eerie silences in the area tied to the phenomenon that they called the Oz effect, which involves a complete silence in an area, like almost unnatural. No signs of wildlife, no signs of moving brush or trees, just complete silence, which is horrifying. And this feeling can also bring on a sense of being watched or a

detachment from reality. And researchers claimed that the silence was extremely eerie. The supernatural Silence gives the body the feeling that something is very wrong. But after 20 days after his disappearance, his body would be found. Four and a half miles away through two gullies over a 12,000 foot mountain in an area where they completely didn't expect to find him. And he would be found by three hikers at 9,950 feet in elevation in Boot Falls, where search and rescue would later recover his body. It was on an ice sheet.

So the surrounding area would be completely frozen compared to its flowing water in the image here. We're at Booth Creek Falls, 9,950 feet in elevation. That's Booth Creek behind me. And this is the location where in April, 20 days after his disappearance, Dr. McGrogan was found on an ice sheet. And that's what it would have been. This would have been solid ice back in April. He was found wearing black leggings, a shirt, an undershirt, gray socks, no coat, no gloves, and no boots.

And the jacket, along with the GPS, was found unused and packed away in his backpack for some odd reason. However, again, the phone was not used. And conflicting reports state that he would have had service around this location as well. But we can really never know. But according to David Politis, there were two bars of reception from the location where he died. The interesting part behind the phone is that the phone had a backup battery.

And when the coroner took the phone, he turned it on and it worked. Now, where we're at right now, I have two bars and active service on my phone. And if you look at the mountain over here to my right, you'll notice that it's huge. It only makes sense that the further you went up and did that mountain,

you would still have phone service like I do now. And they also found his snowboard where it was later returned. He was also wearing a helmet and underneath the helmet, They had noticed he had severe head injuries and trauma to the left side of his chest and a broken femur. And what makes it strange is the complete disappearance of his boots. And we have seen this before in many 411 disappearance cases and especially in the Dietlough

Pass case where for some reason shoes and boots were removed during these times, which I believe is due to hypothermia because it is very, very common for people experiencing hypothermia to get very, very hot and take off their clothes, so that could be a factor. And it would kind of make sense because his coat wasn't found on him either. So he had been almost like shedding layers. So that could be a possibility. So not only did he have a GPS and a phone and the path wasn't too confusing to get off of, especially for an experienced skier and hiker, how did James Rogrogan get lost and die in such a tragic way? It's essentially completely unexplainable. David Plydis went back to Confluence kayaks, the place where all the stuff was rented and would ask Brian some questions. He was the one that was there when James rented the

equipment and the specific supplies. A splitboard, skins for it, a probe, a beacon, a shovel, and a helmet. Only the probe and the helmet were never returned. And he never questioned why the helmet wasn't returned due to the understanding that anyone that dies with equipment that they wear and is lost in the wilderness for 30 days made sense. However, he was kind of unbothered by the probes. And when asking Brian what would ever cause someone to take that specific route that James or Grogan took, he says it's basically unexplainable. That route was not normal and it was an extremely difficult route, even for training, let alone fun. And the exact journey isn't factual, but they alleged that it went something like this. He would have had to climb up 1,296 feet

to then a thousand feet down towards the creek, then up another 1,100 feet again, to get to the peak of Bald Mountain, which is about 12,000 feet. That's a lot. Then he descended to a lower summit and then another 1130 feet down again. The end of his journey where his body was found was another far drop leading to his resting place. And what doesn't make sense is through this entire journey. It's estimated he never used the skis for going down the mountain since they were found

attached to his pack when his corpse was found. And that's around a four and a half. mile long trip just going in a straight line. So it would actually be 12 to 16 miles long due to the zigzag down up steep cliffs and whatnot. And all of this is what James McGrogan allegedly traveled, all on his own with loose snow that could have been an avalanche. So completely unsafe, basically.

So why would an experienced hiker put himself through this? So it's really unfortunate because it's so unexplainable. And the phenomenon of the Oz effect and its eerie undertones really make that place seem haunted or paranormal possibly. There's really no explanation. Did James see something that caused him to walk off the path? Or was he dealing with something behind the scenes that people didn't know about? Or was he really not in his right mind and something caused him to act so strangely that still to the stay can't be explained? I don't know. All I know is that it is a truly depressing

horrible tale in what was meant to be a very fun boys' trip ended in death. And in the last case of our crazy conspiratorial disappearances, we have Tom Messick. On November 15, 2015, an 82-year-old man went missing while on a hunting trip with his friends near Lily Pond located in the Adirandek Mountains in New York. At around 10 a.m. in the morning, he was a very experienced hunter and outdoorsman, and he had extensive experience with rifles due to his background as an ex-paratrooper for the 82nd Airborne Division and the hunter's safety classes he taught. He was known to be reliable and independent, so there was no question that he knew exactly what he was doing. However, at 82 years of age, an accident that left him blind in

one eye when he was in his 20s was catching up to him. So the group he was with had walkie-talkies, but this was the first time they had hunted in this particular area before. So they made sure to stay close and keep in contact. However, a plan in scaring the dears towards the each other was made to draw the wildlife into the area that they were in. But before separating, they agreed to meet up at the rendezvous point at around 2 p.m. So after the group separated, they began the hunt. And what was strange about this hunting trip so far is that they hadn't seen any deer where they were, let alone any wildlife at all.

Red flags. Red flags. And after a while searching and realizing that there was no wildlife in the area, they decided to head towards the agreed upon meetup point. and Tom never initiated or responded on his radio, so the group became a bit worried at that point. A few of the members would stay behind, while the rest would go ahead and search for Tom,

eventually going to the position that he was meant to be at. However, when the group arrived, Ton was nowhere to be seen. There was no clue or sign, nothing left behind and all his gear was nowhere to be seen. The group was getting extremely worried at this point, given that there was no signs of an attack or any clue to lead the group to Tom's supposed,

and the group would drive to find help while the rest of the group tried everything in their power to get Tom's attention. From shooting in the sky to screaming for him and the search would continue for about four hours before the sun had finally gone down, realizing that they needed to change their strategy since what they were doing wasn't working. So they headed towards their vehicles and began to drive along the roads with their high beams on honking their horns. And eventually rescue teams would also search for Tom and 13 professionals from park services were all looking for him. as well. And over the next several weeks, 300 professionals and volunteers continued to search for Tom. Even using dogs and separate helicopters to try to locate the missing vet. So 15 different agencies were looking for Tom at this point. Forest Rangers, police canine units, DAC police officers,

the FBI quick response team, tactical teams, and search and rescue teams. And of course, the help of volunteers from different backgrounds. All for Tom. And they checked everywhere from the roads, to the swamps and no stone was left unturned, supposedly. And the search teams would also notice the lack of wildlife in the area, which left an eerie aura throughout the coming weeks, similar to the case that we just talked about with like the Oz effect. And the search would be extremely difficult, not only because of the weather conditions and where it was, but also because Tom was wearing camouflage,

which is why the search dogs were so important in this case. Also, the area of the search was huge. The search area being around 3,000 acres or about 4.7 square miles big. Some people believe that Tom could have gotten lost or hurt over the rough terrain, such as the swamps and the hills. But Tom's family stated that he knew what he was capable of at his age and wouldn't put himself through any danger of any sort. If he had genuinely been in danger, his common sense would have caused him to contact his friends

via the radio, but yet he didn't. And multiple theories have sprouted up after his disappearance. This episode sponsored by Forkfull. Most meal delivery services promise healthy food, but look closer, and you'll often find cheap industrial seed oils hiding in the ingredients.

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Meals.com. This episode sponsored by Forkful. Most meal delivery services promise healthy food, but look closer, and you'll often find cheap industrial seed oils hiding in the ingredients. Forkful does things differently. Forkful delivers chef-prepared meals made with premium ingredients you'd expect at a great restaurant, from center-cut filet mignon to wild-caught lobster mac and cheese, and every meal is 100% seed oil free. Instead of canola or soybean oil, Forkful chefs cook with extra virgin olive oil, avocado oil, and grass-fed butter, because better fats make better food. Meals arrive fresh, never frozen, with clear nutrition and ingredient transparency, so you always know exactly what you're

eating. Restaurant quality meals, real ingredients, no seed oils. Discover Forkful today at Forkful Meals.com.