Crime Fix with Angenette Levy - Child Killer Susan Smith Generates Hundreds of Parole Board Letters

Starting point is 00:00:00 Wondery Plus subscribers can binge all episodes of this Law and Crimes series ad-free right now. Join Wondery Plus in the Wondery app, Apple Podcasts, or Spotify. Child killer Susan Smith is days away from coming face-to-face with members of the parole board, and members of the public in South Carolina have something to say about her possible release. The prosecutor who put Smith away is here with the latest on the upcoming hearing. Welcome to Crime Fix.

Starting point is 00:00:27 I'm Anjanette Levy. Susan Smith will make her case to the South Carolina Parole Board on November 20th. And if you know anything about parole boards, you know that you can write to them and people are writing to members of the South Carolina Parole Board to tell them what they think about the possibility

Starting point is 00:00:44 that Susan Smith could be released after serving 30 years for the murders of her sons. I'm going to tell you more about people writing to the parole board shortly, so stay tuned. I really want you to hear about this. But first, a recap on how we got to this point. What Smith did is absolutely unimaginable. On October 25th, 1994, Smith was 23. She strapped her two young sons, three-year-old Michael and 14-month-old Alex, into their car seats in the back of her red Mazda and rolled that car into John D. Long Lake. Susan Smith stood on the edge of that lake in

Starting point is 00:01:19 Union County and watched as her helpless baby boys drowned. It took time. South Carolina's Law Enforcement Division would later say their experiment showed it would have taken six minutes for the car to sink. Susan Smith had time to rethink what she had done. And as I've told you before, she didn't. What Susan Smith did next still shocks the conscience 30 years later. She reported that a black man had carjacked her

Starting point is 00:01:45 and taken her car with Michael and Alex inside. It wasn't true. It was a lie that was racist and could have put people in harm's way. For nine days, Smith kept up the lie, the story of Michael and Alex supposedly being kidnapped made national news. And so did Susan Smith. Whoever has my children, that they please, I mean, please bring them home. And for those nine days, Susan Smith's then estranged husband, David Smith, stood by her, consoling her, and he defended her when others questioned her story. I spoke with David Smith and his wife, Tiffany, recently. You know, during those nine days, my entire focus was on finding micronautics and, you know, bringing them home. Nothing else mattered to me. You know, because I was hearing reports that she was failing polygraph

Starting point is 00:02:47 test and it and I was trying to help her give her suggestions on how to pass a polygraph because I just you know I believed 100 so I thought she was just failing these tests because she was going through trauma herself you know that Michael and Alex had been taken from her. And she was dealing with that and she wanted them back to just as I did. And so. I was just trying to help her pass polygraphs. And I was trying to do anything humanly within my power to bring Michael and Alex back. That's all I was focused on. I didn't care about failed polygraphs. I think all these stories, rumors that were going on, I didn't care.

Starting point is 00:03:42 I just wanted Michael and Alex back. After nine days, Susan Smith finally confessed to what she had done. Smith killed her little boys, Michael and Alex, for a man. It was selfish and callous, and those words are probably not even harsh enough to describe it. It was just evil. Susan Smith murdered Michael and Alex because that man, who had ended their relationship, had told her he wasn't interested in raising children. Sled agents pulled the Mazda from the lake with Michael and Alex still strapped into their car seats. Solicitor Tommy Pope sought the death penalty against Susan

Starting point is 00:04:16 Smith, but the jury opted for a life sentence instead. But the law at that time was written in a way that allowed a person sentenced to life to be eligible for release after serving 30 years. David Smith plans to speak against his ex-wife's release on November 20th. No, I do not want Susan to be released. I don't know what I'm going to even say to the parole board other than I don't want her released. But more than that, I don't know what I'm going to even say to the parole board other than I don't want to release. But more than that, I don't know. I know I'm just going to speak from the heart. of most importantly the lives that she took but also the lives that she changed forever all the people that all the family that you know she she changed

Starting point is 00:05:18 i don't know if it's the right way to put it, but history for, like, my life, the way my life's supposed to go, she changed all that. And I just, I want to tell the parole board, you can't let her out. I mean, she, you know, she did it intentionally with malice and forethought, as they say in the courts and 30 years is it's just not enough for justice for michael and alex for her to come out of prison any in the future would be an injustice to michael alex She needs to stay in there until she dies of natural cause or whatever, but she needs to stay there for the rest of her natural life. So now I want to go back to what I was telling you earlier about people contacting the parole board.

Starting point is 00:06:19 A spokesperson for the parole board told me the board has received 321 letters about Susan Smith's parole hearing. 319 of those call for her to remain in prison just to support Susan Smith's release. By law, South Carolina does not allow those letters to be released. The parole board will have a lot to consider when looking at whether Susan Smith should be released. The main consideration, has she been rehabilitated over the past 30 years. I want to tell you about a great free app it's called upside and it will give you cash back on things that you buy all the time like groceries and gas. This is not a

Starting point is 00:06:58 confusing rewards program upside gives you real money back that will go straight into your bank account. Just download the upside app and click on it and claim an offer and pay with your debit or credit card as usual. Upside works at places like Shell, Exxon, 7-Eleven, Taco Bell, KFC, and even Chipotle. To find out how much you could earn, click the link in the description to download Upside or scan the QR code on your screen and use our promo code CRIMEFIX to get an extra $0.25 back on every gallon on your screen and use our promo code CrimeFix to get an extra 25 cents back on every gallon on your first tank of gas. That's promo code CrimeFix for extra cash back. I want to bring in Tommy Pope. He is that solicitor who put Susan Smith in prison

Starting point is 00:07:38 for what the jurors apparently thought was going to be life in prison, but she is now eligible for parole. So Tommy, you know, the number one question the parole board is going to be life in prison, but she is now eligible for parole. So Tommy, you know, the number one question the parole board is going to have to answer is, has Susan Smith been rehabilitated to the point where she should be released from prison? And I know what you're going to say. What is your answer? Yeah, I obviously don't think she has based on her behavior. You know, the jurors, actually, some of them spoke after the trial and said the reason they gave her life as opposed to the death penalty was the belief that she would spend time, you know, remorseful for what she did, you know, thinking of Michael and Alex and the lives she had

Starting point is 00:08:16 taken. She's exhibited, you know, in prison, whether it's sex with guards or social media accounts. Now she's got sugar daddies that want to take care of her and just recently was contracting or attempting to contract to somehow make money or profit from the story itself. So unfortunately, Susan is always focused on Susan, I think from the time of the act to till today. And you're exactly right. That's what I would be telling the parole board. Yeah. And I'm glad you brought that up, the behavior in prison. Yes, she had sex with two prison guards. That is undisputed. And, you know, she hadn't gotten any reprimands from 2015 until

Starting point is 00:08:59 this year. And then in August of this year, she was caught, as you mentioned, communicating with a documentary film producer and having some conversations with that person. And she was told, telling this person, apparently, she would connect them with people involved in the case, including David Smith, which is confounding to me because David Smith told me he hasn't had contact with her in 30 years. The last time he had any contact with her was a month after her arrest. And, you know, that's what he told me. And so it's the fact that she would even say she could connect the producer with David is interesting to me. And this person was putting money on her books. And so she she's had a reprimand. She's had an infraction and she's been disciplined

Starting point is 00:09:45 for that. So she lost canteen privileges for 90 days and tablet privileges. So it seems to me, she almost, um, sounds like she almost thought she was readying for her release. Like maybe she thought she could, she was getting out and she was going to do a movie i i actually had um one of the media groups that had come and interviewed me played for me some tapes um from some guys that are you know having phone conversations with them from outside that talk about saving money up for her and taking care of her and i'm sure for her it's very exciting to have this much attention. You know, she embraced the attention for that nine days. And it only got difficult for her when people like you started asking the hard questions instead of just being supportive. And so Susan is histrionic.

Starting point is 00:10:39 She's always the princess of the victim. And I think, you know, she is proving to us right here at the worst possible time for her that she hasn't changed and you know going to David the story that I always want to be told I tell people you know we didn't have cameras in the courtroom if if a prosecutor acts like he wants cameras then I'm a glory hound if I don't want cameras I have something to hide but I always wanted people to hear David Smith's story because ethically, we couldn't tell that story. You know, we heard about poor Susan out in the media, but you couldn't hear what David suffered through,

Starting point is 00:11:14 what those boys suffered through. And so the story that needs to be told isn't Susan. You know, she loves when it's about Susan. The story to be told is David Smith and the fight he's had for this 30 years and he and Tiffany and the good days and the bad days. And, you know, we always say that let's focus on the victims. But, you know, he's had a tough row and I think he's handled it well. He really has. He really has. And we spoke with him a few weeks back and, you know, just what he's gone through. And it's just been horrible. And he was supportive. And he doesn't know what he's going to say, but he's he's going to speak from the heart when he speaks in front of the parole board. You have the opportunity to speak when you go when this hearing happens on the 20th. What are you going to say to the parole board? So mine is fairly straightforward. You know, actually, I don't want to eat up up all of the airtime because I think,

Starting point is 00:12:25 as you just said, David, speaking from the heart, his faith, the things that have brought him through, I think he's classy in the way he's forgiven her because as a Christian, that's absolutely what he feels he needs to do, but still feels she needs to be justly punished. As far as my part, really, it's twofold. It's, you know, I believe in truth in sentencing. The jury believed that she received life. And so I want the parole board to basically enforce that sentence, coupled with Susan, you know, the theme that we kind of started with. Susan hadn't learned her lesson. Susan is still about Susan and doesn't deserve to get out. I reached out to the parole board this week.

Starting point is 00:13:07 And I reached out to them back in August and I asked in August, has anybody written to the board? And they said, no, we've received no correspondence. Well, this week, as of this week, the board has received 321 pieces of correspondence. Out of that 321, the board tells me 319 pieces of the correspondence oppose her release to support her release.

Starting point is 00:13:35 So that's interesting to me because I feel like in South Carolina in particular, and we can't read these letters. They're private by law. Like, unfortunately, we can't. I want to read them, but I can't to to support her release. So this is still very raw in South Carolina. Just the fact that she she blamed a black man. This was like a racist thing that was conjured up in in the conscience of the public. And it was a national story. I mean, this is still a very raw story 30 years later. Sure. I think a couple of things. I think one, and I want to give Union credit, you know, at the time,

Starting point is 00:14:17 you know, it could have been explosively racist, you know, in the way the community handled it. One lady, an African-American lady, said it best. They said, well, what do you feel about the community blaming a Black man? And she said the community didn't blame a Black man. Susan Smith did. So the community was very good, you know, even here in the Deep South, of focusing that this was her acts and her conduct and so I think that you know as far as the opposition I think Union is weary of being the place where Susan Smith killed Michael and Alex I think Union wants to move on you know that's you know every time these people travel or they say I'm from Union isn't that the place where the woman killed the kids so I think Union doesn't want Susan coming back, you know, so you have that component. I think Susan drew in so many people and, you know, Michael and Alex became our children

Starting point is 00:15:12 that were missing. You know, we saw their faces. She begged us to help her find them. And, you know, you were just, your heart was torn. When you then find that betrayal has occurred I think it amplifies the grief it amplifies the loss and I think people you know feel again betrayed by her and have less sympathy than you may in other circumstances you know the defense always claimed it was a botched suicide well I argued she if she stopped the car for her she could have stopped the car for the kids you know if she had changed her mind she'd been wet her clothes had been torn something if she had run to that house and said I did a horrible thing I wasn't thinking I rolled the kids down the lake you and I would never be talking about this you know there would be

Starting point is 00:16:01 some mitigation in this case but there's not and it's it all comes back to to Susan and her focus and her selfishness. And I think the the people want to see justice served. Yeah, and there was time for the boys to be saved. I mean, it took time for that car to sink. About six minutes. Six minutes. And, you know, and we always say that lies are, you know, the best lies are coupled with the truth. I remember one time watching a video, you know, where she closed her eyes and just start telling me.

Starting point is 00:16:32 She said, and the boys were just crying for me as the carjacker drove off. Well, I think the boys were crying for her as she rolled them in the lake. Oh, my God. Just horrible. It's just absolutely awful to think about. Michael and Alex are the victims here and David and Tiffany want them to be remembered and they often get lost in this. I mean, we have, they're frozen in time. I mean, they are, as Tiffany says, forever three and 14 months old. And we just have these photographs of them. I mean, that's, that's all that's left.

Starting point is 00:17:11 And David said he really barely has memories of them because, you know, it's been so traumatic. It's almost like a defense mechanism, a coping mechanism for him. So these sweet little boys, you know, that's what that's, you see their photos, but it gets lost. And all of this talk about sugar daddies and sex with jail guards and documentaries. I mean, that's what really matters here. It's very sad. So, so you'll be speaking. This current solicitor will be speaking. We know David will be speaking. Your prediction, because it seems so rare to me

Starting point is 00:17:49 that people get parole on the first go around anyway. I think you're right. You know, as time has evolved, we've gotten closer to the actual hearing. It is probably rare. Of course, I knew it was rare that a woman would receive the death penalty, but I felt strongly based on all the things we've discussed that she deserved the same thing that the black man would have gotten or David would have gotten. And so I always say I've had jurors nod at me and then come back with not guilty. So you

Starting point is 00:18:22 never know. But my gut tells me she won't be getting out this time the unfortunate thing for david particularly and tiffany is um you know the nature of the system is this will be repeated you know whether it's two years or whatever you know area you know however often they let her come back for parole, this will be repeated again and again and again for a long, long time as long as they don't let her out. And it will. And it's so sad that they're going to have to go through this over and over again. So we will look toward the 20th and see what happens and what is said. Thank you so much, Tommy Pope. We appreciate you coming on. Absolutely. Take care. will look toward the 20th and see what happens and what what is said thank you so much tommy pope we

Starting point is 00:19:05 appreciate you coming on absolutely take care so right now i want to take a little bit of a look at more of what david smith told me a couple of memories of Michael and Alex. I was told by, you know, counselors and stuff that that was my body's way of defending itself, that it would be too traumatic maybe for me to remember them at the time, but that eventually over time, those memories would come back but unfortunately they haven't but i do know that michael was very protective of alex um especially at like the daycare where they stayed he if someone would take a toy from alex michael would get it back. He would get that toy back for Alex. Alex, he was more of you kind of, I would say,

Starting point is 00:20:11 like you rough and tumble little boy. He loved to play a lot, which Michael did too, but Alex was different, and he liked to just get in the floor and just roll around. Michael was a little more, I don't know the right word, but. Timid. Yes, timid. If he fell down outside, he would wipe his knees off.

Starting point is 00:20:39 He would wipe his hands off. He didn't like to be dirty. So, yeah, they were different in their own ways. He was, he was kind of held, he was more restrained. So David, you, you've kind of, as a coping mechanism blocked out your memories of your two boys because of the pain that you went through in losing them. That's correct. And I wish so,

Starting point is 00:21:15 so, so much I could have more memories of them. I mean, I really, honestly, I only have a few like snippets, snapshots of them in my head. And it's very few. All the three years with Michael and the 14 months without it, 15 months Alex is just gone in my head. And I wish it would come back. And maybe it will one day, but it hasn't yet. In the end, David Smith wants people to remember what truly matters in this case, his two young sons. I would just like to reemphasize that for people to remember who the victims were, it sure wasn't Susan or isn't Susan. And I know, I guess people look at me as a victim, and I can see that in a way,

Starting point is 00:22:12 but still, I'm more about Michael and Alex. I want people to remember that she took those little boys' lives and just think of them and the ultimate price that they had to pay because of her actions. You know, life is one of the greatest gifts that we're given. And she took those away and she had no right to do that. So I just would like the public to not, when they think about Michael and Alex and all the story and all the events, I want them to smile though when they see a picture of Michael and Alex or something. Not be sad. Smile. They were beautiful little boys who had a whole life ahead of them and,

Starting point is 00:23:05 and just smile for them. Don't be sad. And that's it for this episode of Crime Fix. I'm Anjanette Levy. Thanks so much for being with me. I'll see you back here next time.

Pet Camera - EBO Air 2

Crime Fix with Angenette Levy - Child Killer Susan Smith Generates Hundreds of Parole Board Letters

There aren't comments yet for this episode. Click on any sentence in the transcript to leave a comment.

Your Ad Here

Pet Camera - EBO Air 2

Crime Fix with Angenette Levy - Child Killer Susan Smith Generates Hundreds of Parole Board Letters

There aren't comments yet for this episode. Click on any sentence in the transcript to leave a comment.