Crime Stories with Nancy Grace - 13-year-old cheerleader stabbed dead, classmate charged

Episode Date: May 18, 2021

Tristyn Bailey, 13, was found dead Sunday evening, hours after her family reported her missing. Police arrested 14-year-old Aiden Fucci arrested earlier this week and charged him with second-degree murder in Bailey’s death.The suspect and victim were reportedly seen walking together in the early hours of Sunday morning. Two hours later, the boy was seen walking alone, carrying his white shoes. He reportedly told police he was carrying the shoes because “his feet hurt.”A local resident found Bailey’s body Sunday evening near a pond in a wooded area, reportedly less than a quarter-mile from Fucci’s home. Fucci and Bailey reportedly attended the same school and grew up in the same neighborhood. In autopsy findings announced Tuesday, a medical examiner determined that Bailey died of sharp blunt-force trauma, with homicide as the manner of death.Joining Nancy Grace today: James Shelnutt - 27 years Atlanta Metro Area Major Case Detective, Swat officer Lawyer www.ShelnuttLawFirm.com Dr. Susan Lipkins, Psychologist and Hazing Expert, Author: "Preventing Hazing", insidehazing.com, Dr. Tim Gallagher - Medical Examiner State of Florida www.pathcaremed.com Sheryl McCollum - Forensic Expert & Cold Case Investigative Research Institute Founder, ColdCaseCrimes.org Ray Caputo - Lead News Anchor for Orlando's Morning News, 96.5 WDBO Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

You're listening to an iHeart Podcast. A 13-year-old little girl seemingly vanishes into thin air. A little cheerleader, eighth grader Tristan Bailey, then a twist in the case. Tristan Bailey was reported missing by her family on Sunday morning. Hours later, her body was found in a wooded area near her neighborhood. The medical examiner says she was stabbed to death. You were just hearing our friend Jennifer Reedy at WJXT News for Jacksonville. Let me introduce you an all-star panel to somehow make sense of this. First of all, James Shelna, 27 years, Metro Major Case Detective, now lawyer. And you can find him at shelnalawfirm.com.

Dr. Susan Lipkins, renowned psychologist joining us, author of Preventing Hazing at InsideHazing.com. Dr. Tim Gallagher, the medical examiner for the entire state of Florida. You can find him at PathCareMed.com. Cheryl McCollum, director of the Cold Case Research Institute, forensic expert at ColdCaseCrimes.org. But first, out to Ray Caputo, lead anchor, WDBO. Ray, thank you for joining us. I don't understand where exactly this happened and what part the news reports about Jacksonville,

but this did not happen in Jacksonville proper, did it? No, Nancy. It happened in St. John's County, which is south of Jacksonville. It's an absolutely gorgeous part of the state. And Tristan Bailey lived in a neighborhood that was nestled between the St. John's River and I-95. It was a really quiet neighborhood. It was a safe neighborhood. In fact, you know, Tristan was only 13, but this was late Saturday night, early Sunday morning into Mother's Day,

and she was out late hanging out at a community center in her neighborhood. You know, Cheryl McCollum, that reminds me so much of growing up in rural Georgia. We had the Rutland Community Center, and that was the thing. In the middle of nowhere, I mean, you had to drive 30 minutes to get to McDonald's. Let me just put it that way. But we could walk back and forth. It was a good little trek to the Rutland Community Center. My brother played in a rock band, The Reflections, and that was it on a Saturday night to walk to the Rutland Community Center. And nobody thought anything about it, Cheryl. Nancy, this particular community center is inside her neighborhood. That's where the swimming pool is, the tennis courts.

I am certain these, you know, her parents thought she was safe. She was hanging out with kids. That's where the swimming pool is, the tennis courts. I am certain these, you know, her parents thought she was safe. She was hanging out with kids she's grown up with and lives next door to. You know, a lot of finger pointing has been going on at the family, at other people involved in this case, in this investigation. But now is not the time for finger pointing. Now is the time for fact finding. Take a listen to our friends at News 4 Jacksonville. The medical examiner ruled Tristan Bailey's death a homicide. The cause, stabbing. The details, downright disturbing. Most being kept confidential. We got to keep as many facts of this case out of the public realm to ensure the integrity of the

investigation and ensure a proper prosecution for justice and accountability in this case. Now, the medical examiner has ruled this a homicide right off the bat, stabbing. Let me go to Dr. Tim Gallagher, the medical examiner for the state of Florida. Dr. Gallagher, I understand that there have been times that you had to keep the facts of an investigation under your hat, secret so to speak, and that's what they were doing here, trying to keep as many details of the investigation a secret. Have there been times you had to keep facts of an otherwise public investigation secret? Oh, there have been. We've had many cases of high profile cases where the media has tried to get information from the office in very creative ways. We've had cases

where they would put a GoPro camera on a stick and hold it up to the window and try to get the camera in the window. Wait a minute. GoPro camera. My son loves those things. He's always trying to attach them to his body or his head or his helmet somehow. So you're saying somebody actually put a GoPro on a stick and somehow stuck it in a window at the morgue? We've had that, yes. And people come into the medical examiner's office in all types of disguises, and they may be disguised as a working person, as a transporter, a clergy, a family member. They may claim to be a member of representing the family. We've had people who would walk and

try to forcibly come into the medical examiner's office demanding records and photographs and viewing of the body. So security is something that we... People actually come in dressed like clergy or claim to be the victim's family to get a look at the dead body or to find out information? They do. You know, we've had members of religions that are part of maybe the Caribbean that come in and try to perform some, they want to perform some sort of religious thing to get the person reanimated. Whoa, wait, wait, wait. To reanimate them. Are you talking about voodoo? We're talking about voodoo, Apollo, Matumbe, and Santeria, all those types of religions.

You know, Gallagher, where did you go to medical school? Just curious. I went to medical school in the state of Maine. So I guess you never thought you'd be talking about Santeria or voodoo one day when it comes to an autopsy being performed for Pete's sake. And when I asked you the question, have you ever had to keep facts of a case under your hat like they are in the case of 13-year-old cheerleader Tristan Bailey? I had no idea voodoo was going to come out of that question. To James Shelnut, 27 years Metro Major case detective, now lawyer. Why is it so critical in certain cases that facts do not leak to the public? Well, I think you want to preserve the integrity of the investigation. And one of those aspects is preserving witnesses' memory, making sure that what they tell you is accurate, that it's from their own recollection or what they personally observed instead of what they observed on the news. Additionally, as was pointed out a minute ago, the investigators would like to talk to people first.

What you're seeing now is a trend of people hiring private investigators to go talk to these witnesses first, or even the media will try to run these witnesses down first before law enforcement has an opportunity to do that. And for those reasons and many others, it's very important to only release the information that you have to so that you can preserve the integrity of the evidence in the case. Guys, take a listen to Renata D. Gregorio, First Coast News. The work is far from over here. The sheriff says that they have more than 50 people working at this at any given time and a lot of interviews lined up for coming days. Now he also says here that anyone who is involved in Tristan's murder will be held accountable. There's no doubt in my mind and again I worked homicide for almost 12 years. This is nothing even nearly remote being an accident. As the investigation into Tristan

Bailey's murder continues, it now known she was stabbed to death. St. John's County Sheriff Rob Hardwick leaves it open. There could be more arrests. Anybody that's involved in this case, I'm going to give you a warning that we're going to hold you accountable for your actions. If you helped as an accessory after the fact or an accomplice prior to. He says no one is detained at the moment. As for the murder weapon, Hardwick says dive teams have recovered evidence from the three retention ponds near where Bailey's body was found. And investigators are going through that evidence. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.

Guys, for those of you just joining us, 13-year-old cheerleader who should be heading off to high school from middle school found stabbed dead. The search on for whoever was responsible. Trey Caputo, we were talking about where she grew up and where she went missing, but what about these retention ponds? Well, a lot of these neighborhoods, because they're cut out of the wilderness, they have retention ponds. That's what they use when they're building them. And Tristan's neighborhood had several of them. You know, I'm looking at where the community center is and where she went missing. And there's this line of trees and it looks like there's a pathway. So they cut through, but you know, a lot of times in these neighborhoods, they come to an end

somewhere and there's nothing but trees and in a retention pond. And that's what it was at the end of this road, a cul-de-sac. You cut through a little bit of line of trees, and there, in fact, was a body of water, a retention pond. And that's where Tristan was last seen. Guys, how does a 13-year-old little girl – isn't it true, Cheryl McCollum, she was having her eighth-grade graduation party? Either just had it or was about to have it, heading off from middle school to high school, and then suddenly she's found stabbed dead out in the woods? It just reeks of premeditation to me, Nancy. When you have a victim that is a child, there's extra planning that has to go into that

because they have to be away from their parents. They have to be in from their parents. They have to be in a secluded spot. They have to be where maybe they're not missed for a little bit of time in order to get away from the scene, the killer to get away from the scene. Exactly correct. Guys, take a listen to this. For roughly two decades, Director Howard Cole has been investigating homicides. In my 20 years of investigating homicides, this is probably one of the most tragic and difficult cases that we have faced. Director Cole is overseeing the Tristan Bailey case alongside dozens of other detectives. He sat down with News for Jack's Eye team reporter Vic Miccolucci. How good is the case right now?

I would say based on my experience, which is quite extensive, I am very confident. Now, that's curious that prior to an arrest, prior to the case being solved, one of the detectives says he's confident the case will be solved. I'm wondering if that's because, Ray Caputo, it was multiple stabbings. And with stabbings, you very often find DNA of the perp on the body where the knife slips because of the blood. There's really no easy, nice way to put that. And it slices the perp as well. What do you think, Ray Caputo? Why was he so confident that it's going to be solved? Well, I think because not only that, yeah, when you stab somebody, you leave a lot more evidence than, say, taking a shot at somebody from far away.

But there was a lot of video evidence. You know, people knew where she was. They knew they were piecing together her moments before she went missing. You're absolutely correct. Yet again, Ray Caputo, WDBO. Take a listen. You were hearing Jennifer Reddy at WJXT. Take a listen to our friends at First Coast News.

Surveillance video spotted what appears to be Tristan Bailey walking north from the amenity center at 1.14 a.m. Thirty-one minutes later, two people are seen walking east along Sallistone Drive at 1.45 a.m., 31 minutes later, two people are seen walking east along Saddlestone Drive at 1.45 a.m. One is wearing shorts, a hoodie, and white shoes with the black Nike logo. The other wearing black pants and a black shirt. That same camera then capturing one person walking back west wearing shorts, a hoodie, and this time carrying white shoes with the black Nike logo. That was around 3.27 a.m., one hour, 42 minutes later. Police found clothing with blood on it. You know, hold on just a moment right there.

That was a lot of information to take in. Let's hear that one more time from our friends at First Coast News. Surveillance video spotted what appears to be Tristan Bailey walking north from the amenity center at 1.14 a.m. 31 minutes later, two people are seen walking east along Saddlestone Drive at 1.45 a.m. One is wearing shorts, a hoodie, and white shoes with a black Nike logo. The other wearing black pants and a black shirt. That same camera then capturing one person walking back west wearing shorts, a hoodie, and this time carrying white shoes with the black

Nike logo. That was around 3.27 a.m., one hour, 42 minutes later. Police found clothing with blood on it. Wow. Okay, Cheryl McCollum, you're getting pieces of the puzzle. What do you make of that? These are very important pieces. I mean, obviously, you've got two people walking at 145, and you have one person walking at 327. And, Nancy, you and I have talked at nauseam on your show about the importance of the first three hours and how critical they are when a child goes missing. Now, they didn't realize she was missing, but the killer did because he lured her to a place. And those first two hours for her become the most critical. Cheryl, Cheryl, did you hear this?

One wearing black pants and a black shirt. One wearing a hoodie with white shoes with a black Nike logo. Right. Shortly thereafter, less than an hour later, you see one person with shorts and a hoodie, this time carrying the white shoes with the black Nike logo. And I'm assuming those were her shoes. It could very well be. That's the way it looks to me and i

mean think about it if those are her shoes to dr susan lipkin's psychologist so the killer lures her to a wooded densely wooded area stabs her dead multiple stab wounds then steals her Nikes, if those are in fact her shoes. That's cold, Dr. Lipkins. Yeah, I don't think he stole them. I think he used them as a way of proving what he had done. And I would not be surprised. You mean like as a souvenir? No, as a member of a gang producing, you know,

evidence that he carried out whatever he was supposed to be doing. Huh. I don't know. I don't know about that. I don't know about that at all. But I can tell you this much. Stealing the shoes off the victim's feet, if in fact those are the victim's shoes, that is one cold killer. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Guys, the fear and hysteria seeps into the neighborhood, and people take to social media.

Take a listen to our friends WJX-TV News 4 Jax. Lots of messages on social media from people claiming to be part of 13-year-old Tristan Bailey's murder. We've been reviewing all of the accounts, but are not identifying them. The posts taunt her family and friends. It's hundreds and hundreds of leads. Sheriff Rob Hardwick says his detectives have been bombarded with messages about these internet trolls,

and they're investigating every tip. Nothing is off the table. Interesting times, Vic, you know, where we're trying to figure out, you know, is this real? Is this legit? Is it coming from a person that's a possible witness? Well, we're going to find out and track down every single lead. The sheriff says detectives have identified several accounts and are honing in on the posters. Florida state statutes show that someone could be charged with interfering with their investigation, whether it's resisting an officer or providing false information to law enforcement. The latter could lead to a felony.

You're darn right. Now, this is confounding me. For those of you just joining us, a 13-year-old cheerleader goes missing in a neighborhood. No crime. No crime neighborhood. She goes missing within hours. First of all, nobody knows she's missing. But when they do realize it, her body is found within hours. A 13-year-old little girl stabbed dead in a densely wooded area. And what happens? Internet trolls take to social media claiming they all know something or they took part in the murder.

What is that phenomenon, Dr. Lipkins? That's something that we're finding more and more in today's society, where there can be a lot of confusion and hiding behind the screen, so to speak. And as we just heard, it gives the police a lot of leads and a lot of problems. We really can't predict what this may be. But, you know, at that age, at the 13, 14-year-old, the most important thing is being accepted socially and being part of a group, which often feels like a family. They want to be accepted by their peers more than they do anybody else. Well, you know what? James Shelnut, 27 years Metro Major case detective, now lawyer.

That's exactly what police don't need as a bunch of Internet trolls claiming, oh, I did it. No, I did it. No, I know who did it. Why would anybody screw up a murder investigation of a 13-year-old little girl like this? Yeah, I don't know. It is unreal to me that people would want to get on there and do this. And what it does is law enforcement has to be thorough.

There's going to be a defense lawyer on the other side saying, well, there was this lead. Did you investigate it? There was this person saying that they were involved. Did you investigate that? Shelnut, Shelnut, Shelnut, hold that thought. Because now, I forgot how many, 20 years after Scott Peterson's convicted, the new defense is, hey, the house down the street got burglarized. Maybe they did it.

I mean, and the cops, by the way, did follow those leads, track those burglars down, interview them and rule them out. But the point is, it's rearing its ugly head 20 years later. If you don't track down every single lead shell nut exactly exactly it creates a ton of work and as a minute ago there's a couple theories put out uh you know around you know tristan's death you know what could have happened you know one of the things i think just looking at this from a law enforcement perspective investigative perspective is i would like to know the level of severity of any wounds that were caused from the knife. In other words, was this a few stab wounds? Was this repeated? You know,

that could lead you to the conclusion that this was a crime of rage. Also, I know a couple of theories have already been put out, but, you know, sometimes, you know, it's possible that a person could feel dejected or rejected. Possibly there were some sexual advances towards this girl. I think it's entirely possible that whoever killed this little girl was rejected sexually. I mean, why would you lure a 13 year old girl out into the woods would be the first question. Well, following up on the evidence, not theories, take a listen to First Coast News. A break in the case. A report issued Tuesday by the St. Johns County Sheriff's Office

says surveillance video shows Bailey walking with 14-year-old Aiden Fucci, now charged with a murder, around 1.15 a.m. Sunday at the community's amenity center. They are seen at a home surveillance video about 30 minutes later, walking in the direction toward the woods where Bailey's body was found the next day. And then two hours later, at 3.27 a.m., more house surveillance video shows Fucci, the suspect, walking in the opposite direction alone.

Tuesday, dive crews wrapped up their search of two lakes just yards away from where Bailey's body was found in the woods. No word on what or if evidence was found in the lakes. So question, did this kid, he is a kid, 14-year-old Aiden Fucci, did he go to school with her? Because he is in the surveillance video. That's the other figure walking along with the 13-year-old little cheerleader, Tristan Bailey. Cheryl McCollum, what do we know about this kid, Aiden Fucci, just 14? We know that they did go to school together, and he lived in the same neighborhood about a mile from her. They go to school together.

They live in the same neighborhood. You know, here's the tricky part with grainy surveillance of video. At first, they couldn't really make it out. There is an art to enhancing that. I always say NASA's got nothing on Target and Walmart. Awesome surveillance of video. Many a case has been solved by Target and Walmart video. But in this case, we're not dealing with that kind of video. We're dealing with things like ring doorbells. And it's at night. And the people are walking.

Tristan is walking along the road, the street. And it's really hard to get an ID. That video has to be enhanced, and that takes a minute. But it was enhanced, and it shows this 14-year-old little boy, as many people would describe him, walking along with Tristan Bailey. So let's think this through, Cheryl McCollum. What's the likelihood he's with her just before her murder, and then you see him walking away with her tennis shoes? What, did little green men from Mars come in in between and murder her and stab her repeatedly? No.

I think the video is very compelling. And also, Nancy, if you listen to what the sheriff said, this community sprung into action. Everybody that had a ring video on their door, anywhere in that vicinity started looking at their own video. So there's more than one that shows the path of direction prior to them separating. So I think, again, it's the most compelling thing they have at this point. Ray Caputo, very narrow question. Ray Caputo, lead news anchor, WDBO Orlando. Ray, there is no evidence to my understanding that Tristan Bailey was killed as part of any kind of gang activity whatsoever. This Aiden Fucci, to my knowledge, was not a member of a gang. They were in middle school together. Yeah. I mean, Nancy, this kid, if you look at his, his, a picture of him, he still has acne and couldn't even grow facial hair. Um, it doesn't seem like a gang initiation

to me. Um, another interesting tidbit was that Tristan was found with all of her clothes on. So you're absolutely right. You're absolutely right about that. Take a listen to this. These are our friends at WKMG News 6. The tears here different than what deputies confirm is Fucci seen in this Snapchat now widely shared, showing the teen holding up a peace sign with the caption, quote, Hey guys, has anybody seen Tristan lately? It's now part of the three day old investigation, which an arrest report read a search warrant found clothes with blood on them in Fucci's bedroom. This while the 13 year old's family has asked for privacy and the tight knit St.

John's community grieves the young girl's death. OK, two things right there from our friends at WKMG. Tarek Caputo, lead news anchor WDBO. One, you're right. Her bloody clothes were found pursuant to search warrant in this kid's bedroom. Correct? Well, Nancy, I thought that it was something, there were different types of effects, but there were, there were bloody things found in his bedroom. Absolutely, there was evidence tying him to that scene. And then second, Fucci, the alleged killer, 14-year-old friend of hers in middle school, is in a Snapchat video showing him holding up a peace sign with the caption, Hey guys, is anybody seeing Tristan?

That's correct, Nancy. This is beyond me, and this is the part of the case that just, it gets a lot of people riled up. Now, how did he even post that picture? Well, he was being interviewed. This was before he was arrested, and in between him being interviewed, and obviously he couldn't take the picture, somebody else took it for him, but he had enough gall, knowing what was going on, to post that to Snapchat.

It's his absolutely nutty butters, Nancy. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. We're talking about the disappearance and the brutal murder of a 13-year-old little eighth grade girl, Tristan Bailey, lured into a heavily wooded area in her neighborhood. You've got the trees with the streetlights and the pool and the community center and the tennis courts. And then beyond that are woods and retention ponds. She was lured off of her street into those woods where she was brutally murdered.

And then let me understand this, Cheryl McCollum. The 14-year-old boy, the classmate, actually posts a shot of him shooting a peace sign saying, hey, anybody seen Tristan? Yeah. Let's talk about it, though. Yeah. Because there's a lot in that photograph. If you look at the back of his cell phone, it looks to me like he's got a sticker that's the

Princess Jasmine. His thumb looks like he's painted it with fingernail polish. His hair is basically a bob. Those things have got to be connected. Those things have got to be looked at by law enforcement. What does his hairstyle have anything to do with it? Everything matters. He chose that hairstyle. When you are a 14-year-old boy in middle school and you have a mom haircut and you paint your fingernails and you've got Princess Jasmine on your phone phone you are inviting people to bully you that's number one number two well he only has one fingernail painted and it's painted black i know and that's not necessarily trying to say he is uh i'm not trying to say i don't see it except law enforcement has got to connect why he would select these things and do these things. The Princess Jasmine thing,

there's no way my son would have a Princess Jasmine sticker on his phone, but that's just him. Of course not. But frankly, my daughter wouldn't either. So I don't know how much you can read into that because according to her, once in a while I still catch her listening to Ariel, but she denies it. So, you know, he posted it. it there it is it's from his account i mean dr susan lipkins your theory about this being part of a gang initiation and that's not correct period

but i mean 14 year old boy with princess jasmine sticker on his phone he He posts. Anybody seen Tristan, the girl he just killed? Okay. So he's either severely emotionally disturbed, which if he were, we would have expected that the school and the neighborhood should know and would know something about that. And maybe that's information that has not yet been revealed. But what you were alluding to is that, you know, this is a cold-hearted killer who had a premeditation, which I agree because he had the knife, and that there was a beginning and a middle and an end, and that he disconnected from it and acted like, you know, who me?

I had nothing to do with this by posting that photo. If that was all true, then we know that this is a severely disturbed child. Well, I've got a completely different take. Okay. Because there's no evidence that he ever missed school, that he had any disciplinary problems, which I think would go hand in hand with some sort of severe emotional problem. James Shelnut, Metro Major Case Detective, now lawyer,

I think it's more taunting. He knows he killed her. He knows he's responsible. And it's like a big joke. Hey, anybody seen Tristan? Yeah, she's dead at the morgue, Shelnut. Oh, I agree. I agree.

Look, I agree 100%. And here's something. It's very important for law enforcement to have a confession in a murder case, but they don't always get that. But something that can be just as important, if not more important, is after a person has been placed in a pair of handcuffs or placed in the back of a car for their actions to indicate that they're the type of human being that would have done this. And if this young man winds up in front of a jury one day, because he may very well be charged as an adult if he's charged. Florida, by the way, is the leading state for charging children as adults. And 14 is a magical number in Florida that makes it very easy for the prosecutor to do that. He's going to be charged as an adult. You're right. You are absolutely right, Sheldon. This is the seven deadly sins that take a child into adult court.

Murder, rape, sodomy, child molestation, armed robbery, arson, and aggravated assault, I think, are them. You're dead on. He's going to be treated as an adult. And we find out those are not her shoes he's carrying from the scene. They're his shoes. And I think that's a matter of evidence, Cheryl McCollum.

Why would he be carrying his own shoes from the scene? It's excellent evidence. And I heard that he told his mom when she asked him is because his feet were hurting. I think he was trying to maybe save those shoes because he knew there was blood on them. But, Nancy, there's something else. I've got to make a point. When he posted the picture of him in the back of the patrol car, what he actually texted was, hey, guys, has N body. He didn't spell anybody right.

Maybe that's leakage. Maybe that's indicative of stabbing. So again, all of these things are going to come out, every single one of them. And law enforcement is going to connect everything. They're going to go through his social media. They're going through his phone. They're going through his computer. They're going through his searches. Trust me when I tell you, some more things are going to come that'll blow your mind. Take a listen to our friend, Dane Yanes, WKMG News 6. The truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth to help you, God. With his hand raised high, 14-year-old Aiden Fucci faced a judge in Volusia County today

for the murder of his classmate, 13-year-old Tristan Bailey. Found dead in St. John's County Sunday night hours after her parents reported her missing. Her body found 0.3 miles from the young man's house, according to a new arrest report released today. Also today, the medical examiner confirming she was stabbed and had trauma to her head. Fucci looking up with tears in his eyes as the judge read his charge this morning. Mr. Fucci, you're charged with second-degree murder. His parents, both in the virtual courtroom. His mother, also seemingly upset. The law is and will be read to the jury as part of the jury charge,

where at the very end of the case, after all the evidence is in, both sides have rested, closing arguments are done, the judge charges the jury with the law by which they are to judge the case. And the judge will tell the jury. One may regret the deed immediately, such as crying in the courtroom. But that does not negate intent at the time of the incident. To Dr. Tim Gallagher, we are now hearing that she also had trauma to her head. And I'm understanding there were multiple stabs. A lot of the details are still being kept secret. What does that tell you? A blow to the head and stab wounds? Well, it's difficult to interpret that as a blow to the head. Trauma usually comes in two types. There's blunt force trauma, which would be what you're describing, a blow to the head,

or sharp force trauma, which would be a stabbing. So this trauma could either be she could have been stabbed in the head or she could have been punched or beaten on her head or about her head. So the word trauma is not specific enough for me to understand what the injury was specifically. I hear you. But I notice it was to the head, not to the face. Does that make a difference to you, Dr. Gallagher? Well, in my experience, we've had people who've been stabbed multiple times in the head. We've had cases where the

knife had actually penetrated into the skull and have gone into the brain. So in my experience, it could be interpreted as either sharp or blunt force trauma. Most of the time, it tends to be blunt force trauma. But again, this is just speculation. I don't have the District 23 report in front of me now. Guys, we know that a, quote, celebration of life is taking place for 13-year-old Tristan Bailey. A flurry of motions have been filed on behalf of 14-year-old Aiden Fucci. We wait as justice unfolds. Nancy Grace, Crime Story, signing off. Goodbye, friend.

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