Crime Stories with Nancy Grace - 23-year-old beauty disappears leaving arcade

Episode Date: October 29, 2020

A Seattle woman disappears after taking a Lyft for a night out in Dallas, Texas. Marisela Botello was last seen in the early hours of Oct. 5 going out in the Deep Ellum district for what was supposed ...to be the final night of her stay visiting her ex-boyfriend.Joining Nancy Grace Today: Ashley Willcott - Judge and trial attorney, Anchor on Court TV Dr. Debbie Joffe-Ellis - Psychologist, Adjunct Professor at Columbia University Chris Byers - former Police Chief Johns Creek Georgia, 25 years as Police Officer, now Private Investigator and Polygraph Examiner Joe Scott Morgan - Professor of Forensics Jacksonville State University, Author, "Blood Beneath My Feet" featured on "Poisonous Liaisons" on True Crime Network Dave Mack, Crime Online reporter Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Starting point is 00:00:00 This is an iHeart Podcast. How does a 23-year-old woman go into a bar and then seemingly vanish off the face of the earth? What happened to Maricela? Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Take a listen to our friend Karen Borta at CBS 11. Dallas police are looking for a missing woman last seen three weeks ago 23 year old maricela botelho arrived in dallas from seattle on sunday october 4th to visit her ex-boyfriend she was last seen at 1 a.m monday october 5th leaving a bar in deep ellum wearing a purple dress if you've seen her or have any information about this case,
Starting point is 00:01:06 you're asked to contact Dallas police. This young girl still missing, absolutely stunning 23-year-old Maricela Botello caught on video at the bar wearing a purple dress and seemingly after that, she just vanishes into thin air. With me an all-star panel to break it down and put it back together again in the hopes that we can find Maricela. The tip line is 214-671-4268. Repeat 214-671-4268. With me judge trial lawyer anchor at court tv you can find her at ashleywilcott.com dr debbie joffie ellis psychologist adjunct professor at columbia university she is at debbie joffie ellis.com former police chief john's creek joining me 25 years on the force, now a PI and polygrapher, Chris Byers at Chris Byers Investigations and Polygraph.com.
Starting point is 00:02:10 Professor of Forensics, Jacksonville State University, author of Blood Beneath My Feet on Amazon, now the star of a hit series on the True Crime Network, Poisonous Liaisons, Joseph Scott Morgan. But first, to CrimeOnline.com investigative reporter, Dave Mack. Dave Mack, this 23-year-old woman from Seattle flies to go see her ex-boyfriend in Dallas. And from what we know, they didn't have any kind of an argument. Nothing went wrong. Why did she go out to the bar that night by herself nancy it was her last night in town and she just wanted to go out and go downtown um her ex-boyfriend just didn't want to he wanted to stay in that's why she went by herself and you know very often ashley wilcott judge and trial lawyer court tv anchor you look at the one most closest to the victim. That would be the husband,
Starting point is 00:03:07 the boyfriend, the lover, the ex-lover. But here, it seems to me like they have established the boyfriend that she went to go visit did not go out with her that night. I think they have absolutely established that. She ordered a Lyft. She was alone when she got in the Lyft and went to the nightclub in Deep Ellum. I've been to Deep Ellum. I go there still if I go to Dallas. It's a really fun area, seemingly safe, upbeat. But I need to suggest this. It's a little odd to me that even if it's an ex-boyfriend, that they're going to send off a 23-year-old female in a Lyft to go clubbing by themselves without saying maybe that's not a great idea.
Starting point is 00:03:46 You know, Ashley Wilcott, I see women out partying by themselves all the time. And if he didn't want to go, says I worked all day. I don't want to go. You go ahead. I mean, there could be a million explanations of why he didn't want to go. Yes. Was it a bad decision? Obviously a bad decision. But my point, Ash, is that are we ruling him out right now? It seems like we are. Take a listen to Alex Rozier, WFAA. On a Sunday in Dallas, Deep Ellum is one of the city's most popular spots. This is what I've been doing down here the past few days. But it's a place Patrick Helmbrecht never planned to visit. She was in here and been missing since the 4th.
Starting point is 00:04:31 He's looking for his friend Maricela Botel. She missed her scheduled flight back to Seattle on the 5th as well. Visiting from Seattle after a weekend with her ex-boyfriend, she went drinking alone on Monday, October 5th. Just after midnight, a lift dropped her on Elm Street and surveillance video showed her leaving Select Start, but she hasn't been seen since. From there, she just never came back. And that's around the same time also that we seen the last cell phone activity, the last time her debit card was ever used. You are hearing the voice of a friend of Maricela's. It's Patrick Helmbreck.
Starting point is 00:05:08 He's the one out putting up posters. Have you seen this woman with the tip line 214-821-467-14268? Where they went, Joe Scott Morgan, I want to talk to you about forensics. Where she went was an arcade. She was in an arcade. And that was, as you know, at Elm Street, the Lyft dropped her off there. So we can't blame the Lyft driver. We can't look to the driver because she was last seen getting out and then leaving the arcade. What can we find out about the arcade, Joe Scott Morgan? What potential forensics can we get from there? Well, I think that if there is CCTV that is available, we might be able to, if the video is sufficiently enhanced, be able to see what her movements were like contained in there.
Starting point is 00:06:06 And sometimes that's a big if. It's a hit or miss many times with CCTV. Also, individuals that she may have contacted along the way, individuals whose space she was in. Did she have any kind of conversations with these individuals within this arcade? And I don't really understand what the structure of the arcade is. Let's say, for instance, in typical fashion, if you think about an old-fashioned arcade where they've got games like skee-ball and all those sorts of things, maybe a trace of her was left behind if she actually contacted the surfaces in there.
Starting point is 00:06:42 And that could, in fact, prove that she was in that environment. You know, you're talking about closed circuit TV, and you're absolutely right. Guys, do you recall the case of Kelsey Smith? And we have worked with her dad many, many times. Kelsey was a young teen girl who goes shopping and closed circuit TV, showed something very interesting. I'm pretty sure it was at a Target. In every graph where she went around the store, she was talking to her mom on the cell phone basically the whole time
Starting point is 00:07:18 until she left the store. At different spots in the CCTV, you you see a guy the same guy no matter where she goes she's in the men's department she's buying a gift for her then boyfriend's six month anniversary if she's in the sock department there he is looking at socks if she goes to the popcorn makers there he is looking at a waffle iron. Everywhere she goes, he's somehow, he's not really looking at her, but he's in every frame where she is. I mean, Dr. Debbie Jaffe Ellis, you run into hundreds of people, you pass them all the time on the street, in the grocery store. But for someone to be popping up in every
Starting point is 00:08:07 frame of the closed circuit TV is a huge red flag. It certainly is. It's indicative of stalking. To former police chief Johns Creek, Chris Byers, what do you make of her being in an arcade? My point is, what evidence can I get from the arcade? Well, again, just really what Joe said. You know, you're looking for that CCTV. You're looking for different things she touched. You know, touch DNA is something that can be used. You're looking for the interactions.
Starting point is 00:08:43 What you want to see on those videos or did she have words with somebody did she have any type of confrontation just like you said is there somebody that seemed to be marking her within the arcade that might have followed her out and you know had something to do with her disappearance crime stories with nancy grace
Starting point is 00:09:14 guys we're talking about a bar an arcade where this 23-old girl was last seen alive. Let me understand this, Dave Mack. Is it the Select Start Arcade there in Texas? Is that the name of it? Yes, ma'am. It's called Select Start. Select Start. What do we know about it? We know that it is an arcade slash bar. It's a place where people go in and they can play video games, some of the old school video games that we had back in the day, but also it's an adult beverage place. And people go there and they hang out, play games and socialize. I've been looking at it and trying to find out what I can. Here's what people say. I love it. I want to have my birthday party here. Thanks to the bartender. We all had a great time. The service is great. Atmosphere, great for a birthday party. Awesome games, amazing staff.
Starting point is 00:10:10 And many people compare it to Dave and Buster's. Are you guys familiar with that? It's an arcade where I guess you can drink and get bar food like wings. You're shaking your head, yes. Right. So that's what many people can compare it to. And you know what's interesting to you, Joe Scott Morgan, when you think of Dave and Buster's, you don't think of anything nefarious. I mean, I've taken my children to Dave and Buster's.
Starting point is 00:10:36 Yeah. Yeah, you don't. But the thing about it is, is that you don't know who is inhabiting those spaces with you if you want to shiver, send up your spawn. Particularly if you have an environment where people's, hey, people's guard is down, Nancy. You're playing games. You're distracted. I've been to Dave and Buster's. They've got TVs everywhere. You can watch all kinds of games. So if somebody is looking as a predator to target somebody, it's a perfect hunting ground because you're completely
Starting point is 00:11:06 taken unawares. You've got her leaving as well, or did she? Take a listen to our friends at WFAA Dallas. She just never came back. And that's around the same time also that we seen the last cell phone activity, the last time her debit card was ever used. Maricela's aunt, Dinesley Castillo, said Dallas police haven't started investigating. They're desperate to find her niece. Well, she's not a new traveler, which is why this is also odd to us that this happened to her because she's always in contact. She's always in contact with the family, at least one of us letting us know what she's doing. So for us to not know anything, she fell off the face of the earth. It's completely, you know, it's worrisome. We know that something's wrong.
Starting point is 00:11:50 After learning of his friend's disappearance. She's just a good person. Helmbrecht made the 2,000 mile drive from Seattle. Just kind of been piecing together like a bunch of videos, just going from bar to bar and kind of just putting it together myself. He's hoping posters and publicity help bring Maricela home. We just want some answers at the very least, what's going on, where she's at. I'm thinking about what the aunt said. To judge and trial lawyer, Court TV anchor at AshleyWilcott.com. Ashley, you and I have discussed this on other occasions as it
Starting point is 00:12:27 relates to proving a case. Now, for a lot of people, the fact that the aunt says, this isn't like her. She's always in touch with family. I know something's wrong. We saw that with Vanessa Guillen in the Fort Hood debacle where her sister Marisol tells me that she, excuse me, her sister Myra tells me that she knew that night, her and her mom, they knew something was wrong because they couldn't get Vanessa on the phone. And that was unlike her. And as hours passed, they knew something was wrong. I mean, I'll drop everything if I can and pick up if I see a family member calling me. So it's called routine evidence. And I don't mean it's ordinary. Routine evidence is very valuable at trial. Ashley, explain. Sure, absolutely. So the routine evidence are the things that people do as a matter of course in their every day that they can be relied on to do. That's typical. So it guess what? That is out of the ordinary.
Starting point is 00:13:46 And that's significant in terms of proving something has happened, something is amiss. This is not what she typically does in her everyday life. You know, there is a program that my son loves. It's called Brooklyn 99. And it's kind of a comedy about the 99th precinct in Brooklyn, the cops. And they've got a very, let me just say, buttoned up commander. And in an episode John David was watching, the commander, Captain Holt, walks in wearing a red derby hat. I mean, he always has his shirt
Starting point is 00:14:23 buttoned up to here. He's very formal. And everybody actually stops what they're doing and they watch him walk in. That may mean nothing to investigators or anybody else, but that is not his routine. That would be like if Jackie here walked in one morning and she had on a black sequined mermaid evening gown. No, something would be horribly wrong. So, you know, when we're talking about routine evidence, it's very significant. What else do we know? We know that she's out of town.
Starting point is 00:15:00 To Dr. Debbie Jaffe Ellis, psychologist joining us, Professor Columbia University at DebbieJaffeEllis.com. When you're out of town, that changes your routine, does it not? Well, it often does. It's a chance to enjoy greater freedom or doing things you don't do normally. But, you know, Nancy, while listening, I'm wondering whether anyone has asked any of her family or close friends what was her mood like before she traveled. Was she in a pretty stable state of mind? Was she somewhat depressed? Why did she visit her ex-boyfriend? Was she nostalgic or lonely?
Starting point is 00:15:42 So I wonder if that's been looked into and might that lead investigators to in addition to seeing if there are any suspects and so I consider whether she wandered
Starting point is 00:15:59 off and was not in a good space. Let's follow through what you're saying, Dr. Debbie, to its logical conclusion. Are you trying to say, did she commit suicide? I mean, just come out with it. Is that what you're saying? No, it's not what I'm saying. What are you saying? I'm just suggesting another area to consider. I don't have some notion this is what happened. But you're saying, what was her state of mind? Was she sad? Did she wander off in a bad frame of mind? So what's the logical conclusion to that question? What are you asking? I'm sorry, I look at everything as it is evidence.
Starting point is 00:16:38 Okay, so what is that helping me prove or disprove? Because I think you're onto something. What are you trying to tell me? In addition to looking for suspects, it might be worthwhile to see whether she acted in an irresponsible or reckless way. I don't say that as a criticism of her, but sometimes when people are depressed, they may or may not be suicidal but may not be mindful in what they do. So you brought up suicidal. Okay. You did. Yes, I did. So not mindful of what they do. Yeah. Okay. Let's try to decipher what she is saying. Oh, Nancy, this is Ashley. Can I jump
Starting point is 00:17:22 in really quick? Jump. I have to say, do you remember the runaway bride in Georgia? Oh, Nancy, this is Ashley. Can I jump in really quick? Jump. I have to say, do you remember the runaway bride in Georgia? Oh, dear Lord in heaven. Jennifer Wilbanks. How can I ever forget her? Exactly. So to me, that's a good example of what the doctor was just saying. Exactly. She disappeared and everyone's like, oh my gosh, something's happened to her. Well, guess what? She just chose to run away. Exactly. So Dr. Debbie Jaffe-Ellis, under an intense grilling by myself, has come up with two theories that I can identify. One is, was she depressed and suicidal? And the other, did she intend to do a, as I like to say, a walkabout
Starting point is 00:17:57 and just leave, just drop off the grid? It's possible. Take a listen now to our friend Rebecca Lopez. It's one of the most popular entertainment districts in Dallas. On the night of October 4th, Maricela Botello came here to Deep Ellum to hang out. And that's the last anyone has seen of her. Her mom, Esmestina Valadez, says every day that passes is very difficult. Maricela's family says she flew to Dallas from Seattle to visit her ex-boyfriend,
Starting point is 00:18:29 but she went to Deep Ellum alone, taking a Lyft ride. If she went to visit him, why did he let her go alone that night? That's the number one question I have. Police say her ex-boyfriend is not a suspect. Her family released a video they got from a bar on Elm Street. They say surveillance cameras outside captured Maricela with an unknown man. Dallas police have not verified the tape, but her family says it's her and the man is the key to helping find her. Who is this guy? crime stories with nancy grace
Starting point is 00:19:14 where is 23 year old maricela patello she's absolutely stunning, long, beautiful, dark hair, beautiful complexion. She looks like a model. The family putting pressure on the ex-boyfriend. Why did you let her go out by herself? She's a grown woman. She can go out if she wants to. Explain, Dave Mack, what happened? Nancy, I understand that, you know, saying, well, she's a grown woman, can do what she wants.
Starting point is 00:19:43 This is a young woman who likes to travel. She traveled to see her ex-boyfriend. And when he didn't want to go out, obviously, this is a woman that's got her own mind. She's got her own game plan here. And she said, I'm going out. He said, I don't want to. She goes anyway. This is a woman who hops on a plane to go see an ex-boyfriend for the weekend.
Starting point is 00:20:01 So probably not out of character for her to just go do something by herself. You know, we're acting like she has to have a chaperone, but reality check, this is 2020. You don't need a chaperone to go out to an arcade or throw back a drink on your own. I get it. I have preached to the choir a million times using cases, chief buyers like Natalie Holloway, who I personally think had been given GSB, gamma hydroxybutyrate, and GHB, excuse me. I don't think she realized the the critical nature of leaving a bar out of town with a guy she didn't know and ended up dead at the hands of Jorn Vandersloot. In this case, we know it's bad to leave a bar with somebody you don't know, but it happens every night of the year, Chris.
Starting point is 00:21:05 It does. And yeah, it's definitely something extremely dangerous, especially when you're in a town, when you're out of town and you don't, you know, aren't as familiar with your surroundings. You know, you're talking the FBI statistics say about 2,500 people go missing in the United States every day.
Starting point is 00:21:24 Every day, you know, you multiply that 365 Statistics say about 2,500 people go missing in the United States every day. Every day. You know, you multiply that 365, and there's a lot of nefarious things going on. So it is never wise to go out alone. I always have preached to my kids, my son when he went off to college, always have a buddy, always have somebody to go with, never walk alone. You know, also, I'm curious why, to you, Joe Scott Morgan, the family is the one getting the surveillance video from the arcade. Why is it them and not the police? I can tell you precisely why it is. You know, you have so many of these missing persons calls that come in, the police departments do.
Starting point is 00:22:12 They're not quick to react, particularly in a city the size of Dallas. You know, you can only imagine how many of these calls come in. And the classic line has been, well, they're an adult. We've already stated that they can make free will decisions. She's she's a grown woman. She can go off and do whatever she wants. That doesn't necessarily make this a missing person's case the way we might define it as a police department. So the family's left with no choice. They understand that she might be a very responsible person in this. She's acting outside of the norms. That's why, you know, you start to think about all these things, you know, as as an investigator, you think about things like, well, my God, did she go out and commit suicide? Did somebody snatch her? You know what?
Starting point is 00:22:53 She didn't just vanish into thin air. So the onus comes onto the shoulders. How many times have we heard this? You know, even with the Fort Hood cases, Nancy, how many times have we heard this, where it falls to the family to have to take the initiative with a case? Let's look at what we know. We also know that all of her belongings were still back at the ex-boyfriend's place. He says he simply did not want to go out that night. She wanted to go to Deep Ellum. It's a popular nightlife area there in Dallas. Everything was still there except for two things, her cell phone and her debit card. That tells me she was planning on coming back. Now to you, Joe Scott, what does that tell you? Yeah, it means that she's not planning
Starting point is 00:23:40 on, you know, leaving town anytime soon. She's going out for an evening. You know, it's like when we go out, you know, my wife and I go out for dinner. I don't pack a bag before I plan on coming back to my home. If we're on vacation somewhere, I'm coming back to get my stuff, all right? But we're just going to go out. I got my debit card with me. I got my phone with me.
Starting point is 00:24:02 We got the car keys. We're going to go out for a nice evening. So that tells us quite a bit, these things that she brought with her. And granted, she didn't bring her whole house with her from Seattle. These are things that she valued, okay? Because she brought them with her on a 2,000-mile journey to Dallas. So you would think the right-thinking person would think, well, she's going to go back and pick this stuff up before she bounces out of town. I'm looking at her right now. She's got, I would say, chest length, dark brown hair, very dark brown brown eyes. She has her hair up and kind of a bun that then it cascades down. She is wearing a shiny sleeveless purple top and it looks like a black skirt.
Starting point is 00:24:49 That's what she's wearing the night that she was last seen alive there in Dallas. She has with her her white cell phone and somewhere on her person is her debit card that she used as a debit credit card. Take a listen to Dave Mack. Maricela Botella went on a planned trip to Dallas on October 2nd to see an ex-boyfriend and was scheduled to return to Seattle, Washington Monday, October 5th. When she didn't arrive, her family started looking for her, and what they have found is this. Her family has a Lyft receipt showing she was dropped off on Elm Street just after midnight Monday morning, October 5th. She went to a bar called Select Start, and surveillance video captured her leaving the bar wearing a purple dress. According to Maricela's aunt, Danesli
Starting point is 00:25:35 Castillo, the surveillance video shows Maricela leaving with an unknown male, and it's time stamped at 1.15 a.m. Further, the aunt was able to get into her niece's T-Mobile account and determined that Botella used her phone at about 4 a.m. According to Castillo, there has been no activity on her cell phone or bank cards since then. You know, I'm curious to Joe Scott Morgan, professor of forensics, Jacksonville State University, if we know her last call. And by the way, she only stayed in the arcade for about one hour. Isn't that right, Jackie? About one hour. And from what I can see in the photo, it's a purple top and a black skirt. Check that out, Jackie, and see if you're seeing the same way I'm seeing it. Not a purple dress,
Starting point is 00:26:16 but back to the cell phone. If she used her cell phone at 4 a.m., is there some reason, Joe Scott Morgan, that we can't figure out who she called? I wouldn't think so, Nancy. If you can go back and you can pull those records provided by, you know, by the company as things are bouncing off the tower, they got to go somewhere. All right. So if you can pull that list of numbers, it would be pretty simple to kind of track that information down. And that's going to be a big key here. list of numbers, it would be pretty simple to kind of track that information down. And that's going to be a big key here. You know, who the hell are you going to call at that time of the morning or was somebody else calling it? And also you combine that information with,
Starting point is 00:26:56 say, for instance, where the phone was pinging at that particular time. You know, get that triangulated space in there. Try to find out where geographically the phone, not her, but the phone is located when it does ring. Okay, Jackie's telling me that is a shadow in the picture. It is one full dress, a purple dress. Now that you're saying that in another photo, I can see it's a dress. A solid purple, deep purple, kind of metallic looking dress. So we know her phone is still working at 4 a.m. I'm curious, do we know today, Mac, whether cops have continued to triangulate it after the night she went missing? Where was it used at 4 a.m.? Was it there near
Starting point is 00:27:41 the bar? We absolutely know nothing from the police with regard to that phone, Nancy. We got that information from the aunt, Danesli Castillo. She's the one who said she was able to access the phone and her Snapchat and other things. We're not getting that from the police. Take a listen to this. Maricela Botella's family tells Dateline that the 23-year-old went missing on the last night of her trip, Sunday, October 4th. Her aunt says because it was her last night in Dallas, Botella wanted to go out, but the ex-boyfriend wanted to stay home, so she went alone. Botella
Starting point is 00:28:15 didn't return to her ex-boyfriend's house that night. Worried, he called her parents. Her belongings, except for her cell phone and debit card, are still there. Botella's father and aunt flew to Dallas to file a missing persons report. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Guys, we're talking about the disappearance of a gorgeous young girl, Maricela Batelli, age 23. Tip line 214-671-4268. Repeat, 214-671-4268. Where is Maricela? Interesting. Straight out to Chris Byers, former police chief, Johns Creek, now PI. Chief Byers, the reality is, I believe if the ex-boyfriend had anything to do with Maricela's disappearance, he would not be calling her parents and raising the alarm
Starting point is 00:29:24 that she's missing. Yeah, I totally agree with that. And I'm sure investigators, he's the first person that they looked into. Just like if you get a call to a home of a missing child, the first thing you do is you search their bedroom and then you work your way out. Same thing with suspects. You find those closest to him who had contact and you begin to work your way out. But I would completely agree that it makes him sound like he is not a suspect. I'm very curious. I get the sense that this case is not a priority there with the Dallas PD.
Starting point is 00:29:57 And I don't know why we're finding out more from the family than we're finding out from police. I mean, if she's caught on video leaving the arcade after one hour with a guy that is not the boyfriend, then who's the guy? Can't we tell from credit card receipts or transactions or closed circuit TV inside the arcade who she was with, who she struck up a conversation with. Can't we get an idea of how tall he is, how much he weighs, what color he is, what color his hair is, what he was wearing? I mean, Joe Scott Morgan, it's not rocket science. Okay. For instance, if Jackie were walking out the studio door right now and I took a picture of it. I could then measure the door and figure out exactly how tall, exactly how tall Jackie is. I could then figure out how much she weighed. I could see what color she is, what color her hair is. There's got to be cameras inside that arcade. Why aren't we hearing about who this guy is well you're absolutely right however
Starting point is 00:31:07 i gotta say nancy i don't put a lot of faith in cctv footage particularly when it comes to being inside of a bar all right it you know we talked about dave and busters or places like that earlier yeah you got tv screens that are up and you've got ambient light that's coming off. But for the most part, there's a lot of dark areas in there. So it's really hard to pick up on specific details. However, you know what? I'm not liking what you're saying. I don't like it because think about the case of Savannah Spurlock.
Starting point is 00:31:41 Remember, she walked out and we see the perp. Think about, wrong way, Lois Reese. She was spotted in many establishments on surveillance video at darkened bars as you were saying. And I could clearly see her sitting at a bar chatting
Starting point is 00:32:00 up her next victim, a doppelganger that looks a lot like her, Lois Reese. Yeah, it's not perfect. It's not at, you know, a portrait studio, but I can see if the person is white, black. Maybe I can tell more about them based on where they're standing or sitting. I can tell how tall they are. I can tell if it's a man or a woman. I can tell what color their hair is, what generally they're wearing. Come on. Why are you why are you whipping out on me, J. Scott Morgan?
Starting point is 00:32:30 Well, you know, I'm trying to give you somebody to beat up on here today, Nancy. Yeah, you. I got to tell you. Don't you remember that surveillance video of top mom Casey Anthony buying the push up bras and the beer while her child was missing? That was great surveillance video. Plus, she used a forged check. Well, yeah, and you can tie those things back together. And wouldn't it be interesting that if you had a timestamp on this CCTV footage,
Starting point is 00:32:58 if there was, you could look back to all of, say, for instance, the transactions, electronic transactions that took place in that bar at that specific time. You know, we're handing over your card, you're using it, and you can kind of pair those up. Now, back to the physical description, you know, you can come up with maybe a generalized description of the individuals if the footage is not good. You can do height. You can even do like width of shoulders.
Starting point is 00:33:24 You know, you can talk about hair color. Okay, now you're telling me something. Don't make me hold you in contempt, Joseph Scott Morgan. You know it's serious when I say Joseph. You're right. You can tell width of shoulders. You know the truth. You can tell shoe size. You certainly can. Yes, you can. Go ahead. Yeah, by the relative space of everything else. Let's say, for instance, that we have a marker, for instance, like a bar stool. Well, we know what type of bar stool that is, and we can look at that and we understand the width between the legs. Say, for instance, if the tube in this instance is immediately adjacent to that, you
Starting point is 00:34:01 can do kind of a compare and contrast here. What, what's going to put us in the ballpark? And so, yeah, that's quite possible. And this goes back to this practice within forensics. It's called biometrics. You know, you hear about it relative to the face, where you can pull these dimensions off, and it's very specific. But you can also biometrically evaluate an individual by these dimensions of their body, arm length, shoulder width, even waist size to a certain degree.
Starting point is 00:34:32 Take a listen to this. During the search for Maricela Botella, the family has been able to access her email, social media, and bank accounts. They discovered a Lyft receipt showing she was dropped off on Elm Street in the Deep Ellum area just after midnight on Monday, October 5th. Her aunt, Danesli Castillo, says security video from outside the Select Start bar shows an unknown man who they believe to be the person Botella left the bar with at 1.15 a.m. Botella's camera roll and Snapchat account have pictures of her wearing a purple dress, the same dress seen in the surveillance video. Did he buy her a drink? Did he slip GHB in the drink? What many people
Starting point is 00:35:14 think happened to, for instance, Natalie Holloway. Justice Scott Morgan, what does gamma hydroxybutyrate do to your system? There's something that we refer to as a hypnotic, Nancy. It can actually drive your system down and your awareness of your surroundings so that the individual almost becomes in a zombie-like condition. They're easily, easily manipulated. You can guide them around almost like a small child. Some people, and in many cases, find themselves losing total consciousness, but they still have an awareness. There are any number of stories out there where these poor women that are applied with this drug will kind of have this moment where they come to and they realize, can you imagine this, where they realize they're actually being sexually assaulted and there's nothing they can do about it.
Starting point is 00:36:04 It's almost like their limbs are frozen. It almost works like a sedative that would be applied to somebody prior to surgery. You know, when you're ramping up into anesthesia. You know, what you're saying reminds me of what many of Bill Cosby's victims said, how they felt after he had given them a Quaalude. Do you remember that, Joe Scott? Yes, I do, Nancy. And it works much the same way, only now with this generation of drugs, you know, you commonly hear it referred to as Rehoboanol. It's much more fast acting. And keep
Starting point is 00:36:39 this in mind, it's odorless, it's colorless, and it can be applied in liquid. So if you take this and you just put the smallest dropper amount into a drink, so you're just kind of cruising up beside her at the bar, you drop this into her drink that she's sipping on, she's not going to have an awareness that this thing is going to hit her. But the individual that's using this is practiced at it, Nancy. They're practiced at it. So they can actually almost predict what is going to happen in this short period of time. Now they've got their arm around
Starting point is 00:37:10 her. Almost it looks like they're in an intimate setting together because the person's not fighting that, you know, that he's embracing at that moment, Tom. And you can literally walk them out the door. To Dr. Debbie Jaffe-Ella, psychologist, professor at Columbia University, Dr. Debbie, there's also the possibility that this guy was charming and she felt safe leaving with him. That is a great possibility. You know, people who have psychopathic tendencies can be incredibly charming. And if someone there is in a state of, I want to have fun, they're not going to think things through or necessarily be suspicious. They're charmed. So yeah, that is a likelihood.
Starting point is 00:37:56 And the reality is she is a young girl. She's just 23 years old, out in a strange city, not her home, although she's traveled a lot. Yeah, you know, George Bernard Shaw once wrote, youth is wasted on the young. And I know when I was young, you know, you can tend to feel invincible. You don't think ahead of what might happen. You know, true words were never spoken, Dr.. Dr. Debbie Jaffe Ellis, and I'm thinking about her all dressed up in her cute little purple dress that night, going
Starting point is 00:38:30 out to see the town. Where is this girl, Maricela Botello? Tip line, 214- 671-4268. We wait as justice unfolds. Nancy Grace, Crime Story, signing off. Goodbye, friend.
Starting point is 00:38:52 This is an iHeart Podcast.

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