Crime Stories with Nancy Grace - Cheerleader, 13, stabbed 114 times: NEW EVIDENCE

Episode Date: October 1, 2021

Surveillance photos show the mother of teen murder suspect Aiden Fucci washing his clothes the day Tristyn Bailey was murdered. Crystal Smith was arrested and charged with tampering with evidence in connection to the 18-year-old's death. Fucci, 14, has been charged with Bailey’s Mother’s Day murder. Investigators believe he stabbed Bailey 114 times. The former classmates had grown up in the same neighborhood but it does not appear that Fucci targeted Bailey specifically, though friends later said Fucci claimed he would kill someone in the near future. Surveillance video appears to show the pair walking together early the morning of May 9. Fucci is later seen running, alone, from the same area.Joining Nancy Grace today: Troy Slaten - Los Angeles Criminal Defense Attorney, Slaten Lawyers, APC, Twitter @TroySlaten Dr. Bethany Marshall - Psychoanalyst, www.drbethanymarshall.com, New Netflix show: 'Bling Empire' Dr. Tim Gallagher - Medical Examiner State of Florida www.pathcaremed.com, Lecturer: University of Florida Medical School Forensic Medicine. Founder/Host: International Forensic Medicine Death Investigation Conference Karen L. Smith - Forensic Expert, Lecturer at the University of Florida, Host of Shattered Souls Podcast, @KarensForensic, barebonesforensic.com Ray Caputo - Lead News Anchor for Orlando's Morning News, 96.5 WDBO Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an iHeart Podcast. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. A 13-year-old cheerleader's body found stabbed over 100 times. In the last hours, a bombshell. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. How did it all start? Listen. Tristan Bailey was reported missing by her family on Sunday morning. Hours later, her body was found in a wooded area near her neighborhood. The medical examiner says she was stabbed to death.

Later that day, a jogger in the neighborhood found a young girl's body bloody in the neighborhood's woods. The medical examiner's report released Wednesday indicates Bailey had been stabbed 114 times and had defensive wounds. That report also revealed the suspected weapon, a knife, was found in a pond only 140 feet from the body. The knife missing its tip. The tip found in Tristan's skull. The knife so violently used to murder this little cheerleader, just 13 years old. The tip of the knife is still embedded in her scalp and skull. Oh yeah, somebody is going to jail. Bombshell evidence has emerged. Guys, you were just listening to our friend Jennifer Reddy at First Coast and WJXT News for Jax. Let me introduce you an all-star panel joining us. First of all, you know him well, a veteran defense attorney, Troy Slayton, joining us out of L.A.

Slayton Lawyers. Dr. Bethany Marshall, psychoanalyst to the stars, joining us out of Hollywood. You can find her at drbethanymarshall.com. Star of a brand-new series on Netflix, Bling Empire. Dr. Tim Gallagher, the medical examiner for the entire state of Florida at PathCareMed.com. Senior lecturer, University of Florida Med School in Forensic Medicine. And the host of the International Forensic Medicine Death Investigation Conference. I bet that's a good time.

Karen Nilsmith joining me, forensics expert, lecturer at University of Florida and host of Shattered Souls podcast. But first, to Ray Caputo, lead news anchor, Orlando Morning News at WDBO. Ray Caputo, before you say a word, listen to this. Surveillance video spotted what appears to be Tristan Bailey walking north from the amenity center at 1.14 a.m. 31 minutes later, two people are seen walking east along Sallastone Drive at 1.45 a.m. One is wearing shorts, a hoodie, and white shoes with a black Nike logo.

The other wearing black pants and a black shirt. That same camera then capturing one person walking back west wearing shorts, a hoodie, and this time carrying white shoes with the black Nike logo. That was around 3.27 a.m., one hour, 42 minutes later. Police found clothing with blood on it. This video at 12.15 a.m. on May 9th shows two people believed to be teens walking east on Saddlestone Drive. As to whether or not that is Aiden Fucci and Tristan Bailey in this video, that is not confirmed. This was on Mother's Day, the same day investigators say Tristan Bailey was found dead.

The St. Johns County Sheriff's Office investigators say this video shows Fucci running at 152 in the morning, so over an hour after two teens were spotted walking in the neighborhood. Guys, you're hearing our friends at First Coast News and WJXT News Jax. You know, the shadowy images caught on surveillance video shows the 13-year-old cheerleader, Tristan Bailey, walking with another person. Then later you see a young boy, Aiden Fucci, age 14, running. And you also see someone matching the same outfit, carrying a pair of white Nike shoes. First of all, Ray Caputo, again, thank you for being with us, WDBO. Where is 13-year-old Tristan Bailey that evening? Where had she been? Well, she was hanging out in her neighborhood in

Durban Crossing, Nancy. That's in St. John's Gorge, just south of Jacksonville. It's an upper middle-class neighborhood, and it was late at night before any of this happened. But if you're wondering why a 13-year-old girl would be out late at night on a Saturday night, it was just that type of neighborhood. It was tree lines, surveillance cameras everywhere. I mean, people didn't anticipate problems there. It was in St. John's, Florida, a beautiful place where a lot of people were moving these days. I understand, Ray Caputo, that there was like a community center where they had been.

Do you recall that, Jackie? All the teens. And we had one of those, believe it or not, out in the middle of nowhere. And when I was little, it seemed so big. Now I drive by it, I think, I can't believe that was the huge community center. It's very small when I look at it now. But we would have bands in there and dance and play games and just all sorts of fun. Have Halloween carnivals inside, bobbing for apples, and everybody would go there. And it's my understanding that Tristan had been to a community center event

with a whole neighborhood and a lot of kids coming in and out that night. This shadowy surveillance video we're seeing, where are those cameras, Ray Caputo? Well, the surveillance video cameras you're seeing are actually doorbell cameras, I believe, are ones that are attached to homes. So they're on these homes on Saddlestone Court. So you're seeing, you know, somebody's looking out their window. That's what they may have seen at that time of night in the one o'clock hour. So how in the world does a teen boy's mother get tied into all of this? You've got a little cheerleader, age 13, stabbed about 114 times to the tip of a knife in her skull.

Now you've got an unrelated teen boy's mother charged. Why? Jackie, please play the new sound. We received a series of videos late this afternoon, including those from inside Poochie's Durban Crossing home, which show what detectives say is Poochie's mom washing blood off of his jeans. On your sides, Robert Bradfield is live tonight in the newsroom looking through that video as prosecutors build a first-degree murder case against the St. Johns County teenager. Robert. Good evening. That video inside Fucci's home is about 16 minutes long,

but we're going to show you just the first part, which shows his mother, Crystal Smith, walking into an upstairs bathroom. And that is where the state's attorney says Smith is seen cleaning her son's bloody jeans. which shows his mother, Crystal Smith, walking into an upstairs bathroom. And that is where the state's attorney says Smith is seen cleaning her son's bloody jeans. When officers went into the home, they found a pair of wet jeans in Fucci's bedroom. And as we reported earlier this summer, the jeans and a drain in a bathroom tested positive for blood. Smith was arrested in June. She is charged with evidence tampering. Now, other video released today shows who detectives believe are Fucci and Bailey walking in their neighborhood on the morning of May 9th, the last time Bailey was seen alive.

Okay, Troy Slayton, veteran defense attorney. If mommy had just thrown a lot of clothes into the wash, that would have been one thing because I've actually thrown a shoe, a cell phone, a coat hanger into the washing machine with no idea what I was doing. Okay. Just like Jodi Arias, when she threw her digicam in there with accidental photos of the murder scene. I could get that. It's an accident. But for mommy to pick up her son's blue jeans and then go in the bathroom and wash the blood out by hand. Good luck, Slayton. Well, I know Nancy, when I was a kid and I'd play some soccer and I'd roll on my knees on the soccer field, and big green stains would be down my pants,

those wouldn't just come out in the normal wash. And my mom, God bless her, would scrub those things to get those stains out. So maybe she was just acting like a good mom, saw some really dirty jeans, thinking that wouldn't come out in the regular wash, and scrubbed them to make sure they got the stain out. What we don't know is that the mother knew that this was blood from a potential crime scene and was intentionally trying to destroy evidence. That's what we don't know. How can I slice up everything he just said?

Jackie, could you play that new sound one more time? We received a series of videos late this afternoon, including those from inside Pucci's Durban Crossing home, which show what detectives say is Pucci's mom washing blood off of his jeans. On your sides, Robert Bradfield is live tonight in the newsroom looking through that video as prosecutors build a first-degree murder case against the St. Johns County teenager. Robert. Oh, good evening. That video inside Fucci's home is about 16 minutes long,

but we're going to show you just the first part, which shows his mother, Crystal Smith, walking into an upstairs bathroom. And that is where the state's attorney says Smith is seen cleaning her son's bloody jeans. When officers went into the home, they found a pair of wet jeans in Fucci's bedroom. And as we reported earlier this summer, the jeans and a drain in a bathroom tested positive for blood. Smith was arrested in June. She is charged with evidence tampering. crime stories with nancy grace let's think about what we just heard to dr bethany marshall psycho and was joining us star of netflix bleeding empire dr bethany i'd really like to see the timestamp when mommy is cleaning the jeans in the bathroom.

There's no doubt she knew it was blood. Because there's still blood in the drain. And it's Tristan Bailey's blood, the cheerleader's blood. So she knew it was blood. She knew he hadn't been out playing soccer the night before. But Slayton has a valid point. But if she was doing that at, say, three o'clock in the morning, that's extremely surreptitious, Bethany. Nancy, let's look at it this way. This is not the first time mommy has tried to cover up bad acts

that her son, Fucci, has undertaken. You know, mothers know their sons. You know your son, you know your daughter, you know their character, you know what they're capable of. Bethany, Bethany, I know what class he's in right now and which class Lucy's in right now. You darn right. Go ahead. You know whether or not they've done their homework, you know who their friends are, you know whether or not to let them have sleepovers at certain people's houses. He is a young tween. He's barely a teenager.

He's out at this community center until I think it's 3.40 in the morning. Mommy has to be aware that he has a girlfriend, this cute cheerleader. She has to have been worried about this all along because all parents worry about their children's first dating relationships. And she has to know that her son is just a little bit strange. Okay? So I don't think it's a good thing that mother is watching blood off of her son's jeans. What she should be doing if she's a good mom is sitting down with him and saying, where did this blood come from? What were you doing out till 3.40 in the morning? What was going on at that community center? She should be parenting him, not covering up for him.

You know, another issue I'm going to throw to you, then I'll circle back to Karen Smith and Dr. Tim Gallagher. Dr. Bethany, let me go to Ray Caputo first, lead anchor for WDBO there in Florida. I also learned that according to documents that we have just gotten our hands on, one of Aiden Fucci, age 14, female friends, tells police he frequently talked about killing people, that he would take his knife out and pretend to stab her with it, and that he would draw graphic pictures of depicting mutilated bodies. You forgot to mention that, Reagan Muto. Yeah, well, you know, some people like their guns, Nancy.

This kid liked knives. One of his friends even said that he had a nickname for his knives. He called them Picker and Poker. Whoa, whoa, whoa. Stop. Stop. Yeah. Drinking from the fire hydrant.

Too much, too fast. I got to write that down. He named his knives. Yes, ma'am. Picker and Poker. Are you saying Picker and Poker? Okay. I'm sure we'll need to bring the shrink in on that.

Go ahead. Named his knives Picker and Poker. Did you know to bring the shrink in on that. Go ahead. Name his knives, picker and poker. Did you know that? I didn't know that. Go ahead. Yeah. Well, I mean, this kid liked his knife. They found many more in his home too. Aiden Pucci clearly had a thing for sharp objects, Nancy. He talked about killing people. He collected knives. I mean, talk about the writing being on the wall. You know what? It is just so ironic that when we throw around the phrase, the writing is on the wall, that actually came from the Old Testament. And now it's being used rightfully so, Ray Caputo, in the gruesome murder of a 13-year-old little girl.

Just thinking, you know, my little girl is 13. Lucy and John David are both 13 years old. This little girl was stabbed 114 times with a knife tip still in her skull. Ray Caputo, WDBO, that's not all that was found in the home of the bloody clothes. I understand that the cops recovered a notebook filled with violent drawings of women, including a woman with red X's on her breasts and severed arms with blood pouring out. Oh, that's correct, Nancy. I mean, this kid had some really disturbing things

going through his head. And it makes you wonder, getting back to the mom, why she was so interested in helping him out after he got in trouble. But again, how can you not notice that this is your child and all these things are going on in their lives? He had the knives, he had the drawings, he was even telling people about what he did or what he was going to do. He was clearly a disturbed young man who needed help, and he was crying out for quite a bit of time. But those cries didn't go answered. Ray Caputo, I hardly think that naming your knives picker and poker and drawing mutilated women and keeping the drawings in your room. I would call that the devil, evil, hate, misogyny. And I think he knew exactly what he was doing. I really don't know which way to go, but thankfully I've got a panel of experts.

Dr. Bethany, do not start up second verse, same as the first, with he's insane. If he were insane, he would not know to run away and lie. Well, thank God, Nancy, sociopathy, which this young man surely suffers from, is a personality disorder, not a psychiatric disorder, meaning that it affects, it's an affliction of the mind, not the brain. So certainly he knew right from wrong. Nancy, this is a budding serial killer in the making. You know, the love for the knives, picker and poker, the drawing of the woman with the red X's on her breasts, the severed arms. This guy got, this young man derived great thrill and satisfaction from thinking about stabbing and dismembering.

And, you know, mothers fall into two categories when it comes to having a child like this. The first category is a mother who knows there's a problem and seeks help, gets a psychiatrist and a psychologist, gets social services, and wants to help their son have a better life. And the second category we see all too often is the mother who aids and abets the child, covers up, looks the other way, will do anything to save the child, even if it means that there are other victims out there in society. And surely, surely this mother falls into the second category with washing the blood off her son's jeans. This mother knew what was happening, Nancy. She saw this all unfolding for a long, long time. Why does she even let him out in the community past midnight? To Dr. Tim Gallagher, medical examiner for the state of Florida, this occurred in Florida, St. John's County. Dr. Gallagher, would you explain what happened to this 13-year-old

little girl? Because we're talking a lot about what may or may not be going through the mind of her killer. But what about her? What happened to her? Well, first of all, I want to mention that Dr. Bulek in St. John's County, which is District 23 in Florida, is probably one of the most intelligent physicians that we have in the state. He is Yale educated and trained in Fort Lauderdale. Wonderful, wonderful man. But going, getting back to her. What was his name? Bulek, B-U-L-E-K.

Okay, go ahead. So you've got a great, you've got a great doctor on the case. Go ahead. Wonderful, wonderful man. I can't say enough about him, but getting back to her, you know, so initially, you know, there was the surprise of the stabbing. I'm sure there was an argument leading up to it. But when the... I don't know about that. I don't know about that, Dr. Gallagher, because this was not boyfriend, girlfriend. They were just, just you know in the same grade they knew each other uh there was no romantic interest like they had an argument so i don't know if if there was an argument or if he led her out there in order to kill her i mean he had a knife with him but that said go ahead right but you can see there was a struggle. She had defensive wounds on her forearms.

And what defensive wounds are is she was actually holding up her arms to defend herself against the knife. And he was slashing at her arms on her forearms. I've got to tell you something, doctor. I just saw out of the corner of my eye. I wanted to do it myself as you were talking. But Jackie here, as you were saying, held her hands up like that. How many times have I done that in front of a jury? When you say defensive wounds, trying to cover your face or your body.

And this little 13-year-old girl, as Dr. Tim Gallagher is telling us, was covered in defensive wounds, trying to save her life. Right. So she was conscious and aware of what was going on at that point. She knew at that point she was fending for her life, but eventually she became overpowered. And these stab wounds to her head, oftentimes, if the knife is sufficient, will penetrate through the skull and into the brain. And we see that could have been the case here when a tip of the knife broke off and lodged itself into the skull. So she may have died from the brain injury, or she may have had other stab wounds on her chest organs, that being the heart

and the lungs. Either way, it was a very protracted assault and had gone on for at least a minute or two. Dr. Tim Gallagher, have you ever seen a case where there were over 100 stab wounds like this? Unfortunately, that's more common than a single stab wound. This is something that we like to call overkill, where there is an emotion involved or emotions are involved in the homicide. The person gets absolutely worked up and just loses track of how many times they're stabbing them or the frustration of the release of stabbing this person is pleasurable to the assailant. And that we find that more often than not, there are more than 50 words. I'm trying to take in everything you're saying, Dr. Gallagher, because frankly, when anybody on this panel speaks, sometimes I have to get them to repeat it. I'm just a trial lawyer, and your thoughts are actually very in, believes, and you may think this is outside of his province, that he's talking about mental, emotional, sexual gratification of a defendant. But when you've seen thousands of homicides, you begin to statistically analyze what you see.

And I think he's right, whether it was a sexual release or you have a goal. And when you achieve that goal, you feel proud, you feel proud? Do you feel satisfied? Maybe it was that type of feeling he got from this brutal murder. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Karen L. Smith joining me, forensics expert, lecturer, and host of Shattered Souls podcast. You've seen so many homicides as well. Agree or disagree? And why? I do. I've seen it.

Unfortunately, just like Dr. Gallagher said, it does happen. Whether or not it's a rage or like you said, a sexual release, whatever the motivation is, multiple stabbings are more common than a single stabbing. And Nancy, there's something that I need to talk about regarding not only what Tori Slayton said, but what everybody else has been saying about these, these genes, mommy can try to clean them all she wants, but they tested positive for blood. And that tells me they did a simple color test. After a visual inspection, the blood was still on those pants.

Now, if the blood was still on the pants, there's a possibility that patterns can still be discerned even after they've been cleaned. If that blood was allowed to dry on the fabric first and if there were small blood droplets on those jeans that put the wearer which would be Aiden Cucci in close proximity to the victim time the crime was committed it is absolute 100 proof that he was there that the blood broke up into droplets while he was there. It can also help position him over the victim. His DNA was found on her body, which means he probably injured

himself since he used the knife. That's very common as well. So I just want to commend the St. John's County Sheriff's Office for their wonderful work on this. They really did a great job processing this, plus finding the weapon as well. Guys, there's more. Take a listen to Hour Cut 25. This is Heather Crawford, First Coast News. So let's talk more about these new documents. They are also shedding light on the night Aiden Fucci and his parents were inside of an interrogation room after Tristan Bailey's body was discovered. Aiden's parents questioned him with no detectives in the room, but the audio and video devices they were rolling.

According to the report, his mother told him that Bailey was found in their neighborhood. The report says Aiden then asked, is she good? The mother's response, no, she's dead. It's all on you right now. The report says Aiden asked, how is it my problem? They reportedly said because he was the last one seen with her. The report also says the mother asked where Bailey went after they parted. And Gucci stated that she probably kept walking.

His father asked, according to the report, he didn't turn around to see where she went. And he replied, no. Now, according to the report, Aiden's parents told him to find his story and stick to it. He was arrested at 3.30 the next morning. His mother, Crystal Smith, would later be arrested, accused of tampering with evidence in this case. Troy Slayton joining me, L.A. veteran criminal defense attorney, Slayton Lawyers, APC, Troy. So the recording devices are still rolling. And this Aiden Fucci, age 14, says, how's it my problem when they tell him Tristan is found dead?

So firstly, there is no parent-child confidentiality privilege known to the law. So although they may have thought that they were speaking privately, the parents and the child suspect, the police were perfectly in their right to be recording inside that police interrogation room. And so anything that he said to his mom and dad can be used against him. And even though he would say to his parents, and he's probably experienced in deflecting his parents off of things that he's done wrong over his past 14 years, that doesn't protect him in this case. I want to get your thinking, Dr. Bethany Marshall, of what you have heard that audio recording that we've gotten of the parents talking to 14-year-old Aiden Fucci. Well, I think this is not their first rodeo. I think he's done all kinds of things that they have aided and vetted in covering up. Maybe not a homicide. Maybe this is the first catastrophic violation of the law he's done. But I'm sure there's been lesser infractions. I'm sure he has tortured animals,

gotten bad grades, hit people, poked at people, maybe stabbed people, even in a non-homicidal way, but in a threatening way. So these parents are well-skilled and well-schooled in covering up for their child. And Troy Slayton said something I think is so fascinating, and we see this with parents, is that from the time our children are born, they teach us how to accommodate to them. They teach us how to cover up. They also teach us that we can't look past their flaws and we have to take the hard road of reprimanding them and punishing them and disciplining them to make them better human beings. And if this young man was born as a sociopath, he really needed his parents to discipline him and to try to override

those tendencies. And apparently he just never got the memo. Well, Dr. Bethany, I want you to hear something. And that is how this guy, Aiden Fucci, behaved in the cop car. Take a listen to our cut 27, our friends at Action News Jacksonville. New Snapchat videos show Fucci in the back of the cop car before he was a suspect. Having fun in a cop car. Tristan. What's up, guys? Tristan, if you walk out when you see this in a month. Another video from inside Fucci's home appears to show his mother cleaning the jeans. Police say Aiden wore the night of the murder she's been charged for

tampering with evidence to those jeans investigators say both the jeans and the sink she washed them in tested positive for blood not only that in that cop car he made a statement having fun in an effing cop car hey anybody seen tristan says that the car, but that is not the end. In my mind, that shows he knew what was happening. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. What I'm saying, Troy Slayton, is that this guy is in the back of the car mocking everything and everybody. I'm having fun in an effing cop car. And then he makes some comment like, hey, anybody seen Tristan?

She's dead. Why did he say that? As a matter of fact, anybody seen Tristan? She's dead. Why did he say that? As a matter of fact, listen to our cut 27 one more time. New Snapchat videos show Fucci in the back of the cop car before he was a suspect. Having fun in a cop car. Yep. Tristan. What's up, guys? Tristan, if you walk out, when you see this in a month.

Another video from inside Fucci's home appears to show his mother cleaning the jeans. Police say Aiden wore the night of the murder. She's been charged for tampering with evidence to those jeans. Investigators say both the jeans and the sink. She washed them in tested positive for blood. I mean, it is argued amongst many legal eagles, Troy Slayton, that his

sick selfie in a cop car shows that he's actually proud of murdering cheerleader Tristan Bailey. To me, Nancy, it shows the elements of not guilty by reason of insanity, which in Florida uses the McNaughton rule. If I were to use the evidence from the medical examiner on this show and the testimony of Dr. Bethany Marshall from this show, we clearly establish by clear and convincing evidence that he was not guilty by reason of insanity at the time that he committed this act. Well, I couldn't disagree more because here he is in a cop car saying, hey guys, has anybody seen Tristan lately? Shooting a peace sign, having fun in a cop car, being a snarky brat.

That's what's happening. Dabbing somebody 114 times, running from the crime scene, throwing a knife into the water, and then- Why do you think he threw the knife in the water, Troy? So nobody could find it. Why is that? Because it's a murder weapon with his blood on it. But brings the sheath home. But comes home and just throws his bloody- He threw away the murder weapon with his blood on it. But brings the sheath home. But comes home and just

throws his bloody... He threw away the murder weapon. Am I the only one on this panel that believes that shows evidence of guilt? I mean, somebody jump in for Pete's sake. Nancy, he knew what he was doing and

mocking Tristan from the police car is the same M.O. as the murder. We were talking about it earlier in the show that he wanted to triumph over her, control her. He likely got sexual satisfaction from killing her. I doubt this was a frustrated rage. I think he was romancing the idea of killing somebody for a long, long time. I think his family knew that. I think it family knew that.

I think it was sexually exciting to him. That's why he had the red crosses over the woman's breasts and her arms severed. You know, he's going to disable her so he can rape her. That's what that picture is all about. Well, you know, that's what we call, Troy, we call malingering. It's when you make up a fictitious illness to look ill when you're not. I've got more for you guys that bears on state of mind. Take a listen to Our Cut 26. This is Dani Bozzini, Action News Jax.

New evidence giving us a glimpse into the moments before and after beloved 13-year-old Tristan Bailey was brutally murdered. Police say in this video, Tristan is walking with her accused killer, 14-year-old Aiden Fucci, just after midnight Sunday, May 9th, Mother's Day. 90 minutes later, another surveillance video shows Fucci running in the opposite direction with what appears to be his shoes in hand. The state attorney's office releasing another clip time stamped at 3.30 a.m. that same morning. You can see Fucci walking up to his home, heading to the front door and going inside. Fucci initially told investigators that he left a friend's house with Tristan and they

walked together until she turned onto her street. That story changed a few more times. Okay, let me capsulize this. Karen Smith, we've got him running from the scene, carrying his shoes that were likely bloody, throwing away the murder weapon, slowing down when he gets to his own home, walking in, changing his story multiple times, and continuing to lie about it. To me, all of that shows he knew what he did was wrong. And that is, as Troy Slayton throws around the technical term, the McNaughton test, it's very simple. Did you know right from wrong at the time of the incident?

It shows me evidence of guilt, hiding, running, destroying evidence. That's right. And guess what? Found, found, found. Knife was found 140 feet away. The shoes were found in his room, likely bloody. That's why he was carrying them. They found his jeans. They found his clothes. They found her DNA all over it. They found blood patterns. They found his DNA on her body. They found the tip of the knife embedded in her skull. This is an open and shut case in my mind. Now, it's up to you lawyers to battle out whether or not he was quote unquote insane. But to me, every single step, every single thing that has been seen in the forensics of this case shows me that he had a premeditated, murderous mind,

and he knew what he did was wrong. He's running from the crime scene with evidence in his hand. To me, that's an open and shut case, Nancy. Dr. Tim Gallagher, joining me out of Florida, a medical examiner. Dr. Gallagher, so he throws the murder weapon into a body of water. How can they still get both his and her DNA off the murder weapon? Well, that's a really good question. You know, water does tend to degrade DNA. So if they recovered it very quickly, then it would certainly be possible, especially if not only blood was on it, but the flesh of the victim and flesh of the assailant was on there, then DNA could be recovered from that quickly.

Yeah, Nancy, I have to jump in here. There was another case out of Jacksonville, the Cherish Periwinkle case, where one of my coworkers recovered an entire full 13 loci profile from Cherish Periwinkle's neck after she was submerged in water. So it is absolutely possible to find both sets of DNA on that murder weapon. I was just thinking about Cherish last night. As a matter of fact, Karen, she was a little girl that was led out of one of those super stores where the sex predator who murdered her. Well, we see where the defense is headed. I mean, demons, really? Couldn't you just surprise us once? I mean, ever since Flip

Wilson, the TV star, said the devil made me do it. I mean, here we go with the demons. Take a listen to new footage we've obtained of this young man, Aiden Fucci, at his first court appearance. And yes, demons also appear. Take a listen to our friends at 4 News Jax. I don't know you demons, take my soul. I don't know you demons, take my soul. What's going on? I don't know you demons. Demons take my soul, blah, blah. I guess he's going to be a co-defendant with Bill Zibub.

We wait as justice unfolds. Nancy Grace, Crime Story, signing off. Goodbye, friend.