Crime Stories with Nancy Grace - CLASH OF TITANS NANOS-PATEL COSTS NANCY GUTHRIE'S LIFE?

Episode Date: May 7, 2026

Savannah Guthrie's mother, Nancy Guthrie, missing now more than three months. Clashes between FBI director Cash Patel and Pima Sheriff Chris Nanos has seemingly torpedoed the search for Nancy. The search continues as we learn a vast area near Nancy's home is unsearched and why have investigators shifted, now searching for a gray van.    Joining Nancy Grace today:  Caryn Stark -  Forensic Psychologist,  www.carynstark.com, Instagram: carynpsych, FB: Caryn Stark Private Practice  Brian Fitzgibbons  -  Director of Operations for USPA Nationwide Security, website: www.uspasecurity.com, Instagram: @uspa_nationwide_security Joseph Scott Morgan -  Professor of Forensics: Jacksonville State University, Author, "Blood Beneath My Feet", Host: "Body Bags with Joseph Scott Morgan", Instagram @JoScottForensic,  Allison Weiner   - Senior Reporter, NewsNation and Author: "Murder in the Media".    Dave Mack -  Investigative Reporter, 'Crime Stories' See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Guaranteed human. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Savannah Guthrie's mother, Nancy Guthrie, missing tonight? Clash of the Titans, a war between the gods. The FBI director, Cash Patel versus Pima Sheriff Nanos. How badly has Nanos torpedoed the search for Nancy as we discover a vast area, Near Nancy's home, unsearched.

Why? Sources reporting investigators shifting the hunt to a gray van. Why? And will solar-powered cams reveal more video? I'm Nancy Grace. This is crime stories. I want to thank you for being with us. Stalkers cannot help but write about their relationship with the victim and the victim's families.

This perpetrator had gleaned a lot. lot about Nancy Guthrie's life. The perp likely has a criminal history. I got frustrated because I knew from my sources, they were trying to keep you guys out. They did. They did keep you out. And look, here's, here's all this matter is in an investigation. The first 48 hours of anyone's disappearance are the most critical. And here's how these cases works. It is a state matter. It's a state and local law enforcement matter. What we the FBI do is say, hey, we're here to help. What do you need? What can we do. And for four days, we were kept out of the investigation. And when we were finally let in, Sean, look what we did. We went in and got the ring doorbell. And we said, hey, is anyone talking to

Google? I called the leadership at Google and I said, look, we know that there was not a subscription service to capture all of the data that would have been captured had there been a subscription service. But can we go into the cache? Can we go into the data before it's deleted and see what we can find? that's why you have that image because the FBI worked with Google to put that image out. Another thing we asked to do. You guys got that tape, which was the biggest breakthrough during that case. We could have gotten it days before. Now, the Piva County Sheriff today responded to Cash's comments on our podcast saying the Sheriff's Department did immediately start coordinating with the Bureau.

Not buying it. Nice try. That from our friend Sean Hannity at Fox News and on his podcast hanging out with. with Sean Hannity, where he has an incredible interview with Cash Patel. And I learned a lot. Straight out to Alison Weiner, joining us, senior investigative reporter, author of a brand new book, Murder in the Media. Hey, New York Control Room. Let's see that book, Murder in the Media. That's going to be a bestseller.

Alison, thank you for being with us. I want to follow up on what Cash Patel was saying. It's stunning. We also learn he has a plane on standby, but let's take one thing at a time. What do you make of it? I'm not buying it either. We were there. I was there with Brian Anton and we were in Arizona in Tucson for almost two months.

And in the early days of that investigation, there was no FBI. He had that scene with just the sheriffs for four. four days. It wasn't until the fifth day when the FBI came in. Furthermore, uh, in those first four days, uh, in one of those days, they thought it was just a walk away and that she had just gone meandering despite the family saying that she didn't have cognitive issues and was not ambulatory. So I, I have to say that all the crime scene collection in those first four days, whatever they were doing before they released the crime scene, they released the crime scene before the FBI got in even.

We have Quantico, best live in the world. I had a fixed-wing aircraft on the ground ready to move it immediately through the night. Did they just say no? And they said, we're sending it to Florida. Amazing. Amazing. I don't know whether to cry, laugh, or go take all the air out of Nanos's tires. I'm not sure which way I should go.

That's from our friend Sean Hannity in his new podcast, hang out with Sean Hannity. Let me understand what I'm hearing, Allison. Cash Patel had a fixed-wing aircraft on standby, ready to take DNA taken from Mrs. Guthrie's home to Quantico to, arguably, the best lab in the world, and they were turned down. Did I hear that correctly, Allison? I don't think they were even turned down. I think they didn't tell them that they had taken it to their own private lab until after the fact. And the private lab is in Florida. It's a good lab. But the basic fact is that the FBI lab is free and one of the best in the world. So I'm not quite sure about that. But actually, Nancy, there's even more. We learned that HRT, the hostage rescue team from Quantico had flown in and was waiting at the Air Force. And when they did that run to Rio Rico, the SWAT team went to Rio Rico to look into a there or potential suspect.

They did not, they got there and they went there, the sheriff's team, SWAT team, local team, without even racing there before the HRT could get there, even though they were on standby as well, some of the, you know, best guys and ladies in the business. You're not kidding. Alison Weinner joining us. Brandy book, Murder in the media. Okay, let's hear this one more time. I want to hear specifically what Patel says. We have Quantico, Best Live in the World. I had a fixed-wing aircraft on the ground ready to move it immediately through the night.

Did they just say no? And they said, we're sending it to Florida. They just said we're sending it to Florida from our friend Sean Hannity, hang out with Sean Hannity. Joining me now, Joseph Scott Morgan, Professor, Forensics, Jacksonville State University, author of Blood Beneath My Feet on Amazon, star of a hit podcast series, Bodybags with Joseph Scott Morgan, but for our purposes, he is a death. investigator that has been to over 10,000 death scenes. And he's not just a talking head that blathers on and on with no experience. In fact, I first met him in a heated argument when he was with

the Fulton County Medical Examiner's Office because I needed evidence then and it wasn't ready. Through no fault of his, I might add. That's how I met Joe Scott Morgan. Joe Scott, did you hear what Patel said? And I agree with Hannity. I'm not buying it. Every turn, at every turn, the feds are being thwarted. And what does that mean? I don't care about some turf battle.

I care about finding Nancy Guthrie. And tonight we're learning more and more about how Nanos, let me just say, technical legal phrase, screwed the pooch. Left, right. No matter what he was offered, he said, no. what difference has it made that the feds were not allowed in, and they did not take access of that fixed wing aircraft to get the DNA sent immediately? That from our friends at News 12.

Let's preach a little bit, Nancy. Pride cometh before the fall. And that's what this is all about. And it's so critical in these moments when you can avail yourself of the services of the Fed, you know, their abilities to what they can do are almost limitless. Think about how much money we dump into an organization like the FBI. And what Patel was saying relative to Quantico, it's what everybody else shoots for in the area of forensic science relative to have those assets at your disposal.

And for whatever reason, for whatever reason, they did not want to avail themselves of these opportunities. And, you know, the thing about it, Nancy, and you know a lot about chain of evidence, right? The more hands evidence passes through, okay? It becomes degraded, not just in the physical sense. You know, when you think about that, the sample, for instance, if you're talking about DNA because it's very, very fragile, But also from chain of custody or the chain of evidence relative to how many hands is it passing through before it's processed, those little markers along the way kind of dictate the validity of whatever you're in game is. My biggest question about this case relative to DNA is was it ever compromised along the way? You know, when you send it to Florida, right?

And it's not in the same chain that the FBI uses. And I know that they avail themselves of other services like Arthur. They, you run the risk of really having a problem here. So, you know, looking back, and anybody can Monday morning quarterback it. But this isn't Monday morning, Nancy, the game is still on at this point in time. We have not seen any evidence of Mrs. Guthrie at this point. and this is critical. This is not like this thing's been adjudicated

and we're sitting over coffee and we're talking about it or whatever the case. This is an active case. Let me understand what you're saying. You're saying that the delay may have cost, let's just be blunt, the delay may have cost Nancy Guthrie her life. Delay, delay, delay.

How long was she alive? She could still be alive and I pray. I pray for a happy reunion for our friend Savannah. But delay, delay, delay, that's what happened. And it could have caused her her life. Yeah, you're absolutely right because they didn't hop on this. The other thing that they didn't hop on it, to Allison's point earlier, about the security of the scene, if they had secured this thing from Jump Street, Nancy, okay?

No pizza deliveries, no pool boys, all that, all that, that nonsense. If they had secured it, they would have gotten to this cloud earlier that can, this information and it could have gotten into the hands of people. And again, I don't want to beat this drum over and over again, but when we see those tiles there, they could have done electrostatic lifts on those. We actually see where this guy is putting his feet in this image right here. If they had frozen that scene, you could have done shoe lifts off of that. That's gone.

That's gone like a vapor. Usually. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Alison Weiner, joining us, investigative senior reporter News Nation, author of new book Murder in the Media. Alison, normally when prosecuting a case, putting together a case,

discussing a case, analyzing a case, I rarely go into coulda, should, or woulda, because frankly, it's a waste of time. You need to keep moving forward because every minute you delay, you're losing the possibility

of preserving evidence or finding a witness or finding Nancy Guthrie. But I think it's worth noting how badly this torpedoed the case. In a nutshell, everything Joe Scott Morgan said was true, but simply put the delay in the DNA. I mean, look, we still don't even have it. We still don't have it because of the delay caused by Nanos. Who knows what a positive match. could have meant in saving the life of Nancy Guthrie or finding her, Allison? It's really, you know, at first we tried not to focus on the sheriff

because we really wanted to focus on Nancy Guthrie, but he was just too reckless of a presence to ignore because he was providing even the media with conflicting information about timelines, about, you know, oh, yeah, my bad, I opened up the scene too soon, I wouldn't do that again. He, and there was an opportunity for FBI to come right in there and do evidence collection, which is also, you know, what they know how to do. Instead, he had inexperienced homicide investigators there, including the sergeant who reportedly,

we've reported, did not have from an insider inside of the investigation, did not have any experience investigating a homicide. So we have these guys and in the sheriff's office giving, conflicting information to the public. They don't know for weeks that they should be looking at all of January, preserve information on their ringcams, because that wasn't also given out as information to the public. So I think I don't know what should have could have happened, but I do know that the sheriff has a longstanding animosity towards the FBI,

and that became apparent in terms of access, what he told and what he didn't tell. And I think to the detriment of the Guthrie family, and finding Nancy Guthrie. I launched hundreds of agents and Intel staff to Phoenix and Tucson, just for this case, just to be on standby. And they didn't want to do the canvassing. And we said, we'll take the DNA. From our friends at Fox sat, Sean Hannity's new podcast,

hang out with Sean Hannity, another thing to Brian Fitzgibbons. Guys, Fitzgibbons is Director of Operations, USA, a nationwide security. He leads a team of expert investigators around the world. He leads them finding and extracting missing people. Specifically, I'd like to point out, often from Mexico, which may come into play here. He is a former Marine and an Iraqi War vet, and I think that says it all. Brian Fitzgivens, thank you for being with us tonight.

Did you just hear Patel State? I, and I'm reading it verbatim, I launched hundreds of agents in Intel staff to Phoenix and Tucson, just for this case. and it's just to do the canvassing. And we said, look, we'll take the DNA. We'll start canvassing. Brian, a delay is a defendant's best friend. The canvassing needed to happen then immediately.

And not just the two next door neighbors. All around the neighborhood, getting video that maybe has now been overridden, questioning people about the night before. Like, can you tell me? What noises you heard a week ago in the middle of the night? Because I can't. If you asked me about last night, yes, I can tell you the dog started barking at precisely 4 a.m. But if you ask me a week from now, I'm not going to know that anymore.

All those agents on standby to find a missing person. Gone. All that evidence. Gone, Brian. And these issues, Nancy, with the DNA are the tip of the iceberg. because here's the deal. This is where my mind went almost immediately. If that was the level of collaboration or the lack thereof,

how much work was duplicated when the FBI did actually enter the scene five days later, right? And what I mean by that is how much of this canvassing had already been done by Pima County, how much information was being shared between the agents from Pima County on the ground doing the investigation with the federal law enforcement agent. How much was done twice? How much time was wasted in those early days? And you're talking days five through 10, right, when the FBI first entered the scene. So, you know, this statement from Patel is very concerning. And, you know, so far, Patel has kept quiet until Hannity got him to speak out and tell what he knows. But, you know, I want you to hear this because the faster you can get on the ground and start. start looking, the more likely you're going to solve the case. And at first, at the very beginning, this was treated as if Nancy Guthrie had just wandered off and must have fallen in a ditch. What a load of hot, stinking, steaming BS. Now, listen to this, Fitzgibbons.

It is a state matter. It's a state and local law enforcement matter. What we, the FBI, do is say, hey, we're here to help. What do you need? What can we do? And for four days, we were kept out of the investigation. Four days. Four days from our friend, Sean Hannity at Hang Out with Sean Hannity's podcast. Four days, Brian, you can't get that back. As I always say, like, when you got a missing child, every hour, 60 MPH at best, they're getting further and further and further away. In this case, same thing.

Nancy Guthrie getting further and further and further away, while Nanos has his thumb up as you know what. For Pima County to not have the agility to, to plan for bringing in these federal resources quickly on a high-profile case like this, it just speaks to the political nature of the decision that Nanos made, that this is a long-standing beef with the FBI and that he, you know, Joe Scott Morgan said it best, Pride cometh before the fall, and this was a decision born out of pride that he wanted to be the one to solve this case. The FBI worked with Google to put that image out. Another thing we asked to do.

You guys got that tape, which was the biggest breakthrough during that case. We could have gotten it days before. We could have also maybe gotten more data had we been looking early. Again, from Hangout with Sean Hannity, the Google tape. Oh, Joe Scott Morgan, Professor Forensics. Can I tell you how valuable that video is? Let's see, the porch guys, if we haven't seen it before. And not just the day of that's, let's say, yes, he's got.

the gun on right there. That is the night Nancy was stolen in the middle of the night. What if you woke up to see that in your face? I mean, and then you know they hit her. You know that's why she's bleeding on the front porch. Was she screaming? Was she crying out? And they hit her. I think they hit her in the face. This 84-year-old woman. Joe Scott, you met my mom. If someone hit her in the face, it might just kill her for Pete's sake. But all those days, and not only did Patel manage to get Google to dig that up, like Lazarus rising from the grave,

but then the other video that you and I went round and around and around chasing our tails, why doesn't you have a gun on in this video? I got into it with Dave Mack, our investigator from crime stories who's joining us tonight, who dared to suggest to me that the other porch video, which we now know us from an earlier, date was the Perps twin the same night and that they were dressed alike. Oh, that said, that's the biggest break so far.

Hannity's right. And they sat on it. If it hadn't been for Patel, we wouldn't even have that. Imagine all of the homicides that you have not just covered on the air, but the ones that you prosecuted Nancy. Think about that just for a second. How much would you have loved to have had an image, a moving image of a perpetrator like this? Kind of frozen in time, that moment captured.

How many cases have there been over the years where we had nothing, Buckkus? There was nothing out there to literally hang our hat on. Here you have an individual approaching. And there are so many things about this image, everything from gate to clothing. that have forensic value, timing, all of these issues, and not to mention the presentation of this weapon, which by the way, we've talked about this, is in no way common.

Somebody would wear presenting in this format a weapon like this. What's the purpose of it? Was it for intimidation? Was it for what they perceived as easy access? I have no idea. Was perhaps she struck with that weapon? Was she what's called buffalo? You know, where you strike somebody in the face with a weapon like that.

I don't know. I know that looking at the blood that was out there, I see expert there, not aspirate, it's expert, where you have blood that is being coming out of the nasal pharynx area where somebody's blowing out, coming from their nose, the mouth, and then you have those free-frawling drops right there. Do you realize, I'm not saying this necessarily to you, but do people realize how fragile that evidence is, the mat that was not collected. You know, for all of that blood that you see right there that's deposited on those tiles, do you realize how much evidence would have been on that black

mat itself? We, I don't know, we'll never know, right? Because it's been compromised at this point in time. And that's the real, that's one of the real tragedies about this. Hey, look at this, Joe, Scott. Yeah. It's past the porch and actually goes down the front walk. This is for my friends, at Fox News Digital, we know that Nancy Guthrie was struck in the face based on this evidence and what the blood evidence reveals. It's aspirate. Aspirate is when you aspirate, you breathe out blood. Also, it appears to be in a satellite positioning.

Give me a close up on that, please. and what that means is she's standing still long enough to have one blood drop and then blood drops around that without her. See those at the front right and behind it. She's likely standing there and dripping blood down. That's what we call a satellite pattern. All this said, the delay may have cost Nancy Guthrie. her life. Back to Alison Weiner joining a senior investigative reporter, author of a new book, Murder in the Media. It seems as if focus is shifting to the hunt of a gray van. What do you know,

Allison? Well, I've heard that, but they haven't seemed to be able to pick up that van past that little bit of video that we had. I will tell you, in terms of searching, that area. The only search we saw of that area was in the couple of days following Nancy's abduction and it was some helicopters, but it was basically around the home and just in a very small area. There's a lot of ways in and out of the Catalina foothills, and that search didn't encompass that. It did not also encompass the nearby desert, which has a road straight to Mexico. I actually went out there with a former SWAT official. And I have to say that they didn't really get a chance to look at that freshly in the first couple of days either.

And finally, going back to the point of how many agents the FBI had provided, there were about 600, I think, of Pima County officers available in hundreds and thousands. of FBI agents that were sent and they were not used. It's crazy. In early February, neighbors reported a suspicious van in the area just before Nancy Guthrie went missing. A separate distinct gray silver range rover was then towed after a traffic stop, indicating a distinct interest in a gray van or SUV. There was an investigation focused by Pima County on analyzing footage, and neighbors were actually asked about the existence of a gray van.

Now, this video is from our friend Crystal's Crime Board. Karen Stark joining us, forensic psychologist, renowned TV and radio trauma expert and consultant at Karen Stark.com. Karen, there's more to come. But I wanted you to hear some of the evidence that has been delayed or even lost because of Nanos's refusal to let the feds step in. It's somebody who believes that he can do this himself, no matter what's available to him, took a chance. He actually took a chance with somebody's life because he had approved this point that he could do it because he was upset with the FBI. And it's playing out in front of everybody, how ridiculous and mean and scary it is, that he did not take action and get all the help available to him so that this woman could possibly

be found as quickly as possible. They always talk about the first 48 hours. Where was he? How could he not pay attention to that because of his own self-interest? And that's exactly what happened. Straight out to Dave Mack, joining us Crime Stories Investigative Reporter. Dave, what can you tell me about a huge swath of land near Nancy Guthrie's home? That has not been searched. This is an area that we're talking a mile to a mile and a half away from Nancy Guthrie's home. It is an area that is fenced off because it is a water processing facility.

Okay, it's called the Tucson Water Municipal. property. Totally gated. You can't go in. Civilians enter. It's a felony. But Nancy, six days after Nancy Guthrie was kidnapped on February 7th, NASA's firm satellite, this is F-I-R-M-S. It is a free information for resource management system. This is some satellite that actually maps platforms providing real-time imagery of heat signatures, hot spot data, in particular in areas like the Tucson Water Municipal Property. At 1057-1058 a.m. on February 7th, NASA's Firm satellite picked up a clear, high-confidence, daytime heat signature at a very precise coordinate on the Tucson Water Municipal Property. Again, a mile from Nancy's home, the area is gated and locked. But Nancy, the area where this heat signature came from is at the top of a hill leading down to an arroyo that has shrub brush, small trees, and things like that.

But the heat signature was there, not near the municipal pipes for water and everything else. We're talking in a land area that is going uphill, dirt, trees, things like that. or shrubs rather. So this heat signature, Nancy, on February 7th, was out of the ordinary. Not something that normally happens. And it hasn't been searched. This is a mile from Nancy Guthrie's home, a heat signature at 1057 in the morning, and nobody searched to find out what it was.

Straight out to Joseph Scott Morgan, joining us, Professor Forensics and Death Investigator, explain the impact of what Dave Matt Mack has just reported. Imagine grains of sand, you know, that are falling with every moment, uh, you're, you're losing valuable time here. Guess what? That heat signature doesn't exist anymore. It's gone at this moment, Tom. And any trail that might lead to some kind of information that would be critical relative to the status of Mrs. Guthrie, that trail has gone cold at this point in time. So that leaves us wondering, what in the world, what in the world would we do, you know, as far as seeking her out now? Because that is precious time.

And this case, Nancy, all hinges on Tom, doesn't it? Response times. You know, it seems like that the people involved in this from Jump Street have a bit of disorganization and, let's face it, lethargy. They didn't prioritize this case the way that they should have. And for me, you know, when I'm analyzing this, they're not, they have not prioritized Mrs. Guthrie's missing status. Really wonder how this plays in to other cases with not so elevated persons, let's say, for instance, in this jurisdiction. You know, who else? You know, who else is out there that's suffering that have missing family members or crimes that have gone unsolved?

And you look back at this right here, and this is a glaring example of problems. I'm just hoping that they're going to be able to address these problems. I'm not really, really hopeful. I got to tell you, Nancy, about Ms. Guthrie's status right now. And that lies, that lies at the feet of those that are in charge of an investigation, Nancy. That from our friends at News 12. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Dave Matt, explain to me where exactly that heat signature was.

It was in the Tucson Municipal Water, Corden-off area, about a mile, mile and a half from Nancy Guthrie's home. I mentioned, Nancy, that this is a very large area, a huge, as you've called it, a huge swath of land. that is cordoned off. It is gated, it's locked, barbed wire at the top, and no civilians are allowed in. But this is only a mile, mile and a half from Nancy Guthrie's home, six days after she has stolen in the middle of the night.

A heat signature. Exact position. You know, I'm curious. You know, Joe Scott Morgan, you mentioned that that evidence is now gone. To Brian Fitzgibbon's joining us, Director of Operations, USPA, nationwide security. How valuable would that be in a search for a missing person? You've got this

giant swath of land very close to Nancy Guthrie's home. And out of the blue, an elevated heat signature indicating a living creature, not a dead creature, a living creature. And it wasn't pursued. Now, is it because the land was surrounded by Barb White? You know what? Where I grew up, a lot of pastures full of cows were surrounded by barbed wire. We just went over them or under them. It's not hard. So a barbed wire fence is stopping Pima sheriffs from searching. And you've got this elevated heat signature popping up in the middle of it and nothing's done. Yeah, I have to think that what you're seeing here is issues with triaging these data points. You know, in that close proximity to Mrs. Guthrie's home,

you would think that this would be followed up very quickly. And I'll add one thing here. Private investigator Steve Fisher, who's been many times a guest to this show, did a great job explaining a few months ago, drone technology that's available that can quickly grid search these expansive areas and stitched together effectively a,

it looks almost like, like a satellite map, but it's taken by drone. Something like that, tying in an external resource that quickly, you know, there were failures all along the way to bring in outside help to do things like that. So it was just a, you know, I don't think it was the bobwire that kept them out. I think it was an inability to effectively work with anybody outside of Pima County. Ryan Fitzgibbons, you're absolutely right. Take a listen to Steve Fisher. So we can do with these specialized drones, and these are enterprise drones, these are not regular consumer drones,

is we can program them to search or to fly certain search grids and whatnot. And so what we do is the drone flies these lines that we define, and then when it's complete, we have a photography of, we have imagery of this whole. area. And then we can do is we can actually build a map out of that. It stitch those together and then actually search the map. Dave Mack, Crime Stories investigative reporter, what can you tell me about solar powered cameras and what, if anything, they may yield? Nancy, the one thing we know about these solar powered cameras and devices is that we watched as the law enforcement removed. one of the solar powered devices and wired camera from the roof.

If you remember, it was around February the sixth, then to the investigation seven days in. And we know that these solar powered cameras and other electronics, you know, they're not attached to the grid. So whatever is being run and recorded by these cameras would be saved. It's not part of any kind of grid. So it doesn't matter to cut it. cut all the wires in town. These things are independently powered.

Nancy, a white female, 84 years of age, 5-2 million-billed, probably bling after 22-hundred hours. As of yesterday, Nancy has high blood pressure, past maker and cardiac issues. Alison Weiner, joining us, senior investigative reporter and author of a new book, Murder in the Media. Allison, is it true that even though the family, Nancy Guthrie, said, this isn't right.

The camera's dislodged. There's blood on the front porch. She didn't just wander away. At the get-go, Nanos insisted on treating this as a case where an elderly individual simply wandered off. Yes, and I think that's what they were used to dealing with there. He actually had a press conference where that's exactly what he said, that this is, you know, she had wandered off or looking for her.

And there were at that time, the family was inside the house. There were other officers inside the house. And they all went searching around to see if they could find Nancy. So again, you have like evidence disruption. You have them looking and wasting. I mean, not wasting, but not spending the time and not seemingly being able to put together the fact that there's blood on the porch and a trail of blood on the porch. so maybe she didn't just walk away.

And also the fact that the family said she was not ambulatory, and we heard Savannah say that in a press conference that she barely could make it to the mailbox most days. And my sister called me, and I said, is everything okay? And she said, no. She said, Mom's missing. And I said, what? What are you talking about?

She said she's gone. She must have had like some kind of medical episode in the night and that somehow, you know, the paramedics had come. I started calling the hospitals and the police were there and talking to her at the same time and it was just chaos. My mom, her, she was in tremendous pain. Her back was very bad, you know. She was trying to on a good day. She could walk down to the mailbox and get the mail, but most days not. So there was no wander off.

And the doors were robbed open. Yeah. And there was blood on the front doorstep. And the ring camera had been yanked off. Yeah. And so we were saying this is... Yeah. Do something.

This is not okay. Yeah. This isn't... Something is very wrong here. That from our friends at YouTube today, that is Savannah, describing what happened? immediately when she realized her mom was missing and that authorities were told she did not wander off. Look at the front porch.

Look at the door cam. Yet it was pursued for who knows how long as a wander off by an elderly. The question tonight is how badly has the state's investigation been torpedoed by the unfortunate misjudgments and at the very beginning of the case. Can it be fixed? Did it cost Nancy Guthrie her life? Is there a way for her to be brought home alive? If you know or think you know anything about Mrs. Guthrie's disappearance,

please dial toll-free 800-225-3-24. Repeat. 800. 225.5.324. If you wish to remain anonymous, 520882-7463. 520 882-7463. There is a 1.2 plus million-dollar reward on the table for information leading to the whereabouts of Nancy Guthrie. $1.2 million. And remember, a conviction, even an arrest, is not required for you to collect the reward.

$1.2 million in reward. We remember an American hero trooper Andrew Wall, Tennessee Highway Patrol, killed in the line of duty after 14 years, leaving behind devastated parents, Tom and Wendy, and grieving girlfriend, Cindy, American hero, Trooper Andrew Wall. Nancy Grace signing off.

Goodbye, friend. This is an I-Heart podcast. Guaranteed human.