Crime Stories with Nancy Grace - CORONAVIRUS CRIMES From SUPERMARKET STABBINGS to POISONOUS CURES and DOOR-TO-DOOR VIRUS “TESTS” BEWARE!

Episode Date: March 18, 2020

As cases of the coronavirus continue to spread, so does mayhem. From stabbings to scams and downright fake treatments, we're seeing it all.Joining Nancy Grace today: Wendy Patrick: California prosecutor, author “Red Flags”   James Shelnutt: 27 years Atlanta Metro Major Case detective, SWAT Officer (RET) Attorney Dr. Michelle Dupre: South Carolina Medical Examiner & Author of “Homicide Investigation Field Guide Caryn Stark: NYC Psychologist  Levi Page: Investigative reporter CrimeOnline  Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an iHeart Podcast. Nancy Grace is coming to Fox Nation. I want justice. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Available now only on Fox Nation. Stabbings in Sam's Club. Fights over sanitizer. Online scams jacking up the prices of Purell to $48 a bottle. People losing money.

Jim Baker, the televangelist on TV, offering a cure for coronavirus and people spending their hard-earned money on it. What is going on? Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Coronavirus crimes. Take a listen to this. You were just hearing a fight, including a stabbing that breaks out at a local Sam's Club. I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. Thank you for being with us. Believe it or not, it even included a motorized wheelchair. The place was packed. People were arguing. Way, way, way too many people crowding in to get toilet paper and hand sanitizer. And it ends up one

person is actually wheeled out on a stretcher after another is stabbed. Joining me today, an all-star panel to break it down and put it back together again. What is happening? Has the world gone mad? Don't be a victim. Wendy Patrick, California prosecutor, author of Red Flags. You can find her at WendyPatrickPhD.com. James Shelna, 27 years Metro Major case detective, SWAT officer, now retired lawyer. Dr. Michelle Dupree, South Carolina medical examiner and author of Homicide Investigation Field Guide. Karen Stark, joining us from Manhattan, psychologist at karenstark.com with a C. But right now to CrimeOnline.com investigative reporter Levi Page. Levi Page from Texas to Georgia, all across the country,

we are seeing fights, fistfights, and even stabbings occurring, and especially the big warehouse sales chains such as Sands Club. What's happening, Levi? You know, Nancy, since this virus has broke out, people are rushing to the stores to purchase supplies. Supplies are low because some people are hoarding them. And what happened is, I think, Levi, they started banging and hitting with wine bottles. And, of course, people get cut. Okay, as you were saying? Yes, I mean, there's this really obnoxious in stores. And there have been, you know, stabbings, fights.

People have been willed out on stretchers after getting into altercations at stores. It's really astounding that people are reacting this way when we should be supporting each other in a time like this. In your fairytale world, Levi Page, I guess you're right. James Shelnut, 27 years Metro Major, K-SWAT officer, now lawyer. James, it's a pack mentality. and I first saw it in a case where a group of young guys who would not have committed this crime on their own ended up affecting a triple homicide because there were four of them together it seems as if people work themselves into a frenzy

James, and they do things they would never do on their own. Oh, absolutely. You know, sometimes people go into a criminal feeding frenzy when they wouldn't normally do it by themselves, you know, and you like to think in situations like this, you know, that you would take the high road, you know, that you don't want to be one of these people contributing to the chaos, you know, but then again in the back of your mind, you're thinking, okay, well, if I'm a nice guy, I may finish last, and maybe my family doesn't get these necessities that we need to get through this time. James Shelnut, you know how much I appreciate you.

I mean, 27 years Metro Major Case SWAT officer, now lawyer, but I'm going to leave the shrinking to the shrink. I'm asking you and your experience of all those years in Metro Major Case and SWAT, even as a lawyer, have you seen in a crowd where evil takes over and people commit horrible crimes? Levi Page from Crime Online called it really obnoxious. I call it a felony, James Shelnut. Oh, absolutely. I mean, you know, you think about the many times that you see videos online or on TV where one person starts getting

attacked or two people get in a fight, and then all of a sudden you have multiple people join in, and exactly what you just said was the PAC mentality. It is very common when you have states of civil unrest, when you have conflict and there are large crowds of people. This is not an uncommon event in this type of scenario. And to Dr. Michelle Dupree, South Carolina medical examiner, author of Homicide Investigation Fuel Guide, in the example we were using, and there are examples all across the country, we had to pick one. Dr. Michelle Dupree, in this case, people were slugging each other with wine bottles and somebody, oh, can you imagine, Jackie, if I had the twins at Costco or Sam's Club and this

went down? Oh, Dr. Michelle Dupree, don't people get when you swing a wine bottle, somebody's going to get killed or stabbed? That's what happened here to our understanding. Surely they must, Nancy. I mean, a wine bottle is going to break. Not only are you going to hit that person, but you risk damaging that person by glass cutting. You know, the reality is that using a wine bottle or a big bottle on someone is just as dangerous as a switchblade or a knife, even more so because the force behind a full wine bottle, when you hit somebody with that, it's like clubbing them, James Shelnut. It's like using a club on their head.

Oh, absolutely. It's blunt force trauma that can crush your skull and absolutely kill you. I mean, I think at that point, if you're armed, you know you have the right to use deadly force to defend yourself because the force being used against you is potentially deadly. And catch this, guys. Levi Page, take a listen about really obnoxious, in our business we call it a felony. Apparently a man was in the aisles in a motorized shopping cart,

like a rascal, those things you sit on and they move around. When another family tried to get in his very same spot, the man in the motorized shopping cart hit the family's cart. And that is when the woman, I guess the mother, setting a wonderful example for her children, started wailing on the guy, and everything escalated into fights with wine bottles. To Karen Stark, New York psychologist, joining us this morning from Manhattan. Karen Stark, help me out, the mentality. Can you imagine me with the children, twins with me, suddenly hauling off and punching a guy in a motorized, a rascal. What do you call those?

A motorized shopping cart. That's what all the news reports say. You know how they drive around in the grocery store and they steer it? It's like a little scooter. What was she thinking? A woman, a lady started the fist fight. People are not themselves right now, Nancy. And as one of the experts mentioned.

Karen, are you serious? Did you really just say that to me? If I heard that in court, oh, he wasn't himself when he stabbed someone with a wine glass. What? Not themselves. It's acceptable, but I'm not surprised. And I think that people need to be prepared and make sure that things like this don't happen because there's that underlying hysteria that's happening. I'm constantly doing sessions at this point and helping people to calm down.

But they start to get this idea that this is going to be the last roll of toilet paper on earth and they become frantic. And there's really truth to the fact that when you're in a crowd and people become aggressive, other people will catch them. They've done experiments where they show that if one person begins to do something like that, other people will pick up on it. If people do something in a good way and are gracious, there's more of a tendency to follow that. You know, you said Karen Stark people are not themselves, but I'm wondering if themselves actually take over and crack through that thin veneer we call being polite and that their true natures come out. I mean, attacking a guy in a motorized wheelchair?

Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. We are talking about coronavirus crimes. Everyone going insane, actually coming to blows, stabbings, attacks with wine bottles. In open view right there at a Sam's Club. But it's not just Sam's Club. It's throughout the country in all sorts of grocery stores, these warehouse stores, especially where a lot of people congregate. But believe it or not, it goes all the way to TV. I want you to take a listen now to host of the Jim Baker show, Jim Baker.

This influenza that is now circling the globe, you're saying that silver solution would be effective. Well, let's say it hasn't been tested on this strain of the coronavirus, but it's been tested on other strains of the coronavirus and has been able to eliminate it within 12 hours. Yeah. Totally eliminate it, kills it, deactivates it. Yeah. And then it boosts your immune system.

So then you can support the recovery because when you kill the virus, then the immune system comes into action to clear it out. So you want a vibrant immune system. Well, you heard it right there from the horse's mouth. Jim Baker, disgraced televangelist, trying to sell a cure for the coronavirus. Now, I don't know what they're saying about it. It cures one strain of coronavirus, but not another. Wow. If we only knew that Silver Solution would cure coronavirus.

Well, don't worry. Jim Baker, now in hot water, being sued by the state of Missouri for selling fake coronavirus cures on his website. Baker, the Jim Baker Show, and six other companies warned by the FTC, where I used to work, the Federal Trade Commission, and the FDA to stop selling unapproved products and treatments, products like silver salt liquid that claim to diagnose or cure the coronavirus illness. He is now being sued. Take a listen now to Inside Edition. This is amazing. Is there a miracle treatment for coronavirus? Order silver now. This televangelist seems to suggest so. Hello and welcome to the Jim Baker Show. Jim Baker, the notorious pastor who served five years in pris

1990s and was once marrie Faye Baker is now back on well, surprising claims t could be effective against We've tested it. It works This influenza that is now circling the globe, you're saying that silver solution would be effective. Well, let's say it hasn't been tested on this strain of the coronavirus,

but it's been tested on other strains of the coronavirus and has been able to eliminate it within 12 hours. So what do you think about these people kind of pushing this silver as a treatment? It's an absolute outrage that they're pushing this product. There's no evidence for its effectiveness. They're exploiting people who are fearful about the virus. Stay away from the product. All you're doing is wasting your money. I wonder how many thousands of dollars Jim Baker raked in, and he's notorious for that. That's what he did on the Jim Baker show. I don't remember the name of his televangelist show, but he and his wife,

Tammy Faye, as you recall, went to trial over various, uh, many infractions and he went to jail. Well, he's back and wow wow what a comeback straight out to levi page climb online.com investigative reporter what oh wait whoa whoa whoa whoa let me just drink this in for a moment there's jim baker um on his way oh oh there he is and is he coming out nope no no there he is he's coming out of a law enforcement van, a secure van, and hobbling his way into court. You know, let me circle back to you in a moment, Karen Stark. It seems as if once you've done jail time, you wouldn't want to go back. Okay, Levi Page, CrimeOnline.com investigative reporter.

What is Jim Baker selling? Colloidal silver? What is that? Yes, it's called silver solution and basically it's just the mineral silver. Nancy and he claims that it can cure a certain strand of the coronavirus as well as HIV and the FDA. The Federal Drug Administration has said that that is not true that

those claims are false. In fact, this silver mineral in high doses can actually call Igeria, which is a condition where it actually can hurt your kidneys and actually make your skin change color. It can turn you into a silver color. And basically, the state of Missouri is actually suing him the Missouri Attorney General telling him to stop advertising this product and we shouldn't be surprised Nancy in the 80s and 90s he was very controversial a woman even accused him of rape and he used church funds to pay her off yes that's her name Jessica Hahn who later appeared in Playboy magazine, but apparently people believed her story.

As I recall, she may have been given alcohol or drugs. Everything was very fuzzy to her about what happened. Oh, there he is. He said it was consensual. He said it was consensual. Guys, we're talking about people such as Jim Baker, allegedly scamming you for thousands and thousands of dollars for coronavirus cures. Jim Baker at it again.

I want to go to Dr. Michelle Dupree out of South Carolina, medical examiner, author of Homicide Investigation Field Guide. The moment I heard about what Baker was up to now, ripping people off, not only ripping them off for their money, but potentially killing them. It's colloidal silver. He claims it's effective to cure coronavirus. I know it can build up in your body's tissue, and it can actually make you turn blue. You turn blue, and I don't believe that's reversible. But what is colloidal silver, and what does it do to you? Why is it so dangerous?

Nancy, this is actually something that we call a heavy metal, and there is no use for this in the body. And again, as you said, too much of it is damaging to many of your internal organs. There's no use for it that your body can deal with it. And you do. Your skin turns blue, your hands, your face, your whole body. Dr. Dupree, when you say it affects your internal organs, what does it do? It'll build up in things like your liver, your spleen, even your intestines. And when it builds up in something like the liver, your liver is what processes much of our food, many of our nutrients.

If that liver is damaged, then it can't process the normal nutrients and things that it needs to process. So therefore, part of our body starts to have problems with the normal functioning. And if it continues, then we become very ill and could possibly be fatal. The Jim Baker Show falsely promised to consumers silver solution can cure, eliminate, kill, deactivate coronavirus and boost the elderly consumer's immune system. The ones most at risk, the elderly, some of our most vulnerable in our society, are the ones he's hawking the silver solution to? The reality is there is no pill, no potion, no product, no vaccine yet on mass market to fight coronavirus. Take a listen to our friends at St. Louis KMOV4. This is Samantha Jones. The well-known Missouri televangelist is being sued by the state.

He's accused of claiming he has a cure for coronavirus. Missouri Attorney General Eric Schmidt has filed a lawsuit against Jim Baker and Morningside Church Productions in Branson. According to the lawsuit, Baker and his doctor, and a doctor, claimed a silver solution can cure the disease. This was on an episode of the Jim Baker show. The lawsuit is calling for a permanent injunction against Baker, which would require he stopped selling the silver solution as a treatment for coronavirus. Hi guys, Nancy Grace here. We have all worked so hard to bring to you Don't Be a Victim, Fighting Back Against America's Crime Wave, a brand new book. After interviewing literally hundreds of crime victims and police, we put our knowledge into Don't Be a Victim.

You can pre-order now. Go to CrimeOnline.com, pre-order now, and know that portions of our proceeds goes to the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Well, the world has been turned upside down since coronavirus hit. And now there are wolves, coyotes, hyenas at the edge of the pack of people trying to take advantage of them, get their money. And here, I learned that after researching it. Jim Baker advertised colloidal silver products for up to $125, a variety pack deal on the Jim Baker Show.

He often preaches about the end of times. Now, we know that he rebuilt his empire after doing a stint in jail, and this is just one of the ways he's doing it. The FDA says he is misleading viewers into thinking Silver Solution can keep the coronavirus at bay and even, quote, kill it within 12 hours. That is entirely false. In fact, the Silver Solution cure, colloidal silver, can kill you. Not kill the coronavirus, but kill you. Thank goodness the Missouri Attorney

General is filing an action against him. It's not just Jim Baker. So many are out to rip you off in ways that could even harm you. Hysteria has taken over and criminals are being held at bay. Coronavirus crimes. I want you to take a listen to our friends at WRCB-TV. This is Hunter Hoagland. For Matt Colvin, a pandemic meant an opportunity. It went to zero to 60 really fast. After the first COVID-19 death in the United

States, Colvin went state to state clearing out sanitizer shelves. He now sits with 18,000 unused bottles in his home and storage unit, while people in the Tennessee Valley struggle to find one. The bulk of it was purchased with just driving around to retail stores in the Chattanooga area. Colvin bought the sanitizer with the intention of selling them for profit on Amazon before they took his listings down. Now, feeling the same panic as many others. Oh, crap is the PG way to say it. Though he would not discuss on camera the exact prices he sold the sanitizer for,

he told the New York Times in a recent interview that some items were listed at $70 a bottle. The pricing on Amazon was higher than it was definitely higher than retail. $70 a bottle for a bottle of Purell. Last night, I did not take my children with me. I went to various stores looking for hand sanitizer. After the fourth one, we quit. This guy has, what did he say, Levi Page? It's 17, 18,000 bottles of hand sanitizer. He scoured the country acquiring them as soon as coronavirus hit.

What happened? Yes, Nancy, we're talking about Matt and Noah Coven, and they live in Hickson, Tennessee, which is outside Chattanooga. And they had this get rich quick scheme that they were doing. And they were going around Tennessee and Kentucky, collecting 1000s of units of hand sanitizer. And then what they were doing, Nancy, is they were storing them in a storage unit and they had 17,000 bottles of it. And they were selling it on eBay and Amazon for like 80 bucks. Some of it was going for 80 bucks just for hand sanitizer. And the Tennessee attorney general made them shut this down. The New York Times did an extensive report over it, and now they say that they're donating it to local churches now.

Right, that's what they say. To Wendy Patrick, California prosecutor and author of Red Flags at WendyPatrickPhD.com. Wendy, is what they did technically a crime? Well, yeah, you know, it is criminal to have this type of misrepresentation that goes to this extent. Obviously, as you and I and our listeners know. Whoa, whoa, whoa, wait, wait, wait, wait. They're charging people $70 a bottle for hand sanitizer. What is the misrepresentation?

It depends on how much it normally was. Remember that the price gouging laws kick in when you're reselling a product at a certain percentage over what it would normally sell for. And, Nancy, you also have to, as we know, you have to look in a hard spot trying to justify why they needed to raise the price as much as they did. If it's an exorbitant difference, then you bet it goes into price gouging criminal laws. If it's not, they're going to have to explain why they needed to raise the price as much as they did and how much that same bottle would have gone for, as you point out, just three weeks earlier. Well, I know that you can buy them for a dollar at the Dollar Tree or the dollar store. Colvin and brother Noah loaded up on the items before the online retailer Amazon stopped their sales and the Tennessee Attorney General intervened as Levi Page just told us, $70 a bottle for a $1 bottle of Purell or hand sanitizer, thousands of bottles of hand sanitizer packs of antibacterial wipes, medical masks were being stored. 17,700 bottles of sanitizer is what we're talking about.

These two brothers on the hunt for people to buy sanitizer at jacked up prices. But what's going to happen to them? Take a listen now to our friend, WRCB-TV News reporter, Hunter Hoagland. Box after box. Greed left storage units across Hickson, Tennessee. At the end of the day, we've got nothing to hide. Then again, hiding is hard to do when a plan to profit from a pandemic is made public. Matt Colvin bought 18,000 first coronavirus death. Amazon took down his listings after some were posted at $70 each. Is your business taking advantage of people? No, my business is

not taking advantage of people. Tennessee's attorney general sent Matt and his brother Noah Coven a cease and desist order, stating they have reason to believe the two were charging unreasonable prices for sanitizer, masks and other medical goods. I didn't think it was going to blow up into a flat out situation where everyone is home and being told to stay home. A public outcry on social media as Matt cleared out sanitizer shelves across the Tennessee Valley, while many others struggle to find any as much as $2 million that we know of has been scammed due to coronavirus cells, for instance, hand sanitizer. Guys, let me pause one moment and thank our partner making today's program possible. It's the farmer's dog. My dog, who is a pound puppy, his health is so important to us. I don't want to feed him highly processed, burned, brown kibble. And that is why we switched to the farmer's dog.

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Guys, we are talking about coronavirus scams, and some of them could very well cost you your life. Right now, online and phone scams ripping off the public. Take a listen to our friends at NBC. This is Ling Kent. Tonight, states across the country cracking down on coronavirus price gouging. We are now starting to see scam artists trying to profit off of the fear of the coronavirus. As fears grow, products like masks and hand sanitizer are selling out in stores and online. Prices on Amazon, Walmart and Facebook marketplace from third-party sellers are skyrocketing. $220 for a box of 10 masks on Amazon, 11 times the regular price. And for a bottle of

hand sanitizer on Walmart.com, $48, normally less than four. Amazon tells NBC News it's blocked or removed more than one million products. Both Amazon and Walmart also say they're actively working to take down overpriced items. But a quick Amazon search of hand sanitizer still turns up bottles that are more than twice the regular price. However, the listings of those price-gouged bottles are fewer. Now, according to city officials in Kentucky, scammers are actually going door to door. You know, like the encyclopedia salespeople or the vacuum cleaner salesman. They're going door to door now pretending to test for coronavirus. We learned that from our friends at KFOX.

Going door to door to test for coronavirus, and I'm sure charging the people that answer when they ring the doorbell straight out to CrimeOnline.com investigative reporter. You know, Levi Page, we are now understanding that there are phishing scams, social engineering, non-delivering scams. As a matter of fact, Levi, hold on. Take a listen to our friends at JWJXT. This is Ashley Harding. Listen, Levi. With the coronavirus outbreak on the minds of many,

scammers are now taking advantage of people's fear, and they're doing it in some of the most secretive ways. The Secret Service has identified three different scams infiltrating people's inboxes. They include phishing, social engineering, and non-delivery scams. With phishing, the Secret Service said victims got emails from a health organization with attachments claiming to have info on the coronavirus.

The victims opened it, which led to malware infecting their systems or prompted them to enter their email login credentials. The scammers are also getting unsuspecting victims to hand over money to fake charities related to the virus. Even more daring, bad guys are posing as an in-demand medical supply company, selling supplies to prevent or protect people from the coronavirus. They'll demand money up front without delivering any products. So how do you spot the scammers?

The feds say you should never open attachments or click on links from senders you don't recognize and always independently verify any requested information originates from a legitimate source. Not only should you not open up attachments that you don't recognize, don't open your door to that you don't recognize, don't open your door to people you don't recognize. That's a rule of thumb always. But right now, when so many people are afraid, as they should be, of coronavirus infection, these scammers are actually going door to door to test for coronavirus. So, Levi Page, CrimeOnline.com investigative reporter, what can you tell me about these scams? And, Nancy, with a lot of those scams that are going on, they're just flat-out false because you can't, there's no door-to-door testing for coronavirus and the Department of Justice has said that they are going to crack down on these scams because the state of emergency has been

declared and when a state of emergency has been declared a lot of laws kick in especially a lot of antitrust laws and these people are going to be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law according to William Barr the Attorney General and the Department of Justice is taking this very seriously, Nancy. And we know the people that fall for these scams most often, Nancy. And this is scary. It's the elderly because, you know, they're not on the internet as much as younger people are. And they don't know that a lot of these things the scams look like an official notice. I got one from American Express. It looked just like American Express.

It wasn't about coronavirus. It was another scam. It wasn't American Express, but it was using their logo and their colors. It happens all the time in these cases. As a matter of fact, let me tell you about this one. Wendy Patrick, California prosecutor, author of Red Flags. My brother and his wife got a phone call that, I forgot how it went, that somebody had taken their identity and they needed to come immediately to the Northern District Court in Atlanta and answer a summons. Well, they were getting in the car to go and called me about it.

I'm like, whoa, wait, that's not how summons work. This was a total scam, and they were somehow trying to get their vital information, such as Social Security, credit card numbers. What I mean is now in the time of coronavirus, it's even worse. Could you explain in simple terms, Wendy, what it means to phish, P-H-I-S-H, phish? That's right. You're exploiting unfamiliarity. You're looking for people online that won't recognize a scam. You're preying on people that can't tell the difference. And as you just pointed out with the example of your brother and wife, I mean, how would a normal person know what a summons looks like if they have no experience with the legal process?

So thank God he had you to call. Think of how many people don't have that lifeline that know people in the industry that can let them know truth from fiction. That is the worst thing we're seeing. And here's the thing about them, Wendy. They're very savvy. They know all about travel. They both, you know, retired and they go to the Westminster Dog Show and they go here and they go to Lake Placid. They're, you know, retired, and they go to the Westminster Dog Show, and they go here, and they go to Lake Placid. They're traveling the world. They know all the ins and outs. They give me tips for the twins, and somehow they almost signed away all their vital information, and what's so tricky is these fake emails that you'll get look real.

As a matter of fact, take a listen now to our friends at WGN Chicago News. This is Lourde Duarte. Your phone is one way they're targeting Americans. The other is online. Domains being registered with the mention of coronavirus are up. Internet security groups have already identified several as potentially dangerous. Among them, coronavirusstatus.space, coronavirus-map.com, and coronavirus-realtime. Even the Better Business Bureau, which has been warning people of the coronavirus scams,

received this phishing email this week. It's the worst I've ever seen it in my 32 years here at the Better Business Bureau. Scams are everywhere right now. They're going from, you know, from businesses to consumers. The emails, which to the average person look real, come with baggage. This one from John DeFranco and the title, Everything You Need to Know. It should be closed and deleted. Another one seems to come from China with an attachment and an update. Clicking on it gives the bad guys the opportunity to peer into your personal information, steal bank accounts, even, in fact, an entire company's software.

That's right. By clicking on that attachment, it actually delivers malware, mal, M-A-L, like Maleficent, the evil witch, or malignant. Mal means bad. As I was saying, a lot of these emails that come to you look real, and now the feds are on it, and I'm talking about the Secret Service. Listen to CBS, Catherine Herridge. The Secret Service is tracking the spike in coronavirus cybercrime. Anytime there's a heightened element of fear, such as with the coronavirus, criminals are going to exploit that. If you get an email like this, what are the red flags?

They request Western Union money, grant or Bitcoin as forms of payment. A legitimate business will offer payments either through invoicing or through credit cards. Hackers are also mimicking legitimate government agencies. This email, claiming to be from the World Health Organization, promises safety tips. Agents are

urging the public to be on alert for misspellings, bad grammar and not to open attachments if you don't know the sender. Threat actors are going to take advantage of the situation and milk it for all that it's worth. Adam Myers with the tech security firm CrowdStrike says cyber criminals are working all of the angles.

There are plenty of threat actors that will use phone scams as well. How does that work? They will call up, they'll know a lot about you, and that will kind of build that trust, and then you kind of follow the instruction. Always call back and make sure that it's something that's legitimate. Coronavirus is bringing out not only the best,

such as nurses and doctors leaving their own families and working around the clock, scientists trying their best to come up with answers. But the worst, please don't be a victim. Nancy Grace, Crime Story, signing off. Goodbye, friend. This is an iHeart Podcast.