Crime Stories with Nancy Grace - Couple sex attacked & murdered on date night, 'Pot-Mom' feeds baby pot-mac-n-cheese

Episode Date: April 13, 2018

The murders of Channon Christian and Chris Newsom shocked Tennessee in 2007, leading to the conviction and life prison sentences of 4 people. But now a 5th person has been indicted. Nancy Grace looks at the new charges against Eric Boyd. She is joined by  lawyer Anne Bremner, private investigator Vincent Hill,  psychologist Caryn Stark, Juvenile Judge Ashley Willcott, and reporter Pamela Furr. Grace also digs into the case against an Arizona mom arrested after allegedly feeding her toddler mac and cheese laced with cannabis butter. Addiction expert Dr. William Morrone and lawyer & psychologist Dr. Brian Russell join the discussion. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an iHeart Podcast. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace on Sirius XM Triumph, Channel 132. I don't think that we're ever going to get true justice on this earth. We had heard a report on TV about a body being found that was badly burned on the railroad tracks, but never did we ever connect the two. We were two blocks from where she was. If they had just knocked on the door, walked the streets, we don't know if we could have saved her life,

but she wouldn't have sat there for two days in a trash can. A crime that strikes terror into the hearts of parents across our country. A wonderful, bright, young couple carjacked after a Saturday night date night and murdered in the most horrific way you can imagine. Christopher Newsom tied up, shot in the back of the head, dragged to a railway track and set on fire after a rape. His girlfriend, 21-year-old University of Tennessee student, Shannon, her fate even more horrific. Her death comes after hours of torture in which she was raped and tortured with a broken chair leg,

beaten, bleach poured down her throat and over her bleeding body in an attempt to cover up evidence of rape. All this occurs while she is alive. She's tied up with curtains and a plastic bag put over her face. According to the autopsy, she was suffocated to death. Nancy Grace, Crime Stories, thank you for being with us. Straight out to Pamela Furr, Crime Stories investigative reporter. In the last hours, someone has appeared in court. I want the truth of what happened that night, and I want all murderers brought to justice in this case. Pam, please

start at the beginning. What happened? I'm looking at photos of Shannon Christian right now and her boyfriend, Christopher Newsome. They're so happy. They're so young. They're so in love. Start at the beginning, Pamela. What happened? While out on a date, Chris Newsome and Shannon Christian were carjacked from an apartment complex by Lamaricus Davidson and Latalvis Cobbins, their two brothers. And they had their buddy Eric Boyd with them. The carjacking apparently turned immediately into a kidnapping because another vehicle came up on them in the parking lot. Their headlights shone into the car, and these guys freaked out. They didn't know what to do so they decided to throw the young couple back into the car and they drove to a house nearby that the two brothers were

renting. It was on Chipman Street in Knoxville and this is where the real nightmare begins. Take a listen now to what the victim's parents understand happened the night their children were murdered. 1235 the phone rang that night and he spoke to spoke to her on the phone she called to check in to let us know that she was coming home rather than staying at Kara's that night and I sat up and she never came home. We had not seen him since Saturday night, which that's not unusual. He was 23 years old, and he kind of came and went, you know, with not a whole lot of restrictions at that age. And the way we discovered he was missing was Shannon's mother, Dina, called and said that Shannon didn't show up for work.

I got a phone call and it said, man, there's something going on up here at this house by the trash place and then I got another call that said that they thought that they had found her because or somebody because they were bringing in there was an ambulance that had just gotten there detective Snodderly says it's Chris we asked well how do you know and he, I recognized him by his eyes. Everything fell apart at that moment. This is what we know. Chris was a talented carpenter, a former baseball player, and college senior Shannon had gone to a friend's home after a date night at a movie

and a local restaurant. They were held up at gunpoint and carjacked, forced to drive to an old home in one of Knoxville's toughest neighborhoods where they were approached by their captors, some of them ex-cons, and then lived through a nightmare no parent wants to imagine could ever happen to their child, Pamela. Investigators say Newsom, he's the young man, at one point was taken to the railroad tracks near the house. He was made to walk there barefoot. They'd beaten him up quite a bit before this happened, but they made him walk barefoot. He was then raped, bound, gagged, shot three times.

One of those shots in the head, execution style. He was then wrapped with some sort of comforter, doused with gasoline, and then set on fire. Now, while this was happening, the young girl, Shannon Christian, was tied up. She was raped in every way imaginable. Evidence shows at some point she was savagely beaten in her vaginal area. This young girl had also suffered blows to the head. At one point dragged into the living room of the house, and in what investigators say was an attempt to destroy DNA, bleach was sprayed down her throat. We're also told she was later hogtied, and while she was

still alive, her body was encased in black garbage bags, and then her head was wrapped with a plastic grocery bag. She was then stuffed into a garbage can, left to die slowly in pain, suffocating. These two did not die quickly, y'all. It was a very, very savage way for both of these young people to go. I want you to listen to Shannon's dad describing the kidnap. Do you know how quick to Shannon and Chris that that carjacking went down? Boom. You come down your stairs and you go get in the car and you are cranking your car

and your boyfriend gets inside the door, they're going to get him a little sugar. Boom. There's a gun in the back of your head, and some big sucker gets in your 4Runner and puts a gun on you just like that. It's done. Pamela Furr, Crime Stories investigative reporter. One of the alleged murderers has just been in court.

How was he brought in, Pamela? Five people were convicted in the murders of these two young people. Let's start with what investigators call the ringleader, Lamaricus Davidson. He was found guilty on all counts and sentenced to death. We do have the death penalty still here in the state of Tennessee, and he was indeed sentenced to death. His brother, Latavis Cobbins, was found guilty of murder and facilitation of murder. He was sentenced to life in prison without the possibility of parole. Another man who was involved in all of this, George Thomas, guilty on all counts, sentenced to life without parole originally.

But later, he was granted a retrial, and he was convicted on almost all of the same charges, but this time sentenced to life with the possibility of parole after 51 years. Vanessa Coleman, she's the only female involved in this case. She was found guilty of facilitation of Christian's murder, kidnapping, and rape, sentenced to 53 years in prison originally, but was later retried and convicted on lesser charges and sentenced to 30 years. That brings us to Eric Boyd. Now, at first, he was only convicted of hiding Davidson after the slaying, right? He was hiding the ringleader, Lamericus Davidson, and didn't bring him to authorities who were looking for him. So at this point, he was sentenced to 18 years in prison. But now, 11 years later,

prosecutors believe they have enough to charge him with murder. Well, this is what I don't understand, too. Ashley Wilcott joining me, founder of ChildCrimeWatch.com, juvenile judge and lawyer. Ashley, it seems to me that one of the other killers, I mean, these two young people murdered after horrific torture where both the man and the woman, the young girl were raped and then tortured and murdered. It seems to me that one of the others would have given states evidence against the last one. No, right. I would think so, too. I don't know why not. And it does beg the question for me, did the state not give any kind of deal, any kind of something to try to get them to do that? I'm surprised as well.

You know, to Karen Stark, a renowned psychologist joining us out of New York. Karen, the pack mentality. When people get together, and here you got a bunch of ex-cons, number one. But when people get together, they do things they would not normally do on their own. And I believe that's how these two young people, Shannon Christian, just 21, and boyfriend Christopher Newsom were murdered. That's correct, Nancy. PAC mentality is the right way to describe it. You find that people will be more likely to commit a crime, go along with what the rest of the pack is doing, and become highly influenced

by the behavior of those around them. So, and especially if one of the people that's in charge of this group or has a powerful personality seems to be approving it and, you know, okaying the fact that they can do this. Well, another thing that is really disturbing, to top it all off, is there is a female involved in this horrific double murder. A female, Vanessa Coleman, is involved as well, too. Pamela Furr, Crime Stories investigative reporter. Why is a woman involved with a bunch of ex-cons who carjack, sodomize, rape, torture this young couple who all they did was go out to a movie that night? How does she get involved in this?

She was at the house, and investigators believe she's the one that raped young Shannon Christian with objects and also beat her pretty savagely in her vaginal area. So this was a brutal thing this woman did to another woman, but again, was later retried, convicted on lesser charges and sentenced to 35 years in prison. Four males, one female first arrested and in the last hours another perp brought into court on rape, theft, kidnapping, robbery, capital murder and carjacking. You know 50 years isn't enough. This is a death penalty case. We also know four of them had multiple prior felony convictions. Now, what I don't understand is how one of them walked away with just time behind bars. Everybody, all of them, should stew in the same pot together with the death penalty. Prosecutors say they

didn't have enough evidence against Boyd at all, and what they did have was circumstantial. So they decided to go after him for what they believe could actually bring a conviction. So what's changed? To be honest, we really don't know. Prosecutors aren't saying much at all, but we do know technology has gotten better in the last 11 years. So perhaps DNA evidence. He's being charged with 36 counts. They include first-degree murder, felony murder, especially aggravated robbery, especially aggravated kidnapping, and aggravated rape. And in the state of Tennessee, he could get the death penalty. Prosecutors are not saying yet if they're going to go for it, but they could.

Take a listen now to the victim's parents. Anybody that knew Chris was his friend, and he had a smile that everybody just loved. She was a typical girl. I mean, she wasn't perfect. Nobody's perfect, but she was, never gave us any trouble, always did well in school. She was beautiful, but what made her even more beautiful was the fact that she was not stuck on herself. Two weeks before this happened, Chris had that motorcycle at the time and he loved it. He rode it all the time and we were always afraid for him when he rode the motorcycle. We didn't want anything to happen and he knew that we were scared about him riding it and he called me one afternoon and said mom I've sold my bike and I said you have Chris I said why did you do that

and he said because I want a life and that just haunts me now that he said that in two weeks later here he is dead it just haunts me they raped him they tortured tortured him. They beat him. Then they killed him. It's not a normal murder. Christian and Shannon leaving together that January evening when they were carjacked, kidnapped, sodomized, raped, and murdered. The perps pouring bleach across Shannon's body to hide evidence of rape. Police recover an envelope from the vehicle that yielded a fingerprint, a fingerprint that led them to one of the killers just two blocks away from Christian's car. One body, Newsom's body, discovered near a set of railroad tracks. He had been bound, blindfolded, gagged,

stripped naked from the waist down, and shot in the back of the head. And only now are we learning the final perpetrator being brought to justice? To Ann Bremner, high-profile Seattle lawyer, joining me. What took so long, Ann? Well, of course, we did have retrials in this case, but when we look at Eric Boyd, he was convicted of accessory after the fact or rendering criminal assistance,

which is not as serious, of course, as aggravated first-degree murder. And it looks like they were looking for evidence for quite some time to basically take that timing of his participation back from just before the murders in any way, because, as you know, you're in for a dime, you're in for a dollar, and that would make him complicit as a principal for Murder One under felony murder, which was one of the indictments, or as being a direct participant. The prosecutors certainly will be working very, very hard to make sure they get this one right. There were two of those convicted in the murders in this case.

Their trials or their convictions were overturned. Now, it didn't have anything to do with the prosecution. The judge in those cases actually was involved in some sort of pill scandal, and so their convictions were overturned in the middle of all of that. They were retried. The good news is they were convicted, but they don't want to get anything wrong in this case with Eric Boyd. He was convicted, sentenced to 18 years, but not for murder and not for aggravated rape, but harboring the ringleader in this case. So this is a big deal. Something else had to come up. They had to be working on this for a long time. They got four of them. One of them got the death penalty. But in this instance, he was going to be paroled in 2022. And time was of the essence

really to get him back in. So i'm very anxious to see what they have well i'll tell you what i think they've got his own words apparently are going to be used against him to vincent hill a private investigator when will anybody learn actually i hope they don't that their jailhouse phone calls are taped vincent i mean think back on top mom casey anthony and all the hate she spewed on not only tape recorder, but video recorded visits with her parents. Jailhouse phone calls are recorded, Vincent. Yeah, absolutely. And the good thing about criminals is they're not too smart, even though they believe they are. So yeah, as long as people talk, then people will find

themselves in the exact same situation this guy's found himself in. We have long known the state needed more evidence to finish this case. What is the evidence? Police and prosecutors are being tight-lipped, but we have reason to believe that it is recorded jailhouse conversations. Eric Boyd's own words may be evidence used against him in the Christian Newsome torture slayings. And you know what that means? That means to Pamela Furr, a Crime Stories investigative reporter, that somebody has to sit there and listen and listen and listen,

combing through jailhouse audio to find exactly what they're looking for, Pam Furr. We've also seen the witness list, and what's interesting is this. Several people from the Blount County Sheriff's Office are on it. Boyd was housed in the Blount County Jail while he was awaiting his first trial, and he stayed there up until his conviction. So that suggests he may have been talking a lot while he was behind bars. There are two BCSO corrections officers and a former BCSO jail investigator on that list. And as you well know, phone conversations are recorded between the incarcerated and anyone on the outside. Only now are we learning the final perpetrator being brought to justice.

Boyd has appeared before a judge. He was assigned an attorney to defend him. A tentative trial date has been set for September the 10th and a status hearing is set for June the 6th. In fact, the parents of both of these young people were ecstatic when they heard that the prosecutors were going to go after Eric Boyd for actual murder charges because the parents believed all along that he had a bigger role in their children's murder. In fact, the Knoxville News Sentinel talked to the parents. Take a listen now to the victim's parents speaking out. It's about time. We've been trying to get something done for, well, ever since the trials were over. Everything that we've heard through seven trials and everything that we know from bits and

pieces of evidence, testimony. There's never been a doubt in our mind that Eric Boyd was at the carjacking. He was one of the ones that got in the forerunner with, that forced Shannon and Chris into the forerunner with them. We knew he was guilty. And there was a time when we, in the very very beginning we tried to get the federal prosecutors to go for more than what they did when they tried him for accessory after the fact but they didn't have for the state court. They didn't feel like they had enough and obviously things have changed and

36 counts I think shows that the district attorney's office is pretty much convinced that that he is guilty. So I'm personally, we're glad that he's finally here. But we wanted to be here, and we were, and Boyd's presence. What went through your mind when you first saw him? Well, his presence has changed a lot. He looks a lot different now than he did before. He looked a lot tougher before and now he looks like he's been relaxed. Good shape. Good shape like he's you know. Felt well.

Been rested and he just looks a lot different. Did you feel any emotions when you saw him? I mean this is the first time in years that you've probably seen him in person, right? It is, but I really didn't feel anything. I just looked at him, but I just really didn't have any emotions. If I had any emotions that I could say, they would not be anything that's really mentionable.

It was just kind of like, duh. Are you glad to see him now in a courtroom facing murder charges? Yes, I'm very glad about that. That's where he should have been to begin with. It's been a long time, but it's finally come. What's justice for you? What would you like to see happen to him? I would like to see him guilty.

I'd like to see him convicted on all 34 counts. That's 36 and that's what he should be found on. That would be justice for us. Just the thought though of another trial having to relive this again. Is this going to be hard for you? No. No. No because I'm this is the one that will matter the most to me. After seven trials you kind of get used to the environment and it's not going to be major pain for us. You know, sometimes pain and hurt never goes away. I want you to listen to Shannon's dad. I'd be sitting in that chair,

and she would come, I bet, a thousand times and slide right over the arm of that chair and sit in my lap. She was so tall, long-legged, her feet still dragging the ground. But she would sit in my lap, put her arm around me, and look at me a certain way.

Daddy. And I would get this feeling that would come over me like, this is going to cost me. If I sit down in that chair and shut my eyes, I can feel her do it. And it sure feels good. And when I open them, I got a rage in me you wouldn't believe. I hate in me that ain't normal. We still yet have to deal with it on our own.

And that is something that we face day to day. We can't bring her back. These two, just 21 and 23, minding their own business, going out to dinner and a daughter, according to police, mac and cheese made with marijuana. What? Alan Duke, what happened? It was dinnertime in this Arizona home where this mom had cooked up a special dish for her husband, Elena Marie Lampert. She's 25 years old in Tempe. She made some mac and cheese and her husband decided to share it with little the little 21 month old daughter.

There was a problem with that, though, and they noticed it quickly when the child started acting strangely. Turned out that Ms. Limpert had used THC butter, that's a chemical that comes out of marijuana, in the mac and cheese, and so their young daughter was high. I mean, hold on with me, a renowned guest, Dr. Maroney, medical examiner. Dr. Maroney, I'm overwhelmed that a 21-month-old child, this Arizona mom behind bars after her child is 21 months old, has mac and cheese. I mean, Dr. Maroney, my children would eat mac and cheese for every meal that eat it in their sleep. If I would let them, they're like addicts. All kids love mac and cheese, but I don't make it with THC. Dr. Maroney, what is mac and cheese? For those of you just joining us with us, Dr. William Maroney. Dr. Maroney, what is THC?

THC is tetrahydrocannabinol. It's a chemical that's produced inside the cannabis plant. That's why it's called cannabinol. There's 50 or 60 different chemicals that are produced, but it's considered to be the active psychotropic. It has brain stimulating activities. And in 21-month-old children, it can cause high blood pressure, sleeping, tachycardia, delusions and this child right after eating it should have gone to the emergency room for monitoring and maybe a pediatric icu this is the problem when we introduce cannabis

ambiguously into the society and cannabis products. Okay, when you're saying cannabis, you mean marijuana? Yes. Anytime you take a part of a marijuana plant and you break it down into the chemicals, the THC, cannabis can refer to the flowers, it can refer to the leaves, it can refer to extracts, but in all those, the active drug is tetrahydrocannabinol. And there's no place, that's like giving opium to a 21-month-old. That's like giving vodka to a 21-month, the untoward consequences are outrageous,

and you have the duality of ambiguous cannabis policy that you can sell tetrahydrocannabinol in butter, and once you get it to the home, there's no control on what happens to it. That's the problem. I mean, didn't you see this coming when marijuana was legalized in so many jurisdictions in 2008 when they said okay we can do this we'll make it medical but then none of the containers that uh medical uh cannabis medical marijuana was sold in none of them were child proof so we need better laws i'm just sick because

when you're saying uh with me is renowned medical examiner dr william maroney author of a brand new book american narcan that you can see on amazon dr maroney when i think of a 21 month old child having delusions i mean this is not a very good comparison, but I remember when I gave my beloved pet catnip, Coco was so afraid he ran under the bed and hid. He had these wild eyes. He was afraid of everything. And this is a cat that was an attack cat.

He would attack grown guys. Okay. He was out of his mind. I felt so bad because it was my fault. Here, this is a baby, a 21-month-old baby girl who is suffering delusions from pot and possible tachycardia. What is tachycardia? The early effects of THC in naive patients, adults and children and babies, would be an elevation in heart rate, fast, bam, bam, bam, bam, bam, bam, bam, or elevation in blood pressure. That's not good. And then long-term exposure the same time later, it slows the heart down and makes it more difficult and puts them asleep.

Cannabis toxicity in the ER, when people come in with cannabis toxic events, if it slowed them down, it makes their muscles flaccid and it's difficult for them to breathe and this would happen in a baby maybe even intubation that's where they hook you up to a ventilator because you can't breathe anymore because of the effects of the drug intubation you mean wait a, intubation is when they stick a tube down your throat. Because the long-term effects of that naive exposure to cannabis in a baby, it's going to stop breathing. But that's not the end of it. Joining me, Dr. Brian Russell, in addition to Dr. William Maroney, author of American Narcan, Dr. Brian Russell, host of the

hit show, Fatal Vows on Investigation Discovery, psychologist and lawyer. Dr. Brian Russell, host of the hit show Fatal Vows on Investigation Discovery, psychologist and lawyer. Dr. Brian Russell, that's so not the end of it because as a little 21-month-old baby girl is having delusions from pot, marijuana, her mom fed her and her mac and cheese, mommy sees the little girl freaking out and having delusions. And instead of rushing her to the hospital, the mother starts laughing. Elena Marie Limpert. I mean, last night, Lucy, Santa Claus in his wisdom,

brought her a balance beam and a bunch of gymnastics stuff, which is still sitting in the middle of the floor for her to play with. She fell on it last night. I mean, it wasn't serious, but I couldn't run over there fast enough and then try to pretend to help her walk her back to the sofa like she's really hurt. But I was afraid maybe she skinned her knee. All right. And my son had soccer yesterday, Dr. Russell.

He came when I got him home. I looked at his leg. It was covered with, like, burns from the grass. We immediately cleaned it and put Bactine all over it. Dr. Brian Russell, they started laughing. The mother and the father start laughing at the little girl. Yeah, I mean, as if it weren't irresponsible and negligent enough to let a situation happen

in that household, allegedly, where the kid got access to marijuana. Here we now have the parents finding out about it and allegedly not even being concerned, not taking the kid to the emergency room, as Dr. Moroney said would have been the responsible thing to do. But actually thinking it was funny to see the effects of marijuana intoxication on this little, little kid.

And this is the problem that I always point out to the marijuana legalization crowd. I don't care if an adult wants to fry their mind on whatever in their privacy of their own home. It would be fine with me if there were no way for that behavior to end up affecting the rest of us. But that's always the problem. And if you ask one of these legalization activists, well, in exchange for the freedom to use this that you say you want the freedom to do, are you willing to agree that if you ever use it in such a way that it gets around a child, or you ever use it when you're supposed to be parenting a child, or you ever end up on the road intoxicated on it you've got a mandatory minimum five years behind bars they say no

they want the freedom without the responsibility and that we can't have okay dr brian russell i know you you think you've seen it all that's what i always think too after all the cases i prosecuted all the bad guys they put in jail all the cases i cover i think well i've seen it all. That's what I always think, too. After all the cases I prosecuted, all the bad guys they put in jail, all the cases I cover, I think, well, I've seen it all. Well, here's a shock. You haven't. Not only did they start laughing at the 21-month-old baby girl tripping thanks to mommy feeding her pot and her mac and cheese. Dr. Brian Russell, I hope you are sitting down. They then take her outside and throw her in a pool to, quote, shock her out of the high. A 21-month-old baby

then put in the backyard pool, the cold water, they say to shock her, Dr. Russell, help me out. I mean, these people need to be tarred and feathered, the mother and the father. And why isn't the dad behind bars? Why is just the mom arrested? But let me start with the pool, Dr. Russell. That's a great question why they're not both arrested. And the pool, the idea that their concern, allegedly, for this kid was so little that they thought that, well, maybe we'll splash some cold water from the pool on the child, and that will be the extent of our treatment

for this intoxication that we've allowed to happen in the house is enough for me as somebody who's been an expert in child custody cases to say I wouldn't be comfortable with that child ever going back to that household with these two. Well, I agree with you, Dr. Brian Russell. To Dr. William Maroney, renowned medical examiner, author of a new book, American Narcan. Dr. Maroney, apparently the Department of Child Safety in Arizona feels the same way because they have removed her other children and she's in court whining and carrying on.

Take a listen to the mom. Here she is in court and she breaks down and starts crying. She's a Tempe, Arizona mom who allegedly makes marijuana mac and cheese, Elena Marie Limpert, and feeds it to her 21-month-old little girl. Listen. State your name and date of birth. Elena Marie Limpert, 12-22-92. Okay, you're here on a Superior Court new case alleging one count of child abuse, class four felony. I've appointed a lawyer to represent you. Your next hearing will be a status conference on April 19th at 830.

I am going to release you to pretrial services with drug testing and monitoring and on an ankle monitor. Yes, ma'am. And you will have a number of conditions, including you will have to have times your leaving of the house will be restricted by the hours set or approved by your pretrial officers. You will have no contact with any children, minor children. Mine? Any of your children.

For how long? You will not have any contact with any minors, including the alleged victim. Okay. And no contact with the, if you have any co-defendant on this case.

A co-defendant, I'm sorry. I don't know if you're, the alleged father has been charged or not. If he has not, then you can have contact, but you will not have any contact with any minors. No, he has not been charged or in any custody, nothing. All right. Another thing to Dr. William Maroney, the father allegedly didn't know about the THC until after the little girl ate it. But I don't care because while the little girl is tripped, A, he knows it's in the house, number one, because this woman, the mother, his wife,

she is, let me just say, a marijuana enthusiast. She is listed as the CEO at Marijuana Demographic and has images with marijuana paraphernalia on all of her social media. In the home, there are two marijuana grow tents, 20 plants, mushrooms, bongs, pipes, hash oil in the fridge. There are three large tubs of THC butter. So she breaks down and cries at the court appearance. But long story short, what about the dad? Because when the little girl, the 21-month-old tot starts tripping, he starts laughing and puts her in

the cold water in the backyard. Why isn't he behind bars? Here's what I would say. He didn't prepare the butter. He didn't prepare the meal. And he only had access to that knowledge after. Here's the hard part about this. They recognized that there was something wrong because they went to the pool, but they didn't have enough concern to bring it to somebody's attention medically. So you can't say that they didn't know because they recognized they needed

something, but they chose a pool instead of a best practice medical exam, an ER, an urgent care to bring it or to call 911. You know, how do you, what, what if there was seizures?

What happens if they gave this to a child and a child had seizures what if there was they stopped breathing you call 9-1-1 you would call 9-1-1 all the time if you couldn't take the child so um there's not a lot of parental support here this goes way beyond parenting classes. There's ethical and moral debates about how they care for their children. Guys, we were talking about a Tempe, Arizona mother who has marijuana throughout the home, three large tubs of marijuana butter that she used to make mac and cheese. Her daughter, 21 months old, starts tripping, likely delusions, and they put her in the cold water in the outdoor pool. Mom behind bars right now. Let me just say, a marijuana enthusiast.

Dr. William Maroney, what about the incidence of deaths, car crashes, other forms of death related to the legalization of marijuana? Where does that stand right now? tell you based on state police studies that we have 56% of fatal car crashes are marijuana positive contributing to the fatal crash. 56%. This is not a small problem. And as states roll out cannabis rights and cannabis access, that's going to go up because the preceding decade has fed a false dialogue of, oh, this is safer than beer. Oh, well, this isn't that bad. Oh, this doesn't cause it. No, any substance. It's never an argument of this is safer than beer so you can drive. They're both bad. It's a false choice. There are not a good and a bad here. There's a bad and a bad. We know that fatal crashes are up in Colorado, but you know what else we know? Toxic emergency room pediatric exposures are up in Colorado. So they did not think out the access here to give adults access to cannabis and to prevent pediatric exposures, to prevent fatal motor vehicle crashes. They're up. And the only reason they got away with the safe dialogue is there wasn't enough time to measure it. When we finish a full decade, people will understand the woe and will have cannabis on the wrong side of fatal motor vehicle crashes. You can't judge that it's safe in one or two years. You have to look for five or six, and we're beginning to see that roll in.

Fifty-six percent of fatal car crashes are cannabis posse in toxicology in the autopsy. That's across the nation. You know, I don't understand it, too. Dr. Brian Russell, host of Investigation Discovery's Fatal Vows. Dr. Brian, I know it makes me sound crazy to rail against the legalization of marijuana. But I prosecuted in inner city Atlanta. I saw crime, marijuana-related violent crime. And it literally breaks my heart to know that our governments have allowed this to happen.

People don't know. They're not expected to know these statistics that Maroney's throwing out. And he's right. They're not expected to have seen what I saw in court. They don't know. They believe, as Dr. Maroney said, the dialogue dialogue that, hey, it's like having a couple of beers. Now, fatal car crashes, 56% of them related to marijuana. We have really screwed up letting this get legalized. You're right. You don't sound crazy to me at all. In fact, you know, think about alcohol for a minute. We have legal alcohol

in this country. And I think that's, I don't have a problem with that because there's a way to enjoy alcohol that is not about getting intoxicated and losing your faculties. Now, think about the percentage of people you know who at some point in their lives try drinking alcohol. I would say in my life it's close to 100. I know just a few people who are adults who have never had a drop of alcohol in their lives. Now think about a country in which that same percentage of people end up at some point playing around with marijuana. I don't think I want to live in that country. And I don't think you probably want to live in that country because a substantial percentage of those people will continue to play around with it

and other things of a more potent nature. And it really is not analogous to alcohol in the sense that there's no purpose of these substances, no way to enjoy them that's not about getting intoxicated and blunting, if not completely shutting down your faculties. This is what we know. This Tempe, Arizona mom behind bars right now, crying over being away from her children. Well, I don't want to sound harsh, but the reality is you keep three tubs of pot butter in your fridge and make mac and cheese out of it. What do you think is going to happen?

Nancy Grace, Crime Stories, signing off. Goodbye, friend. This is an iHeart Podcast.