Crime Stories with Nancy Grace - DECAPITATED DURING BIRTH, Staff Swaddles Baby, Replaces Head for Mom's 1st Peek at Baby Treveon Isaiah

Episode Date: February 12, 2024

Treveon Isaiah Taylor, Jr., is to be the first child of Jessica Ross and Treveon Isaiah Taylor, Sr.   In the early morning of July 9,  Jessica Ross's water broke and she went into labor at 37 weeks gestation. At 8:40 pm, after over 10 hours of labor, she was fully dilated and her doctors told her to start pushing. It was at this point during delivery that Treveon Taylor Jr.'s shoulders got stuck.  Jessica Ross and Treveon Taylor Sr. asked the doctor to perform a c-section.  Dr. Tracey St. Julian reportedly continues to try and force a vaginal birth and Jessica Ross continues to push. At 9:26 pm the fetal monitor showed an abnormal fetal heartbeat and the heart rate continued to decrease for the next hour and 10 minutes.  By 10:36, there is no sign of a fetal heartbeat on the monitoring strips and Dr. St. Julian preps to perform an emergency c-section.  At 12:11 am the baby's body and legs are delivered by c-section, but his head is delivered vaginally. The baby is decapitated during the birth process.  Joining Nancy Grace Today: Dale Carson – Criminal Defense Attorney (Jacksonville), Former FBI Agent, Former Police Officer, Author: “Arrest-Proof Yourself;” X: @DaleCarsonLaw Dr. Heidi Green - Clinical Psychologist, Trauma Specialist,  and Author: ‘The Path to Self-Love and World Domination,www.drheidigreen.com, IG: @drheidigreen  Barry Hutchison Sr. – Former Law Enforcement, Owner & Chief Investigator for Barry & Associates Investigative Services LLC Joe Scott Morgan – Professor of Forensics: Jacksonville State University, Author, “Blood Beneath My Feet,” and Host: “Body Bags with Joseph Scott Morgan;” Twitter/X: @JoScottForensic Dr. Maneesha Pandey – Chief Forensic Pathologist for Forensic Pathologists LLC in Ohio, Board-Certified Forensic Pathologist Ashli Lincoln - Investigative Reporter, WSBTV Channel 2 News in Atlanta; IG: @ Ashlijoi, FB & X: @AshliLincoln   Nicole Partin – CrimeOnline.com Investigative Reporter; X: @nicolepartin  See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an iHeart Podcast. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. I, like many, many mothers across the world, can easily say that the happiest day of my life is when I first saw my twins John David and Lucy. I remember the moment like it happened yesterday. It was a very very difficult birth. Lucy and I almost died but the doctors at Northside Hospital saved our lives and I remember died, but the doctors at Northside Hospital saved our lives. And I remember the moment and the joy I felt when I locked eyes with them. This mother, not so lucky.

Imagine the shock, the grappling with what she was hearing when she learns her baby has been decapitated, decapitated during birth at the hospital. How did that happen? Because after the birth, she saw the baby. The baby was wrapped tightly in a blanket with his little head peeking out of the blanket. What happened? How does a tiny baby, an infant, a newborn, get decapitated at birth and the staff shows mommy the baby with the head on? I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. Thank you for being with us here at Crime Stories and on Sirius XM 111. I can tell you this much. I want one answers to justice. If that hospital has to fall down around us, I want justice, not just for the parents, but for this baby and for future children

that are going to be delivered in similar circumstances. I don't want another mother to hear what this mother heard. First of all, listen to this. And then this is the most egregious part. It is normal, natural, proper, and right for parents after the baby is deceased to say, I want to see my baby. I want to hold my baby, I want to touch the baby's fingers before we put the baby away. And they wanted that also. The staff at Southern Regional Medical Center, they lied to them and said, you cannot hold your baby,

you cannot touch your baby. And when they did not accept that, when they didn't accept it, they persisted. Then Southern Regional Medical Center, they capitulated a little bit. They said, okay, you can look at your child through a glass window and they wrap the baby tightly in a blanket, prop the baby's head up on the body, and set the baby up through a glass window, basically making it look like there was no decapitation. Once again, just defrauding and lying to this young couple.

What am I hearing? What am I hearing? Joining me in the all-star panel, but first I want to go to Ashley Lincoln, investigative reporter, WSB-TV, Channel 2, News Atlanta. Ashley, thank you for being with us. What? Through a glass window? Couldn't touch the baby?

The baby's all wrapped up tightly? Tell me what happened. It's insane, Nancy. I mean, we were all shocked when we got the tip that this even happened. We couldn't believe it. Wait a minute. Whoa, whoa, whoa, Ashley. Mm-hmm.

Let me understand something. Dr. Manisha Pandey is with me, Chief Forensic Pathologist, LLC in Ohio. And she has witnessed a decapitation of a baby during birth when she was just a resident. She was watching. Question to you, simple question, Dr. Pandy, was this to your understanding an internal decapitation? In other words, like Shankwela Robinson, where she was hit so hard in the head, her head became disattached to her spine, but it looked like it was still on.

The skin was holding the head on the body. Do you understand this to be internal decapitation where the head is actually still on the body? Or did they have to take the head and put it on top of the body? This was a complete decapitation, meaning the head was completely separate from the body. Joe Scott Morgan joining me, renowned death investigator. Joe Scott, do you understand? I mean, I've read the autopsy report 10 times, but I'm just a JD. I understand it to be an external decapitation.

In other words, it wasn't just the dislocation of the baby's head. The baby's head was totally off the body. You're right, you are. In that sense, the baby's head had to be delivered separately from the torso, Nancy, in this particular case. So that would lead us to believe that this was something that probably occurred from a procedural standpoint. Hold on, hold on. Let's not put the cart before the horse, Joe Scott Morgan. Yep.

Nicole Parton also joining me, CrimeOnline.com investigative reporter, but back to Ashley Lincoln with WSBT-TV. You were saying you couldn't believe it when you heard this tip. Pick it up right there, Ashley. I just wanted to make sure I understood what exactly happened. Yeah, what we know is that the baby was decapitated through the sheer force that the doctor was applying pressure when trying to get the baby through the birth canal. And that's all based off the lawsuit that the family has filed. Guys, what do we know? What? How? Look, there are difficult deliveries all over the world every minute that happens. I worked on a big case, an antitrust case dealing with certified nurse midwives and doctors, and it dealt specifically with normal vaginal births. I learned more about deliveries than I ever thought I would.

There have been a lot of difficult deliveries, but to you, Dr. Pandy, I've heard of having to pull the baby out of the vaginal tract, but decapitating the baby? Yes. So it can happen when there is like very long labor and the baby is stuck, especially when the shoulders are stuck at the vaginal canal. So the one which I had witnessed as a medical student is there was long labor and they were pushing, pushing. And the OB, she was just pulling at the head and the head just came out. So that was back in India. Have you ever seen this happen in the U.S., Dr. Pandy?

No, I did not. Neither have I. Joe Scott Morgan, in all of the deaths that you have investigated, thousands, over 10,000 deaths, many of them homicide, many of them not homicide. Have you ever heard of a baby being decapitated by a doctor during delivery at a hospital? Have you ever seen this happen in the U.S. ever in all your years? Joe Scott Morgan. Never. No. So that's a no.

No, ma'am. Never. What exactly happened? It's not just that the baby's decapitated. The infant decapitated. And I'm having a really hard time saying that because I keep thinking back and thinking back to when John David and Lucy were born and how they were swaddled very tightly. And the nurse first held up John David. And I remember I was so weak,

I couldn't even sit up to kiss him. So I put a kiss on his forehead and they rushed off with him. And then they held up Lucy same way. They showed this mom and dad the baby and the head was on there. So what was everybody around taking part in the subterfuge? Let's trick the mom and put the baby's head on top and wrap it. Who did that? Whose idea was that? OK, again, I'm putting the cart before the horse.

Listen to investigative reporter Sydney Sumner, Crime Online. Jessica Ross and Travion Taylor Sr. are told their baby is not alive, but the hospital refuses to let them see or hold their baby. Ross and Taylor continue to argue with the hospital staff about seeing and touching their baby until the hospital agrees to let the couple view their child from behind a glass window. They couldn't touch their baby, they could only look at him. Travion Isaiah Taylor Jr. has been wrapped very tightly and his head is propped on his body so as to appear that it's attached. The couple has no idea as to the actual condition of their baby. We just want justice for our son. They lied to us.

They didn't let us touch him. We don't like it. We just want justice for our son. The mother cannot even speak. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Dr. Heidi Green joining us from Vancouver, clinical psychologist, trauma specialist and author of The Path to Self-Love and World Domination. Dr. Heidi Green, thank you for being with us. Dr. Heidi, you hear dad turning to the mom and going, do you want to say anything?

She can't even say no. She just shakes her head. She can't even speak. Dr. Heidi, the effect this is going to have on this mom and dad. And it's not just the doctor. Somebody had to go along with cleaning the baby up from the birth, cleaning the baby's head up from the birth, putting a little hat on the baby's head, not attached to a body, wrapping it up and propping it there for the mom to see, and going to the extra precaution of telling them they couldn't hold the baby. They had to look at their baby through a glass.

Nancy, this mother has been through trauma upon trauma upon trauma in this situation. My understanding is that her baby's head was delivered at a different time than the body. She didn't even know what was going on in the moment with her own body. Nobody is communicating with her about what's happening. She has no idea what's going on with her own body or with her baby. And then to be lied to by doctors, to have to argue with doctors. Can you imagine? You've just been told that your baby is dead and now you have to get into an argument with the doctors who are supposed to be giving you compassionate care, helping you understand what in the world just happened. But instead, they're lying to you.

You're having to argue for your rights. As a parent, when you lose a baby in the hospital in childbirth, you have a right to hold that baby. That's part of the grieving process. It's important to be able to spend some time with that child and to take some pictures if you want to. Many parents choose to do that as well. Their entire grieving process was stymied by the way that the medical staff interacted with them in this effort to cover up. And so then to have to look at their baby and not even know that this baby's head was not attached to its body, to find that out days later, here's the third or fourth or fifth trauma at this point when they find out this information. It's just unreal to me the way that this was handled and how a situation that is horrible, of course, was just made so much worse by the way that the medical professionals handled the situation and engaged with the parents.

Ashley Lincoln joining us from WSB TV Channel 2. Ashley, explain to me what you have uncovered, what you have learned about them trying to prop the baby up so the parents would look at the baby and think everything was okay, and then try to get mom and dad to agree to a cremation. Yeah, it was an extensive cover-up process that we noted after going through the lawsuit. This didn't just involve the OBGYN, but several nurses and other medical staff

at that hospital. They did not tell the parents what exactly happened to that baby's body, yet alone, as you mentioned, they couldn't even touch their newborn. And when all that was happening, the family was getting pressure from hospital staff to cremate the baby.

And their attorneys tend to think that that was their effort to try to cover any evidence of the decapitation. We do know the hospital did not notify the medical examiner's office immediately, which is protocol. They should have done that. Instead, they just had the baby transported to the funeral home. The family, they had a sense that something was wrong,

and thankfully they did not go through with that cremation. Well, hold on. Let me ask you about the propping the baby up part. Tell me, when they were looking through a glass window, how did that whole thing go down? Yeah, from what we understand is that they took the baby after they pulled it out of the mom's body and then took the child to another room where they swaddled it very, very tightly. And then they put it in a, I believe like the newborn NICU type unit that typically preemies are in. And they have the baby in one of those devices and pop the baby's head on top with it being swaddled very, very tightly. And the couple, they're very, very young. I mean,

in their early 20s, I just think through that trauma of being on a high, thinking you're about to have a baby and learning that your baby did not make it through the pregnancy, they were just, they were in shock. And I don't think they knew to ask the exact questions that should have been asked because they were so young. And they leaned on medical staff to guide them. They trusted in their doctors and the medical staff, and they truly believed what staff was telling them. The dad is 22 and had been with the mom for years. As a matter of fact, let's backtrack.

How did the whole thing unfold? Take a listen to our friends at Crime Online. Jessica Ross and Travion Taylor meet when they are both students at North Clayton High School in Atlanta. They eagerly anticipate the birth of their first child, a boy they are naming Travion Isaiah Taylor Jr. They decided on Premier Care for Women because they were close by and because there were women doctors there, so they felt they would get the best care possible. At 10 a.m. on July 9th, Jessica Ross's water broke, and she went into labor at 37 weeks gestation.

At 8.40 p.m., after over 10 hours of labor, she was fully dilated, and her doctors told her to start pushing. 10 hours of labor. Is that normal? I had an emergency C-section because Lucy was dying. So I don't know. What does that mean? Dr. Pandy, is 10 hours normal? Yeah, I mean, people have 15, 18 hours as well. But the thing is that you have to make sure that everyone is doing okay. So 10 hours of labor, and then suddenly the fetal monitors at this hospital, Southern Regional Medical Center, the monitors show there is no more fetal heartbeat. I mean, let me ask you this, Scott Morgan, don't those fetal monitors show me? I saw my dad's monitor as he was dying. And we had plenty of notice that his heart rate was decreasing. His blood pressure was

decreasing. We could see it right over his bed. So it's hard for me to believe that suddenly out of the blue, there's just no heartbeat. I would think that it would get fainter and fainter. What's the norm? Of course it would. And, you know, this is not like when my kids were born, you know, many, many years ago. And there were fetal monitors then. Now this is so fine-tuned that there would be an awareness. And, again, this goes to the professionalism or lack thereof of the staff in the middle of all of this,

in this storm that has been going on. You had mentioned just a second ago how she had been pushing for 10 hours at this point. And they have a close watch on this. And then all of a sudden you see the monitor begin to tank. You know that something is wrong and you have to initiate heroic measures at that point in time. And the idea that this course was chosen is just baffling to me, Nancy. You just said, Joe Scott Morgan, you said the storm was going on this scenario because as you correctly pointed out,

Joe Scott Morgan, who has investigated thousands of human deaths, you would have seen distress happening. Isn't that true, Dr. Manisha Pandey, that a beeper goes off? You can look up there and see that the heart rate is slipping away. Yes. I mean, they should be able to see it because everything starts beeping. So all, I mean, has anybody been in the hospital and you hear that constant beep, beep, beep, beep, beep? You hear it all night long when something goes wrong. I heard it all night, every night I was in the hospital.

I would hear one of my monitors going off. There had to be a monitor going off, but now we hear all of a sudden, boom! There's no heartbeat. They created the storm. Listen to Dave Mack, Crime Online. Dr. Tracy St. Julian continues to try and force a vaginal birth, and Jessica Ross continues to push. At 9.26 p.m., the fetal monitor showed an abnormal fetal heartbeat, and the heart rate continues to decrease for the next hour and 10 minutes,

while Dr. St. Julian continues to have Ross push. By 10.36 p.m., there is no sign of a fetal heartbeat. Three hours and 10 minutes after Travion Jr.'s shoulder got stuck and Jessica Ross and Travion Taylor Sr. asked for a C-section to be performed, Dr. St. Julian performs an emergency C-section at 11.49 p.m. At 12.11 a.m., the baby's body and legs are delivered by C-section and his head is delivered vaginally. When I first heard that, I had to read it again. The body was delivered by C-section. The baby's head, Trayvon Isaiah Jr.'s head was delivered vaginally. Now, did you hear the timing? And isn't it true, Dale Carson? Dale Carson, joining me, high-profile lawyer out of

Jacksonville, former FBI. Isn't it true the devil is lurking in the details? And if you don't know the details, as a good trial lawyer, you're crap. You're not worth the salt that goes in your bread. Isn't that true, Dale Carson? That is absolutely true, Nancy. Did you hear this detail? Did you hear this detail? At 9.26 p.m., the fetal monitor showed abnormal fetal heartbeat. The heartbeat continues to decrease, decrease, decrease.

10.36. There is no heartbeat. So they all sat there on their thumbs while the heartbeat totally stopped and did nothing. Wait, that's 10.36. And then correct me if I'm wrong, Ashley Lincoln, and I know that you will, 1036 at 1149, they do the C-section. They waited multiple hours before doing the cesarean section. And it was also noted that not only no one else, a part of the medical staff advocated for a cesarean section. And you know what I heard, Ashley, when I was researching the case, is that the dad, Taylor Sr., and the mom, Jessica, both asked for a C-section. As soon as they heard

his shoulder wouldn't come through vaginally, they wanted a C-section right then. And it was well over an hour, nearly two hours before the doctor said, okay, we'll do a C. Is that right, Ashley? Yeah, that is correct. And you got to keep in mind just how small the mom is. I believe she's only four feet, nine inches. She's a tiny woman. So I'm sure she really felt that strain and pressure when that baby became lost in her birth canal. Then we have the whole cover up. Tell me again about the cover up, Ashley. Yeah. It's to our knowledge after the doctor and staff realized what happened. They went into a bad move, but they started to recover up their actions. They took the baby. They swallowed the baby.

Didn't tell the mom and dad what happened. Again, they wouldn't let mom and dad even touch the baby. So that's compounded on top of everything else. And we do know they did not follow protocol by notifying proper management at the hospital what happened. They did not notify the medical examiner's office what happened. On top of, they started pressuring the family to consider cremating their newborn. Ashley Lincoln, hold on right there. Barry Hutchinson Sr. is joining me. Former veteran law enforcement officer,

owner, chief investigator for Barry and Associates Investigative Services. Joining us out of Kansas, Barry Hutchinson. Of course, I'm not a private eye, but I know this much. When your nurses and the doctors start hanging over you going, you ought to do cremation. Have you considered cremation? The baby just died. And right then they all troop in and tell mom to get a cremation. I tell you what, I would get every name of every person that trooped into that room and told her to get a cremation. I mean, that's a big red flag, Barry Hutchinson. I would agree with that 100%, Nancy. I think it's a big red flag, Barry Hutchinson. I would agree with that 100 percent, Nancy.

I think it's a nightmare. You know, there's such a thing in the medical field is called standards of care. And I think that that has been grossly violated in this instance, just from the very start to even to the end. And one thing that I wanted to ask a question about here, and there's a very specific reason why I'm asking it. And those of you that have read the autopsy report, does it have any indication in there of an episiotomy taking place as well while they were trying to extract the child's head from the mother? To Joscott Morgan, who has very carefully reviewed the autopsy along with me, there's nothing in the baby's autopsy that would reveal whether the mother had an episiotomy, which is basically when the baby can't come through

vaginally. The surgeon makes a cut, slices between the vagina and the rectum to enlarge an opening for the child to be born. Do I have that right, Joe Scott? Yeah, you're absolutely right, Nancy. And it's my belief that that data is going to be contained within the mother's medical records. If they were in such a state of heightened emergency for the mother and the baby, they would want to extract the baby as quickly as possible, whether it's through the birth canal or C-section. If an episiotomy wasn't done, that shows that they weren't in a heightened state of emergency. And as far as my opinion, at least they didn't exhaust all means of emergency from my standpoint to try to extricate the child, you know, and save the mother's life and the baby's life right away.

It just seems to me like they drug their feet through the entire process. And it's just terrific how they handled everything. I mean, correct me if I'm wrong, but I think that's an important piece of information. Barry Hutchinson Sr., you're absolutely correct. And I did not think of that. You're right. If there had been a problem during the 10 hours of labor and the fetal heartbeat dropping, why not do an episiotomy and get the baby out?

And you wouldn't have even had a dislocated shoulder if you had done the episiotomy because there would have been more room other than the vaginal opening to get the baby out. That's such an important detail, Barry. And listen, I know this is very dark what I'm about to say, but when you begin to think about, you use the term subterfuge relative to the baby's presentation. I got to tell you, I don't know. I don't know if I were an investigator that I would trust anything in the mama's medical records. I would take a long look at them,

who all is involved in this when it comes to a procedural perspective, because it seems like they're trying to cover their rear end in this case. Did you see the analysis in the autopsy of the musculoskeletal system of the baby, baby Trevor Isaiah Jr.? The axiom in the appendicular skeleton is unremarkable. The skeletal muscles are normally developed and unremarkable. In other words, this baby was fine. There was nothing wrong at all with this baby physically. Nothing at all.

No, this child, this little angel was viable, Nancy. You have to, I mean, we have to say it plainly here. This is a viable baby at this point in time. And that's why this is so very egregious, I think. Also, where you have near the end of the autopsy report, everybody jump in. I know you've all reviewed it. Summary of findings and pathologic diagnoses. Fetal demise related to delivery complications.

That's putting it mildly. Delivery complications caused by the doctor in the hospital. And we reached out to the hospital and, you know, they did not want me to ask them any questions. History of shoulder dystocia. Isn't that, doesn't that just mean the shoulder was dislocated, Joe Scott? Yeah. And it goes to the size of the child that's trying to pass through this vaginal. And that's an assessment that the practitioner makes and tries to understand that. However, I got to say that point two, looking at this, this is key. Dale mentioned this just a second ago about homicide. They're listing terminal. Everybody hear that word,

terminal decapitation. That means that this brought about the end of this baby's life so they're not saying that the head was removed from the body in the autopsy report and there's a reason for that it was here this is six days later it shows up six days later the body has been in a funeral home and god only knows what's been it's been put through during that time and so this is a criminal investigation it seems clear otherwise it wouldn't have been handled by the medical examiner's office It's been put through during that time. And so this is a criminal investigation. It seems clear. Otherwise, it wouldn't have been handled by the medical examiner's office. So anyone connected with this matter is subject to conspiracy charge in connection with an involuntary homicide.

I don't know that I would go with involuntary. Uh-uh. N-O. They knew what they were doing. That doctor knew what the doctor was doing. Uh-uh. N-O. They knew what they were doing. That doctor knew what the doctor was doing. Uh-uh, N-O. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Back to the summary of pathologic diagnoses. B, head trauma, extensive subscalpular hemorrhage.

That means bruising and bleeding. Posterior cranial fossa fracture. The cranium was fractured. Okay. You have to read every word of this autopsy to understand what happened to this baby. The skull, the cranium was fractured. There is bleeding, hemorrhage, neck trauma, soft tissue hemorrhage. Hemorrhage means trauma soft tissue hemorrhage hemorrhage means bleeding which turns into a bruise yes no joe scott yes yes you're absolutely right normally formed and developed infant male absence of natural disease absence of any congenital abnormalities. This baby was perfect. And it doesn't end there.

Oh, no, it doesn't end there. Did you hear Dale Carson say the funeral home contacted the medical examiner? Okay, listen to Dave Mack, Crime Online. When Jessica Ross and Travion Taylor Sr. ask questions about what happened, they're rebuffed. They ask about having an autopsy done. Hospital staff tells them they're not entitled to a free autopsy. The hospital staff also strongly encourages the couple to have the baby cremated. Ross and Taylor refuse to have their baby cremated, and the hospital has the body of Travion Isaiah Taylor Jr. sent to Willie A. Watkins' funeral home.

Okay, let me understand something, Joe Scott Morgan. You're the expert in issuing death certificates. They tried to tell the parents, well, you'll have to pay for an autopsy. That's BS. That's not true. I've never had a victim's family have to pay for an autopsy, ever. Yeah, and who wound up having to report this to the medical examiner, Nancy? It was a funeral home, just as you had pointed out. It goes outside the boundaries of normal practice here because this is, listen, I worked for the ME for a long, long time and we had stillbirths.

Now, these are stillbirths, OK, which this was not. This child did not die in utero. That's why they say there's no maceration there. There's a term that's used there that means that I won't go into all the details, but just so that we know this was a viable child when they rolled into the hospital. Back to an autopsy, which was the question. Hint, hint, back on the road, out of the weeds. Think to the families don't have to pay for an autopsy. Do they? No. If they reported this case to the ME, Nancy, the ME would have come, taken this baby,

and they would have done a post at that very moment in time from the hospital. You can take that to the bank, I promise you. It was not reported to them. Listen to Nicole Parton. Sylvia Watkins is the general manager for Willie A. Watkins Funeral Home. When the body of Travion Isaiah Taylor Jr. arrived at the funeral home from the hospital, she knew immediately something was wrong. A body in this condition, where the head is not attached to the body, would normally come from the medical examiner's office, not the hospital. Having never

seen anything like this before, Watkins notifies the medical examiner's office about the condition of the dead infant. The hospital did notify the medical examiner's office about the death of the baby, but they were not aware of the condition of the baby until the funeral home notified them. The funeral home also notified Jessica Ross and Travion Isaiah Taylor about the condition of their baby. Joining me right now is investigative reporter Nicole Parton, who also has an expertise and extensive knowledge in the services of funeral homes and embalmment. Nicole Parton, thank you for being with us in all of your expertise. Have you ever seen anything like it?

I have not. And I have cared for close to 200 infants that have came from the hospital that have passed either stillborn or passed during childbirth. I have never, ever seen a child that was decapitated during the birth. Now, what is the procedure in a funeral home when the hospital sends a body over and the funeral home looks at the body and says, this isn't right.

How did this go down, Nicole? Because it's more subterfuge, hiding, cover up. They want to get the baby from the hospital to the funeral home. Hopefully, the hospital wants her to have a cremation so there's no evidence of what has happened, but the parents refuse the cremation so the baby gets sent to the funeral home. What happens upon intake? And this funeral home did everything right. So upon intake of a body, of course, the deceased individual is received and staff of that funeral home will open the body bag, will confirm the name, the ID numbers, and will begin to evaluate the body. In this baby's case, immediately the staff said, wait a minute, the head is detached from the body.

This is not normal. Under no circumstances whatsoever would the funeral home receive a body from the hospital in that manner. Anytime the death is suspicious or uncommon or the person passed away from something other than what they were being treated for, immediately the medical examiner's office would have been involved, not the funeral home first. So the funeral home recognizes the mistake and right away calls the medical examiner's office. You're right, Nicole Parton. Again, the manager of Watkins Funeral Home, Sylvania Watkins, says that she recalls the intake of baby Trayvon Isaiah Jr.'s body and realized something was wrong, horribly wrong, that it was a red flag, her words, not mine, a red flag that the baby's body had come from Southern Regional Medical Center to the funeral home in

this condition. So what did she do upon getting the baby's body with the head disattached, Ashley? She contacted the Clayton County Medical Examiner's Office because they knew protocol wasn't followed and they knew something was off. It was the funeral home, not the hospital, who first informed anyone, including the parents, of the baby's state. Is that correct, Ashley? In other words, they heard from the funeral home their baby had been decapitated. The family did find out from the funeral home. St. Julian, she just told them at the hospital

that he passed. And it was the funeral home who notified the family. To Joe Scott Morgan, professor of forensics at Jacksonville State University, author of Blood Beneath My Feet, and host of a hit series, Body Bags. And when I say professor of forensics at Jacksonville State University, their criminal justice and forensics program is amazing. Joe Scott, during an autopsy, I didn't realize this until I prosecuted my first homicide. It's very typical, SOP, standard operating procedure, to take photos of the deceased that in the future may be used at trial. Is that correct?

Yes, that's correct, Nancy. And why are photos taken of the deceased's body? Because you're freezing that moment in time. You can't go back to it at all. And so the people in the courtroom, they have to be oriented to what the physician is saying, the forensic pathologist on the stand. That's their sole purpose is to document what precisely happened that led up to this terminal event, and the doctor can explain it vis-a-vis the pictures. Guys, after this mom and dad find out their baby has had its head cut off, cut off during delivery, it didn't just happen as part of the delivery. The baby's head was cut off.

They hire someone to do an independent autopsy. Listen. Jessica Ross and Travion Taylor say they hired Dr. Jackson Gates to perform an autopsy. Dr. Gates charged $2,500 to perform the autopsy, then took video and pictures of the decapitated baby and posted the media to Instagram without permission. The family didn't know about this for days. Roderick Edmond is quoted as saying, what educational value is it to anybody to view a picture of a decapitated baby? A cease and desist was issued and the photos and videos were taken down. However, days later, two more videos from the Travion Isaiah Taylor Jr.'s autopsy were published to Gates' Instagram page. The new videos included the autopsy of the chest cavity and the cranial cavity of the child.

Ashley Lincoln does it never end, the pain and the suffering of this young mom and dad. So they get this independent autopsy, and the guy that performs the autopsy posts, or somebody in the office posts, the photos of the dead baby online? What, on Insta? Is this real? It is real, unfortunately. I mean, my mouth dropped. I was like, yet another layer of trauma for this family. And they were posted by that doctor, that independent pathologist that the family hired. They thought that they

were doing something good, hiring an outside help since they couldn't trust the hospital, yet alone to have their trust disrupted again by this doctor. The doctor told me, I spoke with him directly, he says he had the family's consent to post the photos. Clearly, that's something the family and their attorneys are denying. And the doctor, he was firm in that he thought him posting this was for educational purposes. He has other photos of other autopsies posted on his Instagram page. And the family sent a cease and desist. The Internet, they could be everywhere by now.

But even if they're down now, Dale Carson, they were up. Certainly. You heard Joe Scott Morgan. I've used autopsy photos at trial before, and I would make sure nobody could see them except the jurors because it's awful and it's disrespectful. This is a little baby, and they posted them online? Well, yes, they did, and they'll never come down

because there are people who want to see that kind of material. Is that true, Barry Hutchinson Sr.? Absolutely, it's true. It's already on the dark web, I'm sure. And just like Joe said, there's a lot of sick people out there in the world that will pay good money to see these type of morbid images. And, you know, it's sickening and it's horrific. No offense to you, Barry Hutchinson, but you're making me sick.

Think about it. After what the mom and dad have been through, she's so happy to have this baby. They've been together for years. They're having their first baby. It's a baby boy. They're naming it after dad. He's going to be a junior.

Ten hours of labor and the baby is decapitated. I don't mean internal decapitation where the head is still attached to the body by skin and the head is just loose from the spine. I mean full on head off the body. The body of the baby boy is delivered by C-section. His head is delivered vaginally. Now, at Dr. Jackson Gates' office, they posted online for freaks to look at. Yeah, it's down now. How many cease and desist or cease and desist orders did it take to get it down? But it's down now. But it's just like Barry Hutchinson, Sr. and Dale Carson are saying.

There's something called the dark web. People actually pay money for this type of a morbid photo. Listen to Cindy Sumner, Crime Online. Jessica Ross and Travion Taylor claim he did this to increase views of his social media accounts and increase his own notoriety. Calling it diabolical, Dr. Rod Edmonds told Fox 5 Atlanta after all the abuse this young couple has suffered, Dr. Gates continued to perpetuate it by posting photos and videos of their decapitated son on Instagram. The couple accused Gates of taking $2,500 to perform an autopsy on the baby and then posting a full face picture and videos of his organs on Instagram. Ashley Link in the case has now been classified as a homicide. And I understand that the local prosecutors there in Clayton County

are pondering charges. What does that mean? Pondering charges. When are we getting a homicide indictment? Yeah, right now, Clayton police confirmed with us last week that their investigation is ongoing. They initially stated they handed the case over to the DA's office, but they since walked that back and they're still investigating. So as soon as they complete their investigation, it'll get handed over to Clayton County District Attorney's Office and they'll have to consider filing charges in this case. Consider bringing charges. I don't know about you, Dale Carson, former FBI. Now I profile lawyer. I love putting a medical doctor on the stand because they think they're smarter than everybody else in the room and actually usually they really are but this one oh i would love love to get them on cross-examination so what's the hold up clayton county you're afraid of cross-examining a medical doctor why are you dragging your feet i volunteer to come try the case for you. Let your voice be heard.

The Clayton County District Attorney, Tasha Mosley. 770-477-3450. Repeat. 770-477-3450. The doctors didn't take up for the baby. The nurses didn't take up for the baby. The nurses didn't take up for the baby. The autopsy doctor made money off the baby and posted pictures of the dead baby's body. Who's going to stand up for the baby? It's time for the Clayton County District Attorney elected to do your job, woman, and bring this to a grand jury.

Also, let's just go all the way to the Attorney General, Christopher Carr. He seems to be a decent guy. 404-651-8600. Repeat, 404-R-A-T-L-O-W-D-O-T-G-A-D-O-T-G-O-V-E. A-G-C-A-R-R-A-T-L-O-W-D-O-T-G-A-D-O-T-G-O-V-E. I'm going to take up for that, baby. Will you join me? Goodbye, family. This is an iHeart Podcast.