Crime Stories with Nancy Grace - Did he really? Convicted pedophile claims he killed little JonBenet Ramsey!

Episode Date: March 5, 2019

Convicted pedophile Gary Oliva is claiming he killed JonBenet Ramsey, the six-year-old girl whose murder is Boulder, Colorado, was one of the biggest crime stories of the last two decades. Nancy Grace looks at the claim and the evidence with Colorado private investigator Bobby Brown, Los Angeles defense lawyer Troy Slaten,  Cold Case Research Institute director Sheryl McCollum, South Carolina medical examiner Dr. Michelle Dupre -- author of "Homicide Investigation Field Guide,"  Crime Stories reporter Robyn Walensky -- author of "Beautiful Life?: The CSI Behind the Casey Anthony Trial & My Observations." Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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with Nancy Grace. We are kidnapped. Hi, please. Explain to me what's going on. Are you... Nancy Ramsey, I'm the mother.

Oh, my God. Please. I'm... Okay, I'm sending an officer over, okay? Please. Do you know how long she's been gone? No, I don't.

Please, we just got out. Can you hear? Oh, my God, please. 22 years after the little pageant princess was found strangled to death in her parents' basement, the murder of JonBenet Ramsey remains one of America's greatest unsolved mysteries. But now we're learning yet another man claims that he committed the gruesome crime. In a series of letters exclusively obtained by Daily Mail TV, convicted pedophile Gary Oliva says he killed the six-year-old.

I get this terrifying phone call. He's screaming, I heard a little girl. It was shock. It was pure shock. Michael Vail recalls the early morning phone call he received from his former high school pal, Gary Oliva. It was December 26, 1996. At the time, Oliva lived blocks from the Ramsey home in Boulder, Colorado. We have a kidnap. All right, please.

That was the same day Patsy Ramsey would make her own frantic call to 911, notifying authorities that her precious little girl was missing. Please explain to me what's going on, okay? There's a note left in our dog's phone. About eight hours later, JonBenet's body was discovered inside a locked room in the basement. I want to be a camel and sweetheart. At six years old, JonBenet had already become a pageant princess and the quest to find her killer garnered international attention. We're here to find

the killer of our daughter. That's been our position for three and a half years. Now, two decades later, Vale says he has a series of disturbing letters from convicted pedophile Gary Oliva that he believes may solve the mystery of JonBenet's death once and for all. That was our friend Jesse Palmer at Daily Mail reporting. And in the background, you could hear JonBenet singing and snippets of her mother, Patsy Ramsey's desperate 911 call. Or was it? Questions still lingering as to who killed the pageant princess, the beautiful little girl, JonBenet, but it's all hit the headlines again when a convicted pedophile already behind bars, Gary Oliva, said, I did it, but do i believe him with me right now an all-star panel troy slayton renowned la defense

lawyer director of the cold case research institute and no stranger to a crime saint cheryl mccollum bobby brown colorado private investigator intimately familiar with this case, medical examiner and author of Homicide Investigation Field Guide. We're very fortunate to have Dr. Michelle Dupree with us today. And joining me right now, crime online investigative reporter, author of Beautiful Life, the CSI behind Casey Anthony trial, Robin Walensky. Robin, who is Gary Oliva? And why now does he jump up and say, oh yeah, I killed JonBenet? Nancy, Gary Oliva was a guy who lived in the area and police had been looking at him. He was a guy who was obsessed with little jean benet and how beautiful she was and in her

little outfits with her teased hair i mean this was a four or five year old girl who looked like hey hey hey hey hey what's wrong with fluffy outfits and teased hair well uh apparently he was very into her look and she really looked like an adult, and I think that's why we've been talking about this case for so many years when those little videos came out of her in her little pageant costumes. She looked so mature. Well, anyway, this guy had hundreds of pictures of her. Hundreds of pictures of her. You know what? As weird as it may be, weird but true, to Bobby Brown, Colorado, private investigator, there sadly are probably thousands of creepy, lonely guys across the country that have hundreds of pictures of JonBenet Ramsey. I'm sorry to have to report that. But he's, I mean, you know, they're a dime a dozen. Pedophiles with obsessions on particular little girls.

I mean, and JonBenet turned out to be fodder for pedophiles all across the country. How many millions of times do you think, Bobby Brown, those videos of her dancing and singing at the pageants completely innocently have been exchanged that's their stock and trade that's what they live for is to get another video of a little girl that that's totally true and it's been shown god knows tens and tens of thousands of times. You ask who believes? I believe that, you know, and when we started, it's like it almost sounded like that Gary Oliva just now had this idea,

well, I'm going to confess to John Bonnet. He has confessed two, three different times over the years, Steve Pease, and I. And one morning, Lou Smith asked me to meet with him at a restaurant that we always met at. I did. It was in September of 2007. And at that time, Lou explained to me, this is when the name Gary Oliva, raises his hand and said, I killed John Bonnet, he might as well get in line. Listen. I've contacted the Ramsey family, especially before Patricia passed away, and I conveyed to her many things,

among them that I am so very sorry for what happened to Jean Benet. And it's very important for me that everyone knows that I love her very much and that her death was unintentional and it was an accident. And I made several efforts to communicate with Patricia before she passed away, and it's my understanding that she did read my letters, and she was aware of me before she passed away. What happened in the basement? It would take several hours to describe that.

If you could be brief. There's no way that I could be brief about it. It's a very involved series of events that require a lot of time and I can't I wouldn't want to to say something briefly about it because it would not first of all it's very painful for me to talk about the only thing that I can say is it's not what it seems to be in every way it's not it's not at all what it seems to be no absolutely not cheryl mccullum director of the cold case research institute you've been on every kind of crime scene known to man in fact you claim that's where we first met i claim we met in court but okay i guess

two honest people can disagree so ch, Cheryl McCollum, please. Did you hear him say, oh, this can't be quick. Because my story of how I accidentally killed JonBenet Ramsey needs a lot of time, translation, a lot of attention on me. In front of the microphone, in front of the camera, with everybody clicking their photos. What a load of bs now cheryl you are a crime scene investigator extraordinaire now that's a legal technical legal term load of bs do i need to explain that to you let me tell you it ain't latin no it is a load of bs and i'll tell you I'm going to explain why it's a load of BS.

I have been on thousands of crime scenes, Nancy. And when something is an accident, that scene can absolutely be staged. But I have not seen where a stranger makes an accident look worse. So here's what he wants us to believe. JonBenet flipped and hit her head and died. So he doesn't admit to killing her. He said she flipped. He doesn't talk about the strangulation. He doesn't talk about the sexual assault. He doesn't talk about whether or not there was a taser involved with this child. He doesn't talk about anything but an accident. It wasn't an

accident breaking into the house. It wasn't an accident, you know, taking her from her bedroom on the third floor and finding a locked room in a basement in a house you supposedly never been in. How in the world did this man write a three-page ransom note after she accidentally dies so he ain't in a hurry to get out of that house which is also crap but he stays there and writes this ransom note and he just happens to be able to write exactly like her mama to the point that fbi can't rule the mama out which is another reason i do not believe gary ol. And I didn't believe John Mark Carr, also known as Captain Underpants at the time. I can't recall why, but I think both of them are lying and capitalizing on the death of a little girl. JonBenet completely changed me and removed all evil from me.

Just one look at her beautiful face, her glowing, beautiful skin, and her divine God body. I let her slip and her head bashed in half, and I watched her die. It was an accident. I believe in my heart of hearts that these are confessional letters. He told me that if he had the chance, he would have eaten JonBenet.

Oliva also made these chilling drawings of the kindergartner. The 54-year-old has a history of sexually abusing minors. He's currently serving a 10-year sentence in Colorado for possessing child pornography. Oliva isn't the first to confess to killing little John Binet. In 2006, John Mark Carr confessed to her murder. I love John Binet.

We knew you had. Died accidentally. Carr was cleared of all charges. As for Oliva, although he has confessed to the crime, investigators are not convinced he did it. Oliva is eligible for parole in 2020, but Vail, a writer and publicist who lives in California, says his former friend needs to stay behind bars.

The day he walks free is the day that I will be terrified for every child within hundreds of miles of him because he is not safe to be out in society. The police department in Boulder, Colorado has come under heavy criticism for not bringing John Bonet's killer to justice, even admitting that crime scene evidence may have been mishandled. You're hearing our friend Jesse Palmer at Daily Mail TV, and part of this guy Gary Oliva's letter being read about this little girl's God body and her beauty and her purity later saying he wanted to eat her. Okay, 2020, well, that's certainly a year we can all look forward to, the year that this guy will make parole.

Troy Slayton joining me, along with Cheryl McCollum, Bobby Brown, Dr. Michelle Dupree, and Robin Walensky. Troy, you're the famous L.A. defense attorney. Why would this guy, Gary Oliva, festering behind bars, make this confession? Because he wants attention. Because just like the other people who have confessed to this crime but proved to not be the murderer, done it for exactly what you said. They want their five minutes of fame. Now, thank goodness there's a legal principle just because someone confesses to a crime doesn't allow them to be prosecuted unless there's other evidence that they committed the crime and thank goodness for that rule you're right uh troy slayton you're absolutely right the law is throughout every jurisdiction and

this has been taken all the way to the U.S. Supreme Court, and that is why it's uniform in every jurisdiction. You know, violent crimes are usually prosecuted by the states, and we've got 50 of them. You'd think there'd be 50 different sets of rules. There are not. They may differ in some ways, but many state opinions, decisions in criminal court have been taken all the way to the U.S. Supreme Court. The Supremes make a decision and then all the other states fall into line with that. Now, he's right. Troy Slayton is right. You cannot prosecute someone based on their confession alone. There has to be corroborating evidence.

Thank the Lord. So, Robin Walensky, let me ask you this. What do we know about the physical evidence opposing or supporting this freak, Gary Oliva's confession he killed JonBenet? Well, Nancy, there is not a DNA link. From what I understand, there was DNA in JonBenet's underwear to this day that has never been identified. Every year, to my understanding, the FBI crime lab in Virginia runs that sample over and over and over again, more than 20 years. To this day, Nancy, never has been identified. And it's interesting, and you know this because you have kids. If you go to a store, a Target, a Walmart, wherever, and you go to buy underwear that's just hanging on a little hanger that's not in a plastic wrap,

and someone, if she had on, for example, new underpants, and someone would have touched that in a store, or the lady who, man, someone who's checking you out at the counter touches that, they still don't know where that DNA is. And Gary Oliva does not match that DNA sample. Well, I mean, Cheryl McCollum, you and I both are raising a boy and a girl a million times. I've been the one, mom and I hate that mom sitting in the floor of Target or wherever and I take the underwear out of the pack I know it's all so neatly you know packaged and I take it out I try not to destroy the package and I hold it up into Lucy's shock and horror I hold it up to her as she's standing there in her clothes going mom to, to see, okay, is this going to fit her?

So I've handled it. Right. You know, I may have on lotion. I may have just washed my hands, whatever. The minute amount of DNA on JonBenet's underwear, what, if anything, does that mean? Except one thing, we know it's not Gary Oliva's. What else do we know about that? It also doesn't match anybody in her family.

So, again, it could very well come from the person that was examining the underwear before it left the factory. Somebody could have sneezed. They could have been sweating. Who knows? We don't know. That's the whole point. But it doesn't match this guy.

And the other thing that falls short with his story, Nancy, he wants us to believe that he stopped and fed the child pineapple. He wants us to believe that he spent all this time looking for a legal pad and looking for a pen and writing this three-page ransom note and just walking all over the house instead of getting the hell out of there because he just killed a child. None of this makes sense. He just happened to know John's bonus of 118 000 he just happened to know about this locked room none of this makes any sense and here's the biggest thing for me in the autopsy they are very clear to point out that john bonnet had chronic vaginal injury

that to me does not suggest a stranger at all. What does it suggest? And again, let me point out that the brother who I have never once suspected based on statistics alone, but especially looking at him compared to JonBenet, I think she could crack him in two with one hand behind her back. The brother has actually sued when it was suggested he was guilty. And, you know, doing that, it would have basically allowed him to be put on the stand, and he was not afraid of that. So I've never believed Burke did it. Exactly. And I don't believe the dad did it because JonBenet, to my understanding, still had a hymen, which means an adult male had never had relations with her.

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Crime stories with Nancy Grace. Boulder police say Gary Olivia is still a suspect in the John Bonet Ramsey murder. THE FAMILY'S BIRTHDAY. THE FAMILY'S BIRTHDAY. THE FAMILY'S BIRTHDAY. THE FAMILY'S BIRTHDAY. THE FAMILY'S BIRTHDAY. THE FAMILY'S BIRTHDAY. THE FAMILY'S BIRTHDAY. THE FAMILY'S BIRTHDAY. THE FAMILY'S BIRTHDAY. THE FAMILY'S BIRTHDAY. THE FAMILY'S BIRTHDAY.

THE FAMILY'S BIRTHDAY. THE FAMILY'S BIRTHDAY. THE FAMILY'S BIRTHDAY. THE FAMILY'S BIRTHDAY. THE FAMILY'S BIRTHDAY. THE FAMILY'S BIRTHDAY. THE FAMILY'S BIRTHDAY. THE FAMILY'S BIRTHDAY.

THE FAMILY'S BIRTHDAY. THE FAMILY'S BIRTHDAY. THE FAMILY'S BIRTHDAY. THE FAMILY'S BIRTHDAY. THE FAMILY'S BIRTHDAY. THE FAMILY'S BIRTHDAY. THE FAMILY'S BIRTHDAY. THE FAMILY'S BIRTHDAY. THE FAMILY'S BIRTHDAY. THE FAMILY'S BIRTHDAY. THE FAMILY'S BIRTHDAY. Nearly two decades after John Benet Ramsey was killed inside her family's Boulder home, a suspect in the infamous Christmas night murder is behind bars, accused of downloading child pornography.

We haven't ruled him in or out in connection with the Ramsey case. Boulder police, the same agency investigating the Ramsey case, arrested 52-year-old Gary Oliva after getting a cyber tip. It looked like somebody was getting pornography materials related to children to an address that investigators were able to link to Mr. Oliva. Court documents show he downloaded 22 separate sexually explicit images. All of the photos show children under 10 years of age. We certainly understand the interest in Mr. Oliva, both in connection with the new charges and his possible connection in the past. Oliva wasn't one of the early suspects in the Ramsey case,

but the convicted sex offender may have been close to the Ramsey home on the night of the murder. IT'S A POSSIBLE CONNECTION IN THE PAST. OLIVO WASN'T ONE OF THE EARLY SUSPECTS IN THE RAMSEY CASE. BUT THE CONVICTED SEX OFFENDER MAY HAVE BEEN CLOSE TO THE RAMSEY HOME ON THE NIGHT OF THE MURDER. AND WHEN HE WAS ARRESTED ON OTHER CHARGES BACK IN 2000, POLICE FOUND A PHOTO OF RAMSEY IN HIS POSSESSION.

AND HE DID ADMIT TO HAVING AN OBSESSION WITH THE YOUNG BEAUTY QUEEN. I FEEL LIKE WE OUGHT TO LOOK AT ALL PEOPLE AS BEING POSSIBLE SUSPECTS THAT HAVE BEEN POSSIBLE SUSPECTS BEFORE. FOR NOW, BOLDER POLICE SAY IT'S

FOCUSED ON THE MOST RECENT CHARGES. BUT THAT COULD CHANGE. IF ADDITIONAL INFORMATION ABOUT HIM BECOMES AVAILABLE, WE'LL HAVE TO TAKE A LOOK AT THEM. BUT THE POLICE SAY IT'S possible suspects that have been possible suspects before. For now, Boulder police say it's focused on the most recent charges, but that could change. If additional information about him becomes available subsequent to his arrest in this case, we'll certainly look at it. Now Oliva is charged with three felonies for sexual exploitation of a child. You are hearing our friend at ABC7 there in Denver, that's Jennifer Kowalewskiski talking about the 2016 arrest of Gary Oliva on

child porn. Now he jumps up and says, I killed JonBenet. But Bobby Brown, Colorado private investigator is correct. He said it before. But you know what? As I always love to say in court, when the defense jumps up and over and over, I'm like, you can say that all you want to. You can say it a hundred times, 200 times, a thousand times. It doesn't make it true. Just because he keeps saying, I did it, I did it, doesn't make it true. Joining me right now, renowned medical examiner and author of Homicide Investigation Field Guide. Now there's some good reading right there. Homicide Investigation Field Guide. You know, Jackie and Alan, Jackie Howard and Alan

Duke always roll their four eyeballs when I talk about one of my favorite books ever, Method and Assessment of Homicide and Suicide. I can't tell you how many times I read that. And of course, the Gun Lover's Bible. So I would familiarize myself uh with ballistics so you know it homicide investigation field guide i'm very impressed dr michelle dupree but that's not my issue today my issue is gary oliva because a lot of people want to believe yes he did it and put the case to bed but i i don't take it very lightly when somebody makes a false confession because you know what that does?

That ruins a potential future prosecution of the real killer because it's giving, no offense, Troy Slayton, slimy defense attorneys, a defense on a silver platter. Say I catch the real killer. And then here comes Troy Slayton bouncing into court

in his $2,000 Armani suit and his fancy Italian loafers. He comes up and he goes, oh really? Because John Mark Carr said he did it. And Gary Oliva said he did it. It doesn't help Dr. Michelle Dupree. It doesn't help at all when some nut job like Oliva claims he did it. And hey, what if he did? So Michelle Dupree, Dr. Dupree, how do I prove he did or didn't do it based on the crime scene and the DNA? Nancy, that's an excellent question. We go with the physical evidence. I mean, physical evidence does not lie.

And your guests so far have mentioned many instances in where it just doesn't add up. The DNA doesn't match. There's no other physical evidence at the crime scene. To make a confession, we all know that some people just want the spotlight. And so that's where we'd have to go on the defense of this. Go with the physical evidence and you will never go wrong. You know what? I used to argue something like that to juries all the time, not as eloquently as you just did. And you didn't even train three years to speak in front of a jury. Very well put. You have to follow the hard forensics if you've got it. And here, Cheryl McCollum, we have a glaring lack of forensics pointing to Oliva.

Cheryl McCollum, if you had one minute in front of the jury, what would you say to sum up the fact, did Gary Oliva murder little beauty queen JonBenet? He has not given us one thing about that crime scene we didn't already know or we didn't publish. He's a liar and he's out for attention, period. What about forensic, Cheryl? There is none. Zero. That leads to him. There's no DNA. He's got no clothing with her blood on it. He's got no hair from her. Nothing. Nothing leads us to him. And Nancy, here's another thing. Snow blanketed the whole surrounding of that house, the whole perimeter. There's no footprints coming or going from that house. What did he do? Hover back out of there? Come on. He didn't do it. He doesn't write like her mama. He didn't

spend hours in that house after he, quote, accidentally killed her and found a paintbrush and a piece of rope and did a makeshift you know way to strangle that baby yeah so Troy Slayton you're the renowned defense attorney if you were defending a future defendant what would you say because I know you can spin a yarn no offense Troy and I'm sure none taken, but what would you say to say that he would do it? If you say you are defending Jackie Howard five years from now, who's now charged with murdering JonBenet, how would you try and pin this on Oliva? Well, I would certainly point to his confession. I would say, let's believe a person when they make a statement against penal interest.

Here's another legal theory for the audience. When somebody says something that goes so far against what an average person would do and tends to inculpate themselves themselves tends to make themselves look guilty That type of statement is more trustworthy Here a normal person doesn't commit. I mean doesn't admit to committing a crime that they didn't do a normal person doesn't obviously Olivas is not a normal person and If I was called upon to defend Olivas in some sort of future prosecution, well, you have my witness list already all set for me. To Bobby Brown,

who is a veteran in law enforcement, Colorado private investigator, Bobby Brown, again, thank you for being with us. You've heard Cheryl McCollum explain why she doesn't think Oliva is responsible or committed the crime. But you disagree. Explain. I want everybody to know that I am not saying by any means that Gary Oliva is, even though he confessed again, that he is the person that is responsible for the death of John Bonnet. But I just want to say a couple of things is that after John Bonnet's death, Gary Oliva did leave the state where he sexually molested a seven-year-old little girl. And he was in Boulder the night that John Bonnet was killed. He was supposedly staying at a church nearby their house. And the next morning, he called his friend. He tells his friend that he had done something really bad, that he had hurt a little girl. One thing that I will say that when I called up, when he was arrested in 2016 with the pornography charges, I got all of the bonding information, which I have printed out right in front of me. And it clearly says that he was arrested on april 10th

however he was booked into the boulder county jail on june 17th and he had a bond set for 25 000 when i asked the jail where was he between april 10th and June 17th. And the exact quote from the deputy or the person that I spoke to at the jail said that was the $64,000 question of the day. The world was shocked to hear about the murder of the six-year-old beauty pageant princess, JonBenet Ramsey. Since this horrible day,

her death has remained as one of the biggest mysteries of all time, which has set in motion many conspiracy theories, some crazy, but others more grounded in reality. Today, law enforcers are on the brink of closing the case after Gary Oliver, a 54-year-old convicted pedophile who is currently serving time in prison, confessed to her murder. The Daily Mail obtained letters written by Gary Oliver. The report claimed the 54-year-old is taking full responsibility for the crime, saying he killed her by accident. I never loved anyone like I did JonBenet, and yet I let her slip. Her head bashed and I watched her die, he allegedly wrote. It was an accident. Please believe me. She was not like other kids.

JonBenet completely changed me and removed all evil from me, Oliver stated. Just one look at her, beautiful face, her beautiful skin and divine god body. I realised I was wrong to kill other kids. Yet by accident, she died. And it was my fault. The sensational letters were sent to the music publicist Michael Vale, a former mate of Oliver's, who has reportedly suspected his involvement in the crime

for many years. The shock admission is one of the biggest breakthroughs in the now infamous case, which has had detectives stumped for years. My suspicion began when Gary called me late one night on December 26, 1966. He was sobbing and said, I heard a little girl, the 55-year-old told the publication.

You are hearing our friends at Daily Mail regarding Gary Oliva announcing he murdered John Bonnet. I don't know that I would call his confession a breakthrough. I think I'd call it more of a speed bump. To Bobby Brown, Colorado private investigator, how did you first learn about Oliva? At a breakfast meeting that Lou Smith and I had. And Lou Smith was the one that brought up that there was a suspect, Gary Oliva. And Lou was very serious about it. I was. And obviously, that's how I have put a lot of work to this. And I want to say that when people ask real quick, why would anybody confess to this?

You know, why would Oliva confess to this? You know, why would you leave a confess to this? And, you know, that's a great question because somebody that's been around with this a long time, sex offenders and especially pedophiles, they don't do really well in prison. So, you know, if you're in prison and all of a sudden you're saying, here's this gigantic case that's been out there for all these decades, and then you're saying that you are the one that did it. You know, that's not a very smart move by any means. Well, it could be. To Robin Walensky, CrimeOnline.com investigative reporter and author of Beautiful Life,

See a Side Behind Casey Anthony Trial on Amazon. Robin, you've studied this very, very carefully. We all covered JonBenet's death and the investigation intensely at the time. What do you make of it? What about his confession is consistent or inconsistent with the facts, the forensic facts as we know them? Well, I'll tell you, Nancy, I was actually out there in another lifetime in 2006 working for another network when they brought John Mark Carr back to the United

States. And I will tell you that I knew of Oliva, but I do not believe that the DNA, there's no DNA that puts him inside that house. For me personally, my big takeaway after all these years, the only thing that connects John Mark Carr, the other guy who said that he killed John Bidet, the only thing in my mind that connects him to the case, you know, there's no receipts, there's no DNA, that ransom note that Patsy finds on the bottom of the staircase is signed S-B-T-C. And no one has ever been able to explain what those letters stand for. Well, in my old job at a different network, we had a producer that was sniffing around in this little town in Alabama where John Markar is from.

And in one of his yearbooks, he signs it, SBTC, shall be the conqueror. And to me, that's an interesting takeaway to this case. Also, there was a window in the basement that there's some glass that was pushed in. The only person skinny enough, physically small enough to have gotten into that window from the outside is not Oliva. He's a much bigger guy. The only person who would fit through that window would be someone like John Mark Carr, who's that thin. You know, Robin Walensky, when I would try cases, in closing argument, I carried with me a huge jar of water. And at the bottom, Cheryl, don't groan because you remember this, there was dirt at the bottom. And at the beginning of my closing statement, sometimes if it fit, I would take the big jar and I'd shake it

in front of the jury to make sure they saw me do it. I'd sit it down on council table and then I'd start my closing argument, which would at the least take one hour. By the time the hour was up, I would pick up the jar, which now all the soil was at the bottom, and I'd hold it up and say the defense is trying to muddy the water I've explained to you the facts and see now it's crystal clear you are muddying the water Robin Walensky I'm just going to tell you right now because it's and you have me you're like a little snake charmer oh sbtc and he could fit through the window i'm calling bs again troy slayton la defense lawyer isn't it true john mark car was in another

state when john bonnet was killed that's what all the evidence shows and it's it's unbelievable why can't you just say yes like a normal person why Why do you have to leave a little dabbling? That's what the evidence shows. As if to say, but maybe he transported there. I wasn't with him, Nancy. Maybe he was with Harry Potter. Maybe he was with Harry Potter. And they transported. What's the word they use in Harry Potter?

I've read them so many times. And they appeared in JonBenet's basement. He wasn't out of the state, Troy Slayton. He may have been out of the state. That's what the evidence appears to show, Nancy. But I wasn't with him. You weren't with him. So we can't say for sure.

And it's this exact type of confession from Oliva that is, as you've said, a goldmine for the defense in any future prosecution of this horrific tragedy. To Dr. Michelle Dupre, medical examiner and author, homicide investigation field guide, do you see anything on the scene of the murder that indicates Oliva is the killer? Nancy, not that I can tell. I mean, there is no physical evidence, and that's always what we have to go for. Everything that your other guests have said is absolutely true. There's no way to tie him to this. We depend on something called low-charge exchange, where a perpetrator comes in, brings something from outside into the crime scene, and then takes something away from the crime scene outside. We don't have that here. Cheryl McCollum, Cold Case Research Institute director, CSI expert. Cheryl, you know, give me your best shot as to why he did do it. I know that's going to be tough.

Zero. There's nothing. And I'm going to blow your mind. Couldn't you just use your imagination for Pete's sake? Defense attorneys do it all the time. I do, and in order to do that, I would have to make something up, which is exactly what he's done. But I'm going to blow your mind. He didn't even confess. He said JonBenet slipped and she hit her head. We don't even have a confession.

He's a liar. Is that true? Bobby Brown, Colorado PI. Is there nowhere he says, I did it? Not in front of me. No, I don't. And I don't know that there is one. To Cheryl McCollum, director of the Cold Case Research Institute, I know you couldn't stretch your imagination to come up with an argument that Oliva's guilty. But if you were arguing to the jury right now, why would you say he's not guilty of John Bonet's murder? His handwriting does not match the ransom note. He writes in all caps.

The ransom note does not. In the ransom note, it says things like attache and she's going to be beheaded and all of these things. His confession does not. It's not a confession, number one. And number two, he doesn't say what he hit her in the head with. It doesn't say why he did it. He doesn't say he molested her or anything. He doesn't say how he got in or out of the house.

He doesn't say how he knew where the locked bedroom was or the room. He doesn't say where the pineapple came from or why he took time to feed this child. He doesn't say where he found the legal pad or the ink pen or why he would go from the third floor to the basement and spend all of this time in this house writing a three-page note, looking for the instruments to do that. All the while, there's a dead six-year-old in the basement that he didn't mean to really kill in the first place. None of it makes any sense, Nancy. He's a liar, and he's an opportunist, and he and his elementary school friend, maybe they want to write a book. I don't know what they're doing, but it's not true. There's nothing authentic. Again, he has not told us one thing that is not

public knowledge about that scene. Explain whether or not she was tamed. Tell me. Tell me what the marks are on her neck. Tell me how the scratches got on her back. Tell me why the paintbrush, why you would make this really crude Garrett to strangle her with. And why do you keep talking about the head injury and you don't mention strangulation at all? There's petechiae there. We know she was strangled. That's the official rule. Explain it to me.

Why would you make a little drawing in the palm of her hand? Why would you go back upstairs and get her favorite toy? He can't explain any of that because he didn't do it. I think that says it all. Common sense tells me Gary Oliva is just seeking attention, a book deal, a movie deal, or who knows what, maybe even protective custody. We'll see. Nancy Grace, Crime Story, signing off. Goodbye, friend.

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