Crime Stories with Nancy Grace - Distraught mom: 'This is no accident! My son was murdered!'

Episode Date: March 4, 2019

After Tyler Smith was found dead in the shallow water of a cement canal in Galesburg, Illinois, last September, investigators concluded it was an accidental drowning. But the parents of the 23-year-old aspiring police officer believe foul play was involved in the death and they are demanding answers. Mom Sandy Halsne and dad Keith Smith called Nancy Grace for help. Nancy assembled a panel of experts including South Carolina medical examiner Dr. Michell Dupre -- author of "Homicide Investigation Field Guide," Cold Case Research Institute director Sheryl McCollum, Atlanta juvenile judge & lawyer Ashley Willcott, and Crime Stories reporter John Lemley. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Parents of a 23-year-old who was found dead in Galesburg say they have never gotten the full story of how he died. Kittle to QC's Sarah Jones was at Galesburg say they have never gotten the full story of how he died. KELOLAND QC Sarah Jones was at Galesburg City Hall tonight as Tyler Smith's parents pressed for answers. Sarah? Tyler Smith wanted to become a cop and according to his parents the same group of people he wanted to join have failed to provide answers. September 12th marked his mother's birthday. Tyler's was the next day and the 14th was the last time he was seen. The 15th was when his parents say they learned he was dead. They say they received a lot of conflicting information and that a preliminary autopsy

report says he drowned in three inches of water. TV6 has not yet been able to view the autopsy report. Tyler's parents accused Galesburg police of mishandling the investigation. Earlier this week, Galesburg police told TV6 they are doing everything they can. I saw pictures of my son from that night. He had injuries to me and he looked like he had been in a fight. I was told that by police that they believe that his injuries were from possible decomp due to possibly being out there dead for several hours. I have to disagree as the autopsy report states there are no signs of external decomp. How did this beautiful, brilliant boy with his life in front of him, Tyler Smith, how do you drown?

A grown man, essentially. He's no boy. He's a grown man. But he's his mama's little boy forever, like mine. How do you drown in three inches of water? So many questions left unanswered. I want the truth. I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories.

Thank you for being with us. With me, two very, very special guests. The mother and father of Tyler Smith. First, to John Lindley, CrimeOnline.com investigative reporter. John, what happened? As we'll hear more from his parents in just a moment, Tyler had recently, he was in the process of making a move from Rochelle, Illinois to Concord, California to begin training as a cadet in the police academy there. He had one last remaining drill to do with the Illinois Army National Guard in Macon, Illinois, so he thought he'd use the opportunity to catch up with some of his favorite people in nearby Galesburg.

This is about three hours southwest of Chicago. His plan was to stay overnight with a friend and head to the guard drill the next morning. Tyler Smith announced his arrival in Galesburg with great fanfare with a text about 6.03 p.m. This is Friday, September 14th. The text simply said, I'm here. Now, over the next few hours, Tyler and a couple of friends first grabbed a bite of dinner, then did a bit of bar hopping around the area. According to information given to the Galesburg Police Department, at roughly 11.35 p.m., the three of them head to their vehicles, Tyler walking with one of the friends to his car. From that point on, the mystery of what happens to Tyler really deepens.

There is an odd series of calls and texts to one of his friends and another buddy in Maycomb. At 11.46 p.m., Tyler sends a Snapchat message to yet another friend saying, I don't know where I am. And that's the last that anyone heard from Tyler. All that together sounds very, very suspicious to me. A text, I don't know where I am. Joining me in addition to John Limley, CrimeOnline.com investigative reporter, judge, lawyer, Ashley Wilcott, with a young son of her own too, as a matter of fact. Cheryl McCollum, director of the Cold Case Research Institute, also with a son. Dr. Michelle Dupree, medical examiner. And boy, do we need a medical examiner today.

To Cheryl McCollum, director of the Cold Case Research Institute, before I go to Tyler's parents, Sandy and Keith, I want your take on this. First of all, Nancy, could he swim second of all you're talking about three inches of water with no injury then did he have some type of drug in his system like GHB or something and then the other question that I have is at you know 11 35 he's walking with a friend that he's going to stay with the place by 1146, he's completely lost and doesn't know where he is. I question whether he sent those last text messages. Well, I question the text message about, I don't know where I am. I don't know where I am.

Guys, this is a guy. I want to call him a boy because he's Sandy Key's son, but this guy is on his way to being a grown man. Out of 5,000 candidates, 5,000 candidates, only 50 were picked for the San Jose Police Academy, and he was one of the 50. I'm not really buying that he drowned in three inches of water. And I am not buying that injuries on his body were caused by decomposition when he had only been there a couple of hours. I don't believe that. I've never seen a case like that in all of my history where a body begins to decompose in just a couple of hours. And to add more mystery to this, listen. It seems every time I ask to have things checked, like video footage, cameras, I guess so, or what's that going to tell us?

The only evidence they do have is what I have provided to them. For example, I provided ATM info, which that would show Tyler using an ATM on a video. We were told then that when they received the video that the detective watched it from beginning to end several times and Tyler was not on that footage. I asked the direct detective to contact Wells Fargo again and he did and he said it would be December before we got another video due to they thought we had the wrong footage from the wrong bank. I questioned getting the wrong footage and drove two hours to drive to Galesburg on November 12th, where I met with the sergeant, where he said he would prove the footage was not from the wrong bank and it was from the wrong time.

I was told Tyler was not on the video. The sergeant put the video in play, and as we were discussing it to see if it was the correct bank on the video he stated what the f you want from me your son drowned right after that he said tyler and the two individuals he was with showed up on the atm video this is the original atm video that we were told he was not on on the exact time he was supposed to show up for two minutes and 21 seconds this leads me to wonder did the detective even watch the video? And if he did, how was he not able to see Tyler on the video? I have ever been asked if I was here. I have also been asked if I was here for the first six days

Tyler died to check any videos of myself. My response was, I was planning a funeral for my son, but I would have been here if I would have known that you guys weren't checking the videos. Wow. You are hearing Tyler's mom, Sandy Halsney with me, Sandy and Keith, mother and father of Tyler Smith. If my son allegedly drowned in three inches of water, I would be on the rampage. Sandy, Keith, thank you for being with us. First to you, Sandy, did you see Tyler on the ATM video footage? I did. It was the original ATM video that we were told he was not on.

And I had questioned. There is absolutely no way that he could not be on it because I had a receipt emailed to me. He had an email receipt when he took the money out of the ATM, which was about an hour, but it was 10 42 PM. And they were telling me that it was the wrong footage from the wrong bank. And I said, well, then you need to call Wells Fargo because, you know, I have an exact account number. I have an exact transaction number. I have an exact time. I even went down to the bank to see if the time was correct, which they didn't do either. But I did that myself just to see, you know, oh, maybe the time's wrong. There was 20 minutes of footage and he is on that and he shows up there for 22, two minutes and 21 seconds at 10 42 PM, exactly at the time he's supposed to show up. This is on the original ATN video, which was in their possession for at least three weeks before I started to question,

okay, what's going on here? You know, why are things not being done? And then after that point, when I found Tyler, who's on that video, is when we decided, okay, nothing was done. We've been lied to. And what else have you lied to us about? Sandy Halsney, Keith Smith, the mother and father of Tyler Smith. Sandy, when you observed him on the ATM video, how did he look? What was his demeanor? He looked fine. I mean, he looked, he had no problem getting the money out. We noticed, we did notice he had cash on him at the ATM. He had a money clip. We questioned why he took $100 out and why he used his debit card at the last bar he went to and what happened to his money because he didn't have all that money on him when he was found.

He only had $72 of it. But he looked fine. His demeanor looked fine. You could tell he had been drinking, but he was not stumbling. He was walking fine. He was, you know, you could tell he had been drinking, but he was not stumbling. He was walking fine. He was able to use the ATM. Sandy, did he have any bruises, lacerations, or anything on his face or body that you could see? Yes. Not on the ATM video, no. So then, no, he did not. And you're telling me you observed a money clip in his hand with cash in it, and he took out an additional $100.

But when he was found, he did not have that amount on him. Is that correct? That is correct. We just want answers. You know, we just want a timeline. We're not trying to point fingers. We just want answers. He deserves more.

Anybody deserves more. It, anybody deserves more. It's just a little effort, you know. The city appreciates Tyler's parents coming in to speak to the CRC. As they outlined, they don't have jurisdiction over this type of case. They're limited in what types of cases they can investigate. However, at the same time, we have received a formal complaint from Tyler's parents. At that time, the city manager initiated an investigation that will be a joint police and city administration investigation. That investigation is ongoing, but when it is completed, we've looked at the allegations.

We will release the results of that to the city council as well as to the media. Next week, we'll be meeting with Tyler's parents to learn more about their experience and their allegations, and we're hopeful to move on from that point. Tyler's parents say they understand that this is outside the commission's jurisdiction, and the city council referred them to the state. And Tyler's family says they're not giving up. You are hearing from our friend at KWQC-TV, Sarah Jones. You also heard Tyler's dad, Keith Smith, who is with us right now. With me, Sandy Halsney and Keith Smith, the father and mother of Tyler, Dr. Michelle Dupree, medical examiner and, director of the Cold Case Research Institute,

Ashley Wilcott, judge and lawyer, and CrimeOnline.com investigative reporter John Limley to Dr. Michelle Dupree. Bodies do not start to decompose in an hour or two to where it looks like physical injuries, like bruises. That doesn't happen that quickly. That's true, Nancy. It does not. And I wonder if it's not just maybe a misinterpretation of an injury that did occur. One thing I'd like to point out is that, as you know, drowning is a diagnosis of exclusion. And what that means is we must rule out everything else, everything else to be the cause of death.

We need a toxicology report. We need any signs of trauma or injury that would be significant enough to cause the death. And so I'm thinking that one of the concerns is him having drowned in three inches of water. That is entirely possible. But we still need to make sure that the actual cause of death is drowning. Otherwise, we have other things that we need to rule out. But you're absolutely right on those postmortem changes or the decomposition. Way too soon. Well, to me, if he was in three inches of water, he could have just turned over appears he was either beaten or hit by some type of vehicle

before ending up in the creek in Cedar Fork. And I'm basing that on post-mortem photos of Tyler Smith that showed bruising along his body and more facial injuries. I'm very, very concerned about the cause of death. Very concerned. Dr. Michelle Dupree, to all of us Luddites, explain how it is determined that someone has drowned. Again, drowning is that diagnosis of exclusion. We must rule out any kind of blunt trauma, accidental or otherwise. We must rule out toxicology as a cause of death. It is possible to drown in three inches of water, but why? Why could he not, as you said,

turn over? Was he obtunded in some way? Was he sedated in some way? What is the reason for that? There are also two types of drowning, as you know, wet drowning and dry drowning. Did he have a laryngospasm? So there would be very little water in his lungs. Those are the kind of things that we must look at in an autopsy to determine and to be able to actually say that drowning was the cause of death. And I'm not sure that we have it in this case. It's my understanding, back to Sandy Halsney and her husband, Keith Smith, the mother and father of Tyler. That, through investigation, you guys uncovered videotape images of Tyler walking along West Street just four minutes before his cell phone stops registering activity. That would be around 11.52 p.m. that Friday night.

Okay? He walks north past the Casey's on the corner of West and West Main Street in the direction of the BNSF tracks and the Cedar Fork body of water. So you have him alive on video

at 1042 at the ATM and about two hours later at 1152 walking past Casey's. Is that correct Keith Smith? Yes it is. What type of video is this Sandy Halsney? It is a video that we can see Tyler walking in the distance. We were told this video was checked and that he wasn't on it. And we have done our own investigation basically for the last four to five months. And I was able to find the video there at Casey's and check it myself.

And that's when I saw him walking. He's walking very fast. He's walking like he's, to me as his mother, I can tell he seems like he's upset or angry, or he's on a mission. And, you know, as he walks by, it's about 1148. And then at 1152, he, his health app on his phone says he stops moving. Wow. Okay. Let me ask you a question. This is from a building there on West street. I think. How did you manage to get that video when the cops didn't get it? I don't know. Um, I presented it to him in my formal complaint. I, before I presented it to him, they said, I know I went over and I said, you told me you checked this camera and that was a lie.

You checked this camera and that was why you checked this camera, and that was a lie. You checked this camera, and that was a lie. You checked this video, and this was a lie. And I went through all the videos that I was told it was checked and confirmed with them, you guys checked the Casey's video, correct? And they said, yes, yes, we checked that. And I said, well, I have the Casey's video with me. And Tyler is on it, and he's walking. And you can't see his face, so you can't see if he had been in a fight prior.

But you can tell it's him, and it's definitely him. There is another video about a block down that we were told, which would basically tell us if he continued to walk on his own, if he had turned on a cross street called Ferris Street, if he had any interaction with a police car that follows him down that road, as well as another vehicle that follows him down that road. And we were told that that was only good for the weekend. I noticed it right away within about 10 days after Tyler died. I was told, oh, they just have signs up just to scare people. I said, but did you check? Oh, we'll check. We'll check. Well, two months later, I find out from the owner, after we found out they lied about him being on the ATM video is when we decided that, okay, something's not right here. We went down to that owner and he said, nobody had been down here to check their footage and it was good for a week. And that would have basically given us our information, at least where he went.

Yeah. You know, to Cheryl McCullen, director of the Cold Case Research Institute, that's exactly what happened in the case of Chandra Levy. Remember, it was so integral that we find out if she left her apartment building there in D.C. with anyone. And the video cameras in her building, as I recall, it was her building, recycle every 72 hours. And the cops didn't get it in time. And that really hurt the investigation. Nancy, this is an example of a mama on a mission, period. She's doing the lion's share of this.

And it's unbelievable. But I want to ask another question to her. Other than the body, there is something else you can investigate and look at, and that's his clothing. Did his clothing have any injuries to them? Like, were his pants ripped, where he fell down that cement ravine, were his clothes disheveled, like he had been in a fight or a struggle? Has she been able to see the crime scene photograph? I have seen the crime scene photograph. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. We are heartbroken and we deserve answers on how Tyler's death occurred. We want to know what happened the night of September 14th

and to the early hours of September 15th, and how did he get down there and why. We do not feel satisfied as the Galesburg police investigated our son's death without any or little effort. We first learned of our son's death. It was a full-blown homicide investigation. As we were not able to see Tyler the night of his death, I begged to see him, but we were still told no due to Tyler and his belongings and clothes were all still evidence. He had been taken to Peoria to a forensic pathologist.

They bagged his hands for evidence, yet no samples were taken for DNA. I was misled to believe that he would have x-rays, and he didn't. Within less than 24 hours of his death, a press release was made on September 16th at 4.32 p.m. that there were no signs of foul play suspected and no signs of injury. The statement was made off a preliminary autopsy report stating the cause of death was drowning in three inches of injury. The statement was made off a preliminary autopsy report stating cause of death was drowning in three inches of water.

No cause as why or how Tyler ended up in Cedar Fork. I saw pictures of my son from that night. He had injuries to me and he looked like he had been in a fight. I was told that by police

that they believed that his injuries were from possible decont due to possibly being out there dead for several hours. I have to disagree as the autopsy report states there are no signs of external decont. You're hearing Tyler's mom, Sandra Halsney. Of course she's concerned. She's not getting answers no matter where she turns. As we went to break Cheryl McCollum, you were saying there's more evidence than just the body itself.

Repeat. Exactly. The clothing, Nancy. He would have injury to his pants if he fell down that ravine, like if the knee would be ripped or the side. If his shirt was tucked in, if it was disheveled and pulled out. Did it look like he fell? Did it look like he was in a fight? Body placement and his clothes would tell

that beyond the autopsy. To Sandy Halsney, Tyler's mom, what about his clothing? From the pictures of the scene, his clothing looks, the only pictures that I see are his shirt is all the way up. They didn't take pictures, I don't think, of his clothing prior to. The fireman on the scene actually pulled everything out of his pockets before the coroner or even the investigator even got there. They didn't print anything. His clothing, I could not see any rips, but the pictures aren't the greatest. And we were told the night that he died, they would not let me ID him. And I said, why can't I ID him?

I want to see him. I begged and begged and begged to see him that night. And they said, no, his whole body is evidence. His clothes are evidence. And then they took his clothes and they threw them away after the autopsy. So I never saw the clothes. They threw his clothes away. I've never heard of that. They sent him, I found out they sent him to the funeral home four days later. So at that point, you know, they've been tampered with. And I was not in a great place at that time.

It was the first time I got to see my son and i wanted the clothes and everybody talked me out of them but i did not realize his shoes which were bright white shoes were completely clean the left one was completely clean no mud no nothing and the right one had drag marks on the top of it and a little bit of mud on the side of it um there's no way he walked through that creek and kept his shoes clean in the dark, never been there before, and his feet are basically almost up against the concrete wall and his arms are down at his side like he didn't even try to catch himself. His watch is broken off of him, it was broken off the

pin, it was still clasped and it ripped off, basically ripped off skin off his wrist and was laying a foot away from him. He literally looked staged. There was a beer can laying next to him that they took as evidence and they threw it away in four days and didn't print it. They said, well, we didn't think it was Tyler's. I said, but what if somebody else's prints were on it? Which police agency was in charge of this, Sandy? The city police. What city? The Galesburg, Illinois City Police.

Galesburg, Illinois PD. And we have tried to reach them. John Lindley, CrimeOnline.com investigative reporter. What more can you tell me? Nancy, we did reach out to the Galesburg Police Department and we have just received a written response from Chief David Christensen. I'll read some of the highlights for you. The statement begins, at this time, nothing learned from the investigation indicates foul play or suspicious circumstances surrounding Tyler Smith's death. How and why Tyler Smith ended up face down in Cedar Fork

is unknown and believed to be accidental. The statement continues, the Tyler Smith case remains open and any lead or new information will be investigated. The case has been featured with a local Crimestoppers posting and Tyler Smith's family is now offering a $5,000 reward for information that would lead to an arrest. To Keith Smith, Tyler's father, what do you think, Keith? I just think they didn't put any effort towards my son, and they just wanted us to go away, and they just probably thought that he was from California because he had a California license, and I just think they just didn't put any effort towards his investigation. I just don't understand it.

To Ashley Wilcott joining me, Atlanta judge, lawyer, anchor. You can find her at AshleyWilcott.com. Ashley, what do you make of this? You know, there are a couple of problems I have with this case, Nancy. One is my heart breaks for the parents, and I'm so happy that you're speaking out about the problems you see with this explanation for what happened to your son. Their observations directly contradict the reports by law enforcement. So for instance, law enforcement, nothing on the face, no sign of anything, yet we hear from his own mother,

bruises and marks on the face or a bruise and marks on the face. I think the problem is the unanswered question. What I cannot imagine is why any law enforcement agency would not investigate more thoroughly, save the clothes, do the things to make certain that they absolutely have pinned down exactly what happened to this young man. I don't get it. When you say they had no interest, they blew you off. That's their job. And it's not just their job. I mean, Cheryl McCollum, you've been with me from the very beginning when I first started prosecuting. It's not just a job. You're certainly not there for the pay. I had to work two night jobs teaching school to make a house payment while I was a prosecutor. Remember that? Right. You're there because you

want the truth, because you want justice, because you want answers for people like Sandy Halsney and Keith Smith, and most of all, to do justice by Tyler. I mean, I'm looking at Tyler's photo right now and I'm getting chills all over my body looking at him. This young man, bright, excited, exuberant, one of 5,000 people, just 50 get picked to go into this police program. And he was one all over the country that made it. Loving parents. Everything. Just like your son, Ashley, your son, Cheryl, my son. This is not right. You know what? At the end of the day, if it turns out, he drowned. I don't like it, but I accept it. But we can't say that right now, Cheryl. There's no way that that can be determined based on what they know. And even if he did drown, how do I know somebody didn't hold his head down? How do I know that? What happened to the money?

Why was he bruised up? Why did he have abrasions all the way down the side of his body? Why, Cheryl? Why would he suddenly need somewhere else to stay within one minute? Why would he be completely lost within 10 minutes? It's not logical. But, Nancy, I have another major, major issue right now. As you know, I'm a crime scene investigator for a living. Another part of my job is I'm the evidence custodian for my police department. You don't get rid of evidence in four days. In order for me to dispose of evidence, I've got to go in front of a judge and get a court order. I've got to go in front of my chief and get approval before I even go to the judge. There's no way

that could happen at my department in four days on a case that we are not finished with. We have asked for crime stoppers to be brought in on November 30th. We have asked for the state to come in for a fresh set of ice and we were denied. We have also turned in a formal complaint. We have also asked for the Galesburg community to please come forward with any information as we are still trying to find out the events that led to Tyler being deceased in Cedar Port. We still need the police in this matter as they have the authority to help.

As the investigation is still open and we will need them to help us with these as we still need answers to what happened to our son Tyler Smith. This is the main reason why we are still here today. We don't know what happened to Tyler and we won't ever give up as we are a voice for him. So please be a voice for Tyler. A spokesperson for the city told Fox 18 news they found no evidence to support the complaint, but he did say the investigation revealed that in some instances communications with Tyler's

parents fell below the high standards that the Galesburg Police Department strives for each and every day. As a result, the department took appropriate internal measures to address this concern and ensure it does not reoccur. Sandra didn't feel up to doing an on-camera interview but told us her and Tyler's dad aren't giving up. She says they were relying on

surveillance video from a local business to show Tyler's last moments. But she says the video from September was already cleared off the camera. So they've created their own tip line and funded a $5,000 reward for anyone with information that leads to an arrest and conviction. Tyler is a human being who has a mother and a father who love him very much. You are hearing from our friend KLBJ-TV's Grace Runkel reporting. In my mind, there's so many gaping holes in the investigation, bad ones, getting rid of evidence, not testing evidence, not taking evidence, not securing fingerprints. To Dr. Michelle Dupree, medical examiner, joining me, author of Homicide Investigation Field Guide. Dr. Dupree, I know that when an autopsy is done, there's a general panel of tests, of drug tests that are done. Toxicology is what it's called.

They look for pot. They look for cocaine. They look for heroin. They look for all sorts of illegal drugs. But is there another panel that looks for things such as GHB, gamma hydroxybutyrate, or something that may have been slipped into his drink? How does that work, Dr. Dupree? Yes, Nancy, there is actually. When we do a panel, and different labs use different panels, but typically they will look for all of those drugs. And especially in a case like this, where there is some uncertainty or some question as to,

you know, why all of a sudden he didn't know where he was, that should surely indicate to look for those things. I don't know whether that was done or not, but certainly it should be. I'm just appalled at some of the evidence or the lack of evidence in this case that was collected. Guys, we were talking about the death of a bright, bright young man, Tyler Smith, with the world in front of him. He was heading off to Police Academy, one of 50 out of 5,000 that were accepted. John Lindley, CrimeOnline.com investigative reporter, what more can you tell me? This is something that Sandy can give us even more details on, but she says that when she tried to access Tyler's Facebook page on Sunday, September 16th,

the day after his body was found at 7 p.m., it was already designated as a memorial page. Also, she discovered that all the location information from Tyler's phone for both Friday and Saturday was gone, as if it had been wiped. To Sandy Halsney, what does that mean? His phone had been wiped. Basically, the information was gone. His locations were on, and we could, you know, prior days, you can see where he was. I mean, it picks up exactly where you go and it was gone. It was completely, it didn't exist that he was in Galesburg at all. The 14th of September did not exist. And the 15th did not exist. Like it never happened. And unfortunately all that information is encrypted.

And I have tried and tried and tried with Apple to see if I can get that information back. But it's out in the cloud somewhere. And I mean, I don't have the capabilities of doing it. I mean, this is why we've been asking for warrants. And they will not give me a warrant. They will not give me a warrant to Facebook. They will not give me a warrant to Verizon to check location histories. And I asked why and they said, well, there's no crime. And I said, well, how can you tell there's no crime if you haven't tried to prove it? You know, it's within less than 24 hours, they'd already said he drowned and they were done. You know, they didn't even open his phone until

four days after he died. Oh, this is just one, one nightmare after the next. The last two people he was with, they only called two and five days after for a phone statement. They didn't bring him down to the department to interview them until two months later when we found out they were also on the ATM video with Tyler. Let me ask you a question right there, Sandy Halsney. Those two people, after the ATM at 1042,

you see him walking along around West Street alone. Nobody's with him right then. Couple of questions. Sandy, who were these two people? Did he know them? There were acquaintances. One was a buddy that he drilled with and that he was supposed to stay with, and then the other one was the cousin of his friend that he was supposed to stay with.

Okay. Have you spoken to them? I have spoken to the one that he was supposed to stay with. I have not spoke to the other one. He's never reached out to her. Okay. And what did he say? At first, when I spoke to him, he said, you know, he was sorry.

He felt like he let Tyler down. You know, if we needed anything, it would be fine. And then I reached out to him a week later and said, Hey, you know, I'm not having any luck with the police getting any information. Can you at least tell me what you do remember when Tyler got there? Can you give me a timeline from when Tyler got there to the point you don't remember? Cause he was telling the police, he doesn't remember anything. And so I said, can you at least give me that? And his answer was, I'm sorry, we've already given our statements to the police. We would be the last and least likely to be able to help you.

And that was the last I spoke to him. Based on what you know, it sounds like you see him alone walking. They left him. I mean, well, he or he left them at whatever bar and was going somewhere else. So I'm wondering who approached him, who, if anyone, how did he get covered with bruises and lacerations? How did that happen? Dr. Michelle Dupree, if he had fallen from a bridge if he had fallen and then he died upon impact? Because we don't have x-rays of his body. Would he have bruised?

Or because it was so close to the time of death, would he have not bruised? Nancy, that's a good question. And yes, absolutely. If he is still alive at the time that he sustains that injury, he will bruise. So there should be evidence, physical evidence that we can see of any blunt trauma that may have happened like that. We should also be able to determine if any of the blunt trauma was post-mortem. We are learning the forensic pathologist determined all of his facial bones were intact, including his nasal septum. He did not break his nose. There were no external signs of neck injury or trauma.

The pathologist said it was just superficial scrapes on his face, that his skull and scalp were intact. He was found in an area of cedar forks surrounded by 20-foot walls on both sides. His feet were up against the south side wall with his body pointed out into the water. The creek wasn't even full. Is there a way he could have fallen down in there, Keith Smith? I don't see how he could have fallen down in there. And we went there plenty of times just trying to figure it out. And just from the way his hands were placed down to his side and the way he was positioned, I just couldn't figure out how he would be able to, even if he fell or hung down, he would fall forward against the wall and not turn around and fall with his hands to his

side. Just so make any. Was he on his back or his stomach? He was on his stomach, arms down at his side, and his left side of his face was more down than his right, and the majority of his trauma is to the right. He has blunt injuries on both sides of his head, both sides of his face, his elbow, his knees. He has puncture wounds on his ankle. On his buttocks, he has an injury, almost like a road rash injury. He was bleeding from the bottom of his chin, his mouth. And the thing is, is they didn't even test the water that he, that supposedly he drowned, but they didn't even test the water that they found in his lungs versus the water that was there.

And it's not even saying that he really has water in his lungs. It's more saying he has muddy really has water in his lungs. It's more saying he has muddy, muddy water in his nares. You know, in his nares, in his nose. What do you think about the theory that he was hit by a car and instead of calling police, someone disposed of his body? I mean, that's possible. I mean, the one video that would have shown that, we were lied to about the police and said it was checked, and it wasn't.

So, you know, it's hard. You know, those are all the million scenarios that go through your mind. I mean, there is a car that follows him down within 20 seconds of going down that road. Then there's a police officer that comes through at this about two minutes, almost exactly two minutes after Tyler walks down that road. And his phone randomly goes off at that time. What about that police cruiser video, Cheryl McCollum? If that cruiser passed a vehicle or passed a group of people or past his friend's car, it would show up on that video.

Correct. And we were told, I asked them about the dash cam video, and they said the only time the dash cam video comes on is when they turn their lights on. And, you know, their actual lights when you're not just patrolling. And I asked what vehicle that was, and they told me they couldn't figure that out. And I said, you know what beat that car is patrolling in. He's not rushing anywhere. And they said, well, we're sorry, we can't tell you that.

To Ashley Wilcott, Sandy and Keith were saying they couldn't get the phone records or any of the computer records. What about a subpoena ducus tecum, a civil? You don't have to have a warrant from the cops. How about your own civil lawsuit subpoena ducus tecum? A civil, you don't have to have a warrant from the cops. How about your own civil lawsuit subpoena? Absolutely. I think that's what they need to do. And there is a mechanism to do that legally. They may have to get an attorney, but it's worth it because they need to see those records. The other thing I want to point out is my understanding is, and they can correct me if I'm wrong, that on one of the friends thought that he had quote unquote, but dialed with the phone in his pocket, but that they heard another voice. And I've not heard any mention of law enforcement at all, considering the fact that there was another person with him.

What about that, Sandy? I've asked him and they just said, well, we don't know. No, you know, you know, every time I ask them questions, it's either what's that going to tell us? Or I guess we can or we don't know, you know, and they're not interested in finding out. I mean, I had to look at his autopsy pictures to find out where his phone was to find out that it was in his pocket because it left a lividity mark on his leg. And that was three months after I've gotten three different answers of where his phone was. And they just didn't... Cheryl, to me, this sounds like it needs to be handed over to the state attorney general's office because clearly the local police department is not acting. What do you think about that? There's zero question this needs to move somewhere else. Where is the phone now?

Sandy? We have the phone. They released the phone and all his stuff out of his pockets in four days to the family. Okay. So they released the phone to you the same time they destroyed the other evidence? Correct. And that was before they even talked for a phone statement to the second person he was with that night. Sandy, have you considered passing this up, moving it up up and asking the state AG to take over? I have. And I've spoke to the state actually three different times. And just recently I spoke to the state. I have tried to reach out to the

governor's office, the representatives, the senators, trying to push to get the state to come in because there are still things they can do. They can canvass. What did the attorney general's office say to you? The attorney general's office said it's up to the state to come in because there are still things they can do. They can canvas. What did the attorney general's office say to you? The attorney general's office said it's up to the state police. They basically just said, we don't handle this. And then I went to the state police and I was able to get pretty high up in the Springfield area, which is where, you know, our Capitol is in Illinois. And, um, I was reached out by district two and I spoke to, um, uh, the commander and sergeant through, um, um, district two, which is our district or the district where Tyler died.

And they said at this time they have not been invited in, but we are being told by the Gillsburg police that they did invite them in. So I'm being thrown back and forth between the two. They say, well, you know, a lot, a lot of all the physical evidence is gone. I said, but you can still canvas the two. They say, well, you know, a lot of all the physical evidence is gone, I said, but you can still hand us the areas. Well, you can still get a hold of all those records that you haven't been able to obtain and try to get the dash cam video and try to interview other people. There's still a lot that can be done. We want answers. Nancy, have they entertained the idea that they might need to exhume their son and have

a second autopsy we've we have we have entertained that but it's like it's you know it's very hard to do that um and i feel like okay if it shows that there's i mean can you get dna after this point in time after five months off of a body i don't know um can you get um we could have him x-rayed and and it could tell us he has broken bones but it's not going to tell us exactly probably what happened to him at this point so much evidence um the basic things that could have been done at the scene were not done and i just i would exhume his body if it was something that would give us answers, I would do it. But I'm not just going to exhume his body if it's going to just be another person. I think I heard Keith Smith in the background.

Go ahead, Keith. I was telling Sandy that when we first went back to talk to him, that first thing they were saying was, you know, what the F do? Your son drowned. And right then I just knew that there was no, going to be no effort towards his investigation. Let me repeat that. The parents of this boy go to police and they say, what the F can we do?

Okay, right there, that needs to go to the Attorney General's office. Right there. They clearly don't have their heart in this investigation. We want justice. If you have any information, please dial 309-762-9500. Repeat, 309-762-9500. Repeat, 309-762-9500. Or 239-258-8995. 239-258-8995.

Somebody knows something. Nancy Grace, Crime Story, signing off. Goodbye, friend. You're listening to an iHeart Podcast.