Crime Stories with Nancy Grace - ELITE CON WOMAN TRICKS $2.8 Million from Aging Holocaust Survivor

Episode Date: June 12, 2023

An aging Holocaust survivor living alone in New York City signs up for an online dating service, where he meets Peaches Stergo, a 36-year-old Florida woman. The two chat back and forth nearly every day and Stergo opens up to him about her money problems, so the man writes her a check. Stergo continues to have problems. Then, over four years later, the man sends Stergo his life savings and loses his apartment. All the while, Stergo is spending the money on luxury items, cars, boats, and two homes.  Joining Nancy Grace Today: Debby Montgomery Johnson - Victims Advocate and Victim of Cyber Love Crime; International Speaker and Best Selling Author; Founder of The Woman Behind The Smile, Inc. Jeffrey Wolf - Denver-based Cyber Crime Attorney; Founder and Managing Partner at Wolf Law; Twitter: @JeffWolf5280 and @WolfLawLLC John Muffler - Former Chief Inspector for US Marshals, Strategic Advisor for Gavin de Becker & Associates Caryn Stark - Psychologist - Trauma and Crime Expert; Twitter: @carnpsych Susan Constantine - Body Language Expert (specializes in deception and detection), President of the Human Behavior Academy and President of the Human Behavior Lab; Author: “How to Spot a Liar in 7 Seconds or Less"  Dave Mack- CrimeOnline.com Investigative Reporter See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an iHeart Podcast. A raven-haired 36-year-old Florida woman apparently scams an 87-year-old Holocaust survivor out of nearly three million dollars his entire life savings he's booted out of his home while she using all of his money is living in luxury how did that happen repeat Repeat, a raven-haired 36-year-old Florida woman scams an 87-year-old Holocaust survivor like he hasn't lived through enough already. Out of his entire life savings, nearly $3 million, he is thrown out of his home while she lives in a luxury abode. How does it happen? I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories.

Thank you for being with us here at Fox Nation and Sirius XM 111. First of all, take a listen to our friends at Crime Online. An 87-year-old Holocaust survivor living in Manhattan is enjoying a nice retirement when he decides to look for some companionship online. Someone nice, someone to pass the time with, and he found her. Or did she find him? It was a dating app that connected 36-year-old Peaches Stergo with the 87-year-old wealthy retired gentleman. Stergo finds the man easy to talk to, and he looks forward to chatting with her. Then one day, she shares a small problem with him. She was in an accident a while back and the lawyer that represented her is now demanding to be paid

before he will release her funds. She wasn't asking for the money just alone to pay the lawyer. She would pay him as soon as she accessed her money. He asked where to send it. Wow this woman, Peaches Sturgo, aka Alice, she's playing the long game. She got her eye on the prize. This scam took almost four years. So that's almost, what, almost a million dollars a year? $750,000 per year that she steals from a Holocaust survivor? Take a listen to more from Sydney Sumner. The conversations with Sturgo and her octogenarian friend continue.

Sturgo tells her gentleman friend that the money has been deposited in her TD bank account. Oddly enough, there is a small problem with her td bank account and she needs a little more money if she doesn't get the money soon her account will be frozen and not only will she lose her money but she also won't be able to pay back her gentleman friend she really wants to make sure she pays him back so he writes another check this poor guy, 87-year-old Holocaust survivor, living by himself, lonely, goes online to make a friend. And he, of all people, finds Alice Peaches Sturgo. Joining me in All-Star Panel to make sense of what we know of this, but first, straight out to CrimeOnline.com investigative reporter Dave Mack.

Dave, I was noticing the way Sydney Sumner was explaining it, that she has this online conversation going and they talk on the phone as well and they send pictures. So he's got a picture of who he thinks is a beautiful woman talking to him. And then after weeks have passed, then suddenly out goes the hook. She says she has a small problem, a small problem regarding an accident that happened a while back. Now the lawyer wants money. Totally believable. So she basically, you know, wraps him up in a cocoon of complacency and then, bam, puts out the hook. You mentioned early on the long con. You said it and

you're dead on right. What she does is she paints herself as a double victim. She was in a car accident and she was hurt bad enough that she had to get a lawyer to go after a settlement money. And the lawyer apparently won, but she's still a victim because now the lawyer says, well, I'm not freeing up your money until I get paid. So she is able to present this gentleman who, look, he's looking, you mentioned he's lonely, he's looking for a friend. And in reality, when you are talking about somebody who's got a couple of million dollars, $25,000 probably doesn't sound like that much. Not like it does to me.

And the way she pitches it is, hey, this money is already here. All I've got to do is borrow it from you so I can get all of mine, and then I'll pay you right back. That's the hook, and that's the carrot, all at the same time. I'm just thinking about the scam that she pulled on this guy. Dave Mack joining me, CrimeOnline.com investigative reporter. Also with me, Debbie Montgomery Johnson, a real-life victim of cyber love. She's now an international speaker, best-selling author, victims advocate, and founder of The Woman Behind the Smile at thewomanbehindthesmile.com. Debbie, what happened

to you? Similar, but not the same. I mean, it was a long, as our last gentleman said, it was a long con. It actually happened after my husband passed away suddenly. And I went online due to friends saying get a life. They wanted me after six months after Lou died. They said, get a life, you know, get out and date, put yourself out there. And I thought online dating then was safe. It was safer than doing it in person. I'd been married 26 years and I wasn't ready for somebody in the house, but I did want a friend. Just as this gentleman, he wanted a friend. Men, particularly, are subjective to the white knight syndrome, kind of like he wanted to take care of her. And I wanted my guy to take care of me, but, you know, I didn't give willingly to get him out of trouble, obviously. I was helping his company, his business, and I was assured also of being paid back.

And so it's not aimed at people who are necessarily lonely. In this case, this is elder fraud. And that gentleman was lonely. He was by himself. And I always say, be aware of what family are doing, what your friends are doing, and listen to them, watch them. I wonder, his son found out about this later on but who was watching him write 62 checks where was the bank you know um and i the biggest thing i want here is is we all look at it like 87 year old man holocaust survivor yeah that's bad but you've got 60 year old women 70 year old women 80 year old women being taken every single day around the globe and we look at these women as, oh, that was really stupid of them.

Why'd they do that? There's no victim blame here. This is pure manipulation. She is a criminal. And she has gone after this gentleman and just ripped his heart out, ripped his home away from him. And, you know, or I'd put her.

But it happens every single day to people just like you and me how much money were you scammed out of Debbie over two years I lost a million a million dollars oh dear lord and heaven and the guy said that actually let's hear it and Debbie's own words in our cup 43 speaking to CBS I wasn't lonely desperate lonely I really I wanted someone to talk to. Debbie Montgomery Johnson signed up for an online dating service after the sudden death of her husband Lou in 2010. I thought, oh, that's safe. I can do it from my home. That's where the widowed mother of four met a British businessman who called himself Eric Cole. I talked to him a few times. I mean, we messaged every day.

Johnson says she and Cole engaged in a two-year online relationship, but never met in person. Over the course of their relationship, Johnson says she gave Cole more than a million dollars in increments. At this point, your heart rules your head, and I was doing what my heart wanted me to do. In 2012, Johnson says her life stopped when cole came clean over video chat revealing who he really was a young man in nigeria big smile on his face can we keep this going and i'm thinking can we keep this going are you out of your mind can we keep this thing going keep this scam going is what he meant to say a million dollars from a woman who was vulnerable. Debbie had just lost her husband that she loved so deeply.

And in an effort to, quote, get out there, this is what happened. So one story leads to the next. And there's another problem and another problem. That's exactly what happened to our Holocaust survivor. Take a listen listen our cut three strugo continues to have emergencies and a lot of bad luck she seeks advice from her octogenarian friend sharing emails from td bank official letters from a td bank employee as well as invoices to show that she is trying to get things paid off so she can get her money freed up when

that's done she tells the retiree she can pay him back, but now the man doesn't have any more to give, and he calls his son for help. A few years ago, he had enough money to live a financially worry-free retirement, and now he's going to lose his apartment. Losing everything. Joining me, Jeffrey Wolfe, Denver-based cybercrime lawyer, founder and manager of WolfLawColorado.com. Jeffrey, thank you for being with us. You know, it's not hard at all. It's not difficult to fake an official-looking bank statement or an American Express email. I remember I almost got taken in by an email. It looks just like

American Express emails, except it said something that didn't make sense to me. And you know, it always says click here and then you get a ton of malware. Before I clicked, I read it again and I'm like, this just isn't right. This isn't the way my account would normally be. And it turns out it was fake. But I was always impressed by the fraudster's ability to fake such a legitimate looking American Express email. year old guy living alone and this woman peaches, Sturgo, sends him letters from her bank, letters from credit cards and lawyers and they all look real. Yeah, absolutely. That ends up being part of the fraud in these cases is that somebody who you have a genuine relationship with who needs money from you doesn't feel the need to send you proof that they need it. That is lying 101. The more somebody talks, the more they're

lying. The more proof that they're saying they can show you, the more likely it is that they have fabricated that. And so I tell anyone who's dealing with anything online that you always want to make sure that you are only dealing financially with people you know, that you are only dealing with portals and websites that you know, that you're never taking anybody's word for it. You're never responding to emails. You pick up the phone, you call the number on the back of your credit card when your bank emails you, because then you know you're talking to them and not whoever has emailed you. And it's no different than when you're looking at one of these romance cons,

is that the more proof they're trying to give you, the more likely it is that some or all of it is fraud, almost every time. Jeffrey Wolf joining me, Denver-based cybercrime attorney. You brought up something I never actually verbalized or thought through. When people keep saying, look, here's a letter, and you never ask to see the letter. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Joining me right now is the queen of body language interpretation, Susan Constantine. She can spot a lie a mile away. Deception is her specialty. She's president of the Human Behavior Academy.

Oh my goodness, I can just imagine that cocktail party. Everybody watching each other as they move around the room. Author of How to Spot a Liar in 7 Seconds or Left. She's at SusanConstantine.com. I don't want to go to your party, okay, as if I was going to be invited. But Susan Constantine, with all those body language experts at the Human Behavior Academy. Oh dear. Susan, I never thought of it until Jeffrey just said it,

that when people suddenly start trying to offer you proof of the claim of their request when you didn't ask them for it. True. And so that's one of the clues that people will give you unsolicited information. They will give you a lot of additional information without actually answering the question. So anytime we hear or I hear additional extraneous information, that is a really big red flag because what they're trying to do is convince you and to try to gain your trust. When they don't feel confident themselves, they keep on going until they feel

that they have convinced you before they'll go on to the next subject. Susan Constantine, give me some tips. Okay, Karen Stark, renowned psychologist joining us out of Manhattan. I want you to take all this in, percolate, then pour me the perfect cup of analysis. Okay, Susan Constantine, what should we look for when we're looking for lies? Okay, so when we're looking for lies, we're looking for incongruencies between what they say and their, well, in this case, they didn't get to, this person didn't get to know them, you know, in person. But in the real world, what we're looking for incongruencies, we're looking for differences between what they say in their body language, they're not congruent.

So anytime you ever see any sort of shift or deviation from there, that is always a red flag for me. The other thing is they want to build your trust very quickly. They really involve themselves very quickly and rapidly into your life. They are very likable, approachable. They are easy to get to know. They build your trust very easily. And those are really big clues for me. So language is a big one.

They generally don't put their own name into it. They eliminate pronouns like I, me, and my. Those are really big red flags. They tend to use third-person pronouns like they, them, and those guys. They use a lot of verbal red herrings, which I could go into for a long time. But they use third-person gimmicks. They use loophole lying. They use a lot of these different techniques to be able to gain your trust.

And also, too, when you're looking at their body language um you know oftentimes we say they don't make eye contact with you well that's not true because they tend to really lock eyes with you um their eye tends to kind of move or jog around and really not a sign of deception but rather look for these little micro movements you know where they're a little one side of their shoulder will shrug a little bit they'll have a smirk or a smile or a laugh or a puffing out of air when they're talking at the end of a sentence. Or maybe at the end of their sentence, they'll raise their pitch. So any kind of vocal clues, vocal tremors that are kind of off their baseline, those are all indications of deception. You know, one thing I want to mention, Susan Constantine, author of How to Spot a Liar in Seven Seconds or Less.

Susan, I think some of their discussions were over Zoom or FaceTime because he is in Manhattan and she's in Florida. So I think he did get to see her. But of course, he's 87 years old. He's been through H-E-L-L and back. As I mentioned, he's a Holocaust survivor, which may have played into some of his feelings of loneliness and abandonment and looking for comfort. Of course, I'm just a JD, not an MD or a shrink like some of you guys. But him being alone in his apartment in Manhattan, surrounded by millions of people, but not really knowing

anyone. Well, take a listen to what happens when he finally calls his son. Take a listen to our cut four. When the 87-year-old Holocaust survivor's son gets involved, it isn't long before he reaches out for help. The United States Justice Department investigates and finds out that Peaches Stergo, who friends sometimes call Alice, didn't get the money from an injury settlement. There was never any injury or lawyer. The email address was fake, and so were the official-looking documents from TD Bank.

It was all a fraud. But while the old man lost his life savings and had to give up his apartment, Stergo was living large with his life savings. While her old friend is losing his apartment, Stergo lives in a gated community and owns a condo, numerous cars, a boat, and she spends thousands of his dollars on designer clothing and vacations at the Ritz-Carlton. And to our cuts 5 and 6, our friends at Fox 35.

Investigators say Stergo's actions forced the victim to lose his home all the while they believe stergo is using that money to buy cars boats and even a home right here in central florida peaches alice stergo is accused of stealing 2.8 million dollars from an 87 year old holocaust survivor investigators believe the two met on a dating app in 2017 they say not long after the fraud began their creativity knows no bounds investigators believe stergo repeatedly lied to the victim convincing him into sending her fifty thousand dollars a month the indictment states she made the victim believe that her bank needed more money or her account would freeze and she'd lose it all. Out of fear of losing his money, the victim sent

62 checks worth over 2.8 million dollars. Joining me right now, John Muffler, former chief inspector for the U.S. Marshals Service. You can find him at equitasglobalSecurity.com. John, thank you for being with us. John, a problem is going to be how do the feds track her down? Because this is clearly wire fraud. She's using the phone. She's using the computer. She's getting financial transactions across state lines. And that's how the feds get a hold of you.

She's in Florida. He's in New York. These fraudulent transactions used wire, which is like bank transactions or credit card transactions, and checks, financial transfers. But how do they find her? How can they track her down, John?

Yeah, I think it's a relatively easy case for the Bureau in that, you know, this information is all trackable because it's all via electronic communications, bank accounts, social media, correspondence, phone calls, all that's very easily trackable. I imagine they have a very lengthy list of not just a crime, but potentially other victims as well. I can't imagine she came out of nowhere to begin her first act as a con artist with this particular victim. So I think, you know, again, it's an easy, they're easy dots to connect in an investigation. But I mean, physically,

how do you do it? I mean, you've got accounts that she's having the money where it's being deposited. And then so what? You go to the bank and you get an ID of whose account that is

and where they live. How do you do it? How do you physically do it? Yeah, I mean, you're looking at getting, you know appropriate you know information to the courts for the her particular bank information her social security number her date of birth the information they'd be able to get from her and then able to research through the different credit bureaus where that money may be, what's connected to her. So again, it takes some a little bit of due diligence on the agent's part,

but I think fairly easy to connect her name to the different accounts that she's been using to deposit. Wait till you hear how Peaches used this poor man's money. Take a listen to our cut 9 WESH. A Florida woman is facing federal charges after prosecutors say she swindled an 87-year-old Holocaust survivor out of nearly three million dollars. The man met 36-year-old Peaches Sturgo, also known as Alice, on a dating website several years ago. She used a variety of excuses to get him to send her money, always with the promise that she would pay him back. Now instead, we're told she used that money to buy a home in a gated community, a condo, a boat, and several cars, including a Corvette. By the time the man admitted to his son what he had done, he'd given her his entire life savings.

Karen Stark joining me, high-profile psychologist out of Manhattan. You can find her at karenstark.com. Karen with a C. Karen, we heard earlier the so-called White Knight Complex. What happened here? It's so heartbreaking, Nancy, because someone is taking advantage of somebody, elderly person and that is what happens they look for people who are vulnerable and so he he's looking for a companion and has an instinct to want to help that's that white knight he wants to come in and save her. And he doesn't realize he's being scammed. And the thing that is most upsetting to me in situations like this is that the person

like this gentleman, he doesn't think to get in touch with his family. He doesn't think to ask anybody, does this make sense? Or can you look at what I'm doing? And nobody knows to check on him. And so someone who has been through the worst that anybody can possibly imagine, awful, hard experience is now being scammed out of all of his money because he's a good person and believes he's helping somebody. And what this woman spent the money on, multiple Rolex watches, a boat, two cars, luxury items, expensive jewelry, pocketbooks, you name it. What does that say to you, Susan Constantine?

It tells me that she's a con. She's a scammer. And this is all about her. So, you know, I think that she became very obsessive about it once she found that she really got a good fish on her hook. And she saw how easy it was for her to be able to gain more of his trust. Then the more that fueled her. So the more it fueled that narcissism in her,

she felt she was invincible. So she could still continue to take from him and ask money because she knew that she knew exactly what his triggers were. She knew how to work those triggers to her advantage. And that's how she got the money. Guys, what are some red flags we can look out for? Take a listen to our cut seven. There's typically a sense of urgency

and some reason why the money chain has to continue. Experts say romance fraud crimes like this are on the rise nationwide and are affecting people of all ages. Experts say scams like this are preventable. If they feel they're being told the only way to get their money back is by investing additional funds, that's a huge red flag. The only way to get the money back is to spend more money.

That is a huge red flag. Guys, we are talking about an 87-year-old Holocaust survivor that lost his entire life savings. And I think part of it to Debbie Montgomery Johnson, who was herself a cyber victim, now an international speaker, is that he didn't want to tell his children, his son, what he had done. Because he probably knew that someone would disapprove of a relationship with a much, much younger woman in another state that he was loaning money to. So he probably didn't want that judging. Well, that's absolutely true, Nancy. And I know when my kids said, mom, don't, don't, don't. I was like, hey, I'm the adult here. Leave me alone. And I shut them out. And that's exactly what this woman or part of me cannot believe that

she did this by herself, because typically they work in groups. This is very involved in what she did here. But she actually got him to not talk about it. And that's what the scammers, the criminals do is they say, don't listen to those people. You know, I'm going to take care of you. I'm there for you. And I'll make sure that you get your money back, typically with interest, you know. But they isolate because they don't want you to listen to anybody else, just them. And that's devastating when it all

falls apart, because now you've isolated yourself from friends and family who could have helped, would have helped, but didn't know what was going on. And that's part of the con. So Debbie Montgomery, when you were victimized online and lost a million dollars to the scam artist, why is it you did not want your family to know what was happening? Because I was home alone. I was, you know, obviously Lou had died and I was working my company from the house. And I didn't want to bring the kids into it because when they started being the naysayers, I felt like it's not any of their business. They weren't living here. My youngest was here. But my oldest was, my older three were out of the like it's not any of their business. They weren't living here. My youngest was here.

But my oldest was, my older three were out of the house. They had lives of their own. And actually, it was very, I was going to say intoxicating. I'm not a drinker. But I loved the feeling that I got when I was involved because I felt like young again. I felt like I was desirable again. It was very interesting, the emotions that go on when you're in the middle of this and you don't see the red flags. I look back and call them pink flags now, but those red flags weren't hard red flags.

And when my kids wanted to say, Mom, don't, I'm like, just leave me alone. I'm okay. You know, I was not a dummy. I was well trained, well educated. I had a good company and I didn't need my children who I thought, you know, they were good kids. But I said, I don't need you to tell me what to do right now. And I shut them out. And that's what happens. And that's what the scammers bank on. And they go, they're laughing their way to the bank because you are home alone now and you're left by yourself with no one to support you even though you've done it

basically done that to yourself you've isolated yourself from family because of the encouragement of the scammers dave mack joining me crime online.com investigative reporter what are some of the things she purchased from the 87 year old's life savings you know nancy the one thing that really caught my attention and you pointed this out that while he had to give up his apartment in Manhattan, she not only had a house in a gated community, but she also bought a condominium. So while he lost everything and didn't have a place to stay, she had two places to stay paid for by him. She also bought a number of cars, noted was a Corvette, but also a white 2022 Ram 1500 pickup. Now, I don't know the Rolex types that there are. Not my kind of thing.

But she bought a Rolex Oyster Perpetual Day, Date 40 with President's Bracelet just 41 with jubilee bracelet and a date just 41 with oyster bracelet and roman numeral dial are all of those rolexes yeah those are all three rolexes well she bought three rolexes you lost me on oyster she brought three rolexes yes ma'am correct me if i'm wrong dave mack did she buy expensive trips? Yep. Did she stay at places like the Ritz-Carlton on his money? Yes, she did. Did she spend tens of thousands of dollars on expensive meals? Yes.

Gold coins? Yes. Gold bars? Yes. Jewelry? Yes. Rolex watches? Yes. Designer clothing from stores like Tiffany, Ralph Lauren, Neiman Marcus, Louis Vuitton? Yes. Yes. Okay.

I can't claim credit for knowing all that because I am reading directly from the indictment against her, Peaches Sturgo, a.k.a. Alice. crime stories with nancy grace just so you know mr victim out there who we are not naming you're not the only one you're hearing our friend debbie montgomery johnson speaking the founder of the woman behind the smile and international speaker after what happened to her losing a million dollars they're not the only ones guys take a listen to the case with janet cook and our Cut 42 from CBS. I got lonely, and I spent a lot of time on the computer playing games, and I just happened to go to the date site. When Janet Cook went looking for love online 17 years after losing her husband, she found a suitor on the very first day. I liked him because he said sweet things and he was very charming.

After four months of courtship, including emails and phone calls, but never meeting in person, the man who claimed to be a contractor from Virginia was suddenly stuck somewhere in Africa and in serious trouble. According to the story, he became very ill and he was in the hospital. He claimed to have had a kidney transplant. The money started to add up and before Janet realized she was being swindled, the 76-year-old widow was at roughly $300,000. Okay, Jeffrey Wolf joining me, Denver-based cybercrime lawyer. Jeffrey, there's so many red screaming bells of alarm right there.

So the person you've been talking to that flatters you all the time suddenly gets stranded in Africa. And if that's not far-fetched enough, what, they can't get a plane home? If that's not far-fetched enough, then suddenly they need a kidney transplant i mean really how does this happen how can people fall for this jeffrey well we live in a time where people are extremely disconnected and extremely lonely especially coming out of covid these numbers have ticked up incredibly because of how isolated people have been for the last several years. And the bottom line is, if you ever heard the term, not my circus, not my monkeys, that is what it is when or, you know, just coming out of COVID and lost touch with all of their friends, it makes it so much easier to have them so yearning for human contact

that they'll believe anything, they'll do anything, and they'll spend anything to try and do it. It makes no sense when you look at it from a thousand feet in the air. But when you're in those moments, people get victimized very very very quickly because they so yearn for that human contact and that affection that they are being given that love bomb that they get from this person you were hearing about another victim janet cook who was playing online 17 years after losing her husband well then there is another victim take a listen our cut 4040 from wmar his name at least he told me his name was tony richard and he sent pictures of a very handsome doctor these are photos of a real doctor but they're not of the person who contacted Kate Kleinert on Facebook.

The imposter told her they shared similar interests, and their chats quickly morphed into daily phone calls. He claimed to be in Iraq working on a U.N. contract as a surgeon, and due to safety concerns, he couldn't FaceTime or carry money on him. So after four months of communicating, Tony asked a favor for his daughter. She needed a gift card, and that started the whole business. Kate bought a $100 Visa gift card, took a photo of the numbers, then sent it to Tony. Then came more requests.

All told, I gave him $39,000. $39,000? Well, first of all, a red bell of alarm was sent. He calls himself Tony Richard. That's Richard with a funky accent. But explain to me, Jeff Muffler, former chief inspector of U.S. Marshals Service and a strategic advisor for the Gavin DeBecker and Associates Group, John Muffler. We hear that she gave him money for a gift card for his daughter, the photos of the numbers,

and then sent it. Did he use that to ultimately rack up those numbers from the visa, $39,000 of debt? Yeah, it's usually the beginning of the hook, right? So a gift card overseas, I can't connect. That's the MO of a lot of these. And once that transaction begins, you know, the gift card or just a couple dollars here, they become, you know, invested into that exchange. And so, again, gift cards can be tracked and a little harder to do than, say, credit cards or whatever.

But certainly, you know, the beginning of that transaction between con artist and victim. Thirty nine grand in Debbie Montgomery's case, a million dollars. In the case of this Holocaust survivor, nearly three million dollars. He's thrown out of his apartment. While she has not only a condo, but she also purchased a house, a Corvette, Rolex watches, designer clothes. Take a listen to our cut 39. Our friends at Fox 35. We are learning new details about the smooth talking man who's now behind bars after police say he swindled a woman out of $80,000. Police in Franklin, Tennessee say John Martin Hill here tried to hide under a table in

a hotel conference room when they confronted him late Tuesday night. He smiled in his mugshot after he was arrested on a fugitive's warrant. Fox 5's Portia Bruner has more on what we've learned about the man whose charm landed him in a jail cell. John Martin Hill flashed that now infamous smile after police arrested him in Franklin Tennessee Tuesday night. He was taken into custody just hours after Gwinnett County Police released these photos of him. And the tip came into one of our supervisors in the special victims unit. According to Police Corporal Michelle Pajero, that tip came from a woman in Franklin who saw the story Tuesday about the Alpharetta woman who says Hill swindled her out of $80,000

just one week after they met and reportedly fell in love. Susan Constantine joining me, body language expert specializing in deception, author of How to Spot a Liar in 7 Seconds or Less. Online, what are the alarm signs that you advise people to search for when they are communicating? Sure. So one of the things that I've noticed just myself, and by the way, we offer this service at my company.

We have a Facebook scam investigator that works for us, Chris Delgado. But one of the things that I've noticed is, first of all, the inconsistency with these photographs. A lot of times, photographs, when you're looking at the different photographs between he or she, would look to see how they are communicating and what photos they've actually put up on the Internet and what the story they're trying to tell you. You'll start to see some inconsistencies. A lot of times they'll be just like a little round little picture of themselves,

and then they'll keep repeating it over and over and over again and usually they're a military wear they're some high official someone that is like unobtainable for the average person the other thing is that i look forward to is in their language there's always a cut and paste piece of it so when you're looking at how they actually phrase words they'll have miss words, which is incongruent with, of course, their educational level, et cetera. And then they'll pop in a piece that is like, doesn't even make sense. Like you can tell that they're not very well educated. So those are big signs for me and that they tend to really build up the person. They speak about things that are the romance side of them, things that they find, what they'd want to do with their partners, the long beaches, walks, and the sunsets and the dinners

and all this kind of thing, which is kind of enticing for a lonely person on the other end of it that they've never met before. One of the things that I always recommend that they do, number one, do your background check on them. Take the name in there and start to look at it. They can go right in Truthfinder and see who this guy is, see where there's any photographs of the person. I've caught more people just even on that, which is a commercial website, and found scammers on it many times over. Truthfinder.com? Yep, that's it. Can I jump in and add something there? Yes, go ahead, please.

Yeah, I've heard charm and niceness a few times during the conversation, especially from the victims that have participated in the call. But to add what she just said is think of it as charm and niceness is not a credential for good intent, right? So that is not a character trait. So you got to think of it that way. I mean, it's easier said than done. But for victims, if they're hearing such charmingness, niceness, there's a reason for that. That's a big red flag I would add to that list also. So guys, let me ask John Muffler or Jeffrey Wolf. Let's start with you, John. How do we get this victim's money back? That money that she has stolen from the victim,

you know, that will be resold and, you know, he will be able to get some of that money back um um it's probably not anywhere near the 2.8 million that was stolen from him but he will be able to recover um some of that some of that and how do you go about doing that jeffrey yeah yeah nancy that's going to be through the restitution process at the courthouse and the seizure powers of the federal government when you commit a crime. This woman's never paying restitution, okay? Yes, she is. It's going to be a part of her plea bargain. They're going to seize her property.

Where you make the victim pay restitution, the victim is already broke. So she's never paying anything out of her pocket. What the state will have to do is seize all of her assets, what they can find, what they can trace, and the state gets it and sells it. She's never going to willingly write a check to anybody. But how do we go about tracking her accounts, getting those Rolexes back, finding the cars, selling the condos, selling the house? Who does all that? The government? Yeah, absolutely.

This is a federal case. So the Federal Bureau of Investigation and the Attorney General's office are going to be in charge of tracking the money down, tracking her assets down, seizing them under federal seizure laws, and then selling them. And then the proceeds will go to this victim. That is the way the federal government is going to work a case like this. So while she may not write him a physical check because she's about to go to prison for a maximum of 20 years, but she doesn't need to write the check. The government's going to write him the check. You're right that he may not get that almost $3 million that he's out of pocket, but they have a lot of assets already.

We read in the indictment the assets that they have already seized. He is going to get a lot of money back, and he darn well should get all that money back. Gosh, I hope so. So Debbie Montgomery Johnson, a victim of cyber crimes, now international speaker. Bottom line, what's your advice? Beware and be aware. And I can't say that this man is going to be lucky, but he is going to get his money back. Most, if not all of the victims or but he is going to get his money back. Most,

most, if not all of the victims or survivors that I work with have gotten nothing back because you can't, you can't find the money. It's gone overseas. So I just watch out for those red flags. If it seems to be too good to be true, then it probably is do a,

like I love to do the background check. When my brothers told me to do that, I said, don't be ridiculous. This is a dating person, but do a reverse search on pictures get a dating buddy get someone to help you out because you know your your heart rules your head and your your endorphins take over and you don't want to listen to logic and as the fellow said here yeah looking back hindsight 2020 when you're in the middle of it, you can't see what's happening. You feel like you want it to be true, and you will make it true until it crashes and burns.

And people lose everything. They lose all their money. They lose their homes. Many of the women I've known have lost their lives, and that is just devastating. And this is elder abuse at its prime. Karen Stark, we also have to check our own ego. When you are an 87-year-old man, what do you think a 36-year-old woman is interested in? You know, let's take it away from this victim.

My husband had a friend in college, perfectly normal. Wonderful wife, wonderful marriage. He goes to some guy event, to a strip club. I've told you this. Falls for a stripper. By the time she's through with him, he has sent her son through private school for like seven or eight years, got him set up for college.

He's lost his entire bank account. He was like a stockbroker. He loses his job because he went bankrupt and he loses his marriage. And then she dumped him. Now, you have to ask yourself, why does this person want me? And that's a hard question when you want to believe they love you. And I think Nancy, what you are describing, and I have encountered with the people that I work with is that it's so difficult to get somebody to pay attention to that, that to say

to somebody who's 87 years old, you know, why would this young woman be wanting you when they are so excited about the idea that there is someone who wants you? And there's a whole fantasy aspect that takes control. And as your guest pointed out, I mean, you are so embroiled in it and excited about the idea that somebody loves you that it's very hard to be logical,

which is what you're talking about. You know, Karen Stark, I asked a illogical question because everybody on earth wants to be loved, whether they acknowledge it or not. And when you think you found somebody that loves you, you don't say, wow, what's wrong with that person? Why would they love me? You think, oh, my stars. I'm so lucky. This person loves you. You don't say, wow, what's wrong with that person? Why would they love me? You think, oh, my stars. I'm so lucky this person loves me. That's just like screaming up and down I-75 and expecting the pavement to hear you. It's just you've got to watch out for

the red flags that we've heard about and what Susan Constantine was explaining. I pray this poor guy, this Holocaust survivor, gets his money back. We wait as justice unfolds. Goodbye, friend. This is an iHeart Podcast.