Crime Stories with Nancy Grace - Explosive documents detail 3-year-old Mariah Woods alleged sex abuse before tot found dead in creek, CLAIMS mommy knew

Episode Date: December 5, 2017

Child Protection Service documents obtained by Crime Stories detail allegations of physical and sexual abuse against the man charged with dumping little Mariah Woods' body in a North Carolina swamp. Nancy Grace discusses this bombshell with lawyer/child advocate Ashley Willcott, psychologist Dr. Chloe Carmichael, defense lawyer Troy Slaten, forensics expert Joseph Scott Morgan, and reporter Alexis Tereszcuk. Mariah's mom's is jailed on charges including obstruction of justice and hiding a body of someone who died of unnatural causes. No one has yet been charged directly for the toddler's death. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an iHeart Podcast. require hours of tech support. Circle with Disney found a better way. This awesome little device designed for families manages content and time online for all the devices in your home. Easy to set up. You can filter content, set time limits, even set a bedtime. Each person can have their own setting. This way, your children don't end up in scary internet territory, but mom and dad can still use the internet to get their work done. Use code Nancy at circlewithnancy.com. Get $10 off your Circle and free shipping. Circlewithnancy.com. Offer code Nancy. Thank you, Circle, for protecting our children Crime Stories with Nancy Grace on Sirius XM Triumph, Channel 132

The search is still on tonight for 3-year-old Mariah Woods The girl was last seen by her mother at her home in Onslow County The mother tells me she last saw her daughter in the home at around 11pm when she checked on her. This is my world. This is my angel. She said her boyfriend saw the toddler around midnight when he got up, and she says he told her to go back to bed.

Remains believed to be the little girl were discovered along a highway. Now there's an arrest. 32-year-old Earl Kemery, Mariah's mother's boyfriend, no one is charged with causing her death. Kemery's charges only include concealing a death and obstruction of justice. More charges likely to follow and maybe others charged. We are not ruling anything out. After a long search, after sifting through one fact after the next,

after literally thousands of people, ATV, shoulder-to-shoulder, canines, helicopters, divers, three-year-old Mariah is found. She is found at the bottom of a creek 25 miles from her home. Does it jive with mommy's story? I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. Thank you for being with us. In the last hours as we head to air we receive bombshell information on the case joining me dr chloe carmichael psychologist and founder of anxiety tools.com alexis teres chuck raideronline.com investigative reporter death investigator joseph scott morgan and joining me right now child advocate ashley wilcott ashley it's quite a bombshell what have you learned listen so nancy the cps documents that the father had he has shared and it states in here really horrific horrific disclosures by the

10 year old sibling um and quite frankly if kids are listening to the show i don't think they should and hear really horrific, horrific disclosures by the 10-year-old sibling. And quite frankly, if kids are listening to the show, I don't think they should listen to this specific part. And again, please do not mention anyone other than Mariah, if she is included, or the alleged perp, if he is included. If there are any other minor children, let's don't refer to them. If there are, with me child advocate ashley wilcott with a major development in this case as it unfolds right so the 10 year old sibling though

states in this document that he witnessed the boyfriend and i'm quoting put his penis in the mouth of his sister, Mariah. He also states that the mother knew the boyfriend did this. Now, that's one of the allegations, Nancy. It gets worse, right? That's a horrible one. But listen, it also states the mother of Mariah was aware that the boyfriend abuses substances including listen to this pot heroin and methamphetamines lastly that on the same day mariah went missing that the 10 year old was hit in the face by the boyfriend, causing the nose to bleed. That's a hard hit.

Kids get hit. They don't bleed, right, when they're in sports and such, causing his nose to bleed. And the mother knew it and failed to protect him. So, Nancy, I'm sure you're over there throwing up, right? So now I'm going to give it back to you when you probably can't even speak. It's that detailed. I hardly even know which way to turn, Ashley. I don't even know which way to turn.

Guys, we were talking about the disappearance, and now we know the death of this gorgeous three-year-old little girl, Mariah Woods. I have talked extensively with her father, Alex, as he struggles to understand what happened. He was in the middle of a custody battle to get his children back he did not want them in that home this is what we know they lived in a very tiny home and the mom lived with the live-in her two boys and a little girl the little girl the story is Alexis Torres Chuck radar online.com that she goes missing in the middle of the night just break it down really quickly and i want to go back to ashley wilcott what happened well the mom called

9-1-1 at six o'clock in the morning and said her daughter had been missing she said she last she saw her she put her to bed she said her boyfriend said he saw her at about 11 o'clock at night and he said don't worry i'm going to take care of her i'm going to put her back to bed the mom wakes up in the morning and she is missing. Obviously, none of that was true now that we have found little Mariah's body and the boyfriend, Earl Kimrey, has been arrested. You know, the timeline didn't really hang together for me and there was a little confusion at the beginning of it. But what really stuck out in my mind to Ashley Wilcott is this little girl wore braces on her legs. You know like in the

posters for cerebral palsy, the poster boy who has turned out to be a very dear friend of mine over the years has grown up and still advocates for cerebral palsy. Remember him? It's that kind of posters, that kind of braces, Ashley. Her braces were in the home and her PJ she wore the night before. And when you and I heard that, along with Joe Scott Morgan, we were all like, uh-uh, N-O. The child's gone and what she was wearing is still there and no other clothes are missing. I mean, you know, Ashley, I've told you about Lucy. She got on some kicks. She's cleaned her closet out so much there's hardly anything in there anymore.

I know exactly what's in there and I will know if something is missing. Much less when you're three, you know exactly what's in there, and I will know if something is missing, much less when you're three. You know exactly what's in there. No other clothes were missing, which means she wasn't wearing anything when she left except those pink and white undies. Ashley, I want to go back to this bombshell discovery that you have made regarding child protective services, or as I call them, DFACs, Department of Family and Children's Services. Do these documents specifically name the Libyan Kimri? Yes, absolutely.

So I said boyfriend for purposes of making it easier for listeners to follow, but it specifically states, for instance, the 10-year-old states that he witnessed Mr. Kimri put his penis in the mouth of the three-year-old. L3, it references Mr. Kimrey specifically. Guys, I'm looking at the documents myself right now. Across the top, it says, State of North Carolina, in the matter of, and it refers to the title of the case. It says name and address, and it is, in fact, they're 2405 Dawson Cabin Road.

It gives notice. It gives names of lawyers. This lawyer is named Mark Rainer, and that's the lawyer for the mom. Then there's another lawyer, John Paul Saba. It keeps going down, just telling you what we're seeing. It explains, it says where the dad lives. It gives a juvenile summons and notice of hearing. So does that mean to Ashley Wilcott that there was a hearing on this? Because it's given a case number and everything. So what happens, yes, what happens when children come into the custody of the state?

In every state, it's a little different, but every state, there's going to be a hearing that occurs quickly because the court has got to determine, for instance, in Georgia, is there probable cause? Is there reason that these children would be at risk with their family and actually need to be in state custody. And those hearings happen quickly. You know, this filing is December 1, 2017. It's when they're filed, 1234 p.m. in the afternoon in Onslow County. When did she go missing? What day did she go missing, Alexis Tereshchuk?

Either November 26th or 27th, depending on what you think with the mom. And the reason she's saying that, guys, is we don't know what time of the night she goes missing. The mom says she put her to sleep at 11. The boyfriend says he sees her at 12. When did she really go missing? It's one of those two days. So this is filed, let me understand this, after she goes missing. Explain that, Ashley Wilcott. Guys, I'm just beside myself. I'm looking at what Ashley Wilcott has managed to unearth, and I'm now on page four, and it's exactly as she is saying. Go ahead. What do you make of this being filed after she goes missing?

I'm not concerned about that. Only in this respect. What happens is the process is so quick necessarily because the court needs to protect children. So frequently courts are able to give verbal orders based on testimony presented to them or have an emergency order to protect the children. And then often the documents are allowed by law to be filed once they can be prepared within a very short time frame. So in this specific case, I'm not at all surprised those are date stamped later that doesn't concern me because i think the children were likely with a relative or somewhere safe right before everything got filed now keep in mind the other piece of this nancy that we've learned is that the children

are placed with a relative they are with the maternal grandmother so while they remain in the custody of the state as i understand understand, they're placed with the relative, which so long as that relative is appropriate, it's much less traumatic for those children. I'm going back to the paragraph in order. There are about 20 paragraphs of fact allegations. Some of them are just the address and the names, but the one specifically, paragraph 15, a witness states, he observed the live-in boyfriend, Earl Kimrey, put his genitals in the mouth of Mariah Woods, a three-year-old child.

The witness states that the mother knew Earl Kimrey was sexually abusing three-year-old Mariah, and the mother failed to protect the juveniles from exposure. Failed to protect Mariah, correct that. Failed to protect Mariah from exposure to sex abuse. The next paragraph, as Ashley Wilcott, child advocate, has told you, says that the mother is aware Kimrey abuses pot, heroin, and methamphetamine. You know, I've got to ask you something, Ashley Wilcott. The mother, let me state again for the record, has not been named a person of interest or a suspect in the death of three-year-old Mariah.

But, Ashley, she needs a lawyer, a defense lawyer, And I'll tell you why, as you already know. When you are in the commission of a felony, that being felony child abuse or neglect, neglect, and a death occurs during the commission of a felony, that is felony murder. And for a felony murder, just like premeditated murder, you can get the death penalty. Bam! Right. And I have no doubt that charges are going to be forthcoming. And I've said from the beginning, law enforcement has done a bang-up job in this case because they have controlled the investigation so that they can be thorough and deliberate and figure out exactly what happened, what charges can result and will result. So I have no doubt she will face criminal charges.

I think they're being thorough in their investigation. You know, Ashley, when the cops do a great job, nobody ever notices. When one rogue cop does something horrible or the cops in general mess something up, that's all you hear about. It's the headline. But you're right. This child was found 25 miles away from home in a creek bed. They found her. I've gone over it and over it and over it with her father, Alex. How it could have happened, the way it may have happened. Ashley, we also have learned from Alex that someone in the neighborhood observed someone leaving the home around 3 to 4 o'clock in the morning carrying something. It's all fitting together.

But these documents, Ashley, these documents from Child Protective Services, I'm just sick because the scenario is playing out in my mind. When you don't know a horse, Ashley, look at the track record. If there is evidence that he had molested a child before, what do I know about what was happening that night? Allegations the mom knew and did nothing. Was that what happened that night? And then the child ended up being killed? That she was going to tell somebody?

Who knows? Ashley, help me put the pieces of the puzzle together. Look, statistically, if you talk about cases in which a male has been a perpetrator of abuse against a child and it's been substantiated, statistically, it is frequently 26% of the time by a boyfriend or a stepfather. So already, if you just look at statistics, which can be dangerous depending on how you interpret them, but my point is that happened in this scenario. I do not believe the mother did not know and or should not have known. She should have known. She didn't know or she should have known this happened. I have no doubt in my mind. She is equally as responsible and in my opinion, more responsible than the person who actually did it because it is a mother's job to protect her children and stop choosing, making poor choices for who's around your children.

And in this case, that's exactly what she did. She did not protect an innocent child at all. You know, Ashley, so often, and I'm going to have to go to Dr. Chloe Carmichael on this, but Ashley, in our practice, me as a prosecutor, you as a child advocate and lawyer, I don't believe I have ever once, once, in literally 10,000 plus cases I have handled, seen a mother side against the boyfriend or the husband and with the child. Never. Not child? Never. Not once. Never. I don't understand it.

I mean, I love David. You know I do. But I would totally kill him or anybody else that touched the children. And Ashley, you know I love our babysitters. You've met them. Every person I've ever had be with the children. But I've always asked the children alone, has and so ever touched your front end has someone ever ever touched your back and they go mom who would want to touch my back i'm like well i don't know i don't know

beside me i don't know anybody that would touch it but have they just tell me i just tell me and i you know i know it sounds crazy to people on the outside, but you have to be vigilant. But there are people, you know, like women, when their husbands are cheating, they ignore all the signs. They don't want to know. They ignore the perfume. They ignore the lipstick. They ignore the calls outside in the car. They ignore the two cell phones. Why? You know, you just, you make up excuses. You rationalize. Could that be possible here, Ashley? Yeah, absolutely. you make up excuses you rationalize could that be possible here ashley yeah absolutely and i do think women rationalize that but once children are involved that's what you know that's a whole different thing than oh my husband's cheating once you have children and you find out that there's any type of activity that puts your children at risk as a mother that

should come first but there's an emotional and I'm not the expert in this. Thank goodness you have one on the phone who is. Because there's just this inability to choose these children over a man. And they continue to make bad choices and choose a bad man over protecting their own children. I don't get it. I don't understand it. I'm here to say it happens a lot. Yeah, I mean, man, no offense, man.

I love men. But like I tell Lucy, she once had a little crush. And I said, Lucy, don't worry. If he doesn't like you back, men are like buses. Another one will come along in about 15 minutes. Don't worry. And it'll be even better. So I don't understand why a mom would choose a man over, or a husband choosing a woman over their children.

It's the same for both genders. What we know right now, bombshell Child Protective Service documents, I guess we suspected, but now we know that formal allegations had been made in secret. We managed to obtain these documents. I want to thank our partner who is making our investigation into the disappearance and death of baby Mariah possible. And it is 1-800-DENTIST. You know what? We all eat way too much sugar, especially in the holiday season.

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They're wearing braces right now, and I pay for it on a monthly basis. Go to 1-800-DENTIST and give yourself and your children the same, a beautiful smile to face the future. I want to thank you, 1-800-DENIS, for being our partner today. In the last hours, we received bombshell formal documents from Child Protective Services in North Carolina that allege, this is not a conviction,

it is not a finding by a judge, formal documents alleging the live-in boyfriend had been sexually molesting baby Mariah, who has now been found dead at the bottom of a creek. We knew it was all wrong when Mariah was missing and her little leg braces were still in the home, as were her pajamas she was wearing the night before ashley wolcott for those people that are just joining us here at series 6m 132 that may have just found us on the dial please tell me what you have found so nancy what we have found is that there is a witness in the home who has disclosed seeing mry, who is the boyfriend, putting his penis in Mariah's mouth and that the mother failed to address this and knew it was happening. To Dr. Chloe Carmichael, psychologist, founder of anxietytools.com, joining us out of New

York. Dr. Chloe, it reminds me so much of a case, one of the first ones I had, where a very prominent Atlanta businessman had been abusing, he had 30 plus, quote, natural children. I remember it very well, from all different, a lot of different women over many, many years. And he was then living with his new girlfriend. She had a teen girl, like a five-year-old and a three-year-old and of course he was molesting them and i went digging and found all of these similar transactions where he had been doing this for years and years and he was now in his 60s and i remember looking at that living girlfriend her

teen girl had already moved out of the home and was living alone in a housing project rather than live in their fancy home. Wonder why, right, Dr. Chloe? And the victims in the indictment that I was prosecuting looked like two little bitty angels. One was three and one was five. And he was full on molesting this three- and five-year-old. And the mom knew, Dr. Chloe. The mom knew. She would sit on the defense side of the courtroom every day of trial. That's the trial I got held in contempt, by the way. That was a big old mess.

Every public defender in the courthouse ran to the courtroom to see me get handcuffed. But back to the story, she even took the children on the weekend when I wasn't with them, on the weekend to the defense office to recant their stories. Dr. Chloe, I don't understand it. Why would a mother, in the face of all this evidence, side with a boyfriend? Nancy, I hear you loud and clear. I would have been getting arrested right there with you in a situation like that.

With a mother in this type of situation, there's a lot of, you know, potential reasons, although I don't believe any of it really ever fully explains the way that a mother could abandon and really act as an accessory, you know, to this terrible abuse of her own children. You know, in many cases like this terrible abuse of her own children. In many cases like this, the mother was abused herself. It's also possible sometimes that perhaps even due to her own history of abuse that the mom can take on almost more of a childlike role to the abuser. There's also times when, believe it or not, the mom gets a little bit of a sick thrill. And again, we're talking about somebody who could herself be a very sick person.

But there is a certain amount of power that a woman gains when she provides a gateway to a man like this to her children. As we can all imagine, it's not very many women that would stand by and allow this to happen. So in a very strange and sick way, the mother actually takes on a lot of power. It's also possible, you know, from what I understand, that there was a custody battle. It's also possible that, you know, she was afraid that by revealing that this had happened, that she might stand, you know, to lose her children. From what I understand, there were also a lot of drugs, heroin, and things like that in the home. It's also possible that she was so focused on her

own issues. Yeah, I can see the drugs clouding her mind. If in fact she was using them, we don't know that. But Dr. Chloe, to choose keeping custody over protecting your child, and if you want to keep custody and you don't want to lose custody of the father, then kick the boyfriend out. Oh, 100%. The two choices are not live with a boyfriend molesting your child or lose your children. The answer is turn your boyfriend into police and kick his sorry rear end out of the house and get a TPO on him to never come back.

I agree. In fact, it makes it in many ways even more inexcusable because she obviously the father was, you know, standing right there. I don't know why he didn't have any custody, but there was apparently other viable options if for some reason she felt unable or unwilling to cut off her connection to this man. Joining me is Alexis Dreschak, RadarOnline.com, Joseph Scott Morgan, death investigator and professor of forensics at Jacksonville State University, Dr. Chloe Carmichael, New York psychologist, founder of AnxietyTools.com, Troy Slayton, veteran defense attorney joining me out

of LA, and Ashley Wilcott, child advocate. Okay, out to Troy Slayton, defense attorney, joining me. What we have right here are charging documents with a case file. They have not been proven. These allegations have not been proven. But the witness states who is in a position to know what's going on in the home that this occurred, Troy. There's no allegation of murder at this point, Nancy. We have unlawful disposition of a body. We have larceny.

We have moving a body, but we do not have a murder case. So this poor young girl is dead. We don't know who did it. Troy, Alan, could you check his his connection because he must not have heard me correctly we're talking about child protective service documents that we have obtained that alleged through an eyewitness that the live-in boyfriend earl kimrey was methodically abusing sexually abusing this three-year-old little girl and that the mother knew that's what the charging documents say i'm repeating what i see in formal documents i'm not

talking about a murder charge but i i do assume you're familiar with the theory a felony murder are you not troy slayton absolutely absolutely If you commit a crime, a felony, and somebody dies, even if it's not the direct proximate cause of what you did, you're guilty of murder. Would you agree with me, Troy Slayton, that felony child neglect would constitute an underlying felony for a charge of felony murder? Possibly, unless it's too attenuated. Just because you commit a felony doesn't mean that that felony was part and parcel of the death. Troy, you just said in your last sentence, you just said the felony does not have to be particularly related to the death, i.e., you and I go in to rob a bank. I get crazy, and I gun down Alan Duke. You didn't even know I had a gun.

Guess what? You're in for felony murder. You just wanted some easy money. You didn't want any bullets. Bam! It's done. It's over. In fact—

But that doesn't mean— What? it's done it's over in fact doesn't mean what I commit the cry if I hold up a liquor store the day before and then the next day you go and rob a bank and we happen to live with each other that doesn't mean that I'm guilty of the murder that happened at the bank let's hypothesize in this scenario clearly what we're talking about is child neglect. If these documents are true, that the mother knew the child was being neglected, and if the mother knew the boyfriend, her boyfriend, her lover, was molesting her three-year-old daughter,

and she allowed that situation, that neglect, to go on. And during that neglect, the child ends up dead. Are you telling me with a straight face, Troy Slayton, that would not be felony murder? In that exact situation, that could potentially make a case for felony murder. Man, you're slippery as an eel. But we still don't know. You're like a greased pig. Have you ever tried to catch a pig, Troy Slayton? Because my dad and my uncle, Uncle Rabbit,

when my dad would get home at night from working on the railroad, he and my uncle, my uncle convinced him to start a pig farm. And when they would get home, my dad would have to get out of the car and go chase pigs that got loose. And they're slippery. They're not easy to catch. They're filthy. They smell.

And they're typically covered with wet mud. Okay, Troy, not to suggest that you are a pig or bovine in any way, but you're extremely slippery. I had to nail you down. Nail you down on that. I'm talking about a felony murder. And again, nobody, not the mother, not the boyfriend'm talking about a felony murder. And again, nobody, not the mother, not the boyfriend, have been charged with murder. The mom is not a person of interest. She is not a suspect

at all. That's because we don't know the cause or manner of death at this point. Well, I can tell you this much. She didn't sneak out to Joseph Scott Morgan death investigator. The three-year-old girl that walked with braces did not walk out completely naked except for her pink and white undies without her leg braces, get 25 miles on her own, and throw herself at the bottom of a creek.

No, you're absolutely right. That is not possible. And I think that right now we're waiting to find out exactly what her cause of death is, Nancy. And this is a big issue here. She was found, as you stated, at the bottom of a creek. Why would somebody drive that far away to dispose of a body from this little girl's home, over 20-plus miles? One of the things that the ME is going to be looking at here,

along with the FBI, is a dearth of evidence, both at the primary scene, which would be the home, and then where the body was found. They had called out a dive team, Nancy, which implies that this child was at the bottom of a body of water. She wasn't just simply floating in the water. I'm wondering, was she submerged? Was she weighted down and placed into this body of water?

And how does somebody know about this isolated area where the body was found? One of the things that I'm really scratching my head over is, did the individual that was involved in this, whoever brought about her death, did they take this poor little angel out so far away to do something so horrible to this child that they want to complete in total privacy? And then to do away with evidence, they would take this individual child and submerge her in a body of evidence to try to get away from fiber, to try to get away from DNA evidence, all these kinds of things. The FBI is keeping a tight lid on this. I don't expect us to hear anything from the FBI. However, I believe that shortly we will get a cause of death from the medical examiner, and that's

going to give us far more information. Hopefully, they'll be able to tell us what type of trauma was found on the body. And also, and this is one of these things that kind of chills you to your bones, was she drowned in that water? In other words, was she held down? Well, hold on, Jessica. If you look at the search warrant that was used as the basis for arresting the boyfriend for obstruction, it says he took the dead body out of the home. I believe that's what it said. So whatever happened to her happened in the home.

Look at the search warrant, Joe Scott, and read it and see if you understand it the same way I do. Because, you know, we can both look at the search warrant, Joe Scott, and read it and see if you understand it the same way I do. Because, you know, we can both look at a fact scenario and see a completely different thing. Look at it real quick while I go to Alexis. Alexis Tereszczuk, investigative reporter for RadarOnline.com. What do we know about the temperature the night Mariah went missing? So this is winter in the South. It was about 40 degrees that night, which is cold. I live in California, so those are different for me, but I grew up in North Carolina and that is cold at night in the forties. And in fact, there were pictures the next day of the mom with Mariah's sibling and he was wearing a little winter coat. So this is winter. This is not a warm

balmy summer night at all. So this little girl had only her underwear on, only her little pink and white striped underwear. It was too cold for anybody to be without. Alexis, that water in that creek was so cold on that little baby girl. I want you to hear what has just happened. This guy has not been charged with murder, the live-in boyfriend, but he was very briefly in court, and we have the sound. Listen. We are still investigating leads. We're still doing interviews.

There are many other things that need to be considered, the possibility of future charges. Well, you know, we're not going to talk about those things at this point. We have been in constant contact with our district attorney's office and he has provided us guidance about where to go, how to go further. That was Earl Kimrey in court and he's heading back to court. We believe that there will be additional charges, possibly additional defendants. That's what we think right now. But as of right now, nobody is charged with murder.

Nobody's charged with homicide. The mother remains not a person of interest and not a suspect. I want to thank our partner who is joining us today in making our investigation into the death of a three-year-old little girl possible. You know, have you noticed your body changes all through your life? I mean, mine does. And especially since the twins came, I've got so much less energy and I feel fatigued. Well, I just learned that this is due in part to a decrease in circulation. If you start giving your body what it needs now, it promotes natural, healthy circulation to keep you feeling great, even as years go by.

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He is being guided by the district attorney. Listen. Okay. Now at this time, Mr. Kim, you can provide a copy of the warrants charging you with specifically obstruction of justice, concealing the unnatural death of a child, larceny after breaking and entering, second-degree burglary, and possession of stolen goods, correct? Yes. And you understand what all those charges are? Yes. Okay. And also, when I spoke in depth on several occasions to Mariah's dad,

regarding when investigators have actually told him about how Mariah was killed, this is what he tells me. Have they told you how they think she was killed, Alex? No, not yet. As soon as they found her body, they rushed her to Greenville, North Carolina, where they was going to perform the autopsy. And I'll find out further information on how, when, why, well, not why, but how and when and all that information. Alex, do they believe that Mariah was molested? I have not. I do not know

that. Me thinking I have. Yes, I think so. I hope and pray not just for the peace of mind, but I think so. Yes. I have not heard that from nobody because, you know, they're not just doing the autopsy, so I don't know. Alex, was she clothed when she was found? I have no idea. They did not tell me. All they told me was that they found my baby girl. They found Mariah about 20 minutes away from where we're at, 20, 25 minutes away from our home. I guess because Troy Slayton, veteran defense attorney joining me out of L.A., take off your defense hat just for a moment.

I guess we're all trying to figure out why. And the father was saying that he has suspicions that Mariah was molested. He doesn't know. Because we're trying to figure out why would someone do this, kill a three-year-old little girl, Troy. And, of course, the state doesn't have to prove motive. But, you know, really, not just juries, but people in general look for why. They look for the answer, Troy.

Of course, Nancy. general look for why they look for the answer troy of course nancy jurors want to know why somebody did something that is so heinous that they couldn't imagine it happening in their own lives but back to the father here he had visitation rights he had the lawful ability to see his daughter and he hadn't seen her for a year. So he says that the reason why he didn't try and get full custody was because he couldn't afford a lawyer. Well, that just doesn't hold water for me, Nancy, because there are family court facilitators, there are low and free legal services that are available to people. And 911 is absolutely free. If he thinks that somebody was harming his daughter,

he could have called the authorities immediately and start an investigation or child protective services if he didn't think there was an immediate threat. So I just am not buying the story about the father who seems to be just piling on now. Troy Slayton has just pointed a finger at the biological father who was nowhere near the home where the child was murdered, was killed, and then thrown at the bottom of a creek. In fact, he was the one out looking for her.

You know, Alexis Torres, RadarOnline.com investigative reporter. Alexis, that you just saw in stark, stark reality how defense attorneys, no offense, Slayton, play look here, not there. Don't look at the facts. Look over here. Don't look at the suspect. Look at this. Look at this. I don't give a flying fig.

Why? What was going on in the custody battle? I care about who killed this baby. And you can bring up what the father, what he didn't do. You know, Alexis, I don't know if I've told you this story. Do you know, when I started law school, Alexis, I was planning to be a Shakespearean literature professor. I didn't know a criminal case from the hole in the ground. I had to look up the words plaintiff and defendant and I remember I was with my sister she was a professor at Wharton at the time and my fiance had just been murdered and I first time I'd ever been on a plane I flew to Philadelphia and stayed with her

for a while and I looked up the words plaintiff and defendant. I didn't even know what they were. Now, Alexis, I had a degree in English with a concentration on Shakespeare. And I didn't know anything about the legal system. You want to tell me, Alexis, that everybody out there knows what to do when you're in the middle of a bitter custody fight and you're not getting along with your spouse and they're threatening you and you're having fights and they don't know what to do? And when he says he has no money, I believe that. Life is tough and he could be on really tough times. Lawyers cost a lot of money. And to know that there are free services out there, how's he going to know that?

The free lawyers aren't knocking on his door. I really do not think this is the time to pile on the dad. Talk about piling on. I know what it feels like to lose the thing you love the most. And to now say you should have, could have, would have, that you screwed up. It's your fault. It's not his fault. He did not do this thing.

It's not his fault. And I really, really think that's wrong. To lay the blame anywhere other than at the feet of the killer. Joe Scott Morgan, please explain what we know about the way this child, this baby, was found dead. If you can imagine, Nancy, she's over 20 miles away from whatever security she might have perceived her mother out in the woods in a body of water, cold. We have no idea what the cause of death is. But she died, I can guarantee you, in terror and horror. And the warrant itself states that she died of something other than natural causes

i can tell you this three-year-old little girls don't just spontaneously die and if what is true that has previously been stated about the sexual abuse allegedly allegedly. Imagine this tiny little angel is living in fear of her life, not knowing these people that are in custody of her, that have responsibility over her little life. She lives in fear that some savage is going to come creeping into her bedroom and is going to assault her in the middle of the night. It's absolutely absolutely absolutely horrible and we're going to have a much more detailed picture painted for this very very soon when the medical examiner releases the findings

dr chloe carmichael joining me from new york founder of anxiety tools. com you know dr. Chloe I have represented as a prosecutor so many grown women rape victims and sex assault victims and I see what they have gone through and and their life is never the same yes yes yes they go on they soldier on but I always compare it to having a broken arm that you don't get set. You learn to flip a pancake. Like my mom, she's riddled with arthritis, she's got all sorts of ailments, but she was a class, trained a classical pianist and played the cello and the symphony.

And I watch her play the piano and she can't move her shoulder, but she still can play a little bit. These women go on, but it's never the same. Can you imagine what it's like for a three-year-old child to be molested? Just let your mind go there. See, that's the only way I could get through a lot of my cases is don't let my mind go to that moment. But let your mind go to the moment where a three-year-old little girl is in bed. The mom is in the next room. And the live-in comes in and molests you.

Now, I know what it does to ladies, grown ladies. I've dealt with so many child molestation victims. I don't even know how many I've represented. But they can't verbalize the way adults can. Can you imagine that, Dr. Chloe? Nancy, no. I mean, it is. It's unimaginable.

It's really beyond comprehension because it is. It's just outside the bounds of what we consider normal behavior for a reason. the fact that it appears that it had been going on, I'm guessing it wasn't the first time, you know, that there was the police report that a witness in the home had seen the live-in put his penis in her mouth. If he was doing that in eyesight of other people, that suggests that this probably had been going on, you know, for some time. And so for the little girl to not only experience the trauma, but to have it seen and witnessed by other people, possibly even including her mother, who did nothing to stop it, it becomes a trauma on top of a trauma. And I will say it also becomes what we call a trauma for the secondary victims who are also, you know, other children that may have been in the home and been aware of this because they're put in a terrible position because their mom, if she in some

way knew about it, is implicitly sending the message, you know, that you better not speak up about this. I agree, Dr. Chloe. I know that my mother, when I was a child exactly this age, Joe Scott, you've heard me tell this story before, three, risked her own life to save my life. I mean, you look to your mother to protect you from everything. Our program today would not be possible without our partners.

I really can't thank you enough for joining us, and I can't thank our partners enough for making our program possible, and I want to thank this partner that means a lot to me, Circle with Disney, and I want to talk to you parent to parent. I want to protect my children, and I do protect them in every way I can think of, and I want to protect my children and I do protect them in every way I can think of and I want to protect them from the Internet. The Internet is so awesome. We use it every day with their school projects. Last night we were in bed watching James Brown sing I Feel Good before he went to sleep. They know the world of Internet but there are parts of the Internet I don't want them there. I

don't want them. It's dangerous and it's hard to monitor what they're doing online 24-7. There's a lot of complicated, technical, expensive solutions that could require some tech pro to come to your home and install hardware and software. That affects everybody in the family, but here's the answer. It's Circle with Disney. It's a little device designed for families to manage content and time online for all the devices in your home. You, the parent, filter content. You set time limits. You can even set a bedtime, and it's so easy to set up. John David, he's 10, set it up for me. Everyone in the family has their own setting. This way, children don't end up in the scary part of the internet but mom and dad still can use the internet to get their work done use

offer code Nancy in a NCY at circle with Nancy comm get $10 off your circle plus free shipping with this offer $10 off free shipping. Circlewithnancy.com. Offer code Nancy. Circlewithnancy.com. Offer code Nancy. $10 off your circle and free shipping. Circle, I am grateful for what you have done for me to ease my mind, help me protect my two children, and I'm going to thank you also for being our partner here today as we try our best to unravel the story and protect other children now we're talking about the mom and the live-in again mom is not a suspect mom has not been named a person of interest no one has been charged with murder yet. As a matter of fact, listen to mom. You judge her credibility. You're the jury. The jury is the sole judge of credibility. Listen. Please bring her back and I love her. I'll do anything that I can, whatever you want. Just bring her home,

please. Safe as sound. She's my baby. She's my everything. What does she mean to you and your family in this community? She's like an angel. I had my two's tied and burnt on each side. I found out I was pregnant with her. So we call her our little angel. She's got the personality of make you laugh. She's goofy, outgoing, talkative. She knows how to make your day brighter. A lot to this community and people that are here

looking for her, love her to death. What would it mean to you to see her face again? Everything in the world. Just to be able to touch her and hold her and not let her go again. Like if anything. Packed on to the County Sheriff Department, please, and let us know. And if whoever has her, please, I'm begging you, bring her home. Nancy Grace, Crime Story, signing off.

Goodbye, friend. This is an iHeart Podcast.